Rebel News Podcast - Why I'm going to London to cover Tommy Robinson's appeal

00:00:00.000 Tonight, I'm off to London to cover Tommy Robinson's appeal.

00:00:03.740 I'll tell you why.

00:00:04.900 It's July 13th and you're watching The Ezra LeVance Show.

00:00:12.960 Why should others go to jail when you're a biggest carbon consumer I know?

00:00:16.740 There's 8,500 customers here and you won't give them an answer.

00:00:20.460 You come here once a year with a sign and you feel morally superior.

00:00:23.800 The only thing I have to say to the government about why I publish it

00:00:27.400 is because it's my bloody right to do so.

00:00:30.000 Our former reporter Tommy Robinson is finally getting a proper appeal in court in London

00:00:39.360 on July 18th.

00:00:41.140 I'm going to go over there to cover it.

00:00:43.200 I'm not leaving just yet.

00:00:44.220 I'll still be here in Canada early next week.

00:00:46.600 But I thought I'd tell you why I'm going to go and what I think about it

00:00:50.620 and what I think it's about and why I still care,

00:00:52.900 even though Tommy left our company months ago to go independent.

00:00:55.780 As you know, Tommy was reporting live outside a courthouse in Leeds in the north of England

00:01:01.900 on May 25th outside a trial where 27 men and two women were being prosecuted

00:01:08.100 for running a rape gang targeting British girls as young as 11 years old.

00:01:14.080 These rape gangs are almost always Muslim, usually Pakistani Muslim, 1.00

00:01:18.140 and the victims are almost always indigenous white girls.

00:01:22.100 In Britain, sometimes Sikh girls too.

00:01:25.820 These rape gangs work systematically. 0.98

00:01:27.700 It's not rape as we know it in Canada where a mugger drags a woman into a back alley.

00:01:31.520 It's tricking and trapping, targeting children as young as 11 in the case of Leeds,

00:01:36.300 offering them candy, offering them soda pop, cigarettes, liquor, even cash,

00:01:42.280 and then extorting them, give a teenage girl a drink of liquor,

00:01:45.540 and then threaten to tell their mother they've been drinking unless they kiss the men

00:01:50.960 and then threaten to show a picture of that kiss unless they have sex with the men 1.00

00:01:55.040 and then threaten to burn down their family house unless they continue to do so.

00:01:58.940 So it's called grooming, but that's not the right word because that sounds proper and pleasant.

00:02:03.460 This is extortion and entrapment and psychological manipulation and predation.

00:02:08.040 It's men hunting together as a wolf pack, hunting little lambs together,

00:02:12.420 frightening them, using the girls' own kindness and trust and love for their families against them.

00:02:17.800 So these rapes, they don't just happen once. 0.79

00:02:20.020 Once these girls are trapped, they're raped again and again, 1.00

00:02:22.980 often many times in the night by a gang of men.

00:02:25.360 The girls are trapped and they are passed around. 0.72

00:02:27.000 It's Islamic in its character.

00:02:29.140 The defendants in trials often justify it on racial and religious grounds.

00:02:34.080 The British girls are targeted because they're infidels. 1.00

00:02:37.180 And the Muslim prophet Muhammad himself said you can take infidel women as rape slaves. 1.00

00:02:42.480 It's why ISIS did so. 0.99

00:02:44.300 It's Islamic in character, which is why the police, the prosecutors, the politicians, 1.00

00:02:48.220 the press, the social workers, hospital workers, everyone in the establishment is so afraid to talk about it

00:02:52.840 because they're more afraid of themselves being called racist than they are afraid of some lower class girls being raped on an industrial scale.

00:03:02.040 1,400 girls at least in the small city of Rotherham, UK.

00:03:06.460 There's only a quarter million citizens in Rotherham.

00:03:08.860 1,400 girls raped.

00:03:11.180 That is a measurable percentage and everyone knew.

00:03:14.340 But no one spoke up for years so afraid they were about being called Islamophobic.

00:03:20.000 That's what Tommy's against.

00:03:21.600 Not just the Islamification of the UK in general, but the Islamic mass rape of British girls. 1.00

00:03:28.300 Children.

00:03:29.360 Almost all of them are kids.

00:03:30.400 It's horrific.

00:03:30.980 These are, there are estimates that as many as one million British women and girls have been raped.

00:03:36.140 A million.

00:03:36.780 And we'll never know because the police and politicians and the press would never tell us the statistics because there would be riots.

00:03:45.160 Tommy started the EDL, the English Defense League, in response to this.

00:03:48.960 In part, he was called racist and far right.

00:03:50.700 He's neither.

00:03:51.780 Most of Tommy's people are actually leftists.

00:03:54.360 They all vote labor.

00:03:55.500 They aren't racist.

00:03:57.360 Tommy's friends include other minorities, like I say, including Sikh activists who want to stop the Muslim rape gangs targeting Sikh girls.

00:04:04.880 But it was easier for the fancy people to write off Tommy as a lout, a soccer hooligan, as they write off all blue-collar working-class Brits that way.

00:04:12.640 It's not the rich girls, the connected girls, getting raped in Rotherham.

00:04:15.720 It's the poor girls. 1.00

00:04:17.040 Nobody's nothing, says the singer Morrissey would say.

00:04:20.680 So Tommy was against that, and he was reporting on a rape gang in Leeds, 29 accused, including two Muslim women who helped set up this extortion system.

00:04:30.100 And then police swept down to arrest Tommy.

00:04:33.160 This is free speech.

00:04:44.420 This is where we're at.

00:04:45.740 You're not even allowed to.

00:04:46.860 Look at this.

00:04:47.640 Look how many people.

00:04:48.380 Do you know when you do this?

00:04:51.500 More people.

00:04:52.840 More people are going to watch this now than ever.

00:05:01.080 This is ridiculous, lads.

00:05:02.000 Do you feel right what you're doing here?

00:05:03.620 I haven't said a word.

00:05:04.740 In fact, someone laid their hand and assaulted me outside court.

00:05:07.380 Other people have sworeed me and threatened me about my mother, and here I am being arrested for saying nothing.

00:05:12.180 I'm threatened to behead me.

00:05:13.260 I've done nothing.

00:05:14.460 What are they arresting you for, Tommy?

00:05:15.460 A breach of the peace.

00:05:16.560 Apparently I'm inciting on my video.

00:05:18.900 Can you please, George, get me a solicitor.

00:05:21.240 Yeah.

00:05:21.600 Because I'm there.

00:05:22.280 Because I've got this.

00:05:22.960 You don't know.

00:05:23.300 I want us to spend a sentence.

00:05:24.440 You say that.

00:05:25.640 Yeah, that's actually done nothing wrong.

00:05:27.320 You can start anything like that.

00:05:28.780 Let's see.

00:05:29.240 Police said he was causing a disturbance.

00:05:32.400 He was not.

00:05:33.420 He was by himself on the street, only with a couple of friends, talking into a cell phone camera that was broadcasting on his Facebook page.

00:05:39.920 It was not a disturbance.

00:05:41.180 He was not breaching the peace.

00:05:42.800 He was not on the property of the court.

00:05:44.640 He did not call the accused rapists rapists.

00:05:47.500 He called them accused rapists, alleged rapists.

00:05:50.300 And when he read out the names of the accused, he did so by reading from the British government's own website.

00:05:55.460 The state broadcaster, the BBC, which to this day lists the names of the accused.

00:05:59.580 Tommy did not read anything from the trial itself.

00:06:02.360 He did not attend the trial.

00:06:03.680 He couldn't have violated any court publication ban.

00:06:06.160 He didn't know what had happened in court to violate a ban.

00:06:08.520 And he didn't claim to know.

00:06:09.880 He simply stood outside the court for 70 minutes and talked about the issues much the same way as I'm doing right now.

00:06:15.900 And yet he was scooped up, arrested by seven police.

00:06:18.720 You saw it prosecuted for contempt of court, convicted in less than 15 minutes and sentenced to 13 months in prison.

00:06:24.760 Oh, and then a publication ban was put on top of it to boot.

00:06:28.840 The 13 months was absurd, but it was allegedly justified in that Tommy had been convicted of contempt of court a year ago in Canterbury for doing much the same reporting on a rape gang.

00:06:37.540 That's when Tommy worked for us.

00:06:39.000 But I knew because of that that this was an absurd hearing in a matter of minutes without Tommy having the ability to retain or instruct effective counsel.

00:06:46.440 It all happened.

00:06:47.040 And so suddenly, why, why, and why such an absurdly long sentence?

00:06:50.700 And why was Tommy then moved from his prison in Hull, which was probably the safest prison in the UK for him to be in, in terms of the lack of Muslim gangs? 1.00

00:06:59.320 Why was he moved from there to the prison in Onley, which is dominated by violent Muslim gangs? 1.00

00:07:04.200 So much so that Tommy requested the warden put him in solitary confinement for his own safety.

00:07:09.100 He's held in a cell for 23 and a half hours a day by himself.

00:07:12.120 You cannot live that way, not for one month, let alone 13.

00:07:15.460 Why was he moved to Onley prison?

00:07:17.420 What was the reason?

00:07:19.340 Why was the sentence 13 months to begin with?

00:07:22.140 What exactly did he do wrong?

00:07:23.800 I watched the video.

00:07:25.100 Why did it all have to happen so quickly in his trial?

00:07:27.400 And why the publication ban?

00:07:28.640 Why, why, why?

00:07:30.020 Those are interesting questions.

00:07:31.400 And like him or hate him, Tommy Robinson is an interesting person.

00:07:34.900 So why the lack of curiosity from all the media in the world, including Fleet Street, in some ways the most competitive newspaper business in the English language.

00:07:43.620 Why no inquiries?

00:07:44.700 Why no investigations?

00:07:45.740 It's right there in the UK.

00:07:46.900 Why was the media happy to have him sentenced and thrown away?

00:07:51.000 Why not a peep from Amnesty International?

00:07:53.360 Why not a word from Reporters Without Borders, from the rest of the civil liberty set?

00:07:57.200 Why not a word from any elected politician in all of the UK, except for one UKIP peer from the House of Lords and the UKIP leader himself in the European Parliament?

00:08:06.500 Why no one else?

00:08:08.280 There was a rally in London and Geert Wilders attended to speak.

00:08:12.080 Wonderful.

00:08:12.480 A Dutch politician pushing for freedom in London.

00:08:14.980 Well, tomorrow there is another rally in London and Wilders was again set to speak.

00:08:19.200 But look at this news.

00:08:20.480 Wilders announced he was going to go.

00:08:22.320 But then the British Foreign Office told the Dutch government that they not only would not provide security for Wilders, as they normally do as a diplomatic courtesy,

00:08:30.740 but they would ban the Dutch diplomatic police from escorting Wilders, as they usually do.

00:08:36.060 Now, Wilders is a target for terrorist attacks, just like Salman Rushdie is.

00:08:41.080 So the British government was absolutely saying, we don't have the courage or honesty to ban you.

00:08:45.140 So we'll pretend we're not banning you, but we will turn a walk on a British street for a rally into a suicide terrorist trap for you, 0.85

00:08:53.800 so you'll have to back away, Geert Wilders.

00:08:55.800 It's cowardly.

00:08:56.500 It's outrageous.

00:08:57.440 The UK allows foreign tyrants to visit London all the time, including recently the King of Saudi Arabia.

00:09:02.140 He's allowed bodyguards, but not the democratic leader, Geert Wilders,

00:09:05.720 because it's part of the unethical, immoral war against Tommy Robinson.

00:09:09.180 But we have news.

00:09:11.340 The news is that on July 18th, there will finally be an appeal of the sentence.

00:09:15.920 It's too late for my liking.

00:09:17.940 It's too slow.

00:09:18.600 It should have happened months ago.

00:09:20.860 It should never have been necessary.

00:09:22.180 But here it is, July 18th, and it's incredible.

00:09:25.580 It's a three-judge panel.

00:09:27.880 And the judge presiding is Lord Justice Ian Burnett,

00:09:31.180 the Lord Chief Justice of all of England and Wales, the top judge in the entire country.

00:09:35.640 It would be like having the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court of the United States hear a case in the U.S.

00:09:40.400 Amazing.

00:09:40.980 Top judge.

00:09:41.680 Top court.

00:09:42.360 I think there's a real chance things will be aired out.

00:09:44.700 All those questions I listed earlier.

00:09:46.480 I know there might be some conspiracy theorists who, with some justification,

00:09:50.720 point to every other stitch-up so far for Tommy, every other rigged rule,

00:09:54.620 every other time he was framed, even the latest scandal with the Geert Wilders security thing.

00:09:58.580 But I am hopeful enough, I still believe in the UK enough,

00:10:02.100 to think it's finally, finally going to be a fair hearing in a fair court.

00:10:07.500 And Tommy, through his family, has sent word from prison to specifically ask me to go to London to report on it.

00:10:14.500 They contacted me to tell me that Tommy has requested that, and I get it.

00:10:18.720 I get why, because Tommy knows me from when we worked together,

00:10:21.640 and he knows I've been helping with his crowdfunding this past month.

00:10:24.540 He authorized it.

00:10:25.480 But more than that, he knows that there is no mainstream media in the entire UK

00:10:28.740 who are trustworthy on this file.

00:10:30.300 None. Maybe one reporter here or there, but none of the newspapers,

00:10:33.800 none of the TV stations will be positive or fair to him.

00:10:36.780 None. They all despise Tommy.

00:10:38.080 And, of course, they despise so many of their own readers and viewers, too.

00:10:41.080 But they are all in collusion to cover up what Tommy was uncovering.

00:10:44.700 And then there's the class thing, too.

00:10:46.260 They despise an uppity, working-class bloke like Tommy Robinson,

00:10:49.880 who is speaking for his people when the establishment won't.

00:10:52.540 Doesn't he know his place?

00:10:54.760 And they hate that Tommy is a hero to his people, to millions of them,

00:10:58.000 so they hate that, so they attack him, the BBC, the tabloids, even the prestige press.

00:11:03.220 So Tommy asked me to go to report because he knows the media will all lie about him.

00:11:07.680 Of course they will. They always do.

00:11:09.260 And though there might be some citizen journalists there,

00:11:11.340 or even a handful of journalists from places like Breitbart, London,

00:11:14.500 or a few niche publications,

00:11:16.640 we at The Rebel will have more reach than they do.

00:11:19.280 We have more viewers. We'll get the word out.

00:11:20.960 So I accepted his invitation, and I'll be flying out there next week.

00:11:25.040 And I really think that I'm going to cover the appeal of a political prisoner.

00:11:28.760 I think that's what Tommy is. This wasn't a crime, what he did.

00:11:31.580 A contempt of court, as Tommy was convicted, is not a crime.

00:11:34.920 And Tommy obviously didn't hurt anyone.

00:11:36.400 There was no criminal trial of Tommy.

00:11:38.620 He's in solitary confinement.

00:11:40.520 They'll let that sink in.

00:11:41.480 Tommy is not convicted of a crime,

00:11:43.420 and yet he's been in solitary confinement for almost two months now.

00:11:47.140 That's more than any murderer would get in the hole, as they call it, in prison.

00:11:51.300 And imagine if he actually had to serve all 13 months,

00:11:53.820 as the judge demanded, in solitary.

00:11:55.980 This is so wrong.

00:11:57.400 I don't know what we will find out at the appeal.

00:11:59.500 We will find out what we will find out.

00:12:01.020 And I will be there.

00:12:01.680 I will file a video report before and after court

00:12:05.100 and at noon hour and every coffee break, whatever.

00:12:09.520 And if it's allowed, I'll report on Twitter

00:12:11.360 during the hearing itself from the courtroom.

00:12:13.300 I'll have to check to make sure that's allowed.

00:12:15.220 I don't want to be held in contempt myself.

00:12:17.160 So that's what I'm going to do.

00:12:18.620 Because Tommy is, you know, he's being silenced.

00:12:23.480 Like the girls of Rotherham were silenced.

00:12:26.340 Like Herod Wilders is being silenced.

00:12:28.460 Maybe like we will be silenced one day.

00:12:31.020 But for now, I'm going there to report.

00:12:32.980 And what can you do?

00:12:33.800 Well, I have three specific suggestions.

00:12:36.040 Number one, did you know you can send Tommy a letter?

00:12:39.100 You can do that.

00:12:39.760 Now, beneath this video,

00:12:40.960 we will have the instructions on how to send Tommy an email in prison.

00:12:44.780 And I know that he gets them delivered to his cell.

00:12:47.380 His wife told me.

00:12:48.940 He likes these letters, you can imagine,

00:12:50.680 because otherwise he would go mad

00:12:52.020 in that tiny little cell, 23 and a half hours a day.

00:12:56.260 You go to emailaprisoner.com.

00:12:59.020 That's not our website.

00:12:59.980 That's a company that specializes in writing to prisoners.

00:13:02.340 And you enter his proper legal name and prison name and prisoner number.

00:13:06.720 All that info is below this video.

00:13:09.260 Tommy loves the letters and you can wish him well.

00:13:12.280 He can't write back, but he reads what he gets.

00:13:15.580 That's the first thing.

00:13:16.640 Send him a letter just to say hi,

00:13:18.420 just to give him something to do for 23 and a half hours a day.

00:13:22.240 Second, if you haven't already, chip into his legal defense fund.

00:13:25.240 That's at savetommy.com.

00:13:27.460 100% of those funds go to his lawyer

00:13:29.340 and 100% of the surplus goes to his family.

00:13:33.360 The third thing, and this is a fun thing,

00:13:35.700 and it's a free thing,

00:13:37.140 and I've done it myself,

00:13:39.160 is download a Tommy Robinson ringtone for your smartphone.

00:13:42.500 Now, I know that sounds silly,

00:13:43.640 but it is fun and it is a conversation starter

00:13:46.820 and it's free.

00:13:47.720 And if you're wondering what the ringtone is,

00:13:49.140 it's this sound.

00:13:50.060 Come on, Tommy!

00:13:52.680 Come on, Tommy!

00:13:54.240 Come on, Tommy!

00:13:55.660 Come on, Tommy!

00:13:56.680 Come on, Tommy!

00:13:57.940 Tommy!

00:13:59.100 Come on, Tommy!

00:14:00.660 Come on, Tommy!

00:14:01.100 Come on, Tommy!

00:14:02.220 We've taken that audio of that chant,

00:14:04.260 oh, Tommy, Tommy,

00:14:05.240 and we've made a ringtone for your phone.

00:14:06.940 Go to tommyringtone.com

00:14:09.140 and you can download it for free

00:14:10.640 and we have some very easy-to-follow video instructions

00:14:13.720 for how to get your phone,

00:14:16.400 when someone phones you,

00:14:17.720 it rings,

00:14:18.460 it plays that sound as your ringtone.

00:14:19.780 I had to follow those video instructions.

00:14:21.280 I didn't know how to do it.

00:14:22.180 But if I can figure it out,

00:14:23.080 you can figure it out.

00:14:24.760 And the fourth thing you can do,

00:14:27.780 and it would be a good favor to me,

00:14:29.360 Tommy wants me to go to London

00:14:30.580 and I will go to London,

00:14:31.560 but he told me with less than a week's notice,

00:14:33.560 so the airfare was very expensive

00:14:35.160 and the hotel rooms were very expensive.

00:14:37.520 It was more than $2,500, I'm afraid to say,

00:14:40.160 even though I booked economically on Expedia.

00:14:42.440 Now, I don't want to take money

00:14:43.540 from Tommy's official crowdfunding budget

00:14:45.380 for his lawyers, for his family for that,

00:14:47.260 so I am not going to.

00:14:48.720 I've set up a special crowdfund,

00:14:50.540 a different one,

00:14:51.260 just to get me over there

00:14:52.560 to report on the appeal.

00:14:54.180 And it's called TommyTrial.com.

00:14:56.840 We've got a lot of websites, don't we?

00:14:58.800 TommyTrial.com.

00:15:00.520 If you can help me cover my flight and hotel,

00:15:02.180 I'd be very grateful.

00:15:02.960 So that's my report.

00:15:04.460 Now, I know some people,

00:15:05.400 even around here,

00:15:06.020 say,

00:15:06.260 why are you so obsessed with Tommy Robinson?

00:15:09.240 Well, I'm not really.

00:15:10.620 I mean, he's an ex-employee

00:15:12.280 and he's a friend,

00:15:12.980 not a close friend,

00:15:13.600 but we're friends enough.

00:15:15.100 But that's not why.

00:15:16.120 It's because Tommy is a champion

00:15:19.140 for those without a voice,

00:15:20.660 for those without a friend.

00:15:21.800 He's the last lion in the United Kingdom,

00:15:24.240 the last man of courage,

00:15:25.520 at least on this file.

00:15:27.000 There are a few other great Brits.

00:15:28.380 I really like that Nigel Farage

00:15:29.700 who fought for Brexit, don't you?

00:15:31.880 I like a lot of Brits,

00:15:32.740 but no one fights for the people like Tommy,

00:15:35.240 especially against this issue,

00:15:37.200 the Islamification of the UK, 0.95

00:15:38.660 the Muslim rape gangs. 0.91

00:15:39.780 Everyone else is too afraid,

00:15:40.720 too afraid of being killed,

00:15:41.920 too afraid of being called racist.

00:15:44.040 Tommy fights.

00:15:45.160 I'm actually not doing this

00:15:45.900 for Tommy as a person.

00:15:46.820 I mean, I like him well enough

00:15:47.780 and I like his family well enough.

00:15:49.040 We're chums.

00:15:49.980 But that's not why I'm going to London.

00:15:51.580 I'm going there for the larger cause

00:15:53.140 that Tommy champions

00:15:54.460 for all those young girls

00:15:56.100 he stands up for.

00:15:57.760 It's for what Tommy does,

00:15:59.020 not for who Tommy is

00:16:00.080 that motivates us.

00:16:02.620 When Tommy's out of prison,

00:16:03.820 when he's safe and sound,

00:16:04.960 I'll take a break from Tommy.

00:16:06.320 He's more than a handful,

00:16:07.420 I can tell you,

00:16:08.100 from the year I worked with him.

00:16:09.200 My mission is narrow.

00:16:10.640 Crowdfund his lawyers

00:16:11.480 and go to London

00:16:12.460 to report on his appeal.

00:16:13.820 And once he's out of jail,

00:16:14.760 I'll give him a big handshake,

00:16:16.380 might even give him a hug,

00:16:17.540 I'll wish him well,

00:16:18.420 and then I'm going to come back

00:16:19.180 to Canada.

00:16:20.140 And I don't want him

00:16:21.000 to work for us again

00:16:22.500 in the rebel.

00:16:23.100 He's too much of a stubborn mule, 0.99

00:16:24.820 as you can imagine,

00:16:25.920 which is exactly why

00:16:26.920 he's perfect to fight

00:16:27.860 for the future of the UK.

00:16:29.600 We'll always be friends with him

00:16:30.840 and we'll support him

00:16:31.620 from afar.

00:16:32.940 And God forbid

00:16:33.700 he gets into a jam again,

00:16:35.460 we will be there for him,

00:16:36.500 but we hope that doesn't happen.

00:16:38.840 We'll be there for him,

00:16:39.940 not because he's such a character,

00:16:41.100 even though he is.

00:16:42.680 Not because he's a lovable rascal,

00:16:44.300 though he is,

00:16:44.840 but because without him

00:16:46.940 and his fight,

00:16:48.200 I feel like the lights

00:16:49.280 are going out

00:16:50.000 in the United Kingdom

00:16:50.920 and that's just not something

00:16:53.000 any of us want to see.

00:16:54.840 If you can help me

00:16:55.500 get to London next week,

00:16:56.820 please do go to

00:16:57.760 TommyTrial.com.

00:16:58.920 In any event,

00:16:59.780 I promise you not only

00:17:00.560 the best coverage

00:17:01.260 of the appeal,

00:17:01.900 but frankly,

00:17:02.840 the only real coverage

00:17:04.500 of his appeal

00:17:05.300 that isn't a pack of lies

00:17:06.720 for the establishment.

00:17:09.080 Stay with us for more.

00:17:11.940 I'm happy to say today

00:17:28.080 the CEO

00:17:29.580 and the board of Hydro One,

00:17:31.660 they're gone,

00:17:32.840 they're done.

00:17:34.040 They're done.

00:17:35.240 We're going to turn

00:17:35.820 a new corner.

00:17:37.060 We're going to make sure

00:17:37.940 we keep with our promise

00:17:39.660 of reducing hydro rates

00:17:40.840 by 12%,

00:17:41.800 making our businesses

00:17:43.740 more competitive,

00:17:45.620 making sure

00:17:46.360 that we take the burden

00:17:48.000 off the people of Ontario

00:17:50.080 when it comes

00:17:50.880 to their hydro bills.

00:17:52.120 Well, there you have it.

00:17:53.320 The new Premier of Ontario,

00:17:54.900 Doug Ford,

00:17:55.520 keeping a huge promise.

00:17:57.840 I mean,

00:17:57.980 I suppose $6 million

00:17:59.300 is not enormous

00:18:00.500 in the scope

00:18:01.360 of the entire budget,

00:18:02.440 but by God,

00:18:03.320 it was symbolic.

00:18:03.660 The president

00:18:05.620 of a public utility

00:18:07.280 called Hydro One

00:18:08.600 made almost $6.2 million

00:18:12.280 last year,

00:18:13.680 up $1.7 million

00:18:15.000 from the year before.

00:18:16.480 I mean,

00:18:16.600 I guess he was doing

00:18:17.280 that great a job

00:18:18.020 even though Ontarians

00:18:18.880 pay some of the highest

00:18:20.360 electricity prices

00:18:21.680 in the entire province.

00:18:22.860 Well,

00:18:23.060 how did he manage to do it?

00:18:25.120 How did he get

00:18:25.880 the CEO

00:18:26.840 and the whole board

00:18:28.000 to go away

00:18:28.600 without the gazillion dollars

00:18:31.360 worth of penalties

00:18:32.420 that people thought

00:18:34.000 he would be entitled to?

00:18:35.280 Joining us now

00:18:35.920 to help us unravel

00:18:37.500 this mystery

00:18:38.260 is our friend Jerry Agar.

00:18:39.460 He's the host

00:18:39.960 of News Talk 1010

00:18:42.020 weekdays from 9 to 12

00:18:43.300 in Toronto.

00:18:44.260 Jerry,

00:18:44.420 it's great to see you again.

00:18:45.460 Thanks for coming on the show.

00:18:47.140 Thanks for having me, Ezra.

00:18:49.180 You know,

00:18:49.720 a lot of these boards

00:18:50.460 and agencies,

00:18:51.560 they really burrow

00:18:52.960 into the government.

00:18:54.000 They write these

00:18:54.520 sweetheart contracts,

00:18:56.300 termination clauses,

00:18:57.460 extremely luxurious

00:18:58.740 that if you want

00:18:59.340 to sack a guy,

00:19:00.680 you got to make him

00:19:01.300 a gazillionaire.

00:19:02.100 How did Doug Ford

00:19:03.260 manage to say goodbye

00:19:04.080 to the whole board

00:19:04.900 and the CEO

00:19:06.160 with just a fraction

00:19:07.800 of a fraction

00:19:08.440 of the severance

00:19:09.160 everyone thought

00:19:09.760 he'd have to pay?

00:19:11.160 Well,

00:19:11.660 that's actually

00:19:12.200 an open question

00:19:12.840 at the moment.

00:19:13.340 How exactly

00:19:13.820 did that happen?

00:19:14.640 And I'm going to theorize

00:19:15.440 on that in a moment,

00:19:16.340 but just in case

00:19:17.080 somebody is not familiar

00:19:18.560 with how this all transpired

00:19:20.260 over the last several years,

00:19:21.700 energy prices,

00:19:22.640 as you alluded to,

00:19:23.960 Ezra,

00:19:24.560 have been controversial

00:19:25.760 in Ontario

00:19:26.900 for quite some time

00:19:28.080 in a real election issue.

00:19:29.360 And then there were

00:19:30.620 several things

00:19:31.280 that made Hydro One

00:19:32.200 itself specifically

00:19:33.400 controversial.

00:19:34.240 One was that in order

00:19:35.600 to try and balance

00:19:36.420 a budget,

00:19:37.300 the Kathleen Wynne government

00:19:38.520 sold off part of Hydro One

00:19:40.520 to private entities.

00:19:42.280 So there was that.

00:19:43.660 And then there was

00:19:44.080 the $6 million compensation

00:19:45.520 for Mail Schmidt,

00:19:46.520 the CEO.

00:19:47.640 And Doug Ford,

00:19:48.680 as part of his campaign,

00:19:49.680 started referring to him

00:19:50.760 as the $6 million man

00:19:52.680 and said he's gone

00:19:53.840 day one.

00:19:55.300 And all kinds of newspaper

00:19:57.000 editorial writers

00:19:57.980 lectured Doug Ford

00:19:58.980 that maybe he didn't

00:19:59.660 understand how this worked.

00:20:01.020 He didn't have the legal

00:20:01.800 authority to do it.

00:20:03.020 If he did do it,

00:20:04.000 he'd have to give

00:20:04.880 Mail Schmidt

00:20:05.580 a 10 point something

00:20:07.000 million dollar

00:20:07.860 goodbye package.

00:20:09.780 And in fact,

00:20:10.820 the very morning

00:20:12.220 that this happened,

00:20:14.060 the Toronto Star

00:20:15.300 had written about,

00:20:16.460 oh, we thought on day one

00:20:18.060 he was going to get rid

00:20:18.840 of the $6 million man.

00:20:20.400 Well, at 445 day one,

00:20:22.380 the $6 million man

00:20:23.480 left with $400,000.

00:20:25.620 And the board has said

00:20:26.620 that they will all

00:20:27.600 leave as well.

00:20:28.660 Why would somebody leave

00:20:29.680 $10 million on the table?

00:20:31.340 I have no idea.

00:20:32.800 But the rich aren't

00:20:33.800 like the rest of us.

00:20:34.780 And maybe he just decided,

00:20:36.940 Ezra, you know,

00:20:38.040 if that's what you think of me,

00:20:39.680 I'm out of here.

00:20:40.760 I don't have to deal with this.

00:20:42.040 I have millions

00:20:42.500 in the bank anyway.

00:20:43.900 Yeah.

00:20:44.260 And of course,

00:20:46.000 when you're making

00:20:46.960 that kind of dough,

00:20:47.900 you've got a lot of money

00:20:48.940 for lawyers,

00:20:49.500 but no one has more money

00:20:50.760 for lawyers

00:20:51.360 than the premier

00:20:52.580 of the province.

00:20:53.440 He's got the whole

00:20:53.980 Justice Department.

00:20:55.300 So it could have been

00:20:56.040 very lengthy litigation

00:20:57.400 and it could have been brutal.

00:20:59.320 You're right.

00:20:59.680 We may never know.

00:21:01.480 But if his contract

00:21:03.160 called for a $10.7 million

00:21:04.940 severance

00:21:05.620 and he walked away

00:21:06.360 with $400,000,

00:21:07.800 I mean, listen,

00:21:08.300 $400,000,

00:21:09.160 that's still a mighty

00:21:10.120 fine severance.

00:21:11.620 But it's a triviality

00:21:13.480 compared to what

00:21:14.160 he had on paper.

00:21:15.300 I have to say,

00:21:16.860 Jerry,

00:21:17.180 between this

00:21:17.880 and the repeal

00:21:18.740 of the controversial

00:21:20.120 child sex ed curriculum

00:21:22.040 and the scrapping

00:21:24.580 of the cap and trade

00:21:25.520 and coming out

00:21:26.120 against the carbon tax,

00:21:27.520 I can't recall

00:21:28.980 a premier

00:21:29.560 of any province,

00:21:31.260 let alone Ontario,

00:21:32.780 doing so much

00:21:34.020 so quickly.

00:21:35.520 And it's the height

00:21:36.300 of summer,

00:21:36.860 by the way,

00:21:37.400 when normally

00:21:38.480 politicians and bureaucrats

00:21:39.900 are sort of in idle mode

00:21:41.800 or barbecue circuit mode.

00:21:43.840 Jerry,

00:21:44.200 this is very impressive

00:21:45.220 to me.

00:21:45.620 I was a fan

00:21:46.160 to begin with,

00:21:46.760 but I was worried.

00:21:48.020 I'm a super fan now.

00:21:50.040 What do you think?

00:21:51.760 Well,

00:21:52.160 I think it's incredible

00:21:52.960 they've moved this quickly

00:21:53.900 and they're also doing things

00:21:55.340 that, of course,

00:21:56.200 their detractors said

00:21:57.360 they couldn't do.

00:21:58.940 When you said

00:21:59.600 you couldn't recall

00:22:00.440 somebody who's done that,

00:22:01.540 what came to mind for me

00:22:02.720 was the late brother

00:22:04.160 of the now premier

00:22:05.080 and that's the former mayor,

00:22:06.740 Rob Ford,

00:22:07.420 when everybody said

00:22:08.620 he couldn't contract out garbage,

00:22:10.560 that it was a city hall job

00:22:12.740 and he fairly quickly

00:22:14.560 got that done

00:22:15.340 and he did a whole list

00:22:16.400 of other things,

00:22:17.740 getting contracts

00:22:18.740 with the unions

00:22:19.580 without breaking the bank,

00:22:21.280 without allowing them

00:22:22.440 to strike during

00:22:23.140 the Pan Am games,

00:22:24.140 a whole bunch of stuff

00:22:24.960 that people thought

00:22:26.020 couldn't be done.

00:22:27.180 So maybe, Ezra,

00:22:28.800 the Toronto Star

00:22:29.720 editorial board

00:22:30.460 should start to catch on.

00:22:31.460 The Fords aren't as stupid

00:22:32.260 as the board thinks they are.

00:22:33.680 Yeah.

00:22:34.360 You know,

00:22:34.580 and there's also something

00:22:35.320 to be said about

00:22:36.180 having experience in business

00:22:37.800 where if you've got

00:22:39.460 to make a cut,

00:22:40.160 you just have to do it.

00:22:41.280 There's no wiggle room.

00:22:42.440 Unlike a tax collector,

00:22:44.420 you can't just order

00:22:45.560 more revenues.

00:22:47.340 A lot of politicians

00:22:48.520 these days

00:22:49.160 are sort of lifers.

00:22:50.580 They've either been

00:22:51.160 in politics their whole lives

00:22:52.300 or they've only worked

00:22:53.180 in other government institutions.

00:22:54.500 I think of Justin Trudeau's cabinet.

00:22:56.740 I really don't think

00:22:57.720 there's any private sector experience.

00:22:59.380 I mean,

00:22:59.500 I guess you could say

00:23:00.300 Bill Morneau,

00:23:01.200 but he sort of inherited that.

00:23:03.160 Whereas Doug Ford,

00:23:04.960 he actually had to

00:23:06.560 sweat a payroll.

00:23:07.840 He actually had to look

00:23:09.100 at his bank balance

00:23:09.980 and the company,

00:23:10.520 all the things

00:23:13.240 a private sector guy

00:23:14.160 has to do.

00:23:14.900 There's something to be said

00:23:16.200 about having done something

00:23:17.780 before getting into politics,

00:23:19.260 don't you think?

00:23:20.700 Yeah, I do.

00:23:21.480 And in case somebody

00:23:22.700 hears you say

00:23:23.520 Bill Morneau inherited that

00:23:24.660 and thinks that Doug Ford

00:23:26.060 inherited Deco Labels,

00:23:27.600 the company that is

00:23:28.520 their family fortune,

00:23:30.020 he did inherit that company

00:23:31.480 to an extent,

00:23:32.220 but a much smaller version of it

00:23:33.720 and in fact did not inherit

00:23:35.340 the Chicago operation.

00:23:36.780 He flew down there one day

00:23:38.020 with his manager

00:23:39.380 just deciding

00:23:40.060 we're going to open up

00:23:40.860 in Chicago

00:23:41.740 and found a facility

00:23:42.700 and found some people

00:23:43.560 and greatly expanded

00:23:45.420 the business.

00:23:46.080 So that gives him

00:23:47.660 the real solid understanding

00:23:48.960 and managerial experience

00:23:50.420 that you were alluding to.

00:23:52.260 Yeah, I remember

00:23:52.940 during the campaign

00:23:53.720 when he said

00:23:54.280 he was going to scrap

00:23:54.980 the carbon tax

00:23:55.720 and all the fancy pants,

00:23:58.180 economists, pundits,

00:23:59.640 none of whom have ever

00:24:00.600 worked in the real world

00:24:01.440 said, well,

00:24:02.160 now you've got

00:24:02.740 a $2 billion hole

00:24:03.840 in the budget.

00:24:04.900 This is good.

00:24:05.360 And Doug Ford said,

00:24:06.680 don't tell me

00:24:08.360 we can't find

00:24:09.140 a few percent

00:24:10.000 of fat here.

00:24:11.460 And he said it

00:24:12.300 so naturally

00:24:13.100 because of course

00:24:14.060 anyone,

00:24:14.700 I mean, listen,

00:24:15.240 in our own family budgets,

00:24:16.860 if you had to tighten

00:24:18.280 the belt by 2%,

00:24:19.240 you could do it

00:24:20.080 and it wouldn't even

00:24:20.700 be that bad.

00:24:21.880 2%, what's that?

00:24:22.780 Like going out

00:24:23.300 to a restaurant

00:24:24.500 one fewer times

00:24:25.580 a month?

00:24:26.380 So I think

00:24:27.120 all these sacred cows,

00:24:29.620 you're talking about

00:24:30.220 things the Toronto Star

00:24:31.240 said could never be done.

00:24:33.060 All the fancy people

00:24:34.180 said would never be done.

00:24:35.600 And I guess

00:24:36.600 if that's the world

00:24:37.220 you come from,

00:24:37.880 you believe those things

00:24:38.940 as an article of faith.

00:24:40.140 I like Doug's

00:24:41.820 outsider-ness.

00:24:43.240 I like it.

00:24:44.280 And I just got to say,

00:24:45.500 I mean,

00:24:45.620 I know I'm fanboying again,

00:24:47.580 but Jerry,

00:24:48.480 this is so encouraging

00:24:49.780 compared to what

00:24:50.700 Ontario has been

00:24:51.640 subject to do

00:24:52.380 under Kathleen Wynne

00:24:53.340 and Dalton McGinty

00:24:54.460 before her.

00:24:55.140 It's such a change.

00:24:57.300 Well,

00:24:57.620 it's an absolute

00:24:58.860 different,

00:24:59.680 above-face,

00:25:00.680 180-degree way

00:25:02.020 of viewing what

00:25:02.740 government is supposed

00:25:03.460 to do

00:25:03.840 and what things

00:25:04.380 ought to cost.

00:25:05.080 When you say,

00:25:05.980 could you take 2%

00:25:06.900 out of your household budget?

00:25:08.360 Well,

00:25:08.720 most people could.

00:25:09.720 Some people might not

00:25:10.460 be able to

00:25:11.060 at the very bottom edge

00:25:12.000 of the income levels,

00:25:13.100 but most people could.

00:25:15.060 But it's laughable

00:25:15.920 to say that you

00:25:16.580 couldn't do that

00:25:17.140 in government.

00:25:17.720 In fact,

00:25:18.040 I remember the first time

00:25:19.300 Doug Ford started

00:25:20.360 to float that

00:25:21.060 and he was on my radio show

00:25:22.420 and I said to him,

00:25:24.060 how are you going

00:25:24.420 to fund this?

00:25:25.020 And he said,

00:25:25.800 do you think we could

00:25:26.520 find 2%

00:25:27.460 at Queens Park?

00:25:29.260 And I laughed

00:25:30.180 and then he said,

00:25:31.220 yeah,

00:25:31.500 yeah,

00:25:31.700 that's the normal reaction.

00:25:33.240 Yeah.

00:25:33.800 You know,

00:25:34.440 I want to make a comparison

00:25:35.580 and I know that Doug Ford

00:25:36.680 himself doesn't like this,

00:25:38.000 but I don't care.

00:25:39.780 I want to compare him

00:25:41.260 to Trump

00:25:41.700 in these three ways.

00:25:43.560 Number one,

00:25:44.060 he's got some

00:25:44.540 private business experience.

00:25:46.200 He's obviously not a tycoon,

00:25:47.840 a billionaire like Trump,

00:25:49.560 but he knows how to read

00:25:51.480 some financial statements

00:25:53.020 and he knows how

00:25:53.540 to make a decision.

00:25:54.260 Number two,

00:25:55.480 he's not hypersensitive

00:25:57.940 and hyper-conscious

00:25:58.940 of pleasing the media.

00:26:01.060 He sort of likes

00:26:01.940 to fight with them

00:26:02.660 from time to time.

00:26:04.040 And number three,

00:26:05.780 the fancy people

00:26:06.780 look down on him,

00:26:08.400 but folksy people

00:26:10.100 of different backgrounds

00:26:11.060 like him

00:26:11.760 and maybe even more

00:26:13.400 than Trump,

00:26:14.520 Doug Ford connects

00:26:15.480 to new Canadians,

00:26:16.720 to ethnic communities

00:26:17.700 that,

00:26:18.500 I don't know,

00:26:18.880 the Ford family

00:26:19.500 has always had

00:26:20.100 sort of a special bond there.

00:26:21.920 In those three ways,

00:26:23.100 I think that,

00:26:24.220 I know that Doug Ford

00:26:25.780 doesn't want to be

00:26:26.440 compared to Trump,

00:26:26.980 but I think he is

00:26:27.800 a Trump-like figure

00:26:28.900 and I think he's inspiring

00:26:30.660 people across Canada

00:26:31.860 that they don't have

00:26:32.460 to sit back

00:26:33.100 and consider being liberal

00:26:35.680 an inevitability.

00:26:36.880 What do you think of that?

00:26:38.260 Yeah,

00:26:38.680 I don't know

00:26:39.340 that Trump connects

00:26:40.160 with new Americans.

00:26:42.240 Not as much,

00:26:42.860 no,

00:26:43.060 not as much,

00:26:43.560 definitely.

00:26:44.020 No,

00:26:44.260 not so much.

00:26:44.960 In fact,

00:26:45.420 to emphasize on that,

00:26:46.560 you know very well,

00:26:47.840 Ezra,

00:26:48.240 that one of the knocks

00:26:49.140 the left tries to put

00:26:50.080 on the right

00:26:50.680 is that it's a white boy club

00:26:52.980 and we don't care

00:26:53.740 about the unfortunate

00:26:54.480 and we don't care

00:26:55.300 about minorities

00:26:56.140 and from Rob Ford

00:26:57.680 to Doug Ford,

00:26:58.680 those people should go

00:26:59.820 to any of the rallies

00:27:00.900 that the Fords would have

00:27:02.100 and it's now,

00:27:02.720 of course,

00:27:02.960 because Rob has passed on,

00:27:04.080 just Doug,

00:27:04.720 but go to those rallies

00:27:05.840 and see who's there.

00:27:07.540 The rainbow of colors

00:27:10.820 that shows up

00:27:11.660 and the cross-section

00:27:13.960 of economic means,

00:27:16.060 it's unbelievable.

00:27:17.080 It's truly Canada.

00:27:18.260 It's truly Toronto.

00:27:19.500 Yeah,

00:27:19.680 much more so

00:27:20.420 than the stale old NDP.

00:27:22.460 You're right.

00:27:22.720 I mean,

00:27:23.000 I think Trump

00:27:24.080 does better

00:27:24.880 amongst minorities

00:27:26.040 than the media

00:27:26.480 gives him credit for,

00:27:27.760 but certainly not

00:27:28.860 in the massive numbers

00:27:29.880 that the Fords,

00:27:31.260 Doug Ford

00:27:31.780 and his late brother Rob did.

00:27:33.180 Well,

00:27:33.520 Jerry,

00:27:33.820 I tell you,

00:27:34.840 you know,

00:27:35.340 there's a saying,

00:27:36.000 I think it's in the Bible,

00:27:36.920 put not your trust in princes

00:27:38.320 and you never want

00:27:39.640 to be too enthralled

00:27:42.300 by a politician

00:27:43.140 because you're just

00:27:43.920 setting yourself up

00:27:44.780 for disappointment,

00:27:45.760 but so far,

00:27:47.340 so great

00:27:48.180 and I got to say,

00:27:49.520 I was getting to worry

00:27:51.080 that Ontario

00:27:51.740 had accepted

00:27:52.740 its have-not status,

00:27:54.740 accepted a slow decline

00:27:56.540 like, say,

00:27:57.500 Michigan and Detroit

00:27:58.460 over the last 40 years.

00:28:00.100 I think Ontario

00:28:01.220 is coming back

00:28:02.040 on the right track.

00:28:03.020 I'm an optimist.

00:28:04.080 I mean,

00:28:04.280 I'm a new Ontarian myself.

00:28:06.780 You're an old-timer here.

00:28:08.080 Are you optimistic

00:28:08.860 about Ontario's future?

00:28:10.580 I don't know

00:28:11.460 that I'm an old-timer here,

00:28:12.640 but I'm much more

00:28:13.340 optimistic about it now.

00:28:14.700 I want to say something,

00:28:15.840 some advice I got

00:28:16.700 from my wife

00:28:17.400 that you reminded me of

00:28:18.680 when you said,

00:28:19.380 you know,

00:28:19.900 put not your trust in princes.

00:28:21.420 I remember

00:28:22.160 as I was early

00:28:23.300 in talk radio

00:28:23.960 and there was a politician

00:28:24.800 that I was liking

00:28:26.140 and my wife said to me,

00:28:27.920 don't get caught up

00:28:29.020 in the individual,

00:28:30.400 worry about the policies,

00:28:31.740 support the policies

00:28:32.780 because if the person

00:28:33.700 goes off the rails,

00:28:34.740 you were still right

00:28:35.720 when you supported

00:28:36.680 the policies

00:28:37.200 and so far,

00:28:38.400 Doug Ford

00:28:38.920 and the PCs

00:28:39.740 have been right on

00:28:41.520 with their policies

00:28:42.420 and what they've accomplished

00:28:43.300 so far.

00:28:44.140 I think you're right.

00:28:44.840 By the way, Jerry,

00:28:45.520 when I said old-timer,

00:28:46.380 I don't mean you're old.

00:28:47.080 I mean,

00:28:47.360 you're seasoned.

00:28:48.360 You know your way around.

00:28:49.860 You know the beat.

00:28:50.860 You know the file.

00:28:51.740 You're better than me

00:28:52.420 because I'm only five years

00:28:53.880 in this province.

00:28:54.660 Well, Jerry,

00:28:55.400 you've encouraged me.

00:28:57.620 The policies encourage me

00:28:59.440 and, you know,

00:29:01.400 it gives me an optimism

00:29:02.260 for the whole country

00:29:03.080 because how Ontario goes

00:29:04.840 to a large way

00:29:06.140 the whole country goes,

00:29:07.180 it's still the most important

00:29:08.640 economically,

00:29:09.920 demographically.

00:29:10.740 It's so important

00:29:11.640 and I think

00:29:13.220 it could be a role model

00:29:15.060 for the rest

00:29:15.600 of the country again.

00:29:16.360 Here's hope.

00:29:16.840 And last word to you, Jerry.

00:29:18.500 Well, let's hope

00:29:19.320 that one thing

00:29:19.880 that Doug can do

00:29:20.860 is I think he may have

00:29:22.240 Saskatchewan in line,

00:29:24.040 but a few other provinces

00:29:25.120 might join with him

00:29:26.320 to fight Trudeau

00:29:27.520 all the way

00:29:28.040 to the Supreme Court

00:29:28.840 if they have to

00:29:29.560 on the federal imposition

00:29:31.360 of cap and trade.

00:29:32.940 This is a premier

00:29:33.800 now in Ontario

00:29:34.660 who really actually

00:29:35.660 has the will to do so

00:29:37.000 and maybe that will encourage

00:29:38.420 a couple other provinces

00:29:39.360 and we'll see where that goes.

00:29:40.760 From your mouth

00:29:41.300 to God's ears, Jerry,

00:29:42.340 great to have you

00:29:42.820 on the show again.

00:29:43.400 Thanks, my friend.

00:29:44.480 Thank you.

00:29:45.100 All right, there you have it.

00:29:45.880 Jerry Agar, he's the host

00:29:47.020 on News Talk 1010.

00:29:49.380 He's every weekday

00:29:50.220 from 9 a.m. till noon.

00:29:52.800 Stay with us.

00:29:53.980 We're ahead on The Rebel.

00:30:05.960 Welcome back.

00:30:06.720 Well, we're told

00:30:07.500 that Canadians have a duty

00:30:09.300 to do our part

00:30:10.400 to fight climate change,

00:30:12.760 although we're never told

00:30:13.920 what that fight

00:30:15.200 will actually achieve.

00:30:16.340 How many degrees

00:30:17.440 will the weather change

00:30:19.360 if we pay massive taxes,

00:30:21.760 if we no longer

00:30:22.880 have pipelines?

00:30:23.660 We're never told that

00:30:24.500 because the answer is absurd.

00:30:26.680 It is such an infinitesimally

00:30:28.500 small effect

00:30:29.500 on the world's climate

00:30:30.920 that it won't actually have

00:30:32.420 a measurable effect.

00:30:34.360 It's about virtue signaling,

00:30:36.620 proving how moral we are,

00:30:39.300 the theory goes,

00:30:40.180 in order to buy social license

00:30:42.540 from those who hate industry.

00:30:44.380 It's a complex explanation,

00:30:46.420 and it doesn't seem

00:30:47.700 to be convincing many people.

00:30:49.960 The carbon tax

00:30:51.280 that Alberta brought in

00:30:52.260 was supposed to pave the way

00:30:53.280 for social license.

00:30:54.260 It has not placated

00:30:55.760 British Columbia

00:30:57.080 or environmental extremists.

00:30:58.640 So while the benefits

00:31:00.820 of this fight

00:31:02.100 for global warming

00:31:02.940 are harder and harder

00:31:04.080 to find,

00:31:04.560 the costs seem more

00:31:06.260 and more real.

00:31:07.280 Interestingly,

00:31:07.980 Justin Trudeau

00:31:08.660 has refused to release

00:31:10.480 his government's estimate

00:31:12.600 of just how penalizing

00:31:14.980 a carbon tax

00:31:16.220 would be on ordinary

00:31:17.300 Canadian taxpayers.

00:31:18.980 Well, the province

00:31:19.660 of Saskatchewan

00:31:20.600 has gone ahead

00:31:21.200 and done a study

00:31:22.100 of their own,

00:31:22.720 and joining us now

00:31:23.460 to talk about

00:31:24.420 the results of that study

00:31:25.740 is Todd McKay,

00:31:27.680 the Prairies Director

00:31:28.580 of the Canadian

00:31:29.340 Taxpayers Federation,

00:31:30.540 and he joins us now

00:31:31.380 from Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan.

00:31:33.400 Todd, how are you?

00:31:34.040 Thanks for joining us today.

00:31:35.540 I'm doing well.

00:31:36.540 Thanks for having me.

00:31:37.460 Thanks.

00:31:37.800 I don't want to focus

00:31:38.780 on the bizarre formula

00:31:40.520 that we're supposed to buy,

00:31:41.680 which is,

00:31:42.520 if you inflict

00:31:43.600 all this pain on yourself,

00:31:44.920 you will have

00:31:45.740 certain benefits.

00:31:46.640 I don't think people

00:31:47.340 believe in the benefits anymore.

00:31:49.020 They see that it's not

00:31:50.020 buying social license

00:31:50.980 for the pipelines.

00:31:52.140 They know it's not

00:31:53.060 going to actually

00:31:53.460 change the climate.

00:31:54.680 So let's not talk

00:31:55.420 about the supposed benefits.

00:31:56.800 Let's focus on your op-ed

00:31:58.640 in the National Post

00:32:00.040 called Ottawa hides

00:32:01.020 its carbon tax math

00:32:02.220 while Saskatchewan

00:32:03.640 crunches the numbers.

00:32:04.760 So there's no gain.

00:32:05.840 There's no payoff.

00:32:06.580 I think we can probably agree.

00:32:08.140 But what is the pain?

00:32:09.340 How much money

00:32:10.420 would Justin Trudeau's

00:32:11.980 carbon tax

00:32:12.780 hurt someone

00:32:13.760 in Saskatchewan

00:32:14.660 and by extrapolation

00:32:15.820 anyone else

00:32:16.720 in the rest of the country?

00:32:18.420 Yeah, so that's

00:32:19.240 a really good question.

00:32:20.520 So first of all,

00:32:21.160 that's a question

00:32:21.640 that Ottawa refuses

00:32:22.600 to answer.

00:32:23.900 They've been asked

00:32:24.680 many, many times.

00:32:25.720 Everybody's put in

00:32:26.460 lots of access

00:32:27.000 to information requests.

00:32:28.660 Ottawa refuses

00:32:29.460 to answer it.

00:32:30.100 So Saskatchewan,

00:32:31.240 doing the due diligence

00:32:32.100 that really is

00:32:33.020 absolutely required

00:32:34.260 in this situation.

00:32:35.600 Saskatchewan worked

00:32:36.380 with the University

00:32:37.540 of Regina.

00:32:38.440 Experts there

00:32:39.280 did some really

00:32:40.840 comprehensive analysis.

00:32:42.100 They put out a report

00:32:42.920 that's 276 pages long.

00:32:45.820 And of course,

00:32:46.780 there's a lot of

00:32:47.600 a range of variables

00:32:49.020 here.

00:32:49.700 But what they've said

00:32:50.840 is that,

00:32:51.540 you know,

00:32:52.880 the negative range

00:32:54.320 could be

00:32:54.980 that a carbon tax

00:32:56.520 would knock out

00:32:57.460 about $1.8 billion

00:32:59.520 out of the Saskatchewan economy

00:33:02.520 every year

00:33:03.420 when it hits $50 a ton.

00:33:06.980 And in addition to that,

00:33:09.440 it could cost families

00:33:10.760 up to $1,000 per.

00:33:12.820 You know,

00:33:13.140 when you look at

00:33:13.560 that $1.8 billion number,

00:33:15.120 that's about 2.4%

00:33:16.740 of the GDP.

00:33:18.800 That's a huge amount

00:33:19.960 of money.

00:33:21.420 That's a really tough blow

00:33:22.900 to an economy

00:33:23.540 that's still shakily

00:33:24.560 rising from

00:33:25.680 some of the struggles

00:33:26.500 we've had

00:33:26.940 with low energy prices

00:33:28.260 in the last number of years.

00:33:29.780 That's a big price

00:33:30.980 to pay for a policy

00:33:32.340 that's pretty shaky

00:33:33.080 in terms of helping

00:33:33.720 the environment.

00:33:34.520 Yeah.

00:33:35.060 I mean, 2.4%.

00:33:36.300 If you take 2.4%

00:33:37.800 out of an economy,

00:33:39.220 unless that economy

00:33:40.340 is just roaring

00:33:41.300 to begin with,

00:33:42.040 you're pretty much

00:33:42.640 throwing it into a recession.

00:33:44.520 And again,

00:33:44.780 I don't want to delve

00:33:45.400 into the obvious point

00:33:47.020 that this is for nothing.

00:33:50.140 Like, we're achieving

00:33:51.380 no change in the weather.

00:33:53.980 We have not placated

00:33:55.400 the foes of industry.

00:33:57.040 So, the whole thing

00:33:58.680 is a joke to begin with.

00:33:59.800 But what we're trying

00:34:00.600 to measure here

00:34:01.160 is the cost of it.

00:34:02.140 Now, let me ask you why.

00:34:04.120 What excuse

00:34:05.140 has Justin Trudeau provided

00:34:06.960 for not giving

00:34:08.320 the information?

00:34:09.060 I mean, the governments

00:34:09.540 are full of information.

00:34:11.380 If this tax

00:34:12.260 is going to be brought forward,

00:34:13.460 we should know

00:34:14.000 its economic impact.

00:34:15.680 Why have they said

00:34:17.360 they're keeping

00:34:18.040 their estimate

00:34:19.340 of the punishing costs?

00:34:21.300 Why have they said

00:34:22.260 they're keeping that secret?

00:34:24.180 So, the main explanation

00:34:25.300 we typically get

00:34:26.280 is that Ottawa

00:34:28.180 is asking the provinces

00:34:29.400 to impose a carbon tax.

00:34:31.100 And until they know

00:34:31.780 what the province's plan is,

00:34:33.100 it's hard for them

00:34:33.840 to estimate

00:34:34.520 what the cost would be.

00:34:36.700 Now, that's totally

00:34:37.860 a false explanation

00:34:39.060 for two reasons.

00:34:40.240 First of all,

00:34:41.440 they do have

00:34:42.080 lots of analysis.

00:34:43.500 You don't have

00:34:44.100 to know exactly

00:34:44.740 what somebody's

00:34:45.500 going to do

00:34:46.520 to estimate

00:34:47.380 what the impact

00:34:48.060 could be

00:34:48.580 on a range

00:34:49.460 of possibilities.

00:34:50.800 In fact,

00:34:51.300 here's the results

00:34:52.520 to the access

00:34:53.320 to information

00:34:53.960 request that we did.

00:34:55.540 It's all blacked out.

00:34:57.200 They're not showing

00:34:58.180 the numbers

00:34:58.680 they do have.

00:34:59.980 Nobody's saying

00:35:00.520 they have to know

00:35:01.200 absolutely everything

00:35:02.540 about what will happen.

00:35:03.780 But they do need

00:35:04.680 to do at least

00:35:05.420 the due diligence

00:35:06.040 of showing the numbers

00:35:06.880 they do have.

00:35:07.540 But here's another reason

00:35:08.860 that that's an

00:35:09.360 absolutely false excuse.

00:35:11.140 I want to let you

00:35:12.080 in on a little secret,

00:35:12.940 Ezra.

00:35:13.720 You don't have to be

00:35:14.740 James Bond,

00:35:16.280 you know,

00:35:16.840 with super spy gadgets

00:35:18.300 to figure out

00:35:19.160 what Saskatchewan's

00:35:19.980 going to do

00:35:20.340 on the carbon tax,

00:35:21.660 what kind of

00:35:22.200 provincial policy

00:35:23.200 they've got cooking.

00:35:24.640 Look, Saskatchewan says

00:35:25.900 it's not imposing

00:35:26.840 a carbon tax.

00:35:27.700 That's what Premier

00:35:28.460 Brad Wall said.

00:35:29.460 That's what Premier

00:35:30.240 Scott Moe said.

00:35:31.540 That's what everybody

00:35:32.800 who has ever listened

00:35:34.340 to anything coming out

00:35:36.060 of the government

00:35:36.480 of Saskatchewan knows.

00:35:37.660 They're not imposing

00:35:38.540 a carbon tax.

00:35:39.560 So there is no reason

00:35:41.420 that Ottawa can't

00:35:42.680 figure out

00:35:43.180 what it would look like

00:35:44.740 if it imposes

00:35:45.320 a carbon tax

00:35:45.960 because if a carbon tax

00:35:47.500 hits Saskatchewan,

00:35:48.880 it's coming from Ottawa.

00:35:50.080 It's not coming from Regina.

00:35:51.400 It's going to come

00:35:51.800 from Ottawa.

00:35:52.480 They know that.

00:35:53.620 We know that.

00:35:54.360 Everybody knows that.

00:35:56.060 If they don't have

00:35:57.140 all of the math done,

00:35:58.140 they need to get it done

00:35:59.140 because if they're

00:35:59.940 going to do it,

00:36:00.420 it's going to come

00:36:00.960 from Ottawa.

00:36:01.640 For them to say

00:36:02.360 that they don't know that

00:36:03.440 is baffling.

00:36:05.460 It's totally nonsensical.

00:36:06.860 Well, it wouldn't be

00:36:07.460 the first time

00:36:08.140 a liberal has told

00:36:09.600 a fib about a sales tax.

00:36:11.760 That's really

00:36:12.120 what this is.

00:36:14.380 You know,

00:36:14.980 interestingly,

00:36:15.980 Saskatchewan

00:36:16.840 in many ways

00:36:17.860 is more resource-oriented

00:36:19.640 and export-oriented

00:36:21.140 than Alberta,

00:36:23.300 which is,

00:36:23.800 I was surprised

00:36:24.660 to learn that

00:36:25.160 because it's not

00:36:25.640 just oil and gas.

00:36:27.000 It's potash,

00:36:27.980 it's uranium,

00:36:28.840 it's wheat,

00:36:29.280 and everything

00:36:30.520 has to be transported

00:36:31.900 by rail,

00:36:32.980 by truck,

00:36:33.640 whatever.

00:36:34.660 And, of course,

00:36:35.580 it's the prairies

00:36:36.160 get cold in the winter,

00:36:37.260 so you need energy

00:36:38.440 to move things.

00:36:40.080 You need energy

00:36:40.740 to stay warm

00:36:41.440 in the winter.

00:36:42.600 Saskatchewan

00:36:43.040 is a more energy-intensive

00:36:44.300 place than,

00:36:45.020 say,

00:36:46.080 Prince Edward Island,

00:36:47.160 which you could

00:36:47.640 practically bike around.

00:36:49.720 I think that this

00:36:50.720 is very punitive.

00:36:51.620 Let me ask you

00:36:52.100 a question.

00:36:53.220 The northern territories,

00:36:55.060 Nunavut,

00:36:55.700 Northwest Territories,

00:36:56.540 Yukon,

00:36:56.900 are even more sparse

00:36:58.800 than Saskatchewan

00:36:59.900 in terms of population,

00:37:01.340 even more cold,

00:37:03.040 and at least

00:37:04.540 Nunavut

00:37:05.200 and Northwest Territories

00:37:06.600 are larger.

00:37:07.700 I'd have to check

00:37:08.460 the map on Yukon.

00:37:10.020 They have received

00:37:11.320 some sort of assurances

00:37:13.140 that they would be

00:37:14.520 compensated in some way,

00:37:16.000 I think.

00:37:16.900 I know they have

00:37:17.520 other rebates,

00:37:18.520 other subsidies.

00:37:19.820 I don't want to

00:37:20.580 go beyond

00:37:22.060 my knowledge there.

00:37:23.820 Is it possible

00:37:25.020 that Saskatchewan

00:37:27.180 could get

00:37:27.920 some sort of

00:37:28.740 mitigation,

00:37:29.780 or is Justin Trudeau

00:37:30.880 just being adamant

00:37:31.880 and punitive

00:37:32.480 towards the province?

00:37:34.720 Well,

00:37:34.960 I think certainly

00:37:35.620 Ottawa is doing

00:37:36.620 what it often does

00:37:37.620 and trying to

00:37:38.580 buy peace.

00:37:40.360 And so we've seen

00:37:41.160 already with

00:37:42.580 environmental funding

00:37:44.340 that was dangled

00:37:45.020 in front of the provinces,

00:37:46.000 roughly $60 million

00:37:47.100 was dangled

00:37:48.780 in front of Saskatchewan.

00:37:49.880 Sign on to the plan,

00:37:50.940 you get $60 million

00:37:51.760 to put into

00:37:52.720 green projects.

00:37:55.120 Saskatchewan said,

00:37:55.860 no,

00:37:56.920 you know,

00:37:57.520 it's not for sale.

00:37:58.620 The principles here

00:37:59.600 aren't for sale.

00:38:01.160 You can offer

00:38:01.940 $60 million

00:38:02.640 and we're not

00:38:04.600 signing on.

00:38:05.360 It doesn't matter.

00:38:06.760 So, look,

00:38:07.420 I think that that pressure

00:38:08.280 is going to increase.

00:38:09.180 In fact,

00:38:09.740 again,

00:38:10.100 actually,

00:38:10.420 I'll flash this

00:38:11.260 ATIP again.

00:38:12.460 I don't know

00:38:12.700 if you can see it,

00:38:13.520 but the headline here

00:38:14.520 is equalization.

00:38:16.380 They're analyzing

00:38:17.380 what happens

00:38:18.040 with the equalization program

00:38:19.600 based on

00:38:20.500 what would happen

00:38:21.480 with the carbon tax.

00:38:22.580 Look,

00:38:22.760 all of that's leveraged

00:38:23.900 from Ottawa,

00:38:24.640 controlling,

00:38:26.280 throttling the flow

00:38:27.220 of money

00:38:27.660 from the capital

00:38:28.500 outward

00:38:29.440 and trying to force

00:38:31.140 the provinces

00:38:31.680 to get on side.

00:38:33.080 Look,

00:38:33.280 I don't think

00:38:33.560 it's going to work

00:38:33.980 in Saskatchewan.

00:38:34.640 Saskatchewan's been

00:38:35.220 very clear.

00:38:36.100 They're not imposing

00:38:37.140 a carbon tax.

00:38:38.220 If Ottawa wants

00:38:39.220 a carbon tax,

00:38:39.900 it can try to impose

00:38:40.840 it on Saskatchewan,

00:38:42.000 but it's going to see

00:38:42.780 a fight in the courts

00:38:43.640 and it's going to see

00:38:44.220 a fight in the court

00:38:45.240 of public opinion as well.

00:38:46.360 Yeah.

00:38:46.660 I'm just thinking

00:38:47.440 60 million bucks

00:38:48.600 as some sort of payoff

00:38:49.760 and they're going to take

00:38:50.980 1.8 billion

00:38:52.380 out of the economy.

00:38:53.580 You don't have to be

00:38:54.260 a math major

00:38:55.520 to know that's no deal.

00:38:57.740 Let me ask you,

00:38:58.820 I think Brad Wall

00:39:00.360 was very strong on this

00:39:01.600 and Scott Moe,

00:39:02.220 the new premier,

00:39:02.740 very strong on it.

00:39:03.800 You see Jason Kenney,

00:39:04.940 very strong on it.

00:39:05.840 He's probably going to be

00:39:06.960 the next premier of Alberta

00:39:08.280 just if polls are right.

00:39:09.660 And Doug Ford

00:39:10.600 has taken a hard line too.

00:39:12.660 I saw that photo

00:39:13.520 of Doug Ford

00:39:14.280 meeting with Justin Trudeau

00:39:15.560 and their various advisors

00:39:17.100 and I thought,

00:39:17.740 boy, that's a tough meeting.

00:39:20.580 Maybe, maybe there's a chance

00:39:22.780 this can be beat.

00:39:23.960 I mean, we tried to beat the GST.

00:39:26.520 I know you guys

00:39:27.120 and the Taxpayers Federation

00:39:28.140 fought hard about that

00:39:29.140 a generation ago.

00:39:30.820 Do you think you can actually

00:39:32.100 stop the carbon tax?

00:39:33.260 They repealed it in Australia,

00:39:34.920 which is a bit of a miracle.

00:39:36.660 Do you think it's possible

00:39:38.080 that if Alberta

00:39:38.840 and Saskatchewan

00:39:39.760 and Ontario

00:39:40.460 get together

00:39:41.760 and sue in the courts

00:39:43.580 and fight politically

00:39:44.440 and if you guys

00:39:45.480 and the Taxpayers Federation

00:39:46.660 get behind it?

00:39:48.000 Do you think it's possible

00:39:49.220 we can stop this

00:39:50.280 in a way we didn't

00:39:51.000 stop the GST?

00:39:52.840 Yeah, look,

00:39:53.420 I think it is possible.

00:39:54.300 In fact, I think it's likely.

00:39:55.180 We're going to beat this thing.

00:39:56.480 You reference Australia.

00:39:58.080 Australia brought in 0.98

00:39:58.920 a carbon tax.

00:39:59.680 They were told

00:40:00.080 they were going to lead the world.

00:40:01.120 The rest of the world

00:40:01.680 was going to follow them.

00:40:02.820 They woke up and realized

00:40:03.900 that folks in India 0.99

00:40:04.880 and China

00:40:05.540 aren't laying awake at night

00:40:06.920 wondering what Australia

00:40:07.900 is doing about

00:40:08.500 its carbon emissions.

00:40:09.720 Nobody else followed.

00:40:11.200 But the cost of the economy

00:40:12.400 was huge.

00:40:12.920 Australians got rid of it.

00:40:15.560 Look, we can beat this thing.

00:40:17.600 I think it's going to be

00:40:18.280 a long, tough fight.

00:40:19.520 I think that

00:40:20.180 this is going to be

00:40:21.680 a good scrap

00:40:22.640 to be totally honest with you.

00:40:24.640 But we can beat it.

00:40:25.460 And here's the number one reason.

00:40:27.200 There's the court arguments.

00:40:28.560 There's the media debates

00:40:29.580 that we're going to have

00:40:30.320 and all of those kind of things.

00:40:31.980 But people aren't buying it.

00:40:33.940 They're being told

00:40:34.700 that it won't cost them anything

00:40:35.920 and it'll help the environment.

00:40:37.060 What they're actually seeing

00:40:38.180 is it's going to take

00:40:39.360 millions and millions of dollars

00:40:41.000 out of their pockets

00:40:42.140 and it's not going

00:40:43.560 to help the environment.

00:40:44.760 If you really care

00:40:45.580 about the environment,

00:40:46.260 you've got to demand

00:40:46.880 a better policy

00:40:47.600 than a cash grab

00:40:48.340 from government.

00:40:49.360 People know that.

00:40:50.540 The politicians can kind of

00:40:51.640 try to ram it through

00:40:52.720 at the top.

00:40:53.580 But when politicians

00:40:54.360 go up against the people,

00:40:56.280 they generally lose

00:40:57.380 even if it takes a while.

00:40:58.700 I think we're going

00:40:59.180 to win this thing.

00:41:00.360 Well, what a great note

00:41:01.200 to end on.

00:41:01.980 You've given me some hope.

00:41:03.660 I like your attitude.

00:41:05.940 And I think you've got

00:41:06.880 to have that attitude

00:41:07.720 if you're a taxpayer's advocate.

00:41:09.140 And we love

00:41:10.500 the Taxpayers Federation.

00:41:11.580 It's great to have you

00:41:12.360 on the show.

00:41:12.920 We talk to your colleagues

00:41:13.860 in other provinces too.

00:41:15.880 Nice to have someone

00:41:16.920 from Moose Jaw on the show.

00:41:19.000 Keep up the fight

00:41:19.940 and let's keep in touch

00:41:20.900 on this one.

00:41:21.740 I look forward

00:41:22.800 to when Saskatchewan

00:41:23.840 actually takes it to court.

00:41:25.640 Maybe we can have you

00:41:26.320 back on then

00:41:26.900 or even before that.

00:41:28.540 That sounds great.

00:41:29.320 All right.

00:41:29.660 There you go.

00:41:30.200 What a pleasure.

00:41:30.900 That's Todd McKay's article

00:41:32.640 in the National Post again.

00:41:33.860 It's called

00:41:34.220 Ottawa Hides Its Carbon Tax Math

00:41:36.880 while Saskatchewan

00:41:38.340 crunches the numbers.

00:41:40.100 He's the Prairie's director

00:41:41.120 for the Canadian

00:41:41.940 Taxpayers Federation.

00:41:43.260 Stay with us.

00:41:44.140 More ahead on The Rebel.

00:41:56.040 That's the show for today.

00:41:57.440 I am not off to London

00:41:59.200 right away.

00:42:00.000 I'll let you know

00:42:00.780 when I'm over there.

00:42:02.340 But I just wanted to tell you

00:42:03.420 because it's on my mind.

00:42:04.360 I'm booking a trip.

00:42:05.020 I'm getting things set up

00:42:06.120 over there.

00:42:06.620 I'm looking forward

00:42:07.240 to doing court reporting.

00:42:09.500 It's going to be a heavy trial.

00:42:10.860 The fact that the absolute

00:42:12.160 most senior judge

00:42:13.200 in the United Kingdom,

00:42:14.440 the Lord Chief Justice

00:42:16.220 for England and Wales,

00:42:18.440 leading a three-judge panel

00:42:20.260 of Tommy's hearing,

00:42:21.400 that's amazing.

00:42:24.040 That's like going

00:42:25.160 to the Supreme Court

00:42:25.980 of Canada

00:42:26.400 or the Supreme Court

00:42:27.260 of the United States.

00:42:28.960 I've got to tell you,

00:42:29.660 I'm a little nervous, actually.

00:42:31.380 I'm sort of excited by it.

00:42:33.240 Just the opportunity

00:42:34.200 to be there.

00:42:34.580 But, of course,

00:42:35.040 I'm there on a grave mission

00:42:36.740 to report what is said

00:42:38.520 and done in that court

00:42:39.460 and to report

00:42:40.500 contra the mainstream media

00:42:43.160 that will be lying.

00:42:44.480 And I tell you

00:42:45.060 they'll be lying

00:42:45.600 because everything I know

00:42:47.360 from Tommy,

00:42:48.020 from personal observation

00:42:48.900 from the year I worked with them,

00:42:50.440 when I saw how the media

00:42:51.600 were treated,

00:42:52.120 it was a lie.

00:42:52.660 So I'm not just saying

00:42:53.280 they have a different opinion.

00:42:54.480 They can have a different opinion

00:42:55.500 than me.

00:42:56.040 I'm saying that it is fake news

00:42:57.500 if you follow the Daily Mail

00:42:59.040 or the Sun

00:42:59.640 or any of the tabloids

00:43:00.660 or even the prestige papers

00:43:02.100 of the BBC.

00:43:02.680 The way they cover

00:43:03.200 Tommy Robinson

00:43:03.800 is false.

00:43:04.580 I think that's why

00:43:05.280 Tommy had his wife

00:43:06.640 and his other family members

00:43:08.360 contact me and said,

00:43:09.160 Tommy wants you to come

00:43:10.360 to report.

00:43:13.020 I know why.

00:43:14.420 I know why.

00:43:15.520 Because he doesn't want it

00:43:16.420 to be a wall of lies

00:43:17.320 about him.

00:43:18.660 All right.

00:43:19.540 Folks,

00:43:20.000 I hope you enjoyed the week.

00:43:20.960 I hope you enjoyed the day.

00:43:22.620 That's it for this week.

00:43:24.000 We've got some YouTube videos

00:43:25.320 all weekend

00:43:25.740 as we always do.

00:43:26.760 I'll be back on Monday.

00:43:27.800 Until then,

00:43:28.540 on behalf of all of us

00:43:29.840 here at World Headquarters,

00:43:31.400 to you at home,

00:43:32.600 good night

00:43:33.060 and keep fighting

00:43:34.240 for your freedom.

00:43:34.880 Good night.

00:43:34.960 And keep fighting

00:43:36.280 for your freedom.

00:43:37.340 Good night.

00:43:47.600 Good night.

00:43:48.220 Good night.

00:43:50.020 Good night.

00:43:58.900 Good night.

00:43:58.960 Good night.

Rebel News Podcast - July 14, 2018

Why I'm going to London to cover Tommy Robinson's appeal

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