EZRA LEVANT ｜ Trump invites Ukraine’s allies to Washington—minus Mark Carney
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Summary
The world's leaders converge on Washington, D.C. for Ukraine peace talks, but why wasn't Mark Carney invited? And why did Putin get to shake hands with Donald Trump? Plus, why did a plane carrying Russian President Vladimir Putin get shot down en route to the talks?
Transcript
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Hello, my friends. Very interesting days with the second Ukraine Peace Summit within a week.
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And I think we're going to have a third very soon also. What's happening? Why wasn't Mark Carney
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invited? Seven European leaders were. We'll dig into it. But first, let me invite you to become
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Tonight, the world's leaders converge on Washington, D.C. for Ukraine peace talks.
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But why wasn't Mark Carney invited? It's August 18th, and this is The Ezra LeVant Show.
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Well, I don't know if you watched it on Friday. It was absolutely riveting to me.
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The summit between Russian President Vladimir Putin and U.S. President Donald Trump. It was historic
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in a way. I mean, first of all, it ended the attempt to isolate and sanction Vladimir Putin
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for his invasion of Ukraine in February of 2022. Both the isolation and the sanctions are still in
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place, I should say. For example, the Russian president's plane needed to refuel. Normally,
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that would be done electronically, but they literally had to pay cash because Russia is banned
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from using any banking system in the West, including credit cards and the SWIFT system.
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So even in Putin's arrival, sanctions and isolation were in place. But, you know, it was so symbolic.
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And you could see that Vladimir Putin was quite pleased to be there.
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Although Donald Trump, too, seemed quite pleased to end an era of unsuccessful responses to Russia's
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invasion of Ukraine. Whatever you think of that war, and I think it's clear it was an aggressive
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war by Russia, the sanctions just weren't working. In fact, it retooled the Russian economy to aim
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towards China. Russia found new markets for its energy, and it found new vendors for its retail goods.
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I just don't think it actually worked. I don't know if you remember, I did a story on this a while
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ago. Despite the sanctions, during the war, Russia overtook Germany as the, I think it was the fourth
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largest economy in the world, but Russia moved ahead of Germany. How is that possible? Part of it,
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of course, is Germany is sabotaging itself by investing in costly and destructive green energy
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programs. But nonetheless, it's quite something for Russia in the middle of a war with sanctions
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to actually grow bigger than Germany. Putin and Trump shaking hands, talking at length,
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was an image that the Russians were delighted to show because it means the marginalization is over.
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However, you don't want to just look at it from the point of view of the West. Russia was never
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marginalized in other parts of the world, like the Middle East, Asia, or Africa.
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So that was the first step in getting a normalized kind of communication going on. And there was a
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tremendous reaction by the mainstream media to criticize Trump for even having that and for
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certainly granting this symbolism to Putin. But I think that's the thing about peace deals. You make
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peace with your enemies, not with your friends. Now, Trump was insistent that this wasn't his war,
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which is true. It's a war between Russia and Ukraine. So I think Trump was extra repellent
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to that accusation that he was somehow doing something he ought not to. So that was Friday.
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And as soon as it was over, in fact, it all happened at a military base in Alaska, which is very
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interesting in itself. It was a very quick journey. It was about equidistant between Moscow and Washington,
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DC. Both leaders had to fly in there. It was on a military base, which I think made it very secure.
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And I have to say, in the back of my mind, the whole time I was thinking,
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there are a lot of forces that don't want that peace deal to happen. And the chances of the Russian
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leader's plane being shot down by someone who didn't want a peace deal were real. And I think you
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could see some of the protections taken when American F-22 fighters actually escorted the
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Russian plane. Perhaps it was just symbolism, but there was a lot going on there. Anyways,
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that was on Friday. Trump and his lead negotiator, Wychkoff is his name, who also is running the Hamas
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negotiations. Plus, Marco Rubio got on the phone right away with the other European allies and
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brought them up to speed. And they decided to have a meeting today in Washington, DC. Very quick.
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Trump doesn't waste time. He wants to get this thing done. Remember he said he thought it could
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be solved in a day. He was using hyperbole, but still he wants to move quickly. And so wouldn't
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you know it, half a dozen leading democratic leaders from France, from the UK, from Italy, from Germany,
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the head of NATO, the head of the European Union came to Washington, DC at Trump's request. And again,
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that was taken as a sign of weakness by the regime media who said, aha, they're here to oppose you,
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Donald Trump, who said, no, actually, I invited them of what he called the coalition of the willing.
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Chancellor Murs was there from Germany. And there was a guy named Alexander Stubb. Now,
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without Googling it, do you know who Alexander Stubb is? And I confess, I didn't. So don't feel
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bad if you didn't. He's the leader of Finland, which is a pretty small country. It's not that small
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physically, but population-wise about 5 million people. So less than the greater Toronto area.
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And you might be thinking, why was the leader of Finland invited to this meeting, but not Mark Carney?
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Canada is eight times bigger in terms of population, in terms of committing to Ukraine's
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military. Canada was disproportionately spendy, about 20 billion Canadian dollars, if I'm doing the
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conversion correctly, much more than Finland. I don't know if it was an animosity between Trump and
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Carney. It seems like Zelensky didn't lift a finger to get Mark Carney there. It was just sort of
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odd, because it was sort of like the G7 meeting without the Japanese and without the Canadians.
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I know why the Japanese weren't there. They're really not involved in this Ukraine war. They
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have not been diplomatically or financially a part of it. But is there a country that has been noisier
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about its support for Ukraine than Canada, first under Trudeau and then under Mark Carney. And he simply
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wasn't invited. I found that remarkable and so interesting. And he tried to fill the void,
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Mark Carney did, by having a meeting with Doug Ford.
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Well, actually, I'm just going to meet with Minister Leblanc. We'll have a discussion of
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that and an important discussion with Premier Ford this morning on a variety of aspects for the
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Ontario economy, the Canadian economy, which of course includes trade, but goes much more to the
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issues that we can control and how we build out from within.
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Doug Ford thought he would badmouth Trump a bit more. That seems to be all Ford really does.
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Maybe that's part of the reason why Canada wasn't invited, because every time Doug Ford, who is a
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proxy of Mark Carney now talks, it's to insult Trump in a way that I think everyone who has been
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following Trump for any time at all knows that if you personally prick him, if you personally
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attack him, he remembers that. And it can't be an accident that Doug Ford is doing his best
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to keep Trump hostile towards Canada. I just simply don't know how that works to Doug Ford's
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advantage. I don't get it. If I was Doug Ford, I would be worried about the auto sector, which
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the majority of which is in Ontario. I don't understand it. I don't understand how it's good for
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the country. But that's Doug Ford for you. And Mark Carney, of course, doesn't say a word
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against it. It's just really, really weird. Donald Trump is so unpredictable. I don't even know
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what he if he knows what he's doing tomorrow morning. So let's start focusing on creating that
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environment. Is there an acceptance, I guess, from from leaders that we'll just have the tariffs?
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Again, he's the prime minister will speak on that. But the president is unpredictable. He'll come out
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with some cockamamie thing tomorrow that we don't even know about. So do you think that Mark Carney is
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being two elbows down in response? Not at all. Not at all. He's doing an incredible job. He's working
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collaboratively with 12 other premiers and myself and working as Team Canada. And he's he's doing a very,
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very good job, in my opinion, put in his position dealing with Donald Trump. Let's stop worrying
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about Donald Trump. We'll start focusing on Ontario and Canada. Oh, by the way, Doug Ford was asked if
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he has any advice for the leader of the opposition, Pierre Polyev. And the advice was, yeah, to the leader
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of the opposition, don't oppose. He actually said that. Premier, today is Pierre Polyev's by-election.
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If he gets elected, I'm wondering, what's what's your advice to him going into the fall sitting of
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the parliament? Work with the prime minister. How's it? It's Team Canada. You know, let's put our
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political stripes aside and start working together collectively on large infrastructure projects,
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on other areas that he can cooperate with the government. Last question. Would you have plans to
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meet with Polyev to push that message and make sure that he is working with the prime minister? All I want
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to do is move forward collectively as a government. I don't care about political stripes. The person I'm
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working with right now is the prime minister of the day. And as far as I'm concerned, he's doing a
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really, really good job considering the position he's been put in. I challenge anyone to try to deal
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with Donald Trump, myself included. He's a different type of cat. But we're united. We know what we need to
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do. And we know that we need to cut the regulatory burdens off of companies, lower taxes, put money
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back into people's pockets, support companies that need investment to grow and expand here.
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Yeah, what a dummy. I tell you one thing. Let me just tell you a promise. If Doug Ford ever runs for the
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Conservative Party leadership, I will do everything in my power to make that not happen. I think he's a
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disgrace to the word conservative. And I don't think he's why Pierre Polyev lost the last election,
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but he certainly tried his best to make that happen. I don't know what his plan is, but I'll do my best to
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make sure Doug Ford's plans are foiled. Back to Washington, D.C. It was a different spirit than the
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last time Vladimir Zelensky came. So you had meeting number one with Vladimir Putin, which lasted longer
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than most observers thought. It was about three and a half hours on Friday. Zelensky was here and along with all
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those other leaders I mentioned, they had a one-on-one meeting, Trump and Zelensky, and then
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they had the group meeting. And the spirit was very different. I mean, last time, I don't know if
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you remember, it was a disaster. Zelensky was picking fights with J.D. Vance and Trump and,
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and boy, Vance and Trump were pushing back. Let me just play a little bit of that to you.
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It was one of the most shocking things I had ever seen in the Oval Office. Just a reminder, take a look.
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I'm talking about the kind of diplomacy that's going to end the destruction of your country.
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Yes, but if you are not strong- Mr. President, Mr. President, with respect,
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I think it's disrespectful for you to come into the Oval Office and try to litigate this in front
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of the American media. Right now, you guys are going around and forcing conscripts to the front
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lines because you have manpower problems. You should be thanking the President for trying to bring it
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into this conflict. Have you ever been to Ukraine that you say what problems we have?
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I have actually, I've actually watched and seen the stories, and I know what happens is you bring people,
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you bring them on a propaganda tour, Mr. President. Do you disagree that you've had problems
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bringing people into your military? We have problems.
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And do you think that it's respectful to come to the Oval Office of the United States of America
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and attack the administration that is trying to prevent the destruction of your country?
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A lot of questions. Let's start from the beginning. Sure.
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First of all, during the war, everybody has problems. Even you. But you have nice ocean,
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and don't feel now. But you will feel it in the future. God bless.
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You don't know that. God bless. You will not have the war.
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Don't tell us what we're going to feel. We're trying to solve a problem.
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Don't tell us what we're going to feel. I'm not telling you.
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Because you're in no position to dictate that. Remember this.
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We're going to feel very good. You will feel influence.
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We're going to feel very good and very strong. I'm telling you. You will feel influence.
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You're right now not in a very good position. You've allowed yourself to be in a very bad
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position. And he happens to be right about it. From the very beginning of the war.
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You're not in a good position. You don't have the cards right now.
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With us, you start having cards. I'm not playing cards.
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Right now, you're playing cards. I'm very serious, Mr. President.
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You're playing cards. You're gambling with the lives of millions of people. You're
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gambling with World War III. You're gambling with World War III. And what you're doing is very
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disrespectful to the country, this country. It's back to you.
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Far more than a lot of people said they should have.
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Well, this time Zelensky actually wore a suit to begin with. And he said the word thank you
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10 times in the meeting that at least the journalists heard.
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So I think Zelensky realized Trump and Putin have pretty much come to an agreement.
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This is his opportunity to maybe tweak it. But I'll tell you my thoughts about where this
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is going to go in a moment. Trump was right, though, when he said that no one else could
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possibly make this deal happen. No one could chair a meeting with both Putin and Zelensky. No one could
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summon Putin and summon seven European leaders and do this. I mean, who would do it? Emmanuel Macron,
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Keir Starmer. I mean, Trump likes to take credit for these things. But what if it's actually true?
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So people can say whatever they want. Ultimately, at the end of the day, we have to get the Russian
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side to agree to things that they don't want to agree to if we're going to have peace. If not,
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there'll just be a war. They'll keep killing each other. And life will go on in America and in the rest of
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the world, but not for Ukraine. So the president has invested a lot of time in trying to bring an
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end to this war. He deserves credit for doing that. He gets criticism for doing that. He could
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just let this war go on. The president could have just said, this is Biden's war. It started under
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him. We'll do what we can for Ukraine, but we're going to focus on other things. He could have
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easily said that. But he's the only leader in the world that can get Putin to a meeting to talk about
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serious things. I mean, they're mad. The media is mad. I think in some ways they loved this war,
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which is weird. They hated that the war was started, but they loved Ukraine's defense of it.
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And they accused Marco Rubio of platforming Putin. But I just don't know that when the leader
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of the world's largest tactical nuclear weapon country, a massive country, a large economy in
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the middle of a war. He's on the Security Council. I just don't think Trump was giving him those things.
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He has them, whether or not the West acknowledges them. I think there are some people in the West
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who think that Ukraine is winning the war, thinks that the sanctions are working. I just don't think
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that's the case. Here's another clip. Critics of President Trump will say the
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pomp and circumstances, pomp and circumstance, the red carpet, the warm handshake, that President Trump
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simply lost that, that Putin gained there just by being on the world stage and walking down a red
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carpet with the president. Your reaction to that? Well, I mean, critics of President Trump are always
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going to find something to criticize. You don't pay attention to it anymore. But I will tell you this,
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Putin is already on the world stage. He's already on the world stage. The guy's conducting a full-scale
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war in Ukraine. He's already on the world stage. He has the world's largest tactical nuclear arsenal in
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the world and the second largest strategic nuclear arsenal in the world. He's already on the world
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stage. When I hear people say that, oh, it elevates him. Well, all we do is talk about Putin all the
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time. All the media has done is talk about Putin all the time for the last four or five years.
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That doesn't mean he's right about the war. That doesn't mean he's justified about the war.
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Put all that aside. It means you're not going to have a peace agreement between Russia and Ukraine.
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You're not going to end a war between Russia and Ukraine without dealing with Putin.
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That's just common sense. I shouldn't even have to say it.
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I mean, that's the thing about negotiating an end to wars is that you're working with your enemies.
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And I understand not liking that. I mean, I can imagine how awful a lot of Israelis feel when
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there's some ceasefire deal with Hamas. Like, those are diabolical Nazi-like killers. Imagine making
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a deal with them. But that's the thing about ceasefires and peace deals. You have to make them with your
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enemies. I mean, Donald Trump keeps pointing out that this is not his war in any way. He just wants
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to solve it. And by the way, Vladimir Putin, after his meeting in Alaska, said in his view,
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if Trump had been president in 2022, this war would not have begun, which is interesting.
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I'd like to remind you that in 2022, during the last contact with the previous administration,
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I tried to convince my previous American colleague that the situation should not be
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brought to the point of no return when it would come to hostilities. And I said it quite directly
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back then that it's a big mistake. Today, when President Trump saying that if he was the president
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back then, there will be no war. And I'm quite sure that it would indeed be so. I can confirm that.
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I think that overall, me and President Trump have built a very good business-like and trustworthy
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contact. And I have every reason to believe that moving down this path, we can come, and the sooner
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better, to the end of the conflict in Ukraine. I want to throw one more thing in here. And again,
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Trump is self-serving, as every politician is. Trump's just better at it than most. But Donald
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Trump has, even though he's only been in office since January, he has resolved a half dozen other
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wars. Now, maybe you haven't heard of them because they're in places that aren't really top of mind
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for us. But it is true. Here's his clip. This is a tremendous breakthrough in a few short months.
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We've now achieved peace between India and Pakistan, Israel and Iran, and the DRC and Rwanda, and
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a couple of others also. Serbia, you know, was, they were getting ready to go to war with a group. I
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won't even mention because it didn't happen. We're able to stop it. But I have a friend in Serbia and they
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said, we're going to go to war again. And I won't mention that it's Kosovo, but it's Kosovo. But they
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were going to have a big time war and we stopped it. We stopped it because of trade. They want to
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trade with the United States. I said, we don't trade with people that go to war. Trump's right when he
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says these aren't his wars. But he really does seem interested in ending wars. It's interesting
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that way. There's a liberal comedian named Bill Maher, who I think is actually very thoughtful.
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And he's not afraid to zig when the rest of Hollywood zags. And here he is reminding his
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liberal viewers that there was once upon a time when Democrats were against war, too. And now Trump
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is that par excellence. You're listening to Bill Maher for a minute.
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It's funny. I see that today is the anniversary of Woodstock. This is 56 years ago. And the hippies,
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what did they hate more than anything else? War. What is it good for? Absolutely nothing.
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So if you're the kind of person who says, you know, you can find some good in anybody,
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this would be the good in Donald Trump. He really does not like war. Thailand and Cambodia
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were having a firing at each other. Rwanda and the Congo. Most people don't even know about these.
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India and Pakistan, Armenia, Azerbaijan. He got involved in all of them. He really,
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he doesn't really, he wants it. Now, the way he does it, as usual, not, you know, with Ukraine,
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the solution was, well, surrender. Give Putin everything he wants. And even that didn't work.
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That's the thing. He gave Putin anything he wanted and it didn't work. But again, let's not have the
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zombie lie that he's still backing Putin because, first of all, he bombed Iran. That was a Putin ally.
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He, he didn't get out of NATO. No. He mended fences with NATO. So, uh, and he put sanctions
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back on Russia. So, you know. You're really coming around, Bill. I'm not coming around.
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There's no coming around. There's just to what's true. This is true shit. Right. I don't come around.
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I'm on anybody's team. I'm on the team. I'm on what's right, what's true, what happened. This is
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what happened. He just doesn't like war. So, to recap, part one of the meetings was in Alaska.
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Part two was today in Washington, D.C. And, uh, and they're going to have a part three,
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I think, with just Zelensky, Trump, and Putin. By the way, I want to show you one more thing
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about this Finnish leader whose name I've already forgotten and we'll probably never know again.
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The Finn said something that I think is true. That in the last two weeks, more has been done
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to bring about peace than in the last three and a half years. What do you think? Here's the Finn.
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In the past two weeks, we've probably had more progress in ending this war than we have in the
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past three and a half years. And I think the fact that we're around this table today is very much
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symbolic in the sense that it's team Europe and team United States helping Ukraine. And the progress
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that we're looking out of this meeting, uh, is about the security guarantees. By the way,
00:23:38.240
I think one of the reasons he was invited is he played golf with Trump and I think they got along.
00:23:42.480
But, um, Trump, you know, Trump has a sense of humor. He's got a cheeky sense of humor. Uh,
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if you ever watch his long speeches at his rallies, they're, they're almost like a kind of standup
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routine. He has his scripted serious stuff, but then he loves to riff. I mean, he's, he's got a
00:23:58.560
cheeky sense of humor. And there was one point when Trump sort of chided Vladimir Zelensky about
00:24:05.280
not having elections. Look at Trump make sort of an, a wry joke about that. Take a look.
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So you say during, during the war, you can't have elections. So let me just say three and a half
00:24:16.080
years from now. So you mean, if we happen to be in a war with somebody, no more elections.
00:24:32.240
I hope we have a good meeting. And if we can have a good meeting, I'll set up a meeting with
00:24:36.240
President Putin. And, uh, if you'd like, I'll go to that meeting. Not that I would want to do that,
00:24:42.720
but I will do that because we want to save a lot of people from dying. A lot of people dying,
00:24:48.240
we're going to save them. You know, Trump is the only one who could make this happen.
00:24:51.360
He didn't even bother calling Mark Carney. I think Mark Carney, uh, is deliberately trying to antagonize
00:24:58.560
Trump. He obviously ran an anti-Trump campaign. His proxy Doug Ford insults Trump all the time.
00:25:04.400
He does things that seem like they want to sabotage Canada U S negotiations, like right in the middle
00:25:10.000
of a negotiation, putting a huge digital services tax on U S companies or right in the middle of a
00:25:15.520
negotiation, um, where Trump is at the same time trying to negotiate peace with Hamas, uh, saying
00:25:21.840
he's going to support a Palestinian state. Like it's if, if you can get over the disbelief of even saying it,
00:25:29.760
all of these things would make sense if Mark Carney wanted to destroy the relationship with the United
00:25:36.080
States. I'm not convinced of that yet, but if you believe that Mark Carney is trying to disrupt
00:25:43.520
our relationship with the United States, then all of a sudden everything he's doing makes a lot more
00:25:48.720
sense. I don't know. I would have hoped that Canada would have been in that room sitting where that
00:25:54.480
Finn was sitting. I think Vladimir Putin wants things to end. I think basically he wants to keep
00:26:00.800
the land he has conquered in Ukraine and he wants to get Ukraine demilitarized to make sure it never
00:26:07.760
enters NATO. And that those are things he's been talking about as his rationale for invading. Well,
00:26:13.680
really since the beginning, Zelensky has been fighting so hard for so long. I don't think he wants
00:26:19.360
to give up the fight because he was so committed to it. And then, and many of his backers do too.
00:26:24.080
But I sense that even his European allies who were all there realized this is probably
00:26:30.240
the only off ramp. And what I mean by that is if this doesn't get done, I don't think Donald Trump
00:26:37.360
is going to invest his time, prestige, political capital on it anymore. I think he's going to walk away
00:26:43.600
and let the Europeans have it and let Zelensky fail on his own without American support. You know,
00:26:49.920
I used to watch a lot more of Professor John Mearsheimer from the University of Chicago.
00:26:57.280
He always predicted a terrible outcome in this war because Russia outnumbers Ukraine in population,
00:27:05.360
in artillery, in military, in so many ways. And it was just the grinding, almost World War I-style
00:27:12.720
trench warfare with drones. Here's Mearsheimer predicting what would happen in time where
00:27:20.960
Ukraine would be whittled down to what he would call a rump state. It would be constantly destabilized
00:27:25.840
by Russia and depopulated and made so it could never join NATO. Here's a clip of that.
00:27:32.560
Let me make two points on this. First of all, the phrase is sometimes used to describe the situation
00:27:39.200
in Ukraine that it is in a demographic death spiral. Just think about those words. It's in
00:27:47.520
a demographic death spiral. And what this war has done is ended up killing huge numbers of Ukrainians.
00:27:58.160
And furthermore, huge numbers of Ukrainians have left the country. And I would surmise that many of
00:28:04.400
them will not return. So this is a disaster from a demographic point of view. Ukraine is going to
00:28:11.600
end up as a dysfunctional rump state as well. And this is a disaster of great proportions.
00:28:18.640
That's a terrifying outcome, but I cannot see that it's wrong. That is the outcome if Ukraine and Russia
00:28:26.000
can't get a peace deal. And Mearsheimer, by the way, thought it was impossible to get a peace deal
00:28:31.360
because you're arguing over land and it's a zero-sum game. Some business deals are a positive
00:28:37.200
sum game. That is, both sides are winners. But how can you have a winner in this? There's only losers.
00:28:44.000
And if you're fighting over territory, for sure there's only losers. I don't think Trump will stick
00:28:50.640
around if he can't get a deal. I think he's moving very quickly. And I think if we're going to have a
00:28:55.360
deal, we'll have it in the next week. I think Putin will be reasonable enough in Trump's mind. I think
00:29:03.360
Putin will give Trump enough satisfaction that he's compromising enough that Zelensky will be the
00:29:10.960
decider to make or break the deal. But if he breaks it, he's on his own. We'll see. But as that Finnish
00:29:19.280
leader said, this is the best hope yet. Hey, let me play just one last clip. You know I'm interested
00:29:26.320
in the United Kingdom. They have a terrible prime minister, record low in the polls. I just want
00:29:30.560
to show you what he had to say at this meeting. This is Keir Starmer and he was given two minutes
00:29:35.840
to talk today. And tell me if you even understand this word salad. Thank you very much, Mr. President,
00:29:42.240
and thank you for hosting us here. Can I start where Emmanuel started, which is we all want peace.
00:29:49.680
The war in Ukraine has had a huge impact, particularly on the Ukrainians who've borne
00:29:54.240
the brunt of it. But it's also had an impact on Europe and on the United Kingdom. There's not a
00:29:59.840
family or community that hasn't been affected. And when we talk about security, we're talking about
00:30:05.680
security not just of Ukraine. We're talking about the security of Europe and the United Kingdom as well,
00:30:10.640
which is why this is such an important issue. I think this is such an important meeting.
00:30:14.640
As a group, I think we've had a discussion on the phone a number of times, Mr. President,
00:30:18.720
but be able now to be around the table to take it forward. And I really feel that we can, I think,
00:30:25.840
with the right approach this afternoon, make real progress, particularly on the security guarantees.
00:30:31.200
And your indication of security guarantees, some sort of Article 5 style guarantees, fits with what
00:30:36.960
we've been doing with the Coalition of the Willing, which we started some months ago, bringing countries
00:30:41.200
together and showing that we were prepared to step up to the plate when it came to security. With you
00:30:47.440
coming alongside the US, alongside what we've already developed, I think we could take a really important
00:30:53.520
step forward today. A historic step, actually, could come out of this meeting in terms of security
00:30:58.800
for Ukraine and security in Europe. I also feel that we can make real progress towards a just and
00:31:07.680
lasting outcome. Obviously, that has to involve Ukraine. And a trilateral meeting seems the sensible
00:31:14.720
next step. So thank you for being prepared to take that forward. Because I think if we can ensure that
00:31:22.720
that is the progress out of this meeting, both security guarantees and some sort of progress on
00:31:28.080
trilateral meeting of some sort to bring some of the difficult issues to a head, then I think
00:31:36.080
today will be seen as a very important day in recent years in relation to a conflict which has gone on
00:31:41.760
for three and a bit years. And so far, nobody has been able to bring it to this point. So I thank you for that.
00:31:47.520
Yeah, I'm not sure how the Ukraine war has affected every single family in the UK. I just
00:31:52.320
don't think it has, other than they gave billions of pounds to pay for it. I'm not sure if Russia is
00:31:58.000
going to accept British troops as a security guarantee in Ukraine. It seems like NATO soldiers
00:32:06.080
on Russia's borders is the whole reason Russia invaded in the first place. They're trying to remove
00:32:12.080
military threats, if you take them at their word for why they invaded. I don't know if you caught
00:32:18.000
that when Keir Starmer mentioned Article 5. He was talking about the NATO treaty, where an attack on
00:32:24.320
one country is considered an attack on all. It's a mutual defense pact. So he's suggesting that a
00:32:30.560
security guarantee, which Zelensky wants, would have British troops there. And if Russia were to invade
00:32:39.440
Ukraine again, the United Kingdom itself would go to war. I think that's what he was saying there.
00:32:48.400
But mainly, I just think it was Keir Starmer babbling. He's not a decider here and he knows it.
00:32:53.600
It's Trump and Putin and Zelensky can decide if he likes their deal or not. But I think this time it's
00:32:59.040
going to get done because I simply don't think Trump is going to spend, is going to take another crack at
00:33:03.920
it if he doesn't get it done this first time. But could you imagine how rambling and empty Mark
00:33:11.840
Carney would have been? At least Keir Starmer, the Brit, has an army and a navy and an air force to pledge.
00:33:20.080
At least he could say, we're going to do this and that. We're going to move men here and there,
00:33:24.560
even if Russia wouldn't accept that. But what would Mark Carney be able to say? What does Canada's
00:33:31.360
government have other than self-righteousness? Hey, how do you feel about Canada having spent
00:33:39.200
close to $20 billion on this war and not even receiving an invitation to attend? Stay with us for more.
00:33:46.880
I don't think I've done a show about it, but a couple of weeks ago, Donald Trump brought in a
00:34:01.680
new executive order that's going to be incredibly important for conservatives and libertarians
00:34:07.760
and Christians, anyone who has been on the outside of American power for the Biden administration,
00:34:14.240
the Obama administration. I'm talking about an executive order called guaranteeing fair banking
00:34:20.720
for all Americans. In a phrase, it will end political debanking. Debanking is a made up word for when a
00:34:30.720
bank fires you as a customer, not because you've done anything wrong, like say money laundering or
00:34:37.120
something like that, something that actually the bank would not want to have anything to do with you,
00:34:41.200
but for political purposes. In fact, let me read to you from one of the very first paragraphs of this
00:34:47.840
executive order. I'm just going to read a couple of lines. Financial institutions have been engaged in
00:34:54.320
unacceptable practices to restrict law-abiding individuals and businesses access to financial
00:34:59.680
services on the basis of political or religious beliefs or lawful business activities. Some financial
00:35:07.520
institutions participated in government-directed surveillance programs targeting persons participating
00:35:13.520
in activities and causes commonly associated with conservatism. It goes on and gives a few examples,
00:35:20.880
including transactions related to companies like Cabela's, that's a company that sells, you know,
00:35:27.440
fishing gear and firearms, Bass Pro Shop, or who made peer-to-peer payments that involved terms like Trump
00:35:34.880
or MAGA, even though there was no specific evidence tying these individuals to criminal
00:35:39.360
conduct. It's a very meaty executive order, but the crux of it is you can no longer debank someone
00:35:49.280
for breaking these political rules. And not just that, different regulators are now empowered to
00:35:56.000
investigate cases including, quote, past or current, formal or informal policies or practices that require,
00:36:05.520
encourage, or otherwise influence such financial institutions to engage in politicized or unlawful
00:36:13.040
debanking. And by the way, it has teeth too. They can be subject to court orders, huge fines. The reason I
00:36:22.960
bring this to your attention is that the United States isn't just passing executive orders for itself.
00:36:31.120
Other banks do business in the United States, including Canadian banks. You might recall a couple
00:36:37.120
of years ago, Rebel News tried to get a mortgage to buy an office in Calgary. And the local mortgage
00:36:43.360
officers at the Royal Bank were fans of Rebel News. They said, absolutely. They gave us a green light.
00:36:49.120
They even offered us a line of credit we didn't even ask for. But later, they told us it was their
00:36:54.800
head office in Toronto that spiked the deal for, quote, reputational reasons. Now, there's no law
00:37:02.400
against debanking in Canada. In fact, it's sort of the opposite, isn't it? You might recall that during
00:37:07.840
the trucker convoy, without any legal basis, the federal government simply gave a list of names to the
00:37:15.440
banks and demanded that they seize or freeze family bank accounts. If there was a husband
00:37:21.760
that was in a truck and had a joint account with the wife while missus is out shopping for groceries,
00:37:27.920
suddenly none of her cards work. It was an abuse of debanking, no checks and balances whatsoever.
00:37:33.760
And frankly, it was one of the main reasons why the federal court of Canada ruled that the
00:37:39.040
emergencies act was illegal and unconstitutional. Debanking was what did it. Now, Canada still has
00:37:46.640
debanking as my own story proves to you. But now that the U.S. is banning it and punishing such banks,
00:37:53.840
I got a question for you. Will that apply to Canadian banks that operate in the States?
00:38:00.960
For example, one of the largest Canadian banks called TD Canada Trust has a big presence in the
00:38:07.040
U.S. They just call themselves TD down there. They were engaged in massive money laundering,
00:38:12.800
hundreds of millions of dollars. That's fine up here in Canada, you see our regulators turn a blind
00:38:18.640
eye to that. But they were caught in the States, had to pay a $3 billion fine, and it resulted in the
00:38:24.400
shuffle of senior management. My point is that it took American regulators to whip a Canadian bank into
00:38:31.280
shape. Will that happen here? Will Canadian banks that do business in the States now have to stop
00:38:38.400
their debanking if they wish to continue to operate down there? And the reason I tell you all of this
00:38:45.600
is because we have just learned of a case of a Canadian Christian organization that has been debanked
00:38:52.800
and was not given any explanation. Well, that explains it in itself, doesn't it? I'm talking about
00:38:58.720
the Association for Reformed Political Action Canada and their Executive Director, Mike Shoten,
00:39:04.400
joins us now via Skype. Mike, great to see you. Thanks for coming on the show today.
00:39:11.120
Now, first of all, tell our viewers a little bit about the Association for Reformed
00:39:15.920
Political Action Canada. I don't think your name really gives away what you do. Are you the kind of
00:39:23.360
group that I listed there that would be picked on like this? Do you have a religious or a political
00:39:29.360
angle that might cause someone to try and de-platform you? Yeah, we're a Christian political
00:39:35.520
advocacy organization. So, ARPA Canada, the Association for Reformed Political Action, has a
00:39:40.080
mission to educate, equip, and encourage reformed Christians and Christians at large across the country
00:39:46.240
to political action. And we also take a biblical perspective directly to our civil authorities. So,
00:39:51.360
that's to the courts and to the legislatures across the country. We've been doing that work since 2007,
00:39:58.640
and we've had a relationship with financial institutions in Canada since that time as well.
00:40:04.720
Well, I tell you right there, I've heard all I need to hear. I mean, remember, this is the Canadian
00:40:08.960
government that a few years ago, if you wanted a student to sign up for the student summer student
00:40:16.000
program where you get a grant to hire summer students, you had to sign an attestation to agree
00:40:23.040
with Justin Trudeau on matters like abortion. You literally had to swear to support Justin Trudeau's
00:40:29.280
views on that issue, or you would not get any student funding. Just absolutely political bullying.
00:40:38.320
So, I'm not surprised that you found yourself debanked. Tell me a little bit about it. What was
00:40:43.920
the bank? What did you use that bank account for? Were you doing anything unusual? Tell us about the
00:40:51.200
banking you did and how it came to be that they decided to fire you and deplatform you as a customer.
00:40:58.160
Yeah, certainly. So, we have a relationship with a few financial institutions here in Canada,
00:41:04.880
with this particular institution, Canadian Western Bank. We've been with them since 2008. And yet,
00:41:10.080
for the most part, they are the institution whereby we had a relationship through with all our monthly
00:41:15.920
donors. So, the stable revenue that was coming in to support our organization was coming into that
00:41:22.000
financial institution every month, and we never had a problem. We had a very good,
00:41:26.400
healthy relationship with that bank. And then, somewhat out of the blue, on July 30th,
00:41:33.120
we received a letter regarding account closure. And I initially thought this had something to do
00:41:38.720
with their merger, which had been announced earlier this year with National Bank of Canada.
00:41:43.840
But certainly, it didn't. When I looked at the letter, it said, we have reviewed your accounts and
00:41:49.600
decided it's closing as of August 30th. Since that time, we try to reach out on numerous occasions to
00:41:56.240
both our representatives at the local branch, as well as to their complaints handling office,
00:42:02.080
and only received one piece of communication back. And that was last week. And it simply said,
00:42:07.840
we are giving you a two-week extension to September 15th. And that's the only extension. You have to be
00:42:13.760
out of our institution. By that time, we're closing your entire account down. So, that's the communication
00:42:20.000
we received from them. Now, as I said, the National Bank of Canada has merged with Canadian Western. And
00:42:29.040
again, quite surprisingly, I received a phone call from a Vice President of Commercial Banking with the
00:42:35.280
National Bank of Canada on Friday afternoon, just this past Friday afternoon. And he was apologetic. And he
00:42:41.680
said, look, it's come to my attention that this happened. It shouldn't have happened. What can we do
00:42:46.400
to make this relationship right? Well, as your viewers can probably anticipate, you know, when you
00:42:52.880
receive a letter like that, you have to immediately scramble to find a new institution. So, we are in the
00:42:58.160
process of doing that. And that's going well. So, I asked him for, in writing, if he could say, you know,
00:43:04.880
what he said on the phone to me, put it in writing and email it to me. And he did. And he referenced the fact
00:43:10.240
that they had to take what he called this precautionary action because of something they
00:43:15.360
had noticed with our account. So, I have since communicated back to him and said,
00:43:20.240
this is not very precautionary when you send us this type of notice. And the account closure is
00:43:25.120
imminent as of a specific date, causing all this frantic activity on our side to try to find a new
00:43:30.320
institution. Yeah. Mike, that's just called lying. I mean, if there was actually something you were
00:43:36.240
worried about, they would bring it to your attention. They would try and fix it. They would
00:43:39.760
disclose what you had allegedly done. They would say what rule your actions had allegedly broken.
00:43:46.560
I've been through this rodeo before with the Royal Bank. They are bigoted against Christians,
00:43:52.080
and I don't think that that's hard to realize. I mean, I note that when Chrystia Freeland demanded
00:43:58.080
that the banks freeze and seize bank accounts of hundreds of Canadians, not a single one of the banks
00:44:04.480
refused. They all went along with it. They're tantamount to government instruments. They're
00:44:10.160
so highly regulated. Unfortunately, the Charter of Rights does not apply to them because they're not
00:44:16.080
officially government entities, so you don't have the same ability to reach for the Charter. But
00:44:21.520
it's funny that I think, you know, how I started the interview by referencing Trump's executive order
00:44:28.800
from just two weeks ago, not even two weeks ago. What's so interesting is Canadian National Bank has
00:44:36.240
branches in the States, especially in Florida. So does TD Bank. So does Royal Bank. And it wouldn't
00:44:41.600
surprise me if they're going to be taking over Canadian Western Bank. So they're going to be taking
00:44:46.800
over the company that discriminated against you. And by the way, I'm shocked by that because Canadian
00:44:51.600
Western Bank was founded by a pro-Western, pro-freedom, pro-Christian family, the Allard family. I know them a
00:44:58.400
little bit. I don't want to overstate it. But the fact that the Canadian Western Bank was the one that
00:45:04.240
censored and deplatformed you is extremely gross. And I think that Mr. Allard, who founded the bank,
00:45:11.280
would be turning his grave if he knew what was being done to you by the bank he founded. It's sort of
00:45:17.040
weird to me that the National Bank, which is based in Quebec, would be more tolerant. But I don't think
00:45:22.320
they really are. I think they're just afraid. If you say you got this phone call from the National Bank,
00:45:28.240
just a week ago or so, well, Donald Trump's executive order must be ringing in their ears
00:45:33.760
because they have the ability, the US regulators have the ability to investigate any bank and punish
00:45:40.640
them severely. And they proved it by fining TD Bank $3 billion. That's my theory. Mike, I don't think
00:45:47.040
that they suddenly grew a conscience. And I don't think they suddenly started to care about Christians.
00:45:51.920
I think that Donald Trump's executive order is what got them finally walking straight.
00:45:58.720
As an advocacy organization here in Canada, we welcome the input of the international community,
00:46:04.240
certainly. That is impacting our work at numerous levels. And if it does have a positive impact here
00:46:10.720
in regards to our banking situation, then we welcome that. One of the other topics of interest that you and
00:46:17.600
your viewers might want to be aware about is that we actually had a billboard in Hamilton taken down
00:46:23.840
by the city of Hamilton. Mayor Horwath, she instructed that this billboard had to be taken down. And
00:46:32.640
fortunately, in Canada, the charter does apply to governments and it's intended to shield us from
00:46:38.400
government oppression. And in this case, the mayor simply didn't like the message of that billboard,
00:46:43.120
which was very straightforward, factual based advertising website, letkidsbe.ca and calling
00:46:50.720
for the end of medical transitioning for minors in our country. The international community has fed into
00:46:57.360
this campaign in a big way because countries around the world are taking action to protect minors who
00:47:02.480
experience gender dysphoria here in Canada. We're not up with the times yet. So if the international
00:47:08.960
community can impact the policy in regards to how we deal with minors experiencing gender dysphoria,
00:47:14.880
we at ARPA Canada, we welcome that. And we hope that that has a very positive impact on policy here in
00:47:21.280
Canada. As you're indicating in the banking situation, it could have a positive impact on how
00:47:26.480
Christians and people that the banks might not agree with ideologically are treated by them.
00:47:32.880
You know, I'm familiar with the billboard case, and that is a situation that the charter of
00:47:36.960
rights likely does apply to because it's the government that's making the decision.
00:47:41.360
And the charter, of course, is a shield to protect against government bigotry.
00:47:45.840
Now, I think we did a story on the billboards before. Do you guys have legal assistance,
00:47:51.680
either through the Justice Center for Constitutional Freedoms or the Democracy Fund?
00:47:55.440
Do you guys have help to fight against the city? I don't think either of those charities
00:48:00.000
could help you on the banking side, but against the bigoted mayor of Hamilton.
00:48:04.240
Yes, certainly. So we do have in-house legal counsel, and he is pursuing legal action against
00:48:11.520
the city of Hamilton. And we've had numerous offers, including communication with some of
00:48:15.680
those organizations that you mentioned, to assist either in partnering with or as interveners in this
00:48:21.840
case, which we're very confident that we will win. In fact, we have won against the city of Hamilton
00:48:27.600
or any when it came to other advertisements in their city. So we're confident we can win.
00:48:34.080
And it actually, it's simply unfortunate for the residents of Hamilton. The taxpayers of Hamilton
00:48:39.360
are going to have to foot the bill plus pay costs that will be awarded to us.
00:48:43.280
Well, you know, I'm very glad you're lawyered up. And I'm glad that some of those civil liberties,
00:48:50.560
charities that I mentioned, sounds like they've been in touch. And I trust you'll let the world
00:48:56.240
know if you do need help. One of the things we like to do at Rebel News is have petitions that we
00:49:01.680
would, you know, and I bet you we could get 10,000 people to sign a petition and to deliver to the
00:49:05.920
mayor. And of course, if you need help crowdfunding for the lawyer, that's one of the things our
00:49:10.320
viewers like to do too. So keep that in the back here. Keep that, you know, if you do need help,
00:49:17.360
do reach out. Don't be shy about it. You seem very confident and well-versed in things. So I think
00:49:24.960
that's, and if you have in-house counsel, that's probably the best way to go. I'm optimistic. I look
00:49:30.400
forward to following the case because I don't think that mayors of cities should be able to tell
00:49:37.760
you what you can and can't say. I'm also looking forward to seeing what other banks do in response
00:49:44.800
to the Trump executive order. I sort of wish it had been around when the Royal Bank de-platformed
00:49:51.200
us, but hopefully it'll help in the manner I described earlier. What's the best way for us
00:49:55.840
to follow this case and any other work that you're doing? Is there a website out there I can direct
00:50:01.200
people to? Certainly. Yes, it would be for the banking situation and any other work that ARPA Canada
00:50:08.240
does. It's simply arpacanada.ca. And then on the specifics of the billboard and the whole campaign
00:50:15.120
to end medical transitioning for minors, that's the URL is letkidsbe.ca. And it'd be really interesting
00:50:23.680
for your viewers to note as well that we are planning a large rally at Queen's Park on September 27th,
00:50:30.560
Saturday, September 27th at Queen's Park. And the whole purpose of that rally is to put political
00:50:36.720
pressure on Doug Ford and his government to take action to protect minors in that province using
00:50:42.880
the provincial healthcare guidelines in a similar fashion as Danielle Smith has done in the province
00:50:48.320
of Alberta. Well, that's very interesting. Who's going to be speaking at the rally? We have a number of
00:50:55.760
detransitioners. We have some lawyers, some staff from ARPA Canada. And for the more information on
00:51:02.800
that rally and further speakers, simply visit letkidsbe.ca and just click on the link rally in
00:51:08.640
March, September 27th, and all the information is available there. Great. Well, I'm going to talk
00:51:12.720
to my friend David Menzies, who really covers this beat well, and maybe he can go and cover it because
00:51:17.840
I'd like to see how many people you muster. I am pessimistic that the government will respond to you.
00:51:23.360
I think that, you know, really, there's very little difference between the Ontario's so-called
00:51:29.280
conservative government and the opposition. But, you know, you got to hope for the best. Thanks so
00:51:34.000
much for spending some time with us. And keep in touch on these on these issues. And if any more,
00:51:38.960
present. And if we can ever be of assistance, don't be shy to ask. I'll do. Thanks so much for that.
00:51:45.280
All right. Our pleasure. There he is, Mike Shoten of the Association for Reformed
00:51:49.360
Political Action Canada. And I look forward to David's coverage, if you can make it,
00:51:54.480
of the rally on September 27th. Stay with us more ahead.
00:52:08.480
Hey, welcome back. Got a couple of viewer letters. By the way, you can make comments right there on our
00:52:13.200
website if you are a subscriber. And that's often where we take our letters from. Average Gal says,
00:52:18.960
as an Ontarian, I fully support Pierre Polyev. And I fully support Alberta to get the respect they
00:52:23.600
deserve. Let's get Canada back on track and make it prosperous for all. You know, Stephen Harper really
00:52:30.000
made Western separatism fall down because he treated the West with respect. He didn't antagonize it.
00:52:35.760
And that was good enough for happy patriotic Albertans. But I think the problem is that
00:52:41.680
structurally, the system itself was not changed. So all it took was losing an election to a Justin
00:52:47.440
Trudeau and now a Mark Carney. And all those bad things are happening all over again. So I love your
00:52:52.880
point of view and your optimism. But I think one of the complaints in the West is,
00:52:57.360
it's just going to happen again, whether it happens in five, 10 or 20 years. And there's some truth to it.
00:53:02.800
Gray C 1614 says, Trudeau's mentor and advisor was Mark Carney.
00:53:07.120
Carney. Carney's mentor and advisor is Mark Wiseman, the de facto co-prime minister of Canada.
00:53:12.880
I don't think I would go that far. And Mark Wiseman, besides being a kind of lobbyist,
00:53:18.080
is the head of the Century Initiative, this insane idea to pump up Canada through immigration to 100
00:53:24.560
million people, basically to make Canadians a minority within Canada. Now, that is right now,
00:53:32.000
I hate to say it, Mark Carney's policy. I just don't think that that is the Svengali guru here.
00:53:38.400
You might be right, but I haven't seen a lot of proof of that. But yeah, Carney is dangerous on his
00:53:44.000
own. I always say he's like Trudeau, but smarter and harder working and much more networked. Remember,
00:53:50.160
he was a director of the World Economic Forum. He was the boss of the global financial alliance for net
00:53:56.480
zero. He was with the UN like he really, instead of partying and drinking and playing around like
00:54:03.680
Justin Trudeau did, Mark Carney actually was preparing for his moment. And I think that's the
00:54:09.440
danger. That's our show for today. Until tomorrow, on behalf of all of us here at Rebel World Headquarters,
00:54:15.520
to you at home, good night, and keep fighting for freedom.