Rebel News Podcast - EZRA LEVANT ｜ Trump administration steps back from Epstein disclosures, says 'client list' doesn't exist

00:00:00.000 hello my friends i didn't mean to but i got into a debate today with my friend joel pollack about

00:00:05.320 jeffrey epstein the sex trafficker child abuser who died in his prison cell a few years ago was

00:00:12.880 it murder was it suicide we'll talk a bit about that amongst other things it's a show you don't

00:00:17.920 want to miss but first let me invite you to subscribe to what we call rebel news plus it's

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00:00:37.500 tonight what's going on with that epstein file it's july 9th and this is the ezra levant show

00:00:57.120 jeffrey epstein the convicted sex offender and pedophile is not the most important political

00:01:03.620 in america at least as far as i can tell from up here in canada i think protecting the borders is

00:01:09.080 deporting millions of illegals is reigniting the economy is creating jobs is opening up foreign

00:01:16.280 markets to american goods reshoring american industries deterring foreign enemies from going

00:01:23.180 to war stopping men from invading women's spaces in america like bathrooms and change rooms and sports

00:01:29.940 teams those are all real things very real issues that have a real effect on everyday lives of every

00:01:36.060 american trump is ticking a lot of those boxes these days he's getting a lot of things done i just saw

00:01:42.140 this uh that rang a bell with me stephen miller trump's deputy chief of staff with a real focus on

00:01:47.140 immigration he tweeted a video showing just how empty los angeles's normally traffic jammed highways

00:01:53.740 are and he wonders if that's a result of mass deportations including self-deportations there's

00:01:59.220 estimated 800 000 illegals in la imagine what that would do to traffic if they were gone i don't know

00:02:06.220 but at a certain point i think that would be something you could detect i mean imagine for a moment if we

00:02:11.400 in canada deported the 4.9 million canadians who no longer they're not canadians foreigners who no

00:02:17.580 longer have the legal right to be here in a few months 4.9 million visas will expire

00:02:23.200 like this case where someone on a student vita visa a foreigner here on a student visa was actually

00:02:30.940 working for bell canada and he sexually assaulted a woman in her own home why was he let into canada

00:02:37.420 in the first place no criminal jack since he's obviously not in school why hasn't he been sent

00:02:42.940 home since he's here on a student visa how did bell come to hire him if he's here on a student visa not

00:02:48.940 a working visa did bell do what they usually do which is make canadian employees train the foreign

00:02:55.680 replacements before firing the canadian employees and hiring the foreign replacements for less the banks

00:03:02.000 do that all the time it's so gross so all these things i've just been talking about are real and

00:03:07.460 important things that really affect ordinary people but what about jeffrey epstein does that affect us

00:03:13.100 he was a sex criminal who was investigated as early as 20 years ago for sexually abusing young girls

00:03:19.200 some as young as 14 years old so he was a child rapist he was convicted in 2008 for child prostitution

00:03:27.220 another crime but he got a plea deal and to serve 13 months and much of that was on work release

00:03:33.220 got off so easily but he obviously didn't stop he was arrested in 2019 on more sex trafficking charges

00:03:40.840 and then he died in prison a few weeks later authorities claim he killed himself but videotape

00:03:47.400 of his prison cell for the moment in question has gone missing isn't that curious and the two guards who

00:03:55.200 were curiously not there at the same time the whole thing looked like such a cover-up especially when

00:04:00.940 you know that epstein consorted with so many rich and powerful people he wasn't doing these rapes

00:04:05.300 on his own he was procuring these girls for others he had a private jet that was dubbed the lolita

00:04:11.960 express you know lolita that story by nabakov the very young girl that was his private jet that he flew to

00:04:18.880 his private island in the caribbean where he allegedly and he and his guests engaged in raping those young

00:04:25.060 girls and epstein filmed his guests doing so for blackmail material on them it is alleged it was

00:04:32.180 such a large operation and went on for so long and had so many rich and powerful people it's thought

00:04:37.620 that he must have had the cooperation of a government entity the cia the massad mi5 whatever

00:04:43.400 to have that kind of compromise that's the soviet word the russian word for compromise material on so

00:04:50.120 many rich and powerful people epstein died or was killed before he could spill the beans his colleague

00:04:57.720 his trafficker gilane maxwell whose father was a spy by the way was convicted and sentenced to prison

00:05:04.840 where she now is and then there were reports like this a journalist thinking she was speaking during an

00:05:09.860 ad break saying hi upset her network forbade any discussion of epstein had the story for three years

00:05:15.180 i've had this interview with virginia roberts we would not put it on the air um first of all i was

00:05:19.820 told who's jeffrey epstein no one knows who that is this is a stupid story um then the palace found out

00:05:25.740 that we had her whole allegations about prince andrew and threatened us a million different ways um

00:05:32.860 we were so afraid we wouldn't be able to interview kate will say that we that also quashed the story

00:05:38.780 and then um and then alan dershowitz was also implicated in because of the planes she told me

00:05:45.660 everything she had pictures she had everything she was in hiding for 12 years we convinced her to come

00:05:50.060 out we convinced her to talk to us um it was unbelievable what we had clinton we had everything

00:05:58.300 i i tried for three years to get it on to no avail and now it's all coming out and it's like these new

00:06:03.660 revelations and i freaking had all of it i i was so pissed right now like every day i get more and

00:06:10.540 more pissed because i'm just like oh my god we it was um what what we had was unreal other women backing

00:06:17.500 it up hey yep brad edwards the attorney three years ago saying like on like we there will come a day

00:06:25.740 but we will realize jeffrey epstein was the most prolific pedophile this country has ever known

00:06:29.820 and i had it all three years ago and there were always rumors and insiders talking about sex not

00:06:35.100 just unusual sex or extreme sex but illegal sex rape rape of children it was almost too much to

00:06:41.260 believe it felt like something pre-biblical pre-civilizational epstein even had a strange

00:06:48.220 pagan temple on his caribbean island it all felt like something out of the tom cruise movie eyes wide shut

00:06:54.460 and it became a political issue of course so many politicians named in his black book donald trump

00:07:02.060 said it was something he would reveal if he became president the epstein files along with the jfk files

00:07:07.740 and so many other state secrets and his attorney general said so too even just recently the doj may

00:07:14.700 be releasing the list of jeffrey epstein's clients will that really happen it's sitting on my desk right

00:07:21.100 now to review um that's been a directive um by president trump i'm reviewing that i'm reviewing

00:07:26.940 jfk files mlk files that's all in the process of being reviewed because that was done at the directive

00:07:32.540 of the president from all of these agencies so so have you seen anything there you said oh my gosh

00:07:38.700 not yet and so did others in the administration including trump's new head of the fbi

00:07:43.580 you know it's the same thing with epstein's list it's like what the hell are these republicans doing

00:07:47.100 oh i saw you give out i saw you make news this morning about that i gotta get to that

00:07:53.420 you say that the fbi has epstein's list they're sitting on it that doesn't seem like something you

00:07:58.220 should do you're protecting the world's foremost predator that seems like an evil thing to do regardless

00:08:03.100 of who may be embarrassed in the release of that list why is the fbi protecting the greatest pederast

00:08:08.460 um the largest scale pederast in human history simple because of who's on that list you don't think

00:08:14.700 that bill gates is lobbying congress night and day to prevent the disclosure of that list

00:08:20.380 and why is it that the senate you know and good for senator blackburn to try to get it out but then

00:08:25.340 dick turbin comes over the top and says no we're not going to release the names i don't care about the

00:08:29.740 list itself but if released the names right what the hell are the house republicans doing they have

00:08:35.020 the majority you can't get the list you're going to accept dick durbin's word or whoever that guy is

00:08:41.500 as to who is on that list and who isn't and that can and can't be released put on your big boy pants

00:08:46.940 and let us know who the pedophiles are we have an election coming up and we need to adjudicate this

00:08:52.060 matter at the polls god knows the fbi and doj aren't going to do anything but how are you going to reward

00:08:57.340 the fbi with a new headquarters building after their illegal surveillance on donald trump continues

00:09:02.300 with a reauthorization of fisa and we can't even get basic documents out this is why america hates

00:09:07.900 congress and this is why i'm tired of the republican majority saying they're going to get the job

00:09:12.780 done and failing but that was then now the word is there's nothing to see here yeah sure

00:09:22.860 are you still talking about jeffrey epstein this guy's been talked about for years

00:09:28.060 you're asking we have texas we have this we have all of the things

00:09:32.060 and are people still talking about this guy this creep that is unbelievable do you want to waste the

00:09:40.860 time and do you feel like answering i i don't mind answering i mean i can't believe you're asking a

00:09:45.340 question on epstein at a time like this where we're having some of the greatest success and and also

00:09:51.500 tragedy with what happened in texas it just seems uh like a desecration but you go ahead sure sure first

00:09:59.820 to back up on that in february i did an interview on fox and it's been getting a lot of attention

00:10:05.420 because i said i was asked a question about the client list and my response was it's sitting

00:10:13.420 on my desk to be reviewed meaning the file along with the jfk mlk files as well that's what i meant by

00:10:23.020 that also to the tens of thousands of video they turned out to be child porn downloaded by that

00:10:29.580 disgusting jeffrey epstein child porn is what they were never going to be released never going to

00:10:35.020 see the light of day to him being an agent i have no knowledge about that we can get back to you on that

00:10:41.420 and the minute missing from the video we released the video showing definitively the video was not

00:10:49.980 conclusive but the evidence prior to it was showing he committed suicide and what was on that there was a

00:10:59.180 minute that was off the counter and what we learned from bureau of prisons was every year every um night

00:11:05.980 they redo that video it's old from like 1999 so every night the video is reset and every night should

00:11:13.180 have the same minute missing so we're looking for that video to release that as well showing that a

00:11:18.060 minute is missing every night and that's it on epstein what's going on will we ever know

00:11:24.460 if we don't know now how will we ever know in the future don't we have a right to know

00:11:29.500 by the way mark carney our new prime minister his wife's family is listed in epstein's black book

00:11:36.540 epstein's client prince andrew who settled a massive lawsuit with a young girl who raped her

00:11:43.580 um he's friends with mark carney isn't that weird uh prince andrew actually threw a party for mark carney

00:11:49.580 that's weird that's odd seems odd to me we don't have an explanation for it it's a subject that came

00:11:55.500 up in the course of my conversation with my friend joe pollack earlier today i was talking to him about

00:12:00.540 all things american i just wanted to go across the waterfront and get updates on all sorts of files and

00:12:05.260 i just mentioned the epstein epstein news in passing and actually turned into quite a debate let me show you

00:12:11.340 my whole interview with joel which turned pretty quickly into an epstein debate here take a look

00:12:20.060 the trump looks stronger in every uh foreign uh dealing now uh you could imagine what they

00:12:37.900 were thinking in moscow and beijing at the fact that the b2 bombers entered iran undetected

00:12:44.780 completely and that uh they were able to do such a pinpoint devastating attack i think that america's

00:12:52.540 position is so much stronger a great month or so for trump but some recent bumps in the road including

00:13:01.020 his once best friend elon musk now starting another party he says he will at least called the america party

00:13:09.420 and other things um a bit of a bumpy week and here to join us now to talk about it is our friend joel

00:13:15.340 pollack senior editor at large at breitbart.com joel great to see you again i don't want to spend too

00:13:21.420 much time talking about the iran attack or the big beautiful bill other than i think they were great

00:13:27.020 accomplishments and you know in news it's what's new and i think what's new is are some of the things i

00:13:34.460 just mentioned what do you make about elon musk's america party is it a real thing will it hurt

00:13:40.940 republicans more than democrats is it just elon musk hitting back at trump uh publicly to make a

00:13:48.140 point what's going on there the history of third parties in the united states is a rather dismal one

00:13:54.620 our system for centuries has favored a split between two major parties and when third parties have emerged

00:14:03.500 they have quickly been swallowed up by one side or the other usually both in organizational terms

00:14:10.860 and in terms of issues that doesn't mean they don't make an impact and you can look at ross

00:14:15.900 perot's reform party as having had a very significant impact first of all when perot ran and made his

00:14:24.220 biggest impact on the presidential race in 1992 he won about 20 of the vote and that swung the election

00:14:30.300 away from george hw bush who was running for re-election and towards bill clinton but even

00:14:36.540 though perot didn't win any electoral college votes and played the role of the spoiler he did get his

00:14:43.020 main issue onto the table which was deficit reduction in the national debt and bill clinton

00:14:48.780 incorporated perot's ideas and so did the republicans who were later elected to run congress in 1994

00:14:55.580 and clinton and the republicans in a bipartisan way managed to balance the budget so that there were

00:15:00.220 surpluses in the federal budget for the first time in recent memory and unfortunately in the last time

00:15:07.900 until now that was 25 26 27 years ago but many of us still remember it there was a question about

00:15:13.420 what to do with the surplus that was a big question in the 2000 election and that really was a legacy of

00:15:18.860 ross perot's reform party another legacy of the reform party was donald trump himself donald trump

00:15:24.780 tried a third party run or contemplated a third party run in the late 90s early 2000s and so in a

00:15:32.540 way you can say the trump presidency is also a legacy of that third party even though perot and his party

00:15:41.100 both faded and really didn't achieve very much didn't elect anybody outside of jesse ventura the governor

00:15:47.420 of minnesota so that's how third parties go in the united states you can look back to the late 19th

00:15:54.220 century when there were also third parties advocating for things like silver remaining part of the standard

00:16:02.300 for currency in other words not just having gold at that time is the standard for the dollar but also

00:16:07.420 silver and some of their ideas eventually made their way into populist platforms of the other two

00:16:14.060 parties but they did not stick around these third parties the first third party by the way in history

00:16:19.420 of the united states this is a little bit of trivia that you learn in high school history was a party

00:16:24.460 called the anti-mason party it was a party opposed to free masonry and it didn't really do very much

00:16:30.860 but it did happen to win a small percentage of the votes i think it was around in the 1830s or so

00:16:37.100 so elon musk's party will probably hope to do what perot's party did that is to highlight issues that

00:16:44.300 musk cares about musk cares very deeply about the deficit and the debt he's made that very clear

00:16:49.660 i don't think it's going to elect anybody but he could swing the election one way or another it's not

00:16:54.540 going to affect donald trump who's not running for re-election ever again but it could affect future

00:16:59.180 presidential contests and maybe that's as it should be because the only way to address the issues musk

00:17:06.780 cares about is to address entitlements trump made it clear he was not willing to do that he wasn't

00:17:11.980 going to touch social security he wasn't going to touch medicaid or medicare really medicare but

00:17:17.660 there are some medicaid reforms in the big beautiful bill but essentially the old age health care and

00:17:25.420 income support programs that people have relied on for many decades are untouched and trump said

00:17:29.900 he wouldn't touch them but they are driving the deficit problems in the united states because

00:17:35.740 there is so much spending on those entitlement programs alone that even if you take drastic cuts

00:17:42.140 in domestic spending as elon musk suggested it doesn't even come close to touching the problem so

00:17:48.140 the only way to really do this as paul ryan suggested several years ago is to tackle entitlement

00:17:53.500 reform but there's not been any kind of political appetite for that and so you almost need a

00:17:59.020 different kind of leadership to do it you'd need a third party to force the issue and i think musk

00:18:04.860 could have a chance of doing that in the long run but i don't think he'll be elected or certainly

00:18:09.020 he can't be president but i don't think they'll be electing presidents but they will hope to have

00:18:13.900 an impact on the agenda yeah i'm not even sure if he can run for president he was born in south

00:18:18.700 africa i don't i don't know if because it didn't stop obama i'm joking i'm joking um i mean i i love

00:18:24.700 elon musk for so many reasons um i love his dedication to freedom of speech i love his

00:18:30.620 industriousness um i i my guess is what happened there is trump has learned the hard way that when

00:18:39.020 you come to washington there's 100 senators 435 congressmen 50 governors and everyone has a say and

00:18:46.060 and log rolling as it's called is you got to make deals even within your own party that you don't

00:18:51.180 like it's part of being it's part of the system of checks and balances compare that consensus building

00:18:57.660 art of the possible with what it's like to lead a startup in silicon valley where you just do things

00:19:03.820 the faster the better break things the harder the better and you know as long as your financiers

00:19:11.500 like you you're golden it's a very different decision making style and well let me put it

00:19:17.100 another way yeah let me put another way in silicon valley you can fire people very easily and it's

00:19:23.100 nothing personal but musk just fired one of his closest allies in tesla that doesn't happen in

00:19:31.100 washington dc there are consequences for not just firing federal employees but if you for example force a

00:19:38.380 cabinet member to resign or if you break publicly with some political ally you're hurting people

00:19:45.100 and so those people have the same voice you do actually at the end of the day and they can counter

00:19:50.780 that doesn't happen in silicon valley in silicon valley in california in particular and this is one

00:19:54.940 of the great things about california even though it's run so badly in california people accept that

00:19:59.500 they're going to lose sometimes they're going to fail they're going to be fired but they don't

00:20:05.260 mind because they're going to be hired somewhere else they're going to start a new business it's

00:20:08.380 a very entrepreneurial culture and so musk can get rid of employees but those employees are going to

00:20:13.900 find almost instant work in many cases because their skills are so valuable and their experience

00:20:18.700 is so valuable and they have so many ideas that if they don't get hired by somebody they're just

00:20:21.660 going to start their own business and that that has happened i mean it's happened to musk musk applied

00:20:26.380 to work for netscape in the early days of web browsers and he didn't get the job so he started his own

00:20:31.020 company with some friends and the rest is history so musk wants to do that to the federal government

00:20:35.980 he wants to say look i want to fire these people and replace them with these people and it just

00:20:39.420 doesn't work that way because there are constituencies that are being hurt it's partly log rolling but also

00:20:45.740 when you're talking about getting rid of important entitlement programs or just regular government

00:20:51.500 programs or pieces of the federal bureaucracy you're talking about thousands of jobs you're talking

00:20:56.140 about perhaps millions of dependents and these people have a voice they have a vote and it's just

00:21:01.180 not so easy to do things that way it's as if every employee were a shareholder as well you know it's

00:21:06.300 it's not it doesn't work like silicon valley and it can't but what you do need ultimately is an

00:21:12.300 agreement where the two parties agree to jump off the cliff together and say we're going to absorb the

00:21:17.820 political impact of the decision to save these programs from themselves by reforming them and to save the

00:21:25.580 fiscal integrity of the federal government and we're going to accept cuts for democrats that

00:21:31.260 probably means raising the retirement age and maybe even accepting some benefit cuts or changes

00:21:37.260 to the program where it's not a defined benefit program but rather some kind of individual

00:21:42.300 contribution program democrats have resisted those ideas for a long time but that's probably going

00:21:46.620 to have to be what they accept and maybe republicans have to accept some kind of tax increases

00:21:52.140 to pay for some of the shortfalls and they're going to jump off that cliff together and they're

00:21:56.460 saying look we're going to take a political hit from our own voters for accepting these things but

00:22:00.460 there's no other way except this way and musk is probably not going to be the person who does that

00:22:07.420 he doesn't have those diplomatic skills but perhaps by putting the issue of fiscal responsibility back on

00:22:14.540 the agenda he can force other parties to develop policies around that priority and then

00:22:20.700 you might see new leaders emerge who are ready to make those kinds of compromises there was one

00:22:26.620 leader in our lifetimes who could have done it it was barack obama because democrats really have

00:22:31.820 the most credibility on those entitlement programs those entitlement programs are really central to

00:22:36.780 the democratic party's message and its constituency he would have had the political capital to make

00:22:42.460 changes instead of which he decided to be a marxist revolutionary and not to do the job he was elected to

00:22:48.220 do joe lieberman was the one who pointed this out that if obama had used his immense popularity at the

00:22:53.340 beginning of his first term to reform entitlements we would be talking about him today as one of the

00:22:57.500 greatest presidents america had ever had instead of which he's basically an afterthought he affected

00:23:02.220 politics by bringing a new brand of woke into politics but he didn't really leave any positive impact on the

00:23:07.420 country yeah his last legacy was the iran nukes which trump took out um there's only one elon musk and

00:23:15.420 there's only 24 hours in the day i've had some very small interactions with him and i'm stunned by how

00:23:21.580 multitasking he can be um and he he's quite good at delegating too i mean any one of us would be happy with

00:23:30.300 tesla or spacex or the boring company or neural link or or or and he seems to juggle them all but

00:23:38.460 even he when he was so engrossed at the white house you know the stock price of tesla dipped down

00:23:43.580 when he backed away from politics tesla zoomed again because they know he is such a key uh part of the

00:23:50.140 mvp and i wonder if musk will maintain his interest in politics he has a huge database when he was

00:23:57.340 campaigning for trump he was given away a million bucks a day for anyone who signed up to his super

00:24:02.380 pack he's got to have an amazing list um will he i don't i i don't know part of me thinks his greatest

00:24:09.900 contribution to society may not be a third party it may be in industry or tech i don't know but uh

00:24:16.780 do you think there's any chance of a personal rapprochement between him and trump trump is easy to

00:24:21.900 anger but he's easy to quick to forgive as well he's in fact i think he sort of likes uh making up

00:24:28.620 with a foe because he feels that the foe sort of owes him something i've seen it a zillion times even

00:24:35.100 when he meets with um you know he met with carlos slim the the new york times boss he sort of likes it

00:24:41.420 he loves the rapprochement um do you think they'll stay enemies or do you think they'll re-friend each

00:24:46.940 other i think they'll have to be allies because they have common interests and they both believe

00:24:52.380 in the success of the united states and so that's going to bring them together trump does work in an

00:24:57.820 environment where he creates conflict as a creative force and if you've been around trump at all you

00:25:03.580 know that these kinds of conflicts are pretty normal for him even with people he likes i mean look at

00:25:09.740 prime minister netanyahu trump wouldn't talk to him for years because he blamed netanyahu for

00:25:14.060 legitimizing joe biden's election and now they're the best of friends and trump was very emotional

00:25:19.180 i thought when netanyahu nominated him for the nobel prize the week before he had been swearing in public

00:25:24.940 about how netanyahu is so used to fighting wars he doesn't know how to do anything else so that kind

00:25:29.900 of tension comes with a close relationship with trump he's just a volatile person and there's a creative

00:25:37.980 purpose behind that it's not just temper it's not abusive it's just the way he functions in a

00:25:45.020 creative way it's part of the energy that keeps him going and i think we are all the better for

00:25:50.620 it it does make him a little bit more difficult to deal with but it does make him an effective

00:25:54.460 leader at the same time i want to ask a little bit about the jeffrey epstein story because uh i think

00:25:59.980 that was the definition of the deep state uh someone who clearly was involved with some um

00:26:07.020 state or states i think it's pretty obvious it was a honey trap sort of influence operation and

00:26:14.860 trump had talked about releasing those files like releasing the kennedy assassination files and it was

00:26:20.140 sort of proof that he was going to take over the deep state he made promises his attorney general

00:26:25.900 bondi made promises and now they're saying oh there's nothing to release and i and i i think that

00:26:33.340 this is a symbolic thing people want to know the truth about epstein but they also want to know that

00:26:39.020 trump didn't get sucked into the deep state or wasn't uh bamboozled by them or rolled by them and i

00:26:47.340 i think i'm not sure how widespread an issue this is i don't know if it's going to make anyone not vote

00:26:53.580 for trump i think the immigration thing is so huge and taxes are huge and jobs are huge and they're

00:27:00.460 real and maybe caring about the epstein file is sort of a hobby or a luxury belief that people just like

00:27:06.540 an intellectual exercise but what do you make about it because trump seems to be saying there's nothing

00:27:13.820 here i i don't think there's anything there more than what we know and i've always felt that way i thought

00:27:18.860 it was pretty easy to understand why jeffrey epstein had killed himself and i do believe

00:27:23.340 that he killed himself remember that jeffrey epstein had lived a high life he was a billionaire

00:27:27.900 he had then been convicted of statutory rape he managed to work out a plea deal and he walked free

00:27:36.620 eventually it was a very lenient sentence he received and he moved on with his life for the most part

00:27:40.780 then the first trump administration nominated a man named i believe alex acosta for labor secretary

00:27:49.820 and acosta had been involved in the plea deal i think he had been the u.s attorney the prosecutor

00:27:55.260 involved in agreeing to the plea deal so the epstein case hit the spotlight again and with that case

00:28:02.700 came a bunch of other important political personalities who had been involved not because

00:28:06.460 they've been implicated in wrongdoing but for example a good friend of mine alan dershowitz had been

00:28:11.180 jeffrey epstein's defense lawyer at one point so a lot of high profile personalities were suddenly

00:28:17.180 involved people with things at stake and acosta i think was it was a big one and epstein found himself

00:28:23.420 rearrested after thinking he had put this behind him not just rearrested but rearrested for

00:28:29.580 essentially being a pedophile and then he was being held in this cell and when the news came out

00:28:34.460 that he killed himself it made complete sense to me because what i was looking at was a man who

00:28:40.300 had suffered this i mean you can't it's hard to describe him as a victim right he was a terrible

00:28:44.540 criminal in in many ways but in in a sense he he had made a deal with the government that he thought

00:28:50.380 was good he paid good money for those lawyers to make the deal and then he found himself in prison

00:28:56.300 facing potential prosecution once again for things that he thought he had put behind him

00:29:00.780 i think he knew he was never going to get out of jail or prison i think he he believed he was going

00:29:07.660 to be held and uh be in captivity essentially for political reasons that everybody on the democratic

00:29:14.540 side and republican side had a reason to have him in prison not because he was going to spill secrets

00:29:18.620 necessarily but because the fact that he had this sweetheart plea deal for these heinous crimes

00:29:23.580 embarrassed everybody involved and so i think he saw himself just as a target for the rest of his life

00:29:29.580 and so he killed himself that that was my feeling at the time but what are the statements from um um

00:29:35.820 attorney general bondi that there were an enormous number of files and the reason they couldn't be

00:29:40.620 released is because of protecting the identity of the victims of his child rape and and what about

00:29:46.140 you know so i'm not saying no i think all that is true i mean i think to some extent the conservative

00:29:51.820 new media uh created something more out of this than it was and there's a danger in that in that you

00:29:59.500 buy into some of these narratives too yeah you always have to have a little bit of skepticism i mean

00:30:03.420 obviously i'm open to the idea that there was more there especially given the high-ranking officials

00:30:08.460 from other countries and so forth who who seemed to frequent epstein's island and so forth but

00:30:14.300 i i also think that you have to look at the simpler explanations let me let me give you

00:30:18.140 another example of that uh i'm doing a story right now about how my own governor in california gavin

00:30:23.340 newsom is spending 100 million dollars on low-income housing in the pacific palisades this is something

00:30:28.140 residents have feared for a long time town burned down and we fear they're going to fill it with housing

00:30:33.500 projects okay and that's because california is run by socialist democrats so these fears turned out to be

00:30:40.540 well founded but then there's an additional step which is to say maybe that's the reason it burnt

00:30:45.740 down maybe they let it burn down or even set it on fire to allow themselves to build this low-income

00:30:53.340 housing for illegal aliens for the homeless and so forth and to do it on prime real estate near the

00:30:58.860 ocean now that's a level of conspiratorial thinking you have to remain open to because sometimes things

00:31:05.020 like that do happen but it's just not the best explanation and it requires a level of coordination

00:31:12.860 we're just not used to seeing from government officials so and yeah i believe in occam's razor

00:31:18.380 which is the philosophical principle yeah i didn't want to go there because i don't i actually don't

00:31:22.700 i don't believe in occam's razor i i just i just i believe in a healthy skepticism toward everything but

00:31:27.980 but just to go with the i mean my gut feeling on this is that the fire was an accident my gut feeling on

00:31:33.900 this is that the epstein death was a suicide and you know these i stand to be corrected on these on

00:31:39.340 these counts but that's just how i feel about it i i i'll i just can't get out of my head that clip

00:31:46.620 of melinda gates describing how this was why she divorced one of the world's richest men her husband

00:31:53.660 of decades i'm not sure if you saw it she said he just wouldn't stop going back to meet him and and it

00:32:01.420 was that and and you know his excuse bill gates for meeting with epstein more than a dozen times was

00:32:07.980 i was trying to fundraise one of the world's richest men maybe he would fundraise from epstein but after

00:32:13.420 he realized it wasn't like that that just doesn't hold up you don't meet with a guy a dozen times

00:32:18.220 and that's not why melinda gates divorced he said he was ghastly and a horrible here's a quick clip of

00:32:23.900 that you know it was also widely reported that bill had a friendship or business or some kind

00:32:29.820 of contact with jeffrey epstein and that you were not uh that that was very upsetting to you did that

00:32:34.860 play a role in the in the divorce at all in this process yeah as i said it's not one thing it was

00:32:41.580 many things but i did not like uh that he'd had meetings with jeffrey epstein no

00:32:46.780 mm-hmm and you made that clear to him i made that clear to him i also met jeffrey epstein exactly one

00:32:54.700 time did you yes because i wanted to see who this man was and um i regretted it from the second i

00:33:02.380 stepped in the door he was abhorrent he was evil personified i had nightmares about it afterwards so

00:33:10.380 you know my heart breaks for these young women because that's how i felt and here i'm an older woman

00:33:15.500 my god i feel terrible for those young women it's awful you felt that the moment you walked

00:33:20.060 in i didn't realize that yeah and you shared that with bill and he still continued to spend time with

00:33:25.580 him any of the questions remaining about what bill's relationship there was those are for bill to

00:33:31.900 answer okay but i made it very clear how i felt about him like i i think the reason why people care

00:33:37.820 is not because they want a different kind of justice for epstein who is now dead it's they want

00:33:42.700 a different kind of justice for bill gates and reed hoffman and anyone else who they think

00:33:47.100 participated in those pedophile rapes and i don't know i just i mean i i don't think i'm a conspiracy

00:33:54.780 theorist and i understand what you're saying look for other explanations but there is no other good

00:33:59.900 explanation for bill gates being divorced by his wife because she says he just won't stop visiting

00:34:05.340 epstein it wasn't you know to play cards or or to fundraise it was for rape

00:34:10.700 i think we know a lot about epstein's friends already we know about bill clinton we know about

00:34:18.860 reed hoffman as you mentioned we know about others and i don't think they've really been

00:34:24.060 held accountable for what we already know so the things that people are upset about are already in the

00:34:29.580 public domain i don't know what extra information people expected to find maybe some kind of evidence

00:34:35.180 he was working for a spy agency or something like that i mean i think everything looks set up

00:34:41.500 to make that possible certainly he knew some very high-ranking people i mean he knew ehud barak

00:34:46.300 the left-wing former israeli prime minister who's now been implicated in these visits to epstein

00:34:52.780 island and was fundraising with him and but you know what's interesting is it doesn't stop left-wing

00:34:57.500 think tanks from featuring ehud barak very prominently when he wants to criticize the israeli

00:35:01.180 government so and bill gates has never been more you know widespread uh right right i mean it's

00:35:07.980 i think that the job of holding these people accountable really falls to people like you and me

00:35:12.140 but i i just didn't expect more to come out of the epstein files and i i think that people who

00:35:19.100 hung around with him knew they were playing with fire that's why his long-time assistant

00:35:23.340 maxwell is serving a lengthy sentence in prison you know i i think um it's unfortunately uh the the

00:35:32.700 double standard that often applies isn't just in our justice system it's also in our media ecosystem i

00:35:37.980 mean you know look at you know to look at a different sort of part of the clinton world and

00:35:42.620 james carville is basically outed himself as a raving anti-semite but he's on news analysis shows all

00:35:48.620 the time for his opinion about this and that i mean we just we they're you know prominent people

00:35:54.860 are not held to the same standard especially if they're on the left and uh i think that's that's

00:35:59.180 also part of the epstein story but i didn't know how much more there was really going to be uh likewise

00:36:05.100 i don't know that it makes sense to prosecute james comey and and brennan and some of these other

00:36:11.180 figures who who were part of the russia collusion investigation i mean we know they're liars we know that

00:36:16.460 they uh fomented the whole thing is it worth wasting time prosecuting them and looking for

00:36:22.460 some kind of smoking gun or or should we just you know think about other things and move on to other

00:36:26.940 things i'm not saying forgive and forget i'm just saying i i i wonder if the american right is

00:36:35.100 investing in past narratives that helped solidify or articulate an idea about what was failing in our

00:36:42.380 government but might not help donald trump achieve his agenda so that that's all i'm just not heavily

00:36:48.860 invested in the epstein story because i don't think there's much more to mine there even if it was

00:36:53.980 entertaining for a while um in a grisly sort of you know horror show kind of way uh you know to me

00:37:01.020 what's what's really uh interesting is is what's happening with immigration policy we may find out

00:37:07.900 more about what biden was up to i'd like i do think there are some smoking guns about how democrats made

00:37:13.100 the decision to throw our borders open and why they did so i think we are going to find uh that

00:37:19.100 there are some political motives that that are probably uh you know in writing somewhere and and

00:37:25.500 they've called the rest of us racists for assuming that democrats want these people to be voters someday

00:37:29.500 but i i do assume that that evidence will emerge so i i think there are things there are battles worth

00:37:34.940 fighting and and you know we we're we're so busy in the trump era we don't have the resources to

00:37:39.980 fight things i think that are already settled all right well listen i won't go at you another time on

00:37:45.340 that because i i i feel differently i feel that there's a lot of uh there's a deficit of information

00:37:51.660 and a deficit of justice and i think that um i think the deep state has won here and i think to see

00:37:59.500 cash patel and dan bongino and others um go mum and become that which they criticized six months ago

00:38:07.980 i think is uh is telling listen i still love the trump administration i think what they're doing on

00:38:12.620 immigration is the most important thing for western civilization can i defend patel and bongino and

00:38:18.700 again i could be i could be wrong you know and i've made mistakes like this in the past but but i i will

00:38:23.580 say that i actually have more respect for them because they got a better look at the evidence

00:38:29.180 than any of us have and they have to go against what they said before that doesn't mean they sold

00:38:33.020 out it means they were honest i think that's another explanation they they just saw the evidence or the

00:38:38.700 lack of evidence and so they revised their earlier statements not again not because they had to do so i

00:38:46.220 mean in this sense that the people who elected them expected them to continue where they were

00:38:51.340 i it took it took some political courage to look at the evidence and say i was wrong about what i said

00:38:57.260 before um you can look at as you know conforming to this swamp but but i i think to give them the

00:39:03.100 benefit of the doubt is is is reasonable here i think maybe they just stood up and said okay uh

00:39:10.300 we we thought there was more here than there was well if melinda gates uh changes her mind and

00:39:16.620 remarries bill gates uh then i'll accept that thesis but as long as she had billions of reasons to

00:39:22.060 divorce him but bill gates she walked away she walked away with those reasons yeah you know well i uh

00:39:28.060 she had i mean she really can it's called the bill and melinda gates foundation i think she was

00:39:34.780 just as in control as he was i mean i believe her when she says about her personal life that was the

00:39:44.140 reason she divorced him i believe her and uh i actually that's where i don't believe her i think

00:39:51.900 that the epstein scandal became embarrassing to her but i think that privately as long as it didn't make

00:39:57.180 the news i think she was okay with it that's my personal suspicion about it i don't think that

00:40:02.140 she could have interpreted bill gates disappearing for weekends at a time any other way than that he was

00:40:08.620 having affairs or having some kind of alternate romantic attachments i mean i i think that these

00:40:14.780 billionaires get away with a lot of that sort of thing and their wives who are attached to their wealth

00:40:20.620 tolerate it and i think she was prepared to tolerate it until bill gates became associated with epstein and

00:40:26.380 epstein came back into the news i think it was convenient for her to to get rid of him i i think there

00:40:31.900 are other cases like that as well where the wives of wealthy and famous people have tolerated their

00:40:37.500 misbehavior until it became public and then they you know oh you know shock and outrage i didn't know

00:40:42.220 about this and you know it's i feel betrayed and you know nonsense i i mean i'm sure it's true in a

00:40:47.100 couple of cases but i think for the most part this behavior was tolerated and then when it became a

00:40:52.700 problem for melinda gates i mean again i don't want to disparage her this is just my my hunch about it i

00:40:58.620 can't prove it but it's it's speculative i i just i wouldn't take anything these people say at face value

00:41:05.100 nothing well we'll leave it there joel thanks very much i didn't really mean to get into a debate

00:41:09.980 with you about the epstein no it's fine i just wanted to uh this is the healthy discussion you

00:41:14.780 know this is this is we're we're both talking about our instincts here and you need kind of both both

00:41:20.140 sides of this to to get to the truth yeah all right well thanks for taking the time we're talking

00:41:26.620 with joel pollack senior editor at large of breitbart.com keep up the fight thank you all right stay with us

00:41:31.820 more ahead

00:41:44.780 well what do you think of that i don't feel like giving epstein the benefit of the doubt i don't

00:41:49.180 deserve i don't think he deserves the benefit of the doubt and i think the public interest in finding

00:41:54.220 the facts here is enormous i'm absolutely certain that epstein's clients were of both parties the

00:42:02.300 democrats and the republicans and they weren't just of americans they were people in the uk and around

00:42:07.260 the world and i'm absolutely certain that people like bill gates would do anything to stop these files

00:42:13.260 from seeing the light of day there was no reason for bill gates to meet with jeffrey epstein dozens of

00:42:19.180 times but he chose to maybe we should believe his ex-wife melinda well that's our show for today

00:42:28.380 until tomorrow on behalf of all of us here at rebel world headquarters to you at home good night

00:42:33.180 and keep fighting for freedom

Rebel News Podcast - July 10, 2025

EZRA LEVANT ｜ Trump administration steps back from Epstein disclosures, says 'client list' doesn't exist

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