Ep 1156 ｜ Steven Lawson Breaks Silence, Dylan Mulvaney’s Book Flops & Gym Clothes Rant
Episode Stats
Length
1 hour and 6 minutes
Words per minute
165.62476
Harmful content
Misogyny
38
sentences flagged
Toxicity
25
sentences flagged
Hate speech
31
sentences flagged
Summary
Preacher Stephen Lawson has broken his silence after it was revealed several months ago that he had engaged in an inappropriate relationship with a woman that was not his wife. We are going to take a look at his statement today and give my response to it. Also, Dylan Mulvaney is out with a new book and we got some comments on that. And last but not least, I am putting my rant on gym clothes in a permanent spot on this podcast. We ve got lots on this episode of Relatable, which is brought to you by GoodRanchers.
Transcript
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Preacher Stephen Lawson has broken his silence after it was revealed several months ago that
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he had engaged in an inappropriate relationship with a woman that was not his wife.
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We are going to take a look at his statement today and give my response to it.
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Also, Dylan Mulvaney is out with a new book, and he was on The View, man-on-man.
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And last but not least, I am putting my rant on gym clothes in a permanent spot on this podcast.
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We've got lots on this episode of Relatable, which is brought to you by our friends at Good Ranchers.
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Hope everyone is having a wonderful week so far.
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Just a couple things before we get started, though.
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The fall seems forever away, but it's really not.
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And so you need to go ahead and get your tickets.
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Bring your women in your Sunday school class, your sisters, your friends, your mother-in-law,
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We will be releasing some of the speakers so soon.
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So make sure that you go to ShareTheArrows.com.
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I hope that it is the highlight for all of you of your year.
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If you love this podcast, please leave us a five-star review, whether you listen or watch
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Or if you listen on Apple Podcasts, or if you want to subscribe on YouTube, that is super
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Thank you so much to all of you who have been listening now for...
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Seven years ago this month, we started Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey.
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And then a few months later, it was four times a week.
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And here we are giving you news, politics, theology, culture from a Christian conservative
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perspective with two-ish interviews a week, pop culture, and what's going on in D.C. and
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sometimes the world as clearly as we possibly can.
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And some of you have literally been around now for seven years, and I'm just so grateful.
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And for all of you who are new too, and you really have become like friends and family
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every time I get to meet you in the wild, you let me know that you're praying for me,
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I always say I have the best and the smartest, most thoughtful audience in the world that's
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never been more evident to me than at Share the Arrows last year, but it's just really
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Everyone should want an audience like the Relatable Audience.
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You guys are salt of the earth people, and I love you so much, and I'm just so thankful
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All right, let us talk about Steve Lawson's statement that he finally put out yesterday
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So let me go back a little bit and give you a refresher.
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Maybe you don't even know what I'm talking about.
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Steve Lawson was the teaching preacher, not the shepherding pastor, not the main pastor,
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but the itinerant preacher at Trinity Bible Church in Dallas.
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This is a pretty new church, and he focuses on, through not just his preaching, but also
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in his various ministries, his teaching at John MacArthur's Master's Seminary Expository
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I have read some of his books about the Reformers.
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I have met him before, just a very dynamic, charismatic person who seemed to take the Word
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I don't know many preachers who have the same expository passion and skill as Stephen Lawson.
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So when I heard several months ago through a public statement made by Trinity Bible Church,
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the church where he was preaching, that he had been caught, I'm using my own terms here,
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but in an inappropriate relationship with a younger woman, I was so shocked and devastated.
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This is one of the last people I ever would have guessed would have been found in some kind
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And we still don't know the details of that relationship.
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That was a big sticking point for a lot of people who were fans, followers of Stephen Lawson,
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or who attended his Bible study, or who attended his church, is that we didn't really know.
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It was really like a lot of sleuthing of people to try to figure out what went on.
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And we did find out this was a younger woman who he knew through Master's Seminary, whose
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parents had been a part of John MacArthur's Grace Community Church for a long time.
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We don't know the full extent of the relationship.
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It sounds to me, if I am to read between the lines, that it was not a sexual relationship,
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not a full-on affair, but that it was more of an emotional bond, way too familiar, communicating
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Although even the congregants in Trinity Bible Church have really kind of, for the most part,
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been left in the dark, there are congregants at Trinity Bible who feel that the elders there
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They're thankful for the strength, the resolve, what they see as the transparency of their elders.
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And I know many people who have left Trinity Bible Church because they did not like how it
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And maybe they were attending just for Stephen Lawson and his expository preaching.
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And then when he left, they didn't want to stay anymore.
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And I think a lot of people have been very frustrated by the silence that Stephen Lawson
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I understand not wanting to stoke gossip or stoke speculation by giving little breadcrumbs.
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And as we will read in his statement, he says he hasn't said anything because he wanted
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However, I understand how basically being ghosted by your spiritual mentor, a lot of people felt
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like he was a spiritual mentor for them, was really hurtful, much more hurtful than if
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he had come out right away and at least given some clarity, some transparency, and then said,
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hey, I'm going to be taking a step back from all public communication.
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Pray not only for me that Christ would help me walk in repentance and sanctification, but
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please pray for my family, please pray for my wife, and really kind of shifted the focus to
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the people that he hurt, the people that he harmed.
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But just the lack of communication there, I think, was extremely devastating for a lot of people,
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He resigned from all of his duties at the time at One Passion Ministries.
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And also another thing about the statements that we noted, and it turned out to be correct
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at the time, one thing that you noticed in these statements was that they did not say
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It was actually that Stephen Lawson had been found out in his sin, and that at that point,
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it was not clear that he had actually acknowledged and turned away from his sin.
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And there was some very strange, wishy-washy language in those statements that made people
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Some people got mad at me for reading in between the lines, but that ended up being confirmed
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And so he released this silence, or he released this statement, rather, breaking his silence
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He said, it is with a shattered heart that I write this letter.
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I have sinned grievously against the Lord, against my wife, against my family, and against
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countless numbers of you by having a sinful relationship with a woman, not my wife.
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Again, we don't know what kind of sinful relationship, but a sinful relationship.
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I am deeply broken that I have betrayed and deceived my wife, devastated my children, brought
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shame to the name of Christ, reproach upon his church, and harm to many ministries.
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You may wonder why I have been silent and largely invisible since the news of my sin became
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He said he needed time to search his own soul and determine that my repentance is real.
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Reading in between the lines there, I think he's trying to say, don't blame this woman.
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This is something I'm taking responsibility for.
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I have confessed my sin to the Lord, to my wife, to my family, have repented of it.
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He says that his sin carries enormous consequences.
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He says many have looked to him for spiritual guidance, and he has failed these people.
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And some people out there might say, well, it's not fair that all of these people are demanding
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these statements or demanding transparency for him.
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It's not his fault that they look to him as a spiritual mentor.
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Well, he purposely placed himself in that position of being a mentor to thousands and thousands,
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not just people he knew personally, but people that he reached directly online, digitally.
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He put himself in that leadership, mentorship, teaching position.
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He says he's dealt with sin issues that have been painfully exposed in my heart.
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I've submitted myself in weekly accountability to two pastors and the elders of a local congregation
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I am also under the oversight of an accountability team who monitor my progress and give me wise
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I'll talk about this a little bit more in a minute.
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If this is just my personal, subjective opinion, I don't need to hear those details.
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And to me, that almost comes across as defensive.
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I just think that it's, I think that is a little strange personally, just from a PR perspective.
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He says, I'm growing in grace, reading and absorbing the word of God, putting it into practice,
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I'm involved in the life of the church, attending and participating in prayer meetings, Sunday
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school, the worship service, and taking communion weekly.
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I am being fad the word in the midweek Bible study.
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Please pray for my spiritual growth into Christlikeness as I follow him moment by moment during
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And maybe to me, I'm wondering, who are you answering?
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Who are you speaking to when you are listing all of these weekly religious activities that
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I hope and pray and believe correspond to real heart change and real humility?
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I'm not doubting the sincerity there, but are these answers to questions that people have?
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I mean, I've talked to a lot of people who attended his church and who looked to him for
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guidance, and none of them have been like, well, I just, I wonder if he's taking communion
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Really, like, the bigger concern is, what happened?
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Now, you might say, he doesn't have the responsibility to answer those questions.
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To some extent, I would say some of those questions don't have to be answered.
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And look, I have a lot of grace because these statements can just be so hard.
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They can be really, really difficult to say the right thing.
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But listing all of the repentance-centered activities that are happening every week, again, to me,
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And I'm not sure that that's what people need to hear in this moment.
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He says, I'm grateful for the unmerited grace of God and the gospel to extend his full forgiveness
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He says, please pray for me, the Lord's mercy and grace as I seek to make right the deeply
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wrong sins I've committed against my wife and family, and that in his time and way, he
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will bring about redemption and restoration in our marriage for his glory.
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We, of course, don't know exactly what that means, if there has actually been any physical
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And I also, I'm not sure if it would be appropriate, but there is another party here.
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I mean, there is a young woman who, yes, sinned.
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She had agency, and she, as far as we know, willingly entered into this sinful relationship,
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So I'm not saying that she was a victim as far as I know she wasn't a victim here.
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I'm not sure if it's appropriate for him to say that in a statement.
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Should he have said something like that or not?
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But whether or not he should have said that, the truth is we should be praying for her.
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So I've kind of got more of a response to this, the biblical response, and then my PR
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Okay, I have no reason not to believe the genuineness, the honesty of Stephen Lawson as just a fellow
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believer, but also as someone who I want the best for him.
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I want the best for everyone who has ever read him, listened to him, been mentored by him.
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I want the best for the global church, for Christianity in general.
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I hope and pray that this is true repentance, that all of this—I don't really care about—I
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mean, I do care to an extent, but I'm not as interested in all of the weekly activities
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that he's engaging in as much as I am just seeing the true heartbreak contriteness that
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And when I was reading this and I was thinking through my thoughts, the first verse that
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Love bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.
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Really, it's not my responsibility or anyone's responsibility to try to—because I don't have
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a personal, you know, friendship with Stephen Lawson, like, I don't have to go into all of
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the different nooks and crannies of this and try to pick it apart and doubt whether or not
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I'm going to take it at face value and hope and believe the best.
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Most commands, many of the commands that we are given in the New Testament to take care
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of the least of these, my brothers, for example, to ensure that we are caring for the household
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of God and to look after the saints in the work of ministry are actually commands to take
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It is very clear throughout the New Testament that that's really our first obligation.
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That is where our loyalty lies, first to the church, first to fellow Christians.
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And so, yes, of course, we are called to love and to care for others and to care for the
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But the love that we are called to in 1 Corinthians 13, we should feel, I think, most deeply for
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And so, that's one guidance I'm giving to myself and that I would give to you as well.
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I love the whole book of Ephesians, as you guys know.
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Tenderhearted, forgiving one another as God in Christ forgave you.
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So, not just forgiving one another as it feels good.
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Gosh, forgiving one another as God in Christ forgave you.
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Think about how much we were forgiven when Christ died on the cross for our sins.
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All of the ugliest stuff in our heart and mind and lives was completely just obliterated.
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Our slate was wiped clean because of the perfect sacrifice of Christ.
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That is the kind of forgiveness we are supposed to extend to other people.
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So, no matter how deeply Stephen Lawson hurt you, we are actually called to a very powerful
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countercultural forgiveness through the strength of Christ.
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Just so I tell you, there will be more joy in heaven over one sinner who repents than over
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And so, if we are to take this at face value and believe and hope that this repentance is
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real and only he and only God and hopefully those in his life really truly know that that's
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just the nature of it, no matter who it is, no matter who we're talking about, then heaven
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And God is celebrating and God is so gracious and so good and he is quick to bring us back
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and to work out all things for our good and for his glory.
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Pray for his marriage, which is an earthly reflection of the marriage between Christ and
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And my PR opinion does not discount his honesty and sincerity.
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I am just talking about what is effective messaging.
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What is going to appropriately impact as many people as possible?
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There are always going to be people that pick apart what you say and that are going to completely
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Or they're going to say that you said something that you didn't say.
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Or they're going to say that you said the opposite of what you actually said.
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As someone who talks a lot in the public, that happens.
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You get people who are like, you never talk about this or you said this.
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And so no statement, no person is ever going to be perfect or a perfect communicator.
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What I would advise someone in this position, very simple, very straightforward language,
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That's a little bit tricky because you want to give transparency that shows honesty without
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inviting more speculation and more gossip and potentially targeting this young woman.
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He did not say, oh, it was a really hard time in my life or I didn't know how to handle this.
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I do wish he would have said, which maybe you could argue he did in so many words, I was
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a total hypocrite and I was preaching about purity and I was preaching about Christlikeness
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And I don't blame the people that question my ministry and question my integrity.
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But I want you to know that everything that ever came out of my mouth that was directly
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from the word of God is true and that I am not trustworthy, but Jesus Christ is trustworthy,
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that he's the same yesterday, today, and forever.
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Look, I fell into this sin and here's what happened.
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I personally would like to see a little bit more clarity and just forthrightness and what
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actually happened, the timeline of what happened, because you've got a lot of people torturing
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themselves thinking, okay, was it during this sermon?
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What about the time that I followed this Bible study and he said this?
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Or the time he counseled me in this way, was this really going on then?
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Like, I think something really clear about what happened.
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And again, I think there should have been more of a focus on Christ and who he is, his stability,
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his trustworthiness, his unchanging nature, and also a focus more on calls for prayer for
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My personal opinion, I also would like to see something in this statement that says,
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I know that I am disqualified from ministry here on out and you're not going to see me behind
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the pulpit again, and you're not going to see me leading one passion ministries for the
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I am going to lead a private and quiet life with my wife, my kids, and my grandchildren.
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Some of you might disagree with that, but I do think that this is a disqualifying act
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It doesn't mean that God's not going to use his gifts to edify the church in some way,
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but the public platform is part of what led to this compromise.
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And also an assurance again to people who are looking to him for public guidance to say,
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I'm going to go quiet again and you're not going to hear from me.
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And maybe ever again, because public ministry is just no longer in the cards in this last
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chapter of my life, maybe not in the cards, however you would word that in a biblical way.
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Again, these statements, just like the statements of the churches or that the church and the
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ministries released at the time that it happened, they are very carefully curated for people
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that say, well, you're thinking too hard about this statement.
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You're looking too much at what was said, what was not said.
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These statements are labored over for days and days and days, maybe months before they
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All kinds of people are consulted, lawyers, publicists, fellow Christians, all of that.
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But what is said and what is not said is extremely intentional.
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Again, just to reiterate, that is not me discrediting his repentance or saying that he's not telling
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And we should continue to pray for that and pray for those also who were heartbroken by
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this and who have had a crisis of faith because of this failure.
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Pray that Jesus would draw them close, would draw them near, would restore to them the joy
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And they would remember Hebrews 13, 8, that Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today,
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No matter who fails you, who betrays you, Jesus never, ever will.
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And sometimes that helps us shift gears a little bit.
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And we just don't have anything to shift gears.
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I wish I could play some elevator music right now to shift into talking about Dylan Mulvaney.
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And there's no softer way to transition for whatever you say.
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No, no, no pun intended is what I meant to say.
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But OK, yeah, I'm trying to collect myself here.
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And it's called Paper Doll Notes from a Late Bloomer.
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I hope that this episode is included in his PR team's recap email that he receives this Friday
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that Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey highlighted his, uh, highlighted his new book.
00:27:38.760
Earlier this week, trans-identifying influencer Dylan Mulvaney, with 1.5 million followers on
00:27:46.160
I'm guessing this is supposed to be 9.2 million and not 92 million followers on TikTok, released
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a new book, the memoir, about his so-called transition, how he responded to the ensuing
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media firestorm that followed his Bud Light sponsorship.
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If you're new here, we do use the pronouns that correspond with someone's sex.
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It's not because we're being intentionally mean.
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This is something that I debated with myself maybe seven years ago, and then I came to this
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epiphany that I can't out-love God, and I'm not nicer than God.
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And if God says something is true, then the most loving thing I can do in any situation
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Those of you who have been listening for a long time have heard me say that ad nauseum.
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But God says in the first chapter of the first book of the Bible that we are made in
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his image, male and female, that's Genesis 1.27, that's repeated by Jesus in Matthew
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19, 4 through 5, it is positively affirmed throughout Scripture.
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Whether you're looking at the definition of parents, the definition of marriage, you see
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And just that first verse that we mentioned, it emphasizes how important that is, that that
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So when I call Dylan Mulvaney, he or him, that is not me being purposely disorientated.
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Unrespectful or bigoted or unloving, although of course the world will interpret it like
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And you can read about that in the trans chapter of my book.
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And that is me refusing to compromise the truth in the name of a worldly superficial toxic
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We quoted the seventh verse in that chapter earlier.
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The verse right before that says, love never rejoices in wrongdoing, but rejoices with the
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Never rejoices in wrongdoing, but rejoices with the truth.
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So the love to which Christians are called is inextricably intertwined with the truth.
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And only God gets to define love because 1 John 4.8, he is love.
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So again, the most loving thing we can do in all situations is agree with him.
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He was made a male at the point of conception in God's image.
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Dylan doesn't have some secret female deep inside him.
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He doesn't have this identity that is mismatched with who he actually is.
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And I don't even believe that he has true gender dysphoria.
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I think that he was probably considered more feminine growing up in musical theater.
00:30:32.600
I don't know what other trauma he endured in his life and his upbringing, if any at all.
00:30:37.900
I mean, it's usually something when a grown man who was almost 30 years old declares that
00:30:45.940
But the truth is, is that he is a person with a soul.
00:30:52.300
And I don't want to deny him the goodness of the truth that God has for him by affirming his
00:31:02.580
delusions that will ultimately destroy him, body and soul.
00:31:07.620
And a lot of people, I guess we probably won't have time to get into it.
00:31:10.860
And I promise I'll get into the rest of this Dylan Mulvaney stuff.
00:31:13.700
But, you know, there was a whole thing on X, Tommy Lahren saying it was rude for the
00:31:18.740
congressman, congressman self to call Sarah McBride, congressman Sarah McBride, who was
00:31:35.680
I personally believe she just doesn't have a moral foundation for what she believes.
00:31:38.800
But look, if you are still at that point, if you as a conservative are still at that
00:31:43.500
point, I understand if you're new, if you're like part of the maha, you're new over here
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00:31:47.100
and you're just trying to learn this stuff, like grace, patience, all of that.
00:31:50.800
But if you have been over here for a long time and you are still stuck in this idea that you
00:31:57.480
should call a man she for the sake of politeness, you are so far behind.
00:32:03.220
And like praise to all of the center center right people who over the past five or so years
00:32:08.480
have graduated to reality, realizing that it's either a man and a woman or it's not.
00:32:13.860
Like you can't say men can't play in women's sports, but also call a man she.
00:32:21.460
Either two plus two is four or two plus two is five.
00:32:24.260
If two plus two is four, there's no, there's, there's no good in saying that two plus two
00:32:29.720
And there's a big cost in saying two plus two equals five because your complicity and the
00:32:36.460
You saying, oh yeah, that man is actually a woman because he looks like a woman or he
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00:32:49.380
Of course you can't say to someone, oh yeah, you're a woman.
00:32:55.240
I don't want you to be mad at me, but no, you can't go into this woman's bathroom.
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00:33:01.620
And if they are a woman, why can't they go into the woman's bathroom?
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00:33:03.860
But if they can't go into the woman's bathroom because they're not a woman, then they're
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00:33:09.860
Denying reality has a really big cost and it's more important.
00:33:19.640
You'll remember who he is because back in 2023, Bud Light partnered with him to celebrate
00:33:25.640
his year of girlhood social media campaign by sending him packs of Bud Light featuring his
00:33:30.720
face, which Mulvaney then shared to his popular social media accounts.
00:33:34.380
There was a really big response from conservatives opposed to transgender ideology calling for a
00:33:44.300
And Forbes reported at the time that Bud Light lost $1.4 billion in sales in the year following
00:33:50.780
the controversy, which is great because, of course, you are the blue collar conservative
00:34:00.660
And then all of a sudden, overnight, it became super gay to drink Bud Light.
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00:34:05.720
And, of course, they've leveraged different figures, different comedians to try to get back in the good
00:34:12.960
I think they even ran a Super Bowl ad that was like conservative coded, which has probably been kind
00:34:19.980
If you are going to, as a brand, celebrate a grown man acting like a girl, then I've got a big problem
00:34:37.420
And we have to stop for an ad in just a second, but I feel like I've given enough preamble.
00:34:41.520
I have to give you something about this book that we brought up a couple minutes ago.
00:35:05.340
I just heard someone say in the room, it is creepy.
00:35:09.120
Day one of being a girl, and I'm coming out for the third time in my life today.
00:35:13.500
The first time I was 14, I came out as a gay boy.
00:35:18.840
And now here I am at 25, finally ready to tell the world I am a trans woman.
00:35:46.180
Like I have, I have kids now and I have watched three-year-olds turn to four-year-olds
00:35:55.900
And I, and my kids are very brilliant and very verbal.
00:36:00.020
And I know the emotional intelligence of people this age.
00:36:07.280
And by the way, like four-year-olds, they are smart for their age.
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00:36:12.760
They can be smart for their age, but overall, really dumb, really dumb.
1.00
00:36:24.420
And so for a four-year-old to be able to articulate God put someone in the wrong body, this is a
00:36:32.380
There is this whole part of left-wing ideology as, again, they look at everything through
00:36:40.160
They see kids oppressed by the nuclear family, oppressed by parental authority and need to
00:36:47.900
And so this dualistic idea that Nancy Piercy talks about so brilliantly in Love Thy Body,
00:36:53.280
everyone read that, that you can be a different person on the inside than what you are on the
00:36:58.500
outside, and you know that deep down, and you've just got to unlock that one day through your
00:37:06.320
It is a fantasy that he is actually playing out.
00:37:10.980
And again, I will just reiterate, it is creepy.
00:37:15.040
It is weird for a grown man to say that he is a girl, okay?
00:37:22.320
He has dressed up like a six-year-old girl before.
00:37:24.840
Let me show you this picture of Dylan Mulvaney from a couple years ago, last year, dressing
00:37:33.240
Remember, Eloise is a six-year-old fictional character who lives at the plaza in New York
00:37:41.920
And if you know enough about trans ideology, if you've been following this show, listening
00:37:47.080
to the experts that we talk about, you know that this is a pattern of grown men suddenly
00:37:52.680
saying that they identify as the opposite sex, and then starting to dress up as adolescent
00:37:58.280
girls, as teenage girls, even sometimes younger than that, with the bows, with the skirts, with
00:38:12.340
And once you understand that the trans movement is not a bunch of people who have genuine struggle
00:38:19.560
with gender confusion, with gender dysphoria, that so much of it, I don't know this for a
00:38:24.640
fact about Dylan, but so much of it is actually led by pornography, by the worst kind of pornography,
00:38:31.200
then you start to realize, okay, this pronoun politeness stuff, it's completely bunk.
00:38:34.920
I'm not going to affirm that dark, demonic underbelly of the trans movement.
1.00
00:38:43.800
It's not that you don't have sympathy for them, but you have sympathy for them as people
00:38:46.800
who are lost, who are possessed in some way, not as people who genuinely are stuck in the
00:38:53.540
And that's a really important distinction to make.
00:38:56.460
Okay, we've got more about this in just a second.
00:38:59.280
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00:40:14.140
He did this whole Days of Girl thing, Days of Girlhood thing on Twitter, or not on Twitter,
00:40:22.160
Let me tell you something also about Dylan Mulvaney that is just freaky, and I've said
00:40:30.060
So we have been talking about him, and I've talked about him in very compassionate terms
00:40:38.420
too, like pleading to him to see that God did not make a mistake, that he never makes
00:40:44.620
mistakes, and that he made your body exactly what it was supposed to be.
00:40:48.600
He's gone through this, like, facial feminization surgery, all of this stuff.
00:40:52.920
Estrogen, which is not good for the male body to have too much estrogen.
00:40:56.500
It's not good for the female body to have too much testosterone.
1.00
00:41:00.980
And we discovered one day, this was, I don't know, a couple years ago, Brie?
00:41:08.160
Yeah, I think it was 2023 or beginning of 2023, maybe.
00:41:13.120
And, like, Brie, I don't even think you had been on the show at that point yet.
00:41:19.160
And definitely the other girl who worked on the team at the time to do social media had
00:41:23.720
never been on the show, had never, we had never publicly said her name.
00:41:28.080
I might have said the name Brie before, but you wouldn't have known last name.
00:41:33.600
And again, this social media girl, like, y'all probably don't even, y'all don't know the
00:41:42.360
So, and we all found one day when we were trying to look at Dylan Mulvaney's Instagram
00:41:51.420
Our show page, my page, Brie's page, our social media girls page.
00:42:01.000
There is no public information that says, that said Brie's first and last name, our social
00:42:05.780
media girls first and last name and associated with relatable.
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00:42:08.340
And yet somehow he found a way to block all of us.
00:42:14.460
That to me tells me something that to me tells me, I think this is just my suspicion that
00:42:20.380
he had contacts or his people have contacts at Meta, at Instagram, that they were able
00:42:26.420
to figure out everyone who had access to our show page and that they, because you, you
00:42:33.780
can't, again, you can't find that publicly and he wouldn't have been able to find that.
00:42:38.600
But they found everyone who has access to our show page and basically blocked us for
00:42:46.160
Because there were other people on our team who were not logged into our show page who
00:42:55.340
And so anytime that he talks about, you know, being oppressed or whatever, he's got power.
00:43:02.700
You can ask any person how difficult it is, especially as a conservative, to even talk
00:43:10.700
I almost said countries, but, and like get an answer, get help.
00:43:17.140
So yeah, he doesn't, he doesn't like us, which is just so shocking.
00:43:22.060
So he went on The View to talk about his new book, which is crazy.
00:43:30.400
His, his book right now is number like 800 something in the top 100 books.
00:43:37.080
And it just came out, which I have a much smaller platform than Dylan Mulvaney.
00:43:43.580
At one point, my book was in the top 100 books on Amazon.
00:43:48.540
I'm, and I'm not even saying that to like brag, I'm just saying like, this is true of
00:43:52.420
a lot of new authors with any kind of platform or like new books.
00:43:55.500
They hit the top 100, but his has only gone down and he went on The View and has done all
00:44:00.220
of this national stuff and it has 19 reviews and 2.5 stars.
00:44:11.540
So he went on The View and he started talking about, you know, girls sports and things like
00:44:20.580
And they started talking about trans identifying athletes and Whoopi Goldberg brings up California
00:44:27.340
Governor Gavin Newsom's recent comments, acknowledging that it is unfair for trans
00:44:34.600
We haven't even talked about Gavin Newsom's podcast with Charlie Kirk.
00:44:38.440
Charlie did great, but I have so many thoughts on that.
00:44:41.260
Anyway, then she asks Dylan what he thinks about this comment.
00:44:48.080
The last time I played a sport, I was six years old and I was on a soccer team, but I
00:44:56.680
And so in the words of Wicked, I am not that girl.
00:44:59.860
Part of the problem that the trans community is facing, and it's the same problem that women
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00:45:07.240
face is if you don't know anything about our bodies, you don't know how it works.
00:45:12.400
So when you come in and you say, oh, you know, these men, these are men, you know, competing
00:45:21.940
You're assuming that the women are weak and just can't do anything except for you.
1.00
00:45:35.240
First of all, if there is anyone who knows nothing about the female body, it is Dylan
00:45:43.580
And then he said he's someone who is the opposite sex.
00:45:46.420
He knows nothing negative about the female body.
00:45:50.360
Remember that one time when he said he walks around with tampons in case, like, there is
00:46:05.540
Because to say that, oh, the reason why we have sex-segregated athletics is because we
00:46:15.680
Oh, this is your inner misogynist that you don't believe that men can compete against women.
00:46:22.880
Do you remember when the Olympic U.S. women's soccer team, they played a Dallas-based under-15s
00:46:39.020
The 14 and 15-year-old boys beat the Olympic women's soccer team in a scrimmage a few years
00:46:50.140
To quote from, this is a Duke University study from 2017.
00:46:57.500
If you know sport, you know this beyond a reasonable doubt.
00:47:00.160
There is an average 10 to 12% performance gap between elite males and elite females.
00:47:05.580
The gap is smaller between elite females and non-elite males, but it's still insurmountable,
00:47:15.740
There's a performance gap between elite males and elite females.
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00:47:25.060
Just in the single year 2017, Olympic world and U.S. champion Tori Bowie's 100 meters lifetime
00:47:31.620
best of 10.78 was beat 15,000 times by men and boys.
00:47:41.420
This is the most elite runner probably in the world.
00:47:46.720
She was beaten 15,000 times, not just from men, but also from non-elite boys.
00:47:55.000
There are high school boys that can beat the fastest female runner in the world.
00:48:01.660
The same is true of Olympic world and U.S. champion Allison Felix's 400 meters lifetime of 49.26.
00:48:12.580
2017, men and boys around the world outperformed her more than 15,000 times.
00:48:18.500
They note that this is a result not based on mere identity, not based on better resources,
00:48:28.000
It is because these boys have an androgynized body.
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00:48:36.640
The results make clear that sex determines win share.
00:48:41.720
Female athletes are not competitive for the win against males.
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00:48:46.080
The lowest end of the male range of testosterone is three times higher than the highest end of the female range.
00:48:57.240
Post-puberty, that's not changed by pumping a guy with estrogen.
00:49:06.480
He has more aerobic and anaerobic capacity in his lungs.
00:49:18.320
Every single cell of his body, except for some of his sperm cells, are XY.
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00:49:30.720
These biological differences, Duke University says, explain the male and female secondary sex characteristics
0.79
00:49:35.980
which developed during puberty have lifelong effects, including the most important for success in sport.
00:49:44.100
There is no other physical, cultural, or socioeconomic trait as important as testes.
00:49:51.460
The number of men and boys beating the world's best women in the 100 and 400 meters is far from the exception.
00:50:09.520
I mean, science and statistics are basically just catching up to what we already know.
00:50:14.820
And I want to end this segment with this story that I came across on Acts this morning.
00:50:20.320
Just a reminder to you of why anytime you feel, gosh, this is just, it's too harsh.
00:50:30.820
I want to remind you that not only are you trying to outnice God, which is self-idolatry, which is a serious sin,
00:50:38.440
but you are also complicit in a movement that is ruining people's lives.
00:50:44.660
And that is the difference between toxic empathy and love.
00:50:47.400
Toxic empathy simply affirms someone's feelings because you don't want to make them feel bad.
00:50:56.860
It refuses to look at the people on the other side of the moral equation.
00:51:02.220
Remember, Christians are called to the truth in love.
00:51:05.760
That is the difficult and sometimes tense dichotomy that Christians are called to.
00:51:11.620
And the love that we are called to is not always seen as nice or easy or acceptable by the world.
00:51:18.720
And that's okay because friendship with God is enmity with the world.
00:51:30.540
He talks a lot about detransition and just the evil of this movement.
0.99
00:51:35.400
And so he went to a conference recently where he told this young person's story.
00:51:47.080
At Detransition Awareness Day, Forrest Smith describes running away to Portland after dropping out of college
00:51:52.560
and availing himself of a network of homeless youth services that allowed him to reinvent himself as a transgender woman
00:51:59.580
and participate in street political militancy.
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00:52:03.960
During COVID, he was rushed through for an emergency orchiectomy, that is the removal of testicles,
00:52:11.000
despite closure of the hospital for elective procedures with the aid of a referral specialist whose job was to manipulate billing codes for gender procedures,
00:52:20.620
received a letter from a psychiatrist testifying that testicle removal was urgent and life-saving.
00:52:31.660
When he then, after he got his testicles removed,
00:52:42.060
and insurance that paid to remove his testicles while he was homeless and drug addicted
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00:52:47.180
would not cover removal of his breast implants.
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00:53:04.320
But gosh, how many detransitioners have we talked to?
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00:53:07.200
Especially women who will never have their voice back.
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00:53:10.000
They will never have their reproductive abilities back.
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00:53:12.340
They will never be able to breastfeed because they made this horror decision when they were young
00:53:17.100
that there, of course, is some responsibility on them for.
00:53:20.660
But they were affirmed by these adults who were too scared to tell them the truth
00:53:24.720
or maybe who really believed that simply affirming people's delusions was the most loving thing.
00:53:30.920
Whether someone regrets it or not later, it's still not loving.
00:53:36.540
And if Christians are not the one to stand up for it,
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00:53:39.680
as Christians have stood up against evil for the past 2,000 years,
00:53:43.700
and we pass the buck to people who don't even know Christ,
00:53:48.480
who don't even believe that we are made in God's image,
00:53:51.300
the movement against this kind of wickedness will fail.
00:53:53.840
It has to be led by Christians who are uncompromising in the truth,
1.00
00:53:58.840
not despite our love for neighbor, but because of our love for neighbor.
00:54:03.360
And if you want more about this movement, about what is happening to people's bodies,
00:54:09.500
It's a short read, but it is really important for Christians to understand what is going on here.
00:54:15.860
And so that is why I'm not going to – I'm just not persuaded by your pronoun politeness.
00:54:22.880
I'm not persuaded by your moral extortion and your emotional manipulation
00:54:26.580
because lives and bodies are on the line, and I care about that.
00:54:31.880
Let me pause, tell you about our last sponsor for the day.
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So we're going to talk about gym clothes because I posted about this on the fly on my Instagram story,
00:55:58.640
and I just got such a response from so many of you and so many people asking me to talk about this on the show.
00:56:05.960
Some of you are going to love this and be yelling amen, and some of you are going to be like,
00:56:11.400
this is mean, this is wrong, you shouldn't talk about this.
00:56:17.180
And now some of it is biblical, as we'll get into, but I mean, some of it is just my take.
00:56:26.960
Okay, so I joined a gym for the first time in like 12 years.
00:56:33.160
I have done other forms of workouts, every form of workout.
00:56:37.140
I've done CrossFit and cycling and Orange Theory and barre and Pilates and long-distance running and all that kind of stuff.
00:56:45.000
And I really like everything, really, in a different way.
00:56:48.700
But I decided to join just a regular old gym because I like weightlifting, and I had no idea really what to expect.
00:56:59.320
It's been a pretty good experience, except for the fact that the girls wear no clothes.
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00:57:08.340
Obviously, I believe in modesty first as a heart posture, but it should also manifest itself in what we wear.
00:57:15.320
However, I would not call myself a legalist when it comes to this.
00:57:19.280
The Bible doesn't say how long our skirts have to be or if we can wear tank tops or not wear tank tops.
00:57:28.420
Modesty is one of those things that it's kind of you know it when you see it.
00:57:33.120
Different things look different on different people.
00:57:35.840
It's obvious when someone is wearing something for the purpose of provoking lust.
00:57:47.940
So anyway, I'm not what you would call a stickler on every single part of clothing.
00:57:55.600
You would have to be blind to not see what I am talking about in gyms.
00:58:04.600
The things that women are wearing these days are insane.
1.00
00:58:12.960
Bras that might as well just be like your regular brasier, not even a sports bra.
00:58:19.340
These people are wearing, these women are wearing publicly with the leggings that are not typical
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00:58:25.500
leggings but actually scrunch in the butt crack so it looks like you have a wedgie.
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00:58:31.300
Now, I remember when having a wedgie used to be a form of bullying.
00:58:40.000
Like, you know, the old 80s sitcoms where the nerd would get a wedgie and he would get hung
00:58:59.640
You've got your, like, translucent leggings stuck all the way up your butt.
0.93
00:59:05.160
And let me also just say it's not cute for the most part.
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00:59:13.180
I say for the most part because obviously there are people who are professional athletes and
00:59:19.180
they're athletic and they look very strong in this stuff.
00:59:22.620
That's really kind of beside the point when we're talking about decency and appropriateness
00:59:29.780
But I just want to say, and I say this as someone who would also be talking about myself.
00:59:33.960
I am not saying this from the position of thinking I have perfect physique by any means.
00:59:38.300
I just want to be the wake-up call for you because TikTok has deluded you.
00:59:45.720
Like, there is no one that I've seen that would not look better in a shirt.
00:59:50.900
And I think that TikTok has really deluded us into thinking that these, like, light-colored,
00:59:58.680
wedgified leggings and these skimpy sports bras make us look more athletic.
01:00:10.440
I know from experience how easy it is to put on a shirt.
01:00:14.360
It's so easy to just put a shirt or a tank top over your sports bra.
01:00:20.420
It takes no effort at all that it is so obvious that you are making the choice that you are
01:00:26.320
making with your clothing because you are thirsty.
01:00:33.800
And I know that we hear, oh, you know, these women, they're not dressing for the male gaze.
0.81
01:00:42.200
Well, let me just say on behalf of the homegirls, we don't like it.
0.72
01:00:47.740
If you're dressing for us, you can put a shirt on.
01:00:56.300
Because if men have to wear a shirt, I've never seen a man at this gym without a shirt
01:01:02.780
If men have to wear shirts, then women should have to wear shirts, too.
0.99
01:01:06.820
It doesn't seem like that difficult of a rule to enforce.
01:01:16.440
I don't think gyms should have to, like, measure, you know, how long are your shorts?
01:01:20.100
I'm not saying that, although that'd be kind of cool if they did.
01:01:35.060
And I've gotten these responses saying, well, you know, it gets hot in there.
01:01:47.220
Because you are thinking about falling out of your clothes when you're doing your bent
01:01:54.700
It's actually, like, I would think very uncomfortable.
01:01:58.340
And there is no form of working out that I've ever done that I've thought, you know what?
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Like, this would be way better if I could take my shirt off right now.
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So, another part about this is that you will see this, and I think it's influencer culture
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And we can debate all different kinds of things, if women should be wearing leggings at all,
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But influencer culture has made women think that they need to dress like this when they
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And you'll see dialogue, discussion among these influencers, like, well, this man was
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Like, she'll have her phone set up, and she's, you know, wearing this outfit, and she sees
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a guy in the background who doesn't realize he's being recorded checking her out.
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And then she'll have this whole meltdown afterwards.
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And she's like, I can't believe you're looking at me.
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How would he, how, how dare he look at me?
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Girl, look, men are certainly responsible for their actions.
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Jesus said, if your eye is causing you to lust, pluck it out.
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However, you are also responsible for how you dress.
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And there are a lot of men out there who do not follow the advice of Christ.
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And so you can't really be surprised when they're checking you out.
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Now, I'm not saying that that justifies any kind of disrespect or any kind of harassment
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But let's not remove all agency from women.
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You can work out without looking like a hoe.
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And I am respecting your body more than you're respecting your body when I say that.
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Because you are worth more than self-objectification.
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And you should respect yourself enough not to be thirsty when you're working out.
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And I wish that this wasn't controversial to say.
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And I'm sure that I will get a wide range of YouTube comments on there.
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But I just wanted to share my thoughts in a permanent place.
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You can work out without looking like a hoe.
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However, like I sometimes go to like an infrared sauna gym.
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And so sometimes I see people in there working out by themselves in like sports bras.
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I've never seen anyone without any clothes, which is good.
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It's got to be super distracting for dudes, too.
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And then we don't have time to get into all of this.
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But there is this like gym owner in the UK who wanted to start her own gym that was just for women.
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And she is being absolutely lambasted by these trans activists because she was like, yeah, you got to actually be a woman like your biology has to be a woman.
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And she is absolutely getting so much pushback.
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But still, even if we're male, female split up, I don't want to see.
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And for anyone who says mind your business, I would love to mind my business.
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Don't shimmy by the squat rack if you want us to all mind our business.