Rebel News Podcast - EZRA LEVANT ｜ Upholding civil liberties： A longform interview with Lawrence Greenspon

00:00:00.000 You sensorism bug!

00:00:17.620 Well, lawyering is a large part of what we do.

00:00:20.420 I thought when I started Rebel News, it was going to be journalism, journalism, journalism.

00:00:23.900 Yeah, but to do that journalism, you often need a bodyguard called a lawyer.

00:00:28.680 We have physical bodyguards to protect us against physical threats,

00:00:32.080 but what if the threat is a legal threat, censorship, or even an illegal arrest?

00:00:37.080 I've learned a lot about that.

00:00:38.520 Well, I learned a lot about it unwillingly during the lockdowns and the pandemic.

00:00:42.540 And of course, the Democracy Fund has taken, well, 3,000 cases from coast to coast,

00:00:49.180 famous cases like Pastor Arthur Pavlovsky or Tamara Leach.

00:00:52.980 And frankly, 90% of them are severely normal people whose lives were detonated by $5,000 fines

00:01:01.340 for not downloading the Arrive Can app or things like that.

00:01:05.040 But I feel like the tables are turning.

00:01:07.260 The pendulum is swinging back.

00:01:08.820 For me, the key moment, an amazing moment, I was stunned by it.

00:01:11.520 I really didn't think it would happen, was when the Federal Court of Canada issued a ruling

00:01:16.420 that the invocation of the Emergencies Act that Christopher Freeland and Justin Trudeau

00:01:23.200 and David Lomatti did two years ago, that it was illegal.

00:01:26.080 The judge used a lot more words than that.

00:01:28.420 Illegal, unreasonable, unintelligible, and most importantly, unconstitutional.

00:01:35.320 The judge went even further saying not only was the invocation of it illegal,

00:01:39.860 but the way in which it was implemented was illegal too.

00:01:43.040 It was not done with care.

00:01:44.700 It wasn't tailored to be minimally invasive of our rights.

00:01:48.740 It was fascinating to read Judge Mosley walk through the way in which entire families were punished

00:01:55.420 in a case of group punishment because one of them happened to go to the trucker protest.

00:02:01.460 Entire family bank accounts were seized, frozen.

00:02:04.180 Insurance policies were ordered to be destroyed.

00:02:07.080 It was absolutely shocking.

00:02:08.600 And so for the course of the next 20 minutes,

00:02:10.460 I'm delighted to be joined by one of the leading lawyers who fought back during this Civil Liberties Inferno

00:02:16.300 and who is the lead lawyer representing Tamara Leach, the trucker convoy leader.

00:02:22.940 What a pleasure to see you, Lawrence Greenspan.

00:02:25.560 We're on a bit of a break into Tamara Leach's trial. 0.83

00:02:29.560 We have a reporter covering that every single day, Robert Krejcik,

00:02:32.880 who's a really good egg and he's really engrossed in the matter.

00:02:35.620 Yeah, he's doing an excellent job.

00:02:36.800 Well, thank you. But for those who haven't been following, can you give us a summary of Tamara Leach's case?

00:02:42.500 Give us a reminder what she charged with.

00:02:45.580 How is the trial going?

00:02:47.400 It's absurdly long.

00:02:49.020 And what's next?

00:02:50.360 I'm not asking you to say anything that would in any way prejudice the case,

00:02:53.960 but just bring people up to speed who care about Tamara Leach.

00:02:56.680 Essentially, Tamara's charged with six charges. 1.00

00:03:02.160 They are essentially mischief charges in that she encouraged people to come to Ottawa and protest

00:03:12.520 and that this had an impact on the city, whether it was an impact on the citizens in the core of the city

00:03:20.660 or roadways were obstructed for a period of time.

00:03:25.920 This is the essence of the prosecution.

00:03:29.860 The trial, and normally a mischief trial, would take a day or two.

00:03:34.440 We have now spent 34 days in trial and are scheduled to spend some more.

00:03:42.880 We're expecting a decision from Her Honour Justice Perkins McVeigh on an issue which is really,

00:03:50.640 it's a complicated legal issue and we call it a Carter application.

00:03:56.000 And it's whether or not things that Chris Barber said.

00:03:59.900 That's a co-defendant, a co-accused.

00:04:01.720 Whether Chris Barber's, what he said and communicated, can be used against Tamara and vice versa.

00:04:08.340 And we'll have a ruling on that on March 7th.

00:04:11.560 We then go back to court on March the 12th for three days where we will be bringing a motion.

00:04:18.860 The defence will be bringing a motion.

00:04:20.220 And then Her Honour will need to rule on that and all of that before any decision needs to be made

00:04:26.620 as to whether or not the defence will call any evidence.

00:04:30.100 So it's taken an inordinate amount of time.

00:04:34.760 I'm sure we're getting close to the Guinness Book of Records for a length of time of a trial of mischief.

00:04:42.040 But there are some very fundamental freedoms that are at stake here.

00:04:48.320 Freedom of speech and freedom of peaceful assembly.

00:04:51.860 And the evidence so far has established a number of things.

00:04:57.520 That there, one, that there was not just one freedom convoy.

00:05:01.240 There were many freedom convoys.

00:05:03.360 Two, that the police invited and directed the truckers as to where to park,

00:05:10.700 including on Wellington Street and the downtown core of Ottawa.

00:05:14.220 And that, perhaps most importantly, that almost from the beginning,

00:05:21.920 there was a willingness to work with the police to what we call reduce the footprint.

00:05:29.560 In other words, to reduce the impact on the residents in the downtown core

00:05:33.840 by moving the large trucks, which I've since learned you call bobtails,

00:05:40.240 moving those large trucks up to Wellington Street, onto the parkway and out of the residential areas.

00:05:45.920 That was something that the protesters and the evidence has shown that the protesters wanted to do that

00:05:52.220 and were prepared to do that.

00:05:54.580 And, in fact, started doing that and were told by the head of the Ottawa Police Service,

00:06:01.900 the instructions to the police liaison team was not one inch.

00:06:06.380 Don't let them move one inch.

00:06:08.600 And that's all come out in the evidence and I think is very, very favorable for us.

00:06:13.640 One of the interesting parts that has also been established is that there was an agreement made between Tamera Leach

00:06:21.480 and the mayor of Ottawa, Jim Watson, on February the 12th.

00:06:25.560 And pursuant to that agreement, again, the trucks, the big trucks were going to be moved out of the downtown core.

00:06:32.380 It was affecting the residents in that area.

00:06:34.720 They were going to be moved up to Wellington and the parkways.

00:06:37.060 And, in fact, on the morning of the 13th, there were 40 large trucks that were moved pursuant to that agreement.

00:06:44.940 But that, unfortunately, either wasn't communicated to the prime minister or he just chose to ignore it

00:06:52.540 because on the 14th was when he invoked the Emergency Measures Act.

00:06:56.340 I don't think you have to be paranoid or a conspiracy theorist to say,

00:07:01.320 hmm, perhaps Justin Trudeau wanted the feeling of crisis, wanted that January 6th moment in the U.S.

00:07:09.260 that's called an insurrection.

00:07:10.280 And when the truckers started to peacefully move away, he was losing some moral leverage.

00:07:16.040 That's a theory that I've heard a lot of and I believe it, by the way.

00:07:19.200 Well, it's, you know, this was not, like Justin's father, a state of apprehended insurrection.

00:07:26.320 You're talking about the October crisis.

00:07:28.000 The 1970 War Measures Act invocation by Justin's father.

00:07:33.600 This was not that circumstance.

00:07:36.000 This was not a case of, as what Pierre Trudeau referred to as a state of apprehended insurrection.

00:07:41.860 We didn't have cabinet ministers being killed.

00:07:44.800 We didn't have the British High Commissioner being kidnapped.

00:07:47.500 We had none of these things happening.

00:07:49.120 What we had instead were a number of demonstrators demonstrating over a period of three, four weeks peacefully.

00:08:00.480 And how it prompted the Emergency Measures Act was beyond me.

00:08:06.960 And how it was upheld by the Rouleau Commission is even further beyond me.

00:08:11.180 Wow.

00:08:11.400 He was handpicked by Trudeau.

00:08:12.700 That's the answer.

00:08:13.380 Thank goodness for Mr. Justice Mosley.

00:08:17.300 Thank goodness for him and his ruling.

00:08:20.180 You saw the knee-jerk reaction of the government that, oh, yeah, we're going to appeal that.

00:08:26.160 You know, maybe read through it and think about it for a little bit.

00:08:29.040 Like, give it 24 hours.

00:08:30.520 No, there was a knee-jerk reaction there on the part of the government, this to Mosley's decision, which I think is most unfortunate.

00:08:40.420 You know, I don't know the kind of thinking that Court of Appeal judges would have, but reading Mosley's ruling, he basically telegraphs that he was antipathetic towards the truckers.

00:08:53.340 He was sympathetic to those who wanted to hit him hard, but through the trial, he learned about the violations of civil liberties.

00:09:01.660 What I liked him, it actually felt a little bit too chatty and personable to me, but what was interesting is he was saying, look, I actually didn't start off in the side of the truckers, guys, which I thought that was an interesting message that he was telegraphed.

00:09:15.000 Did you pick that up at all, or am I reading things in?

00:09:16.820 No, I think he was being very honest and very forthright, and you often don't see that kind of personal opinion or personal mindset.

00:09:30.840 You don't see that expressed by judges, but Justice Mosley is a former Crown Attorney.

00:09:37.560 He is a longtime federal court judge, very, very experienced, and he was being just very forthright by saying, look, this is how I came into it, and despite that, here's what happened, and here's what shouldn't have happened as a reaction by the government.

00:09:56.900 Let's come back to the Tamera Leach trial.

00:09:58.840 It's one that our viewers care about a lot.

00:10:01.200 We love Tamera Leach.

00:10:02.260 Rebel News published her autobiography, which was a real hit, even though it got zero press coverage and zero reviews by the mainstream media, which surprises me.

00:10:12.060 I mean, the trucker convoy was obviously the biggest story of the year in 2022, obviously.

00:10:17.140 It sparked the Emergencies Act.

00:10:19.900 Tamera Leach was the figurehead of it and the spiritual leader, and I like to say, in so many ways.

00:10:25.680 You would think they would review that book to trash it, to criticize it, even if they didn't review it at all, but it was as if it never happened.

00:10:34.620 I thought that was telling.

00:10:35.640 They didn't want to give her a hearing.

00:10:38.020 They didn't want her to correct the record.

00:10:40.300 That's how I felt.

00:10:40.900 Hey, that's a little aside there.

00:10:43.020 You read the book.

00:10:44.400 I learned things from it that I didn't know about her.

00:10:48.580 I didn't know how, for example, the media tried to denigrate her Métis nature, tried to claim she wasn't.

00:10:56.200 Aboriginal. 0.99

00:10:56.800 That's a really weird attack to do.

00:10:58.880 That's a very personal attack.

00:11:00.320 Was there anything about the book that you found interesting?

00:11:02.740 I read the book with great interest.

00:11:06.320 It gave me a real insight as to who she is and, more importantly, why she is, why she's fighting, why she doesn't even own a truck. 1.00

00:11:18.860 What was she doing trying to assist the various demonstrators by getting them, you know, provisions so that they could carry out their peaceful protest? 1.00

00:11:34.860 What, you know, how did she come to that point?

00:11:37.900 It's an insightful look into how a very ordinary person can be thrust into a position where they can actually try and make a difference.

00:11:54.360 And what happens to them when they try and make a difference is really a sad, it's a sad comment on where we've come.

00:12:02.720 I mean, she's already spent 50 days in jail for what is essentially a mischief charge. 0.95

00:12:09.500 Yeah, the people downtown were subject to horns blowing all kinds of, but there was an injunction within seven days that stopped that.

00:12:24.160 And the evidence has come out in our trial that it stopped after seven days.

00:12:29.320 So, so why, why, why go after somebody like Tamara or Chris Barber, for that matter, in this way and to this extent?

00:12:40.120 It really, it saddens me to try and think of the motivation behind this prosecution.

00:12:46.440 You know, just one more quick comment on Tamara's personality. 1.00

00:12:49.700 I learned a lot about her too.

00:12:50.920 God forbid, and may it never happen, that I'm sentenced to, that I'm put in jail for 50 days pre-trial.

00:12:57.880 And, and the way she described what those conditions were like.

00:13:01.340 And then the trial being dragged out in the manner it has, the process is the punishment.

00:13:06.480 I almost feel like the prosecutors know it's a loser, but they're turning the trial into the sentence.

00:13:13.560 I, she hasn't gotten bitter.

00:13:17.020 In fact, if anything, she's nicer.

00:13:18.440 I literally don't know how that has happened.

00:13:21.320 And that's an amazing part of the story.

00:13:24.000 Don't mind me.

00:13:24.620 That's a little editorial comment, but I want to come back to the length.

00:13:27.360 Oh, go ahead.

00:13:27.740 You have something to say.

00:13:28.760 You know, on that, I, I, years ago, I had the, the opportunity to become friends with Ruben Hurricane Carter.

00:13:35.900 And at one point, one point he was staying downstairs in our house and we had Joyce Milgaard on the, on the upper level.

00:13:43.460 We were running a house for the wrongfully convicted.

00:13:47.440 Um, but the thing that impressed me the most about Ruben was just that here's a man who spent 18 years in custody for a murder he didn't commit.

00:13:56.760 And yet his disposition, his approach to life and his smile, uh, despite all he'd been through was really quite inspirational.

00:14:07.120 And I, I see, uh, you know, I see at least some of that in, in Tamara, you know, uh, she's, I see the way she, she greets, uh, support.

00:14:17.160 She makes time for anyone.

00:14:18.360 Yeah.

00:14:18.800 And it's, it good on her, you know, it's, uh, it's really a strength of character.

00:14:25.240 If folks want to help, by the way, Rebel News crowd funds Tamara's legal defense through the democracy fund.

00:14:31.500 And you can help out at helptamara.com at that same website, you can find her book and do other things too.

00:14:39.360 Um, we're talking a lot about Tamara because I think she's such a consequential person and you're right.

00:14:44.540 She's a severely normal person, an ordinary person without any negative connotations there, who did an extraordinary thing.

00:14:52.680 She rose to the occasion.

00:14:54.500 Um, you mentioned the judge, uh, judge, uh, Perkins McVeigh, the one who's overseeing Tamara Leach's trial. 0.66

00:15:01.460 I seem to recall that she was the same judge who oversaw the wrongful prosecution of vice admiral Mark Norman,

00:15:09.760 the, the senior military official that the PMO really went after.

00:15:14.100 Like it felt very political.

00:15:15.840 And in the end, uh, a document that the crown should have disclosed earlier came to light and the whole case was dropped.

00:15:22.280 And it, and it, they were trying to disgrace a great military man.

00:15:27.140 And in fact, if anything, it vindicated him.

00:15:30.240 And the reason I mentioned that is because I think being, I can only imagine what it must have been like to be the judge in a trial that was so great, had so much gravity.

00:15:39.640 And then you find out that the federal government was a trickster or at least didn't live up to its duty.

00:15:46.280 And I, and part of me thinks, I wonder if the lessons of vice admiral Mark, Mark Norman's trial, if she can see in this prosecution of Tamara Leach shenanigans,

00:15:58.660 turning a two day matter into a 50 day matter over like, this is not a proper apportionment of prosecutorial resources.

00:16:09.400 There's a huge backlog in the courts of serious matters and they're throwing everything at Tamara Leach. 1.00

00:16:15.220 It feels like a second round of a political stitch up.

00:16:19.240 I, you know, I, I can't, uh, comment.

00:16:22.580 I wouldn't even, you know, begin to know what's going through the mind of the, uh, of the trial judge.

00:16:27.320 Uh, she's an experienced trial judge. 0.93

00:16:30.020 Uh, she has, uh, presided over this, uh, with great interest.

00:16:35.940 Um, and if she's had any questions at all at any point along the way, uh, she hasn't been hesitant to, uh, to get involved, uh, to make shame.

00:16:45.660 And, and, and all the way, all the while she's been saying, you know, let's move forward, let's move forward on it.

00:16:51.980 And let's, you know, get back on track.

00:16:54.760 And, uh, it, it's, uh, it's not been an easy, uh, it's not been an easy job for her for sure.

00:17:00.460 I think I sat there for one day and then I said, Robert Krejcik, you take over, I can't take any more of this.

00:17:05.660 The day I sat there was with some city bureaucrat who very early in his testimony said he had never met, spoken with, communicated, or had any observation whatsoever of anything Tamara Leach had done.

00:17:16.700 Um, and now let me talk for eight hours about my feelings about the lockdown and my feelings about the convoy.

00:17:22.600 Like it was, it was a therapy session for a government bureaucrat.

00:17:26.080 It was not a legitimate witness.

00:17:27.620 And, and, and something you said very quickly at the beginning of our conversation, which is actually stunning.

00:17:35.000 You say you haven't decided whether or not to mount a defense as in every single minute of this trial so far has been the prosecution's case.

00:17:42.500 You have not actually made a case yet.

00:17:45.160 You've challenged and you've objected and you've cross-examined, but Tamara Leach has not testified yet.

00:17:50.520 And, and from what I understand, you're saying, she may never testify.

00:17:54.180 There may never be anything.

00:17:55.240 You, you may in the end just stand up and say, judge, nothing here.

00:17:59.120 We have nothing to say.

00:18:00.380 I call you to make a ruling at this moment.

00:18:03.300 That's possible.

00:18:04.420 Certainly possible.

00:18:06.040 Uh, to, to this point, uh, the only evidence, uh, for the defense has come through cross-examination of the crown's witnesses.

00:18:15.940 It's incredible.

00:18:16.980 Listen, you've been very generous with your time.

00:18:18.540 I'd like to broaden the scope just a little bit.

00:18:21.160 I, um, it's, it's a slightly political question, but it's also a legal question.

00:18:26.900 It's a public sphere question, but I think, I think you straddle those things.

00:18:30.200 I mean, even just mentioning the Milgard case and the Rubin Hurricane Carter case, these are political cases that touch on public policy.

00:18:37.720 It's not just criminal law and the law seeps into everything.

00:18:41.380 I think, I think it's good to know the law, even as a layman, to study the law, even as an amateur layman, um, because it affects everything we do.

00:18:48.900 And it's my view that whatever you thought of the vaccine, put that aside.

00:18:54.760 For a period of time, our entire system failed.

00:19:00.240 The opposition parties didn't really oppose.

00:19:02.760 The media ceased being skeptical and critical and in many ways became hired propagandists.

00:19:07.560 And I don't say that as an insult, they say this as an observation.

00:19:09.860 They took funds, both from Pfizer and from the government.

00:19:14.000 Uh, university professors who normally are canaries in the coal mine for violated rights, they never stopped writing letters for Omar Khadr, were silent when we had charter violations en masse.

00:19:26.720 Doctors, doctors at the College of Physicians and Surgeons, silenced doctors who had a second opinion.

00:19:34.520 The checks and balances broke.

00:19:37.680 And, and we hurtled at shocking speed down the road to authoritarianism.

00:19:43.780 And in three short years, we, we lurched back to some of the, I, I'm going to say totalitarian.

00:19:52.660 When someone says, I have the right to know who's in your house.

00:19:55.860 I have the right to tell you how many people can come to your place for Christmas dinner.

00:19:59.720 I have the right to tell me who can come to your wedding and your funeral.

00:20:03.300 I can shut down a church, but keep Costco open across the street.

00:20:06.820 I feel like our country shed a century's worth of civil liberties gains in three years.

00:20:17.220 And you know who else was silent?

00:20:19.880 The Canadian Civil Liberties Association, which hit the snooze button for three years.

00:20:23.520 And all the civil liberties champions, where were they?

00:20:26.480 You're one of those few civil liberties champions who stood up.

00:20:29.100 So I, I say that we lost ground medically, we lost ground economically, but the biggest

00:20:37.900 ground we lost was in terms of our civil liberties, we were set back a generation.

00:20:43.020 What do you think?

00:20:45.760 Two things.

00:20:47.940 One, most Canadians don't appreciate that our constitutional rights, our charter rights,

00:20:57.120 our fundamental freedoms.

00:20:59.080 I've only been protected since 1981.

00:21:03.120 Diefenbaker Bill of Rights was a paper tiger and people know that.

00:21:07.380 It's only since 1981 that we have a constitutional protection of civil liberties, fundamental freedoms.

00:21:15.340 Look at the way our constitution starts.

00:21:20.180 It starts with, it doesn't start with, we hold these truths to be self-evident.

00:21:25.540 That's in the United States.

00:21:27.680 That's clear statement.

00:21:29.120 We hold these truths to be self-evident.

00:21:31.320 It's so clear that these are fundamental freedoms that it's self-evident.

00:21:36.460 Canada, on the other hand, starts with,

00:21:39.480 all rights and freedoms contained in our charter of rights and freedoms are subject to such reasonable

00:21:44.040 limits as can be demonstrably justified in a free and democratic society.

00:21:48.460 What an opening.

00:21:50.220 What a piss poor opening.

00:21:52.560 We're going to give you some rights.

00:21:55.020 But before we do that, you've got to realize every one of them is limited.

00:21:59.400 The other Canadian constitutional mindset that we are burdened with is,

00:22:06.780 and this goes back to the Diefenbaker Bill of Rights,

00:22:09.640 is the importance of peace, order, and good government.

00:22:14.280 We in Canada, for the most part, cherish peace, order, and good government.

00:22:19.520 So when you have a situation where people are peacefully demonstrating,

00:22:25.000 but they're staying there too long,

00:22:27.600 or why don't they go and demonstrate across the street where it won't be as much of an annoyance to us,

00:22:33.980 it's a psyche.

00:22:36.000 And the government was able to take advantage of that psyche with surprising and disappointing ease during COVID.

00:22:49.240 It's the average Canadian will think so-and-so is charged.

00:22:54.300 They will assume guilt as opposed to the United States where you have the former president running for president again,

00:23:00.960 and he's charged in, I've lost count how many jurisdictions.

00:23:04.440 Presumption of innocence is real, if anything, to the other extreme in the United States.

00:23:09.280 In Canada, the presumption of innocence is worth nothing.

00:23:12.620 People charged in Canada with a sexual assault, it's over.

00:23:16.960 It's over.

00:23:18.080 Their lives, their reputation, it's over.

00:23:20.340 Because presumption of innocence, practical sense, doesn't exist in our country.

00:23:25.340 So all that to say that when the government brought in all of these COVID mandates

00:23:30.760 and the various regulations and rules, there wasn't a peep.

00:23:35.220 Hardly a peep.

00:23:36.920 Almost in the Martin Niemöller type of, you know,

00:23:41.560 first they came for the trade unionists,

00:23:43.740 that type of thinking.

00:23:46.360 And nobody, nobody, hardly anyone stood up and said,

00:23:51.860 wait a second, you know, what I do in my home

00:23:54.980 and what I do at my daughter's wedding or my mom's funeral,

00:23:59.840 that's my business, not yours.

00:24:04.060 It's, I don't know if we've gone back a generation

00:24:07.220 or we've just exposed what is very much an unfortunate Canadian psyche

00:24:12.360 when it comes to Canadian civil liberties.

00:24:14.220 I think there's some truth to them.

00:24:16.360 Well, I'm glad you're representing Tamera Leach.

00:24:21.880 And I look forward to the result there.

00:24:26.600 It's very dangerous to allow yourself to be hopeful,

00:24:29.880 but you have to be.

00:24:30.900 I mean, you have to.

00:24:32.660 I think that we're, the pendulum is swinging back

00:24:37.500 and I think hope is being redeemed.

00:24:39.120 And I think, God willing, she's acquitted.

00:24:41.980 That will vindicate not only her personally,

00:24:44.100 but it will vindicate the peaceful protest

00:24:46.740 that she was the moral leader of.

00:24:49.360 And I'm very hopeful from what I've seen personally of the case

00:24:52.640 and from what I've seen through our journalists.

00:24:54.440 Can you, can you leave me with something hopeful?

00:24:59.160 Is there something, whether or not it's in Canada

00:25:00.980 or the United States or around the world?

00:25:03.280 I used to look at the democracy protests in Hong Kong

00:25:05.980 about five years ago.

00:25:07.780 I said, those guys won't give up their freedom easily.

00:25:11.320 And they didn't give it up easily.

00:25:12.400 They were just unarmed.

00:25:13.820 And China rolled in and it was over. 0.97

00:25:16.380 Is there anything around the world,

00:25:17.820 whether it's in Canada, the States or a foreign country,

00:25:20.920 that you say, those guys get it.

00:25:22.640 That's proof that freedom's on the march.

00:25:24.480 Is there any hope out there?

00:25:27.240 Oh, there's, I mean, I go to work every day

00:25:30.580 with the hope that, a very basic hope,

00:25:35.020 which is that where a person's rights and freedoms

00:25:38.520 have been violated, thank goodness in Canada,

00:25:41.540 we have a constitutional mechanism

00:25:43.480 to try and deal with it.

00:25:45.500 Now, in many instances, it's not affordable.

00:25:50.220 It's not, doesn't make good economic sense.

00:25:54.020 That is unfortunately part of it,

00:25:56.560 but at least there is a constitutional mechanism

00:25:58.720 under section 24 of the charter

00:26:00.420 where a person's rights have been violated

00:26:03.340 or denied or infringed.

00:26:04.960 There is the ability for the appropriate court

00:26:08.380 to afford a remedy,

00:26:09.380 which is appropriate and just in the circumstances.

00:26:11.520 They don't have that provision in England.

00:26:15.000 They have a similar provision in the United States

00:26:19.000 and much of our language in our constitution

00:26:21.280 has come from the United States.

00:26:22.880 But that ability to weigh

00:26:25.000 what's an appropriate and just remedy

00:26:27.320 in the hands of judges

00:26:28.860 who I have had just four decades of experience

00:26:33.600 and judges that I trust.

00:26:35.820 I'd much prefer to have them doing the weighing

00:26:38.240 of what's an appropriate and just remedy

00:26:39.940 than the people who are running for political office.

00:26:43.280 And that's where the problem was

00:26:45.020 that the people making the decision

00:26:47.260 regarding vaccinations were in political office.

00:26:50.200 They were not our judges

00:26:52.660 who are independent

00:26:55.120 and open to affording a remedy

00:26:58.240 that's appropriate in justice circumstances.

00:26:59.740 So I still continue,

00:27:02.500 despite all that I've said,

00:27:03.980 to have great confidence

00:27:05.960 in the Canadian constitutional system

00:27:07.900 and just keep trying to make it better

00:27:12.640 on a case-by-case basis.

00:27:15.580 All right, well, we'll leave it there.

00:27:17.040 Lawrence Greenspan,

00:27:17.880 the great civil liberties lawyer

00:27:19.020 who is the lead lawyer

00:27:20.880 defending Tamara Leach 1.00

00:27:22.480 to learn more about her case, of course,

00:27:25.100 go to helptamara.com.

00:27:27.120 That's the show for today.

00:27:28.560 Until tomorrow,

00:27:29.420 on behalf of all of us at Rebel,

00:27:31.960 around the world,

00:27:32.980 and at your home,

00:27:34.240 good night,

00:27:35.280 and keep fighting for freedom.

00:27:36.860 Keep fighting for freedom!

00:27:39.900 Shame on you, 0.92

00:27:40.840 you censorious bug! 0.97

00:27:52.480 you censorian, 0.68

00:27:54.000 you censor huestye, 0.96

00:27:54.660 you censor huestye, 0.96

00:27:55.600 you censor huesty boy. 0.74

00:27:57.060 You censor huestye, 1.00

00:27:57.560 you censor huyestye, 0.89

00:27:58.000 and every other time,

00:27:59.260 be 이 miranda,

00:27:59.700 and keep fighting for freedom.

00:28:02.880 You censor huyesty,

00:28:04.200 you censor huyestye, 0.89

00:28:05.280 you censor huyestye, 0.89

00:28:05.660 you censor huyestye, 0.89

00:28:05.980 you censor huyestye, 0.89

00:28:06.680 you censor huyestye, 0.89

00:28:07.260 you censor huyestye, 0.89

00:28:07.780 you censor huyestye, 0.89

00:28:08.300 you censor huyestye, 0.89

00:28:09.320 you censor huyestye, 0.89

00:28:09.480 you censor huyestye, 0.89

00:28:10.720 you censor huyestye, 0.89

00:28:14.180 you censor huyestye, 0.89

00:28:17.600 you censor huyestye, 0.89

Rebel News Podcast - February 20, 2024

EZRA LEVANT ｜ Upholding civil liberties： A longform interview with Lawrence Greenspon

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