Rebel News Podcast - EZRA LEVANT ｜ Why we're doing politics differently： an interview with Maxime Bernier

00:00:00.000 Hello, my Rebels. Tonight, a feature interview with Maxime Bernier, the leader of the People's

00:00:04.420 Party of Canada. What are his plans for 2023? But before I get to that, let me invite you to

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00:00:31.200 helping to keep us strong. All right, here's today's podcast.

00:00:40.220 Tonight, a feature conversation with the leader of the People's Party of Canada, Maxime Bernier.

00:00:53.720 It's January 11th, and this is the Ezra LeVant Show.

00:01:00.680 Well, you've heard me say it, that the pandemic and the lockdowns and the vaccine mandates was a

00:01:18.380 total failure of the Democratic checks and balances. I said, every part of the system failed.

00:01:23.660 The media failed. The colleges of physicians and surgeons failed. The popular culture failed. The

00:01:30.180 law schools and law professors and the courts failed. Our charter of rights failed. And I also said

00:01:36.020 that our parliaments failed. Not only did all the parties act in lockstep, but the opposition parties

00:01:41.880 did not oppose. The conservatives were not very conservative, now were they? But there was

00:01:47.140 one politician throughout who knew that freedom was at stake. And he was there on the streets protesting

00:01:53.260 for freedom. I believe he has been vindicated. And what a pleasure it is to have a very special

00:01:57.900 episode today with that man, Maxime Bernier, the leader of the People's Party. Great to see you again.

00:02:02.600 Thank you, Ezra. I'm very pleased to be with you.

00:02:04.460 Well, 2023 is an exciting year. It's a promising year. And I'm hoping that it'll be better than 2022,

00:02:11.360 which started off as one of the darkest years in our country's history. I mean, they literally brought

00:02:16.120 in a kind of martial law. They were seizing bank accounts of political opponents. They were deploying

00:02:21.680 riot police on horses. The year started terribly, but it ended. Well, the trucker convoy, I think,

00:02:31.060 freed us all. And you were there, weren't you? Yes, I was there. You know, when we created the

00:02:35.920 People's Party of Canada, we based on party on four principles. One of them is individual freedom

00:02:43.120 and personal responsibility. So when that happened in the beginning of that pandemic, in March, April 2020,

00:02:51.740 I was there and I said at that time, we must reopen the economy. We must protect the most vulnerable

00:02:58.500 in our society, like the Great Burlington Decoration. And I was against the vaccine passport, vaccine 0.56

00:03:06.640 mandates. And I did, yes, some rallies across the country. And I believe that we were able,

00:03:12.880 we, the freedom fighters and Canadians across the country, to build a momentum. And that's why when

00:03:20.520 the Trudeau government decided to say to the truckers that they were not essential workers anymore,

00:03:27.940 and they will have to have the shots to be able to work. That was too much. And with that momentum

00:03:35.040 that we built together, that freedom convoy happened. And it was great. For me, it was not a protest.

00:03:42.860 It was a kind of a celebration of our freedoms. And I was there. It was cold, but it was fun. And you're

00:03:52.040 right. After that, the mandates in Saskatchewan, Alberta, you know, these establishment politicians

00:04:00.000 decided to lift these mandates. And I think that was a very important point in our history,

00:04:06.640 that freedom convoy. Yeah. Now, you were actually arrested during the lockdowns. You were campaigning,

00:04:13.920 I think it was in Manitoba. Manitoba, yeah. And if I'm not mistaken, the premier actually said,

00:04:18.580 if you come here, you'll be lighter in your wallet or something. Like, it was, it was so bizarre to

00:04:23.020 have politicians essentially directing the police to arrest rival politicians. And they did it.

00:04:29.060 And that's shocking to begin with. But the absolute delight and agreement by the other political

00:04:37.880 parties and by the media was the scary part for me. It's, it's scary enough that the police were

00:04:43.680 enforcers. But by that time, they had been enforcing a lot of crazy rules. Yeah. But for a politician to

00:04:49.540 essentially order you to be arrested. Yeah. And then everyone say, yeah, we agree. Yeah. That's the

00:04:56.260 scary part. They said, we agree or didn't say anything. Right. And then you were, I believe,

00:05:03.580 if I remember that the only one in Canada that decided to speak about it and with Tucker Carlson.

00:05:11.860 But yes, I was doing a tour across the country. And when I came to Manitoba, the premier said,

00:05:18.740 I don't want you here. You're not vaccinated. You're not welcome. And if you come, you know,

00:05:23.600 we, we, he said something about, we will empty your wallet or something like that. And it was

00:05:31.500 political repression. I was arrested and cuffed and put in jail for a non-crime after a political

00:05:37.820 gathering in a park, fighting for freedom of choice. And so, but we didn't have, like you said

00:05:45.720 in the beginning, we didn't have any real opposition against these mandates at the provincial and at the

00:05:51.860 federal level. Not one party. There was one or two rogue MPPs. Like in Ontario, you had Randy Hillier

00:05:59.400 and a few others, Roman Baber, but they were very quickly kicked out of their party, even kicked out

00:06:04.740 of conservative parties. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. For me, and I know that now, you know, the conservative

00:06:09.920 didn't do or they're not doing what is right for the country, but what is popular. And at that time,

00:06:19.060 it was not popular to speak against these mandates and they're doing poll and focus group. And because

00:06:26.900 of that propaganda and coming from the government, uh, uh, and all the mainstream media that were,

00:06:35.040 uh, were buying that narrative, uh, uh, for, uh, for, for mandates and things like that,

00:06:44.780 it was not popular. So the conservative party of Canada didn't say anything. And, uh, and that's why

00:06:50.880 I'm always saying we are doing politics differently. Uh, if it's popular or not, if it's politically

00:06:56.720 correct or not, it's not important for us. What is the most important? We have ideas. We are speaking

00:07:02.460 about these ideas and we believe that the more we speak about it, the more popular it will,

00:07:06.700 it will be. Yeah. I remember when Ron DeSantis of Florida really planted his flag and the media

00:07:13.940 reaction and the opposition reaction to him was hysterical and loud and extreme. And I thought if

00:07:21.160 he can just hold it just for a few days and not wither, not bend the knee, he'll be fine. And he stuck

00:07:29.780 it out. And not only was he fine, he became a role model and he became living proof. And then he went

00:07:36.880 on to become a reelected just a few months ago. With a huge majority, the largest majority of any

00:07:42.860 Republican in Florida history, almost 20%. And he did well amongst the Latino population, which is not 1.00

00:07:48.060 normal for Republicans. And I just think that that is what leadership is supposed to be. And I wish that

00:07:54.480 a conservative MP or the conservative leader at the time, Aaron O'Toole, who wasn't very conservative,

00:07:59.060 would have said, you know, this is the most important moment we've had in decades in Canada

00:08:05.540 and I'm actually going to lead. I think other people would have come, rallied around. I think

00:08:11.580 some academics would have had courage. Some pundits would have had courage. Other, maybe even some

00:08:16.700 liberals would have said, yeah, you know, there's something to it. But it was the forced unanimity

00:08:21.840 that was so awful. Not a single person stood up to the hurricane within the system. You were sort of

00:08:28.480 outside the system because you didn't have a seat. No one who had a seat stood up other than a few

00:08:33.180 in Ontario who were kicked out. Yeah. But, you know, we, the People's Party, were and are the only

00:08:40.140 political party that spoken against that. And for dissentists, dissentists is a proof that when you

00:08:48.200 have principles and you stick to your principles, you will win and you can win. And, you know, the

00:08:55.640 conservative didn't have any principles and didn't have any strong conviction. So that was very

00:09:02.880 disappointing. And that's why, Ezra, in 2019, I said when I left the party, this party is morally

00:09:10.140 and intellectually corrupt because they're only conservatives in name. And that's it.

00:09:16.620 You know, I, it's interesting that the first two political casualties of the trucker convoy

00:09:22.240 were not liberals, but were rather Aaron O'Toole and Jason Kenney, who obviously were not being

00:09:28.320 true to their principles. So we've talked about 2022 and I know you've talked about a lot and it

00:09:33.820 really was Rebel News' time to shine. We covered that story in a manner that we had sort of been

00:09:41.000 practicing for. We didn't know it, but for the first five years of our life, we were practicing

00:09:45.640 being contrarian, practicing being citizen journalists. But it's 2023 now. The lockdowns

00:09:53.480 are pretty much over. There are a few attempts to have a vaccine mandate in some, I think there

00:09:59.660 may be some parts of the Canadian government, I think even in the military, they might still have it.

00:10:04.500 And those are problems. But for 99.9% of Canadians, life has gone back to how it was before. There's no

00:10:13.640 mask laws that I know of. Yes. But also for that, for the courageous Canadians who lost their job.

00:10:23.540 Right. They still have to be back and be fully compensated for that. And that's not the case

00:10:30.640 right now. That's an excellent point. Thank you for bringing that up. And I know the New York Supreme

00:10:33.920 Court, throughout the vaccine mandates, ordered that everyone be rehired. And they specifically said

00:10:41.040 that the rationale for the vaccine mandates that it stopped transmission has been proven to be

00:10:45.500 false. Yes. Yes. So we do have a lot of work to do. Thank you for bringing that up. But what I was

00:10:50.660 really driving at is where do you go now? Where does the People's Party go now? You had your time to

00:11:00.460 shine, your important moment during the crisis. And you personally paid a price. You were arrested and

00:11:07.460 jailed. Yeah. I was in jail for 12 hours. Which is 12 hours more than you should have been in a free

00:11:13.360 country. So it's 2023. What is the animating issue? What are the projects that will take your time and

00:11:23.600 your party's time? What are your plans for 2023? Yeah. If you look at our platform as a political

00:11:29.080 party, you know, we have always the same platform and we won't change that platform. That's why I'm

00:11:35.540 saying we're doing politics differently. I spoke about immigration in 2019. And that was not that

00:11:41.820 popular. I believe that this year in 2023, with the mass immigration, that's real, you know, when we'll 0.91

00:11:49.700 have half a million people in 2025 in our country, when you have 38 million Canadians, that is mass

00:11:58.460 immigration. And, you know, I believe it would be an important issue. And I'm pleased, you know, I was

00:12:04.720 reading in the National Post that some leftists now are saying, you know, what about that number?

00:12:10.780 Half a million people? We must question that. And so I did that in 2019. And I will do it because

00:12:18.380 that is having an impact on housing, on also our social services like health care. So we must have

00:12:27.100 sustainable immigration. And we are the only national political party that is fighting for that. You look

00:12:35.980 at the conservative, the NDP, the Bloc Québécois, the Green, they're all for mass immigration. They don't want 0.96

00:12:41.700 anything because they're doing, pandering, they're pandering to some ethnic communities in our country to

00:12:51.160 have their support. We won't do that. So I believe it would be an important issue this year.

00:12:55.920 Yeah, I mean, for housing, I mean, a lot of those immigrants go to Toronto, Montreal, and to an extent,

00:13:00.800 Montreal, sorry, Toronto, Vancouver, pardon me, and French speaking ones often go to Montreal.

00:13:06.080 Yeah, 42% of them are going to Toronto and Vancouver. So that's why it's putting pressure on the

00:13:12.500 housing market. And actually, Polyev did an interview before Christmas, and he said, no, no,

00:13:18.040 it's not about immigration. It's about supply. No, it's mathematical. It's about immigration.

00:13:26.200 Too many people in a short time like that, that create a crisis for housing. 0.93

00:13:33.440 It's a staggering number. I don't know if there's any other country in the Western world that has

00:13:37.420 that proportion. That would be like, anyway, it's a huge number. What are the other issues?

00:13:43.100 One of the things I'm alive to are censorship of the internet. Trudeau has Bill C11, C18. He had a

00:13:51.880 bill called C36 he might bring back. And then he had a fourth bill called the Online Harms Act that

00:13:57.020 he hasn't introduced yet. If I'm counting right, that's four different proposed laws to censor the

00:14:04.320 internet. It's more than he has on any other subject. And I don't know if that will affect you,

00:14:10.300 but it'll certainly affect us as online journalists. What are your thoughts? Have you looked at the

00:14:16.340 legislation, C11, C18? Do you have thoughts on it?

00:14:19.160 Absolutely. Speaking about censorship, you know, I was a censor on social media last year. On Twitter,

00:14:30.300 I was shadow banned there. Now it's okay with the new owner of Twitter. You know, you can have debates

00:14:37.440 on Twitter. But what they're doing, these radical leftists, they don't want to have any debates.

00:14:47.640 And so the only way to control the population is to censor and doing censorship like they're doing

00:14:56.600 right now, you know, with Jordan Peterson, all these regulatory bodies and authoritarian politicians

00:15:06.260 don't want any debates. And the only way, because we're going to win that debate with arguments,

00:15:12.460 with reason, they don't want that. So they try to censor us. And with that bill, and this bill in

00:15:18.260 Ottawa, that's the case. I'm very worried about that. And we, I'm speaking against that all the time.

00:15:25.400 And everybody must be able to say what they want. You have the right to insult me. We are in a free

00:15:31.860 country. Let's enjoy that. And the best one will win if you have both arguments, the left and the

00:15:40.840 right. And that was not the case during COVID-19. You know, they shadow banned everybody that were not

00:15:48.160 in line with the narrative. And, and these bills are very dangerous for democracy.

00:15:54.620 You know, just like there was silence when you were arrested in, in the lockdowns, there's so much silence

00:16:02.520 about this censorship, because so many of the media are in on it.

00:16:06.300 Oh, yeah.

00:16:06.620 I think that 20 years ago, or even 10 years ago, you would have seen a lot of journalists being

00:16:12.520 against this. But because so many of them are on the government media payroll, because so many news

00:16:18.000 companies take huge handouts from the government, I think they've been tamed. I think they've been

00:16:23.760 colonized. Like I really, I could, there's maybe five voices in the mainstream media against it.

00:16:30.180 There would have been 50 or 500 10 years ago.

00:16:33.880 Yeah. But, you know, I don't call them the mainstream media anymore. They're not mainstream.

00:16:38.560 Maybe the legacy media.

00:16:40.060 Right.

00:16:40.600 And the legacy media.

00:16:41.840 I call them the regime media sometimes, because they're for the regime. I don't know.

00:16:45.460 Should I interrupt you? Go ahead.

00:16:46.800 No, no. But, but yeah, the mainstream media, they're not independent. They're not like you.

00:16:53.060 You have to raise money, Ezra, to, to do your show. I have to raise money to be a national,

00:17:00.180 political party and being able to speak about our ideas. They don't have to do that. They're

00:17:06.160 receiving money from the government and all the advertising and propaganda that the government

00:17:11.120 is giving them, all the money that is, that the government, governments, not only the federal

00:17:15.480 one, provincial governments are giving to them. They're not independent and they want to keep

00:17:21.380 that privilege. And so you're right. They are listening. They're master. These establishment

00:17:28.020 politicians and they are promoting leftist ideology.

00:17:34.000 You mentioned Jordan Peterson. I understand that's why you were in town today. There was

00:17:39.500 a protest in support of him. Talk a little bit about him and you, you've been interviewed

00:17:45.880 by him. Am I right?

00:17:46.840 Yeah, absolutely.

00:17:47.440 What do you think of Jordan Peterson? He's really, he started in Toronto with his own fights,

00:17:51.760 but he's really become a global figure, hasn't he?

00:17:53.720 Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. And, uh, you know, um, at the last, it was at the last election,

00:18:00.060 I did an interview with him and a deep interview about maybe one hour and 15 minutes, something

00:18:06.240 like that. Uh, I really appreciate it. He was asking the, the tough questions and that was

00:18:12.600 important for me to be there and to answer these questions. And, you know, he's a leader. Uh,

00:18:18.680 he has a vision for his country and, you know, uh, he wants to help us Canadians and other people

00:18:26.280 to be successful. And now what is happening to him, you know, they try to silence him. They,

00:18:33.240 they don't want his voice out there because they cannot compete with that, with arguments,

00:18:39.780 with reason. And so, yes, I was here in Toronto this afternoon and we had the rally, uh, in support

00:18:47.900 of Jordan Peterson, but also Ezra in support of all, uh, courageous Canadians that lost their job

00:18:56.340 because of their convictions, because of their ideas. And that is happening right now in Canada,

00:19:04.700 in, in a free country that is supposed to be free. So, uh, I don't like that. It's very dangerous.

00:19:11.720 And, and, you know, uh, I will always dare to support people who promote our charter of rights.

00:19:21.440 It'll be interesting to see if any mainstream or legacy media outlets cover the protest today. We

00:19:27.760 had a rebel news reporter down there, David Benzies, and, uh, I saw some of the footage. It

00:19:32.180 looked exciting. There was lots of police presence. Um, it'll be interesting to see what the CBC or the

00:19:37.060 Globe and Mail says, if they were even there. I, I didn't, I was there. I didn't see them. They

00:19:41.820 don't want to cover, to cover the other side of the story. Like you're doing. Yeah. Like you're

00:19:46.940 doing. Um, but more and more people are listening to you, to the independent media. And that's,

00:19:54.420 that's a good news. Uh, so we'll see, but I believe that they picked the wrong guy doing that

00:20:01.960 fight against Jordan Peterson. And I believe that will help the freedom movement because

00:20:08.220 I believe that Mr. Peterson will, will fight, uh, and, and will sue them. And, and because

00:20:15.980 of that, that the challenge that we have in Canada with our, with our freedom, freedom of

00:20:23.020 expression, now more people understand and more people know that this country is not free

00:20:30.660 anymore. Yeah. Well, I think it, I think censorship is going to be a theme for 2023,

00:20:36.480 I believe. Oh yeah. Between the laws proposed by Trudeau and, um, Jordan Peterson example.

00:20:43.500 And I think that Elon Musk has revealed so much of the behind the scenes censorship,

00:20:50.080 government pressuring social media companies. I think it's going to be, um,

00:20:53.700 The Twitter files. Yeah. The Twitter files. That you, you won't hear that in the legacy media.

00:20:58.800 Yeah. Yeah. You know, I did, I went to the CBC website and I typed in Twitter files and I did

00:21:03.720 this a few weeks ago. Maybe it's changed now, but when I did it, they didn't even cover the story.

00:21:07.800 It's a, our, our, our rebel viewers know about it. It's Elon Musk revealing internal records. So

00:21:14.140 he's the boss. He owns the records now. He's revealing the bad behavior where government

00:21:19.100 officials secretly pressured Twitter and Twitter was happy to do it in many cases to censor

00:21:24.260 contrarian views, whether it was political views or health views. I'd like to see the Canadian

00:21:29.600 Twitter files. I'd like to see if Trudeau or Gerald Butts or Catherine McKenna or Chrystia Freeland

00:21:36.980 ordered Twitter to do any censorship. And, uh, I know that, um, there are some, uh, politicians

00:21:46.920 or other prominent doctors that were shadow banned on Twitter during, uh, the COVID hysteria.

00:21:55.920 I was part of that and I want to know more details. I hope we'll have the Canadian Twitter

00:22:01.360 files. Well, and I know that Elon Musk has been giving batches of records to different

00:22:06.120 journalists, uh, independent journalists to do it. And we've certainly let them know that

00:22:09.840 we would love to have the Canadian files. Um, now let's talk about the prospect of an election

00:22:15.780 because there was an election in 2019 election in 2021. It, it seems like there might be an

00:22:23.320 election in 2023, just in terms of timing. Um, I mean, 2023, if not for sure, it'll be 2024,

00:22:29.400 I would think. And Pierre Polyev won the conservative leadership with a large number on the first ballot.

00:22:36.920 I think most members of the party seem to be more excited about him than Aaron O'Toole.

00:22:42.880 His wife, Anaida Polyev seems to be a strong candidate. He seems to be talking stronger and

00:22:50.340 more conservatively about everything from cancel culture to the CBC, to monetary policy.

00:22:58.080 I think he's impressed the party base. Those are issues that you used to own, that you used to be

00:23:06.400 your comparative advantage to the conservative party of Canada. How does the people's party of Canada

00:23:13.460 deal with a conservative party of Canada? And that is not perfect. Don't, don't think I think it's

00:23:19.740 perfect, but I believe that Pierre Polyev is better than Aaron O'Toole or Andrew Scheer. I believe that.

00:23:26.340 I said, I said he's more intelligent than O'Toole for sure. And a better communicator.

00:23:30.720 Yeah. So, so how does that work for you? But we won't change, uh, you know, because on the more,

00:23:39.440 uh, on a lot of policies, there's a lot of differences. You mentioned immigration. Yeah,

00:23:45.680 immigration. And, and, and, you know, I can speak about inflation. Uh, you know, what he said about

00:23:50.420 inflation, I think he was right saying that it's because of a bad monetary policy, but also we had a

00:23:57.140 bad monetary policy. And, and the Bank of Canada was the credit card for the federal government

00:24:03.520 because the Trudeau government, uh, spend money that we don't have. And the Bank of Canada printed

00:24:10.260 all that money. But Trudeau was able to do that because he had the support of the conservative and

00:24:16.780 Polyev. They voted for all these COVID programs. And that's why we have inflation. So when he's speaking

00:24:23.060 about inflation, you know, he, he was part of the creation of that inflation, that, uh, just inflation,

00:24:30.700 and it can be also a Pierre inflation because he voted for all these programs during COVID-19 and

00:24:37.660 during COVID-19, he was okay with the lockdowns and all that. And so the Bank of Canada printed all

00:24:43.260 that money and the solution of that. And he doesn't, he doesn't have the right solution is to say to the

00:24:50.420 Bank of Canada, you must have a zero inflation target. Like that, you won't be able to create

00:24:56.540 money out of tin air. We will preserve our purchasing power. We will be richer. He knows that inflation is

00:25:02.980 because of printing money out of tin air, but he won't do anything about that. He agrees. He agrees

00:25:10.220 with the 2% inflation target, but Ezra, 2% inflation every year. Since 2012, for the last 10 years,

00:25:19.920 we had 25% inflation, 25%. So, so 2% inflation is bad. 20% inflation is bad. 6% inflation is bad. It

00:25:31.360 must be 0%. So there's a lot of subject and policies that we don't agree. And, and, and I hope that it

00:25:40.200 will be on our side. I can speak about Ukraine, the war in Ukraine, polyev, the green, the liberals,

00:25:45.960 and everybody, they are all in for that war. We are the only political party that is promoting peace

00:25:52.480 and peacekeeping and peacemaking. It's, it's our history. It's our culture as Canadians. We must

00:26:02.000 be sure to promote a diplomatic solution to that crisis. So that's another big difference with Pierre

00:26:09.460 Polyev. And I can, I can go on with the equalization. You know, you have Western alienation 0.64

00:26:15.620 and you have Western alienation because of the equalization formula. Quebec received

00:26:22.140 last year, I think it was $40 billion. The equalization money, it's $24 billion. It's all coming

00:26:31.560 from Western Canada. That's unfair. We must change that. Polyev won't speak about that. He doesn't have

00:26:38.120 the courage because if he's speaking about that, he may lose some vote in Quebec and in New Brunswick.

00:26:45.680 I'm speaking against that equalization formula. I'm saying we must be less generous. We must change

00:26:51.600 the formula and we must have a new formula that would be fair for everybody. And I'm saying that

00:26:56.680 in French, in New Brunswick, in French, in Quebec, because I know it's, it, it is what we must do

00:27:03.760 to keep that country united. And I can speak about healthcare. Polyev is okay with sending billion

00:27:11.600 dollars to provinces, provinces on healthcare. It won't solve anything. We must change. We have a

00:27:18.280 bureaucratic, a socialist system. And, and we must say to provinces, raise your own money for healthcare

00:27:24.540 by giving them all the money that the federal government is receiving with the GST. So they will have

00:27:30.980 about $4 billion. And Canadians will know who to blame for a lack of services in healthcare, for waiting

00:27:38.320 time for surgeries. Now our Canadians don't know who to blame. Is it the federal government because it's not

00:27:44.680 giving enough money to the province or the provincial government because they don't know how to manage

00:27:51.080 healthcare system and hospital. So it's a provincial jurisdiction. They must have the money without any

00:27:58.020 conditions. And, and you'll know who to blame. It will be your provincial government. But Polyev won't

00:28:03.640 speak about that. And, and so there's a lot of issues. And that's why when the election will come as

00:28:09.120 raw, maybe it will be this year, maybe it would be next year or in 2025, but I'll be on the stage

00:28:16.360 to debate. I was not on the stage at the last election. They created a new rule because they didn't

00:28:21.860 want me. They said, you need to have five, 4% of the vote. We had 5%. So I'll be there. And I'll be

00:28:26.980 happy to debate with Pierre Polyev and Justin Trudeau about common sense policies.

00:28:34.020 You mentioned Ukraine there. And I know that Canadians are really focused on our domestic

00:28:39.240 situation. There's a lot of problems we have to fix at home, but Ukraine, which I don't think most 1.00

00:28:45.220 Canadians were thinking about a year ago is so it's such a high priority for the media and politicians.

00:28:53.340 And it's, it seems like you absolutely have to be gung ho for sending money and military equipment.

00:29:02.480 Like it's just, it's, it feels like I don't, I've just never seen such a mania for a war that feels

00:29:12.180 far away from here. And I mean, of course I sympathize with a country that's being invaded.

00:29:17.740 And of course I don't admire Putin who was a KGB agent and he's an authoritarian ruler,

00:29:23.200 but I'm, I'm a little nervous about some of the warmongering language because at the end of the

00:29:29.060 day, Russia is a nuclear power. I, I find that whole thing uncomfortable, but the crazy thing about it

00:29:33.940 is if you say even a word of about peace or caution, like not pro Putin stuff, but just, whoa,

00:29:41.080 let's slow down here. You're accused of being a Putin spy or something. What's going on with that?

00:29:47.700 Yeah. That's the, the new narrative. If you're for peace and prosperity, you are pro, for pro Putin.

00:29:55.100 And you know, that, that's the same thing that happened to us during COVID-19. If you were against

00:30:01.700 the mandates, you know, you are not a good Canadians and your story won't be in the mainstream media.

00:30:08.060 Yeah. That's the same thing right now with that war in Ukraine. It is not our war, but everybody,

00:30:14.840 the mainstream media, all these establishment politicians, they are in that war with Ukraine

00:30:21.400 and spending money that we don't have.

00:30:23.800 So let's use on the Golden Globes last week. How did that happen?

00:30:27.360 $4 billion. The Canadian government just gave $4 billion. The liberals, the conservatives,

00:30:33.760 Poliev, everybody, they are, yeah, yeah, yeah, go. Now, now it's a proxy war between US, NATO,

00:30:40.540 and Russia.

00:30:41.800 That's what scares me. That's the part that scares me.

00:30:43.780 And it's very dangerous. It's very dangerous. And you know, we must look at the history and try to

00:30:50.040 have a peaceful negotiation. And I hope it will happen, but it's scary.

00:30:54.840 Right. And again, there's the problem. And then there's the enforcement of only one view allowed.

00:31:00.900 And, uh, you know, I, our viewers know that the university of Calgary, there's a professor there

00:31:06.580 named Boucher who receives funding from Trudeau's department of defense. And he did a study that

00:31:12.780 claimed we were pro Putin and propagandists and you were on his hit list too. It was, it was such a

00:31:19.380 junk science study. And I thought, what is going on here? One of the tests they had for being pro

00:31:25.340 Putin, they had five criteria. One of them was, do you undermine trust in Justin Trudeau or the

00:31:31.440 liberal government? Well, most Canadians don't trust Trudeau. That doesn't mean they're all

00:31:36.060 Putin agents. It's very strange. But, but, but on that, I just want to add, I did an interview in

00:31:41.960 French with a journal de Montréal. That's the biggest Francophone newspaper, uh, when that war

00:31:48.980 started. And, you know, because they thought that, um, you know, Bernie must be pro Putin the way that

00:31:54.560 he's speaking. So the journalist asked me a lot of questions and, you know, he wanted to prove to

00:32:00.780 everybody that I'm pro Putin. And, you know, we did a nice interview about, you know, 25 minutes and I was

00:32:07.480 answering question and I, I had logical arguments telling them why I'm not supporting that war.

00:32:13.840 And, uh, and they didn't print that. They didn't print it because it was not in line with the

00:32:18.820 narrative. And because I was looking good with nice argument that it's not our war. We don't have to be

00:32:24.420 there. Isn't that interesting? Well, we've talked a lot about problems, which is what the job of an

00:32:30.680 opposition politician is. Um, that's part of a healthy democracy. Let's end on a positive note.

00:32:39.360 What do you think, uh, is there a silver lining to the last few years? Is there something positive

00:32:46.840 that's come out of the pandemic and the lockdowns? Is there something about 2023 that you find hopeful?

00:32:52.920 Oh, yes. Yes. You know, I'm traveling across the country and I can tell you that more and more people

00:32:58.200 understand the, the challenges that we are having our country right now. So, and, and more people are

00:33:06.320 looking at leaders, not only politicians for a solution and they're ready to look to a new

00:33:13.900 alternative, like they're, they're leaving a little bit the mainstream media and going to alternative

00:33:20.140 media. And in politics, they're doing that. You know, uh, Pierre Polyev is, uh, is going up in the,

00:33:26.000 in the polls and I'm going up in the poll also. So something would happen. And I believe in people,

00:33:32.040 I have faith in people, and I believe that they have the ability, uh, and, and to do what they want

00:33:38.660 to do with their life. And, and, you know, if you, if, if you don't look at what your politician is doing

00:33:49.300 or are doing, sorry, you won't be able to live in a free and a prosperous country. So I believe

00:33:56.680 that more people understand that a big fat government won't solve anything and they need

00:34:01.040 to have more freedom in a smaller government. And just for an example, for us, when we started

00:34:06.860 the party in 2018 at 0%, our first election 1.6 and the last election 5%, I believe we will grow.

00:34:14.140 And we are able to influence the narrative to, to, to move the public opinion. And something will

00:34:24.660 happen in this country. It can be this year. It can be next year, but I believe the freedom fighters

00:34:30.060 will win. Right on. Well, great to see you again and good luck in 2023. We've been talking to Maxime

00:34:36.600 Bernier, the leader of the People's Party in Canada. On behalf of all of us here at Rebel World

00:34:41.520 headquarters to you at home, good night and keep fighting for freedom.

Rebel News Podcast - January 12, 2023

EZRA LEVANT ｜ Why we're doing politics differently： an interview with Maxime Bernier

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