RadixJournal - The Elon Question

00:00:00.480 Mark, how are you?

00:00:02.720 I'm well, thank you.

00:00:04.460 Over the past six months, there seems to have been this rumor that Elon was taking over

00:00:12.680 Twitter and he was going to turn it into the Wild West.

00:00:17.320 Now, I think a lot of people have bought into that rumor on both the dissident right and

00:00:23.260 conservatives and even the left.

00:00:25.740 I noted that there were a few small time liberal celebrities that are, you know, we've left

00:00:32.300 the platform over too much hate and so on.

00:00:35.560 And I can remember when Elon first put forward his offer and it was accepted by Twitter.

00:00:43.860 This was before he tried to back out and we had this legal battle that he capitulated on.

00:00:49.520 But anyway, there was this day of rage, as they say in the Middle East, of all of these 1.00

00:00:59.920 banned accounts coming back, people doing Twitter spaces where the N-word was dropped with reckless

00:01:08.740 abandon.

00:01:09.780 And there was just this notion that it was going to be 2015 all over again.

00:01:15.420 I think a lot of those expectations have been dampened.

00:01:19.500 And I think a lot of those expectations were ridiculous to begin with.

00:01:23.920 I actually did a little monologue on why Elon Musk is actually not buying Twitter so that

00:01:32.180 you can say the N-word.

00:01:35.320 And but I think there are a couple of factors here.

00:01:38.720 First off, you know, to be honest, I do have a bit of nostalgia for the crazy alt-right days

00:01:51.640 of 2015 and 2016.

00:01:53.660 Just the deranged memes, these hilarious videos where Trump was an 80s beach Miami Vice icon

00:02:05.720 or an anime villain or something like this and the kind of craziness that was going on

00:02:14.000 then.

00:02:14.360 I to use some of your technology, I do our terminology rather.

00:02:20.280 I do think that there was a kind of Dionysian quality to it all where it was just all crazy

00:02:26.620 and you got caught up in the frenzy and you could throw rationality and sobriety out the

00:02:33.400 window in a way.

00:02:34.120 It was just wild and we felt like we were winning.

00:02:37.380 So I'll admit to some nostalgia for that period.

00:02:43.140 But I also have sobered up and I would say that those days are not going to return whatever

00:02:51.620 Elon Musk has in store.

00:02:54.160 He's going to have to monetize this thing and he has pressures that he will bow to.

00:02:58.160 But I would even go further and I think you'll agree with me that those days shouldn't return.

00:03:07.800 But let me pass over to you to get your response to that.

00:03:11.840 Yeah, no, I mean, I think, yeah, it's hard to like in hindsight, I think I've developed a

00:03:20.480 sort of jaundiced view of that time where I feel like because, you know, because you can

00:03:27.240 look at it in hindsight and that we're kind of being, you know, led down the primrose path

00:03:35.180 to a certain extent.

00:03:36.900 And so, yeah, it's hard.

00:03:39.360 It's hard to kind of I, you know, I think at the time, yeah, I had a lot of the same enthusiasm.

00:03:44.140 Um, but it's, um, um, yeah, it was a kind of Dionysian moment.

00:03:52.100 Um, Andy, but I, you know, I think that I also, and probably you and others, uh, but

00:03:57.940 I think I, I think I also had a sense that, um, well, let's see where this goes.

00:04:02.660 So there was general optimism then.

00:04:05.040 Um, but I don't know that any of us were completely sold.

00:04:08.060 Like we were never really totally sold on Trump.

00:04:11.560 Right.

00:04:12.200 And, uh, and then gradually we became, or somewhat rapidly we became disillusioned with Trump

00:04:17.660 after he, after he got into office.

00:04:20.780 Um, but, um, yeah, I don't, it's, it's a, um, it's a different time now, definitely.

00:04:28.360 Um, and I think that, but I think also people are aware of this.

00:04:31.620 So I think that I, when you say that people are coming back on with the expectation, uh, that

00:04:36.920 it's going to be 2016 again, uh, and I don't think you're saying this exactly.

00:04:40.860 I think that there are people are also kind of leery and, and don't in, or, you know, waiting

00:04:48.000 for the other shoe to drop, so to speak, and don't know if they can trust Musk, uh, you

00:04:54.100 know, just because of all this sort of, uh, high expectations and, and, and dash dreams

00:04:59.920 that they've had in the past in, in 2016, I think that people are, are a little more kind

00:05:04.620 of sober minded about these things now.

00:05:06.820 Um, now, I, I mean, to me though, I think that what is, what is interesting is I think

00:05:14.280 that a lot of people are coming back on and in, you know, in, in the leftists are, are

00:05:19.400 actually talking about it in these terms in the media that they're coming on and they're

00:05:22.780 sort of kind of testing, um, you know, how far they can go with the free speech, um, free

00:05:29.460 speech in quotation marks, um, where they're just, you know, they, they're just trying

00:05:34.080 to be sort of outrageous and, and, you know, see if, uh, the N word, for example, is still

00:05:38.720 viable on Twitter.

00:05:40.620 Um, and, you know, I, I think it's kind of not really a, you know, from my perspective,

00:05:46.840 I don't think it's a worthy experiment.

00:05:48.480 Like I think a better approach would be for people to come onto, uh, Twitter and just kind

00:05:54.300 of treat it as a different face to their sort of, you know, their media campaigns, which

00:05:59.040 may have also another kind of subterranean dimension on websites that you can't necessarily

00:06:04.240 easily Google.

00:06:05.400 Right.

00:06:06.080 Um, and just make it their kind of more professional face where they, they speak in a more sober

00:06:12.780 minded way and let it be their portal to this other world that they want to retain as well.

00:06:18.300 But in general, I think that people probably should be professionalizing and just not being

00:06:24.400 as kind of ridiculous as, uh, they were in 2016.

00:06:28.480 Well, I think you're, I, I, I obviously agree with you on a basic level, but I, I do think 0.90

00:06:34.240 you're being naive in, in two ways.

00:06:38.700 Um, first off, I don't think there's much to a lot of these people outside of yelling the

00:06:47.160 N word on Twitter or, uh, you know, harassing Jewish journalist or whatever.

00:06:52.780 I, I don't know if there's much more to that.

00:06:55.900 And, uh, secondly, on, on kind of a more technological level, I, I agree 100% when Elon Musk or even

00:07:07.940 Jack Dorsey before him said that Twitter is a town hall and, um, it is these social media

00:07:16.600 platforms have taken over the web.

00:07:18.720 I mean, a website is great and all, but it actually doesn't mean a whole heck of a lot.

00:07:25.240 And there are people who are social media only.

00:07:28.020 That's where they do all of their activity.

00:07:31.120 In fact, and for better and for worse, that's probably where the most, uh, influential and

00:07:38.380 potent ideological activity takes place is Twitter and YouTube and so on.

00:07:45.140 And these are at the end of the day, private platforms.

00:07:49.260 And it's hugely influential.

00:07:50.620 I mean, not only has the, is the web kind of dead in the sense of when you would log on

00:07:57.880 to a website or something like that.

00:08:00.220 I think it's actually more profound because Trump Trump's campaign was a watermark and

00:08:07.500 you can see precedence for it with Ron Paul in, in both 2008 and 2012, where he was the

00:08:15.300 candidate from the internet in the sense that if you ask a Fox news or a CNN pundit, what

00:08:23.780 are Ron Paul's chances?

00:08:25.000 They would be, they would basically say Ron who, or that's really cute that you're talking

00:08:30.480 about this wacky libertarian.

00:08:32.940 But if you went to the internet, he was doing massive fundraising, uh, online.

00:08:39.740 You can even see this in, um, the democratic candidate, uh, from Maine.

00:08:45.060 I'm forgetting his, uh, the guy who yelled out, like, we're going to Nebraska in 2004.

00:08:49.800 Do you remember that?

00:08:51.180 Um, maybe you don't like we're taking Nebraska.

00:08:54.640 I can't remember his name at the moment.

00:08:56.740 He was actually, are we going to New Hampshire, Tom Harkin?

00:08:59.660 We're going to South Carolina and Oklahoma and Arizona and North Dakota and New Mexico.

00:09:05.480 We're going to California and Texas and New York.

00:09:08.720 And we're going to South Dakota and Oregon and Washington and Michigan.

00:09:13.460 And then we're going to Washington DC to take back the white house. 0.69

00:09:17.020 Yeah.

00:09:18.380 He was actually a fairly interesting candidate.

00:09:20.600 Uh, but, uh, you know, he, some of this even started with him, but then it morphed into

00:09:28.500 the Ron Paul era.

00:09:29.840 And then all of that energy went to Trump on, on both in terms of people who are extremely

00:09:35.700 online and rather savvy about it, but then also in terms of normies.

00:09:41.820 So by 2016, normies were getting their news and their information and their punditry, et cetera,

00:09:53.280 from the internet and from social media in particular.

00:09:57.760 And so previously a, a major, you know, the mayor of Des Moines, Iowa or whatever could

00:10:05.180 denounce Trump and, and, um, endorse someone else or something like that by 2016 and 2015,

00:10:13.440 the people weren't getting that information from the nightly news or their newspaper.

00:10:18.980 They were seeing, they were getting their take on it from Trump.

00:10:22.780 And so he could be, he could not mention it at all, or just basically say, Oh, you know,

00:10:28.060 the swamp is striking back at me because they know I'm a threat to their existence.

00:10:32.360 You know, uh, corrupt mayor of Des Moines, Iowa has endorsed lion Ted Cruz, you know, this

00:10:39.040 kind of stuff.

00:10:39.600 And so they'd, they'd almost have the take even before they learned about it from a reputable

00:10:45.300 source.

00:10:47.100 And so we kind of like pass through the looking glass and it was also 2016.

00:10:51.860 That was the first time that genuinely fake news was surpassing mainstream media.

00:11:01.320 Uh, you know, on social media.

00:11:03.780 And again, I'm not passing judgment on any of these institutions.

00:11:08.940 I mean, to a degree, you could say that discussions in the New York times about weapons of mass

00:11:14.900 destruction in 2003 were fake news.

00:11:18.720 And, and, and you would have a point if you said that, but these were stories like the Pope

00:11:24.460 endorses Trump or Hillary Clinton is a member of ISIS. 0.73

00:11:29.100 I mean, just obviously fraudulent nonsense.

00:11:32.560 These were getting more traction than a mainstream article from USA today.

00:11:37.980 So it really was that crazy alt-right moment when we kind of like went through the looking

00:11:46.500 glass or whatever metaphor.

00:11:48.460 We, if things kind of flipped over where social media wasn't kind of like an add on or a way

00:11:55.480 to create enthusiasm or just another Avenue, it had surpassed and even displaced mainstream.

00:12:04.180 And the mainstream was then kind of reacting to social media.

00:12:08.960 And I don't, you know, this flip still takes place today.

00:12:14.180 And I don't think we fully like contemplated the, uh, effects of this for good and for real.

00:12:23.280 Yeah.

00:12:23.860 I mean, it was, uh, it was to one extent, a kind of democratizing of media generally.

00:12:28.560 Yeah.

00:12:29.580 Right.

00:12:30.060 So, um, social media is a democratization of media.

00:12:35.700 Now, um, I think that we're now we're people, uh, you know, sort of the establishment or the

00:12:42.600 money to powers are realizing that, um, that's not going to totally work for them.

00:12:48.540 Right.

00:12:48.880 So it's, so now we're seeing, um, you know, things are starting to settle a little bit more,

00:12:55.280 um, in terms of what this relationship is going to be like, you know, I mean, at the end of

00:13:00.880 the day, of course, it's, um, uh, capital always rules.

00:13:05.100 So if, if you have resources, you're always going to have a louder voice regardless.

00:13:09.360 Sure.

00:13:10.120 In that regard, it's always going to be a kind of a plutocracy.

00:13:13.300 Um, but the, but there are other ways to gain a voice of course.

00:13:16.960 And, and it is still essentially a kind of democratic structure.

00:13:20.980 Media is now democratic, which is, so it is a kind of an amazing

00:13:24.900 shift.

00:13:26.500 Yes.

00:13:26.620 I mean, Ricky Vaughn, I don't know what, how much money he invested in his Twitter account.

00:13:33.800 And he did have, or developed some connections to GOP people, including people connected to

00:13:42.020 Rudy Giuliani.

00:13:42.980 But that seemed to come afterward.

00:13:44.860 The fact is, you know, for good and for ill, he was a guy tweeting and you could say the

00:13:51.440 same for, um, Oh, I keep, uh, I'm forgetting names to that crazy guy who just basically

00:13:59.500 Trump could slip on a banana peel and he would be like, this is great.

00:14:03.560 This is 40 chess.

00:14:04.700 This is brilliant.

00:14:05.480 This is how we win folks.

00:14:06.600 And when you agree with what QAnon does and says or not, they are, they're great patriots.

00:14:12.360 Everybody I've met at QAnon is a great paper.

00:14:14.140 Thank you.

00:14:14.460 And here's what I said on Twitter today.

00:14:15.480 I said two, two things, uh, one or two things are true with the whole QAnon thing.

00:14:20.100 Um, if it is just, um, uh, um, something that's interesting to talk about, if it's just patriots

00:14:27.660 getting together and postulating about what the deep state might be doing and what Donald

00:14:30.680 Trump might be doing about it, and it's just ends up being just a fun thing that keeps everybody

00:14:34.980 motivated and encouraged.

00:14:35.900 That's fine.

00:14:36.900 That's okay.

00:14:37.900 But there's a possibility.

00:14:40.260 Okay.

00:14:40.720 And it's harmless.

00:14:41.580 There's a possibility that it could all be true and that it could all be for, uh, for telling

00:14:46.880 the, the destruction of the deep state and what the Trump plan is for the deep state, trust

00:14:51.520 the plan.

00:14:52.320 Maybe it's all true. 0.86

00:14:53.080 So one way or the other, either it's a harmless fun thing or it's true.

00:14:56.080 And it's going to be the destruction of deep state to me.

00:14:58.260 I like those odds.

00:14:59.720 I see no downside in it.

00:15:01.480 And I forgetting his name at the moment.

00:15:03.740 You probably know what I'm talking about.

00:15:05.240 And there were probably a collection of people like this.

00:15:07.840 This is a big Twitter account or someone like that.

00:15:10.440 Yeah.

00:15:10.600 He got banned for spreading QAnon, which is like not at all surprising just to continue. 1.00

00:15:16.880 I can't remember his name at the moment.

00:15:24.440 You probably know who I'm talking about, but again, what kind of capital was behind that

00:15:30.480 guy?

00:15:31.460 Nothing.

00:15:33.220 Effectively.

00:15:34.240 He was just tweeting.

00:15:35.380 He lost his job and, or I don't know.

00:15:38.140 I don't know what happened.

00:15:39.240 He, he, he just tweeted all day.

00:15:40.780 I mean, if you are somewhat snappy and if you kind of go with the herd, you kind of

00:15:46.600 realize you have some sixth sense where you can kind of tell where things are going and

00:15:51.560 you're always like rooting them on and you tweet a hundred times a day, you're going to

00:15:58.320 get a million followers at some point.

00:15:59.940 And you actually are going to have tremendous amount of influence, uh, which both of those

00:16:04.740 individuals did.

00:16:06.040 Yeah.

00:16:06.260 And a key to that is you have to, uh, you have to be bringing sort of, uh, glad tidings,

00:16:11.380 right?

00:16:11.700 So in other words, it has to be an optimistic message.

00:16:15.060 Um, I mean, this is really the kind of the root of, or a radically pessimistic.

00:16:20.640 I lives of Tik TOK is another, you know, that's kind of like you live in hell is what

00:16:25.860 she is telling Hayim or whatever her name is, is telling you every day, but, but go on.

00:16:29.860 Um, yeah, um, no, I, so I guess you're right.

00:16:34.300 So maybe my thesis is totally incorrect, but, um, I do think that there is, there is at least

00:16:39.780 a type of, uh, um, you know, social media personality that gains currency by basically,

00:16:47.240 uh, to camp, uh, uh, by coattailing and cheerleading, you know, uh, movements like the MAGA movement.

00:16:55.000 Um, and, and by basically bringing glad tidings, like we're winning, we're winning, right?

00:17:01.400 Yes.

00:17:01.820 Probably something people like to hear that, of course, right?

00:17:05.020 Now, uh, there may also be a black pill equivalent to that.

00:17:09.140 Um, you know, I, I, I, but I, I, I, I would venture to guess that the, the stronger, uh, current

00:17:17.280 or tendency is to basically white pill and you get beyond whatever, uh, and get behind

00:17:23.980 whatever, uh, you know, in our sphere, at least get behind any, uh, conservative movement

00:17:28.680 that appears to be gaining momentum or having success.

00:17:32.020 Right.

00:17:32.660 Yes.

00:17:33.280 Um, you know, so it's in, that also becomes, uh, for some, of course, it also becomes a way

00:17:39.060 of grifting, um, but, uh, and it, and, uh, it is kind of, um, it's a way of like sort

00:17:47.240 of amplifying things that are not necessarily useful movements or directions, um, and kind

00:17:53.780 of wildly amplifying them because you get a lot of like accounts or social media accounts

00:17:57.760 basically doing the same thing.

00:17:59.580 Yeah.

00:18:00.060 Uh, and, and they'll do it no matter how, uh, uh, you know, sort of black pilling, uh, events

00:18:06.460 are, right.

00:18:07.180 So it's, you know, they, they're never, it doesn't seem like they're ever sobered by

00:18:12.160 other reality of the situation.

00:18:14.780 Um, you know, for example, Trump getting elected and, and kind of failing to, uh, live up to

00:18:21.320 his obligations, uh, towards his, uh, constituency.

00:18:25.180 Yeah.

00:18:26.460 So there does also seem to be, sorry to cut you off.

00:18:29.360 First off, his name is Bill Mitchell.

00:18:30.920 It actually came to me.

00:18:32.060 Good old Bill Mitchell, gray haired boomer.

00:18:34.600 Uh, I don't know where he is now, probably gab, uh, but there, there also seems to be

00:18:39.940 a right wing quality to this.

00:18:42.340 And that's not to say that, um, uh, there aren't like left wing equivalents.

00:18:48.840 I, I remember reading about Brooklyn dad or some, one of these guys who was a fairly popular

00:18:56.920 left wing account and he was getting paid, not big bucks, but you know, 5,000 here.

00:19:04.600 10,000 there, you know, pretty good money, I guess, uh, for tweeting and for tweeting

00:19:11.620 on behalf of Joe Biden.

00:19:13.260 And the reason why he was getting paid is because he had more traction as this authentic, um,

00:19:21.680 Twitter account.

00:19:22.700 Like I'm just a guy, I'm a Brooklyn dad and, and between, you know, PTA meetings and fixing 0.95

00:19:29.320 dinner, I'm going to tweet about how Joe Biden's great and Trump is a fascist or something like 0.97

00:19:34.520 that. 0.82

00:19:34.740 And, you know, that was probably money well spent actually from this campaign.

00:19:39.640 So there are left wing equivalents, but I, I think there is this kind of right wing quality

00:19:45.880 to it that this flourishes on the right.

00:19:49.860 And I think it says something about the position that the right understands itself in.

00:19:54.800 Like you go to Bill Mitchell to get your 40 chess copium because the New York times won't

00:20:02.460 do it for you.

00:20:04.000 You know, the New, the New York times is, has a liberal slant of course, but you know, deals

00:20:09.960 and facts and balancing their statements and so on.

00:20:15.020 Um, and so there's this almost kind of like Gnostic quality.

00:20:18.900 And I, I mean that in a loose sense, of course, of, you know, don't believe the lying media. 0.94

00:20:25.780 They're all evil and ridiculous, but like Bill Mitchell, like he'll tell you the real 0.96

00:20:30.700 truth that Jesus is coming back tomorrow morning or something like that. 0.99

00:20:35.240 And there, so there, I don't know.

00:20:38.800 I mean, again, not that there aren't left wing equivalents, but this does seem to be

00:20:43.520 a particular right wing thing.

00:20:47.520 And I guess there's a certain irony to that in the sense that when people were for singing

00:20:52.900 the praises of the internet, you know, 25 years ago, I don't think they imagined this

00:20:59.940 would be, you know, the most prominent force on it would be 4chan and QAnon.

00:21:05.240 Something like that.

00:21:06.140 But, you know, here it is.

00:21:10.160 Yeah, no, I mean, and now, so I guess we have this situation where, uh, Musk is, um, now in

00:21:18.420 control of Twitter and he, uh, is, uh, going to set a new direction ostensibly.

00:21:24.300 Um, he's recently met with, uh, ADL heads, um, which, you know, much to the sort of horror

00:21:32.120 of the, uh, dissonant right community.

00:21:35.300 Um, and, you know, in, in, in, on some level, you get a sense that it may be more of the

00:21:41.020 same.

00:21:41.300 It may just end up being more of the same.

00:21:43.180 Um, which I think that you and I had, uh, sort of girded ourselves for that possibility.

00:21:48.060 Like, I don't, I don't think that either you or I were, um, had any delusions about

00:21:52.520 this.

00:21:52.820 And I'm sure that's the case with many people, uh, the dissident right, especially that people

00:21:56.800 have, who have been in the dissident right, you know, since 2016 or 2015.

00:22:02.220 Um, so, but I, you know, to me though, it's interesting to, like, I, I wonder what he's

00:22:11.100 going to do different because I actually think that he'll probably tried it.

00:22:15.180 Like, I do think it, I do think his interests were genuine.

00:22:19.080 Now they, they ultimately, I don't know that, um, like rather his interest in free speech

00:22:24.360 was a genuine interest because otherwise, I mean, on some level it is kind of a turd of

00:22:29.600 a company, right?

00:22:30.420 It's a, it's a holy, it's a, it's a, um, a very kind of overpriced company that he's

00:22:35.440 bought, um, that is not, it's not a profitable, uh, company, uh, currently.

00:22:41.380 Um, so I think that he is actually doing this as a kind of activist, that he is interested

00:22:47.080 in, uh, issues surrounding free speech.

00:22:50.760 Um, and so that that's genuine.

00:22:52.680 I mean, it's also a kind of, uh, a passion project in the sense that I think he really loves

00:22:57.620 Twitter.

00:22:58.020 He loves being on Twitter.

00:22:59.020 He loves interacting with people on Twitter.

00:23:01.200 So he loves the community of Twitter.

00:23:03.700 Uh, and it allows him to be a kind of media tycoon because now he's, you know, it's social

00:23:08.540 media, which is, has risen as one of these major forms of media.

00:23:13.300 Um, so I think that there are things that are, that he, uh, it is a labor of love.

00:23:19.620 Um, and I think that his interest in free speech or issues surrounding free speech or

00:23:25.120 genuine, um, and I, and who knows, because I, you know, he's not going to hear our voice.

00:23:32.140 Who knows?

00:23:32.760 Maybe some of these ideas will kind of trickle up to him or maybe, hopefully he's already

00:23:37.220 got some ideas.

00:23:38.020 Maybe he's a listener.

00:23:39.720 Well, that would be fantastic.

00:23:42.000 Um, because I, no, because I think that, um, I think that there are directions that he

00:23:47.380 could, you know, if I were, uh, Elon Musk, um, I think that one thing that I would consider

00:23:53.080 doing is, is like, uh, sort of like rigorously banning racial epithets.

00:24:00.160 Right.

00:24:00.860 Which is getting rid of racial epithets.

00:24:02.820 Right now.

00:24:03.980 I know that in, and I, so I'm not going to be like, so, uh, this is not a position that

00:24:08.760 like, if you disagree with me on this position, I'm, I'm going to, uh, unfollow you or block

00:24:13.520 you or something like that.

00:24:14.240 I, I, I think I understand the argument that, um, well, you know, because the counter argument

00:24:19.820 would be kind of more of a libertarian argument and it would be like, well, that's a slippery

00:24:23.900 slope.

00:24:24.480 And if you ban, uh, you know, racial epithets, which are protected free speech and obviously,

00:24:31.220 and obviously they should remain protected free speech, but I'm talking, I'm talking

00:24:36.360 specifically about the, um, house rules on Twitter on the platform.

00:24:41.880 Right now.

00:24:44.140 I mean, there were a couple of factors here.

00:24:46.580 One is execution and enforcement of, you know, what, what speech codes effectively, because

00:24:53.020 one way or another, there's going to be speech codes on, on Twitter.

00:24:55.900 I mean, that's just something that, that's obviously, um, that's something that he's

00:25:00.040 indicated that he's interested in doing.

00:25:01.580 He doesn't want it to be a, a free for all.

00:25:03.880 He doesn't want it, you know,

00:25:05.160 Hellscape was the word he used to describe it.

00:25:09.040 And I, I don't think either of us want it to be a hellscape either.

00:25:12.240 Um, but, but if I were him and there were a good system, because I mean, again, part of

00:25:18.660 it is the policy and then the other part of it is the kind of execution of the policy.

00:25:23.900 And I guess a third part of it would be the people executing the policy.

00:25:27.220 Right.

00:25:28.060 Um, so there's, there's many kind of like pieces to this mechanism, um, that, uh, that

00:25:34.480 he would have to, uh, sort of wield, uh, to make Twitter a kind of more desirable, uh,

00:25:41.900 uh, cultural and political space.

00:25:45.080 Um, but if, if I were him, that, that is something that I, I would consider.

00:25:49.900 Now, I, again, I understand the arguments against it.

00:25:52.060 It's a slippery slope, but again, you know, the counter argument is we're only talking about

00:25:56.280 Twitter here.

00:25:56.720 We're not talking about free speech generally, but other people might say, well, uh, but,

00:26:02.660 you know, free, uh, Twitter is influential.

00:26:05.080 So it could say, well, yeah, but think about it, but before you go on, I, I, you have more

00:26:10.220 to say, I mean, think about it arguing with myself, but yeah, well, think about it this

00:26:15.380 way.

00:26:15.800 I mean, yes, the N word is, is protected speech in the sense that, yeah, I think everyone

00:26:24.300 would be outraged if you were arrested for that or even find, um, although there are some

00:26:31.140 examples of that in, in, uh, great Britain and so on, but this is America.

00:26:36.000 Um, but the fact is, if you, if you think of Twitter as a town hall, it is a, a, a zone

00:26:45.660 for discussion and free speech, uh, Jack Dorsey even used like a global consciousness or something,

00:26:52.340 you know, little airy fairy, but whatever.

00:26:55.160 Yeah.

00:26:55.980 Um, you can't go out onto a, so in that sense, it's replacing public spaces that we had previously,

00:27:02.740 um, maybe some more private, like the local coffee shop or bar, maybe the more, maybe some

00:27:07.820 of them were public, like the sidewalk, particularly the sidewalk outside of a public building where

00:27:12.820 protests would occur.

00:27:13.940 You can't go out onto a sidewalk and run up into someone's face and start yelling racial

00:27:20.820 epithets at them.

00:27:22.260 That's not protected speech that you're going to be arrested for that rightfully.

00:27:28.780 And yeah, it's a little bit different if you're not, if you're not just directly harassing

00:27:34.520 someone, you can get, you know, rough in, um, your protest.

00:27:41.780 And I support that actually, I think people should have the ability to, uh, you know, be

00:27:48.180 a bit edgy or vulgar or combative or something in, in their rhetoric when they're protesting

00:27:55.440 something, sure, but you can't harass people and you're going to get thrown out of whatever

00:28:02.880 coffee shop or bar there is.

00:28:05.400 If you're just dropping in bombs constantly, you know, I mean, like it, I think what the

00:28:13.600 thing is of, of these people, I mean, first off my criticism would be, there's nothing much

00:28:18.360 to them outside of the M bomb, but secondly, they, they almost believe that they have like

00:28:24.380 infinite rights on the internet, that the internet is somehow special.

00:28:29.000 And if you're gonna, if you're gonna understand these platforms as a public space to at least

00:28:35.120 some degree, and I think they should be, you know, you have a little, you have, you have

00:28:39.840 more right to say protest in some way in a shopping mall than you do at someone's house.

00:28:48.280 If you walk into their house, you can't say, well, this is a protest or whatever.

00:28:52.480 No, you're going to be arrested.

00:28:53.920 Now, could you hold up a sign and like protest a company that's, you know, I don't know, killing

00:29:00.820 the whales or whatever?

00:29:02.360 Yeah, you can.

00:29:03.120 You, you, you kind of have expanded rights in a private zone, like a shopping mall, for

00:29:09.480 instance.

00:29:10.920 Uh, but you know, if we, if we take that and we, we, you know, project that onto the internet,

00:29:18.740 you, you don't have infinite rights.

00:29:21.760 You just can't do whatever you want, regardless of whether it's a private or public space.

00:29:28.440 And I, you know, I feel like my own personal trajectory on this was that when, you know,

00:29:37.920 when we were first, when people were first getting banned on Twitter, it did seem, you

00:29:43.940 know, arbitrary and highly politically motivated.

00:29:48.000 And my response then was like, well, you have to think of it as a private place that where

00:29:54.440 you have expanded rights.

00:29:55.720 And I still think of it that way.

00:29:57.160 I think I'm just kind of pushing back, you know, from the other end at this point in

00:30:03.440 my life, maybe it has something to do with age, but I, I think it has just a lot to do

00:30:09.620 with the fact that I recognize just how endlessly toxic this kind of atmosphere can become.

00:30:17.840 No one, if you're on Twitter and you're trying to make a point, you don't want to be on 4chan where

00:30:26.260 there is endless scatological fake misrepresentations, gross pornographic nonsense, 24 seven.

00:30:38.340 You, you don't want to be there.

00:30:44.620 And if that's all the movement is, if you're, if you're just this free speech warrior, because

00:30:47.620 you, you know, post porn and lie about people and drop the N bomb or the K word or what, whatever

00:30:56.300 the hell, you know, I'm just kind of done at this point. 0.98

00:31:01.580 I'm like, let's just sweep them out.

00:31:04.280 They're not genuinely trying to, to add to discourse.

00:31:08.420 I mean, free speech is the ideal of free speech is based on a general level of good faith.

00:31:16.400 You know, like you're trying to contribute to discourse.

00:31:21.800 And if you're not, you can get bent in my view.

00:31:27.080 You, you have, there, there has to be a basic assumption of good faith, you know, and you

00:31:33.600 might very well be wrong.

00:31:34.780 You might be really wrong.

00:31:35.840 Fine, but you are genuinely attempting to contribute to discourse or otherwise free speech is meaningless

00:31:43.380 and, you know, and it can also have rather dangerous effects.

00:31:50.460 Sure.

00:31:51.860 The, uh, Russia, Russia, Russia narrative might very well have been overstated by Rachel Maddow

00:32:00.820 and those types of people that, you know, Trump is in control or there are the Kremlin's in

00:32:07.640 control of America. 0.98

00:32:08.620 It's overstated and it becomes ridiculous. 0.94

00:32:11.360 Yes. 0.94

00:32:12.480 There's no doubt that foreign actors are, are seeking or would like to seek to pollute the 1.00

00:32:23.400 discourse and make our societies much worse in order to benefit theirs in the kind of zero 0.99

00:32:32.940 sum game, which in many ways of geopolitics.

00:32:38.060 So this is a real thing and you don't have infinite rights as a user of the internet.

00:32:45.240 All right.

00:32:56.160 Thank you.

00:32:57.000 Thank you.

00:33:03.000 Thank you.

00:33:04.220 Thank you.

00:33:12.200 Thank you.

RadixJournal - November 05, 2022

The Elon Question

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