Rebel News Podcast - EZRA LEVANT ｜ Mark Carney champions 'net zero wokeness' over profits

00:00:00.000 Hello, my friends. I've got good news for you. Canada now has a free speech union.

00:00:05.420 It's a full-time operation dedicated to freedom of speech. We've got the Justice Center. We've

00:00:09.940 got the Democracy Fund. What a pleasure to have a new NGO. We'll talk to Lisa Bildy,

00:00:15.340 their new boss. We'll also talk to her about a civil liberties case she has taken at the Justice 0.98

00:00:20.800 Center. And I'm going to give you a teaser about my investigative report into Mark Carney and his

00:00:26.240 role of pretty much extorting companies to go green and leave the carbon in the ground.

00:00:32.840 But first, let me invite you to become a subscriber to what we call Rebel News Plus.

00:00:35.980 That's the video version of this show. Just go to rebelnewsplus.com, click subscribe.

00:00:41.820 It's eight bucks a month. And not only does that give you great content, it really keeps Rebel News

00:00:45.860 strong because, as you know, we take no money from the government and it shows. All right,

00:00:50.500 one more thing. Hey there, Rebel News listeners. Do you have a business or cause that you want

00:00:56.120 to promote to the tens of thousands of regular Rebel News viewers? Now's your chance. Whether it's ads

00:01:05.920 on podcasts like this one, videos, our website, or even our digital billboard truck, Rebel News has

00:01:14.380 your advertising needs covered. It's easy to get started. Just head over to rebelnews.com

00:01:22.120 slash advertise. That's rebelnews.com slash advertise. Fill out our form and find out how Rebel News can help

00:01:33.400 spread your message today. Don't wait. Advertise with Rebel News. Reach freedom-loving patriots and support

00:01:42.540 our independent journalism.

00:02:00.540 Tonight, a feature interview with the head of a new free speech organization in Canada. But first,

00:02:06.540 is Mark Carney in trouble for trying to extort banks? I'll give you some details. It's March 25th,

00:02:13.680 and this is the Ezra LeVant Show.

00:02:18.440 Shame on you, you censorious bug.

00:02:21.460 Oh, hi, everybody. We've got a big show today. We're going to talk to Lisa Bildy in a bit about

00:02:34.680 two things. She's been defending nurse Amy Hamm out of British Columbia, who's been put through a

00:02:40.180 five-year ordeal because she put up a billboard that said, I heart J.K. Rowling. Well, she was put

00:02:46.560 through the grinder, including a 22-day hearing by the nursing profession because Amy's a nurse.

00:02:52.920 This had nothing to do with her nursing. This wasn't in a hospital or anything. It was just on

00:02:57.040 the street. But you're not allowed to have views like that. So a little bit like Jordan Peterson's

00:03:01.580 case. We'll talk to Lisa about that and about the fact that she, Lisa Bildy, is the new leader of the

00:03:07.680 Free Speech Union of Canada. Holy moly, do we ever need that. But let me, before I get to that,

00:03:14.040 it's a great interview. Lisa's one of my favorite people. Let me talk to you about a little bit of

00:03:18.740 an investigative report I'm working on right now. And I'm going to take one more day to do it right.

00:03:24.600 So I'm going to give you a little bit of a teaser here, but I'm going to really unpack it tomorrow.

00:03:29.100 There's this funny word, and I honestly hadn't heard of it or bothered to look it up until about

00:03:33.720 a week ago. You know, it's acronyms. And sometimes elites use acronyms and fancy phrases to keep things

00:03:42.660 not understandable. Like that. One of the purposes of jargon is to have like a small society that

00:03:49.700 insiders know what's going on, but outsiders don't. It's one of the reasons why lawyers love 1.00

00:03:56.320 using Latin phrases is just a, you know, there's an elite guild and you're not in it. The UN is awful

00:04:03.260 for that. They, they use all sorts of acronyms and short forms and weird terms. One of them

00:04:09.700 is G fans. What G fans. And I heard that Mark Carney was the co-chair of G fans. And I just was bored

00:04:20.800 right away. And it's just so weird, but I Googled in the sense for Glasgow financial and not alliance

00:04:28.040 for net zero. And that's just as boring and as eye glazing. But if you, if you dig a little deeper,

00:04:36.000 it's actually shocking. Let me go to the homepage of G fans. Um, the Glasgow financial Alliance for net

00:04:43.900 zero G fans is an independent. No, it's not private sector led. No, it's not initiative focused on

00:04:52.300 mobilizing capital. That's a euphemism and removing barriers to investment in the global transition.

00:05:01.580 Do you understand what it is that's designed to hide meaning, not to share meaning, but let me tell

00:05:07.740 you what it means. These are people who are shaking down big banks to get them to stop lending money or

00:05:16.200 investing in oil and gas or carbon. When they say transition, they're not talking about transgender

00:05:22.100 transitioning from being a boy to a girl or something. They're talking about transition

00:05:27.420 off the carbon economy, transition to shut down the oil sands. So this is a global group of elite VIPs.

00:05:37.000 When they say it's private sector, well, that's part of it. But of course, this was a United Nations

00:05:41.700 project. It was hatched in Glasgow at one of these UN, uh, anti global warming conferences.

00:05:48.700 This is to kill the world's oil and gas, natural gas fracking oil sands, energy systems. And Mark Carney

00:05:57.860 was the co chair of this for years. His purpose was to pressure companies to leave it in the ground

00:06:07.000 while he of course, jetted around in private jets. And we all know about this. We know about ESG.

00:06:14.540 That's the corporate version of DEI diversity, equity, and inclusion in a corporate setting.

00:06:19.920 They say ESG environmental, social, and governance. What does that mean? Well, environmental means only

00:06:26.600 one thing. Are you shutting down carbon? So they detest oil and gas industries. And what they do is they

00:06:34.760 pressure companies to divest, not based on financial reasons, which is the fiduciary duty of officers and

00:06:43.080 directors of a company, but based on ideology. Exxon Mobil, for example, is one of the most profitable

00:06:48.840 companies in the world has been for years, it's involved in oil and gas. If you're doing your fiduciary duty to

00:06:55.520 your shareholders, you think how can we maximize profits? Not so with ESG, they're trying to graft force into

00:07:03.560 these companies, a new measurement, which is how woke are you? How environmentalist are you? Do you please not the

00:07:10.560 shareholders, but Greta Thunberg? We know that Mark Carney admires Greta Thunberg. And it's one thing

00:07:17.340 to pressure a company from the outside, to have a little protest outside their annual meeting, or to

00:07:24.080 have a scene in, you know, some spectacle like Greenpeace does. But what these environmentalists

00:07:30.600 have done is go in through the investors. So for example, BlackRock, which is the most famous asset

00:07:37.720 management company, Larry Fink, the head of BlackRock, is a woke, I mean, he's obsessed with

00:07:46.340 wokeness. And what he does is he invests his clients' money, it's not his own money, and puts it in this

00:07:53.100 company or that company and buys an enormous number of shares. Larry Fink is, I don't know, around $20

00:07:57.620 trillion worth of assets under management. It's not Larry Fink's money. He's investing it for his

00:08:03.500 customers. But he says to the companies in which he invests, I demand that you decarbonize. I demand

00:08:12.920 that you have, I mean, it would be the reason why, for example, Bud Light went fully trans. That's one

00:08:18.260 of the ESG values, is how sensible or sensitive are you, rather, to the rainbow agenda? Where's your

00:08:24.660 transgenderism? If you're wondering why a company suddenly goes woke, odds are it's because Larry Fink 0.99

00:08:31.680 or other huge asset managers have demanded that the recipients of their investment do so.

00:08:37.780 When I was in Davos this year, I bumped into Larry Fink, and one of my first questions to him was,

00:08:43.040 why are you putting your ideology ahead of your fiduciary duty as shareholders? Remember this?

00:08:48.460 Here's me asking that question of Larry Fink.

00:08:50.380 Mr. Fink, are you going to follow Donald Trump's plan and get rid of DEI and ESG in your companies?

00:08:56.280 BlackRock really is the opposite of Donald Trump in so many ways. You're authoritarian,

00:09:05.040 you're anti-populist, you're top-down. Are you going to change it all in light of the U.S. presidency?

00:09:13.020 How has Donald Trump, have you talked to Donald Trump since he was elected?

00:09:18.160 Is the World Economic Forum a counterpoint to Donald Trump?

00:09:26.800 Why are you running away from simple questions? Just answer a question. Have you talked to President

00:09:31.040 Trump yet? Why are your bodyguards pushing away journalists, Mr. Fink?

00:09:36.380 Funny enough, a couple of years ago, I was in Davos and I bumped into the boss of State Street,

00:09:41.460 which is a huge asset management company just like BlackRock. And their boss stopped and answered

00:09:49.700 my question. He was sort of mad at me that I dared suggest that he was doing anything other than

00:09:54.360 following the fiduciary duty of his investors. Take a look.

00:09:58.740 Can I ask you a little bit about State Street and ESG? Are you pulling back from it the same way

00:10:04.720 BlackRock is? No. And why don't we just set this up formally? But no, we're not pulling back from it.

00:10:11.220 Well, what about critics like Elon Musk who say it's a kind of reverse racism?

00:10:18.200 Elon's got his opinion. What about shareholders who say you're putting other goals ahead of

00:10:23.820 your fiduciary duties? You're putting cultural Marxism or affirmative action. Those may be

00:10:29.080 political values, but they're not designed to get a maximum rate of return. If there's firms that

00:10:35.140 are doing that, I don't know that. That's not how we do it. We have one focus, which is shareholder value,

00:10:39.220 period. Well, then how, you just told me though, you're sticking with ESG.

00:10:44.940 We're sticking with value. It's about value, not values. Can I ask you about state governments

00:10:51.620 that are pulling their funds out of ESG firms, like the state of Florida, for example? Are they

00:10:56.700 do, are you worried that the state street will be hit by divestment from companies that are rejecting

00:11:01.580 ESG? So we only focus on creating value for our shareholders. And if you look at our track record,

00:11:08.300 that's all that we've ever done. And what we focus on is what's, what are long-term investors need to

00:11:14.100 be thinking about? What are the kinds of risks they need to be thinking about? And they need to make

00:11:18.060 the decision. That's what we've always done. What were your goals? What are your goals here?

00:11:21.960 Okay. Yeah. Why was the state street boss so worried, but the BlackRock boss, well, he wouldn't

00:11:30.040 engage. I think one of the things that's happened over the last few years is that especially Republicans

00:11:35.460 have woken up to the way the G fans, extortionists, I call them, operate. That they basically say,

00:11:42.720 follow our political biases, do our political errands, or we will divest, which is not what they're

00:11:49.940 supposed to do. They're supposed to follow their shareholders' interests. You know, they blackmail,

00:11:54.580 they blacklist. And that could be seen as a crime, a cartel. In the United States, they have a RICO

00:12:02.620 statute, the Racketeer Influence Corrupt Organizations. I think that's what RICO says. I'll have to look it up.

00:12:10.840 It's usually used against gangs. But what happens if you're not trying to extort some shopkeeper,

00:12:16.300 like the mafia, which is what RICO laws were used for? What if you're trying to shake down companies

00:12:23.080 for billions of dollars? Mark Carney was the co-chair of G fans. And he went around the world

00:12:31.040 by private jet, meeting with companies and demanding that they divest from oil and gas and coal. And if

00:12:38.740 they didn't, he threatened them. This isn't my theory. This is what the United States Congress has

00:12:46.620 concluded based on their research and their interrogation of Mark Carney. Did you know that

00:12:53.480 Mark Carney was interrogated by the U.S. Congress about whether or not he was part of an extortionate

00:13:00.300 cartel? Did you know that? I didn't know that because the mainstream media doesn't talk about it.

00:13:06.700 G fans is boring to me. It's going to be double boring to them. I was going to have a big presentation

00:13:12.940 today, but I'm going to save it till tomorrow so I can do a proper job of it. I will have that for

00:13:19.160 you tomorrow. But for now, enjoy my interview with our friend Lisa Bildi. But come back tomorrow for the

00:13:24.920 G fan stuff.

00:13:37.380 Well, I remember it very clearly in March of 2020, when the world went mad and all sorts of senseless, crazy,

00:13:46.920 insane policies became law. And not just law, they became enforced as polite society, wear a mask, six

00:13:56.180 feet of separation, don't meet for Christmas dinner, don't go to your own parents' funeral, don't have a

00:14:04.040 wedding, don't go to school. All these insane rules with no scientific basis. In fact, some of them, as the

00:14:10.520 former head of the FDA said, no one simply knows where the six feet of separation rules came from. It

00:14:16.480 was madness. And the government, of course, is always at the vanguard of madness. They love an

00:14:22.440 emergency. It gives them liberties to go beyond what they normally can do. One of the problems with that

00:14:29.280 is it was so difficult to find lawyers to stand up to. There are some lawyers who are built as

00:14:37.600 dissidents. I think you quite often find them in the criminal law side of things. I mean, think about

00:14:43.560 it. If someone is an accused rapist, an accused murderer, even an accused terrorist, it is very

00:14:49.480 socially unacceptable to be seen in their company, let alone to defend them. I mean, would you want to

00:14:55.420 be known as the lawyer who defended Carla Hamalka or Paul Bernardo? So there are some lawyers who are

00:15:01.920 built not to care about public fashion. And we need them because even atrocious monsters like Hamalka 1.00

00:15:09.760 and Bernardo need a lawyer. The system requires a lawyer for it to work properly. And even monsters

00:15:15.880 are guilty until proven innocent. Excuse me, innocent until proven guilty. My point is, it was so difficult

00:15:24.320 to find lawyers who were willing to dissent in the mania, the moral panic of our time. I made so many

00:15:32.720 phone calls to otherwise courageous lawyers who simply did not want to be seen, not just as taking

00:15:39.560 controversial, but taking antisocial and unpolite points of view. I tell you, in March and April of 2020,

00:15:48.800 it was nearly impossible to find a lawyer to stand up for civil liberties in the face

00:15:56.980 of COVID mania. But one of the lawyers who did, one of the first lawyers who answered the call of

00:16:03.780 the Democracy Fund to fight back is our guest today. She's our friend, Lisa Bildy is her name. And she

00:16:10.160 joins us now via Skype from London, Ontario. Lisa, great to see you. Nice to see you too, Ezra.

00:16:14.820 It's very hard to be unfashionable. We're social creatures. We want to fit in. We want to be polite

00:16:20.960 company. We don't want people to like us. We want to get invited to Christmas parties. We don't want

00:16:25.040 people to look at us funny. To be a dissenter on things often means you're going to be at best

00:16:33.720 identified with your client, but at worst called, well, just shunned from society yourself. I think

00:16:39.860 it's very difficult. You were a key lawyer fighting for freedom during the lockdowns, weren't you?

00:16:46.300 Yes. I was at the justice center at the time and the whole organization just got geared up to fight

00:16:51.900 those restrictions. So, and I had had, I guess, a taste of it before when I battled our law society

00:16:59.220 as well. So over the statement of principles. So I guess I'm, I'm used to, to being on the so-called

00:17:05.060 wrong side of issues. And, and once you kind of go through that experience and live through it,

00:17:10.240 you realize that it doesn't kill you. And then in fact, it probably makes you stronger.

00:17:15.340 Well, it certainly makes you resourceful. That's a long way of introducing you, but what I want to

00:17:22.260 talk about today is one of your most recent clients, a friend of ours, Amy Hamm. She's a nurse

00:17:27.880 in the Vancouver area who a few years ago did something a little bit social media influencer-y,

00:17:36.160 but it wasn't a particularly heavy duty thing. She rolled out a billboard in Vancouver that just

00:17:42.020 simply said, I, and then the heart symbol, J.K. Rowling, the author of the Harry Potter series.

00:17:49.860 It's such an innocuous thing. I mean, there are quite scandalous billboards everywhere.

00:17:54.640 Um, this just had a message that could be interpreted as standing by J.K. Rowling's

00:18:00.360 stance, opposing transgender colonization of women's spaces, swimming pools, changing rooms, 0.78

00:18:06.720 things like that. And she was prosecuted for five years. Tell us the story of Amy Hamm.

00:18:14.200 Well, she, yes, it was almost, it was over four years. She put up that billboard and it immediately

00:18:20.440 attracted the attention of activists who of course don't like you to be critical of anything to do

00:18:26.020 with, with transgender ideology. And so complaints were made to her college. I guess she'd been

00:18:32.160 identified by the reporter in one of the articles following the billboard as a nurse. And so that put,

00:18:38.160 uh, that put the word out that there was a way to get at her. And that was to file complaints with 0.99

00:18:43.520 her regulator. And a couple of people did do that. One of them was a self-described social justice

00:18:47.920 warrior and Marxist. And, uh, he basically advised the college that they should ensure that she never 0.90

00:18:53.440 works as a nurse again. The other one was anonymous. So, uh, so the college took it upon

00:18:58.840 themselves to do a complete investigation of pretty much everything that Amy Hamm said, uh, on social

00:19:04.340 media, on podcasts, in various articles that she'd written on, on gender ideology. She'd become a bit

00:19:10.460 of a, um, well, it's fair to say quite a critic of, of gender ideology and its impact on women's rights.

00:19:16.940 That was her focus. So there was a lot out there. And in fact, they pulled together a dossier of about

00:19:22.180 330 pages of things that she'd said and written online. So, uh, you know, not content to, I guess,

00:19:30.180 shut up as is maybe what was expected of her. She, uh, decided to fight it. And with the justice 1.00

00:19:36.100 center's help, uh, she was able to do that. And it turned into a marathon hearing. We, we had 22 days

00:19:41.300 of hearings. That's insane. I mean, I spread out over a year and a half. That's more than most

00:19:46.600 murder trials to be candid. Yeah. And it was as stressful as, as one probably too, to be in the

00:19:53.620 hot seat like that. And we had people from all over the world watching this case, because of course

00:19:57.780 it's, it's a very, um, timely issue right now. There are a number of people around the world,

00:20:04.020 especially in the UK and the United States and Canada, the Anglosphere, basically where,

00:20:08.560 you know, women who are standing up to gender ideology are being raked over the coals and 1.00

00:20:14.400 fighting legal battles. And some of them are successful and many are not. So, so, uh, there

00:20:19.640 was a lot of interest in her case. Yeah. 22 days of hearing is just insane. Now, let me just

00:20:24.160 confirm with you something I believe to be true, that there was never a single piece of evidence

00:20:28.860 adduced in these hearings that suggested that Amy was any way inappropriate in her conduct 0.68

00:20:35.000 of nursing. So in her actual profession on the job, dealing with patients, dealing with

00:20:40.160 others in hospitals or clinics or other health settings, there was never any accusation that

00:20:45.640 she actually harmed or discriminated or anything like that. This was purely an assessment of her

00:20:52.700 external political views set on the street with a billboard and on Twitter. Is that accurate?

00:20:58.760 That's absolutely accurate. There was not a single workplace complaint. And her evidence was that

00:21:03.640 she had, uh, she had actually dealt with transgender patients before and shown them the utmost respect.

00:21:09.300 She told the story of working on the downtown East side as a younger nurse and having a transgender

00:21:15.300 patient who she was quite fond of. And, you know, there was never any suggestion that she misgendered

00:21:20.720 anyone. She always made, made it a point to use preferred pronouns. Uh, she took all courses on DEI 0.98

00:21:26.760 related things and, and on gender ideology or gender, gender identity in order to ensure she was fully

00:21:33.020 informed. She read from all angles and her, her workplace conduct was respectful. So, uh, yeah, this was

00:21:39.600 purely off duty conduct, uh, targeted by activists. Hmm. Now, 22 days of hearings. I've been through a lengthy

00:21:49.860 process before the human rights commission. So what I'm talking about, I observe the extraordinarily long

00:21:56.600 trial of Tamara Leach for mischief, which is the lowest species of crime in the book. And the phrase

00:22:03.400 that comes to my mind is the process is the punishment. First of all, can you even afford a

00:22:09.420 lawyer to stand with you for 22 days? Luckily the justice center for constitutional freedoms assisted

00:22:15.300 with that. Second of all, who's got 22 days they can take off from work, from family. And it's a

00:22:22.800 stressful 22 days. It's not a vacation. You have to intensely follow the proceedings. You have to

00:22:29.600 withstand cross-examination. It's not a part, like a 22 day trial is exhausting mentally. And I'm sure

00:22:38.460 physically too. Even if she had been acquitted, I mean, I can't even believe a 22 day hearing about, about a gal's 1.00

00:22:46.660 tweets and her billboard sign. How many lawyers, bureaucrats, activists, complainants do you think were on the

00:22:54.420 other side? Was it one of those typical swarms? Was it like, uh, you know, did the other side through, I mean, what kind of

00:23:02.660 resources did they deploy against Amy? Oh, uh, you know, they had, uh, three lawyers on it, including in-house

00:23:10.420 counsel and two external counsel that they hired. I'm sure it wasn't cheap. Um, they had a couple of

00:23:15.920 expect, I don't know what they paid for their experts. They did have a couple of experts as well. Um, you

00:23:21.180 know, I, and, and it was a time consuming affair for, for that organization as well. I'm sure they spent a lot

00:23:26.460 of money prosecuting her for this. And the justice center to its great credit allowed her to have not one,

00:23:32.060 but two lawyers for most of it, uh, bringing in Karen Bastow is, uh, another lawyer who, uh, the

00:23:37.540 justice center put on the case. And, um, you know, she was able to fight and she was able to put up a 0.53

00:23:42.660 strong defense. We had some excellent experts as well, who were very generous with their time. And,

00:23:47.340 and, uh, I thought they did a fantastic job on her behalf, but, you know, it wasn't enough in this

00:23:52.960 environment where we're fighting a very, very entrenched worldview that, um, gosh, you know,

00:23:58.980 I, one of the things about being one of these rebel lawyers, as you say, the hard part is that

00:24:04.340 you can do the best job possible, uh, or at least you can certainly try and you still end up losing

00:24:11.000 a lot of these cases, probably more than, you know, than the average. I, I, I joke sometimes that

00:24:16.880 I'm on, I walk this earth to give opposing counsel the thrill of victory because it just feels like

00:24:21.280 it's, they're, they're all uphill battles these days.

00:24:23.560 Yeah. You know, we have the same experience at the democracy fund. We were actually very successful

00:24:28.880 with the tickets and the COVID, uh, uh, the app that the, uh, the arrive can app. Most of those

00:24:37.180 have been thrown out. Um, but on the major case, so on, on the minor cases, we've actually been

00:24:42.500 extremely successful over 90%, I would say, but on those major strategic cases that set precedents,

00:24:50.120 absolutely we lose most of the time. And I think of the case that Maxine Bernier and Brian

00:24:55.060 Peckford filed about being banned from traveling on airplanes during the election. I think of the

00:25:00.620 case that we did with Kian Bextie when he flew through a airport, uh, the sort of, uh, detention

00:25:08.600 where you had to stay in the hotel as a quarantine hotel and pay over a thousand bucks. We challenged

00:25:14.740 that we lost all those strategic cases. The only strategic case that I think was one over the last

00:25:21.780 half decade was challenging the emergencies act itself. It was a bit of a miracle that the federal

00:25:28.140 court ruled that illegal, but those were about COVID matters. We're talking about Amy Hamm and

00:25:32.820 transgenderism. Tell me what, tell me, first of all, who were the deciders? If this was within the

00:25:39.720 nursing profession, these would not have been judges. And I imagine they were not even lawyers,

00:25:46.220 were they, were they sort of senior nurses? Who made the decision here?

00:25:50.820 So it was a panel comprised of two nurses, one of whom is a retired nurse, I believe,

00:25:55.660 and one active plus a member of the public. So like many of these bodies, they have lay appointments

00:26:01.940 to their, to their disciplinary bodies. And I don't know what her background was. I don't recall.

00:26:06.620 But they had a lawyer who advised them along the way and very likely, you know, helped write the

00:26:13.180 decision and work and walk through the analysis of the charter and so on. But yeah, I mean, these are,

00:26:19.860 these are not people whose job it is to decide free speech issues. There are people who are there to

00:26:25.180 decide if nurses are competent, ethical, you know, are, are not, you know, stealing drugs on the side or

00:26:33.600 sexually assaulting other people. I mean, that's the normal kind of work that they would do. So

00:26:38.800 it's very weird. I went through the same thing when I was a lawyer. I mean, I, I'd never had a

00:26:42.660 complaint from a client, not once ever. I mean, I didn't do law for a long time, but you know, I had

00:26:47.140 no disciplinary history at all. All the complaints against me, and there were more than 20, were about

00:26:53.060 my politics. You know, my newspaper columns, my videos would be shown to the law society and they

00:26:59.100 would have hearings about that. Now, I mean, in the end, none of them stuck, but it was the process

00:27:05.340 that was the punishment. And I would trust a panel of a retired nurse and an active nurse. If like you 0.86

00:27:14.160 say, how is the nursing? How is the, you know, the, the scientific medical nursing? Was there an

00:27:20.400 ethical question violating the privacy of a patient? Absolutely. I would trust a nurse more than I

00:27:26.320 would trust a lawyer, but to weigh the freedom of Amy Hamm outside the nurse's station, who the hell

00:27:34.780 do they think they are? I think it's outrageous. I know for a fact that wouldn't live a day in America

00:27:39.660 under their first amendment, but alas, in Canada, we're not as free. What did these two nurses and 1.00

00:27:45.680 a lay member of the public in the end, what did they say? Well, it was interesting. I mean, of that

00:27:51.640 330 page dossier, they actually found that most of it, they would not, they would not declare it to

00:27:58.640 be professional misconduct because she didn't attribute her name or her, sorry, her profession

00:28:03.300 to it. Whereas there were three articles that she had written and a podcast, I think with Megan

00:28:08.480 Murphy that she had been on, where she did specifically identify herself as a nurse. So they

00:28:13.040 drew that, that distinction. They didn't like everything that she said on Twitter. And there were some,

00:28:18.180 some comments in the appendix to the very lengthy decision where they, where they talked about that.

00:28:23.140 But they did not use those as a basis for the finding of professional misconduct. They really

00:28:28.500 wanted to tie it to the fact that she had identified herself as a nurse, which is kind of funny because,

00:28:33.960 you know, it's pretty hard to have, just imagine like LinkedIn, people have almost their entire

00:28:38.080 resume on their page. Does that mean that every professional would have to not identify themselves

00:28:43.740 as being a professional in order to have a conversation in the public square on matters of

00:28:48.240 social policy? I mean, it's- But this is obviously one-sided. I can guarantee you that if I were to go on

00:28:53.500 LinkedIn or Twitter or any other social media platform, I could find countless examples of nurses

00:28:59.760 in support of transgenderism, of doctors in support of transgenderism. So you have a live political issue

00:29:08.280 that's basically being created from whole cloth in the last 20 years. 20 years ago, this wasn't a

00:29:13.980 thing. Now, I would say it's a debate with two sides. In fact, I would say that the, that the

00:29:22.420 Amy Hamm side has 80% public support. But even if you say, well, it's 50-50, why should only one side of

00:29:30.500 this debate be censored? I can guarantee you that the nurses of British Columbia have never

00:29:35.420 prosecuted a nurse for being pro-transgenderism. I think that they are doing what was done to

00:29:43.760 Jordan Peterson, the Ontario College of Psychologists. They're injecting politics right in the bloodstream

00:29:49.440 in the profession and essentially expelling anyone who is not politically correct. Tell me what the

00:29:56.100 ruling said. Well, that was essentially it. I mean, they, they found that she, um, she was discriminatory

00:30:02.760 and derogatory against transgender people. But let me pause right there. Discriminatory.

00:30:07.760 Discriminatory suggests you've done something differently. I'm discriminating. I didn't hire you. 0.98

00:30:12.520 I didn't give you the nursing care you, I didn't do something that, you know, having an opinion,

00:30:19.180 how's that even discriminating? Well, I argued that point. I said, you know, that you're importing 0.95

00:30:24.300 a concept here into a human rights concept into this that isn't, isn't appropriate here. There is no

00:30:30.720 suggestion that she denied anyone service, that she, that there's not even a complainant except for

00:30:36.940 people from, you know, the public who aren't transgender. So, so where's this discrimination?

00:30:42.600 Uh, but it, it didn't matter. Um, that, that was the language that, that was imported from an old case

00:30:47.440 called Kempling and they used it here. And, you know, actually the BC human rights legislation, just,

00:30:52.660 just, uh, to, to point this out, actually does have a, a prohibition against publication,

00:30:57.720 a discriminatory publication. So, you know, it's, it's kind of out there that it isn't just a denial

00:31:03.600 of service anymore, but, but, uh, anyway, that, that's what they found, um, that she was discriminatory 1.00

00:31:08.600 and derogatory because she insisted on there only being two sexes. And they felt that, and that was 0.89

00:31:14.400 one of the things. Two sexes or two genders? Two sexes. Well, now don't tell me they're saying 0.97

00:31:20.560 there's more than two sexes now. They are saying that they bought the, they, they preferred, 0.67

00:31:26.060 let's just put it that way. They preferred the evidence of the college's expert, Dr. Greta

00:31:29.900 Bauer, whose testimony was that sex is multidimensional, multidimensional. That is the new way to look

00:31:37.860 at sex. Um, I don't think that this is scientifically, you know, um, uh, uh, unimpeachable. I mean,

00:31:44.780 I'm sure that if we really had a debate about this, which we really not have been allowed to have,

00:31:48.820 uh, to date, that the vast majority of professionals would not agree that it's multidimensional,

00:31:54.060 but, but that was what they found. And as a result, saying that there are only two sexes

00:31:58.780 is exclusionary and erases transgender women or transgender. But those, you know what? I think

00:32:05.620 the word gender is BS. And as Billboard Chris always says, please defend, please define gender. And

00:32:12.620 people have a tough time with that. Gender is sort of a made up word that I think refers to how people

00:32:17.420 express themselves. I think it's another way of saying your personality, uh, in, in, on, in terms

00:32:23.100 of sexual issues. But there is no doubt that there's an X chromosome and a Y chromosome.

00:32:30.220 And we're talking about sex. I thought that was why the, the left moved away from sex to gender. 0.91

00:32:35.500 So they could get to all these blurry things like they, them, she, sure. And that's all gender gobbledygook. 1.00

00:32:43.020 That's, I thought that's why they moved away from the word sex because sex is obviously boy or girl,

00:32:48.940 male or female. I didn't know that in British Columbia, I mean, if a nurse cannot determine

00:32:55.420 what's a boy or a girl, but nurse doesn't know what a boy or girl is, maybe, maybe this goes to a core,

00:33:03.020 you know, a core competency of being a nurse. If you're delivering a baby, what do you say?

00:33:09.100 It's a baby, they, them. Like, I, I don't know. I, I, it's sort of crazy. Um, what, what was the

00:33:16.780 penalty? What was the punishment they gave to Amy for not agreeing that sex is multi-dimensional? 0.98

00:33:24.460 Well, they haven't yet. So it's a, it's a bifurcated proceeding. We have a finding now that she

00:33:29.740 is, that she, the panel has determined that some of her posts, uh, were, um, professional

00:33:36.300 misconduct. So now we have to go back for a hearing on penalties. And now, um, Amy is intending 0.99

00:33:42.140 to appeal this and the justice center is going to continue to support that. I have to work out

00:33:47.100 what the grounds are. I think there'll be some, and, and we have, you know, another couple of weeks

00:33:51.100 to get that filed. So, um, but I expect that we will be proceeding with an appeal and then we'll

00:33:56.060 have an argument about whether we can have to stay the, um, the penalty part of it until we get a,

00:34:01.500 uh, an appellate court ruling on the finding of professional misconduct.

00:34:05.980 Sounds to me like the BC nurses are spending hundreds of thousands. They may be in fact into

00:34:12.300 the millions now going after Amy Hamm for a billboard. It's sort of gross. I'm glad to hear

00:34:17.980 you're considering appealing. First of all, the misconduct side, and I'm sure the penalty side.

00:34:23.100 Um, I'm impressed that Amy Hamm, I mean, she's a, I I've, I've met her a couple of times and she's a

00:34:28.380 really normal person by that. I mean, she's like, she's not someone who is a conflict oriented.

00:34:36.060 Um, you know, she, like, she's as normal as you get. I mean, she's got opinions, but she's not.

00:34:43.980 I mean, I'm sort of impressed that she didn't collapse under the weight of the whole

00:34:50.540 system. And I'm so glad you were there and the justice center was there to give her support.

00:34:54.380 Cause I think that was essential for her.

00:34:56.220 I just want to say that is around that point I have found, and I've found this a lot through

00:35:00.380 COVID too. There, there is a certain kind of person who has an extremely strong conscience

00:35:07.100 and they cannot act against it. It is painful to them to act against their conscience. And I

00:35:11.820 would say Amy is that kind of person. She cannot just speak something that she does not believe to

00:35:17.580 be true. And, um, and, and she'll suffer. I mean, it's hard, but she will suffer the consequences

00:35:23.260 in order to, to abide by her conscience. And we need people like that, but boy,

00:35:27.900 we don't make it easy for, for people like that. Yeah. Well, that's our kind of girl over here. 1.00

00:35:31.980 I mean, boy, that's, that's what we admire about her. Well, listen, I hope you keep it. So when,

00:35:36.780 so, so the next step is like you say, the penalty portion, you're going to appeal the misconduct

00:35:43.420 finding. And I presume you would appeal the penalty portion if it's anything significant as well.

00:35:49.100 And what's the rough timing on those two things? Yeah. I'm not really sure actually. Um, you know,

00:35:55.260 we're going to be entering into the court system now to, uh, to appeal the finding we're going to

00:36:00.540 the BC Supreme court. Now, fortunately it's a statutory appeal, which means that we do have

00:36:04.780 a standard of review. That's a little bit, uh, more robust. We, um, you know, the, on legal issues,

00:36:10.700 the panel has to be correct and not just reasonable. Right. So unlike say the Jordan Peterson

00:36:15.740 case where the standard was pretty deferential to what the panel had decided, we do have a little

00:36:20.940 bit more of an argument here. So, um, I don't know how long the, I don't know what the court system is

00:36:25.660 like in BC at the moment in terms of backlog, but I suspect, you know, it'll be another year or so

00:36:30.060 down the road before we have all of this ironed out. Yeah. Like I say, the process is the punishment.

00:36:34.380 Well, listen, give our best regards to Amy. We're fans of hers and, um, I'm glad you were there to

00:36:39.340 fight for it. I want to shift gears for a second while I've got you here. Uh, for a few years now,

00:36:43.740 I've been a member of something in the United Kingdom called the free speech union. And in my

00:36:49.180 view, it is the world's leading free speech organization. It's run by Toby Young, who was

00:36:55.020 recently knighted. He served Toby Young, which is sort of cool. I was sort of amazed that he was

00:37:01.260 given that standing, given that he's such a troublemaker, um, fighting for free speech for

00:37:06.860 quite a number, like for thousands of people. And the free speech union in the UK has grown quite a bit.

00:37:12.780 And, uh, and I'm really glad that they're there. I really think they're one of the most important

00:37:19.340 civil rights groups in the UK. I don't really think we have something so dedicated free speech

00:37:25.180 in Canada. The justice center does touch on free speech. Of course, the democracy fund does too,

00:37:30.220 but we don't have anything called the free speech union. I mean, I say again, there are

00:37:37.020 dabblers in that, but I was delighted when Toby said he was gonna set up versions of the free

00:37:47.020 speech union in New Zealand, in Australia, in South Africa, and in Canada. And I am delighted

00:37:55.180 to learn that you are the founding executive director, or what's your title? President of the

00:38:02.060 free speech union Canada. Tell us a little bit about it. Yeah. So, I mean, Toby sort of put out

00:38:06.940 the call for anybody in Canada who was concerned about this and wanting to, to set up an organization.

00:38:11.660 And a number of people responded, including myself and, and we met over a number of times and,

00:38:17.020 you know, people had various skills. This is an area where I'm, I'm, you know, I've been obviously

00:38:21.100 working quite a lot and I felt it was really important that we continue and add more organizations

00:38:27.580 that can help fight these cases. Because as you, as you said earlier, Ezra, there, the cost of

00:38:33.100 fighting these battles is massive. And the average person, even like the well-off person can't afford

00:38:38.780 to have a 20 day hearing. It's just, you know, I did this, you know, at a reduced rate and, and

00:38:44.300 justice center was very generous in covering it. And, but even then most people can't swing it. And,

00:38:49.420 and so then what happens? Well, they, they end up, you know, probably if they're a professional

00:38:54.060 signing some undertaking with their regulator, that they'll, they'll take their account private,

00:38:58.220 they'll be more discreet. They won't say the bad thing, whatever it is they're being called out for.

00:39:03.340 And, and we never hear their opinions again. And I just don't think that's right. And so I like the

00:39:08.780 idea of there being another way to help crowdfund. And this, so this is a mass membership organization.

00:39:14.780 That means that when people join as members, they're helping to fight these battles themselves.

00:39:18.780 They're taking an actual role in it themselves as members. And, and they'll help their fellow

00:39:23.820 Canadians stand up against this because the problem is, is if, if, if we just all kind of

00:39:28.700 let it wash over us like a steamroller, mixing my metaphors, but you know, it just, the, the

00:39:34.700 censorship beast just continues to grow and grow and grow. So even if we don't win all the cases,

00:39:40.220 we have to stand up and fight where it's appropriate to do so. And so I'm really excited

00:39:44.460 that the free speech union has, has launched now. It's a lot of work for me right now,

00:39:48.620 just trying to balance, wear two hats, but I think eventually I'll move more into just the free

00:39:53.900 speech union role. And we're, we're going to be building up a network of lawyers that will help

00:39:59.180 us with cases. We have our first case already, which I'm excited to, I'll probably come back

00:40:03.260 sometime and tell you about it. And yeah, we're going, we're going to do some great things.

00:40:07.740 And because it is just free speech that we're focused on, I think we'll fill some gaps that

00:40:12.380 the other groups as great as they are, are, are maybe not focused on. We're not a charity. We're

00:40:17.340 going to be able to work in employment situations and universities and places where the charter

00:40:21.900 doesn't necessarily apply and, and try to help people navigate cancel culture, you know, censorship

00:40:28.780 and, and regulatory proceedings like, like poor Amy's gone through. Well, I'm really glad to hear it.

00:40:33.500 And I'm proud that the democracy fund has chipped in a little bit to help get things going. And we

00:40:38.780 would love to talk to you about that first case when you're ready to talk about it. What's the

00:40:42.860 website where people can connect with you? It's fsucanada.ca. Well, there you have it,

00:40:49.180 fsucanada.ca. Lisa, it's great to hear your battles. I'm so glad you're there with Amy Ham.

00:40:54.140 I'm disappointed, um, but not surprised that, um, the wokeness won. I mean, 1.00

00:40:59.420 it is British Columbia after all, but hopefully the courts will help sort it out.

00:41:02.860 Thanks for spending so much time with us today. My pleasure. Thanks for having me on,

00:41:06.220 Ezra. Oh, our pleasure. There you have it. Lisa Bildy. Stay with us. More ahead.

00:41:22.860 Well, it's great to catch up with Lisa Bildy. I got some letters here. O'Neill Creighton says,

00:41:28.540 drive your truck around to pee in all day, every day. You're talking about our beautiful

00:41:33.820 billboard truck. That truck is given her. I'm so excited about that. I never thought

00:41:39.740 that I would set up a, it's basically a Canadian version of a super pack. I'm talking about for

00:41:44.860 Canada.ca, our third party campaign group. I never thought of it. I've been out of politics for 20 plus

00:41:52.620 years. You may know when I was a kid, uh, when I was 29 or something, I ran for parliament. That

00:41:56.860 was really fun, but that's long ago. I would, did not want to register as a political group,

00:42:01.740 but if I didn't, I know in my bones, they would have charged me for that billboard truck. And they

00:42:06.940 probably would have hit me with a six figure fine because they, they only find me, I think,

00:42:11.660 3000 bucks for the Libranos book, if I recall, but absolutely they would come at me. So I'm

00:42:18.460 registering, but that's, has opened up this whole new world to me of fun stuff we can do

00:42:23.740 in the campaign. Anyways, uh, we're just going to keep the accounting separate. We're very careful

00:42:28.460 about that. Um, but we're going to have a lot of fun. If you haven't checked it out,

00:42:32.220 go to 4Canada.ca. Not a lot to see there now, but more to come. I can promise you.

00:42:38.940 Add Salo says, Mark Carney's role as a high profile advocate for net zero commitments

00:42:44.460 is undermined by Brookfield asset management's heavily fossil fuel inclined investment strategy.

00:42:50.060 Carney stepped down from Brookfield in January. After four and a half years, he's allowed to enrich

00:42:54.540 himself though through fossil fuel investments, but not Canada or Canadians. Got it. You're so right. I 0.92

00:43:01.180 mean, that's the thing about ESG. It never applies to China or the developing world.

00:43:06.540 John Anderson 1245 says a hundred million immigrants policy would draw nobody, but the poor unskilled

00:43:14.460 undereducated and impoverished who would do nothing but consume resources, both natural and economic.

00:43:20.940 That's just plain nuts. It is, it makes no sense other than, you know, if you're in certain industries,

00:43:28.940 it's going to lower wages, drive up housing. I suppose if you're a bank, it's more customers.

00:43:35.500 If you're a cell phone company, it's more customers. There are certain businesses that would be doing

00:43:41.260 super duper if we had a hundred million people in this country, because everyone's got to have a phone.

00:43:47.260 Everyone's got to have a home, but it's at the expense of the rest of it. You simply cannot,

00:43:52.940 you cannot save the third world by putting 40 million people in Canada or a hundred million

00:43:59.420 in the United States. You can't do that. You'll wreck, you're not going to wind up saving their home

00:44:04.380 countries and you're going to absolutely economically and culturally destroy the target countries, 0.89

00:44:10.140 the sacrifice zones. Well, that's our show for today. Come back tomorrow. I'm going to have more

00:44:16.140 on this G-Fan stuff. Until then, on behalf of all of us here at Rebel World Headquarters to you at home,

00:44:22.140 good night and keep fighting for freedom.

Rebel News Podcast - March 25, 2025

EZRA LEVANT ｜ Mark Carney champions 'net zero wokeness' over profits

Episode Stats

Summary

Transcript