Rebel News Podcast - What does Erin O’Toole have to say about the pandemic？

00:00:00.000 Hello, my Rebels. What does Aaron O'Toole, the conservative opposition leader, have to say

00:00:03.720 above the lockdown? Well, I'll take you through a major speech he gave on the subject just a

00:00:08.140 couple days ago. Hey, before I let you hear that, let me invite you to become a subscriber to Rebel

00:00:12.500 News Plus. It's just eight bucks a month or 80 bucks for the whole year, and you get the video

00:00:16.740 version of the podcast, plus extra goodies from Sheila Gunn-Reed and David Menzies. Just go to

00:00:21.740 rebelnews.com and click subscribe. All right, here's the podcast.

00:00:30.000 Tonight, what does Aaron O'Toole have to say about the pandemic and the government's

00:00:44.880 response to it? It's December 2nd, and this is the Ezra LeVant Show.

00:00:50.800 Why should others go to jail when you're a biggest carbon consumer I know?

00:00:54.340 There's 8,500 customers here, and you won't give them an answer.

00:00:58.240 The only thing I have to say to the government about why I publish it is because it's my

00:01:03.260 bloody right to do so.

00:01:09.120 The British government, run by the allegedly conservative Boris Johnson, has been even

00:01:14.580 worse than Canada's in terms of its bizarre, erratic, unscientific, and punitive response

00:01:20.120 to the pandemic. Just nuts. Crazy rules like pubs are now only allowed to serve drinks to 0.91

00:01:26.620 customers if they are also ordering a substantial meal. Along with it, what's that got to do with

00:01:32.920 the virus? And what is exactly a substantial meal? And the police are going to enforce how

00:01:39.800 substantial your meal is. Do you know what a scotch egg is? It's a British thing. Their health

00:01:46.520 minister is now literally taking questions on what food items are legal in pubs during the

00:01:52.480 pandemic. Are scotch eggs legal? This is a big scotch egg I've got in my hands. Is that

00:01:58.780 a substantial meal? Well, as far as I'm concerned, it's probably a starter. But the broader and

00:02:05.260 more serious point that I think that we need to establish is that there are reasonable rules

00:02:11.620 about hospitality, which are there in order to keep us all safe. And they specify that in certain

00:02:19.200 areas, if you are in a hospitality setting, in a pub, that when you're ordering drinks, it needs to

00:02:25.400 be alongside a substantial meal. The stupid, it burns. I don't mind my politician's stupid, frankly, 1.00

00:02:31.520 because maybe they'll be less effective that way. Alas, in the United Kingdom, they match stupidity 1.00

00:02:36.320 with meanness, which is very un-British, I think. What are those police even doing? I'm pleased to 1.00

00:02:51.480 say this week we will reveal to you that we have hired a new British journalist to cover this beat

00:02:57.360 for us, like Avi Amini is doing in Australia. And our first British video done by a Brit should be up

00:03:03.920 as soon as tomorrow or Friday, so I'm excited about that. There is one thing I will say about

00:03:08.760 the Brits, though. They let their MPs have some freedom in Parliament. And so a few Conservative

00:03:14.000 MPs have actually disagreed with Boris Johnson and Matt Hancock, their laughable health minister.

00:03:19.780 Here's an example. Freedom, Madam Deputy Speaker, is not an absolute, but it should be regarded as

00:03:27.000 precious. And it should be always the strongest possible presumption in its favour. If government

00:03:35.560 is to take away fundamental liberties of the people whom we represent, they must demonstrate

00:03:41.720 beyond question that they are acting in a way that is both proportionate and absolutely necessary.

00:03:48.660 Today, Madam Deputy Speaker, I believe the government has failed to make that compelling case.

00:03:53.980 The benefit of the doubt that this House has extended to government in March and since is

00:04:01.320 harder to take for granted in December. Madam Deputy Speaker, six weeks ago, many of us made the case

00:04:09.260 that the curfew policy at 10pm was not just unnecessary, but that it was counterproductive. Today,

00:04:17.760 the government apparently agrees that the 10pm curfew makes no sense. A month ago, the government insisted

00:04:25.360 that golf and tennis and bowls and gyms were unsafe. Now, it seems that they are not.

00:04:33.860 Madam Deputy Speaker, before the second lockdown, I invited the House to consider whether government

00:04:40.580 had the right to make it illegal for people to see their children, their grandchildren or their

00:04:46.760 elderly relatives, whether the government had the right to ban collective worship or to take away

00:04:52.460 the right to work to support your family. Different people, different members of this House

00:04:58.720 will draw the line in different places, but we must all accept that these are fundamental freedoms.

00:05:06.640 Why can't we have something like that over here? Here's another example.

00:05:09.460 Charles Walker. Madam Deputy Speaker, I have just witnessed an elderly lady peacefully protesting

00:05:15.280 with a handful of other people be arrested and carried spread eagle to a police van just outside

00:05:23.980 the precinct of the House of Commons. This is a disgrace. This is un-British. It is unconstitutional.

00:05:32.980 And this government, our Prime Minister, needs to end these injustices now.

00:05:39.080 Madam Deputy Speaker, will you bring the Prime Minister and all the Home Secretary here today

00:05:46.020 to sort this out? She was an old lady robbed of her dignity for having the courage to protest 1.00

00:05:55.340 about having her fundamental rights and those of my constituents and others removed. 1.00

00:06:00.800 We have 338 MPs in Canada. Have you heard one of them raise that alternative point of view?

00:06:08.280 Surely that must represent at least a sizable minority of Canadian opinion, perhaps even a

00:06:14.840 majority, but not one out of 338 MPs will muster themselves. Well, I thought I'd check to make sure

00:06:22.480 that I wasn't just relying on the untrustworthy media party to tell me what our MPs were up to.

00:06:27.420 So I reviewed an entire lengthy speech given just a couple days ago by Aaron O'Toole,

00:06:33.140 the fairly new leader of the Conservative Party, new leader of the opposition. I'm hopeful for him.

00:06:38.640 I'm hopeful that it'll be more conservative and more feisty than the footnote in history he just

00:06:44.620 replaced, old what's-his-name, you know, the guy with the dimples who kept putting his family

00:06:49.120 members on the payroll. Anyways, I found a recent speech that O'Toole gave on Monday, I think it was,

00:06:55.280 and I'd like to share it with you in some length, some excerpts. So this is the state of the art of

00:07:02.300 his thinking since it's just two days old. Here, let's start off this way.

00:07:07.760 Mr. Speaker, the Minister of Finance has proven their government has no plan. Without a plan for

00:07:16.060 vaccines, there can be no long-term plan for our economy. Without rapid testing in wide distribution,

00:07:26.340 we've missed out on a critical medium-term tool, Mr. Speaker. And the Minister of Finance in her

00:07:33.960 speech seems to realize that she's putting the economy on hold. She'll say, we'll rebuild the

00:07:41.780 economy once COVID is beaten. Well, Mr. Speaker, rapid tests could help preserve the economy and the

00:07:51.700 vaccine will help us beat it. This government is late and has no plan for both. Canadians should see

00:08:01.160 that off the start. This year has been a very difficult year for Canadians, Mr. Speaker. We all

00:08:09.200 know that. 2020 will be remembered as the year of global pandemic came to our shores and took this

00:08:16.600 government completely by surprise, despite many departments warning them for months. It will be

00:08:25.120 remembered as a year of foreclosures, rising unemployment and uncertainty. Worse, for 12,000

00:08:33.920 Canadian families, it will be remembered as a year of grief and tragedy. I agree. It's a tragedy that

00:08:41.640 12,000 people have died from the virus. That's slightly higher than the normal death toll for the annual

00:08:46.760 flu. It's typically, I don't know, seven, eight, nine thousand deaths. So this is worse and every life is

00:08:53.160 precious. And now that we've all said that, let's talk about how the opposition leader is opposing.

00:08:59.400 At least in that clip, his big beef is that there hasn't been lots of rapid testing for the virus.

00:09:05.520 Is that really the problem? Not enough testing. Now, when you test healthy populations, especially when

00:09:11.080 you set the actual test to be extremely sensitive, which is being done, you know that half or more of the

00:09:19.880 results are false positives, right? Here's the deputy public health officer of Ontario saying exactly

00:09:25.620 that. And in fact, if you're testing in a population that doesn't have very much COVID,

00:09:31.340 you'll get false positives almost half the time. Rapid tests and a vaccine? I mean, maybe it'll be

00:09:37.260 here in a few months. And I'm absolutely sure that Justin Trudeau has botched whatever he's done with

00:09:42.580 vaccines. He actually signed a bizarre contract with a Chinese military company a few months back to get

00:09:47.700 in on the ground floor of their vaccine. He's so dumb, that Trudeau. But look, my thesis, and I think 1.00

00:09:53.580 the facts bear at home, is that the big problem now is not the virus, actually. It's the government

00:09:59.420 response to the virus, the lockdowns, the quarantines of healthy people, the travel bans, the fear

00:10:05.340 mongering, shutting down hospitals for regular operations, thus delaying countless small examinations

00:10:12.960 and surgeries and tests, leading to so many more casualties than the virus itself.

00:10:18.720 I agree with O'Toole that Trudeau was sleeping at the switch. I agree we're in a pickle. But what is

00:10:25.120 the opposition leader's opposition today? All right, let's listen to find out. I'm going to let this run

00:10:30.880 for a couple of minutes. Take a look.

00:10:31.960 Canadians have shown courage and fortitude. They've respected directives from our health

00:10:38.120 authorities. But Canadians are hurting. Canadians want their lives back. And this fall economic

00:10:47.580 statement shows that they cannot rely on the Liberal government to get their lives back.

00:10:54.840 Canadians are not difficult people, Mr. Speaker. They have complied, followed rules. They've

00:11:01.580 tightened their belts. They're reassuring their worried children and taking care of aged parents.

00:11:10.060 And to this effect, I'm really glad the Liberal government and the Minister took my proposal from

00:11:16.440 this spring on support for parents by boosting the Canada Child Benefit. There it was on page 10 of my

00:11:25.120 leadership platform, Mr. Speaker. And I'm so glad the Liberal cabinet was reading it

00:11:30.800 just as hundreds of thousands of Conservative members were.

00:11:39.280 Yes, I'm glad, Mr. Speaker, because this was a concrete proposal to help families, especially

00:11:45.360 moms, working moms, juggling it all, helping families through the toughest time in our modern history.

00:11:53.640 But we know that Canadians need more. As I said, Canadians want their lives back, Mr. Speaker.

00:12:02.120 And they've only asked one thing from this government, one simple thing. What is the plan, Mr. Speaker?

00:12:12.120 For widespread use of rapid tests, what is the plan for rolling out the vaccine? When does it arrive?

00:12:20.600 Who gets it first? Do we have the freezers for the minus 70 vaccine, Mr. Speaker?

00:12:27.560 A robust portfolio in 2023 doesn't help us as we enter 2021.

00:12:36.600 Well, Mr. Speaker, this fall economic statement answers the question on whether there is a plan.

00:12:45.880 And it answers that no, there is not. And as the red ink on our balance sheet turns a dark crimson,

00:12:53.800 we're facing a $399 billion deficit, Mr. Speaker. Not $400 billion. It's a bit like 1999.

00:13:06.200 You're not spending $20, Mr. Speaker. It's only $399 billion, Mr. Speaker. And Canadians know that not

00:13:16.840 even half of that went to the emergency programs.

00:13:19.480 Okay. Good points about overspending. Excellent. Good point about wastefulness,

00:13:23.880 about debt. I get it. I'm with you. That's important stuff. Good. And questions about the

00:13:29.240 vaccine. Fair enough. But is there a more philosophical opposition to the government's

00:13:34.200 approach? Let's listen some more. If this government spent half as much time

00:13:38.680 meeting with real Canadians, small business owners, than they spend on photo ops, they would

00:13:45.160 know that workers, small business owners, are asking for clarity. Canadians in a pandemic aren't

00:13:52.440 asking them to ban single-use plastics. They're asking for details on when the vaccine gets here,

00:13:59.000 how it's being distributed, how it's being preserved at minus 70. How can they save their aging parents

00:14:07.160 from a senior's home or a hospital bed? This Prime Minister needs to get his priorities straight,

00:14:13.160 but it's hard to take this government seriously when we know how this all started, Mr. Speaker.

00:14:18.440 Think about how much better off Canada would have been if the Liberals had not shut down the pandemic

00:14:25.960 early warning system. They did that in 2019, Mr. Speaker, without any consultation with scientists or

00:14:33.560 with opposition parties in parliament. I don't disagree with any of this. The government is childish and

00:14:39.480 silly, plastic bag bands, things like that. I agree with shutting down the warning system was stupid, 1.00

00:14:45.480 all the botched responses. I get it. But that was the story six months ago, right? Is there anything 1.00

00:14:50.920 more now than Monday morning quarterbacking about the past? As in, other than simply promising to be

00:14:56.600 more competent, and hopefully he would be, what would Aaron O'Toole actually do differently? Is he a lockdown

00:15:04.360 man? Is he more laissez-faire? Is he worried about civil liberties? Does he really believe that this is

00:15:10.200 on par with the Black Plague and we have to shut everything down? Or is it overblown and simply being

00:15:14.600 used as an excuse to build bigger government? Like John Jane Fonda says. 0.99

00:15:19.080 This is a crossroads. It's an existential crossroads. And we are people who can help determine which way

00:15:29.160 humanity goes. What a great gift. What a tremendous opportunity. We're just so lucky. We have to use it

00:15:37.960 with every ounce of intelligence and courage and wherewithal we have. Because you're absolutely right.

00:15:45.240 This is it. This is it. And, you know, I just think COVID is God's gift to the left.

00:15:59.720 All right, back to O'Toole.

00:16:03.160 The Liberal government closed our borders two months too late. They also flip-flopped on the risks of

00:16:11.960 contagion in person and on mask wearing. The Conservatives though have been good team players,

00:16:19.880 Mr. Speaker. We tried to work with the government as much as we could. We tried to improve the

00:16:26.040 government's erratic action. Most importantly, the Conservatives have been there for workers who

00:16:35.480 really needed our help. We voted for emergency legislation and we voted for programs to help

00:16:45.960 workers. Again, I'm fine with this, but what's the conservative approach? What's the alternative?

00:16:51.080 I'm just showing you as much of his speech as I can without playing the whole long thing.

00:16:55.400 I want to show you that I'm not cherry-picking anything. I'm still waiting for that aha moment.

00:16:59.640 Here's some more. While Americans are talking about mass vaccination throughout all of January,

00:17:05.000 our government is only speculating about getting part of our population vaccinated by September.

00:17:12.600 That means 10 extra months, Mr. Speaker, of health risks for Canadians, business closures,

00:17:19.960 and economic uncertainty. Canadians want their lives back, Mr. Speaker.

00:17:25.880 The Minister of Health talks a great deal about the whole of government effort and the robust portfolio.

00:17:33.720 But there's only one way to describe the performance of this government

00:17:38.200 when it comes to vaccines. Incompetent, Mr. Speaker. Canadians, in the midst of the second wave, 0.97

00:17:46.040 would rather have one dose of the vaccine in the next month

00:17:50.440 than the largest portfolio 18 months from now, Mr. Speaker.

00:17:57.080 So he's big on vaccines. Okay, fair enough. I believe people should be free to take a vaccine

00:18:02.200 if they want. I don't think that's the actual issue. What I'm worried about is whether or not

00:18:07.320 vaccines are safe, especially if they're being rushed without the usual testing. I'm worried about

00:18:12.760 mandatory vaccines, not just forced by governments, but vaccine passports that corporations may try to

00:18:19.320 impose to fly on a plane, to go to a restaurant, to work at a job. Does O'Toole have a view on that?

00:18:26.360 And if so, is he afraid to say it? Here's some more.

00:18:29.800 This liberal government does not inspire confidence.

00:18:34.760 This liberal government does not inspire confidence. Let's talk about its purchase of

00:18:40.680 $370 million for medical gowns paid to a company with almost zero experience. Or

00:18:48.840 their $237 million respirator contract to their friend Frank Bayliss. The We Charity scandal revealed

00:19:03.480 liberal friends who are trying to profit during a pandemic. And at a time when the trust of citizens is

00:19:12.280 so important, the liberals continue to use their donor list to choose future judges.

00:19:23.240 It's one scandal after another, Mr. Speaker.

00:19:26.120 Yes, yes, I agree. It's a corrupt government. It's getting filthy rich off the pandemic. 0.98

00:19:31.800 All of their friends are. Just like profiteers get rich off of the crisis of war,

00:19:37.320 every liberal lobbyist is feasting off the spoils of this war. I get it, but what's the alternative vision?

00:19:44.840 Well folks, here's some more, but I don't think you're going to get it. Take a listen.

00:19:48.280 My first job was as a dishwasher and a short order cook, Mr. Speaker, in high school.

00:19:54.040 And my last job before the military was with TransCanada inspecting pipelines.

00:20:00.520 Back at a time before this government when that company was still proud to have Canada

00:20:04.920 in its name, Mr. Speaker. I respect people, my colleagues do, that work hard to provide for

00:20:12.280 their family, whether they're a uniformed and unionized plant worker or an entrepreneur,

00:20:18.520 whether they work the night shift in Mississauga, Ontario, or get up at 5 a.m. to open their small

00:20:24.680 business in Cape Breton, Nova Scotia. There's a nobility in that act of discipline,

00:20:31.720 perseverance, and working hard for your family. We cannot lose that in this country, Mr. Speaker.

00:20:39.400 We will fight hard to ensure that we never lose touch with that fundamental value upon which Canadian

00:20:47.720 society has been built.

00:20:48.360 All right. So you're a grassroots guy as much as a lawyer can be, but I admire his work ethic and his

00:20:55.000 military service. But I don't think we're further along in understanding, does the Conservative Party

00:20:59.560 of Canada have any fundamental objection to the Trudeau Liberals approach? Sure, they want to spend less

00:21:05.480 money. And let's give them that. That's important. Though I note O'Toole bragged in his speech about

00:21:10.680 supporting a lot of Trudeau's spending. But other than the evergreen criticism of competence, is there any

00:21:16.440 opposition to the state of fear and panic and the forever lockdown, the violation of civil rights?

00:21:23.160 Is there any of that? Here's some more.

00:21:25.960 This country working again, Mr. Speaker. Hard work emboldens the soul and builds a nation.

00:21:32.040 Hard work helps families. Those families build communities and make us proud to be Canadian.

00:21:38.600 Got it. I think a Liberal could say those exact words, right? What makes a Conservative different? I'm

00:21:44.440 trying to get to it. Listen to some more. Canadian workers deserve a government that fights for them. 0.98

00:21:51.000 A government that is not obsessed with transitioning our industries in the midst of a pandemic,

00:21:58.840 Mr. Speaker. A government that is patriotic and not afraid to fight on the world stage for rapid access

00:22:08.120 to vaccines. A government that knows that Canada has an identity, a history, and that we can be proud of

00:22:18.120 this. More vaccine talk. I'm fine with people being allowed to choose vaccines. I want to make sure we

00:22:23.800 can choose not to take them too since they're so new and risky and the virus itself has turned out to be

00:22:28.760 not risky for young people especially. Is there anything on that? And the lack of a plan to address the

00:22:34.680 most critical issues facing our country in one of the most challenging years in our country's history

00:22:41.080 will only fuel the fears and uncertainties facing Canadian families across this great country.

00:22:49.000 Mr. Speaker, now is not the time for experiments. Now is the time for experience. Now is not the time for

00:22:57.240 building back with slogans. Now is the time we show we have our citizens backs, Mr. Speaker. That's right.

00:23:05.560 We need to have a plan for the challenges we face today so that our children will have the same

00:23:11.640 opportunities we did tomorrow. Look, I'm going to stop punishing you with with more of this

00:23:17.320 blather. It's all boilerplate stuff. I don't know what he said. That speech could have been half as long

00:23:22.280 and I only played half of it to you to begin with. Look, I know it's tough to take on the establishment,

00:23:28.680 take on the government, take on the media, take on the public health, deep state, the experts. I know

00:23:32.760 it's tough. The social peer pressure, all the people who are loving this lockdown because it's just a big

00:23:38.680 paid staycation for them. They get to order and take out and watch Netflix. That's how half the world

00:23:45.080 sees it and probably 90% of how Ottawa sees it. But it's not how conservatives see it. It's not how

00:23:51.080 working people see it. Most Canadians would rather take the chance of a virus with a 99% plus recovery

00:23:57.320 rate and be able to have a job and live freely than to live under this perpetual state of fear

00:24:02.200 and stress and disinformation. It's hard opposing the juggernaut. I get it. Look at what they did to

00:24:07.880 Adam Skelly, the barbecue restaurant guy. I get it. But look at the job description. Leader of the

00:24:13.480 opposition. Her Majesty's loyal opposition. It's Erin O'Toole's job to oppose. I know it's tough,

00:24:19.400 but it's the job he asked for. I think Erin O'Toole has to oppose what's going on. 1.00

00:24:25.960 And I don't think he is. And I hope that changes. Stay with me for more.

00:24:43.480 My friends, there's an important video I want to show you. Normally I interview a guest at this hour,

00:24:48.200 but Sheila Gunn-Reed has an important video about the war on Christian churches that is happening

00:24:54.760 under cover of the pandemic. You'll notice cannabis stores are open, liquor stores are open, Walmart's

00:25:00.120 open, Costco's open, and of course Amazon dominates it all. But the one place where the crackdown is the

00:25:05.400 crackdown is the toughest. Other than that barbecue in Toronto, it's churches. I want to play for you 0.98

00:25:11.320 Sheila's story from Prince Albert, Saskatchewan. Take a look.

00:25:14.200 A Prince Albert, Saskatchewan church has received a $14,000 coronavirus fine for singing without wearing

00:25:24.120 masks. It's outrageous. It's un-Canadian. And we refuse to let this stand. We are helping 0.98

00:25:31.160 the full gospel outreach center. Fight back. And we need your help to do it.

00:25:41.080 Today I'm bringing you a story about a fight the fines case that we've been working on for

00:25:46.280 almost a month now. And then after this is all over, I'm going to ask you to help us help a man

00:25:52.200 who's doing good work to help vulnerable people that few people are willing to do. And he's paying

00:25:58.360 a high cost for all of it. In early October, an inner city Prince Albert, Saskatchewan church

00:26:05.400 was given a five-figure COVID-19 fine by the province of Saskatchewan for singing in their

00:26:11.640 church without masks on. It could be one of the highest fines of this kind we've seen in Canada.

00:26:17.640 Look at this. A Prince Albert, Saskatchewan church was fined $14,000 after a multi-day event caused an

00:26:24.200 outbreak of the novel coronavirus. A traveling evangelist spoke at the full gospel outreach

00:26:30.600 for several days, according to Prince Albert Mayor Greg Dion. Remember that name? He said the

00:26:37.160 event drew hundreds to the church, both from the city and further north. They crossed the line, said

00:26:44.120 Dion, adding he doesn't understand why the church wouldn't follow guidelines when, quote,

00:26:52.040 every other place of worship in the city has. And while it was the province of Saskatchewan

00:26:59.480 that eventually issued the fine for the church, it was that mayor, Greg Dion, and a local First

00:27:06.040 Nations chief who pushed the province to issue the fine to the church. Look at this. The mayor of

00:27:13.080 Prince Albert and the chief of the Peter Ballantyne Cree Nation in northern Saskatchewan,

00:27:18.520 say the organizers of Prince Albert church meetings that have been tied to a regional outbreak of

00:27:25.880 COVID-19 should be fined by the provincial government. There's got to be strict consequences,

00:27:34.920 said Mayor Greg Dion. They weren't wearing masks. The rules say they have to. So take action. People have to

00:27:44.840 know that we are a strong government. Well, that was it for me. This bully mayor

00:27:53.080 had a poor church fined for singing without masks on. It's absolutely unreal. So I went on a road trip 0.96

00:28:01.320 to Prince Albert, Saskatchewan to see this church for myself and meet with the pastor the mayor insisted

00:28:09.720 be fined. Pastor Vernon Temple to get the other side of the story. I met with Pastor Vernon Temple

00:28:15.320 at his church in downtown Prince Albert, where he ministers to the homeless and the addicted,

00:28:22.520 where he also runs a clothing bank to clothe the cold and wary, where he feeds the hungry.

00:28:29.480 There are intravenous needle drop boxes just up the street from Pastor Vernon Temple's church. And as

00:28:37.320 you'll see, his church is not wealthy by any stretch of the imagination. In fact, the church recently

00:28:45.160 suffered a flood. And that was when the city and that vindictive mayor Greg Dion cracked down on

00:28:51.640 Vernon Temple. Take a look at this. There's something about it when the government intervenes like this,

00:28:56.600 and they kind of really put the, uh, the screws down on you and put fear in, in, into, you know,

00:29:04.520 and it's, it's, it is a serious thing, right? It's a serious virus, very contagious, and, and in some

00:29:11.240 cases can be fatal. So that, that kind of, that kind of is, is the faith position of a lot of, a lot of, uh,

00:29:21.080 faith people is, is that they were kind of intimidated by the, you know, the whole propaganda,

00:29:26.920 all the, all the media, all the government, uh, propaganda of, of, uh, fear. So it's, it's something

00:29:34.040 that, you know, uh, it's sad. I want to learn a little bit more about your ministry here, Pastor Vernon

00:29:41.640 Temple. Um, because it appears to me that you minister to people sort of, uh, the most vulnerable.

00:29:51.160 Yeah, no doubt. That's, um, um, like we, we, uh, we have apartments upstairs. The city pushed hard

00:29:59.080 against us to close them. So we just, you know, figure, well, you know, like it's, uh, it just isn't

00:30:05.800 worth the trouble anymore. So we close our apartments. That's what we do. So we, you know,

00:30:10.600 fulfill that one of the part of that commission, at least to, you know, feed the hungry and to

00:30:16.840 close the naked and, and, uh, and then, um, and so we kind of given up a little, a little part of that

00:30:23.720 in, in providing shelter. But even when we're having services here, we had services for 32 days.

00:30:29.560 There's always people here that wanted, that needed a place.

00:30:32.680 These people are like second, third generation coming from second, third generation, dysfunctional, 1.00

00:30:38.520 alcoholic, violent homes. And, and, and they need, they need, they're hopeless. Like they just,

00:30:45.400 they're, they can't even go back to their own reserve. In some cases, they, they can't go back

00:30:49.160 to their families because, because, you know, uh, it just too much chaos, right? Again, these marginalized

00:30:55.240 people, they were receiving and may in a process of turning, changing their lives.

00:31:02.520 And, and, and surrendering their lives to God. And then all of a sudden it just stops.

00:31:09.240 I just want to go back for a second here, um, and, and come back to the point that you're making,

00:31:13.960 because the government did force you to shut down. Um, and I think you and I would both agree

00:31:20.360 that church is essential. It's an essential service. Um, tell me about what services looked like

00:31:28.040 during the pandemic. Did you have hand sanitizer, offer masks? How many people were here?

00:31:33.640 Uh, in this, in this area we had, I think maybe up to about maybe a hundred people. Uh, we provided,

00:31:41.800 um, uh, sign in sheet. Um, I think, I think most people signed in at least to begin with,

00:31:51.880 you know, once they, I guess maybe once they figured they signed in, then they're recorded

00:31:56.760 as being, you know, like if there's ever an issue, uh, then they would, they were on the list,

00:32:02.120 right? So they didn't have to sign in every day or they just forgot. I'm not sure what happened there.

00:32:06.440 And we provided masks and we provided hand sanitizer. Um, the problem with, with, you know,

00:32:12.840 social distancing in the church is that, is that, you know, a group of people come in and you're assuming

00:32:18.840 and they drove together that they're family, uh, that they're kind of a, what they call a pod or

00:32:23.560 whatever. And so they want to sit together. So you can't just put chairs, you know, uh, you know,

00:32:29.320 like six feet apart because, because they're actually people, people are allowed to sit together.

00:32:36.440 Families are allowed to sit together. So, um, so we did, we did, um, it's, it's very difficult to

00:32:44.680 monitor those, but the street people are probably the, the hardest to manage. Um, you know, like

00:32:51.800 if you're used to not washing your hands more than once a day or once a week or something, you know,

00:32:57.400 I don't know what the situation is, then, then hand sanitizer, like, you know, like, you know,

00:33:03.160 like they're, they're just, you know, so how do you enforce that? Right. So, um, and even social

00:33:07.640 distancing, we'd put chairs out kind of, but you know, you want to include them, eh? You don't want to

00:33:12.360 put, okay, all the street people have to sit in the back here, you know, and sorry, but you know,

00:33:16.600 just government regulation, you know, and, uh, you know, like that, how do you, how do you do that?

00:33:21.480 You know, that's a really great point. You want people to show you, you love them and care for

00:33:25.480 them and you're, you're, you're really there to help them. And you're saying, well, you know,

00:33:29.400 but you've got to sit over there, right? You're trying to integrate the homeless population into

00:33:33.400 your regular congregation. Yeah. You mentioned that you already had some friction with the city

00:33:38.760 because of, uh, in the past, because, because of the apartments upstairs where you're trying to,

00:33:45.160 you know, meet your Christian obligation to, you know, put a roof over the head of the homeless.

00:33:49.960 Um, and so even though you were holding, uh, church here and doing your best to social distance

00:33:57.800 and follow the rules, um, you still came under fire from Prince Albert Mayor Greg Dion and the chief of

00:34:04.680 Peter Ballantyne First Nation, Peter Beattie, they called on the province to find you.

00:34:10.600 Yeah, apparently. Um, and this is after the outbreak, of course. Right. And, and, and, um,

00:34:17.080 uh, I think that maybe at the time there might've been maybe 20 cases, 20 known cases.

00:34:23.160 And, uh, but Greg Dion, like he would just jump on any opportunity to, to come against us and to,

00:34:30.360 to, uh, to, uh, anything that he could possibly use to, to, they, they wanted two years ago,

00:34:37.400 they wanted to, uh, uh, uh, take our building, close it down, take our building and demolish it

00:34:43.240 for a parking lot. Like, so that's, you know, like no, no consideration for what we're doing,

00:34:49.160 what we're trying to do, trying to reach out to, to homeless, marginalized people.

00:34:53.560 How did, uh, the outbreak sort of come to light? I know it was initially just a handful of cases

00:35:00.280 that were attributed. One person that I know of that was, she worked at the casino. Uh, 0.89

00:35:04.760 she got tested positive. And so that was the first one that I know of.

00:35:09.480 Oh, so the casino. Yeah.

00:35:11.880 So the casino, so maybe it came from the casino, right?

00:35:15.040 Is the casino still open? Yeah.

00:35:17.280 So the church is closed, but the casino's open. Yeah.

00:35:19.800 Oh, okay. So, yeah. But then, you know, like they, again, it's just, you know, to where it came

00:35:25.320 from. Yeah. Like it, you know, it came from somewhere, right? Came from China.

00:35:32.600 So let's blame the Chinese again, right? We should be, that's what, you know, and if we're really all 1.00

00:35:37.080 in this all together, then that's probably, you know, like, should, should there even be tickets?

00:35:43.400 You know, like, let's, let's try to get some money out of China, perhaps, you know, like.

00:35:50.120 I'm listening.

00:35:52.120 You know, maybe that's where we should be trying to get the money from, but no, then, then, but then,

00:35:58.120 you know, we're afraid to challenge China, right? And we're afraid to stand up against them. 0.99

00:36:03.920 It's easier to challenge Christians who are called to turn the other cheek. 0.88

00:36:07.400 Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. There you go.

00:36:09.680 How did the fines come down? How did you find out that you were levied some fines? You had an

00:36:15.720 evangelist, Ian Lavely, he received a $2,800 fine plus a victim surcharge. And the, your ministry

00:36:24.600 received what I think so far is the largest fine issued in the country for the coronavirus

00:36:32.320 and breaking the regulations of a municipality is $14,000 plus a victim surcharge or with 10 plus

00:36:41.000 the victims. Yeah. So yeah, I was just, I was contacted by Peter Ross from the, you know,

00:36:48.820 from the health authority said he wanted to talk to me and I wouldn't, even if he said,

00:36:53.880 I've got something for you. I might, I think he did say that anyways, but he didn't tell me he's

00:36:59.140 going to, you know, give me a fine. Uh, but yeah, two weeks ago, uh, he contacted me and, uh, so I

00:37:08.440 met him at my place of, uh, quarantining and, uh, out at the farm and, and he, uh, um, basically gave

00:37:17.600 me the ticket. Now you're not a wealthy congregation, but your congregants immediately

00:37:24.000 started fundraising to help you pay that fine. Now at Rebel News, we don't want you to pay that

00:37:29.620 fine. We want you to keep that money, continue to do the good work that you do for, uh, vulnerable

00:37:35.620 populations, people on reserve, Métis communities. So are you going to get us off this? We're going to 1.00

00:37:39.880 do our best to get you off it because we hired you a really great lawyer and he's going to fight

00:37:44.480 that fine for you. And our people at home, our viewers, our rebel supporters are going to fundraise

00:37:51.360 to pay your lawyer. And, and, uh, so nothing out of pocket. The lawyer doesn't work for us. He works

00:37:58.480 for you. We're going to pay the bills. Um, and that's what we're going to do because, uh, we believe

00:38:03.560 that church is essential. And I'm very disappointed that the city of Prince Albert put a stop to the

00:38:10.760 work that you were doing when people needed it the most. Yeah. You know, like, I really,

00:38:17.040 really appreciate that. Really awesome. Uh, wonderful. Um, uh, so we've been, we have been

00:38:24.040 doing fundraising, uh, not really because people are just voluntarily given, you know, the money's

00:38:29.120 gone into our savings account. Uh, we're going to keep the money there for the fine. Well, we'll see

00:38:34.960 about that. We'll see about that. But you know, it's comforting to know that the money's still

00:38:38.840 there, right? Like, and people have been so good, been so gracious and loving and caring

00:38:43.060 about this and been sending us, you know, like, like I think we're at 11, $12,000 right

00:38:49.560 now. And, and, uh, you know, and I so appreciate that and it's going to stay in the account until

00:38:55.820 this is done. Hey, like, uh, and, uh, but you know, by all means, you know, uh, you know,

00:39:02.240 we, we, um, we, um, we'll, um, keep receiving, um, we'll keep receiving gifts for, and specifically

00:39:09.660 for that, for the, for the fine, uh, just, and, and, um, maybe any other costs incurred. But

00:39:17.100 yeah, uh, it's been, it's been, uh, pretty amazing to see the support and the help. And it's

00:39:24.740 really amazing that, um, that you've got a lawyer for us. And, uh, it's really, really

00:39:31.800 wonderful. Thank you. And, and, uh, thank you to your supporters. We don't want to be

00:39:36.820 uncooperative. We don't want, well, we don't want to be uncooperative in the least, but the

00:39:41.840 thing is, is that as a church, we're trying to exercise our rights and freedoms, constitutional

00:39:46.540 rights and freedoms, and, and, and the commission, which, which a lot of people actually ignore,

00:39:53.500 or they don't even know about, but the commission of Jesus to preach the gospel to the poor, you

00:39:58.480 know, that was, uh, yeah, that's, that's a command, right? That's, that's a, uh, that's

00:40:02.960 a commission to preach the gospel to the poor. I know that, that I was gifted to minister

00:40:07.900 to the poor. Not everyone is gifted to minister to the poor. Not everyone. And I write, I don't

00:40:13.020 judge Christians for not reaching out because they just not gifted to, to reach out to, to 0.72

00:40:19.740 people that are just like crazy lives, you know? And, and, uh, so I know that I was gifted

00:40:27.120 at that time. The Lord gave me the gift of mercy. And, um, and you know, that's been part

00:40:32.880 of the reason why I've been able to persevere because when you know you're called to do

00:40:36.280 something, then there's no turning back. You can't back down from the government. You

00:40:39.980 can't back down from their pushing hard against you. You just have to keep going on. You know

00:40:44.380 that God is on your side. That's part of faith, right?

00:40:47.060 I don't think this is going to happen because we've been pretty successful fighting these fines,

00:40:51.280 um, for other people. If the government doesn't drop this fine against you, what does $14,000

00:41:01.480 taken out of your ministry mean for the people that you're trying to help?

00:41:05.440 Now what we could do with that money?

00:41:07.140 Right. That's my question. What would you do with that money if you were able to keep it?

00:41:10.080 We would, uh, what we do some renovations in the church. We have to, we'll go next door

00:41:14.660 there and we had, we had a flood there a year and a half ago and we were underinsured,

00:41:19.480 which, you know, like people understand that, right? They understand, they, you know, you

00:41:24.480 have a $3 million building and you, you, you insure it for about as much as you can afford

00:41:33.400 and hope for the best. But when something happens, then you're underinsured. And so it paid,

00:41:42.440 paid our bill of, of tearing out the stuff. And, um, and, but there was, there was no

00:41:49.760 money left over to do the renovations to re to rebuilding.

00:41:53.760 Here's another issue, right? Like we were packed in here and then Ian says, we got to

00:41:59.100 move next door. We, we have to, we need the space, right? So, and then, so we, we, we

00:42:04.880 got, probably got the ticket because of this, but then we moved next door where there's

00:42:09.580 lots of room. There's positive space. So, um, but it's a little rough in there. We moved

00:42:14.700 over there from there over to here so that we would be able to, you know, uh, social distance

00:42:22.160 and to comply to as well as we could, you know, to, to the, uh, you know, reopen Saskatchewan

00:42:28.300 guidelines. And then they hand us a ticket a week later or, or, you know, 10 days later,

00:42:34.840 actually, you know, or actually it's about two weeks after, but we were here for, uh,

00:42:39.520 Brad, do you remember how long we were in here? Like at least a week, eh? Yeah. At

00:42:45.200 least a week we're in here and we were trying to move sooner. But the problem is, is that

00:42:49.240 like, um, uh, we weren't sure what to do with the floor.

00:42:52.880 It's a construction zone.

00:42:54.180 Yeah, basically, you know, but it doesn't, you know, I mean, it's okay. You know, it's

00:42:57.620 like camp meeting, right? Like if you've ever been, ever been to a tent meeting, you know,

00:43:00.940 they have, you know, grass is your floor, right? So then, yeah. So we move over here

00:43:05.880 and then they, after we've moved over here and actually, uh, complying to the, to the

00:43:12.260 regulations a lot better here than we were over there, they still give us a ticket.

00:43:16.160 So there's, you know, not saying, okay, well, we can see what you've done. You know, you

00:43:20.560 move from there to here, uh, you know, you're, you're like, that's a major effort, right?

00:43:25.580 Sure. That's a major effort on our part to, to, uh, to comply, you know, to do our best

00:43:31.260 to comply.

00:43:32.100 I didn't even realize that they ticketed you after you moved over here.

00:43:35.660 Yeah. Like that's almost insane. Like that's, that's vindictive. I think that's vindictive.

00:43:41.760 That's, you know, and so here, like again, the mayor makes, you know, he makes decisions

00:43:47.900 off the cuff. Uh, he doesn't understand, you know, like really doesn't understand that

00:43:53.540 people we're trying to minister to. And if he doesn't understand the people we're

00:43:57.260 trying to minister to, then he doesn't understand us. Right. Nick, he doesn't, he's,

00:44:02.100 you know, and, uh, you know, and that has never really made any attempt to bridge that

00:44:09.240 gap of ignorance. Not that I'm calling him ignorant, but you know, uh, ignorance is bliss

00:44:14.260 for some people. And, and like he, he should have, he should have been, Hey, he got, and 0.75

00:44:20.000 he's got my phone number. The mayor has my phone number and he should have been phoning.

00:44:25.460 Hey, Vern, we've got to talk, you know, but never, never is always, always a political

00:44:30.720 agenda. And he used to be a nice guy, but then it became a politician. You can quote

00:44:37.320 that.

00:44:38.240 Does that look to you like a church that has $14,000 just to throw around to pay a bully's

00:44:43.640 fine. Imagine what taking $14,000 out of the budget of a church that feeds the homeless

00:44:51.860 really means in a practical sense to the people they help every day. I want to tell you, I

00:44:59.020 reached out to the mayor, Greg Dion, that mayor of Prince Albert with some questions about

00:45:05.100 why he was so heavy handed with the full gospel outreach center, because the more I dig, the

00:45:14.680 more I find out there's absolutely more to this story. And I'll share that with you in

00:45:19.400 a subsequent update. But here's what I asked the mayor to clarify. Were any attempts made

00:45:25.440 by the city to bring the church into compliance before calling on the province to levy fines?

00:45:32.060 Were any warnings issued? Inspections done? Advice given? Supplies provided?

00:45:39.860 Question two. Pastor Temple says that contact tracing suggests the outbreak spread to his church

00:45:46.560 through a congregant who caught it on the job at the local casino. Did the casino face any

00:45:53.060 strict consequences, investigations, fines, or closures? If not, why not? What replacement

00:46:01.920 resources are being provided by the city of Prince Albert to the vulnerable populations that usually

00:46:08.520 seek food and clothing from the now closed full gospel outreach center? Well, I'm sure that none of

00:46:17.380 you are surprised to learn that this authoritarian mayor with what I have now learned seems to be a

00:46:23.460 real vendetta against Pastor Vern never ever got back to me. I sent that email three weeks ago at least.

00:46:31.880 Now, our regular viewers know that religious freedom and the rights of Christians in the public square to

00:46:36.740 practice their faith completely unmolested by the government is something that I am deeply passionate

00:46:44.460 about. And I've raised money to help Christians return to their indigenous homeland on the biblical

00:46:51.860 Nineveh plain after facing an ISIS genocide in Kurdistan. I've walked in the bombed out churches

00:46:59.820 in the Iraqi town of Batnaya, a town that sat behind the ISIS front lines. So what I'm saying here is I'm not

00:47:07.720 scared of a small town bully mayor with a mean on for a pastor who helps inconvenient people on the fringes

00:47:16.440 of society so that the city of Prince Albert doesn't have to. As I mentioned in our interview, I promised

00:47:23.700 Pastor Vern that I would find him a lawyer. And I did just that. Sarah Miller from JSS Barristers is a lawyer

00:47:32.220 whom I think might feel as deeply passionate about religious freedom as I do. She's already had some

00:47:40.480 success fighting for Christians in the public square. She was the lawyer who helped street preacher

00:47:47.620 Archer Polosky beat his fine in Calgary. Archer was given a social distancing fine for feeding the

00:47:56.340 homeless on a bitterly cold Alberta winter day. Rebel News stepped in and we connected Sarah and Archer

00:48:05.160 and Sarah helped Archer fight that fine. And now she's going to be the lawyer to help Pastor Vern

00:48:13.460 beat this fine too. I spoke with Sarah a couple days ago from her office in Calgary about how she plans

00:48:21.320 to do just that. Sarah, thanks for taking on the case of Pastor Vernon Temple. Why did you take on

00:48:31.000 this case? We had a little bit of trouble finding a lawyer who would. You're based in Calgary, but you're

00:48:35.780 still helping Vernon Temple and Prince Albert. Yeah, absolutely. So when I was first contacted by

00:48:43.260 Rebel News and as part of the whole Fight the Fines program, I've been helping a number of pastors and

00:48:49.460 street churches and for whatever reason, Saskatchewan, Alberta, anywhere we seem to be, the police and

00:48:57.580 the professionals who are prosecuting and charging these people really target churches. And they're

00:49:05.840 doing great work. They're helping the poor. We've seen over and over in the media how the rules of

00:49:12.600 COVID and the laws on lockdowns target and affect poor people, marginalized people the worst. And so

00:49:19.900 I decided to take on this file because that, you know, offends something deep in my core. I think it

00:49:27.160 offends most people's understanding of how law and justice should work. $14,000 for a church that is

00:49:35.480 working with the poor in a, you know, a relatively small community in Saskatchewan is just frankly

00:49:42.260 obscene. Um, and so that's why I decided to take it on. You know, I agree with you. I've been to see

00:49:49.360 the bombed out churches in Northern Iraq. So I've, I've seen churches that are in places where they are

00:49:56.740 doing the absolute most with the least amount of resources. And that's what I saw when I visited

00:50:04.140 Pastor Vernon's church. Now, without giving away too much of what you plan to do, because I mean,

00:50:11.380 you don't work for us, you work for Pastor Vernon and the Full Gospel Outreach Center. What is the

00:50:19.180 vague plan of attack here? Yeah, absolutely. So part of what we've been doing on, on a number of these

00:50:26.840 church defenses is first looking at the facts, what, you know, happened around the time of the

00:50:32.580 circumstances, the alleged circumstances, and, and does that really fit what these, these new laws

00:50:39.760 are supposed to be doing and providing for the public? Um, so just doing a review of the facts

00:50:45.300 and seeing if there's any way on those facts that, you know, this doesn't fit what the purpose of the

00:50:50.080 law is. Um, and then also considering charter rights, uh, it's one of our fundamental freedoms in

00:50:55.900 the charter to have a right to religion and a right to practice your religion. And so that is one of the,

00:51:02.480 the big questions that come up in all of these, uh, these defenses is at right to assembly, right to

00:51:08.620 association, right to freedom of religion, right to freedom of speech. So, uh, we're going to kind of

00:51:13.780 attack it as a two prong. Uh, I think I've mentioned before in the show that we, we look at the facts, see if

00:51:19.180 there's, you know, a factual analysis, that's kind of our, our first step. And on the second side,

00:51:25.920 our two prong approach is addressing the charter issues. Well, Sarah, I want to thank you so much

00:51:31.340 for agreeing to take on this case. It's a, it's a big one. It's egregious. $14,000 is a lot to ask of

00:51:37.020 any church, but especially this church that is doing such good work, um, feeding the, the hungry and

00:51:45.560 clothing, the, the poor and the cold in downtown Prince Albert. Um, it's just, it egregious to see

00:51:54.660 the amount that they were fined. And I think that people fighting for their own religious freedom

00:52:00.300 have a good friend with you, Sarah. Thank you so much. Great. Thank you, Sheila. Now here's where you

00:52:05.480 can help me help Pastor Vern continue to help the homeless, the addicted, the marginalized, and the poor

00:52:13.680 in Prince Albert, Saskatchewan. Fighting this enormous fine and fighting for religious freedom

00:52:20.560 in Saskatchewan is going to cost a lot of money in legal fees, but Sarah Miller is one of the best 1.00

00:52:28.620 and she's been successful so far. And I think she's absolutely the right person for the job. And we are

00:52:35.200 already winning these cases with your help and your donations at fightthefines.com. If you go to that

00:52:43.360 special website, fightthefines.com, you can see all of our previous cases and our recurrent victories

00:52:50.660 that are already starting to trickle in. There's Walter Matheson, the man who is fined for eating a muffin

00:52:55.880 in a Tim Hortons parking lot, Tamara Ugolini. She's now a rebel news reporter, but at the time she was just 0.87

00:53:01.520 a lady wanting to walk on her local beach. And the aforementioned street preacher, Arter Poloski.

00:53:09.940 These are all fight the fines cases that we won with your help and your donations. And maybe you

00:53:17.440 don't care about religious freedom and you know what? That's fine too. But maybe you care that $14,000

00:53:24.340 is an atrocious fine for anybody to be given for singing without a mask on. And maybe you care about

00:53:31.920 people who find it their calling to help those of us with nothing, because that's Pastor Vern.

00:53:39.600 Please go to fightthefines.com to help us help Vernon Temple today. For Rebel News, I'm Sheila Gunnery.

00:53:47.840 Well, let me read you my letters. That's Sheila video. She's the best, isn't she?

00:54:04.160 On my show last night, John writes, cops are becoming goons for hire. Overtime hours add up

00:54:08.740 real fast for a small army standing around doing nothing. You know, it's frustrating to me that

00:54:13.120 police can be used as such political props. I sort of don't mind the idea that you can hire a cop to

00:54:19.360 guard a school or a church or a synagogue. I remember as a kid, there were police guarding

00:54:24.700 the synagogues in Calgary on the high holidays. Just, you know, make sure nothing happened. I think 1.00

00:54:29.720 that's okay. But for such a political muscle flexing, it gives me the creeps that you can hire police as

00:54:36.920 some sort of private mercenary army. I don't think it looks good on the cops. Guard a school, sure,

00:54:41.900 fill your boots, but be part of a political showdown between a mayor and an intransigent

00:54:46.720 restauranteur. I don't like the looks of them. Susan writes, I just don't understand that if

00:54:52.280 places like Costco and Walmart can operate as non-spreaders of the China virus, why small

00:54:57.840 businesses can't implement similar practices to keep their customers safe and therefore remain

00:55:02.280 open? Well, not just that, but restaurants actually train food safety, cleanliness, hygiene. It's a

00:55:09.020 higher standard of training and regulation than a Costco or a Walmart that's not a restaurant.

00:55:15.680 So I don't think it makes any sense other than, as we told you before, Walmart hired two in Ontario,

00:55:21.800 two of Doug Ford's senior staff as lobbyists to lobby the government to let them stay open. So

00:55:27.740 I guess it's who you know. Our last letter, Corey writes, great professional reporting by Drea,

00:55:33.700 a good hire, I think, Ezra. Drea is amazing. I'm so proud of her. And our whole Rebel team has done

00:55:39.640 very well during the pandemic and it's growing. I should have news for you as soon as tomorrow

00:55:43.680 about a new teammate joining us too. Well, that's our show for today. Until next time,

00:55:48.500 on behalf of all of us here at Rebel World Headquarters, to you at home, good night and keep fighting for freedom.

00:55:53.060 We'll be right back.

Rebel News Podcast - December 03, 2020

What does Erin O’Toole have to say about the pandemic？

Episode Stats

Summary

Transcript