Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - February 17, 2025


Ep 1141 ｜ 'Patriarchy Hannah'： A Disturbing Deep Dive into a Tradwife Fraud


Episode Stats

Length

48 minutes

Words per Minute

163.3417

Word Count

7,912

Sentence Count

539

Misogynist Sentences

49

Hate Speech Sentences

22


Summary


Transcript

00:00:00.960 Patriarchy Hannah was a prominent ex-account that promoted the trad life, trad wife lifestyle,
00:00:10.120 as well as so-called patriarchal marriage. She was propped up by a lot of the patriarchy bros
00:00:17.340 on X, but it turns out she wasn't a real person at all, or at least that is what is being reported
00:00:25.040 by those who have dug into the claims that she has made. And oh my goodness, what a tangled web
00:00:32.140 Hannah or Jennifer has woven. And for those of you who really wanted me to get into another
00:00:40.460 dramatic scenario that was unraveling on X this week in Ashley St. Clair and Elon Musk, we will
00:00:47.660 get to that tomorrow, but I had to dedicate an entire episode to Patriarchy Hannah because there
00:00:54.460 is so much here. This episode is brought to you by our friends at Good Ranchers. Go to
00:00:59.320 goodranchers.com, use code Allie at checkout. That's goodranchers.com, code Allie.
00:01:12.760 Hey guys, welcome to Relatable. Happy Monday. Hope everyone had a wonderful weekend. All right,
00:01:17.960 we've got so much to get into. Quick shout out to Share the Arrows 2025, October 11th in
00:01:24.100 Dallas, Texas. Get your tickets at sharethearrows.com on February 28th. That is when the early bird
00:01:31.760 pricing is available to the general public. If you want to get access to that limited number
00:01:36.740 of early bird tickets, then sign up for Blaze TV if you want to get early access to them.
00:01:41.760 BlazeTV.com slash Allie. Go ahead and subscribe. You'll get a discount. You get access to all the
00:01:48.440 behind the paywall content that all Blaze TV hosts produce. Plus, you will get early access to those
00:01:55.360 discounted early bird tickets for Share the Arrows. All right, that's it for announcements. Let's go
00:02:01.840 ahead and get into this crazy story of Patriarchy Hannah. Now, many of you probably haven't even heard
00:02:09.320 of Patriarchy Hannah, or maybe you heard about her for the first time in the last 48 hours. This is a
00:02:16.260 story that I will say is near and dear to my heart, or maybe is personal to me because this person,
00:02:22.260 Patriarchy Hannah, did not like me very much. She and her gang of Theo bros always talked about how
00:02:28.480 Allie Stuckey was a secret feminist, yada yada. Well, it turns out this Patriarchy Hannah influencer who
00:02:35.120 had a podcast and had amassed about 30,000 followers on X does not seem to be a real person at all. She
00:02:44.020 not only is not really a trad wife, she also apparently isn't really a mother. She said that
00:02:52.020 she was a traditional patriarchal wife and mother of 14, some biological, some adopted and fostered,
00:03:01.540 but it seems through the digging of a very vigilant researcher on X that she is actually a single 37-year-old
00:03:11.200 woman living in Arkansas who made up the whole identity and deceived thousands of her followers.
00:03:18.600 There were several people digging into this, a few different accounts, but the thread that went viral
00:03:23.680 on X was authored by X user Ryan Duff. And so I am going to tell you who she is based on the information
00:03:34.440 that she has given, both her persona and who she actually is based on the research of Ryan Duff. Now, this is
00:03:42.300 a developing story. And if I always do my best to be as truthful as possible, to give every angle that I
00:03:49.620 possibly can, to be as fair as possible, even as charitable as possible. But as this develops, and as we learn
00:03:58.760 more, I may have to come back and correct something, hopefully not, or add something, or give additional context,
00:04:08.220 but I am just going to tell you what we know and what has been reported. And there are many things, assertions
00:04:16.980 that have been made about this person that I will not say, even though I think they are interesting hypotheses, but I
00:04:23.860 don't think there is enough to substantiate or corroborate them. It's just hearsay. And so I'm
00:04:31.260 going to avoid that speculation until there is more. So just know that, that I could make this a lot more
00:04:36.960 salacious than I'm going to, but I really just want to stick with the most substantial stuff. So first,
00:04:45.120 who is this persona? Patriarchy Hannah will put up what her X profile looks like. I mean, to me,
00:04:50.640 okay. Like it just looks like a gimmick right away. Like we see that it's an animated picture of a
00:04:57.540 person. And then we've got the Patriarchal Wives Club as the banner of her X page. Graphic design is
00:05:06.460 my passion style, whole three holy Bibles in the middle, like cattywampus. It almost seems like she's
00:05:14.780 trolling. Like this is a parody of what, I don't know, someone thinks a patriarchal wife should look
00:05:22.480 like. So she grew to be a social media influencer. Again, she portrayed herself as someone embracing
00:05:30.060 this patriarchal belief system. She would always go to bat for these patriarchal Theo bros. She never
00:05:36.740 revealed her face. She hid behind this avatar in her profile picture. She said a while ago,
00:05:45.740 this is how we know she claimed to have 14 kids. She said herself on her, it's her handle is harmonized
00:05:51.900 grace. Her name that she uses the moniker on her page is Patriarchy Hannah. One of her posts before she
00:05:58.060 deleted her account altogether a couple of days ago, she said 14 kids. And I never once needed an
00:06:04.540 epidural or complained about the pain. Well, good for you, Hannah. Birth does feel a lot better when
00:06:11.100 you've never done it before. Um, according to her posts, Hannah has a husband named Tony who had his
00:06:17.940 own X account and owns a construction company in their town, which she calls Tony town. And I thought
00:06:24.380 that this was a hilarious tidbit. This also seems to be an intentional troll. Uh, she gained what I
00:06:31.880 already said a pretty large following, almost 30,000 followers. Um, some examples of her content. She
00:06:39.500 had a podcast called Patriarchy country. And again, it just seems almost like a skit. Uh, the description
00:06:45.880 that she has of this podcast, I'm pretty sure that she scrubbed everything now and taken it down, which
00:06:50.600 if none of this were true, she simultaneously saying that it's not true that she's a fake person
00:06:56.280 while also taking everything down. That just doesn't really add up to me. But the description said,
00:07:01.260 welcome to biblical patriarchy country where the sandwiches are always made and the women are
00:07:05.980 encouraged to have personalities. We are pulling back the curtain on what life is like when you're
00:07:10.420 a member of the Patriarchal Wives Club and talking all things, church culture, motherhood, and
00:07:15.100 homemaking meet the biblical housewives of Twitter. Um, okay, here is some content from her now deleted
00:07:23.280 X account. She posted regularly about women lacking discernment compared to men. And we will get
00:07:30.940 back to the irony of that statement in just a bit. She said, women act like having children. She also
00:07:36.760 said, this is not, uh, you know, exactly the lacking discernment part, but she'll say things like this.
00:07:43.140 Women act like having children is an excuse to gain weight. It's not, I have 14 children and never
00:07:49.040 lost my figure once. People are appalled that my husband has a weight range that he expects me to stay
00:07:56.360 in. But what they don't know is that if he doesn't work out for two days, I start giving him a hard
00:08:01.240 time. The couple that fat shames together stays attractive together. Uh, I'm going to have to
00:08:07.100 chill out or I'm going to gain too much weight, LOL. But he says I get a new phone. If I stay in my
00:08:13.040 ideal weight range for three months, that is so disturbing. If someone actually has a marriage
00:08:21.360 relationship like that, there's, there's a pattern in a lot of these so-called patriarchy trad accounts
00:08:27.380 that you will see that the dynamic that is described between the thought of between the
00:08:33.200 husband and wife is really more similar to a father and daughter. And that is when it takes on. And this
00:08:39.960 is real. I don't know if patriarchy Hannah was a part of this or not, but you'll see this on TikTok.
00:08:44.640 It has fetishistic undertones. Okay. And I called this out in, I think May of 2023 was the first
00:08:54.180 episode that we did on it. And a lot of you agreed with the message, but I caught a ton of heat for
00:09:01.760 saying that any part of the trad life aesthetic trend on social media might not be real and might
00:09:09.280 actually just be a fad and might actually just be personas that these women are taking on to make
00:09:15.120 themselves feel better, to make other people feel bad. I was told that's not a problem. We shouldn't
00:09:20.140 talk about that by the very Theo bros that got their ego stroked by patriarchy Hannah, as we'll get
00:09:26.580 into in just a minute. I was told that's not a problem. You're just projecting your internalized
00:09:32.140 feminism on other people. When I was just trying to say, look, like some of this is not real.
00:09:39.460 Traditional lives are real and they are great. But a lot of the content that you are seeing focusing
00:09:46.060 on this is not real. And they're made by people who aren't real. And I've been saying that for almost
00:09:52.400 two years now and have been incessantly called by people like patriarchy Hannah, a feminist for
00:09:58.720 pointing out this obviously true fact that she apparently also played a part in. She said on
00:10:05.540 Acts, I don't understand the concept of having theological differences with your husband. If
00:10:09.760 my husband tells me that something in the Bible means something different than I thought, I just
00:10:13.940 accept that he's right. Okay. Like you're allowed to have a brain. I mean, I very much respect my
00:10:20.860 husband's wisdom and he teaches our Sunday school and he is great at it. And we love having discussions.
00:10:28.080 But if we have a disagreement about a passage, it's not a lack of submission. We have a lot of fun
00:10:35.800 discussing those things and debating those things and looking at those things from a different angle
00:10:40.720 because my husband actually married a woman, a wife, and not this weird relationship where the
00:10:48.440 woman is not allowed to have a brain and is not allowed to talk about her perspective on things.
00:10:54.880 Patriarchy Hannah says, if your husband isn't capable of violence, you don't have a husband,
00:11:00.540 you have a wife. Weird thing, weird thing to say. Some things that she said about me specifically,
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00:12:04.960 So last year in particular, I think it was the beginning of 2024 or was it the beginning of
00:12:16.300 2023? I think it was the beginning of 2024. Gosh, it's so—the past, like, few years have been such
00:12:21.080 a blur where I did—I think it was maybe the beginning of 24 where I did another big episode
00:12:28.100 on, like, the red pill version of Christianity and some of the pitfalls of this kind of, like,
00:12:37.440 weird trad world online. And this is when I was also being called, like, a girl boss and blah,
00:12:44.740 blah, blah. And she also—so she came out swinging during that time agreeing that I was a feminist.
00:12:51.820 People shouldn't be listening to my podcast. But then in fall of last year after Share the
00:12:56.260 Arrows, she made fun of the name, Share the Arrows, and was like, I don't even know what
00:13:00.800 that means. Like, you can read. It's—I think, like, it's possible for you to just look it up and
00:13:06.100 it's really not that hard to figure out. But she said, sorry, guys, I totally forgot that I'm not
00:13:10.880 allowed to criticize ABS in any way because she's a modern-day golden calf for many women. I forgot
00:13:15.740 that if I do, said women will bring in totally irrelevant and incorrect facts to the argument,
00:13:20.460 like that I want postpartum women to wait on their husbands. I have no idea.
00:13:25.080 What is that even referring to? Because honestly, I didn't pay attention
00:13:27.920 to this woman. This is all stuff that I have now seen in the past few days as I've been researching
00:13:33.800 this. Oh, this has made a lot of people mad when I said last year that I don't believe that women
00:13:42.300 should be pastors. Of course, they agree with that. And that it is about calling, not necessarily
00:13:48.000 capability, like actual ability to deliver a sermon physically, rhetorically. I said, yes,
00:13:55.720 I can physically do that. I know that I'm—that I like to talk, that I am pretty good, hopefully,
00:14:03.280 at communicating. And I love the Bible and I can apply that in a way that makes sense. And I said,
00:14:09.720 even if I am capable of doing that, I know I'm not called to do that. I am capable,
00:14:14.720 physically capable of delivering a better sermon than probably a lot of men in the country. I'm
00:14:20.240 thinking about the false teachers. Of course, that is true. A lot of women are capable of that.
00:14:24.560 But we are not called to preach to men. We are not called to the office of pastor. They were really
00:14:30.260 mad that I said that I was capable at all of doing it, that I shouldn't say that.
00:14:37.260 And she retweeted some tweets criticizing me for that. She also said, here's the thing about
00:14:43.080 internalized feminism. She's talking about me in this debate. You don't think you have it. And then
00:14:48.060 something happens and you realize you do. OK, see, this is so funny because this is the exact same
00:14:53.900 thing that BLM activists said about white fragility. Like, you don't know that you are a white supremacist.
00:15:00.520 You don't know that you have white fragility until something happens to you. And then it kind of
00:15:06.660 just it sparks up and then you have to combat it. And all these people are secretly just fragile
00:15:12.820 because they don't agree with BLM and critical race theory. I mean, she probably should write.
00:15:19.400 She's probably good friends with Robin DiAngelo. It's all the same thing. She said, you know,
00:15:25.460 she doesn't think it's wrong for women to have podcasts. Well, that's good because you have a podcast
00:15:30.120 or she did have a podcast. She said, I do think there's a way that it should be done in a bold
00:15:35.520 line that won't be crossed. She's not crossing that bold line, but relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey
00:15:40.980 apparently is. Someone says, someone named Brian said on X, simply saying that she, I, have the
00:15:49.960 capability of a man to preach is a prime example of deception. And patriarchy said, patriarchy Hannah said,
00:15:56.580 the men get it. And she said lots of other things about me being a, you know, secret feminist and
00:16:03.380 blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. You know, it's so funny. I had a guest on the other day
00:16:07.080 who brought a family member with her and this family member told me she was so sweet and so kind.
00:16:15.320 And she was talking about how she's been listening to the podcast for a long time. And she said, you know,
00:16:20.500 before I started listening to your podcast, my best friend and I, we were girl boss, feminists,
00:16:26.700 don't need no man all the way. And then as we started listening, God started softening our
00:16:32.180 hearts. And now we are both stay at home wives and moms and like super traditional and completely
00:16:39.060 changed. I don't take credit for that. I don't have the capability to change hearts, but God has the
00:16:44.120 capability to change hearts. And a tree is known by its fruit. I can't tell you how many people have
00:16:50.200 told me by the grace of God that through listening to this podcast, they decided to have children.
00:16:54.980 They decided to have more children. They decided not to abort their child. They decided again,
00:16:59.340 by the grace and providence of God to become a Christian, to get married and to live a completely
00:17:04.760 different life than the secular or functionally secular life they were living before. And a lot of
00:17:12.420 these people in this patriarchy camp accused me of either being a feminist girl boss myself or trying to
00:17:19.400 get other women to do that when that is not at all the fruit of this podcast. And really, if you look
00:17:25.540 at the tone of people like Patriarchy Hannah and those in her circle who talk like this constantly
00:17:31.060 about women and how awful women are and how everyone who is not them, every woman who is not them is
00:17:36.700 really just internalized feminists and all of this stuff is that really those people are extremely
00:17:42.880 aggressive. Like the women in these patriarchy trad circles on X are extremely masculine or extremely
00:17:50.660 aggressive. They spend their days stroking the ego of the patriarchy Theo bros on X, chatting with them,
00:17:58.400 going back and forth with them. I would say probably even by definition flirting with these men. And the men
00:18:05.400 in these circles are extremely catty and they're extremely gossipy and are extremely sensitive.
00:18:12.440 And both sides are preaching about what a strong man should be and what a soft women should be. And
00:18:18.540 none of them, none of them exemplify that at all. We'll get into some more specific details about that
00:18:25.900 in a second. So let's look at this evidence. Is this a real person? Ryan Duff says no.
00:18:31.840 So the most recent update before we even get into his thread on Ryan Duff, he shared an X Spaces chat
00:18:38.680 with Bethany Mandel and Abby Libby last night that his initial tip to looking into this person was a
00:18:45.540 mutual friend who shared information from an anonymous X account making claims about patriarchy
00:18:50.360 Hannah's true identity. Skilled at finding records, Duff said that he began to investigate other women who
00:18:56.160 were close to her like Abby Libby. I did not know that Abby Libby was close to her, began to suspect that
00:19:01.260 she may not be who she said she was. Patriarchy Hannah appears to be, according to Ryan Duff,
00:19:08.360 Jennifer Bays, a 37-year-old single woman who Hannah claimed was her cousin. Hannah and Bays have the
00:19:15.540 exact same birthday to the year. Katie Johnson posted this on X Genuine Question, Hannah. All of this could
00:19:26.260 be easily cleared up. I know behind the scenes you claim Jennifer Bays is a cousin. How is it that you
00:19:30.600 have the exact same birthday to the day? I'm honestly trying to clear it up. Everyone wants it cleared up.
00:19:36.320 And Hannah said, oh, so people are still leaking private info. Cousins never have the same birthday.
00:19:42.920 So very weird response. That was before she deleted her X account. Well, here's Ryan's evidence. He dug into this.
00:19:49.740 So first he looked at Hannah's house, a house that she had posted a picture of. He just went through
00:19:57.080 her post, the things that she had said about herself, the pictures she had posted, the information
00:20:01.540 that she had given. And then he looked to try to verify that information and he found some really
00:20:07.100 interesting stuff. So in November, 2023, Hannah posted on X that she had just built a house in
00:20:12.940 Tonytown. That's, I guess, what she calls the area where her husband builds in. Remember,
00:20:19.040 Tonytown is the name, apparently, of her husband's construction company for her son and soon-to-be
00:20:26.120 daughter-in-law. However, the picture that she shared was not built by her husband and his friends,
00:20:31.580 but was actually built by a custom home builder for another person. Ryan Duff found this. The house
00:20:36.740 matches the Google Street View and satellite imagery down to the propane tank in the side yard,
00:20:41.620 and the stairs down into the river. Property records confirm it was built by a woman and
00:20:47.120 her sister in 2020 for their mother, who has since passed in 2023. So Ryan dug into the property
00:20:54.340 records. He looked at Google Street View to try to figure out who actually owned the house in the
00:21:01.200 picture that she had posted, found out it was not actually her. But Jennifer Bays, the person that she
00:21:09.660 seems to be, her parents do own property across the river from the house she pictured. So she would
00:21:17.080 have had access to take a picture of the house with the river pictured as above. I really encourage you
00:21:23.540 to watch this on YouTube if you're just listening. When people called Hannah slash Jennifer out on this
00:21:28.920 particular thing, she ended up deleting that post with the picture of the house. And then here is like
00:21:36.100 the crux of it. Here is where this person, Jennifer Bays, actually comes in and how Ryan Duff figured
00:21:41.860 out that Hannah is probably this person named Jennifer Bays. And that has to do with an Amazon
00:21:48.040 receipt. So Jennifer or Hannah hosts a Discord channel where she talks to other women. She gives
00:21:54.500 them homemaking advice, marriage advice. And one of the women in the Discord group had a baby. She got a
00:22:00.500 stroller from Amazon that was a gift from Hannah. But the Amazon receipt that was posted said from
00:22:08.160 Jennifer. And it had an address that was in Arkansas. Well, Ryan Duff tracked down the address
00:22:16.540 on the Amazon receipt and connected them to a family called the Bays family, specifically an address
00:22:24.220 of a person named Joe Lynn Bays. Well, when he dug into who Joe Lynn Bays is, she is the mother of
00:22:33.140 someone named Jennifer Bays, who again has the exact same birthday as Patriarchy Hannah and whose parents,
00:22:44.820 Joe Lynn, own the property that is across from the house that Patriarchy Hannah had posted a picture of
00:22:53.800 and said that her husband, Tony Town, had built that. Like, are you tracking with me? It's pretty
00:22:59.660 confusing. But this person has pieced it all together. And it's even, you know, another hurdle
00:23:04.800 for me to have to like, you know, explain it to like, describe it. And then there's the Louisiana
00:23:14.100 house, which I'll explain in just a second. Let me go ahead and pause and tell you about our second
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00:24:04.600 slash relatable code relatable. Okay, we've got the Louisiana house. A few years ago, Hannah slash
00:24:14.420 Jennifer shared an address with some of the ladies in that discord group. Property records on that address
00:24:20.940 showed an LLC listed as the owner. Louisiana business search records show that LLC to be owned by
00:24:28.820 Jennifer's parents. We've already met JoLynn Bays, but also Bobby Bays. She also shared a picture in
00:24:35.600 her discord, which just happens to match the Zillow pictures for that address. Hannah slash Jennifer did
00:24:42.940 the same thing with another house. That records show belongs to Bobby and JoLynn Bays. Now, what about
00:24:50.340 her husband, Tony? There's no evidence that Tony exists aside from a barely used X account. Jennifer's
00:24:56.600 father is the one who actually owns a construction company. Her grandmother's obituary. Hannah's
00:25:03.900 grandmother passed away, she said, she announced, but it was the exact same day that Jennifer Bays'
00:25:11.280 grandmother passed away, and that was verified, again, through an online obituary. According to the
00:25:16.920 obituary, the grandmother only had three great-grandchildren, not close to the 14 children
00:25:23.020 that Hannah claims to have and would be her grandmother's great-grandchildren. Now, Hannah's
00:25:28.500 face, we've already said that she hid behind an avatar. Multiple people have spoken to Hannah on the
00:25:34.700 phone or via a podcast interview, but she has always denied requests to video chat reportedly, so people
00:25:41.780 have never seen her face to face. Now, at one point, Hannah was asked for proof of who she was, so she
00:25:48.300 provided a photo. She provided this photo. We'll put it up, but then it was actually discovered that the
00:25:55.200 photo she used was a Facebook profile photo from someone named Allison Brown, as far as we know, a complete
00:26:04.460 and total stranger. So, obviously, not her. Hannah may have also run the account of her husband, Tony.
00:26:16.120 There is the account that was apparently his, What's Good It's Tea. He posted this in March of last year,
00:26:25.360 without my wife, I would die. Without me, my wife would die. It's not because of what we do for each
00:26:30.940 other. She is me. Let the reader understand. Is this some cryptic, freaky way to say that she is
00:26:38.320 actually Tony? Like, she, this Jennifer Bays person, is running his account? Now, who is actually
00:26:44.860 Jennifer Bays? If this is really patriarchy, Hannah, I think it's important to know who Jennifer Bays is.
00:26:52.220 According to Harris County records, a warrant was issued for Jennifer Bays for issuing worthless checks.
00:26:58.280 This was reported by Katie, the Burean millennial. A newspaper clip from the Lafayette Daily Advertiser
00:27:04.160 in 2011 showed that Jennifer Bays, 24, was arrested for identity theft. Possible family criminal history,
00:27:13.720 too. She has a brother slash sister. Okay. So, this is someone, apparently, a woman who identifies
00:27:22.080 as a man was arrested two years ago for exposing children to pornography, which is really sad.
00:27:30.800 And an account that is assumed to also be run by Jennifer, Dr. Roxo, says targeting Leo,
00:27:40.660 the brother slash sister, will put crosshairs on your back. Expect us. Expect vengeance. Which is
00:27:45.900 very troubling. This was actually, like, two days ago that this person posted this. And if you look
00:27:54.640 into this person, this Jennifer Bays' sister slash brother, it is true that her sex is recorded as
00:28:03.640 female in the prison system. You can look at the mugshot. Obviously, this person has been on testosterone
00:28:08.880 for a long time for a long time. And it is confirmed in the Bays' grandparents' obituaries that Jennifer
00:28:17.560 goes from having one sister, Elizabeth, to having one brother named Leo. So, that apparently changed
00:28:24.020 over time. If you look at, if you do a Facebook search of this person, you can see that the mugshot
00:28:32.560 picture also matches the picture in his profile. So, there's also been a lot of skepticism
00:28:40.820 surrounding patriarchy Hannah from people who actually, like, liked her, followed her. A fellow
00:28:47.320 trad account, Mother Goose, who goes by Trad Mother, pointed out that the screenshots of Hannah's
00:28:52.120 supposed conversations with family were missing timestamps. She would post messages back and forth
00:28:57.340 with her kids. But they don't look like they are genuine because they're missing timestamps. Although,
00:29:04.300 I don't know, like, this wouldn't have been an iPhone. So, this is not iMessage. I don't know if
00:29:09.940 timestamps are typical. I don't know. Bri, do you know, like, what kind of messaging platform she would
00:29:15.260 be using here that would have timestamps? I think this looks like just a normal Android text message.
00:29:22.180 I saw someone responding to it with a screenshot from their own. And it does look like there are,
00:29:27.340 timestamps normally. Unless maybe they're, like, straight back-to-back messages. But I think
00:29:34.180 typically an Android does have at least a timestamp. So. Okay. So, it seems like it could possibly be
00:29:39.740 edited, which is just another weird thing. And, like, if so, the texts are so specific that it
00:29:45.580 goes to show that if all of this is true, this person is a very deeply embedded pathological liar who
00:29:50.780 is addicted to the specificity that comes with building a false identity. And this Jennifer Bayes
00:29:56.400 had apparently been caught up in faking identities in the past. Also, some people who were reportedly
00:30:04.620 friends with her, at least online, her contacts and people through Axe, said that she claims that
00:30:14.100 Hannah has claimed to be really good friends with the head of Apologia and Pastor Jeff Durbin. He's the
00:30:21.360 pastor at Apologia Church and head of Apologia Studios. He's been on this show before. He,
00:30:28.480 that, she said that she was really good friends with Jeff Durbin, that Jeff Durbin had been to her
00:30:35.020 house before. And that she, that he had, apparently, she made this really weird claim that Jeff Durbin
00:30:42.620 came to her house and ate all of her kids' snacks. Well, Jeff Durbin says, who is this person?
00:30:49.180 What are they saying? This would be news to my wife and I. He says, I don't know who this person is.
00:30:55.780 I've never stayed at her house and eaten her snacks. I don't stay at other people's houses. I don't know
00:31:00.480 what to be more offended by. The claim to know me when I don't know you are the claim that I cleared
00:31:04.580 out a bunch of poor children's snack cubbies. So, very odd there. Also, some conflicting information.
00:31:11.760 Hannah claimed to have 14 children, one stepchild, and 13 adopted children. Well,
00:31:18.140 that's also strange, but she gave conflicting reasons for not having biological children.
00:31:24.020 Like, again, strange, looking at the post that conflict because she also said that she never
00:31:28.480 had an epidural and that she never was, or she never struggled in getting her figure back. Well,
00:31:35.440 yeah, that is, if you never actually have a child, then of course. Maybe that was sarcasm. It's just
00:31:42.960 very strange, but Abby Libby and this girl named Lizzie, who say that they were close to her,
00:31:49.640 say she claimed to be infertile. At one point, she told me she was pregnant, and then a couple
00:31:53.880 months later, she miscarried. Lizzie says she told me she had a hysterectomy because of abuse by her
00:31:59.300 father. Okay, so there's a lot going on there. And now the question is, like, why does this really
00:32:06.100 matter? Does it really matter that this person was apparently faking this entire persona? Well,
00:32:12.880 one, she was mentoring women. She had influence over women, and women listened to her. And women
00:32:22.800 maybe even compared herself to her or felt that they had to reach her standards of what it meant to be
00:32:27.880 a godly wife and mother. She built a brand upon having a large family with one income and claimed
00:32:36.880 they made it work. And again, she set the standards that weren't even real. And the worst part of it is
00:32:43.840 is that she used Christianity to spread her lie. She used the gospel. She used scripture. She used her faith
00:32:55.000 to try to push the idea that the only way to be a godly biblical woman is to be her version of a
00:33:03.140 patriarchy woman. And again, also, it's just lying. Lying in itself will always cause damage. And
00:33:13.440 especially when you say something like, oh, I've never had a problem losing weight after I had kids when
00:33:19.900 you didn't even really have kids. You also hurt people who are actually close to you, like some
00:33:25.500 of these people who claimed to be her friends. Now, I just want to talk about quickly her relationship
00:33:34.000 with the patriarchy Theo bros and how she really was given credibility and she was really given a
00:33:41.500 platform and given followers because she was hoisted up by a lot of these men whose egos were stroked
00:33:49.220 by her. And they now are distancing themselves, acting like, oh, it's no big deal. But the truth
00:33:55.680 is they were deceived because they were gullible, because they were thinking with their pride and
00:34:00.800 not with wisdom and discernment. That, of course, comes from fear of the Lord. So Dean Abbott pointed
00:34:08.080 this out. He said, to illustrate my point that patriarchy Hannah played up to the egos of the
00:34:12.520 online patriarchy bros, here is a tweet where she tags a bunch of them as good sources on how to be a
00:34:17.280 great leader. A few searches will show that Eric Kahn routinely interacted with her on the timeline.
00:34:23.320 So she tags people like Michael Foster, Zachary Garris. I don't know most of these people. Eric Kahn
00:34:28.460 and Joel Webin, King's Hall podcast, all are good resources on biblical masculinity and leading well.
00:34:35.240 Now, this in and of itself, someone who is supposedly a fraud suggesting someone doesn't in and of itself
00:34:42.360 discount someone. But I am pointing out that she used their names and their platforms and their
00:34:50.660 retweets and their replies to gain credibility and gain followers, all the while saying it's women
00:34:57.020 who are so easily deceived and are so naive and gullible. Hannah also hosted two of these people,
00:35:06.480 Eric Kahn and Joel Webin on her podcast, Patriarchy Country. I truly think that this is like intentional.
00:35:13.440 I think that she's trolling these people. I mean, it's just so, so silly. And I'm just like curious,
00:35:19.520 did these men check with Hannah's husband before going on her podcast? Because these men have
00:35:24.060 criticized me for having a platform. Now, it's interesting because a lot of these men, like,
00:35:30.000 you know, people like Joel Webin, who have told me, you know, I shouldn't be on the,
00:35:34.100 you know, front lines of the culture wars. There's so many things with that. First of all,
00:35:40.080 he has promoted Candace Owens' show, who is also a working mother. And also, a few years ago,
00:35:51.320 Joel Webin really, really wanted to be on my show, was asking and asking and asking to be on my show.
00:35:57.960 I did not want to do it. Didn't know who he was. I gave him a 10-minute interview. It was fine.
00:36:02.920 And whatever. And I think we probably agreed on a lot of things. But I haven't changed since then.
00:36:08.820 Like, I'm the same person with the same platform saying the same things. And now,
00:36:13.680 apparently, I am some, like, secret girl boss feminist. You know, Eric Kahn has made the same
00:36:19.100 kind of comments. But both of these men went on Patriarchy Hannah's podcast. Again, I don't know.
00:36:25.440 It's unclear if they asked if it was okay with her husband. I'm not sure. She said on the episode
00:36:32.800 with Eric Kahn, she wasn't sure if women should vote. Yeah, a lot of people say that. Eric Kahn also
00:36:39.260 talked about, interestingly, how his wife works, which is fascinating because I've been criticized for
00:36:46.840 having a podcast that is outside of the home. Kahn also said that women should not be arguing with men
00:36:53.800 on Twitter using insults like heretic without addressing the issues through proper channels,
00:36:58.520 like their husbands and their church. Okay, what's funny is that I have never argued with any of
00:37:05.380 these people on Twitter. But he and other men like him have repeatedly tried to goad me into a debate
00:37:11.940 for attention. They've picked fights with me, with other women, even though I've never given them the
00:37:17.880 time of day. And so they are extremely catty. They pick lots of fights, they get into lots of little
00:37:26.600 arguments. And at the same time, they will be like, no, we're on the front lines fighting the culture
00:37:31.960 war. And women shouldn't be on here, bro. It's a podcast. Okay, it's a podcast. And one thing that
00:37:39.240 women are really good at doing is talking. Hannah added, I would like not have a phone if my husband
00:37:45.740 saw me on Twitter saying these things. I don't know. I'm not even saying they're specifically
00:37:51.380 talking about me. I don't think I've gone around and like called them or anyone a heretic. That's
00:37:55.800 just not typically a word that I use. But the irony here is that Hannah was insanely aggressive or
00:38:03.060 Jennifer and rude online way more than I've ever been. Like these people are simultaneously more
00:38:09.100 aggressive and cattier than I've ever been online. And they spend way more time online than I do way
00:38:16.480 more time. These men that interact with her and other women do so for no other reason that I can
00:38:24.960 see than to like boost their own egos. Colin also referred to me in the same sentence as Julie Royce
00:38:31.260 claiming that they see themselves that we see that ourselves as the watchdogs of the church, which is
00:38:36.400 just so funny that I would be included in the same sentence as Julie Royce, who literally hates me.
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00:39:35.060 Joel Webin also went on the patriarchy country podcast, and he talks about the nature of women
00:39:41.980 and how they are more easily deceived. And I actually like I agree that women can be more easily
00:39:49.140 deceived. I've talked about that. I basically that's basically what you're not enough. And that's okay,
00:39:53.120 is about. That's what toxic empathy is about. That's really what both of my books are about in
00:39:58.500 different ways, how women because we are in a very, very good way, more emotional and more
00:40:04.760 compassionate and see things through a more relational lens. That is our strength, but it can
00:40:09.740 also be our weakness. And so I don't even necessarily disagree with that. It is ironic that you were
00:40:17.780 being interviewed by someone who is not real while you are talking about women being more easily
00:40:26.380 deceived. And like, why were you on this woman's podcast only because she was like the cheerleader
00:40:34.200 for all of these men on X. Joel said, okay, a woman. So in response to all of this, a woman lied.
00:40:42.480 Therefore, feminism is true. Did I do this right? He's sarcastically saying that all of the people
00:40:47.200 like making these claims about the fakeness of trad patriarchy culture, that they're getting it all
00:40:53.300 wrong. But that's a straw man. No one is saying that. I mean, maybe some people are saying that.
00:40:57.960 I'm certainly not saying that. I'm not saying, I'm not even arguing that because this person was fake,
00:41:03.740 that all trad people, trad influencers are fake. I'm not saying anything against like farming or making
00:41:09.860 sourdough bread of certainly not being a, not anything wrong with being a stay at home mom and all of those
00:41:15.680 wonderful things. I freaking love being a wife and mom and I am home so much the majority of the time.
00:41:22.520 And I love all of those things. It's not to discount the truly biblical life. It's to say that so much
00:41:28.500 of this so-called trad world, it's fake. It's an aesthetic. And a lot of these people are using it for
00:41:33.660 a platform. They're using it for fame. They're using it for money. And it doesn't actually reflect how
00:41:39.460 they live their lives. Now, maybe some of it is really genuine and really sincere, but I guarantee
00:41:44.800 you, Hannah patriarchy is not the only one that is a total fraud. It might not be identity theft by all
00:41:52.880 of these trad influencers. But it very often is true that their online life does not at all reflect how
00:42:02.860 they really live. Pastor Tom Buck pointed out that Webman did not platform Hannah on his show,
00:42:09.480 but he allowed Hannah to platform him. Buck added that this was similar to how he was on
00:42:13.260 Relatable, but then tried to distance himself later as it became, quote unquote, problematic.
00:42:22.380 And so that's the deal. That's what happened with Hannah patriarchy. And some people have some really
00:42:31.040 good commentary out there. Like my friend Samuel say, Joel Webman has also had words to say about
00:42:37.160 Samuel say, Samuel said patriarchy. Hannah isn't the only trad wife with a fake online persona.
00:42:44.060 She's an extreme example, but it's obvious that some trad wife influencers are just cosplayers
00:42:48.960 taking advantage of desperate women and men with weird fetishes. There are some good trad wife
00:42:54.580 influencers, but many of the trad lives you see online are performances, not real life.
00:42:58.500 Completely agree. The irony is in all of this is that Hannah or Jennifer, while she was calling me a girl
00:43:12.340 boss feminist, she, single and childless, was spending her days stroking the egos of married men online while
00:43:23.340 I was at home breastfeeding my third child and probably making my husband a sandwich out of
00:43:30.500 sourdough bread. Like that's the irony in all of this. So here's a lesson that I have for you.
00:43:39.020 Focus on your obedience to Christ. You focus on being a biblical woman based on what the word of God
00:43:48.860 says. You abide by Ephesians 5. You abide by the precepts that are set in scripture for you and do not
00:44:01.120 worry about what any of these trad accounts say is the standard for biblical womanhood. Okay? Because
00:44:09.740 most of these people are completely and totally fake. Thankfully, Jesus Christ is the same yesterday,
00:44:17.780 today, today, and forever. And he will never deceive you. He will never disappoint you. He will never
00:44:23.040 let you down. He is who he says he is. He is real. And he has freed you from the unbiblical and unfair
00:44:33.460 standards that are set by human beings. Also, another good reminder is that the love of money is the root of
00:44:41.780 all kinds of evil. So is the love of power. So is the love of prominence. These are the roots of all
00:44:50.920 kinds of evil. And I encourage you to lead as much as you can. Doesn't mean that you can't have any kind
00:44:58.460 of public platform. It doesn't mean that you can have no voice. But we should all strive to lead very
00:45:04.220 normal lives. We should, as far as it depends on us, get married and have kids and go to church
00:45:12.980 and do normal things that no one ever sees and that no one ever hears about and that is not turned
00:45:20.060 into content and that is not monetized or commercialized in any way. Now, again, I say that
00:45:26.660 is someone who has a platform that I feel that God has called me to and that he has equipped me
00:45:33.160 to steward, hopefully, for his glory. And as long as he calls me to that, I will be here doing that.
00:45:40.880 But even in this, I strive, by the grace of God, to live a very normal, real, private life. And I think
00:45:50.160 a lot of this craziness and deception would be avoided if we focused on that. You focus on living a
00:45:56.480 biblical life according to God's word and he will take care of the rest. All right, let me tell you
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00:47:03.000 a discount on your order. That's promo code Allie at Jace.com. Okay guys, so I told Brie that if we
00:47:14.440 got to, if this took 40 minutes or more, then I was not going to talk about Ashley St. Claire and
00:47:22.520 Elon Musk today that I would save it for the next day. So that's what I'm going to do. We decided to
00:47:27.760 give you Patriarchy Hannah today and the Elon Musk episode will be tomorrow. And gosh, it was really
00:47:34.240 difficult to make that decision because there's just so much. And I really wanted to do both in
00:47:40.180 one episode, but this would be a whole other hour because there's also so much to say about that.
00:47:47.000 And gosh, I've got a lot to say about everything that happened over the weekend with Elon Musk and also
00:47:55.120 so many different hidden connections and pieces of drama. And we will try if we can to put that
00:48:01.880 episode out earlier tomorrow so that you can have it because I know everyone has been asking me to
00:48:09.160 talk about both of these things. So first we went with Patriarchy Hannah. Tomorrow we will talk about
00:48:14.420 Elon Musk and Ashley St. Claire because oh my goodness, goodness, there is so much there and just
00:48:20.180 so much to discuss and it really, really matters. All right. That's all we've got time for today.
00:48:25.320 We will be back here tomorrow.