Rebel News Podcast - BREAKDOWN： Trucker Commission Day 10 ｜ Ft. Tom Marazzo & Keith Wilson

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00:00:29.780 today.

00:00:45.960 Hey everyone, welcome back to our evening live stream here in Ottawa. I'm joined by Alex Salavoie

00:00:51.180 who is joining us online. I'm joined with right-wing extremist Tom Morata wearing the worst outfit I've

00:00:56.840 ever seen him wear during a live stream. Tom, first of all, how are you doing, but also why are you

00:01:01.680 wearing such an outfit? I'm actually doing pretty good. No, the tie is a joke because I wore a tie

00:01:10.100 on Julie Panessi's podcast recently. And so William was always asking me, why aren't you dressing up

00:01:15.880 for me? So in honor of you and your fashion sense, I had to wear a tie. Exactly. You know, when you're

00:01:21.960 doing news, you've got to dress well, got to dress appropriately. And that's the way this right-wing

00:01:26.440 extremist is dressing today. Alexa, how are you doing? I'm pretty good. That was a really interesting

00:01:32.740 day. And we heard a lot, a lot about Tom Morato today. It was just all about you. Yeah, it was Tom

00:01:40.300 Morato. They've definitely got a bigger head now. Just before we begin analyzing everything, once again,

00:01:45.600 if you want to make sure to, you know, stay tuned with everything that's happening during the commission,

00:01:50.220 you can always go to trickercommission.com during the day. And also, if you want to chat with us

00:01:55.260 during the live stream, you can go on to Rumble and you can send paid chats that we will be able

00:02:00.960 to read on air. So Tom, we've got a lot of things to go through. Same thing, Alexa, what were your

00:02:07.460 general thoughts from today? Really interesting, a little bit surreal, to be perfectly honest,

00:02:13.340 listening to some of the testimony, especially later in the afternoon. And, you know, one thing

00:02:20.460 we learned is the order that myself and some of the others will be testifying next week. I believe

00:02:27.060 Chris Barber and I are next Tuesday. Keith Wilson's going to be testifying, Tamara and some of the

00:02:33.480 others. But watching was pretty interesting, I have to admit. No, 100%. There are definitely shocking

00:02:41.580 things that we saw take place. One of the first things that I want to talk about was one of the

00:02:46.580 clips that Bath showed during her cross-examination of, I believe, the first witness. You know,

00:02:54.860 once again, that's what happens when you live tweet all day. You forget the name of the witness. I

00:02:58.480 believe it was Bernier. So when cross-examining Bernier, Bath, one of the lawyers for Freedom Convoy,

00:03:05.600 and I apologize for not using her last name, I just can't seem to remember.

00:03:08.960 Or Vandenberg, right. So Bath Vandenberg, one of the great lawyers for the Freedom Convoy,

00:03:14.360 showed one shocking clip to the crowd, to Bernie during his testimony. Are we able to show it on

00:03:23.040 the screen? All right. So I guess we'll show it later. But just before we watch the clip,

00:03:33.540 we'll be able to see it in a second. But how were you feeling in the crowd? I know I saw some people

00:03:38.200 in the crowd shed tears while this video was shown. How are you feeling sitting there and

00:03:43.420 seeing what's happening? Well, it's truthfully, it's really hard. I know myself and many of the

00:03:48.740 others, we do struggle watching a lot of the footage at times. It's really hard to be there

00:03:54.280 and actually see that. I know, you know, even as an example, your documentary that Rebel put out about

00:04:01.980 Coots and I know the other guys that did Trucking for Freedom, like watching the documentaries are

00:04:07.160 really difficult to watch. Well, we can actually see the clip right here. I'll say,

00:04:11.680 look, the full clip, including Vandenberg's words. There it is right there.

00:04:15.820 All right. So do you agree that the OPS officer in this video in the back behind the ranks, the line

00:04:37.340 is using what is actually the muzzle and not the butt of what looks like a 40 millimeter chemical

00:04:42.380 munition launched to beat a protester with? Not enough for me to see what exactly is going on.

00:04:49.360 But you can see that there is a police officer in the back beating a protester with a rifle.

00:04:55.020 There is not enough for me to see what is actually happening behind bodies.

00:05:00.380 We continue playing the video, please.

00:05:01.960 And the second part of the video is even worse because you can't even see further what was

00:05:10.400 happening. And for me, the reaction of Superintendent Bernie to this clip was absolutely shameful.

00:05:16.700 The guy wasn't shoveling snow. The police officer was not shoveling snow. He wasn't dancing. He was

00:05:22.380 beating up the protester. So do you want to continue your thoughts?

00:05:25.820 Well, I had recently seen that. I've seen that video several times. And what was interesting to me is

00:05:30.940 until recently, somebody slowed it down and you realized it wasn't the butt of the rifle.

00:05:37.240 It was actually burned down. It was the barrel.

00:05:39.380 It was super dangerous.

00:05:40.620 You know, it's incredibly an aggressive move. I mean, I'd hate to be on the receiving end of

00:05:45.680 either end, but definitely I wouldn't want to be hit with the barrel of a rifle like that.

00:05:52.800 For peacefully protesting.

00:05:53.520 For peacefully protesting. I just, I don't know how you can justify that level of violence against

00:06:00.100 a protester. I just don't understand how you can get to that point. Or shooting, you know,

00:06:07.200 reporters in the thigh with a ballistic projectile. Yeah. 0.91

00:06:10.700 When they're clearly indicated that they're media.

00:06:13.440 Yeah. Well, that, that, that brings me on to my next point, Alexa, you know, you, you also

00:06:16.640 had an experience similar to that. You want to touch on that?

00:06:19.100 I mean, nobody's, it was as well, like what, um, I think it's Bernie, I say that after that

00:06:26.640 day, they rise the protection because of the aggressiveness of the protester. Um, on that

00:06:34.440 video, I don't see any protester that is violent at all. I saw like the opposite way. And I remember

00:06:40.780 something that the first day they were pretty aggressive, I would say on the side of the

00:06:46.500 police, but the second day I noticed something else. It was like more and more aggressivity

00:06:55.100 that was rising up on the side of the police. I don't know what they say to each other that night,

00:07:01.500 but it was not the same kind of police that I noticed like in these two days.

00:07:07.820 No, 100%. But just to go back to the question, um, you know, you were shot by a police officer

00:07:14.020 in the leg during the convoy. That clip was not shown, but seeing that clip, you know, we saw people

00:07:20.020 in the, in the crowds, primarily notably crying and some people having to leave the, the, the,

00:07:24.700 the room at the commission because it was too emotional for them. Well, how does it make you feel

00:07:28.700 to, to see that?

00:07:31.580 Well, at least I'm, I'm actually happy that they show video some evidence of what is

00:07:37.700 happening. Uh, I think it should have more like to really put them to the confrontation of look at

00:07:45.380 what happened. Do you notice the same thing that you are testimonied? Because what you are saying

00:07:51.460 is not accurate of what we saw on the field. And especially like, I just don't really understand

00:07:59.220 why they don't actually ask me to go and testimonies something. But anyway, I just find that, um,

00:08:07.060 it's the time that we talk about what happened during these two days, because it's all about these

00:08:12.340 two last days that we should like make the government accountable of these actions.

00:08:18.900 Because a lot of people have been injured. A lot of people have been injured these two days.

00:08:24.260 Well, we saw the RCMP horses trampling a woman as well. But one of the things related to this

00:08:28.660 clip that I also want to touch on, um, I'm going to quote Bernie, superintendent Bernie. He said earlier

00:08:33.700 that we adopted a philosophy of slow methodical approach. We didn't want to rush through this.

00:08:39.460 We didn't want to force a confrontation yet. I think the video should show otherwise.

00:08:45.860 Yeah. And you know, there's, uh, shortly after the, the convoy ended, there was, uh,

00:08:53.540 uh, screenshots of phone or, uh, text messaging going back and forth between the RCMP members.

00:09:00.020 And they were using a language basically saying, you know, don't, don't do it all yet. Like save some

00:09:05.620 for us. We want to bring the Jack boots, right? Yeah. We saw the text messages,

00:09:08.900 text messaging of the RCMP that were there from out of town, wanted to get in on the action. So

00:09:14.420 I think what happened maybe on the first day, there was this, uh, this sense of, you know,

00:09:20.900 look at the free for all that we had. I mean, these people had an opportunity to go out there and

00:09:24.740 attack protesters. And so it's kind of logical that the next group up wanted to get in on it.

00:09:30.020 And we saw texts to that, but what's also interesting is one of the RCMP officers,

00:09:34.180 I believe are the ones that leaked that, uh, text messaging. So you're seeing inside and I don't

00:09:41.140 know if you remember Alexa, but there was, there was a lot of reports where, uh, when we were standing

00:09:46.020 on the line there, uh, you know, with, with the protesters against the police, there was a lot of

00:09:50.900 reports. I didn't see it, but I had heard it that if a police officer actually engaged whatsoever

00:09:56.660 with one of the protesters, their supervisor would pull them right off the line and plug the hole with

00:10:01.940 somebody who, uh, was more disciplined or more, um, uh, to, to what they were doing. Right. And so

00:10:11.940 I can certainly understand the difference in the mentality going into the second day.

00:10:17.380 Uh, the message was clear. I think a lot of those teams went back and they were told by their

00:10:20.820 supervisors, you communicate with these people, there'll be consequences. Uh, that's my read on

00:10:26.420 that situation. Yeah. And I think that, that, that philosophy, they did have that mentality at

00:10:31.060 fear-mongering the police cause on the police officers was one of the reasons why they were

00:10:35.540 so aggressive and so unwilling to actually speak, you know, in a nice way to the protesters. We saw

00:10:42.180 the protesters trying to engage with the police. We saw them coming up to them and being nice and

00:10:46.100 giving them the charters of rights and freedoms, being peaceful with them. Yet the reaction from

00:10:50.180 the police wasn't the same thing at all. I had seen a video of, uh, one of the young protesters,

00:10:55.300 it was a young lady, she was handing them a flower and, uh, the police officer batted her

00:11:01.060 right across her forearm with the baton, uh, smashed her across the arm while she was extending

00:11:07.620 a flower. So, you know, let's, let's, you know, zoom out and look at the big picture here. Do we need

00:11:13.620 the emergency act to, to go after? I mean, did, did any of that on that video or any of the,

00:11:20.580 even the testimony, I mean, it always comes back to relevance. We, we, we've never seen

00:11:26.020 any testimony yet to date that, that met the four conditions of this act section two,

00:11:33.380 therefore nullifying the, the justification of the use of the emergency act. And again,

00:11:39.860 you know, I think we're on day nine of the testimony and yet you only, you're only seeing

00:11:46.420 the four groups of the lawyers out of the total of 14 actually talking about the emergency act.

00:11:52.260 Yeah. All the rest are just, it's cover your ass. It's still another day. 1.00

00:11:57.300 Cover that. Plus also you see Paul Champ only touching about the impact on communities,

00:12:02.260 but the impact on residential neighborhoods is not a reason to invoke the emergencies. I think

00:12:08.260 it's not a valid reason. That's not what the emergency act is there for. It's not a valid

00:12:11.620 reason at all. That's the role. It's just not. And what surprises me, I just want to add that what

00:12:16.500 surprises me is how much time the lawyers for Peter slowly seem to get, which is a little bit bizarre

00:12:23.460 to me. They seem to get an enormous amount of time. And it's about, he gets the time. His lawyers are

00:12:29.220 there basically to protect Peter slowly. That's why they're there. They're not there to talk about the

00:12:34.900 justification of the emergency act. They're there to protect him from culpability later.

00:12:39.700 And he gets an enormous amount of time where other groups are getting like very,

00:12:43.380 like five minutes, 10 minutes slivers. It's very bizarre to me.

00:12:49.060 Quality. It's always better than quantity because at the end of the day, the quality will win.

00:12:55.780 But I just want to remember that everybody that revenues has, have still like a lawsuit against the

00:13:02.020 RCMP. If you want, you can do so and go and stand with Alexa.com. But Tom, since I have you,

00:13:09.220 because we did talk about you so much, and I want to clarify just a point with you. They were talking

00:13:15.540 about you about the fact that you agree with them to talk with the trucker to move them to Wellington.

00:13:22.980 When the trucker did agree to, it seems that you have some miscommunication between the police to

00:13:31.540 agree to move them to Wellington. And afterwards, they say that the truckers didn't want to follow

00:13:37.460 you anymore because of that. Can you clarify a little bit what they say about you?

00:13:42.660 Absolutely. So, what's interesting is what we learned today was that before I had the meeting

00:13:50.100 with Steve Kay, and you know, there were police officers that did join in after, so did Keith and

00:13:57.060 Eva. Despite Inspector Drummond's confusion on the issue, they actually did attend the meeting

00:14:02.820 afterwards. And we did talk about these details. And what's really interesting to me is that we found

00:14:08.260 out today that the Ottawa police services had already decided that we weren't going to be able

00:14:14.500 to move those trucks up onto Wellington. So, the question had to be asked, why did you send anybody,

00:14:20.740 myself, why did you try to get me to go to Rideau and try to convince the truckers to move up onto

00:14:29.380 Wellington if you knew the day before that you were not going to honor the deal? And what's really

00:14:35.060 troubling? This is what's really troubling is that then they're spinning this narrative that

00:14:41.700 because the police are the ones who reneged on the deal. That's what happened that night. I basically

00:14:46.420 had them on the one yard line. I had the truckers ready to go. They were going to actually do this.

00:14:53.460 And then the police reneged on the deal. And then they're reframing this narrative that,

00:14:58.900 well, they're not going to follow Tom. It's like, actually they were. And I want to make a really

00:15:05.140 important distinction here. I went up there to not to negotiate with the truckers on there because we

00:15:13.220 had different groups of people there, but to lay out what the upside for us was and then to get them

00:15:21.220 to decide themselves. Right. I wasn't in a position to direct. I was just talking. I was laying out the

00:15:27.540 argument and my recommendation to do this. I thought that it was, and others agreed that it was the best

00:15:33.780 strategic move. So you move and then we'll reevaluate what's going on. And we were there,

00:15:40.820 we were there. And then the police last minute, hold the carpet out from underneath the police liaison 0.96

00:15:46.500 team. And now they're reframing the narrative to say, well, the truckers didn't have control of the

00:15:52.100 truckers. So they're blaming us for a deal that they knew was a setup from the day before.

00:15:57.620 Well, I think it was the most, the most intelligent thing to do, the most intelligent

00:16:00.740 move. And I think we're seeing that in the commission. And now we've been talking for a

00:16:04.180 little while. I want viewers to be able to see parts of the testimony given by the first witness

00:16:10.100 of the superintendent, Bernie. So let's, let's take a look at some of what you had to say.

00:16:13.540 Police have common law powers to exclude the public from an area in which a police operation

00:16:20.260 is underway. Is that correct? Yes. And those powers could have been used in the clearing of

00:16:26.100 the protests in Ottawa, couldn't they? Yes. In fact, you planned on using those

00:16:31.540 powers to clear the protests and the federal emergency declaration did not significantly impact your

00:16:36.740 planning. Is that right? I wouldn't exactly say that. Very, very hard to, to know what it would

00:16:47.380 have been like without it. Right. I, your, your interview summary does say that, but, uh, but I'll

00:16:53.860 leave it, uh, I'll leave that answer as is. Um, you would have carried out the planned police operation,

00:17:00.820 whether the government declared a public order emergency or not though. Isn't that right?

00:17:04.900 Correct. The planning and the, the concept of operation was already in place and I didn't

00:17:10.500 have any knowledge that an emergency sack was going to be put in place.

00:17:14.660 Council for Canada earlier on today, put it to you that, and I'm paraphrasing a bit, uh, you never

00:17:21.460 know whether your use of a common law exclusion zone will hold up in court if it's challenged after

00:17:26.580 the fact. Do you remember that question? Yes. Um, if police proceeded as planned and relied on

00:17:32.900 common law exclusion zone powers to clear the protest, the fact that those powers might have

00:17:37.460 been challenged after the fact wouldn't change the fact that the protests had already been cleared,

00:17:42.260 would it? That is correct. All right. So would you agree that the federal emergency power to create

00:17:47.700 exclusion zones may have been helpful to police, but it was not necessary?

00:17:51.780 Well, once again, um, I, I think it was beneficial.

00:17:59.460 Beneficial, but not necessary. Correct. Thank you. Um,

00:18:06.180 Council for Canada showed you a letter dated February 17th, 2022, earlier on today, which appeared

00:18:12.900 to be a letter from OPP Commissioner Karik to tow truck, tow truck drivers. You had never seen that

00:18:18.580 letter before it was shown to you today. Is that right? Correct. Uh, you have helpful,

00:18:25.780 but not necessary. I think that's, I feel, I feel like we're just repeating ourselves at this point,

00:18:29.860 but that's, that's what we're feeling every day, you know, and I, and I have to admit there are,

00:18:34.900 there are times in there where I do want to do cartwheels down the aisle in there. And that was one of the

00:18:40.660 moments. But means about the suffering, like the suffering face of like the, the witness, like to

00:18:49.140 try to avoid, but you see that he's suffering because he's like, ah, I should not say it, but yeah.

00:18:57.940 Yeah, no, exactly. That's what they keep repeating all the time. Helpful, but not necessary. What's one of

00:19:04.820 the conditions? I mean, we're going to have a lawyer later on, Keith Wilson, but one of the conditions for

00:19:08.900 the invocation of the emergencies act is that it has to be necessary. It doesn't matter if you're

00:19:13.780 too incompetent to do your job and that's helpful for you. It doesn't matter. It's not about convenience,

00:19:17.700 about necessity. Yeah. And let's just look at the timeline. Okay. So it, you know, I, I wasn't a

00:19:23.540 police officer as a soldier, so I understand planning. It made perfect sense to me that the Ottawa police,

00:19:29.540 their entire infrastructure would be planning, doing a big contingency plan to at some point,

00:19:37.300 get the order to start clearing the protest. That makes perfect sense to me. And what's interesting

00:19:43.940 though, is that the mayor under, uh, under oath on the stand said he had no knowledge that the

00:19:51.220 emergency act was going to be invoked, but their plan was still being put into motion. They were,

00:19:58.500 they were actively for days building a plan. This, we knew it made sense. It's logical that they would do

00:20:03.620 it. But under what authority were they making the plan? The plan was the authority that they always

00:20:10.340 had from day one to execute that plan. So then he just confirmed it right there. We didn't actually

00:20:16.180 need the emergency act. We already had the authority to do the plan and we were going to execute the plan.

00:20:22.100 And the only thing that was helpful, tow trucks. Yeah. That's the same thing they've been saying

00:20:26.980 all along. Yeah. Tow trucks. I don't know if you, did you follow like the, the, the emergency, like

00:20:33.940 today? Yeah. The plan on the nine and the plan on the 13, the plan on the 17, the plan, and I was like

00:20:40.660 lost in all the plan that they had. I was like, how many plans did you have? Like, I don't know.

00:20:45.780 I think they had three. I think they had three at the end. They had an original one, the ninth,

00:20:49.060 then they had a second one, the 13 at the end. They only had three. I think that was a total.

00:20:54.180 Yeah. They, they would have, it makes sense to me that they would go through. Cause I listened to

00:20:58.100 the testimony. A lot of the planning that they go through that side is very similar to the way the

00:21:02.500 military would do that type of planning. They it's modified. It's not exactly the same, but a lot of the

00:21:08.580 vocabulary, the expressions are very same to military planning. And, um, so I just thought it was very

00:21:15.460 interesting to me that when I was listening to it, I thought, okay, you're doing your operational

00:21:19.860 plan or your tactical plan and you're doing it under your own authority. You don't need the

00:21:25.380 emergency act. And let's back up a little bit too by, I believe, uh, that before the invocation of

00:21:32.260 the emergency act, Ontario had already declared a state of emergency. So that even further enhanced

00:21:37.380 their plan. So they already had an, an, an enhanced level of authority under Ontario. Uh, but it didn't,

00:21:44.900 doesn't appear to have a, uh, an enormous amount of teeth, but it still was the city declared a

00:21:50.340 state of emergency, uh, which strangely enough was toothless because it, it actually had to,

00:21:55.860 you have to invoke the riot act, which is a bizarre thing. And then the, the province went to an

00:22:02.740 emergency under all of that authority that they already had, they were doing planning to do what

00:22:08.180 they did. It's just now they got the emergency act. And the only benefit that it gave them was the

00:22:13.940 fact that they could literally, um, almost federalize some tow trucks. Yeah. And I mean,

00:22:21.140 yeah, everyone declared the situation, emergency situation, but I just want to touch on two last

00:22:25.700 things because I see a Keith Wilson entered, entered a little building right here and we only

00:22:30.260 have you for seven more minutes. But one of the things that I want to touch on is one of the things

00:22:33.860 that Paul champ said, uh, as a question, this great lawyer, he said that, that doing this with the

00:22:40.900 jerry cans, uh, jerry cans and propane, um, you guys using this, he said quote unquote would mean

00:22:48.740 that the protesters could have been hurt or injured due to their own freedom. I couldn't stop laughing

00:22:55.380 when I heard that. What a bizarre thing to say. Yeah. I, uh, due to their own freedom. I, I listen,

00:23:05.140 I don't really, I was listening and I was really struggling to understand where he was going. Uh,

00:23:13.620 and you're going to hear, I hope we're going to hear testimony about the steps that we took, uh,

00:23:19.540 both involving two inspections from the fire marshal and from the electrical safety authority with, uh,

00:23:26.660 generators and electrical panels. We set up in places as well as all the steps we took to safely store

00:23:33.460 the fuel. There was inspections and I'm hoping it comes out. Yeah. I think as you touched on it on

00:23:38.740 yesterday's live stream, you touched on the fact that the police department came to you guys and

00:23:43.380 made an inspection. Yeah. I mean, my, my recollection of that is that, uh, the day before on the, on the

00:23:49.380 Saturday, the day before the police raid at Coventry, the, uh, the fire department, it came and

00:23:55.220 inspected, made recommendations. We, we did the modifications. They still came in and did the raid

00:23:59.700 anyway, which by the way, we also heard testimony by several people. Yeah. There was a, there was a

00:24:05.220 lot of divide about doing that raid. And in fact, I, there's a phone call that we received where, where

00:24:11.220 a police officer was making an apology about doing the raid at Coventry. Uh, and, and I'll leave that

00:24:17.540 alone. Cause I think I'll be testifying on these facts, but the day after Coventry, again, the, uh,

00:24:23.540 fire department came out and did an inspection on the fuel and they said, okay, it's, it's safe.

00:24:27.940 So for Paul champ to grasp at, uh, ambulances while he's chasing it. Yeah. I don't know where,

00:24:36.660 I don't know. I don't know. I think it's surprising from Paul champ though. But seriously, I think Paul

00:24:43.140 champ like is a waste of time, uh, for other like great lawyer or other people to ask questions,

00:24:50.420 especially on what, one of his question was like, are we been lucky in Ottawa to have nobody being

00:24:57.460 hurt or killed? I was like, are you kidding? Are you kidding? Unless like I've been feed feed in,

00:25:05.220 in the street and like some people like have been donated, like most of that their time to others.

00:25:11.940 Like you think that someone would be hurt or killed? Yeah, no, I, well, I'd love to know what this

00:25:18.500 tax the rich incompetent lawyer guy, Paul champ would have to say about the BLM protest that took

00:25:24.820 place in the United States. If he thinks those were just unlucky protests where it costs billions

00:25:30.740 of dollars in reparation to the city. Uh, one last thing that I want to touch on before you,

00:25:34.820 you leave us at some right-wing extremists, you know, at the beginning of the show today,

00:25:38.660 I made that joke that you're a right-wing extremist. And I see that as soon as Keith Wilson

00:25:42.340 entered, you took your tie off. Yeah. But, uh, right-wing extremists, we heard

00:25:46.100 them discussing the fact that there was right-wing extremism in the protest. What do you have to say

00:25:51.780 to that report that was presented? Yeah. So what's interesting is this report

00:25:56.580 that they were referencing in, in the commission today. Uh, I found it really interesting because

00:26:01.540 even inspector Drummond said, Hey, that's not something that we would have factored into our

00:26:05.540 intelligence. Where did that come from? And I, and I suspect I know, but I don't want to say

00:26:10.580 because I'm not a hundred percent sure where that report came from, but it is from my perspective,

00:26:16.820 it was just dropped in, uh, to further a narrative. I don't think it had any, it's good. It doesn't

00:26:22.980 have a lot of practical use in, in the commission other than to drop in this, um, these phrases,

00:26:31.140 right. These phrases, you know how it is, it's just wash, rinse, repeat, just say the same thing

00:26:35.540 over and over and over and it'll, it'll, it's meant to manipulate people that are susceptible

00:26:40.020 to that kind of a language. Uh, and the reality is that, uh, you know, I, my joke is I played right

00:26:48.040 wing in hockey, uh, a little bit of soccer, uh, but in terms of extremist, um, yeah, I'm just going

00:26:56.260 to leave it at that because, uh, we'll see how that fair. You were, you were probably a little bit

00:26:59.860 too far away in the oppositions. Cause I tend to consider myself a moderate right down the middle.

00:27:04.980 To be perfectly honest. So it was to say right wing, uh, that's just using words against people.

00:27:11.380 Uh, it's, it's all a sign up. No, I'm sure the Antifa groups wouldn't agree with you that they

00:27:16.820 would think that you're, you're an extremist. Tom, Tom, thanks for coming on today. And we'll

00:27:20.340 definitely see you. See you soon. Thanks for that. Of course we're going to go to a quick ad.

00:27:25.300 And then when we come back, we're going to have freedom convoy lawyer, Keith Wilson coming on as well.

00:27:35.940 Freedom in 2022 is not sitting idly by while health diktats with no skin in the game make up all the

00:27:44.100 rules. If you're like me and want to play an active role in upholding civil liberties and freedoms for

00:27:50.740 all Canadians, for our children, and eventually our grandchildren, then come out to our rebel live 0.97

00:27:57.300 event and get to know us in person. We'll hearing from some of the most influential leaders in the

00:28:04.260 freedom movement. We have events in Toronto on November the 19th and in Calgary on Saturday,

00:28:11.620 November 26th. Tickets are on sale now at rebel news live.com. Come out, have lunch,

00:28:18.820 get some rebel swag, meet the rebels and more. You don't want to miss this event. Check it out, rebel

00:28:25.380 news live.com.

00:28:30.340 Hey folks, from October 13th to November 25th, we are here in Ottawa for the Emergencies Act

00:28:48.180 inquiry organized by the Public Order Emergency Commission. But why? Why the Emergencies Act

00:28:52.740 inquiry? Well, because during the freedom convoy back in February, Justin Trudeau used a never-invoked-before

00:28:58.740 emergency act to basically seize protesters' bank accounts, seize protesters' money, seize their

00:29:04.180 assets, trample their civil liberties. So we're here this month for the next month and a half to

00:29:08.740 figure out if the way the government acted was lawful and was appropriate. So we are here to hold

00:29:13.700 the government accountable, but we need your help. We are here to cover it for you because everyone

00:29:17.300 else here is mainstream media. So if you want to help us cover it, if you want to help us bring you the

00:29:21.300 other side of the story, factual, actual news, go to truckercommission.com and consider making a donation.

00:29:29.700 All right, so we're back. We have someone that actually is able to wear a tie properly with a

00:29:33.700 proper dresser. Just by the way, before we start again, I just want to say a quick thing. I have my

00:29:38.180 phone on because I don't have my computer here, but all my notes are on my phone. So that's why

00:29:42.260 I look at my phone sometime. Keith, how are you doing? I'm doing great. Great. So just to begin,

00:29:47.540 I just want to get to your thoughts on Bath Vandenberg. How did you say her last name?

00:29:52.100 Vandenberg? Bath Shiva Vandenberg. Vandenberg. On her cross-examination of Mr. Brunier.

00:29:59.540 Well, I mean, she's trying to expose certain themes of contradiction in their testimony.

00:30:06.420 You know, one of the things that's troubling is how each of the senior police officials are dodging

00:30:14.340 the question about who made the decision to send hundreds of Canadians, after they'd been detained

00:30:21.140 for several hours, out into rural locations and drop them off with dead batteries in their phones,

00:30:28.500 without shelter or other means of communication or transportation. And my colleague pursued that

00:30:37.460 line of questioning. And the police official did the same thing that the previous one did,

00:30:43.140 which is to start talking about processing centers. And of course, we knew they had two

00:30:48.020 processing centers, but the issue is after people had been processed, they then took them to these rural

00:30:53.780 locations, minus 25, snow, wind, and kicked them out. A lot of them had been beaten. A lot of them

00:31:03.540 had already some frostbite on their hands because they were zip tied behind their backs and they

00:31:08.580 didn't have gloves on. They didn't have access to a bathroom for several hours. So it's outrageous.

00:31:15.380 This is Canada. Yeah, no, for sure. I think a lot of people have some hard time believing what

00:31:20.900 our country is like right now. Is what you're talking about the snatch and grab method? Because

00:31:25.860 we did hear Beth talk about that, but is that what you're talking about? Can you explain more?

00:31:30.180 Snatch and grab is where they have the line come forward. And then when someone's close,

00:31:35.540 they open the line, pull them through and then close the line. So that's how they would start

00:31:41.220 arresting people as they do this snatch and grab. And I think you guys witnessed that firsthand.

00:31:46.660 Yeah. Did you see some of that Alexa? I saw it a lot. It was actually what I saw

00:31:53.940 during the two days, just grabbing the one that was closer from the police that was more vulnerable.

00:31:59.860 And they were grabbing and bring it like really far away. And sometimes they wear a bee or the face down to

00:32:07.620 the snow. I saw it as well. I don't know for any legal site, but most of the vehicles were injured too.

00:32:22.260 Like they broke the window. They actually broke most of the window of the car. I was there at the

00:32:27.940 towing place and most of the car that was like going out of there was really destroyed. And I was just like,

00:32:35.780 do they have any help, like legal help for doing something against that? It seems like in the

00:32:42.100 commission, nobody's talking about like the injury of the car. Do they have like the power to do that?

00:32:50.100 Yeah. Well, I mean, you're a lawyer, so you can talk to you.

00:32:52.340 Yeah. And I should explain something because I get a lot of emails in the day. It's a disadvantage of

00:33:00.020 people being able to find your email address and maybe an advantage too. And here's what everybody

00:33:06.100 needs to understand is why is it that today, for example, our team had 25 minutes to cross-examine

00:33:15.860 this witness who was up for a day. And what happens is each day. So today we had to file by five o'clock

00:33:25.700 all of the documents that we plan to cross-examine the witness who will appear three days from now

00:33:32.500 and indicate the subject matter of our questioning and how much time we want. So we'll say like an

00:33:38.420 hour and a half. And then two days later, we'll get an email saying you're allowed to cross-examine,

00:33:48.100 but you get five minutes or you're allowed to cross-examine, but you get 15 minutes.

00:33:52.740 Yeah, it depends every day.

00:33:53.700 And we even get a seating order as to who can sit at a council table and the sequence

00:33:58.340 of when the questioning will occur. So then we triage and we go, all right, we had an hour and

00:34:04.820 a half worth of questions. So we have to focus in on certain areas. And we've been incrementally

00:34:11.540 bringing things in, as you'll notice, like today was the first time you saw the videos of the violence

00:34:16.420 because we had other things we had to deal with earlier. And we had to say, okay,

00:34:20.020 yeah, we wanted to ask Bell about that, but we knew we had too many more important things we had

00:34:26.020 to get out from him. So, so it's a big complex chessboard we're dealing with and we're always

00:34:31.860 have way less time and way more questions. So we have to triage. So for those out there wondering

00:34:37.140 why we're not asking certain questions, that's part of the answer. One of the things that we wanted to

00:34:42.100 get out today was the violence of the police. And that's why we put that video in where you can

00:34:46.260 clearly see that police officer just ramming his rifle, muzzle and not even button into someone's

00:34:53.940 back or head or something. Um, and you know, the room went really quiet when that video played,

00:35:01.780 I think it had, it had the desired effect. And that's, and that's another thing we're wanting

00:35:05.380 to play a lot more videos. But if you think about how long it takes to play the video,

00:35:11.300 and they always seem to have trouble queuing it up and then it buffers or it stops. Well,

00:35:16.020 that's our time tick, tick, tick, tick. You're playing the video now. Um, so we're, we're, we're,

00:35:21.700 you're going to see more videos. Um, but those are some of the, the, the tactical procedural

00:35:27.620 challenges we have in the room, uh, given how much evidence they're trying to get in over such a

00:35:33.220 short period of course, of course, the strategy that you lawyers have to, to decide which evidence

00:35:37.460 we put first, which evidence we put to which person, definitely some interesting stuff. And

00:35:42.100 you know, as you often come on our live stream, you're becoming sort of a star, but I think you

00:35:45.940 were also a star on tick tock as we saw today. Um, well, um, my question is like, did you expect

00:35:57.780 that they were using that video? Probably. I don't know if it was kind of against you,

00:36:02.740 but it was like a kind of a narrative that was going in the other way that the parties

00:36:09.460 was telling, uh, the protestor to do. So did you expect that they were playing it today?

00:36:16.420 I actually thought, I thought they would actually use that against me in cross-examination.

00:36:23.140 So I was glad to see it come out today because they used it in cross-examination on the police,

00:36:28.100 one of the lawyers. I mean, honestly, it doesn't make you look bad because you are saying to the

00:36:31.540 protesters that are coming here to Ottawa to cause trouble not to come. So you are telling

00:36:37.620 them that if you come here to, you know, disrupt international trade or to cause trouble,

00:36:42.100 do not come to Ottawa. Those are your exact words from the tick tock video. So I was very surprised

00:36:46.980 to see that lawyer who is leaning against the freedom convoy to try to put that video

00:36:52.260 out and show it to me. I don't think it makes you look bad, to be honest.

00:36:54.820 Well, uh, thank you for that. I mean, it's always weird to watch yourself as we all know,

00:36:59.700 uh, and what we're the three of us do, but, um, the background on that video was,

00:37:05.860 uh, we had, uh, Tamara had called emergency board meeting. We were in the seventh floor

00:37:11.620 boardroom in the Sheridan hotel. It was the, uh, that would have been probably the 16th, the Wednesday.

00:37:20.180 Yeah. That was the last time we were all together before we had to disperse because the arrests were

00:37:25.460 starting. Um, and what had happened was I just briefed the board. I had several lawyers,

00:37:31.300 some on my team and some on a new team. We brought in review the legislation. In addition to my own

00:37:36.260 review, wanted to make sure I was absolutely solid in my understanding of the law. Cause I knew I was

00:37:40.740 going to make a definitive statement about it. And, uh, I briefed the board. Chris Barber said,

00:37:46.820 that's great. You just told the board, come over here, let's do a tick tock and tell the world.

00:37:51.860 And he's like, Hey, I'm joined by lawyer. Keith Wells is like, Oh, okay. I guess I got to say it.

00:37:57.220 Um, and I stand by what I said. It's a hundred percent legally accurate. That was,

00:38:02.260 was amazing to us is what the actual emergency act order said. It clearly said that Canadians

00:38:08.980 continued to have their charter right for peaceful assembly. It clearly said that Canadians

00:38:13.220 continued to have the right for, uh, political advocacy, protest and dissent. And then it went

00:38:18.580 on to say, however, you know, if you're going to block international trade, or if you're going to

00:38:23.540 interfere with critical infrastructure, like a ferry terminal or a bridge,

00:38:27.540 or if you're going to engage in serious acts of violence against persons or property,

00:38:32.260 then you weren't allowed to go to downtown Ottawa. Well, I didn't know anybody wanted to do

00:38:37.060 any of those things. So that meant everybody was allowed to go to downtown Ottawa.

00:38:41.860 And you've heard repeatedly them use the expression that this became an illegal protest,

00:38:47.700 right? There is no point in time, none at which it became illegal protest. And you'll notice

00:38:54.100 they're always vague about what was the moment in time that it became illegal? What was the criteria?

00:38:59.540 The bottom line is at no point in time, was it illegal?

00:39:02.500 Well, I think that we both know the exact thing that had to be done by the mayor.

00:39:06.900 We will. We'll show it at some point. We don't want to spoil it already, but let me assure you,

00:39:12.340 it's very funny. Um, but you mentioned earlier that you were scared in a certain way that they

00:39:16.660 would use it against you in cross-examination. So that would mean that you're going to be testifying.

00:39:21.860 I think I, I, I learned earlier that you're going to be testifying next week.

00:39:25.540 Yeah. We received the tentative, uh, schedule for the protest witnesses. Uh, the tentative schedule

00:39:31.460 is, uh, on Tuesday will be Chris Barber and Tom Marazzo. Uh, on the Wednesday, it'll be myself.

00:39:39.060 On Thursday, it will be Tamara Leach. And then on the Friday, it'll be Danny Bulford.

00:39:43.540 And you know, you're going to be testifying for full day, but I have a couple of questions on that.

00:39:46.420 So I know in the preliminary witness list, get me warmed up here. You're going to do a little practice.

00:39:50.580 Yeah. Uh, you weren't, your name wasn't on the preliminary witness list. So why were you added?

00:39:58.500 Was it something that you guys requested? Yeah. So what worked is, and let me help clarify this too,

00:40:03.780 because so the witnesses is always a living document in an inquiry of this nature. They

00:40:09.780 released a preliminary witness list because we were still in discussions with them about

00:40:14.660 the range of witnesses that we wanted to put forward and the rationale for putting them forward.

00:40:18.980 They only put very few of our witnesses on, on that list. And people looked at the list and they

00:40:25.140 went, wow, how come there's so few from the convoy? So that's the reason we submitted a list of 25.

00:40:32.340 In fact, we're expanding it by a few more. Um, so the commission is currently reviewing that list of

00:40:39.140 25 witnesses that we're requesting. And, uh, and only three on the current list are, are on the

00:40:46.420 official list that you've seen. I mean, I'm not on that list and I'm testifying. Danny

00:40:50.100 Wolfer's not on that list, but he's testifying. So, um, there'll be a further list that will come

00:40:55.860 out in probably the coming days. Um, you know, we're shifting, uh, the resources of the commission

00:41:01.780 have been really focused on, on the municipal officials and the, the, the municipal and provincial

00:41:07.860 police. Now they're shifting their energies into the protesters. That'll be the next phase.

00:41:12.820 And, and then the federal police, and then the, the, the, the, the great crescendo at the end

00:41:19.060 will be, uh, in the last two weeks, the, uh, one fifth of the federal cabinet is expected to

00:41:25.220 testify, including, uh, prime minister Trudeau himself. But I mean, why Keith Wilson? I mean,

00:41:30.580 you're, you're, you're just a tech talk star. Why, why are you? Well, uh, I, I take your,

00:41:35.300 your sarcasm, um, gotten to know this guy, seeing him every day in the hearing room. Um,

00:41:41.220 you know, I, I was asked to lead the legal team and I flew in with my team on February 2nd,

00:41:47.540 and I was on the ground for 19 days. And I was just talking to Tamara cause I was reviewing my

00:41:52.020 telephone logs from my, my, my cell phone bill to show all the phone calls I had with

00:41:56.180 premier Peckford and the mayor's chief of staff and the police and all these things to confirm

00:42:01.100 dates and times. And, um, I said to Tamara, I said, your phone number's not on there once.

00:42:07.820 And she said, yeah, she said, we, we, we always talked face to face cause we were always together.

00:42:11.900 So Tom and Tamara and Eva and I, and others were always together from early morning to late at night,

00:42:19.420 dealing with the issues. Um, Evan and I were involved in all the negotiations with the police.

00:42:24.520 We dealt with GoFundMe. We dealt with give send go. We've dealt with the class action lawsuit.

00:42:28.820 We dealt with the horn injunction. We've dealt with the Mareeva injunction. We dealt with the Bitcoin.

00:42:32.900 Um, so, um, I think that's why they've asked me to testify. Oh, it'll be interesting to see you

00:42:38.980 testifying. Yeah. And you, you were, you, you were there when, um, the, the meeting with the mayor

00:42:45.300 was there and they actually say today that you fell at, um, uh, the, I, I, I don't know, maybe you need

00:42:54.740 to refresh me, but I, they say that when Keith Williams did fell for the, um, um, to seal the deal,

00:43:02.820 I think, uh, with the protestor, with the mayor. Um, I don't know if you recall. Oh yeah.

00:43:08.660 They were talking about you. Yeah. Yeah. Their, their, their narrative is,

00:43:14.660 well, the police have a narrative and the federal government have a narrative. The police narrative is

00:43:19.380 it's not their fault that they blocked the trucks for moving. Cause we had trucks ready to go every

00:43:25.140 day. We had, we had, we had a huge note. We, we were really surprised at the buy-in on the Saturday

00:43:31.860 night and the Saturday, the leaders and the block captains went around to all the different blocks,

00:43:36.740 Coventry, uh, Tamara herself went out to the farm locations to make sure that the owners of those

00:43:41.780 lands were satisfied with hundreds of vehicles showing up in the coming days. And they were,

00:43:46.100 and they had room for them because the most of the vehicles were 75% of the vehicles were

00:43:50.020 going to leave the downtown core 25. We're going to go up to Wellington. And then the idea is that

00:43:54.100 we would expand the shuttle bus service from the farms, the camps. So the protesters could keep

00:43:59.380 coming during the day. And there was also a lot of people that needed to get home. You know,

00:44:03.460 they wanted to stay and they wanted to stay as long as they could, but we have to be realistic.

00:44:07.620 And, and, and so making this move provided an opportunity for them to move with dignity.

00:44:12.580 Um, so the police narrative is, well, the trucks were never going to leave.

00:44:15.940 So it didn't matter that we blocked them. It's still the truckers fault, right? It's like, no,

00:44:19.860 it's your fault. So that's what the commission's lawyers are really pursuing today. Um,

00:44:24.420 the federal government narrative is the federal government was right to ignore this breakthrough

00:44:30.020 deal between the mayor and the truckers because the truckers weren't going to honor it. And the

00:44:34.660 truckers never completed the deal. Well, when they keep concrete barriers in front of your truck,

00:44:41.780 it's pretty hard to move. So I think this commission is seeing through that. You can see

00:44:46.260 that in the questioning that they're having. And I'm hoping that by the time the rest of us testify

00:44:51.300 and tell the other side of the story, that it'll become clear. What really happened here is that we had

00:44:56.500 a plan to deescalate, to reduce the pressures on the downtown, to concentrate the pressure on the

00:45:03.220 federal government where it needed to be and to allow the protest to carry on in a way that was

00:45:09.460 more sustainable. Yeah. No, we, we, we keep hearing a lot of stuff. Yeah.

00:45:14.900 Yeah. And, uh, they talk a lot today about the miscommunication and I have the impression that

00:45:22.340 all the group of, uh, different, um, unite of bodies like the, um, the PLT or the OPP or the OPS.

00:45:32.820 And I have the impression that they were not communicating to each other. It was just like,

00:45:37.700 we are communicating with the OPS, but I have the impression that the information was not going

00:45:43.140 true to others. So, um, probably I have the impression that if everything went not well,

00:45:50.340 it's, it's a lack of communication. Yeah. I mean, one of the things we realized is that,

00:45:56.180 and we knew this at the time is that we had better communications than the police.

00:46:00.340 Um, so the number of times I would get a phone call from, from the, the police level that we were

00:46:06.900 dealing with constantly and they go, Keith, Keith, what's going on? And we'd say, well,

00:46:12.420 your superintendent is meeting with your chief and they're deciding this, this, and this. They're

00:46:16.900 like, okay, thanks. We'll tell the other guys here. Like, no problem. Why don't you guys just

00:46:20.340 give me a radio? You know? Um, so we had that, but the other thing that we learned that we didn't

00:46:25.540 know at the time, we thought it was all communication was the problem. We now know from all of the notes

00:46:31.540 of the superintendents and the interim chief that they made conscious decisions, not to let the deal go

00:46:38.660 through. They made conscious decisions. Like the first attempt for us to clear Sussex and Rodeau,

00:46:44.820 which occurred after the meeting we had with Steve Kaye, the city manager on the eighth,

00:46:49.060 Eva, Chipyuk, myself, and Tom is, uh, uh, we now found out today from the police notes

00:46:57.700 that the senior command had in the morning said, there's no way we're going to let any trucks move

00:47:03.540 from that intersection. So Tom Marazzo was like, well, why did you send me in to negotiate with

00:47:09.380 Sussex and Rodeau? When you already knew you weren't going to let any trucks move. And Tom had

00:47:15.300 them ready to move. He walked forward in a parlay because all the police were gathered, had a

00:47:20.900 conversation with Sergeant Fong and Fong said, oh, I got to take a call. Cause Tom said, we're ready to

00:47:27.940 go, pull the barriers. We're going to move up to Wellington. Uh, you're going to get your intersection

00:47:32.260 cleared. And, uh, Fong said, oh, deals off. And we now have the notes from the senior command

00:47:39.780 officials that made that decision and noting that they phoned Fong and said the deals off,

00:47:44.900 or there were, there was never going to be a deal. So it's remarkable. Um, this could have been

00:47:50.020 handled in a way that would have, this could have been handled in a Canadian way, you know, by respect

00:47:56.820 and dialogue and recognizing that there was a fundamental difference of view. Um, and by

00:48:02.580 deescalating, uh, as, as the commissioners asked many of the witnesses, was there ever a plan or an

00:48:09.540 offer to allow a way for the protest to continue in a way that was peaceful and lawful? And we were

00:48:16.740 actually on a track for that. And the other bombshell that came out yesterday, you guys probably covered

00:48:21.140 it, but I just got to highlight it. Uh, you know, the mic drop moment with, uh, with Miller.

00:48:26.100 Oh yeah. And, and, and just to, to simplify that for everyone, because it's, unless you're,

00:48:31.860 it was hard to pick up on exactly what happened there, but it was this, the same steps that Eva

00:48:38.820 and Tom and I were taking with the city and the mayor and Dean French, former chief of staff to

00:48:43.540 Premier Ford, who was acting as the emissary, the intermediary, but with the mayor, um, that whole

00:48:48.980 kind of framework that we had in place to deescalate, reduce the footprint, focus the, the protest right

00:48:54.500 on the federal government's doorstep was something that the RCMP and the federal government and the

00:49:00.180 public safety deputy minister had come up with as well. And they had laid it out in this document

00:49:05.780 and this whole plan as to how it could work. And it was basically mimicking what we had done at the

00:49:09.860 municipal level. They were going to do it implemented at the federal level and it would have worked.

00:49:14.100 It was presented to the cabinet and they said, no, we're invoking the emergencies act. And that's

00:49:19.460 when Miller said to the head OPP yesterday, sir, cause he was involved in developing this plan of,

00:49:26.820 of negotiation. Sir, you, do you, I I'm, I'm telling you that this plan was presented to the IROC,

00:49:37.060 whatever their initials are, this cabinet emergency committee, um, for this deescalation,

00:49:45.540 they rejected it and they invoked the emergencies.

00:49:48.260 Exactly. Look at exactly what, what Miller said right here.

00:49:57.300 An email from the deputy minister of public safety, Rob Stewart to you, right?

00:50:01.460 Yes. Okay. And in the third sentence on the top paragraph, it says,

00:50:07.620 we have a big meeting this afternoon. Well, this will be discussed. So I really need your input,

00:50:12.740 right? Yes. All right. Did you know that that meeting

00:50:17.060 was at 3 30 PM and that it was with cabinet and it was the incident response group

00:50:23.620 of the political executive meeting and that your proposal was provided to them?

00:50:28.980 Uh, no. Okay. It was, I can tell you that. And then they invoked the emergencies act.

00:50:35.060 Thank you. If you look, look at his face, that's the first time he discovers that this plan he had,

00:50:52.100 that was a really good plan. And the proof that it was really good plan was it was so similar to the

00:50:58.340 plan that mom and Eva and, and Steve K and, and, and, and the mayor and his chief of staff and Dean

00:51:04.580 French had put together. And that was succeeding was succeeding. And so he's really excited about it,

00:51:12.900 this senior OPP officer. And he finds out on a live stream under oath in cross-examination that

00:51:20.820 his plan was in fact presented to the cabinet and the prime minister. What you can see, he's like,

00:51:26.100 wow, really? What happened? They rejected it. They invoked the emergencies act. And you saw his face

00:51:32.740 as he stares at Miller walking off the stand.

00:51:36.180 And your friend, your friend Miller from Alberta is such a great lawyer. And I think we have another

00:51:39.780 clip from today that we can show to our viewers about the cross-examination done by Brandon Miller.

00:51:44.740 Let's take a look at that.

00:51:45.540 So at any time on February 8th, 2022, there was nothing stopping OPS in the city from moving the

00:51:53.380 barriers, letting the trucks leave the residential area and letting them go on to Wellington, was there?

00:52:01.060 You're referring to Rio and Sussex, which that's not necessarily a residential area. That's a commercial

00:52:07.700 area there.

00:52:08.500 Right. So you agree that there was nothing stopping you or the city or OPS from

00:52:15.300 allowing that to happen on February 8th, 2022.

00:52:18.980 It could have been done, but we didn't reach an agreement. And the group there didn't want to move.

00:52:24.260 I understand that may be the evidence. Where did you, you didn't ever hear from anyone from that

00:52:30.260 group. You didn't speak to them and they didn't say to you that they didn't want to move, did they?

00:52:35.940 I had had dealings up at that street. I'd been up to Rio and Sussex during the course of the events.

00:52:40.580 Right. And did they just go and tell you, someone approached you, you're saying,

00:52:43.700 and said, no, we're not moving?

00:52:46.260 They made it clear on a number of occasions they weren't too happy.

00:52:49.380 But you knew from your PLT work that Tom Morazzo had apparent control of 322 trucks.

00:52:55.380 And that was on February 7th. That's in your own document.

00:52:58.260 Correct.

00:52:59.380 Correct. And so if you move the barriers and the deal went through, as discussed on February 8th,

00:53:07.140 right, it could have been done.

00:53:10.820 I think there was some, there were some issues about whether they were leaving or moving.

00:53:15.700 And I had spoke to Inspector, Superintendent Patterson earlier, and we didn't have approval to do that.

00:53:22.260 Approval?

00:53:22.820 To move west.

00:53:24.820 Okay. And what, whose approval did you need?

00:53:28.660 The event commander, Superintendent Patterson.

00:53:30.420 Superintendent Patterson.

00:53:31.460 So you're saying that Superintendent Patterson didn't permit the February 8th, 2022 deal?

00:53:37.620 Yes, perfect.

00:53:41.700 Interesting. Yeah, what do you make of that question?

00:53:43.620 Well, it just, again, it illustrates that

00:53:49.540 we worked really hard to earn the trust of the bulk of the protesters. 0.68

00:53:56.340 You know, there's always going to be lone wolves and guys who are going to say silly things.

00:54:01.220 I mean, you get more than 10 people together, you're going to have that one person do that.

00:54:04.660 But if the reality is, if the police would have cooperated,

00:54:10.980 and they wouldn't have stopped and kept double crossing,

00:54:15.380 we would have had the entirety of the downtown cleared, but for Wellington.

00:54:21.460 I estimate that about, you know, so 25% of the vehicles would have went up onto Wellington.

00:54:26.900 We had lots of room under on Wellington.

00:54:30.900 About 75% would have left.

00:54:32.980 And I think about half of those would have went to the base camps.

00:54:35.700 And some would have went home.

00:54:36.740 And they maybe would have only went home for five or six days.

00:54:38.900 And then they would have come back to the base camp.

00:54:40.420 And we would have been running our shuttle buses.

00:54:42.180 And we would have kept the pressure on the federal government.

00:54:44.580 But, you know, you think about what would have happened if you gamed that out.

00:54:47.060 And we did.

00:54:48.260 We knew that if we did the deal with the mayor,

00:54:52.180 and the mayor effectively solved the problem, who looks incredibly weak?

00:54:57.140 The prime minister.

00:54:58.260 Yeah, the mayor looks strong, and the prime minister looks weak, right?

00:55:03.380 So he wasn't going to have that.

00:55:05.380 The truckers had already showed him for what he is.

00:55:09.860 And that's why our plan and its success didn't dissuade them from bringing in the Emergencies Act.

00:55:17.460 And as we now know, the OPP plan and the federal government public safety plan to open up negotiations at the federal level that we were always open to was not going to be allowed.

00:55:30.980 And instead, I said to each of the police liaison and senior government officials that phoned me on the Wednesday, this would be the 16th, and told me the deal's not going ahead anymore.

00:55:47.220 The new police chief stopped it, and the federal government stopped it.

00:55:50.580 And I said, it's clear to me that the prime minister wants his Tiananmen Square moment.

00:55:58.580 When you think back to Beijing, when the students revolted 20-some years ago, and the communist regime sent in the goons to beat up and shoot citizens that were protesting for democracy.

00:56:11.580 Well, he's got his deep admiration for the basic dictatorship in China.

00:56:17.180 He said it.

00:56:17.620 He said it.

00:56:18.440 He's told us about his admiration, and then we have his other ties to Cuba, which might be family.

00:56:25.180 We're not sure.

00:56:25.860 But, you know, so he's got those affinities to these kind of authoritarian regimes, and it's his default, obviously.

00:56:32.400 We know we've got to make sure that we're careful of what we say because Bill Steele then might be enacted into law.

00:56:36.940 Let's throw to a quick ad.

00:56:38.260 When we come back, we'll talk about Doug Ford for a quick moment,

00:56:40.680 and then we'll read some of your chats.

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00:56:51.100 and has invited Alex Epstein, American author of the best-selling new book, Fossil Future,

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00:57:01.620 Join us on Friday, October 28th at the Westin Calgary Airport for beef and beer with Alex Epstein.

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00:57:14.220 My mug? I know. It's pretty cool.

00:57:19.220 So is this hoodie I got on, and you could have it on, too, if you check out our special website at rebelnewsstore.com.

00:57:26.740 That's where you can see Freedom Focus hoodies that we have for you, beanies, cell phone cases, you name it,

00:57:33.020 all while supporting our journalism, where we fight to bring you the other side of the story,

00:57:38.100 as opposed to, you know, being forced by the Trudeau government to fund leftist media out of your taxes.

00:57:44.820 The truth is, without you and your generosity, there is no Rebel News.

00:57:50.020 So, again, if you like the reports that we bring you and that we also fight for freedoms in Canada,

00:57:56.940 please consider doing some shopping, picking up some swag at rebelnewsstore.com.

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00:58:03.720 I think to Doug Ford, may you allow me, I was surprised that to watch the commission so far,

00:58:14.740 and none of them mentioned the number of press conferences that the leader of the convoy did

00:58:22.720 to try to pass the message and to communicate and to make their voice heard by the politician.

00:58:30.500 And I was just like, really, I found that really incredible that they didn't bring that up at all.

00:58:37.360 Yeah, well, you guys were willing to engage with the politicians.

00:58:40.300 You guys were willing to talk to the politicians.

00:58:42.740 In regards to Doug Ford, now we learned recently that he was summoned to participate in the Public Order Emergency Act inquiry.

00:58:50.620 Do you have any updates on that situation?

00:58:51.980 Well, he has been summonsed.

00:58:55.880 The commission has detailed initially their efforts over the past couple of months to have him participate.

00:59:03.560 They've indicated in writing the questions they were looking to get answers to,

00:59:08.260 so there's no trial by ambush here.

00:59:11.940 And he refused all of those, so they took steps to subpoena him, to compel him to attend by force of law.

00:59:18.700 He has responded by having his lawyers bring an emergency judicial review application seeking to strike down the summons.

00:59:27.600 And he might have some success because of some peculiarities in the law with respect to the jurisdiction of a federal inquiry to compel and subpoena a sitting provincial politician.

00:59:40.700 But aside from that, you have to say to yourself, well, what's he got to hide?

00:59:47.160 You know, what's he afraid of exactly?

00:59:49.260 I mean, none of those involved in the protests that I know who are being asked to testify, including myself, we're sleeping fine at night.

01:00:00.120 We know that we've got nothing to hide.

01:00:02.840 What is it that he knows that he doesn't want to come out?

01:00:06.200 So very, very perplexing, concerning, and it will be even more concerning if he's successful in preventing the subpoena from being effective

01:00:17.620 and able to escape being examined and cross-examined under oath in this inquiry.

01:00:23.160 Yeah, well, in terms of transparency, you know, we know Doug Ford is not the most transparent premier at all.

01:00:26.900 He blocks our Rebel News reporter, David Menzies, from all of his events, even though he used to come on our Rebel Live event.

01:00:33.660 I don't know if you're able to touch on it, but what do you expect to press Doug Ford on?

01:00:39.360 What do you want to see the lawyers press him on when he comes on the stand?

01:00:42.600 Well, I think some of the things that he would be pressed on would be questions relating to the powers that he had at his disposal

01:00:53.500 under the Provincial Emergencies Act and the sufficiency of those.

01:00:58.940 Another would be why he sort of hid from this issue.

01:01:05.320 He didn't, you know, he pointed out how many press conferences to Mara Leach and media statements she did,

01:01:12.140 and the premier was, you know, missing in action.

01:01:15.840 So I think those are a couple of things that could be pursued if he is eventually required to testify.

01:01:21.780 Yeah, no, it'll definitely be interesting.

01:01:23.940 See, I really do hope that Doug Ford actually comes on the stand and testified.

01:01:29.540 All right, we're already past our time.

01:01:30.900 Do we have any chats, Olivia, that we can read on the screen?

01:01:36.000 All right, so the first one.

01:01:38.020 I like to think that Catherine McKinney's testimony had a small part to play in her election loss.

01:01:42.660 I promise I won't misgender her, William.

01:01:44.960 Be careful, you might be banned from the internet with Bill C-11.

01:01:51.920 Do you know who Catherine McKinney is?

01:01:53.360 Oh, yeah.

01:01:53.900 Oh, that's right.

01:01:54.540 Well, you were in the room.

01:01:55.380 Yeah, you've heard a little bit.

01:01:56.440 Yeah, honestly, my plans on moving to Alberta, to the great province of Alberta,

01:02:00.320 have been delayed now that Mark Stuckliffe is elected.

01:02:03.120 I can assure you that if Catherine McKinney had been elected mayor of Ottawa,

01:02:08.660 I would most probably move to Alberta in the next few months, next few years.

01:02:12.580 But, yeah, no, it's great to see someone other than this woman. 1.00

01:02:16.880 Sorry, this individual be elected as mayor of the city, yeah.

01:02:21.800 Well, I wouldn't be surprised if her testimony and the publicity around it

01:02:26.560 and her hot mic moment, you know, like she was running on a campaign of transparency

01:02:32.340 and she gets caught in a public inquiry that's live-streamed coaching a witness.

01:02:38.100 Yeah.

01:02:38.400 I mean, wow, that's the antithesis of transparency.

01:02:41.680 That's called manipulation.

01:02:43.780 So, you know, and the internet, well, she had to issue a statement about it.

01:02:52.040 She felt she did.

01:02:52.820 She did a video about it.

01:02:54.380 She tried to walk it back. 0.93

01:02:56.100 She issued some threats.

01:02:57.620 So, you know, it underscores the importance of this media.

01:03:02.900 You know, this is the way we reach people now.

01:03:04.880 We know we can't rely on the captured legacy media that is always seeking to please its

01:03:10.980 paymaster, the Trudeau government.

01:03:13.580 And we need to rely on these forms of communication to get to truth and examine issues in a full way.

01:03:20.980 And you said transparency.

01:03:22.300 That's the same woman that when I asked her to state her position on the value of freedom of speech in Canada,

01:03:26.440 wouldn't give me an answer.

01:03:28.420 She wouldn't give me an answer on what her position is on freedom of speech,

01:03:32.220 which is one of the basic rights that we have as Canadians.

01:03:36.540 So, no, I'm truly glad that she wasn't elected.

01:03:38.960 We went to the bar after the election night, everyone.

01:03:42.660 Do we have another chat that we can read?

01:03:44.300 I have a really challenging question for you, Keith.

01:03:56.720 What will be the consequences if they find out the Emergencies Act was not necessary?

01:04:03.860 What will happen?

01:04:07.480 So, I get that question a lot.

01:04:12.080 And I need to say two things about it.

01:04:16.240 First of all, if anybody's been involved in a lawsuit or any kind of legal process,

01:04:23.000 it's not often the decision at the end that crushes you.

01:04:26.980 It's the process.

01:04:28.300 It's the process that you go through.

01:04:31.160 So, what we're witnessing right now, you know, I warned everybody,

01:04:38.060 all of the clients and the leaders of the freedom movement that we're going to have a really tough two months,

01:04:46.840 that we're just going to get beat up every day.

01:04:49.980 It's going to look like the world's against us.

01:04:52.620 We're going to be smeared and lied about.

01:04:55.700 I never, ever thought it was going to go as well as it's going.

01:05:00.240 Yeah, exactly.

01:05:00.580 That's what I was going to say.

01:05:01.540 Yeah.

01:05:01.700 I just really didn't.

01:05:02.280 The number of times we've all looked at one another and said, well, I guess we're off to the airport.

01:05:07.220 Time to go home, you know, after one of their witnesses reveals something.

01:05:12.620 And, of course, we're not going anywhere.

01:05:14.280 We're going to see this through to its conclusion.

01:05:16.580 But part of what's happening right now is even some of the left-wing press is coming out against the government.

01:05:24.300 And it's a drip, drip, drip, drip of the truth.

01:05:30.040 And so one of the consequences is the consequence of the process.

01:05:35.320 Another is it is true that when Justice Rouleau issues his report in February,

01:05:44.400 that if he concludes that the invocation was not justified,

01:05:48.520 it doesn't mean that Justin Trudeau pays a fine.

01:05:51.560 It doesn't mean that he goes to jail.

01:05:55.560 The expectation of the legislation is there'll be a political consequence.

01:05:59.900 In any other situation, one would expect the leader of the party that invoked it

01:06:04.900 and its cabinet to resign, to do the honorable thing.

01:06:09.360 Now, that requires people of integrity.

01:06:12.620 And I don't need to finish the sentence there because you can fill it out yourself.

01:06:16.180 So the best that we can hope for is that more and more Canadians,

01:06:25.300 like the number of people that have tacked me on Twitter saying there was no deal,

01:06:29.240 there was no deal to move the trucks.

01:06:31.140 Well, what, 102 trucks just magically moved?

01:06:34.240 All these notes in the superintendent's things about truck movements, they're lying.

01:06:39.460 So even the naysayers are having to admit the truth about what really happened during the protests.

01:06:47.480 And it's so counter to the legacy captured media's narrative and the propaganda that they were pushing.

01:06:55.220 You know, Solzhenitsyn, who helped bring down the Soviet Union, did it by always staying honest to the truth. 0.64

01:07:06.300 You know, that expression about as time went on, I can't do the whole thing, but it's we knew they were lying.

01:07:14.800 They knew they were lying.

01:07:15.960 We knew that they knew that we knew they were, you know, et cetera.

01:07:19.080 It's going through all these permutations.

01:07:20.780 And I think we're going down that road right now where more and more people are realizing the government was lying.

01:07:26.800 Yeah.

01:07:27.260 No, that's what's great about the emergency act inquiry, 100%.

01:07:30.900 It'll be very good to see the outcome of that.

01:07:33.200 Well, thank you to everyone for joining us.

01:07:35.380 I know we're already 10 minutes past the time that we're supposed to end.

01:07:39.620 Thank you, Alexa, for working so hard and being on the live stream tonight.

01:07:42.700 Thank you for joining us once again.

01:07:43.980 Thank you.

01:07:44.560 And being able to wear a tie properly with a proper dress shirt.

01:07:48.720 Thanks again to everyone for joining us.

01:07:50.720 And I'll see you tomorrow.

01:07:55.380 According to that first email that we saw, you were the one who was provided with this information, right?

01:08:00.160 That Mr. Morazzo wanted to meet with a city official.

01:08:02.880 Yes, from John Ferguson, Staff Sergeant John Ferguson.

01:08:05.460 Okay.

01:08:06.240 And so this was a sort of, you know, if he's able to meet with a city official, then he will attempt to negotiate movement of trucks out of the Rideau and Sussex area.

01:08:17.300 I don't know if it was necessarily defined at that point as Rideau and Sussex, but the request was to meet with a city official in exchange to try to help move some trucks out of the area.

01:08:28.380 Okay.

01:08:28.900 And in the witness summary that we just looked at, you provided a bit more background.

01:08:32.620 And you said that moving these trucks was being considered because there was space available on Wellington.

01:08:38.180 Yes.

01:08:38.500 Is that right?

01:08:39.140 Yes.

01:08:40.240 Okay.

01:08:40.880 And why did you understand the protesters at Rideau and Sussex wanting to move to the Wellington area?

01:08:48.460 They wanted to be closer to Parliament Hill.

01:08:50.880 And it also, from our perspective, would have helped shrink the footprint and opened up that road.

01:08:57.660 And why was that important to open up that road?

01:09:00.900 It's a main artery in the City of Ottawa at Rideau and Sussex.

01:09:04.060 It's the main access.

01:09:05.460 It's a bus route.

01:09:06.420 It's emergency access for emergency vehicles.

01:09:08.940 It's access to the Rideau Centre.

01:09:11.940 It was a main area that we wanted to try to get opened up.

01:09:16.000 But equally, there were lots of other areas we wanted to get opened up as well.

01:09:19.820 Our goal was to try to help the move.

01:09:23.100 And by reducing the footprint, that would also help us.

01:09:26.260 And is it fair to say that this move would have been seen as helpful to OPS?

01:09:31.020 Yes.

01:09:31.560 I mean, ultimately, we wanted people to leave and to vacate those roads, period.

01:09:36.600 But in the meantime, as part of a negotiation strategy to try to reduce the footprint,

01:09:41.160 yes, we were interested in moving them.

01:09:42.540 And I think that's sort of the ability and I think that we're going to open to see thoseulos in the past. 1.00

01:09:46.320 So let's look at the end.

01:09:47.420 I think that's a way.

01:09:47.820 I think that's a way.

01:09:49.120 That's right.

01:09:49.260 So let's head in.

01:09:49.660 So let's look at the momentum of the pavement Spirit.

Rebel News Podcast - October 27, 2022

BREAKDOWN： Trucker Commission Day 10 ｜ Ft. Tom Marazzo & Keith Wilson

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