Real Coffee with Scott Adams - Episode 1996 Scott Adams： Why Do The Most Educated People Keep Getting All The Wrong Answers？

00:00:00.360 But I'm going to be asking people on Spaces to chime in.

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00:00:48.240 That's good stuff.

00:00:49.180 All right. Well, apparently I caused a little kerfluffle.

00:00:54.800 Kerfuffle on the Internet with a video that I put out yesterday in which I said the...

00:01:04.020 I made the mistake of calling them anti-vaxxers.

00:01:06.260 People didn't want to be called that.

00:01:07.960 But let's say the purebloods, the people who are unvaccinated, 1.00

00:01:12.240 I said that they're the winners.

00:01:14.580 Because we've reached Omicron and whatever vaccination you got probably didn't help you at this point.

00:01:20.200 And so, if you're young and don't have lots of comorbidities but you've got a vaccination in your blood

00:01:28.480 and you don't have any real risk from Omicron,

00:01:31.540 you've got an extra risk that it would be great if you didn't have.

00:01:36.080 So I'd say the people who got to this point with nothing in their blood that's out of the ordinary

00:01:41.060 are the winners.

00:01:42.600 So I sent that in the video and I sent that around and it's got about half a million views

00:01:47.340 and I was quite interested in them.

00:01:51.580 I'll give you some of the hot takes and we'll talk about this in a moment.

00:01:54.620 And then I'll take some questions on spaces.

00:01:59.020 So if anybody wants to jump on me and insult me and criticize me in public,

00:02:04.100 this would be exactly the time to do it.

00:02:05.880 So please jump on if you'd like that.

00:02:09.280 The critics are the ones I want to hear from.

00:02:12.280 So let me ask you this.

00:02:14.800 Don't get on spaces and compliment me or say you like the show.

00:02:20.820 I love to hear it, but nobody else does.

00:02:24.140 So for the benefit of the other listeners, just hit your criticisms.

00:02:29.140 All right.

00:02:29.460 So I was fascinated to see people's reaction when I told the unvaccinated that they were 1.00

00:02:37.740 the winners and that I'm acknowledging that with no reservations.

00:02:43.620 And it's amazing the reactions.

00:02:47.520 Because one of the things I wondered was, could people take yes for an answer?

00:02:52.860 Could you just say, okay, well, based on what we know now,

00:02:56.560 it looks like, you know, you had the winning strategy.

00:03:01.920 Some people said, oh, I respect that because you admitted you're wrong.

00:03:07.440 Other people said, you're being arrogant in the way you admit you're wrong. 1.00

00:03:12.580 So you're really still a dick. 1.00

00:03:15.240 Okay. 1.00

00:03:17.000 Other people wanted to dance on my grave and tell me why they were so right and why I was

00:03:22.980 so wrong.

00:03:23.380 And I'm trying to learn from them.

00:03:24.640 And that's what we'll talk about today.

00:03:27.880 And other people wanted me to know that it wasn't about winning.

00:03:33.640 It wasn't about winning.

00:03:34.960 They care about people.

00:03:36.440 So it's the caring about people that matters, not the winning and losing.

00:03:42.520 But the funniest comment was, this one was, why did so many intelligent people fall for

00:03:48.820 the shots?

00:03:49.540 And we're going to talk about this on Spaces in a minute.

00:03:51.580 I'll set it up for you first.

00:03:52.740 And I thought to myself, I wonder if it's true that there's any correlation between education

00:04:00.500 and vaccination.

00:04:03.640 So I looked it up.

00:04:04.760 And sure enough, in Pew Research 2021, the highest rates of vaccination by far are correlated

00:04:12.900 with the highest education.

00:04:14.120 So people with postgraduate degrees, the highest level that they measured, 89% of them at the

00:04:21.360 time, I don't know what the, this is 2021.

00:04:23.980 But at the time, 89% were vaccinated, which we don't really call vaccinated, do we?

00:04:30.820 We call them the shots, the shots.

00:04:34.060 So 89% had the shots.

00:04:36.200 College graduate, still pretty high up there, but less than the postgraduates, 81%.

00:04:43.520 So it starts going down, it should go down.

00:04:46.120 People who had some college but didn't graduate, goes all the way down to 69%.

00:04:50.640 These are a little different now, but this was 2021.

00:04:53.460 And then people who had only high school or less, it goes all the way down to 66%.

00:04:59.840 And interestingly, among Asian Americans, it's 94%.

00:05:06.640 So the highest ratio is Asian Americans.

00:05:11.020 And Asian Americans, as you know, have, I think maybe among the highest education levels,

00:05:16.500 right, and educational attainment.

00:05:18.080 So what's interesting is, when I asked people how they knew, how they got the right answer,

00:05:26.020 and I didn't, they said that they had data.

00:05:31.280 And if I listened to the data, I would have had the same answer too.

00:05:36.720 And so this raises the question, why is it that the most educated people tend to look at

00:05:44.060 the wrong data, where the people with the least education were looking at the right data?

00:05:51.200 Or they were using the right heuristic or the right decision making?

00:05:55.100 So why was that?

00:05:57.260 And apparently, I trusted the government too much, and I trusted Dr. Fauci,

00:06:04.680 which is an interesting comment when you're talking about the creator of the Dilbert comic,

00:06:09.800 who for 35 years, wakes up every day, and says something about distrusting large organizations.

00:06:17.720 Every day.

00:06:19.360 But I guess I trusted Fauci too much, despite being the first person in the country to call

00:06:24.100 him a liar in public.

00:06:25.800 I still own that. 0.94

00:06:27.060 I'm the first person to call him a liar in public for the pandemic.

00:06:31.240 Maybe other people hated him before for other reasons.

00:06:34.000 And apparently, I trusted Fauci and didn't listen to all the other scientists.

00:06:42.260 So that was my problem, they say.

00:06:45.260 And so here's what I'd like to suggest.

00:06:50.220 We need a new way to check on our decisions.

00:06:53.940 And this is suggested a way of going to the whiteboard.

00:06:57.180 I didn't warn you.

00:06:58.200 I should have.

00:06:58.640 But this is sort of preliminary.

00:07:04.620 But I think we need new ways to make decisions.

00:07:08.000 In the old days, I would go to a doctor for a first opinion,

00:07:11.100 but then I would make the mistake of potentially going to a second doctor.

00:07:15.800 And what good is that going to do?

00:07:17.680 It's basically two highly educated people, probably both sheep. 0.98

00:07:23.380 So to improve my outcomes, based on what we've learned, I should go to an uneducated person,

00:07:30.300 but not an ordinary uneducated person.

00:07:34.020 Because it turns out that the lower you went in the education attainment, the more accurate

00:07:39.760 the opinions were.

00:07:41.740 So you want not just an uneducated person, but you want to go as low as you can into the

00:07:46.180 uneducated realm.

00:07:47.240 And then you want to also second, you know, maybe double-check your double-checking with

00:07:54.800 the rogue experts, but not the mainstream.

00:07:58.440 The mainstream experts tend to have a bad record, but you want to be able to pick out

00:08:04.700 the ones who are not mainstream and then believe them.

00:08:08.700 So this would be the new, sort of the new decision-making.

00:08:12.020 And I thought you could extend this a little bit, given that this phenomenon is so strong.

00:08:21.760 You know where else you see this?

00:08:23.900 Climate change.

00:08:25.720 If you were to look at climate change alarm, like who's the most afraid of climate change,

00:08:31.660 wouldn't it scale exactly with education?

00:08:35.280 It would, wouldn't it?

00:08:36.020 The more alarmed you are, it correlates with how educated you are, doesn't it?

00:08:45.480 And so, so you've got the, you've got the Davos people, the richest and probably most highly

00:08:54.840 educated group you're likely to get in one place.

00:08:58.300 You know, maybe academics would be a little different.

00:09:00.380 But in terms of a business gathering, it would probably be the, you know, some of the highest

00:09:04.980 educated, smartest people.

00:09:07.400 Now, as you've taught me recently, they're getting all the wrong answers, right?

00:09:14.520 Would you, would you agree with the statement that you've got all these brilliant people

00:09:18.260 in one place and you tell me, are they getting the right answers or the wrong answers?

00:09:24.220 It's all the wrong answers, right?

00:09:25.620 So, here's what we need.

00:09:29.040 Instead of a Davos, now, don't take this the wrong way, because I mean this as a compliment. 0.97

00:09:35.240 We need a dumb Davos, dumb Davos, because we've got a smart Davos with all the smartest 0.98

00:09:42.780 people, and if there's one thing we know about the smartest people, they are not good 0.99

00:09:47.680 at figuring stuff out.

00:09:49.900 That, that much we know for sure. 0.99

00:09:51.620 So, we need like a dumb Davos of the least educated people, and ideally the poorest, 0.97

00:09:59.800 because the elites are giving us, you know, all their elite biased opinions. 0.98

00:10:04.940 You don't want that.

00:10:06.140 You want to, you want to get the real people who got everything right. 0.97

00:10:09.300 So, if you go down there and you get a dumb Davos, and again, in this, in this context, 0.99

00:10:13.620 dumb is a compliment, right? 0.99

00:10:15.280 I remember, like I'm old enough to remember, I don't know if you are, but I don't know 0.98

00:10:21.560 how long ago was it?

00:10:23.600 Probably a month ago.

00:10:25.160 I was thinking that smart people were more likely to get the correct answers.

00:10:31.180 Like, that's how brainwashed I was.

00:10:33.400 It's like, oh, you smart people who know how to analyze things are going to get the right

00:10:36.420 answers.

00:10:37.000 Like Elon Musk.

00:10:38.940 A month ago, I thought, that guy can figure stuff out.

00:10:42.280 But it turns out he got vaccinated, so I have to revise that.

00:10:48.300 And really, I should find out who at Tesla has the lowest level of analytical abilities

00:10:55.800 and see what they did, so I can get a second opinion. 0.96

00:11:00.220 So, we see this everywhere, and I'm thinking that if we do a dumb Davos, dumb being a positive 0.95

00:11:05.740 in this case, because they get the right answers, wouldn't we be better off? 0.86

00:11:10.620 And so, I'd like to open it up to the spaces, people.

00:11:17.180 Erica, are you there?

00:11:18.740 I think you've got your...

00:11:19.920 I am here.

00:11:20.900 All right.

00:11:21.440 Erica, do you have any comments on this?

00:11:24.380 I know I just asked you out here to test the audio, but do you have anything to say

00:11:28.980 before I invite other speakers?

00:11:31.320 Well, thanks.

00:11:31.980 My only comment would be, I never considered myself an anti-vaxxer.

00:11:36.460 I never really thought about it.

00:11:37.800 Um, I was depending on smart people to make a decision to match my confirmation bias to

00:11:47.520 not get it, and yeah.

00:11:50.080 Yeah, that didn't work out, did it? 1.00

00:11:51.420 Because it turns out the smart people were the dumb people, and the dumb people were the 1.00

00:11:55.340 smart people. 0.99

00:11:56.260 But what happens when you know the dumb people are the smart people, but smart people are 1.00

00:12:00.960 dumb? 1.00

00:12:01.240 I didn't see it that way. 1.00

00:12:04.100 I don't know if you did.

00:12:05.020 It was very individual.

00:12:06.420 It was very individual for me.

00:12:08.220 And I remember Scott, like, waiting to see what you were going to do.

00:12:10.780 I'm like, okay.

00:12:12.400 Scott's going to really think this out.

00:12:13.940 He's going to analyze it.

00:12:15.320 And then I'm going to really have a better feeling about what to do.

00:12:17.920 And you were.

00:12:18.580 And you were really taking your time.

00:12:21.060 You weren't sure.

00:12:22.100 You said, I'm going to wait as long as I can.

00:12:25.120 And then.

00:12:25.980 Well, wait a minute.

00:12:26.540 Wait a minute.

00:12:27.220 Wait a minute.

00:12:27.880 Erica, you've listened to me every day from the beginning of the pandemic.

00:12:32.820 From the beginning of time, yeah.

00:12:34.660 Why is it that your opinion of how I handle the pandemic is totally different than the

00:12:40.280 people who only dipped in and saw a couple of tweets from me?

00:12:43.500 Why do you have such a different and wrong opinion than the people who didn't follow me?

00:12:49.540 How can you?

00:12:50.140 I don't know.

00:12:50.760 So I think this is another case.

00:12:52.480 I mean, Erica is proving the case again. 0.86

00:12:54.300 She has the most exposure to my opinions and yet got it completely wrong.

00:13:00.480 But the people who just saw a couple of tweets totally nailed not only my public opinion,

00:13:05.980 but my inner thoughts and my secret fears.

00:13:10.440 So that was pretty awesome.

00:13:12.280 Anyway, Erica, thank you.

00:13:14.140 I'm going to take some, see if I can find a critic.

00:13:16.860 Okay.

00:13:17.800 Okay.

00:13:18.360 Good luck finding a critic.

00:13:19.740 All right.

00:13:21.780 All right.

00:13:22.400 I'm going to remove.

00:13:24.300 Remove the speaker.

00:13:27.100 This interface is a little.

00:13:29.960 All right.

00:13:30.320 Carla.

00:13:31.740 Let's see.

00:13:33.520 Carla, I'm going to add you as a speaker.

00:13:35.980 Are you there, Carla?

00:13:39.840 People take a while to turn on their microphones.

00:13:42.360 Carla, if you were there, activate your microphone, please.

00:13:46.160 If you don't, I'm going to go somewhere else.

00:13:51.520 Carla, you are removed from speakers for not being fast.

00:13:55.460 Randall has requested.

00:13:57.220 Randall, come on in here. 0.91

00:14:02.020 Randall, can you hear me?

00:14:03.080 If you can, turn your microphone on.

00:14:05.380 Yes, sir.

00:14:05.980 Thank you very much.

00:14:06.780 Oh.

00:14:07.080 Hi, Randall.

00:14:07.860 What would you like to say or ask or criticize?

00:14:11.700 Well, I think it was a moving target.

00:14:13.120 I mean, I think you can be right to varying extents at different times.

00:14:15.940 I think as Omicron came into existence, it was an absurdity to keep pushing the vaccine and for people to listen, obviously.

00:14:26.240 Omicron is not a genetic genomic relative of the original SARS-CoV-2 strains, as were the other Greek letters.

00:14:33.760 And, you know, to answer your question, why people fell for this, I mean, it was huge propaganda and a social aspect and so forth.

00:14:42.300 But it was a clear malfeasance.

00:14:44.220 I don't think we've seen the back end of kind of the political kind of kickback scheme from the pharmacology and whatnot, from the pharmacologic companies and so forth.

00:14:55.020 But to keep pushing this and now bivalent and so forth when SARS-CoV-2 no longer exists on Earth is an absurdity.

00:15:01.120 As far as your own position, I think it's an amazing thing that you, you know, kind of made this very logical admission, and you should be, you know, proud of that.

00:15:10.300 I think that if you've gone over the short-term phase healthy, I don't think there's likely to be much more in the way of long-term problems.

00:15:18.140 I think most of the problems are on the short-term phase.

00:15:20.600 So I'm a medical doctor.

00:15:22.980 I'm not intending to give you medical advice over the Internet and whatnot, but I think a lot of the problems are on the short-term aspect.

00:15:29.360 Ah, okay.

00:15:30.380 I think we found the problem here, Randall.

00:15:32.600 You're a medical doctor?

00:15:34.500 Yes, sir.

00:15:35.200 Well, why aren't you listening more to Alex Berenson, who's a journalist?

00:15:42.220 You should be getting, because even today, well, hold on, hold on, Randall.

00:15:45.920 Even today, he told us on Twitter that long COVID is fake.

00:15:50.920 Are you getting your information from, like, journals and stuff, or do you get it from Alex Berenson, like a smart person?

00:15:58.540 I have been listening to Alex Berenson a lot.

00:16:00.820 I've been doing my own videocast on a small basis throughout the COVID pandemic.

00:16:06.360 I have not followed him today.

00:16:07.700 I don't follow everything, all things COVID, all the time.

00:16:11.020 I think long COVID probably will fall into the same category as all of our other previous kind of long problems.

00:16:16.920 Well, you know, there was chronic mononucleosis.

00:16:21.080 We've had neurasthenia.

00:16:22.320 I think all through the history of mankind, we've had these kind of, like, quasi-depression things, fibromyalgia and whatnot.

00:16:30.500 I think long COVID will probably fall into that category.

00:16:32.640 I think the study that I saw from Israel, that there's not that much of it, really, you know, but people, you know, people are funny things.

00:16:41.420 You know, we, you know, microbiologically, radiologically, pharmacologically, you can't find the soul, but people probably have them in a sense or act as if they do, and as Bart Simpson did.

00:16:52.640 And people will, you know, get torn up and swirled around in the tornado of their emotions.

00:17:02.480 And I think that people will, you know, think they have long COVID because they're, you know, we certainly did nothing to help people get away from COVID.

00:17:09.580 We blocked people.

00:17:10.280 Wait, are you, Randall, are you, or let me call you a doctor.

00:17:14.600 Sure, don't be Randall, that's fine.

00:17:16.260 Now, are you suggesting that long COVID will probably not be real, or it will be real, but as real as all of other long stuff?

00:17:27.000 Yeah, I think it's, look, I mean, you know, we treat individuals.

00:17:30.860 I only see individuals, and I try to deal with them as, you know, helpfully as I can.

00:17:36.080 And you don't necessarily want to put, you know, kind of rub people's noses in their infirmities or their misconceptions.

00:17:42.840 And so if somebody is tied to, you know, having long COVID, I'm not going to argue with that person.

00:17:47.780 You know, I think if you, you know, were to do things pathologically and somehow could, you could do an immediate dissection of, you know, super MRI and check all their cells and whatnot, I doubt you'd find a tissue diagnosis of long COVID in people.

00:18:00.840 You know, I don't think coronavirus per se is that unusual thing.

00:18:04.280 I mean, coronaviruses have existed as long as human beings, you know, coincident on the earth.

00:18:08.060 And, you know, if you look at journals before the SARS of 2003 or either one, you know, 2019, 2020, you'll find the coronaviruses by type were the second leading named cause of the common cold.

00:18:21.660 So, you know, zillions, you know, billions, whatever, you know, of cases over thousands of years or hundreds of thousands, whatever.

00:18:28.820 So through the existence of time, there have been coronaviruses in humans, and we've never noticed this long COVID before.

00:18:34.080 So I don't think, you know, I think SARS-CoV-2 is a slightly, you know, stronger version because it came from the animals, you know, it didn't need to have equilibrated with humans.

00:18:45.920 You know, the example I give is coyotes and dogs.

00:18:49.260 There are coyotes existing right now, and there are schnauzers existing right now.

00:18:53.340 They're related, and they have some common ancestor who's probably more wolf-like than schnauzer-like because the schnauzers, you know, and puppies or poodles or whatever have all been domesticated from wolves and coyotes and whatnot.

00:19:04.080 But the coyotes don't need us, and coyotes can come and swoop down, and, you know, like the dingo ate my baby, they can come take something, and they don't care.

00:19:12.320 And so when you have a zoonotic virus, they can come in and swoop down and be, you know, damaging and then disappear.

00:19:18.360 But the schnauzers and poodles and whatnot, they don't want to do that.

00:19:23.360 They don't want to eat their host because they'll starve themselves.

00:19:26.280 And so over time, these viruses equilibrate.

00:19:28.740 So what we're seeing now is basically kind of an equilibration of the, you know, the tornado, the coyote, more, you know, evil, whatever, dangerous SARS-CoV-2, which, mind you, was not that dangerous, all things considered.

00:19:42.060 If you look at the spectrum of influenza viruses pre-vaccine, so if you stack SARS-CoV-2 or SARS-CoV-1 up against Spanish flu, and both were, you know, given to populations, naive, no vaccines, extant in either population, you know, I would rather have SARS-CoV-2 than the Spanish flu.

00:20:03.640 So the Spanish flu killed a lot of young people, and SARS-CoV-2 predominantly killed in the median age of death.

00:20:08.760 It was like 82 worldwide.

00:20:10.400 And so it's mostly people with infirmities, you know, multiple diagnoses and whatnot.

00:20:15.320 But, you know, getting back to the zoonotic thing, you know, right now, you know, in order for the virus to coexist with people who come in cold viruses, they don't have a zoonotic host.

00:20:25.440 They don't have an animal host.

00:20:26.420 So the ones that do can come in and swoop down and be difficult all the time.

00:20:30.560 Like influenza, as an animal host, it's probably domestic pigs in China, historically, who come, you know, are brought into the house because, you know, there's tiny farms and whatnot.

00:20:39.240 They want to keep the animals warm.

00:20:40.720 So in the winter, they bring the animals back in the house, and they get, you know, they get the sniffles from their pigs.

00:20:45.600 They go to market, and they spread this thing.

00:20:47.480 So every year we've had the, you know, the Hong Kong flu, the Shanghai flu, this flu, that flu.

00:20:51.880 But they're all Chinese names because that's what the Chinese farmers have done, and then commerce brings it around the world.

00:20:57.720 And so the influenza tends to be a more potent virus because it doesn't need humans per se.

00:21:02.840 So it can equilibrate in another animal and then come back to people.

00:21:07.240 But the other common colds, you know, adenovirus, rhinovirus, all that kind of stuff, we just, you know, sniffle and whatnot.

00:21:11.920 And the viruses don't have brains, but, you know, in the population sense, they don't want to knock us down too much because then they will not be able to persist.

00:21:23.840 So if they kill somebody, then that virus and that person doesn't pass on to the next person.

00:21:28.120 So on a populace, again, this is kind of an iterative, you know, kind of a huge, massive computer problem in a sense.

00:21:33.280 But, you know, trillions of viruses and billions of people, the ones that will be, you can basically have a choice.

00:21:40.540 You can be hugely virulent or you can be hugely numerous, so transmissible or more powerful.

00:21:46.320 And the ones that are hugely powerful, like Ebola, don't tend to be hugely widespread because they make like a meteor crater.

00:21:52.640 They crash down and that's that.

00:21:55.500 And everyone else moves away because we have population response to the virus.

00:21:58.460 We move away from it.

00:22:00.220 So a virus, in order to pass around to billions of people, has to be somewhat surreptitious and not kill them.

00:22:06.420 So it has to be like a good spy.

00:22:07.960 All right.

00:22:09.080 Yeah, I think I got the gist of it.

00:22:12.180 I want to let some other people in here, but thank you, doctor, for all the background.

00:22:17.700 I want to just make sure I get some more people in here, okay?

00:22:20.380 Yeah, thank you so much.

00:22:21.520 Appreciate it.

00:22:21.960 All right.

00:22:22.300 Thank you very much.

00:22:28.120 All right.

00:22:28.740 Let's see what else we'd like to talk.

00:22:31.660 Dr. Molly.

00:22:36.080 Dr. Molly James, can you hear me?

00:22:39.740 Hi.

00:22:40.060 Yes, I can.

00:22:40.680 Thank you.

00:22:40.980 Good morning.

00:22:42.720 Do you have a comment or a question?

00:22:45.700 Yep.

00:22:45.940 I just wanted to comment on what he was talking about with coronavirus.

00:22:48.800 And this isn't the typical coronavirus because of the spike protein.

00:22:53.060 And that is completely what weaponized it and has changed the face of this.

00:22:56.880 That is why I have commented repeatedly, people are not dying from COVID.

00:23:01.080 They're dying of cytokine storm, which people fail to talk about.

00:23:05.880 This is the reason that patients in the hospitals did so poorly is because they didn't recognize cytokine storm and it wasn't treated.

00:23:11.760 We were treating for a virus instead of an inflammatory condition.

00:23:15.580 So, you know, the last speaker, I would have to kindly disagree that this isn't, quote, a normal coronavirus.

00:23:21.060 And also, we have several syndromes.

00:23:24.320 You know, he was talking about long COVID.

00:23:25.840 We have several syndromes that are clinical in nature that don't have a tissue diagnosis.

00:23:29.700 And likely what happened is the inflammation from spike has exacerbated or caused a lot of inflammation and inflammatory or autoimmune situations that are presenting as clinical symptoms.

00:23:41.600 Now, how is the layperson such as myself supposed to know which of you two doctors has the right take on it?

00:23:51.180 How would we know the difference?

00:23:53.100 Two experts tell us different things.

00:23:56.260 How do we sort about it?

00:23:57.220 So, I don't know the other doctor's background, so I'll tell you mine and you can choose.

00:24:00.440 I treated 6,000 COVID patients.

00:24:02.420 The first 2,000 were in the ICU in New York City during the pandemic and in the Midwest.

00:24:07.060 And most of those patients were treated by the NIH protocols and died.

00:24:10.280 I then left the ICU and treated with early treatment, and I had less than 1% mortality.

00:24:15.600 And those were patients presenting with stats in the 60s and 70s in severe distress that never went to a hospital.

00:24:22.060 So, I'll let you decide.

00:24:23.560 What did you give them for early treatment?

00:24:26.640 So, we gave a combination of ivermectin, steroids, medications like Singulair, ciproheptadine, finasteride, and then we were using hyperbaric oxygen.

00:24:38.840 How many of the people who died with the standard treatment died on ventilators?

00:24:44.480 Was it the ventilators killing people?

00:24:46.820 It wasn't the ventilators killing people.

00:24:48.880 The ventilators are just a tool.

00:24:51.120 So, the cytokine storm, this massive inflammation and blood clotting, destroyed the lungs, right?

00:24:57.080 It created, basically it filled up the lungs.

00:25:00.000 So, the patients, they said, I can't breathe, right?

00:25:01.980 What they meant is, I can't take a deep breath in, because their lungs were filled up with this inflammation.

00:25:07.900 And so, when we put them on ventilators, we had to do that because they were breathing 40, 50, 60 times a minute, right?

00:25:13.560 There was no other choice.

00:25:14.560 They would have become exhausted and died.

00:25:17.240 It's like if you went to run a marathon, but the marathon never ended, okay?

00:25:21.200 Right.

00:25:21.400 But, the lungs were very, very fragile.

00:25:24.720 So, and we didn't treat them properly for their inflammatory condition.

00:25:29.080 They were getting 6 milligrams of dexamethasone twice a day.

00:25:32.460 If somebody has an airway compromise, we get 40 milligrams of dexamethasone a day, you know, in the ICU.

00:25:38.380 So, they were completely undertreated.

00:25:39.680 Let me ask sort of a patient question.

00:25:44.220 Yeah.

00:25:44.340 So, you had this experience, which is dramatic, and the differences between those two sound like night and day.

00:25:51.080 But, did you find that you couldn't convince other doctors and professionals that your take was the right one?

00:26:00.260 Yes, I have, but most of those people aren't in clinical practice.

00:26:04.580 Or, they're not in practice.

00:26:05.900 So, you're saying that the people who have the same experience as you are largely on the same side?

00:26:14.540 So, let me go back.

00:26:16.640 So, the people in the ICU are not convinced, right?

00:26:19.620 Like, my entire profession thinks that what they're doing with remdesivir is correct.

00:26:23.900 That's why people continue to die.

00:26:25.840 And, it's dropped dramatically since Delta went away.

00:26:28.240 I want to point that out as well.

00:26:29.600 Because, since Omicron came, we're not seeing cytokine storm, which is why you're not hearing about ventilators so much.

00:26:34.680 Right.

00:26:35.080 But, those people in the ICU are absolutely 100% convinced that they have to vaccinate their way out of this.

00:26:40.920 And, they're completely traumatized by what they saw.

00:26:43.400 We've never seen so much death in the ICU as we have during the last three years.

00:26:49.240 So, come to the early treatment side.

00:26:51.200 And, the people who are successfully treating their patients absolutely buy into this.

00:26:54.680 I see Dr. Vaughn on here and some other doctors that I've seen that are actively treating patients and having good outcomes.

00:27:00.440 Well, wait, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on, though.

00:27:02.440 But, we're in the age of Omicron now.

00:27:04.580 Everybody's fine.

00:27:05.780 Like, can you really tell the difference between good and bad treatment for Omicron?

00:27:09.860 Don't they all just get a, you know, tough few days and they're fine, no matter what you do?

00:27:15.420 Um, yes and no.

00:27:20.000 What I can tell is people get better faster when you give them early treatment.

00:27:24.180 But, I don't disagree with you.

00:27:25.820 We're not seeing the death that we saw before.

00:27:28.220 Okay.

00:27:28.980 All right.

00:27:29.500 Thank you, doctor.

00:27:30.480 I appreciate that.

00:27:31.200 Thanks.

00:27:31.640 All right.

00:27:32.600 Bye for now.

00:27:33.120 All right.

00:27:36.660 That was interesting.

00:27:37.740 Let's get a non-doctor on here. 1.00

00:27:41.680 Let's see.

00:27:42.280 Who looks very non-doctorish?

00:27:45.760 I want to look, I'm looking for somebody's face who looks like they're really going to give me a fight.

00:27:50.480 All right.

00:27:50.860 Caroline.

00:27:53.020 Caroline, you look like you're ready to fight.

00:27:57.980 I don't think so, but we'll see.

00:28:01.240 All right.

00:28:01.740 Caroline is your, oh.

00:28:03.120 So, there you go.

00:28:03.740 Your microphone on?

00:28:05.420 Yes, I'm here.

00:28:06.680 Hi.

00:28:07.000 Do you have a question or comment?

00:28:10.340 Both.

00:28:11.780 Thanks for inviting me up.

00:28:13.260 I just wanted to commend you for the video that you made.

00:28:17.080 I think a lot of people, when they find out that they're wrong, an acknowledgement feels like a lie.

00:28:23.340 And your video and this face are evidence of a whole lot more than an acknowledgement.

00:28:27.660 Thank you.

00:28:28.220 But no compliments.

00:28:29.520 Thank you, and I'm sorry.

00:28:31.160 No compliments.

00:28:32.480 Insults only.

00:28:34.020 All right.

00:28:34.480 Or criticisms, if you have any.

00:28:36.340 My comment was that I think to the question of the space where educated people getting the wrong answers on vaccines.

00:28:45.780 I think in the community of highly educated and credentialed people, the culture is really to rely on the education and the credentials of the people around them.

00:29:00.960 And we maybe put a little bit too much stock in that.

00:29:04.200 And so, I just wanted to draw a distinction between people who are educated and people who are curious.

00:29:11.420 And I think that a lot of the people who did get this right, that I've observed in my life, are people who are curious.

00:29:22.260 They're curious about the people around them, the world around them.

00:29:25.140 Because I wouldn't even say skeptical.

00:29:27.820 They're just people that want to understand how things work.

00:29:32.360 Let me ask you this.

00:29:34.880 Do you think that there are people in the category of who did not want to get vaccinated, but if they had, they'd still be alive?

00:29:44.880 Is there anybody in that category?

00:29:46.740 Or is that empty?

00:29:47.440 People who did not want to get vaccinated and did not get vaccinated that would still be alive.

00:29:55.040 Is there anybody dead who would be alive had they got vaccinated, let's say during Alpha and Delta, not so much now.

00:30:05.200 I mean, I would have to say that I'm sure there's always exceptions.

00:30:10.920 I would have to say I'm sure that maybe somebody would have had that situation.

00:30:16.380 I don't think that the evidence bears that out at all.

00:30:20.180 So at this point, you would say the evidence does not show that there's any population that benefited from the so-called vaccinations.

00:30:29.500 That there's not somebody alive who would otherwise be dead as far as your take on the data?

00:30:36.580 Correct.

00:30:37.220 I mean, you couldn't make that argument for an entire segment of the population.

00:30:42.960 Absolutely not.

00:30:43.240 That there's nobody, let's say over 65, who died who didn't need to, let's say if they'd taken the vaccination.

00:30:52.640 You believe there's nobody in that category?

00:30:55.740 Of people who were unvaccinated?

00:30:58.200 Are there any people who died who would not be dead had they been vaccinated, like any?

00:31:03.600 Man, my gut is no.

00:31:10.160 I mean, the evidence does not bear that out.

00:31:12.640 Like I say, there are always exceptions to every rule, but there is no evidence that that is true.

00:31:19.480 So the million or so people who died, did they die of the, they died of coronavirus, or maybe they didn't.

00:31:30.500 Maybe they died with it.

00:31:32.440 Okay.

00:31:33.080 All right.

00:31:33.580 Thank you, Caroline.

00:31:34.800 Let's...

00:31:35.380 Thank you.

00:31:35.840 We're going to get another speaker up here.

00:31:37.500 Appreciate it.

00:31:38.560 Thank you.

00:31:38.900 All right.

00:31:43.820 David, you're coming up.

00:31:46.120 I hope your mic is on, David.

00:31:50.860 We're connecting here.

00:31:52.620 David, can you hear me?

00:31:56.140 Turn on your microphone if you can.

00:31:59.060 Your microphone is muted.

00:32:00.340 Okay.

00:32:04.420 That didn't work.

00:32:05.580 We're removing David.

00:32:07.260 David, sorry about that.

00:32:09.920 Let's try...

00:32:13.040 I think we're going to go with this monkey person here.

00:32:18.060 Somebody who's representing as a monkey. 0.52

00:32:20.820 That looks like that would be interesting.

00:32:23.520 I'm going to go with the monkey.

00:32:26.380 All right.

00:32:27.080 Bam, can you hear me?

00:32:29.280 Yes.

00:32:29.660 Hi, Scott.

00:32:30.340 Hi.

00:32:31.120 Do you have a comment or a criticism?

00:32:35.840 I have a little bit of both.

00:32:37.860 All right.

00:32:38.380 Let's hear it.

00:32:39.700 I want to say I've listened to you for a while, and I appreciate you.

00:32:44.580 So in terms of the kind of the axis of who can we trust, I think it falls apart into what other background?

00:32:57.160 What's the ideology?

00:32:59.480 Because when you think about people, how they think about the pandemic, it can be about all the numbers, and you can think about how many people did we save in general.

00:33:12.820 And those are the scientists, you know, they think about the statistics, but then there are other people that think about just giving all the information out and treating each person individual.

00:33:24.940 So I think that makes a big difference on who can you trust.

00:33:33.180 So you would trust more of the people who are treating individuals rather than treating to the data?

00:33:40.420 Well, I would want to get the information from both.

00:33:46.600 And kind of, you know, myself.

00:33:51.720 I'm a layman.

00:33:52.880 I'm not a scientist.

00:33:53.920 I'm not an academic.

00:33:55.580 Why do you think the most educated people got the wrong answer?

00:34:03.260 Why do you think that is?

00:34:05.560 Well, in part, I think it's because they have less time to look at people's backgrounds.

00:34:10.300 Like some people that I followed through the pandemic, I had followed from before.

00:34:15.720 And I had a certain amount of trust in them from way back.

00:34:19.400 But when they came out and gave some comments on the pandemic, I had already developed trust in them in general.

00:34:30.420 And I knew their ideology a little bit more than I did of the, you know, the scientists and the TV that came from the CDC or wherever.

00:34:39.060 So the ideology.

00:34:40.640 All right.

00:34:41.440 I'm being asked to invite some different people on.

00:34:44.580 So I'm going to move on.

00:34:45.740 Thank you for your comments.

00:34:47.380 Okay.

00:34:47.880 Thank you.

00:34:48.220 Thank you.

00:34:50.140 Let's see.

00:34:53.940 Let's see.

00:34:54.880 I heard you say.

00:34:59.360 Did somebody say that Brett is on here?

00:35:02.140 Brett Weinstein?

00:35:05.240 Is he still on?

00:35:05.980 I don't see him listed.

00:35:07.000 There are too many people on here.

00:35:08.000 Let's see.

00:35:08.960 I'll do a quick search and see if he's there.

00:35:14.800 All right.

00:35:15.200 There's a ton of people who you're mentioning that I can't.

00:35:17.860 See, because the interface changes as I scroll.

00:35:21.320 See that?

00:35:22.440 See, you can't even scroll down.

00:35:24.320 It's actually changing as you scroll.

00:35:26.340 See, you don't even know if you've already looked at that page.

00:35:29.580 I don't even know how to find anybody here.

00:35:31.880 Can I do a search?

00:35:35.020 Can I do a search?

00:35:36.080 All right.

00:35:36.460 Sorry.

00:35:36.760 It's just a terrible interface.

00:35:39.660 Well, it's not a terrible interface, but when you get...

00:35:42.760 Oh, my God.

00:35:43.460 It's just dancing all around here.

00:35:44.960 You can't...

00:35:45.760 Yeah, you can't even barely select things.

00:35:48.240 It's just moving all around.

00:35:50.620 All right.

00:35:51.060 Well, I've got way more...

00:35:55.520 Oh, we've got 1,200 people listening.

00:35:58.600 That's crazy.

00:36:00.660 All right.

00:36:01.640 Sorry I'm being boring, but it's hard to pick from the interface because it's just dancing around here.

00:36:07.020 But I don't want to pick just from the people who are in the top of the list.

00:36:09.780 So, I'm going to randomly pick Mike.

00:36:20.300 Mike, can you hear me?

00:36:24.920 Mike, take your microphone off...

00:36:28.920 That's not good.

00:36:33.280 Mike?

00:36:35.560 Mike?

00:36:37.200 Yes, can you hear me?

00:36:38.660 I can hear you.

00:36:39.440 Do you have a question or a comment on why educated people...

00:36:44.540 Yeah, it's not a lot.

00:36:44.980 Yeah.

00:36:46.240 Sorry about that.

00:36:47.740 So, I just wanted to let you know a couple of things early on that I picked up because I listen to your show every day.

00:36:53.480 I don't agree with you all the time, but I appreciate your views and perspectives on things.

00:36:59.380 But a couple of criticisms, maybe you could call it, is that one of the things I noticed early on with Dr. Robert Malone was on Joe Rogan.

00:37:12.460 And I felt like you were kind of dismissive of that discussion.

00:37:17.060 Well, you have to be specific.

00:37:18.720 Not dismissive of discussion, but rather a specific fact or a specific point.

00:37:24.580 Well, no, I just, I feel like you, I don't know, that was just one of the things early on.

00:37:30.120 And, um...

00:37:31.380 Now, are you aware that I made the same decisions as Dr. Malone at about the same time and for the same reasons?

00:37:39.340 Oh, yeah, yeah, absolutely.

00:37:40.700 Okay.

00:37:40.960 And, um, I just, and there was that.

00:37:43.760 And then there was a tweet that you put out that I think rubbed a lot of people the wrong way where you tweeted that for the vaccinated, it was a Tuesday for the unvaccinated, you're in the middle of a deadly pandemic.

00:37:54.740 Thank you.

00:37:55.260 I think that's the thing.

00:37:55.980 I see that retweeted a lot.

00:37:57.560 Thank you.

00:37:58.440 Thank you.

00:37:59.020 That's exactly what I was hoping somebody would bring up.

00:38:01.780 How many of you remember or saw a tweet of mine in which I said, after I got vaccinated in 20, whatever it was, and I tweeted that for the vaccinated, now, if you're unvaccinated, you're in a deadly pandemic, and if you're vaccinated, it's a Tuesday or a Wednesday, whatever I said.

00:38:21.520 How many saw that?

00:38:23.780 All right, a lot of you did.

00:38:24.660 All right, a lot of you did.

00:38:25.340 All right, so I've got some feedback here.

00:38:28.380 So turn off your mic.

00:38:31.700 I have to mute you.

00:38:37.660 I had to remove him.

00:38:38.860 He had his speaker on, so it was feedback.

00:38:43.100 So let me explain that.

00:38:45.340 How many of you thought that was a fact, that I was relaying data?

00:38:52.000 Did that sound like a data argument to you?

00:38:55.520 Because it shouldn't.

00:38:56.480 Did you take it as an opinion?

00:39:00.280 Because you should have taken it as how I felt.

00:39:03.800 How I felt was I had now done everything I needed to do.

00:39:08.480 I had no more decisions to make.

00:39:10.920 At the time, the masks had already dropped.

00:39:13.760 They came back, but at the time, there were no masks.

00:39:16.260 So I had no masks.

00:39:17.440 And once I was vaccinated, I could go anywhere, and I could travel internationally.

00:39:23.320 I could take my vacation to Greece.

00:39:25.100 So when I got the vaccination, my feeling was I have no more pandemic-related problems.

00:39:34.580 But the people who had not got vaccinated were still living under some constraints that I no longer had.

00:39:41.180 So to me, the pandemic was over.

00:39:44.480 I'd done everything I needed to do.

00:39:46.020 And, you know, I had my freedom back temporarily.

00:39:51.720 The masks came back.

00:39:53.640 So a lot of people have fact-checked me on my feeling.

00:39:59.000 Does that make sense?

00:40:01.260 Why were you fact-checking me on my feeling?

00:40:04.020 That was how I felt.

00:40:06.540 That's how I felt.

00:40:07.520 Jenny is saying, take the L.

00:40:12.120 Jenny, why do you think we're here?

00:40:15.860 You might be missing the context here, Jenny.

00:40:20.200 No, my feeling is my feeling.

00:40:22.540 You can't fact-check a feeling.

00:40:25.100 Can you?

00:40:27.160 Who's fact-checking my feeling?

00:40:30.400 Jenny, taking the L is the only reason I'm here. 1.00

00:40:33.960 So you're too much of an asshole, so I'm going to get rid of you. 0.99

00:40:40.460 So the funniest thing about my video, I mean, I pinned a video saying the people who didn't get vaccinated are the winners. 1.00

00:40:51.040 And there's still somebody out here yelling, take the L, take the L.

00:40:56.600 It's like you can't take yes for an answer.

00:40:59.080 So Alex Berenson dunked on me on Twitter today.

00:41:03.100 And he wasn't happy to take my, he wasn't going to take yes for an answer.

00:41:09.460 He was a little bit angry about the things I've said about him in the past.

00:41:13.480 Didn't take it too well.

00:41:15.460 So some people don't want to take the win.

00:41:17.760 All right.

00:41:18.940 Ian.

00:41:21.040 Ian, are you there?

00:41:24.280 I think you will be.

00:41:28.960 Ian.

00:41:30.040 Hey, Scott.

00:41:30.880 How's it going?

00:41:31.420 Good.

00:41:31.840 How are you?

00:41:32.340 What would you like to say today?

00:41:36.160 Well, I mean, you know, you mentioned how a feeling made you take the vaccine, right?

00:41:42.040 No, no, no.

00:41:43.820 No?

00:41:44.400 No, I didn't say that.

00:41:45.780 What was it?

00:41:46.500 What's the reason you took the vaccine?

00:41:48.500 Was it just the data?

00:41:49.620 Was that the sole reason?

00:41:51.100 Well, there wasn't any data.

00:41:53.520 True.

00:41:53.780 So there was a risk of long COVID, which might be zero, or might be extreme, and we knew less

00:42:00.480 about it then.

00:42:01.600 And there was a risk from the virus itself, which we didn't know how engineered it was.

00:42:07.080 So there were two extreme risks that could not be measured.

00:42:11.560 And then the tiebreaker, I did the same tiebreaker as Dr. Malone and Elon Musk, which is I needed to travel, what I wanted, to travel internationally.

00:42:21.460 And so I had two impossible-to-measure risks, but the only thing that was unknown is I wanted to travel.

00:42:31.500 So I got it, and then I traveled, and I'm still alive, but now I have those chemicals in me, and who knows what those will do.

00:42:41.000 Well, the risk of the virus itself has now dropped to basically zero.

00:42:48.180 So what was your question?

00:42:52.420 Oh, looks like you dropped off.

00:42:54.600 I have to add him back on.

00:42:59.240 All right, Ian.

00:43:01.980 Oh, I think he disappeared.

00:43:04.980 Bummer.

00:43:05.780 All right.

00:43:07.040 Let's try somebody else.

00:43:10.260 Let's try...

00:43:12.320 I want somebody who's going to give me a hard time.

00:43:14.380 Otherwise, this won't be fun.

00:43:16.060 The people who agree with me are not going to be a good show.

00:43:20.700 So let's look for Mike.

00:43:24.740 Another Mike.

00:43:26.540 Mike, are you there?

00:43:27.440 Mike, are you there?

00:43:31.500 Mike, your speaker is muted.

00:43:35.080 Unmute your speaker, Mike.

00:43:38.580 Mike is not quick enough.

00:43:40.580 Mike is deleted.

00:43:42.300 Got to be quick.

00:43:43.460 Folks, you got to be quick.

00:43:44.400 Mike, I was looking for Adam.

00:43:47.040 I invited him once before, and he didn't want to come on.

00:43:52.560 But how about... 0.98

00:43:54.000 Ah, damn it. 0.99

00:43:55.200 It's the interface. 0.99

00:43:55.920 Marty, Blarfest, turn off your muting.

00:44:04.660 Marty, Blarfest.

00:44:05.240 There you are.

00:44:06.620 Hey.

00:44:09.140 Hey.

00:44:09.740 Got a question or a comment?

00:44:10.880 Well, I'm happy to disagree with you about something in a minute, if you want.

00:44:17.180 But I will point out, I'm sure you're well aware of the answer to the question, why are

00:44:22.200 educated people getting the wrong answers?

00:44:25.380 That's a, you know, cognitive distance issue right there.

00:44:30.680 That's all that is.

00:44:32.000 Because we don't even know who the educated...

00:44:34.080 People we call educated, some of them have college degrees and they're not really educated.

00:44:38.380 But, um...

00:44:40.460 So you're saying that the lesser educated people were, uh, had an immunity to cognitive dissonance

00:44:47.560 in this...

00:44:47.940 No, not at all.

00:44:48.860 Not at all.

00:44:50.500 Not at all.

00:44:51.300 We all found the answer we were looking for.

00:44:53.560 Then why did the educated people get the wrong answer?

00:45:00.020 Well, because...

00:45:01.820 Well, I get you.

00:45:05.560 The issue...

00:45:06.380 I don't actually don't have any issues and I think it's remarkable how you handle things

00:45:11.320 given all the assaults.

00:45:13.940 But I will say that from the very beginning of the pandemic and the vaccines and everything,

00:45:19.700 I thought it was very strange in the very beginning when everybody talked about the

00:45:25.500 coming vaccine and how great it was going to be, especially President Trump.

00:45:28.840 And there were, of course, some Democrats saying we will never take the Trump vaccine.

00:45:34.000 And I thought to myself, I don't think anybody would ever take that vaccine no matter what.

00:45:37.620 Why would you take this vaccine that usually takes 10 years to make and then all of a sudden

00:45:43.380 they have it in nine months?

00:45:45.160 And there were just a lot of questions about the whole thing.

00:45:47.600 And then when it came time to talk about those questions, they were snuffed out by one side

00:45:52.480 of the argument.

00:45:53.540 And that was my clue.

00:45:54.920 When you can't have an open debate about something, the side that's suppressing that debate is not

00:46:01.540 being honest.

00:46:02.600 And I thought that would be obvious to nearly everybody.

00:46:05.240 But that's the part that I don't understand why educated people couldn't understand, because

00:46:10.880 that's the function I always have felt.

00:46:15.480 People should understand.

00:46:17.640 Suppose you were in charge of the pandemic and you believed that the information you were

00:46:24.340 putting out was correct and it would save millions of lives.

00:46:28.080 Would you try to suppress the information you thought would kill millions of lives?

00:46:32.840 Or would you let the free speech do its thing?

00:46:37.280 I don't know how I would be in that position, because I wonder how the people in charge got

00:46:43.280 and trusted their information, too, being that they are supposedly educated.

00:46:48.840 Well, but I'm OK.

00:46:51.320 Seriously, let's go to the top and root it out.

00:46:53.640 Let's find out who really gave that person the information.

00:46:56.760 I don't think, you know, it wasn't one person beginning that there was a consensus in the

00:47:02.280 science.

00:47:03.200 There was a lot of disagreement on the science of what little data was left to us.

00:47:08.220 And it turns out there is there was no consensus.

00:47:12.380 But we were led to believe we were intentionally led to believe there was some kind of consensus.

00:47:16.740 And there never was.

00:47:18.480 It was just the government leaders taking the side of the most coercive argument.

00:47:25.680 That's all it was.

00:47:27.140 All right.

00:47:27.400 Thank you for your comments.

00:47:29.780 Thank you.

00:47:32.760 Remove from the speakers.

00:47:34.420 I think Ian's back.

00:47:36.960 While I'm bringing Ian up here, let me clarify.

00:47:41.160 There were, of course, brilliant and highly educated people on all sides of the debates.

00:47:47.120 Yeah, my phone just like randomly crashed.

00:47:50.640 All right.

00:47:50.900 You're back.

00:47:51.260 Let me just finish a point and then we'll go to you, Ian.

00:47:54.480 Somebody was saying that I wasn't making the point that there were highly educated people

00:47:59.940 on both sides.

00:48:00.980 There were.

00:48:01.960 It's just that the trend is a very strong trend that the more educated you were, the

00:48:08.020 more likely you took the vaccination.

00:48:09.860 So I'm not saying only smart people who were on one side.

00:48:13.000 Nothing like that.

00:48:14.180 All right, Ian, go ahead.

00:48:15.700 Yeah.

00:48:16.100 So the question I wanted to ask you, and this is kind of like a weird thing, right?

00:48:19.760 So I kind of figured out pretty early on that a vaccine didn't really work, right?

00:48:24.100 Because it wasn't really showing efficacy against Delta.

00:48:27.140 And then when Omicron came in, you know, you would have people in your face.

00:48:29.740 Hold on.

00:48:29.760 Hold on.

00:48:30.580 Ian?

00:48:30.920 Ian?

00:48:31.200 Yeah?

00:48:31.720 We have to clarify in this conversation when you say it worked.

00:48:35.940 We found out early on that it wasn't stopping transmission.

00:48:40.000 But even...

00:48:40.580 Oh, yeah.

00:48:40.700 That's what I'm referring to, yeah.

00:48:41.680 It wasn't stopping any transmission.

00:48:43.060 And so, you know, by the definition of a vaccine, it kind of failed in that aspect, right?

00:48:47.280 Right.

00:48:47.440 And then, you know, some scientists supposedly, you know, came out and said that, hey, it's

00:48:51.540 showing some efficacy in the hospitalization rates.

00:48:54.460 Now, we don't know if that's, you know, entirely true.

00:48:56.140 The sample sizes are really small, at least the ones I've seen.

00:48:58.780 So I don't know if there's some dispute there.

00:49:01.060 Well, hold on.

00:49:01.940 Hold on.

00:49:02.580 Let's do a fact check.

00:49:04.000 Are you saying that there's a dispute today that vaccinated people are doing better than

00:49:11.520 unvaccinated people in the hospitals?

00:49:14.400 Is that still a question?

00:49:15.620 I think that was what was being told to us, right?

00:49:19.120 Like, that was...

00:49:20.320 They're saying people who had the vaccine were showing that, you know, they had better results

00:49:25.140 in the hospitals.

00:49:25.940 I don't think that actually is true nowadays because the vast majority of people, at least

00:49:31.040 the ones that have been sampled, have been vaccinated, right?

00:49:33.400 In countries like Japan, you know, 90% of the population plus, you know, has been, or

00:49:37.600 at least actually closer to 100% have been vaccinated, and yet everybody's still getting

00:49:42.080 sick.

00:49:42.420 They're still getting in the hospital.

00:49:43.400 So I don't think there's any real significant difference.

00:49:46.500 I mean, China's the same way.

00:49:47.720 There's thousands of hospitalizations a day, and they've all been vaccinated with their,

00:49:52.020 you know, version of its Sinovac.

00:49:53.260 But Ian, how do you compare what they would have, how sick they would have been without the

00:50:01.380 vaccination when that category doesn't exist?

00:50:05.240 Right.

00:50:05.620 So my point that I'm getting at is that I don't really think it worked at all because

00:50:11.060 of the way the vaccines were developed.

00:50:13.040 Like, it was simply too slow.

00:50:14.480 The rollout was too slow.

00:50:15.860 The technology's not there.

00:50:17.080 It's not fast enough to keep up with the mutations of the variants.

00:50:20.580 So, you know, by the time Omicron came out, it was pretty clear that Omicron's fairly safe,

00:50:25.700 right?

00:50:25.980 It's, for most people, it presents as a mild cold, and it effectively provides natural

00:50:30.980 immunity.

00:50:31.540 This is something even Bill Gates said.

00:50:33.140 He said it's basically natural immunity, and we kind of don't need the vaccines anymore.

00:50:37.320 And yet you still have Fauci out there pushing the vaccines.

00:50:40.300 Biden was pushing the vaccines.

00:50:41.940 I mean, a lot of governments are pushing the vaccines.

00:50:43.760 Not all.

00:50:44.560 You know, some of them simply stopped the mandate at that point.

00:50:47.360 Or if they, you know, were thinking about doing a mandate, they just skipped it entirely.

00:50:51.320 They even dropped airline restrictions, like my country, for example, Malaysia, Singapore,

00:50:56.620 you know, even Germany.

00:50:58.280 They were like, okay, we're not even going to restrict people from traveling to and from

00:51:03.020 their countries if, you know, even if they don't have the vaccine, right?

00:51:06.620 So it's pretty clear that a lot of health authorities were like, okay, this is not a big deal anymore,

00:51:11.100 right?

00:51:11.440 But the question I wanted to ask you, right, is that why did so many people take the vaccine

00:51:17.180 even early on, despite kind of figuring out that it didn't really work?

00:51:21.300 I mean, like, I took the vaccine.

00:51:22.580 I don't know why I did it.

00:51:23.960 Like, and I'm asking myself that question.

00:51:26.180 Why did I take it with even knowing logically, right, logically, like my heuristics tell me

00:51:31.880 that, first of all, don't trust the pharmaceutical companies because they're just there to sell

00:51:35.860 vaccines.

00:51:36.700 And secondly, I mean, if it doesn't work, why the hell take it at all?

00:51:40.120 Because it wasn't effective, right?

00:51:41.640 What was the date that you took it?

00:51:45.060 Because when I took it, the entire medical community said it totally worked.

00:51:49.520 When did you take it?

00:51:51.020 I took it maybe about three months after.

00:51:53.560 Three months after, you know, so we already had some data showing that it wasn't really

00:51:58.320 effective.

00:51:58.840 Wait, wait, wait, wait, hold on.

00:52:00.160 You're telling me you took it three months before I did?

00:52:03.300 No, no, no, no.

00:52:04.280 After, after you did.

00:52:05.840 After you did.

00:52:07.120 Do you know when I took it?

00:52:08.220 Uh, I don't know.

00:52:11.020 When did, I'm assuming day one.

00:52:12.700 I'm assuming you got it day one, right?

00:52:14.000 Oh, God, no.

00:52:14.880 I, I, I was, uh, I'm not going to take a day one vaccination. 1.00

00:52:19.000 What the fuck? 1.00

00:52:20.300 What, what the fuck? 1.00

00:52:21.700 Do you think I'm going to be the first one to take an experimental vaccination? 1.00

00:52:25.700 Seriously?

00:52:26.220 I don't know.

00:52:26.700 So, hold on, hold on.

00:52:27.580 Seriously.

00:52:28.100 A lot of people do.

00:52:28.520 Oh, hold on.

00:52:29.060 I want, I want to see if there's anybody else who thinks that.

00:52:31.620 Do you actually think I would have been first in line for this vaccination?

00:52:36.820 Does anybody think that?

00:52:40.360 That's, that's a polar opposite of everything I was saying at the time.

00:52:44.080 I told people I was going to wait as long as possible because most of the complications

00:52:49.240 happen in the first few months.

00:52:51.080 So, it would be actually insane to take it first.

00:52:54.500 I waited, uh, at least six months or so before I touched it.

00:52:59.000 And six months after it announced, they were still saying it was super effective against

00:53:05.220 transmission, which by the way, for a clarification, my understanding is it was, but only against

00:53:11.940 alpha, which didn't last long enough to make any difference.

00:53:15.500 And it was, and it was, and it was a little bit, little bit effective on delta.

00:53:19.140 And then, you know, after that, basically nothing.

00:53:22.280 So, when I took it, the vast majority of the experts were saying, you know, we don't know

00:53:28.240 if there's going to be side effects because nobody could know that.

00:53:30.920 But they were saying it's definitely stopping you from getting alpha, probably helps you a

00:53:36.920 lot against delta.

00:53:38.080 But that's all we know, and we're trying to flatten the curve.

00:53:42.040 Now, if those things were true, then it worked, except for whatever unknown, you know, future

00:53:50.260 problems you have, which is a big, big variable.

00:53:53.100 But in terms of, uh, if you took it during alpha and delta, are you saying that you don't

00:53:59.820 believe it had any protective value for those people, let's say over 65, who took it right 1.00

00:54:05.800 in the middle of the worst alpha, delta?

00:54:07.920 Do you think it didn't have any, any effect?

00:54:10.140 I took it during delta, right?

00:54:12.160 But I don't think it had any effect on delta.

00:54:14.080 I think it did have an effect on alpha.

00:54:16.140 Like, perhaps in places where alpha was just introduced, right?

00:54:20.060 Um, where alpha is still going around.

00:54:21.440 Now, the, now the, you know, but hold on, hold on.

00:54:24.920 You know, the entire medical community disagrees with you and would tell you, not the entire,

00:54:29.380 let's say 90%, would disagree with you and say that it made a big difference on survivability

00:54:35.660 of delta.

00:54:36.600 I'm not saying that.

00:54:37.420 I'm saying that medical community.

00:54:38.440 Right, that's what they're saying.

00:54:39.380 Yeah.

00:54:39.780 Yeah.

00:54:40.180 I would, I would say, I would disagree with them because, simply because of the, just

00:54:43.900 the logic, right?

00:54:44.680 I'm not a scientist, right?

00:54:45.860 But the logic is that, uh, the virus, I mean, sorry, the vaccine is developed to counter

00:54:51.380 just a specific variant of the virus.

00:54:53.280 You change a few things and so it's not the same virus anymore at that point, right?

00:54:57.220 It's like, it's like, it's with like influenza, right?

00:55:00.340 But you have a vaccine for a certain strain for it and you can kind of predict, uh, what,

00:55:05.200 you know, that strain might be, which is what they're using, you know, like AI now to try

00:55:08.640 to predict it, where it's going to develop or evolve into.

00:55:11.560 But I don't think it's very effective.

00:55:13.020 But I think you're, I think you're missing the sort of a basic thing about the vaccinations

00:55:17.860 is that they're never exact, you know?

00:55:20.780 So if, if the virus morphs in some ways, but not always, then the vaccinations would still

00:55:27.360 work because it could still identify it.

00:55:30.200 So, so it might work on the, you know, the first variation, but it's not, it's not going

00:55:35.300 to work on the thousandth variation for sure.

00:55:37.940 Right.

00:55:38.420 Yeah.

00:55:38.840 Right.

00:55:39.180 Yeah.

00:55:39.440 No, I mean, I get that.

00:55:40.380 So, I mean, let me ask you this too.

00:55:42.380 Right, if it was actually effective on Delta.

00:55:44.700 All right, Ian, let me ask you this.

00:55:46.380 Do you think there was any chance that the vaccinations during Alpha and Delta, uh, helped

00:55:54.140 the, um, healthcare system not crash?

00:56:00.100 I mean, I realize it's hindsight.

00:56:02.140 I don't believe so.

00:56:03.180 So you think probably the healthcare system would have been pretty much the same, but even

00:56:08.360 if nobody got vaccinated, right?

00:56:10.120 That's right.

00:56:10.500 And you, you know, that's the opposite of what mainstream science thinks.

00:56:14.700 Of course.

00:56:15.220 Yeah.

00:56:15.440 They will argue for, you know, the efficacy of the vaccines, right?

00:56:18.300 But the reality is that-

00:56:19.580 Not now.

00:56:20.040 The reason-

00:56:20.640 I don't think they're not arguing it under, I see, I think this conversation, we're always

00:56:27.280 conflating Omicron and Alpha and Delta.

00:56:29.720 I think, I think mainstream everybody thinks Omicron's not going to kill them and so vaccinations

00:56:37.940 might be a little overkill unless you're, you know, 100 years old.

00:56:41.140 But during the Alpha-Delta phase, if the experts were right, and at this point, of course, we

00:56:49.220 have to doubt all data, but if they were right, then it would have made a big difference in

00:56:53.380 keeping the hospitals operating, you know, if you think that's important.

00:56:57.440 Now, you could argue that that's not as important as their freedom and free speech and, you know,

00:57:02.900 getting the information out there and, you know, not having mandates and all that.

00:57:06.820 Those are separate.

00:57:07.400 But the argument is, did it make any difference during the peak of Alpha and Delta?

00:57:13.160 That's the only vaccination question that I think is interesting, because once you get

00:57:17.260 to Omicron, it's obviously just a money grab.

00:57:21.380 I mean, I don't see any- I see no medical reason for that.

00:57:25.580 And, you know, maybe you could give me some data someday that if you're 85 and near death,

00:57:30.140 it'll buy you a month or two.

00:57:31.300 I don't know.

00:57:32.200 But in general, I don't think anybody's thinking Omicron's going to kill them these days.

00:57:37.400 That's right.

00:57:38.740 All right.

00:57:39.300 Thank you, Ian.

00:57:40.700 Thank you.

00:57:41.320 Thank you for having me up.

00:57:43.140 All right.

00:57:43.560 Thanks a lot.

00:57:44.760 Yep.

00:57:48.020 All right.

00:57:48.660 How about one more?

00:57:52.380 What do you think?

00:57:54.520 One more?

00:57:57.060 All right.

00:57:58.320 Let's talk to Owen.

00:58:02.240 Owen, turn on your microphone.

00:58:10.100 Take that mute off, Owen.

00:58:11.700 There you are.

00:58:13.300 Hey.

00:58:13.640 Hi, Scott.

00:58:14.240 Hey, Owen.

00:58:15.140 How's it going?

00:58:17.400 Yeah.

00:58:17.920 So I, in general, I am not a critic of yours.

00:58:20.640 I've actually been in your local community for a long time.

00:58:22.680 I listened to all your live streams.

00:58:23.780 So I wouldn't classify myself as a Scott Adams critic, but for the purposes of this conversation,

00:58:28.940 I'll try and challenge my critic.

00:58:30.680 All right.

00:58:32.400 I think a few of the criticisms I have or the mistakes I think that might have made is

00:58:38.600 one goes back to, I'm sure you remember, there was a live stream you did with a risk

00:58:43.400 management matrix where you kind of laid out, here's how you think we could think about

00:58:47.660 the risk of taking the vaccine versus the risk of being unvaccinated.

00:58:51.280 Do you recall that?

00:58:52.600 Roughly.

00:58:53.060 Yeah.

00:58:53.340 Go ahead.

00:58:53.680 What's the point?

00:58:55.020 Well, I think what shocked me as you were walking through this was that you got to the

00:59:00.960 point where you said, here's the long-term risk of taking the vaccine, and you said,

00:59:08.160 that's unknown, so we should just treat that as zero.

00:59:11.800 And that part didn't make any sense to me at all.

00:59:14.020 Yeah, well, I can see why that didn't make sense, because I didn't say anything like

00:59:20.000 that.

00:59:21.400 That's the opposite of anything I would say.

00:59:24.120 Well, I know there was one of the vaccination risks that you said, basically, this is unknown,

00:59:29.900 so we should treat it as zero, because there's no quantifier.

00:59:32.420 No, no, no, no, no.

00:59:33.520 I would never say anything, I would never say anything even in that universe.

00:59:38.520 You think I would ever treat a vaccination as a zero risk?

00:59:44.020 Well, I specifically recall this.

00:59:47.660 I think even people in the local community are agreeing with me right now.

00:59:51.740 No, well, actually, but just think about it logically.

00:59:57.740 You should have known I wasn't saying that, because nobody would say that.

01:00:01.360 That's like something that literally nobody would say.

01:00:04.240 There's not a doctor who would say it.

01:00:06.020 There's not a critic who would say it.

01:00:07.700 There's not a patient who would say it.

01:00:09.180 But you think I actually said that in public.

01:00:11.620 Literally nobody would say that.

01:00:14.260 But let me tell you what you might have heard.

01:00:18.280 You might have heard something you thought was that.

01:00:21.520 So here's what I think you heard.

01:00:23.840 That if you looked at the risk of long COVID, that was totally unknown.

01:00:28.320 And if you looked at the risk of the vaccination, it was totally unknown.

01:00:34.060 So since both of those are potentially big and totally unknown, you should treat them like they're not part of the decision.

01:00:41.560 And that's what you heard.

01:00:43.320 Which makes perfect sense.

01:00:44.540 But if you just say you're ignoring one of the big risks, I would never say that.

01:00:51.360 I'm saying that there are two big risks, and they're both unknown.

01:00:55.220 So you have to treat them as equivalent unknowns.

01:00:57.940 They don't move you in either direction.

01:01:00.660 That's what I said.

01:01:02.520 Okay.

01:01:03.240 Well, in any case, I think, and to be fair, when you went through this risk management matrix,

01:01:07.520 you said very clearly everyone should make their own decisions on how to weigh all these different risks.

01:01:12.900 You were just laying out the matrix for people, and then you walked through an example of it.

01:01:16.340 But I think your example probably colored how people perceive that.

01:01:20.760 And that kind of leads into my next criticism is that I think one of the reasons that people perceive you as being pro-vax and pro-mask

01:01:29.720 and all these other things that I do think are mischaracterized is that as I listen to you, you know,

01:01:35.360 I don't know, maybe a hundred times going through, let's talk about this aspect,

01:01:38.660 or let's talk about this study, or let's talk about this particular way of thinking about the pandemic or the vaccines.

01:01:44.960 The majority of those things were discrediting anti-vax arguments.

01:01:50.720 And, you know, you had all sorts of disclaimers saying, I don't know if this is true,

01:01:54.800 or I, you know, I don't, I'm not telling anybody whether or not to get the vaccine.

01:01:58.700 But when you then proceed to say, here's why this anti-vax argument doesn't make any sense or isn't credible,

01:02:05.160 which is usually what you focus on is whether something's credible,

01:02:08.420 that it definitely leads people to believe that you're on that side of the argument

01:02:13.760 because you didn't spend nearly as much time talking about here's why the pro-vax arguments don't make sense

01:02:18.900 or here's why the pro-mask arguments don't make sense.

01:02:21.000 And I know you're a persuasion expert, so you had to be somewhere, I would think, of how you would perceive it that way.

01:02:27.020 Yeah, and I didn't care.

01:02:28.920 So that was something I wasn't trying to fix.

01:02:31.760 So you're right, I was completely aware of that and had no interest in fixing that at all.

01:02:37.180 But here's why.

01:02:39.280 I'll tell you my internal thinking.

01:02:40.880 But your observation is correct because that's your take on what was happening.

01:02:45.840 So there's no argument on your subjective impression.

01:02:49.940 But here's why I didn't criticize the other side.

01:02:55.460 I was the first person who told me the vaccinations wouldn't work.

01:02:58.720 I predicted that before warp speed started, like as it was announced.

01:03:04.000 Because it was very clear that they'd been trying for 20 years to get something that would work as a vaccination as a coronavirus.

01:03:11.480 All of the experts said we have no idea how to do it and it's not going to happen in a year.

01:03:15.780 And then it didn't.

01:03:17.280 So that was the very first thing I said.

01:03:18.860 The second thing I've said, consistently and always, I'm the creator of the Dilber comic strip.

01:03:26.120 I never believe anything that comes out of big pharma, big government, big corporation.

01:03:32.060 I also say, follow the money works every time.

01:03:36.100 And you don't need to know anything else about the vaccination side of the argument.

01:03:39.500 To me, to me, the entire pro-vaccination criticism is how much money is involved.

01:03:47.000 And then you're done.

01:03:49.000 Right?

01:03:49.940 And I've always said that you can't believe the data.

01:03:52.960 I always said that I'm going to wait as long as possible because I don't trust it.

01:03:56.880 You know, on day one, I definitely don't trust it.

01:03:58.780 But at least I'll see how many people die in the first six months.

01:04:01.880 So to me, the argument against the vax, meaning against trusting big companies, is just so stipulated and given that it needs no explanation.

01:04:13.120 Whereas the anti-vaxxers were primarily swimming in misinformation.

01:04:21.320 Primarily.

01:04:22.720 So I would say 95% of the anti-vax stuff was wrong data and misinterpretation.

01:04:30.840 And maybe 100% of the pro-vax stuff was wrong.

01:04:35.140 Maybe.

01:04:35.860 It might have been 100% wrong.

01:04:37.220 I don't know.

01:04:37.520 But the pro-vax side is so discredited on obvious grounds.

01:04:44.540 Big money, people you don't trust, big governments.

01:04:48.040 Those things were, I think, everybody knew that.

01:04:50.920 And everybody knew that the vaccinations were not tested as much as normal ones.

01:04:56.080 Everybody knew it was a new technology.

01:04:58.660 Everybody knew there was coercion.

01:05:00.840 So those arguments didn't need to be made because everybody could see them plainly.

01:05:04.680 But you're right that I quite intentionally stirred the pot of the people who were the, let's say, the most riled up.

01:05:15.280 Because I thought it would be useful to help the skeptics know which parts they shouldn't rely on.

01:05:22.200 In other words, I was the skeptic of both the pro-side and the anti.

01:05:28.000 I was skeptical, extreme skepticism on both sides.

01:05:31.840 But it is nonetheless true that although most of the anti-vaccination arguments were based on ridiculous data and misinterpretation of data and confusing causation and correlation, which is what I like to talk about,

01:05:48.160 it is nonetheless true that if they didn't get vaccinated and they got to the age of Omicron, they won.

01:05:55.340 Now, the people who didn't get vaccinated and, according to the medical professionals, died because of it, hypothetically, they lost.

01:06:07.860 So I'm just saying, if you just look at the outcomes, the people who simply said, don't trust the government, there's a lot of money involved, they're going to be right 80% of the time.

01:06:17.440 Wouldn't you say?

01:06:20.760 Yes, I do.

01:06:21.640 I agree with you on that.

01:06:22.860 Yeah, it doesn't even matter what the topic is, right?

01:06:25.440 The people who say, look, look, look, I don't even care what the topic is.

01:06:28.660 Could be climate change, could be vaccinations, could be the World Economic Forum, could be anything.

01:06:34.680 Whatever it is, 80% of the time, the government's lying to you and it's not good for you.

01:06:39.960 So if you just took the heuristic of, follow the money, do they have a billion-dollar reason to lie?

01:06:48.320 Oh, yeah, they do.

01:06:49.820 Yeah, they do.

01:06:50.740 We all saw that.

01:06:52.080 Like, nobody was confused by that.

01:06:54.160 There's nobody who didn't understand the size of that risk.

01:06:58.080 So it's nonetheless true that the people like me, who took it analytically, we got one answer.

01:07:05.960 The most highly educated, trained people, got one answer.

01:07:11.260 And the people who used a rule of thumb, like, look, they're obviously lying.

01:07:15.520 You know, they're hiding stuff.

01:07:16.700 They're asking for immunity.

01:07:18.260 They're doing everything you would do if you were shady.

01:07:22.500 And if you do everything that you do when you're shady, we're going to assume you're shady.

01:07:28.020 So don't put that in my arm.

01:07:29.680 And that argument turned down to be one that if you didn't die, you won.

01:07:37.700 Well, I would also take issue with saying that the other side, the anti-vax side, didn't approach it analytically.

01:07:43.660 I think many of them did.

01:07:45.160 And I think many of them dove deep into looking at studies.

01:07:49.080 I mean, I read hundreds of medical studies.

01:07:51.580 Well, hold on, hold on, hold on.

01:07:53.160 Well, that means you believed some and you disbelieved others.

01:07:57.600 And none of us have that ability, unfortunately.

01:08:00.240 I did not just take them at face value.

01:08:02.980 In fact, I had a network of people, many of them were doctors, that we would discuss these things in depth and try and demunk them.

01:08:09.420 So it was more of a group effort.

01:08:11.620 Right.

01:08:12.020 In my case, at least.

01:08:12.700 But we know there's no amount of group that can know which data is correct.

01:08:17.560 There is no mechanism.

01:08:18.800 There's nobody who can ask.

01:08:20.380 There's nobody who's good at it.

01:08:22.500 There's nothing.

01:08:23.840 We have no way to know.

01:08:25.000 I'm talking about there were vaccinated people in it and unvaccinated people in it.

01:08:28.700 So we got a lot of perspectives.

01:08:31.040 No, getting a lot of perspectives doesn't help you as much as you want it to.

01:08:36.040 Because it's a lot of people who don't know what they're talking about.

01:08:38.960 If you add them together, it doesn't improve.

01:08:42.700 Well, in any case, I don't think it was, for many people on the anti-vax side, just a rule of thumb decision, though.

01:08:51.480 I think they were analyzing it.

01:08:53.860 And to your point, yes, maybe they have just as much cognitive dissonance and groupthink or errors in terms of saying,

01:09:01.620 I'm only going to trust the things that agree with me.

01:09:03.440 I'm sure some of that is true for me and for all the people that I consulted with.

01:09:07.540 A hundred percent of them.

01:09:08.800 I do think that there was an analytical approach there.

01:09:11.200 I mean, I was looking at studies that was saying the spike protein is what's causing the damage of coronavirus.

01:09:16.800 And that seemed to never get connected in the media with, by the way, that's the same spike protein that's in the vaccines.

01:09:24.500 All right.

01:09:24.840 But I would argue that your view, if you believe some of the medical data, but not, say, the mainstream,

01:09:32.140 that that's not a data argument, that that's an argument that the other people are liars.

01:09:39.160 Well, they're lying or they're just wrong.

01:09:50.300 I mean, I think a lot of them may have certainly believed what they were saying.

01:09:52.680 And how would you know, how could you judge, even with the help of the other people who are looking at it,

01:10:01.640 how could you judge what it was correct in the data?

01:10:05.820 I honestly would still say I'm not sure.

01:10:08.780 Like, I'm not a hundred percent certain of either side.

01:10:12.020 I would just say that the risk management decisions, to me, seem pretty obvious.

01:10:16.120 But with all these unknowns, it doesn't make sense to take this treatment,

01:10:20.060 especially with a disease that is not nearly as deadly as they were saying it was.

01:10:24.320 Well, then let me test your logic then.

01:10:29.600 So do you believe that long COVID is real?

01:10:33.300 Or did you believe it when you made your decision to vax or not vax?

01:10:37.020 What?

01:10:37.520 Did you believe that long COVID was a real thing or no?

01:10:39.740 I would have put a low probability on it, maybe 20%.

01:10:43.660 Or at least that it's true, but it's only true in the sense that there is a post-vaccine

01:10:48.860 or post-disease fatigue syndrome that applies to any major illness.

01:10:54.760 Like, if you're in the hospital, there's a time it takes to recover.

01:10:57.920 So some of it might just be the normal amount of that.

01:11:00.940 Right.

01:11:01.340 Which could make it drag on for six months or so.

01:11:04.900 So you had an unknown risk of COVID.

01:11:07.160 And then you also had an unknown risk from the vaccination itself.

01:11:13.400 Unknown, yes.

01:11:14.380 But I tried to at least assess a probability.

01:11:17.180 So I took my own age, my own health, lack of comorbidities into account.

01:11:22.020 I mean, in my case, I actually thought my parents, because they're very old,

01:11:26.620 probably should take the vaccine.

01:11:28.020 But part of that calculation, in my mind, is that because they're older,

01:11:31.760 even if there are side effects of the vaccine,

01:11:33.820 well, they're only going to be alive a certain number of years anyway.

01:11:35.780 Or as a young person.

01:11:37.240 How old are you?

01:11:39.180 I'm 51.

01:11:40.960 All right.

01:11:41.280 So you were well below the old people level. 1.00

01:11:45.760 So do you think you could compare your decision to somebody who is older?

01:11:50.580 So I was in the category where the professionals were saying,

01:11:56.520 okay, you're in the category where you should get vaccinated.

01:11:59.660 If I were young, if I were 51 and thinner, I'm not sure that I would have.

01:12:05.780 And if I didn't have asthma, I'm not sure I would have.

01:12:09.540 So your decision and mine actually sound the same.

01:12:12.740 In other words, if I were young, I would have said, oh, the risk is low.

01:12:19.440 So I'm going to take my risk of low COVID.

01:12:22.260 I'll take a risk of long COVID if I'm young and healthy.

01:12:25.820 But not so much if I'm older and I have some risk.

01:12:30.800 Yeah, Scott, I have no criticism with the decision you made.

01:12:33.680 Like, I mean, I think you, I mean, I don't know that I would have necessarily

01:12:37.520 made the same decision.

01:12:38.580 I don't know.

01:12:39.140 I'd have to think about it.

01:12:40.160 I think if I were 65 and if I had comorbidities, maybe that would have

01:12:43.960 affected my decision.

01:12:45.000 But I don't fault you for getting the jabs.

01:12:48.020 Yeah.

01:12:48.380 And by the way, I don't claim that I made a correct decision.

01:12:53.760 So I've always claimed it was guessing on my side.

01:12:56.800 Where people got angry is when I said, I think it's guessing on your side, too.

01:13:00.800 That's where everybody got mad.

01:13:03.320 Yeah.

01:13:03.600 No, I mean, my criticism is just about, you know, the fact that you're saying,

01:13:09.660 well, the analytical people made one decision and the other people were all

01:13:13.580 using a rule of thumb, whereas, you know, I mean, I think I did a very deep

01:13:18.520 dive into research and talking to all sorts of people and listening to all

01:13:21.580 sorts of perspectives and made my decision based on that analysis, not based on

01:13:25.900 just, I don't trust the government, end of story.

01:13:27.780 Okay.

01:13:28.420 So I was skeptical of all the government's information, but also all of the skeptics'

01:13:34.280 information.

01:13:35.480 You were a little more convinced by the skeptics' argument, whereas I gave them all zero credibility.

01:13:44.000 Yes.

01:13:44.280 Although, I mean, in many cases, I did not believe some of the skeptics' information,

01:13:48.960 especially the ones that were very hyperbolic or, you know, the ones that are saying everyone's

01:13:53.280 going to die, and there were all sorts of theories that people would put forth about

01:13:58.040 how, you know, it's going to just be the end of the world.

01:14:01.080 It's a depopulation agenda.

01:14:02.220 No, I didn't buy into any of that.

01:14:03.680 Like, it's just, on the whole, when I put it all together and when I have to come up

01:14:09.100 with a decision, I certainly fell out on the anti-vax side, and it seemed a pretty easy 0.75

01:14:14.100 decision once I looked at all the arguments and data and perspectives.

01:14:18.040 Well, what's your education or field?

01:14:22.100 What do you do for a living?

01:14:24.640 Mostly in technology consulting.

01:14:27.160 So you're a tech, you're a rational tech kind of a brain?

01:14:32.680 Yeah, yeah.

01:14:33.520 Okay.

01:14:34.000 All right.

01:14:34.680 Thank you, Owen.

01:14:36.160 We'll see you on Locals.

01:14:38.880 Thanks.

01:14:39.580 I appreciate all your Twitter interaction as well.

01:14:43.320 All right.

01:14:44.480 All right.

01:14:45.280 Bye for now.

01:14:45.940 All right.

01:14:47.100 I think we've done what we need to do.

01:14:49.300 I wasn't watching your comments as much as I should have.

01:14:53.000 But for those of you on YouTube, you're unaware that if you look at my pinned tweet,

01:14:59.480 you're going to be happy, because that's where I say that the people who didn't get vaxxed

01:15:03.360 are the winners.

01:15:05.440 That's what you want to hear, right?

01:15:09.120 So go look at that.

01:15:10.460 You're missing some context.

01:15:12.080 The ones who are saying, you refused to say you were wrong.

01:15:14.740 The entire context of today is that I tweeted a video of me saying that the people who didn't

01:15:22.740 get vaxxed are in the better situation.

01:15:26.220 Because if you didn't get vaxxed, you don't have any risk of the vaccination itself.

01:15:31.160 And Omicron's, you know, if you're young and healthy especially, Omicron's no big deal,

01:15:35.640 especially if you've been infected before.

01:15:39.140 All right.

01:15:39.800 Anybody else have a problem?

01:15:49.800 We all lost.

01:15:50.840 You lost your little brother.

01:15:55.580 I'm sorry about that.

01:16:00.140 You knew from the jump.

01:16:01.380 Well, I would like to learn from you. 0.90

01:16:04.540 That's why I think we need a dumb Davos, because the people who knew before the data was reliable, 0.92

01:16:12.260 and they knew just from, you know, heuristics and from their common sense and their logic, 0.95

01:16:19.540 you need to teach me how to do that.

01:16:21.400 Because my education experience didn't teach me how to be certain before there's any information.

01:16:31.240 I don't know how to do that.

01:16:32.300 But you guys nailed it.

01:16:33.960 So you're the winners.

01:16:36.460 All right.

01:16:40.960 By the way, if you haven't looked at the comments to my video in which I say the non-vaxxed are the winners,

01:16:49.280 you have to read the comments, because they're hilarious.

01:16:53.100 Maybe just to me.

01:16:53.980 I don't know.

01:16:54.920 But I thought they were hilarious.

01:16:56.960 All right.

01:16:57.380 That's all I got for today.

01:16:58.720 We're going to go.

01:16:59.440 I'm going to talk to the locals people for a minute.

01:17:02.240 Bye for now.

Real Coffee with Scott Adams - January 22, 2023

Episode 1996 Scott Adams： Why Do The Most Educated People Keep Getting All The Wrong Answers？

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