Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - Ep 1157 ｜ What’s God’s Will for Me？ Here’s How You Know ｜ Guest： Costi Hinn

00:00:00.800 How do we know God's will for our life?

00:00:04.100 Is it just a feeling?

00:00:06.060 Are we supposed to hear audibly from God?

00:00:08.920 How do we discern not just between right and wrong, but between good and best?

00:00:14.840 Kosti Hinn is here today.

00:00:16.520 He is a pastor from Arizona.

00:00:18.920 He's been on the show before talking about his last book, God, Greed, and the Prosperity

00:00:24.760 Gospel, and now he has a new book called Walking in God's Will.

00:00:29.820 It's about demystifying God's plan and purpose for your life.

00:00:34.180 Y'all, this conversation is so good.

00:00:37.180 Here's what I encourage you to do if you're not driving.

00:00:40.440 Get out your notebook, get a pen, get out your notes app on your phone.

00:00:45.200 Make sure that you are taking notes.

00:00:47.380 This is all stuff you are going to want to apply to your life.

00:00:50.020 You're going to want to add this book to your library.

00:00:52.640 You will be referencing it for years to come.

00:00:55.760 I promise you this was awesome.

00:00:57.040 I got so much out of this, and I'm so excited for you to hear this discussion.

00:01:01.900 It's brought to you by our friends at Good Ranchers.

00:01:04.100 Go to GoodRanchers.com.

00:01:05.520 Use code Allie at checkout. 1.00

00:01:06.940 That's GoodRanchers.com, code Allie.

00:01:18.960 Kosti, thanks so much for taking the time to join us.

00:01:21.660 I think the last time you were on was 2021.

00:01:24.080 Yeah, it's been a minute.

00:01:24.960 Thanks for having me.

00:01:25.620 I like your studio.

00:01:26.600 Thank you so much.

00:01:27.540 It's so comfy.

00:01:27.640 Nice.

00:01:27.980 I know.

00:01:28.260 Last time you were on, it was virtual.

00:01:30.920 And gosh, that's four years ago.

00:01:33.160 You've added at least a couple kids.

00:01:35.260 Two.

00:01:35.440 A church.

00:01:36.600 Two kids.

00:01:37.460 You have six kids now.

00:01:38.800 Yes.

00:01:39.260 All two years apart.

00:01:40.420 Yep.

00:01:40.920 Amazing.

00:01:41.600 Yeah.

00:01:41.860 And tell me about the church that you've planted in the past few years.

00:01:45.760 Okay.

00:01:46.080 So we talked in 2021.

00:01:48.420 Yes.

00:01:48.640 And we're in planning mode for a church.

00:01:50.300 The church's name is called Shepherd's House.

00:01:52.580 And we planted in the Phoenix, Arizona area.

00:01:56.180 And right around February, 2022.

00:01:59.000 And so when you were just out hanging out with all of us, that was our, actually, I didn't

00:02:02.720 tell you this, but our three-year anniversary that weekend.

00:02:05.640 No way.

00:02:06.100 Of the church plant.

00:02:07.160 And so God's blessed it.

00:02:08.220 It's been neat.

00:02:08.960 And that area is full of people that are hungry for the truth and they want to grow.

00:02:14.500 They need a spiritual community.

00:02:15.560 And then a lot of young families have moved into the Phoenix area, cities like Gilbert

00:02:20.440 and Chandler.

00:02:22.680 And so, yeah, it's thriving.

00:02:24.120 We're thankful.

00:02:24.660 Lots of work, but rewarding work.

00:02:26.780 Okay.

00:02:27.000 So a lot of people watching and listening, they already know your story, but there are some

00:02:30.460 out there that don't.

00:02:31.520 Give us a recap.

00:02:32.520 Last time we talked, it was about your book, God, Greed, and the Prosperity Gospel, right?

00:02:36.720 That's right.

00:02:37.240 Yeah.

00:02:37.920 And so we talked a lot about your testimony, then your upbringing, but give us a summary.

00:02:42.840 All right.

00:02:43.240 So grew up in sort of the center of what's called the Prosperity Gospel and the Word of

00:02:49.000 Faith movement.

00:02:49.860 You just had a friend of ours on yesterday, Melissa, who deals with new thought and a

00:02:55.780 lot of mysticism, Joel Osteen stuff.

00:02:57.740 So I was thick in the center of that, mainly because I grew up in it.

00:03:00.760 My uncle, his name is Benny Hinn, and a lot of people even around here know who he is and

00:03:06.140 just his legacy of 50-something years of a lot of faith healing.

00:03:10.180 So I grew up in it.

00:03:11.040 I worked for him, and over time—and I believed it, bought the thing, took it hook, line, and

00:03:17.460 sinker—but over time I would ask questions just in my inner mind, thinking, that's not

00:03:21.740 right.

00:03:22.080 The Bible says this.

00:03:23.500 That seems pretty crooked.

00:03:24.760 Or I saw things behind the scenes that were really fake or really staged, and I thought,

00:03:28.980 that doesn't seem like we're supposed to do it.

00:03:31.620 And when I would bring it up privately, a lot of times my family members would say, there

00:03:37.720 are always going to be things that aren't necessarily true or right, but our job is to

00:03:42.020 give people hope and we give people faith.

00:03:44.080 Or if people maybe like you or others would say things about us or criticize or like Dateline

00:03:51.460 NBC, Inside Edition, CBC in Canada, Canadian Broadcasting Corporation, would do hit pieces

00:03:57.740 on my uncle, my father, and a number of things going on with the ministries that they were

00:04:03.100 involved with, we would say we're being persecuted, like Paul and like Jesus.

00:04:07.680 And so I grew up with this chip on my shoulder, and Baptists and non-denominational Christians 1.00

00:04:13.640 or people like you who will speak truth on things, you are all dead Christians, you don't 1.00

00:04:18.960 have the Spirit, you don't have the power and the anointing like us, and the Lord's

00:04:22.580 not going to bless you, and you're just jealous of our special spiritual status.

00:04:26.760 And so that was the way I grew up.

00:04:28.600 Well, I end up playing baseball at Dallas Baptist University.

00:04:33.900 It was a really formative experience.

00:04:37.060 I had already worked for my uncle, and so I roll up on the DBU campus in a black H2,

00:04:43.640 Hummer, and had like a $10,000 Breitling watch, and my Baptist coach, who literally is like

00:04:50.340 one of the best hitting coaches in college baseball, one of the best coaches, period,

00:04:53.640 but one of the best hitting coaches in all baseball anywhere, is sitting there, and at

00:04:58.700 the time he drives this white Camry, super mellow guy, like biblical, simple, and he's

00:05:03.880 talking about God's sovereignty, and he's saying like, guys, don't worry about scouts and

00:05:07.820 getting drafted.

00:05:09.140 Proverbs 21.1 says, the heart of the king is like channels of water in the

00:05:13.620 hand of the Lord.

00:05:14.420 He turns it wherever he wishes.

00:05:15.840 He controls kings, scouts, leaders, the world.

00:05:19.380 Don't worry.

00:05:20.080 God's sovereign.

00:05:21.100 You just control what you can control and play hard and trust the Lord.

00:05:25.000 And I always used to make fun of him in my head, like this Baptist dude or this white 0.99

00:05:28.140 Camry, like I know how to control God and get him to do what I want.

00:05:32.220 And like, what does this guy even know?

00:05:33.980 But that seed of God being sovereign and a biblical understanding of the gospel was planted.

00:05:40.040 And so years later, I was a pastor at a church that wasn't very rooted in biblical teaching

00:05:47.400 at the time.

00:05:48.200 It was just sort of a popularity contest, very like seeker-driven, get him in as long

00:05:53.760 as it's cool.

00:05:54.940 And one day, the team there, the pastor, a number of us, we went through this season

00:05:59.580 where like, we should probably preach the Bible more, which is really shocking.

00:06:03.840 It was like, what?

00:06:04.380 This won't attract people.

00:06:06.320 So we start preaching through books of the Bible and we get to the gospel of John and

00:06:10.280 I'm studying John 5 and the healing that takes place at Bethesda.

00:06:14.600 And I grabbed this commentary that someone had given to me.

00:06:17.140 I'd never used one before.

00:06:19.060 And I start studying and it just wrecks my world that Jesus heals one man out of a multitude.

00:06:24.440 He heals him immediately.

00:06:25.820 So there's no offering and special seed of faith.

00:06:28.780 There's no white jacket getting waved, no music, no buildup, no shenanigans at all.

00:06:33.400 He just heals him.

00:06:34.380 And the person's not limping.

00:06:35.840 I would see people limp across the stage and my uncle or a faith healer would say, oh,

00:06:40.440 I know they're limping, but your legs would be limping and stiff too.

00:06:44.680 If you had been crippled for 30 years in a wheelchair, let's give God a hand of praise.

00:06:48.480 He'll finish the healing as you believe.

00:06:50.140 And you're just like, oh yeah, sure.

00:06:51.720 Like I'd be limping too.

00:06:52.720 They're probably just stiff.

00:06:53.980 Yeah.

00:06:54.600 Read the Bible.

00:06:55.740 Ain't nobody stiff.

00:06:57.100 Pick up your palate and walk.

00:06:58.560 They're walking.

00:06:59.300 So I'm like, that's different.

00:07:00.360 True.

00:07:00.640 And then the last big kicker for me in that point of my study was the Pharisee said, who 0.61

00:07:06.720 told you you can pick up your palate and walk?

00:07:09.020 The man said, well, the man who healed me did.

00:07:12.340 And John records that the man didn't know who Jesus was because Jesus had slipped away.

00:07:16.880 And so that messed me up because I went, how did you get your healing if you didn't know

00:07:21.960 who Jesus was?

00:07:22.800 Because you have to have enough faith to get healed.

00:07:24.980 I used to believe that.

00:07:25.820 If you don't get healed, if you're like Johnny Erickson Tata and you're still quadriplegic,

00:07:30.520 if you're broke, if you're infertile, if your kids are prodigal, you just don't have

00:07:34.700 enough faith.

00:07:35.180 Oh, Allie, you must not be giving enough money to the church.

00:07:37.860 And I see that and I'm like, how did he have enough faith?

00:07:40.480 And then he complained that he didn't get to the pool.

00:07:42.880 Like what in the world?

00:07:44.100 So I grabbed this commentary and it's by a pastor.

00:07:47.640 I didn't really know him at the time named John MacArthur.

00:07:49.660 And in this section, he goes off about the sovereignty of Christ in healing the man,

00:07:55.780 not because he had enough faith, not because he's special, not because he said the right

00:07:59.480 things.

00:07:59.800 He actually complained and didn't know Jesus, but Jesus healed him as a sovereign healer

00:08:05.260 who loves and initiates, like with salvation, when we're dead in sin.

00:08:09.720 And I started crying, lost it, and everything came flooding back from Coach Hiefner talking

00:08:14.960 about sovereignty and how God will do what he does.

00:08:18.060 And I surrendered my life to Christ in that moment, said, I'm going to preach the true

00:08:22.720 gospel.

00:08:23.380 And I started studying the Bible and basically saying, what did I believe?

00:08:27.520 What do I believe?

00:08:28.700 What does the Bible say?

00:08:29.860 And it wrecked my world in a good way.

00:08:32.180 So that was a long time ago, like 13 years now, almost.

00:08:35.600 And since then, went to seminary.

00:08:38.560 I got the privilege to be in ministry properly and biblically.

00:08:42.060 And here we are.

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00:10:19.200 Do you still have a relationship with your Uncle Benny?

00:10:22.140 No, he doesn't want to talk to me.

00:10:24.220 He's pretty upset still.

00:10:26.640 My family is a very tight-knit Middle Eastern cultured family where no matter what, you don't 1.00

00:10:33.220 go against the family.

00:10:34.200 We'd say blood is thicker than water.

00:10:35.900 So I've described the way I grew up as a hybrid between the royal family and the mafia.

00:10:40.460 Royal family because the lavish wealth.

00:10:42.520 And we flew on Gulfstream jets and lived just the high life, the highest life.

00:10:47.460 And the mafia because the loyalty is very enforced.

00:10:50.540 And so when we left, we were cut off.

00:10:52.820 No money.

00:10:53.760 No safety.

00:10:54.940 We got death threats and all sorts of things way back then.

00:10:57.520 And over time, some family members have had the courage to pull away, and others kind

00:11:04.100 of live in the middle of like, you know, one family member called me one time and was

00:11:08.100 like, just know that I'm saying in the background, go, Kosti, go.

00:11:12.520 But I can't say anything because I don't want trouble.

00:11:15.580 And so that encourages me.

00:11:17.880 But yeah.

00:11:18.600 And then the reason that we started for the gospel with like media and podcasting is because

00:11:23.960 it turns out a lot of people deal with this.

00:11:26.220 And they get gaslit, and they're in hiding, or they have questions, and they have nowhere

00:11:30.240 to go.

00:11:30.660 And I'm thankful God helped me because I ended up with a commentary randomly.

00:11:36.000 But I know there's a lot of people out there who have questions.

00:11:39.000 They need biblical teaching.

00:11:40.160 So it started with, let's talk about the gospel.

00:11:43.040 And now it's led to God's will, healing, the Holy Spirit.

00:11:46.620 I'm a pastor.

00:11:47.660 So I preach the whole Bible and want to help people grow in the Lord.

00:11:52.300 And there was, maybe it was a headline.

00:11:55.680 I don't want to say a rumor.

00:11:56.580 I think that he might have said something.

00:11:58.700 Benny Hinn said something about repenting from some of the things that he had done in

00:12:04.080 the past.

00:12:05.260 Did that end up being true?

00:12:07.480 Did he repent of some of the false teachings that he had propagated for a long time?

00:12:12.620 Well, not fully or not truly.

00:12:15.720 And one thing that's happened over the years, it's happened since the 90s.

00:12:18.960 And I did a bunch of research on this afterwards as well.

00:12:21.340 Some of it I personally experienced.

00:12:22.960 And then other things I realized there were wise people watching too, is he would repent

00:12:28.320 throughout these intervals in history. 0.98

00:12:30.580 Like in the 90s, he said, when he said that God was going to burn all homosexuals in America 0.99

00:12:35.680 with fire. 0.97

00:12:36.420 I don't know if you've ever...

00:12:37.500 No, I don't think I knew that.

00:12:38.420 So that got him on the news.

00:12:39.920 He said Jesus was going to physically show up in Africa.

00:12:43.960 He settled, and he would apologize later because he would just get raked over the coals by a 0.97

00:12:48.700 lot of wise, faithful pastors.

00:12:50.840 He apologized, said, I'll never do it again.

00:12:52.600 And then he would falsely prophesy again.

00:12:55.360 And then again, when he repented the first time, the big one that hit everywhere, my aunt

00:13:01.300 sadly had filed for divorce, and he was losing a lot of donors and a lot of headway.

00:13:06.620 And I was still around in those days.

00:13:09.040 That was pretty devastating.

00:13:12.020 And so he ends up repenting, kind of going back, they get remarried.

00:13:16.200 Then there was...

00:13:17.340 And I don't take credit for this.

00:13:18.780 I think there were a lot of people putting pressure.

00:13:20.460 American Gospel came out, that documentary.

00:13:22.960 It was right after my first book, God, Greed, and the Prosperity Gospel.

00:13:26.820 And I was having a lot of conversations behind the scenes with some of his inner circle who

00:13:31.340 could talk to him because he wouldn't talk to me, and saying, like, why don't you just

00:13:36.340 repent?

00:13:36.800 Like, just say sorry, admit it, turn.

00:13:38.660 Like Zacchaeus, let's go the other way.

00:13:40.620 And well, what does he have to repent for?

00:13:43.080 And there was a lot of that.

00:13:44.020 And then a few months later, he had this public repentance.

00:13:47.260 And he said, I'm sick of it, or he said, the Holy Spirit is sick of it.

00:13:50.720 He's had enough.

00:13:51.560 I'm like, wow.

00:13:52.440 Like, without being too cheeky, just going, well, I'm glad the Holy Spirit, who is God,

00:13:56.980 has finally had enough.

00:13:58.460 Like, wow, he didn't have enough before.

00:14:00.560 Now he's hit the tipping point.

00:14:02.420 So he repents.

00:14:03.380 They get a flood of donors, a lot of momentum back.

00:14:05.920 Everyone's like, he's repented.

00:14:07.340 It's all good.

00:14:07.880 I'm like, okay, let's watch and see.

00:14:09.840 And I remember calling a family member and saying, what's going on?

00:14:15.460 Is it, is this like true?

00:14:16.960 Because I'll fly there, I'll show up, I'll drive to his front door.

00:14:20.520 What, I'll be louder for his repentance than I ever was about his false teaching.

00:14:24.620 And the family member in Arabic said, just shway, shway.

00:14:28.980 And shway, shway means like, take it easy.

00:14:31.080 Just slow down.

00:14:32.060 Shway, shway.

00:14:32.800 Like, and I was like, what's going on?

00:14:34.480 And they said, he's going through a lot of fear right now.

00:14:38.040 And his exact words were, I'm scared to meet the Lord.

00:14:40.900 And he was like, I'm scared to meet God.

00:14:42.360 And I said, well, great.

00:14:43.800 The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom.

00:14:45.780 Now just take the next step and repent of your sin.

00:14:48.260 Don't just be scared.

00:14:49.600 Judas had remorse, not repentance.

00:14:52.060 But come on, like, don't be Judas.

00:14:53.620 Be Peter, be Zacchaeus. 0.97

00:14:55.240 And then went back to it again.

00:14:57.940 And then even just recently kind of cycled back.

00:15:01.380 So when we look at the Bible and what true repentance is, 2 Corinthians chapter 7 is one

00:15:07.400 that I think every Christian, even people who have been hurt by someone or abused or

00:15:11.380 harmed or betrayed, and they go, how do I know if they're really sorry?

00:15:15.360 You go to 2 Corinthians chapter 7, and Paul uses all of these descriptive adjectives to

00:15:20.700 describe the way the Corinthians were sorry, real sorry.

00:15:24.500 He says it's godly sorrow, not worldly.

00:15:26.980 It's not just remorse.

00:15:28.040 But he says, what indignation, what zeal.

00:15:31.300 In other words, they're so mad about their sin, they hate it now.

00:15:34.680 And they're like, whatever it takes, I want to make this right.

00:15:37.580 I want to be right with you.

00:15:39.040 Paul, we're clear in our name.

00:15:40.800 We're going to walk away from this.

00:15:42.180 We're not going to tolerate it.

00:15:43.480 And there's a picture of true repentance.

00:15:46.300 It's not, hey, I'm so sorry you got your feelings hurt, Allie.

00:15:49.260 I'm sorry you're sensitive.

00:15:50.580 I'm sorry you felt that way.

00:15:51.900 No, it's I'm sorry that I did this.

00:15:55.040 Please forgive me.

00:15:56.280 Full stop.

00:15:57.060 No, but.

00:15:58.340 And that's really what it's been for him.

00:16:00.500 And it's a play for donors and for traction because his ministry is dying and his life

00:16:08.820 is sort of just continuing to go in the same direction.

00:16:11.760 But I'll say this to close in that he's breathing.

00:16:14.640 And so there's chance for change.

00:16:16.620 I pray for him often.

00:16:18.000 And my hope is he'll just lay it all out there before the end.

00:16:22.120 Yes.

00:16:22.460 Amen.

00:16:22.840 And a hallmark of that movement, I'm sure of Benny Hinn's ministry, but Word of Faith,

00:16:29.220 Prosperity, Gospel, is claims to hear directly from God, especially those who might call themselves 1.00

00:16:36.280 apostles.

00:16:37.020 Yeah.

00:16:37.420 Like the NAR, New Apostolic Reformation Movement.

00:16:41.300 There are some within that movement that call themselves apostles, claim to hear directly

00:16:45.920 from God.

00:16:46.720 But a lot of the charismatic language is that that is how you know the will of God.

00:16:50.880 You hear directly from him.

00:16:52.340 They might say, you know, well, Jesus said, my sheep know my voice.

00:16:55.960 And they take that to mean all Christians need to be hearing audibly from God, or maybe through 0.50

00:17:00.580 dreams, maybe through emotions, feelings, manifestations, different things like that.

00:17:04.680 You wrote a book about demystifying God's plan.

00:17:07.920 And I love that word because especially I think in the Reformed crowd, because we don't 1.00

00:17:14.340 take on that charismatic understanding of the revelation of God's will, it can feel mystifying.

00:17:21.040 And so break that down for us.

00:17:24.200 How do we hear from God?

00:17:26.640 Should we be listening audibly for his voice?

00:17:28.840 Should we be interpreting dreams?

00:17:30.860 How do we know his will?

00:17:32.460 That's such a good question.

00:17:33.880 I believe strongly that it all starts with the Word of God.

00:17:37.100 If you, Colossians 3.16, saturate, let the Word of God dwell within you richly, everything

00:17:43.540 that comes out of that is going to be informed and directed by God's Word.

00:17:47.140 Lord, often people will now ask me questions like, okay, so Kosti, I know, like, I get it.

00:17:52.820 God's will is God's Word.

00:17:54.380 God's Word is God's will.

00:17:55.560 I agree with you.

00:17:56.260 I agree with you.

00:17:56.820 But what do I do with that thought?

00:17:58.060 Like, I had that thought about that person.

00:17:59.860 And like, what do you call that?

00:18:01.920 Like, didn't God speak to me?

00:18:03.700 And, or I really felt like God spoke to my heart.

00:18:06.840 And I think a lot of people, I would be careful just to blanket statement, like, oh, what

00:18:11.540 a bunch of mystics.

00:18:12.560 I think a lot of people just don't think about the language they're using, and we could lobby

00:18:19.140 for a language change instead of saying, well, I feel like God's telling me, well, why don't

00:18:24.240 we just say, I have such a strong conviction?

00:18:27.240 Or instead of saying, God spoke to my heart, just say, I was meditating on this verse this

00:18:33.080 morning, and a thought came to mind, and I just have the strongest urge and desire now

00:18:38.440 in light of that truth.

00:18:39.660 Or I was praying, and I thought of this individual, and it was such a strong feeling of conviction

00:18:47.460 to reach out to them.

00:18:49.200 Why don't we just say that?

00:18:50.580 Because you hear with your ears, you feel with your emotions, you think with your mind.

00:18:54.660 We don't need to say, I feel like God spoke to me.

00:18:57.220 In the Bible, when God spoke, you weren't like, I feel like Yahweh might have just showed up. 0.63

00:19:02.680 I don't know, or I feel like.

00:19:04.120 And so if you go to the Word of God, you'll have a lot of conviction about things.

00:19:10.360 And 1 Corinthians 2 talks about the mind of Christ.

00:19:13.240 Paul says, we have the mind of Christ.

00:19:15.240 Okay, so think about this.

00:19:17.100 If you're filling up your heart, your mind, with the Word of Christ, you now have a mind

00:19:23.380 that's infiltrated in a good way by the Word of Christ, which means your actions are going

00:19:29.180 to be guided by Christ.

00:19:31.560 So of course you're going to think about people in a certain way.

00:19:34.380 Of course you're going to be praying, and someone will come to mind.

00:19:37.460 Of course you're going to want to obey God.

00:19:39.060 And of course you're going to have strong convictions about things, because you're reading God's

00:19:42.880 Word.

00:19:43.480 So we tend to mystify it for a couple of reasons.

00:19:46.620 I've done these.

00:19:47.420 Number one, we're trying to prop ourself up and make it look like we've got a real spiritual

00:19:53.420 in with God.

00:19:54.280 We just need to admit that's pride, and humbly come to people and not say, hey, God told me.

00:19:59.080 You know, God spoke to me.

00:20:00.560 No, just say, yeah, I was reading the Word, and here's the conviction.

00:20:04.700 Another is insecurity.

00:20:06.580 We want to have a definitive plan in a way that we know that this is true, and so we psych

00:20:13.120 ourself up.

00:20:13.740 We're like, you know, this has got to be God.

00:20:15.180 I'm pretty sure God told me that.

00:20:17.320 And we convince ourself.

00:20:18.940 And then a third is manipulation.

00:20:20.860 I remember time and time again to get what I wanted out of whether it's parents or to convince

00:20:26.060 authorities, anyone in my life, that what I needed to do is what they should approve.

00:20:31.600 I'd say, you know, I had a dream last night.

00:20:34.940 God showed me.

00:20:36.160 And everyone, whoa, like, no way.

00:20:38.140 Okay, we can't come against that.

00:20:40.060 And so it's the ultimate gag order, or filibuster moment, or hostage takeover, when you just

00:20:47.680 say, God told me, and God said.

00:20:51.000 And in that, I think there is a lot of pride where we go, I don't care what you say.

00:20:54.640 God told me.

00:20:55.740 So we go to God's Word to hear from Him, and our thoughts, emotions, and actions are going

00:21:01.680 to be controlled by that.

00:21:03.480 And that's a good thing.

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00:22:43.380 When it comes to the discernment that's required in figuring out not just right from wrong,

00:22:54.940 because the Bible does graciously, pretty clearly speak on what is sin and what is good.

00:23:00.940 But sometimes our decisions are between good and best, where it's not obvious that something

00:23:06.280 is a sin.

00:23:07.000 Say you're trying to pick between two colleges, two jobs, something.

00:23:10.920 One is not overtly simple or obviously in the bad direction, but you want to do what best glorifies God.

00:23:17.380 A lot of people are crippled with anxiety over those decisions.

00:23:21.280 When we're asking God for wisdom in those things, what does it feel like,

00:23:25.140 or what does it look like to have wisdom to go a certain direction?

00:23:30.100 That's a great question.

00:23:30.840 Okay, I'll share personally from my own life briefly.

00:23:33.840 When we planted the church in Arizona, it started with a move to Arizona to serve at a church

00:23:39.580 for a couple of years, and they wanted to plant churches and so to be planted there,

00:23:43.380 which means moving from Orange County, California.

00:23:46.040 And I remember in the process, my wife kept saying, well, Christine, you know,

00:23:49.580 you guys were just out, but Christine's like, Costi, are you sure?

00:23:53.520 She's a California girl. 0.98

00:23:54.720 And I kept giving her first down.

00:23:56.200 Like every time we talked, she's like, are you sure, babe, you're moving me to Phoenix, Arizona,

00:24:01.240 like to the desert.

00:24:02.520 You're sure?

00:24:03.860 And I was going like, first down every time.

00:24:06.900 She's like, you're that confident.

00:24:08.080 I was like, yep.

00:24:09.020 The reason I was confident was not because of some mystified pie in the sky vision,

00:24:14.960 not some inner cockiness like a dude, like, no, I know.

00:24:18.280 And I'm like, oh God, I hope this works out.

00:24:20.240 Please, Lord, make it work.

00:24:21.400 No, I had by that time refined a process that I would walk through, and I had learned it

00:24:28.200 from older, wiser men.

00:24:29.700 And I now, in the book, I call it the fundamentals for every fork in the road.

00:24:34.240 That's the chapter.

00:24:34.980 And I call it the seven Ps for no regret decisions.

00:24:37.400 And I had gone through all of these, and I thought, yeah, it is absolutely the right decision.

00:24:44.380 It was the desert.

00:24:45.340 It wasn't glamorous.

00:24:46.280 And I chose Phoenix.

00:24:48.720 Why?

00:24:49.680 The reason is I went through this process.

00:24:51.420 Number one, there was a process.

00:24:53.280 That's my first P.

00:24:54.520 Like an architect, like a builder, like a GC, a general contractor, we're going to lay

00:25:00.380 out a process.

00:25:01.280 We're not just going to run into it and go, yeah, we'll figure it out.

00:25:03.980 What's our process?

00:25:05.180 Who are we going to talk to?

00:25:06.540 What is our reasoning?

00:25:07.720 What are the opportunities?

00:25:08.600 You've got to lay it out and slow down.

00:25:10.600 Number two is, have we prayed?

00:25:12.480 James 1.5 says that we can ask God for wisdom.

00:25:15.520 It's the ultimate, not prosperity gospel, but it is the ultimate ask in faith and you'll

00:25:19.820 get it.

00:25:20.240 Promise.

00:25:21.260 It's not money.

00:25:22.300 It's not a house.

00:25:23.180 It's wisdom.

00:25:24.320 James 1.5 says that we can ask for wisdom with faith and God will give it.

00:25:29.320 And it says, actually, let the one who doubts not expect anything from God.

00:25:33.220 It's as though God is saying, look, don't you dare doubt.

00:25:37.420 You should have enough faith.

00:25:39.140 You should believe that I'm the God that will pour out wisdom.

00:25:41.520 So come to me and believe in who I am and what I can give.

00:25:45.820 So have we prayed?

00:25:47.060 And when you pray, it's Luke 22, 42.

00:25:50.420 Lord, these are two really good decisions.

00:25:53.760 Not my will, but yours be done.

00:25:55.500 This one seems good for these reasons.

00:25:57.320 This one for this.

00:25:58.700 Guide the direction and providentially open doors and make it clear.

00:26:03.000 Now, let's say it's still, they still kind of are both sitting there.

00:26:06.540 Um, there's a third P and it's have we sought wise counsel with prudence.

00:26:12.120 Prudence is kind of the unsung hero nowadays.

00:26:14.660 It's the ability to rationalize, slow down, and think through things without emotion or

00:26:21.860 your heart or materialism or ego or pride.

00:26:25.480 You're just going, what should we do?

00:26:27.420 And you seek wise counsel from the wise.

00:26:29.780 Proverbs says, I always tell this to my kids when they go to school every day.

00:26:32.560 If you want to be wise, walk with the wise.

00:26:35.580 Seek wise counsel with prudence.

00:26:38.060 And then there's another one, and it's, uh, what are our priorities?

00:26:41.460 I lay out four priorities.

00:26:44.060 Spiritual.

00:26:45.120 It's got to be top.

00:26:46.140 Too many people move places and take jobs and they think about the money first.

00:26:49.580 You've got to think about the local church.

00:26:51.900 You've got to think about discipleship.

00:26:53.620 You've got to think about your soul.

00:26:55.760 Biblically, Hebrews 13, 17 speaks about those who oversee and care for our souls.

00:27:01.420 That's what we do.

00:27:02.260 So if you're out on a, you know, walk in the plank spiritually, but you've got a huge

00:27:08.620 salary offer, flip those.

00:27:12.340 Pick a church.

00:27:14.000 Identify.

00:27:14.800 Don't just buy a home because it's gorgeous and you're like, oh, this will be the best

00:27:17.940 one.

00:27:18.280 Well, where's a church nearby that you can grow with?

00:27:20.440 You have a community.

00:27:21.600 Well, no, no.

00:27:21.960 We'll figure that out.

00:27:22.820 And you're now an hour and 10 minutes detached from people, but you're like, oh, but look

00:27:26.480 at my magnolia level home.

00:27:29.600 That's awesome.

00:27:30.180 But have we thought about spiritual?

00:27:32.080 And if you want to drive an hour, great.

00:27:33.740 But have you thought about it?

00:27:34.660 So spiritual, financial.

00:27:36.520 I talk about those priorities.

00:27:37.900 It is important.

00:27:38.700 It is good to think about provision.

00:27:41.020 Which one will be most advantageous in that way?

00:27:45.220 Relational.

00:27:46.320 Are you on an island?

00:27:47.240 Who are your friends?

00:27:48.260 Are you going to be around a community?

00:27:49.940 We're meant to be in community as Christians.

00:27:52.140 That's part of God's will for us.

00:27:53.720 And then fourth, I say eternal.

00:27:55.860 What's the long-term play here?

00:27:57.920 How will this help you achieve your eternal purpose?

00:28:02.560 Bobby Bowden, the famous Florida State coach, was asked once, what's your legacy?

00:28:07.580 And is it the national champion?

00:28:08.880 Is it the undefeated season?

00:28:10.120 What is it?

00:28:10.640 And all these reporters wanted to know.

00:28:12.300 And he was like, I don't look at it that way.

00:28:14.220 I asked the question, did I fulfill God's purpose for my life on earth?

00:28:18.160 And that's a man who, with all of his earthly accolades, was thinking, did I achieve the

00:28:22.560 eternal purpose?

00:28:23.120 You could decide, should I do relatable?

00:28:25.780 Should I have a studio?

00:28:26.600 Should I this?

00:28:27.100 Should I have a show?

00:28:27.860 Should I that?

00:28:28.400 Should I that?

00:28:29.260 And in all of those priorities, eternal, what you're doing here, every recording, every

00:28:34.800 book you write, every effort, every time you push a button, that's just, I'm like, okay,

00:28:39.860 Allie Bestucki, sister, you want to be controversial this week?

00:28:44.240 I'm thankful for it.

00:28:45.500 You talk about things that I'm like, no, you're actually going to lose followers.

00:28:48.760 But go, go, Allie, go. 0.95

00:28:51.040 Because it's truth.

00:28:52.340 You're deciding to pick something that's eternal.

00:28:55.420 Those four priorities will guide you.

00:28:57.860 Another quick one, has God given us permission?

00:29:00.420 Christian liberty.

00:29:01.540 I think a lot of people get crippled by this.

00:29:03.520 Yes, true.

00:29:04.200 I had a guy recently say, Pastor, you think it's sin if I want to move to Nashville, Tennessee?

00:29:09.340 I said, why do you want to move to Nashville, Tennessee?

00:29:11.280 He's in Arizona.

00:29:12.520 He said, well, I'll just be honest with you.

00:29:15.400 It's not a need.

00:29:16.300 It's a greed.

00:29:16.920 I said, what greed is it?

00:29:17.980 He said, I just want a couple acres, I want grass, I want a chicken, or I want chickens

00:29:23.140 and I want a cow. 0.99

00:29:23.900 He said that.

00:29:24.480 And I said, no, it's only sin if you don't invite me to come hang out.

00:29:27.260 But he was wrestling through.

00:29:29.500 He felt like it was sin to do that.

00:29:31.940 And I said, let's talk through the four priorities.

00:29:34.700 And he said, I've already found a church.

00:29:36.980 There's a Bible study that we could plug into.

00:29:39.540 Financially, it would be okay for our family.

00:29:41.540 We just want to be in the South.

00:29:43.640 And I said, it's not sin.

00:29:46.000 And he was like, oh, I just, and he grew up in kind of a cult-like church environment

00:29:51.200 where the pastor would hold it over everyone's head.

00:29:53.400 You couldn't move far away.

00:29:54.500 Couldn't own a home.

00:29:55.920 Look, God's given us permission for things.

00:29:58.760 And so if someone says, this school will not derail me spiritually, but it will affect

00:30:05.580 my future and help me get a better job, or it's got a better medical program, it's got

00:30:09.560 a better nursing program.

00:30:10.980 Think about your spiritual priorities first.

00:30:13.600 And do those.

00:30:14.380 And so there's a couple others, but that will help people, I think.

00:30:17.500 No, that was an incredible memory.

00:30:19.180 Because even, I mean, as someone who has also written a couple books, whenever an interviewer

00:30:24.440 asks me to list like five things I listed in the book, I always have a moment of panic.

00:30:29.520 I'm like, can I remember the things that I came up with?

00:30:31.860 So that was incredible.

00:30:33.260 I don't think you listed all seven, but we did get permission.

00:30:36.200 Was the second one prayer?

00:30:37.800 So what is our process?

00:30:40.040 Yes, process.

00:30:40.720 Let's pray.

00:30:41.440 What are our priorities?

00:30:42.560 Have we sought wise counsel with prudence?

00:30:44.640 Has God given us permission?

00:30:46.620 Have we considered the long-term perspective?

00:30:49.080 And I include that more than just eternal.

00:30:51.240 We want to be thinking about our marriages, our kids, our families, our homes, our future.

00:30:56.100 You know, just make decisions on a whim.

00:30:58.960 But also, I've told people before, maybe it is wise to take that job for two years.

00:31:04.940 Like I have a friend who became a, she was from our church, traveling nurse, and it was

00:31:09.740 a short-term thing, but it paid really well.

00:31:12.400 She was single, and she said, this will actually be helpful down the road.

00:31:17.120 You've had seasons where, think about this, moms choose to leave the workforce, sacrifice 1.00

00:31:23.320 that extra salary, or do things a certain way, to do what?

00:31:27.520 Consider the long-term perspective.

00:31:29.180 This is a short season.

00:31:30.280 I'll go back to work down the road.

00:31:31.940 We'll get the lake house with my salary later.

00:31:34.500 But for now, I'm staying home and we'll live on one income.

00:31:37.960 That's long-term.

00:31:39.160 And then finally, do we have peace?

00:31:41.340 And if you'll allow me to lay this out for folks, subjective and objective peace.

00:31:46.540 We don't just say, Allie Beth, I don't care what you say, I feel peace about this.

00:31:52.360 We're back to the manipulative, God told me type of thing.

00:31:55.740 It's okay to feel peace.

00:31:57.200 You should.

00:31:58.100 But there's an objective peace that comes when you walk through a biblical process and you've

00:32:03.380 got people in your life who are wise counselors.

00:32:06.080 Now you can say, if I get a cancer diagnosis in this place, if a child goes prodigal, if I go 0.84

00:32:15.680 through a tough time, if the market crashes, whatever, I don't need to second guess and

00:32:20.000 say, Well, if we would have chosen California, or if we wouldn't have stayed in California,

00:32:24.440 or if I would have chosen Texas, if you would have chose Florida, if we should have, could

00:32:28.580 have, would have ourselves into anxiety and we get crippled with fear and doubt.

00:32:33.080 Now the next time we go to make a decision, the devil's holding that over our head.

00:32:37.020 Well, maybe this wouldn't have happened if you wouldn't have this.

00:32:39.760 When you've been through a process, you can say, Whether like a Moses in Midian or Egypt,

00:32:44.720 whether like a Joshua staring at Jericho, whether like our Lord Jesus himself, enduring suffering

00:32:51.920 in the cross, you're never second guessing.

00:32:53.980 Like Paul, when you're sitting in prison with Silas in Philippi, and you're like, Hey,

00:32:57.860 and like, well, God's really up there going, Man, I didn't see that one coming.

00:33:02.320 Shouldn't have come here.

00:33:03.600 Paul's like, No, we're right in God's will.

00:33:05.040 Let's sing.

00:33:05.500 And they burst the doors off the prison and Lydia gets saved and the jailer gets in

00:33:09.320 the church at Philippi starts.

00:33:10.900 And now we have the book of Philippians.

00:33:12.240 You can know you're in God's will no matter what.

00:33:15.640 Why?

00:33:15.940 Because you've assessed your motives.

00:33:17.480 You've considered all the perspectives you should.

00:33:20.400 Now you have objective peace.

00:33:22.140 And then I'll speak to subjective as well.

00:33:24.320 In the book, I lay this out.

00:33:25.900 There are times where a husband is being a dominator and he's just saying, I'm just doing

00:33:30.920 this and we're going to do this and we're all, and this is what I, I'm the head of this

00:33:34.240 home.

00:33:34.740 And the wife doesn't have peace. 1.00

00:33:36.740 No one has peace.

00:33:37.500 And there's like a war going on.

00:33:40.220 I'm not saying that it's not the right decision.

00:33:42.340 If someone feels passionate and they're like, No, this is true.

00:33:44.960 It's logical.

00:33:45.640 And now you have a fight and there's conflict.

00:33:47.720 Maybe you're not going about it the right way.

00:33:49.600 And the Holy Spirit is causing some conflict so that you can visit those issues before moving

00:33:55.960 forward or vice versa.

00:33:57.400 There's a decision in which a wife says, Well, I want to do this. 1.00

00:34:03.120 And the husband says, I'm just not there.

00:34:05.960 And maybe she's got other motives. 0.82

00:34:08.380 Or perhaps a couple together is being super materialistic.

00:34:11.660 And all of a sudden, though, there's conflict in different places or one spouse is being

00:34:16.480 a little pushy.

00:34:17.200 If we don't have subjective peace in our relationships, the ones that matter, those wise counselors

00:34:24.740 are saying, Kosti or Mark or Allie Beth, you should slow down.

00:34:30.600 This seems a little impulsive.

00:34:32.100 Oh, you're just trying to hold me back.

00:34:34.820 No, maybe that person is sent from the Lord to slow you down for the right reasons.

00:34:39.820 And so I speak about the kind of peace that will flood your relationships.

00:34:42.960 And I share the story of us moving to Arizona.

00:34:45.520 My wife, yes, there was some trepidation of like, It's surreal.

00:34:51.240 It's Arizona.

00:34:52.300 Are you sure?

00:34:53.260 But in the end, we laughed our way down the freeway.

00:34:56.680 I was driving a giant U-Haul and she was in the family car and we were having a blast.

00:35:01.080 And I once in a while pull up next to her and give her a first down again. 0.97

00:35:04.200 And she's laughing.

00:35:04.900 The kids are having memories.

00:35:06.700 And now, no matter what, we know we're in God's will because we've been through a process

00:35:11.380 and we feel peace even when it's 115 degrees in the summer.

00:35:16.400 I'm going, we're in God's will.

00:35:18.560 So those are some processes people should walk through.

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00:36:36.740 Gosh, I remember when Timothy wanted to move from Georgia, and I did not.

00:36:48.020 And I had a timeline, like a specific timeline in my head.

00:36:51.900 I was—and my reasons weren't bad for wanting to stay in Georgia.

00:36:55.260 I was working, but I was leading this Bible study of girls, and I really wanted to see

00:37:00.500 them graduate college.

00:37:01.740 And to me, I was like, well, that's a really good reason.

00:37:04.800 Obviously, this is God indicating to me that we should stay.

00:37:08.740 But Timothy was convicted strongly that we needed to move, and he got a job elsewhere.

00:37:15.360 And while I didn't initially agree, and I didn't see his perspective, I totally understand what

00:37:21.260 you're talking about with Christine's reaction, because I did end up agreeing with him, and we

00:37:28.240 did have peace.

00:37:29.120 We did have peace.

00:37:30.180 It was like, that was really one of the first leadership tests of our marriage.

00:37:34.720 And because it was obviously not sin that he wanted to move us somewhere else, I was

00:37:39.180 like, okay, this isn't really exactly what I had in mind, but he feels strongly this is

00:37:44.580 where we're going.

00:37:45.540 I don't know if we had necessarily the specifically seven Ps in our process, but he was certainly

00:37:51.320 following that kind of like in principle.

00:37:53.380 And we did have peace, and obviously, God has worked that together for our good and

00:37:58.220 his glory, and I'm so thankful for that.

00:38:00.420 So it's so important for people to realize that peace doesn't necessarily mean, especially

00:38:05.100 you as a wife, that you are going to 100% at the onset agree with everything that your

00:38:11.500 husband is proposing, or whatever opportunity God is putting in front of you.

00:38:15.220 It might be a process of God working that out in your heart as a means of sanctification

00:38:20.080 or whatever.

00:38:21.240 Yeah.

00:38:21.420 You'll never be forcing in the sense that one person is being dominated or dragged,

00:38:28.300 but more so, I think God uses those processes to grow us closer to one another, to be sanctified,

00:38:34.600 to be humbled, to also build trust in a marriage or those relationships.

00:38:38.780 So everything, yeah, what you're talking about is awesome, because it's so helpful for people

00:38:44.040 to not just jump to conclusions.

00:38:46.300 Yeah.

00:38:46.580 And then presume motives, too, and accuse.

00:38:48.280 Sometimes we do that.

00:38:49.060 We ascribe motives in marriage, like, well, you're just trying to hold me back, or you're

00:38:52.720 just insecure, or you just want what...

00:38:55.620 It's like, no, hold on.

00:38:57.200 There's something bigger here.

00:38:58.380 And what's interesting is both of your desires, neither one was sin, and yours was spiritual,

00:39:03.420 and his could have been and could be spiritual.

00:39:05.340 As a man providing and a door opens up, and working that out, I think God strengthens our

00:39:12.380 relationships.

00:39:13.160 So my encouragement to folks is to have some sort of process in place.

00:39:17.680 And maybe they cherry-pick one of the Ps at any given moment or work through those things.

00:39:22.440 But our relationships are going to be stronger, healthier, and our confidence won't wane.

00:39:28.000 One story that comes to mind is when our kind of stand for truth coincided with a cancer

00:39:36.980 diagnosis.

00:39:37.540 Our son, Timothy, was diagnosed with a rare form of cancer.

00:39:40.320 And it's why I wrote the book, More Than a Healer, because I know people are out there

00:39:44.420 going like, well, Jesus is a healer, but He's so much more, and there's so many aspects to

00:39:48.640 what He does that minister to our hearts.

00:39:51.100 And there was a family member that said, are you sure?

00:39:54.860 Are you a thousand percent sure?

00:39:56.540 You're telling me that you have a son who gets diagnosed with a rare form of cancer at

00:40:02.920 three months old, and no part of you believes that's God judging Him and your home because

00:40:09.520 you touched the Lord's anointed.

00:40:10.920 You came against Uncle Benny.

00:40:12.060 Wow.

00:40:12.560 You spoke against this.

00:40:14.500 You're sure?

00:40:15.580 Like, absolutely sure?

00:40:17.340 Because that's like, man.

00:40:19.040 And it almost seems like God, instead of touching, because it was prophesied that God was going

00:40:24.300 to kill me and things were going to happen to me, and because of what I had done, and

00:40:29.400 one person suggested, even more than touching me, the Lord's chosen to strike my son, so 0.88

00:40:36.960 now I have to suffer by watching Him.

00:40:39.640 And I remember this calm came over me, because there can be like a righteous anger, and like

00:40:45.420 you've touched the kid now, and you're going after that, and it's so wrong, and it's spiritually

00:40:49.040 abusive, but this calm flooded over me, and I said, I am absolutely sure.

00:40:54.500 And they looked at me dumbfounded, like they couldn't believe it.

00:40:58.160 That peace came from the fact that I knew I was on the side of truth.

00:41:02.860 I knew I was siding with the true gospel. 0.92

00:41:06.080 I knew that my decisions were in line with Scripture, never been perfect, haven't done

00:41:10.300 it all right, probably came out a little hot and burned some bridges.

00:41:13.480 I blew the whole city apart when I did it and was like, we're going to get them all.

00:41:16.840 And I was like, maybe I should be a little more gracious and open up conversation.

00:41:21.460 But that's the way I came out hot.

00:41:22.840 I call it cage stage.

00:41:24.140 You've heard of it?

00:41:24.880 It's like, you should be caged for a little while, unless you just hurt people for the

00:41:28.440 first year or two of your conversion.

00:41:30.340 But I knew I had followed Scripture, and so I didn't have to second guess.

00:41:34.980 And I know there's people out there listening or watching who, you made that move.

00:41:39.760 You took that job.

00:41:41.320 You went to that school, and you walked through a biblical process, and then something bad 0.93

00:41:46.460 happened.

00:41:47.460 Maybe you got injured.

00:41:48.300 Maybe you've been wrestling with infertility.

00:41:50.420 Maybe the house didn't happen like you thought it would, and it foreclosed.

00:41:53.500 Or maybe you missed something, and you thought, man, if I wouldn't have done this, I wouldn't

00:41:57.820 have.

00:41:58.260 Let me tell you, if you go through a process, you don't have to be crippled by fear, paralysis

00:42:02.980 by analysis, shame, perfectionism.

00:42:06.720 Nope.

00:42:07.500 Now Romans 8, 28 applies.

00:42:09.720 God will cause all things to work together for the good of those who love Him and are

00:42:14.000 called according to His purpose.

00:42:15.360 He will work it out for His good.

00:42:17.640 You just take the next step of obedience.

00:42:20.160 And if you've done that, then even come a cancer diagnosis, you don't have to second

00:42:25.800 guess if you're in God's will.

00:42:27.700 Yeah.

00:42:28.260 You know, even those of us who are not in the prosperity gospel camp, it can be so easy

00:42:33.660 to look at bad things that happen and think, wow, is this the result of me making the wrong

00:42:39.120 decision and I didn't realize it?

00:42:41.080 I mean, prosperity gospel says the same thing.

00:42:43.260 If you sow the seed of faith, tithe, do this, whatever, then God will reward you for your

00:42:49.220 obedience.

00:42:49.860 He will punish you for your disobedience.

00:42:52.960 And I think all of us can kind of think that without realizing it that, wow, are these bad

00:42:59.920 circumstances a punishment for something that I didn't realize?

00:43:03.720 Or conversely, am I getting these blessings because I'm doing something right?

00:43:09.480 And I'm sure, like growing up in the ministry that you were raised, I'm sure that was a mentality

00:43:14.020 of, well, if we were really sinning, would God be blessing us with this Gulfstream?

00:43:18.480 Oh, totally.

00:43:18.880 Would we have this many people following us?

00:43:21.060 Of course God is on our side because He's given us all these things.

00:43:25.220 It's easy for us on a smaller scale to also kind of get stuck in that mentality.

00:43:29.940 Yeah.

00:43:30.220 I call it prosperity gospel light or the diet version is I don't believe like Joel Osteen

00:43:35.700 and I'm not following this crazy Benny Hinn guy and I ain't driving Bentleys and believing

00:43:42.040 that, but we have this mentality that if I obey God and do all the right things, then

00:43:47.280 God will give me this.

00:43:48.740 And it works in first world America because generally speaking, if you work hard and you're 0.94

00:43:55.360 a good person, dependable, hard work, life can get better fiscally every year and things

00:44:00.600 could go well for you.

00:44:01.600 And pretty soon you get in the pattern of like, well, I do all things the right way.

00:44:04.680 And so that's why God's blessing me.

00:44:06.900 And I think it's a slippery slope because pretty soon when trial does hit, and we know

00:44:11.580 it will, suffering and trials are a part of the Christian life.

00:44:14.860 When it does, we get disillusioned if we've attached our blessings to just our obedience,

00:44:20.480 then we tend to, by default, prosperity gospel light version, even though we say we're not

00:44:25.440 Osteen, we've attached our trials then to disobedience.

00:44:30.440 Now God must be mad and I must not be doing enough.

00:44:33.120 And that really cripples people.

00:44:35.020 There's a passage in the Psalms, Psalm 37, verse 4.

00:44:39.560 And I used to think that it meant if I delight myself in the Lord, He's going to give me whatever

00:44:44.480 I want.

00:44:45.400 The passage is delight yourself in the Lord and He will give you the desires of your heart.

00:44:49.760 So I used to say, I'm going to delight myself in the Lord and He's going to give me all my

00:44:53.720 blessings, give me whatever I want.

00:44:55.000 Years later, I'm reading that passage and it strikes me biblically, proper hermeneutics,

00:45:01.460 which is the process of interpretation.

00:45:04.280 I look at it and I saw it with new eyes and I thought, delight yourself in the Lord.

00:45:10.360 So you're delighting in the Lord and He will give you the desires of your heart, meaning

00:45:14.620 you are delighting yourself in the Lord and He will put in your heart the desires He wants

00:45:20.140 for you.

00:45:21.140 And so if you read it the way that it's properly written and conveyed biblically is, delight

00:45:26.240 yourselves in the Lord and He will place in you.

00:45:29.060 He'll give you the desires that are in your heart, meaning He put them there.

00:45:33.240 Too many people are delighting in other things.

00:45:35.880 But if you delight yourself in the Lord, your steps will be ordered.

00:45:39.480 And when you have the desire to take the step of faith in some area, when you have the desire

00:45:44.380 to reach out to that person, when you have the desire to take a sacrificial step in some

00:45:50.320 other way, whatever that looks like, and good desires, the desire for a job, the desire for

00:45:55.060 a certain career, the desire for a family, if you can't necessarily have your own children

00:46:01.780 biologically, the desire to adopt, the desire to minister to the poor, the desire to reach

00:46:06.700 out to the hurting person or start a Bible study for young women, if you're delighting in

00:46:10.520 the Lord, He will have put those desires in you.

00:46:14.280 And so the main question people should ask about God's will is, am I delighting in the

00:46:19.600 Lord?

00:46:19.900 Is Jesus my everything?

00:46:21.760 Do I have eyes for Him?

00:46:23.020 Am I focused on Him?

00:46:24.420 If you are, I'm convinced biblically everything else flows into the wake of that, like a boat

00:46:32.020 just pulls it in behind eyes on Jesus.

00:46:35.720 It really gets simple when you think about your sole purpose in life is to enjoy God.

00:46:43.460 And if you're enjoying God, you're obeying Him.

00:46:46.340 If you're obeying Him, you're glorifying Him.

00:46:48.860 That doesn't mean that everything is easy, but it does simplify it.

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00:47:53.060 I love what you said about objective versus subjective piece, and I've never heard it exactly like that,

00:48:03.780 but it reminds me, I remember I had a conversation with a friend, gosh, maybe in college or maybe

00:48:09.040 in high school, and we were talking about, you know, this relationship with this guy that

00:48:13.520 we both knew.

00:48:14.700 It just, it wasn't good.

00:48:15.760 And, you know, she was someone who professed to be a Christian, and, you know, maybe she

00:48:20.560 really was at the time, but I remember she told me, well, I just don't feel convicted about that.

00:48:25.860 So it's like, I don't feel convicted about that.

00:48:28.720 And we've probably all been there, just that callousness.

00:48:31.880 If I don't feel it in my heart, then this must not be bad.

00:48:38.140 And I was thinking about the verse in Philippians 4, the piece that God will give us, the piece

00:48:43.800 that surpasses understanding.

00:48:46.020 But I wonder if sometimes we misinterpret that to mean the piece that defies understanding.

00:48:51.960 That's a good word.

00:48:52.900 Like the piece that denies understanding and is denying the wisdom of the Lord.

00:48:57.620 And so if it's a piece apart from what the Word of God says, then it's not a piece that

00:49:02.040 comes from God.

00:49:02.540 It's actually like a callousness.

00:49:05.380 And there's a difference in peace and having Holy Spirit-filled assurance and not being able

00:49:11.420 to feel conviction altogether because your heart is just hard.

00:49:15.980 So there's a difference there.

00:49:17.760 The piece that surpasses understanding, it's going even beyond what we read in God's Word,

00:49:22.860 right?

00:49:23.140 It's not contradicting it.

00:49:24.660 No, and it's beyond your feelings.

00:49:27.080 So when you have a piece that surpasses all understanding, it would be as though you're

00:49:31.980 going through something, you and Timothy, and I come along and I'm going, you guys, how

00:49:36.260 are you so calm?

00:49:37.680 How are you so full of joy right now?

00:49:40.240 How are you so stable?

00:49:42.380 And you say, Kosti, our anxiousness was given over to the Lord.

00:49:48.120 Our hearts are full of gratitude.

00:49:50.260 We know we're in His will.

00:49:51.720 We're delighting in Him.

00:49:53.320 And we've just been overwhelmed with this sense of peace, even in the midst of all that's

00:49:56.820 going on.

00:49:57.520 And I'm going, but what about this?

00:50:00.020 What about that?

00:50:00.820 What about this?

00:50:01.460 What about this?

00:50:02.120 What about this?

00:50:02.620 And you say, we're leaving all those in the Lord's capable hands and trusting Him.

00:50:08.440 But what we're going to do is control what we can.

00:50:10.320 And that's our next step of obedience.

00:50:11.760 And so we're trusting Him.

00:50:12.600 We're in prayer.

00:50:13.460 And we're staying low and submitted before Him, knowing that He's the sovereign over

00:50:17.640 all sovereigns.

00:50:18.420 And so we trust Him.

00:50:19.520 Well, yeah, but Timothy, Ali, Beth, if you don't make moves, and if you don't this, and

00:50:23.700 if you don't...that's how so much of the world operates.

00:50:26.060 I've got to force it.

00:50:26.880 I've got to make it happen.

00:50:28.380 And people lose their minds because they're not rooted in the Lord Jesus Christ.

00:50:34.400 And so that passage in Philippians 4, where it starts in verse 6 and goes all the way

00:50:38.720 to verse 9, when it talks about what you dwell on.

00:50:41.620 Dwell on what is about whatever is right, true, noble, lovely, of good repute.

00:50:46.240 Why?

00:50:46.820 Because what you think about, what you dwell on will consume you.

00:50:50.880 And what you're consumed by will control you.

00:50:53.360 And that's where your destination is going to lead to.

00:50:55.860 And so I think you're spot on.

00:50:57.740 You don't say, well, I just don't feel convicted about that.

00:51:00.320 You may not feel convicted about something because you are not full of God's Word.

00:51:06.080 It's impossible to be convicted by something that you don't know.

00:51:10.520 And so it's important to find that elsewhere.

00:51:12.880 But it is to be a witness.

00:51:14.260 When we're confident about God's will, it's not to be cocky.

00:51:17.160 Say, yeah, we know what we're doing.

00:51:18.560 Look at us.

00:51:19.480 It's to say, hey, I'm confident and I have such peace in the will of God because I'm

00:51:24.700 rooted in His Word.

00:51:26.040 Did you know you could have that too?

00:51:27.780 And that was the goal of the book.

00:51:28.860 Demystify God's plan for your life and make decisions with confidence.

00:51:32.220 The reason I wrote it, there were two book ideas.

00:51:35.020 I walked into the office of my co-planter, Brett McIntosh, one of our pastors, and the

00:51:42.200 man who leads our prayer ministry.

00:51:44.080 His name is Tom at the church.

00:51:45.880 And I kind of bolted into the office.

00:51:47.660 I interrupted their meeting before I wrote the book.

00:51:50.180 I said, hey, I got two book ideas with Zondervan, this one and this one.

00:51:53.760 And they both immediately were like, the book on God's will, the book on God's will.

00:51:57.600 And I said, why?

00:51:59.280 And Tom said, literally every week, it's like clockwork.

00:52:02.220 People have questions about God's will.

00:52:03.780 They're nervous.

00:52:04.380 They're scared.

00:52:05.000 They wonder.

00:52:05.860 Our church could use this.

00:52:07.560 And Brett was like, literally, dude, all the people we counsel, so much that we deal

00:52:11.400 with is how do we make great decisions?

00:52:14.000 And how do I not second guess everything?

00:52:15.900 How do I have peace in the midst of good versus good, great versus great?

00:52:21.320 What seems to be not sin and what seems to be not sin?

00:52:24.640 What do I do?

00:52:26.980 And my pastoral heart is just going, what if there's a resource?

00:52:31.480 And what if there's just biblical guidance that could help people say, we feel biblical

00:52:36.680 peace?

00:52:37.140 And someone goes, I want that.

00:52:39.140 And we can point them to the Lord.

00:52:40.480 Yeah.

00:52:41.200 Gosh, I remember two things growing up that helped demystify God's will for me.

00:52:46.900 And this is just a reminder, when you're giving your kids a Christian education, all those

00:52:51.800 times you're sending them to Awanas and church camp, and maybe moms and dads are thinking,

00:52:55.620 is this really doing anything?

00:52:57.360 There are these crazy teenagers who don't want to talk, whatever it is.

00:53:01.880 I talk to lots of parents with kids in all different directions spiritually.

00:53:06.120 But just know, again, like we always say, those are seeds planted that will blossom in

00:53:11.220 eternity.

00:53:11.560 And I still remember little things told to me throughout my upbringing.

00:53:16.020 And I remember this time at church camp, whatever pastor they brought in, I don't even remember

00:53:21.260 his name, but I remember him telling me that it was wrong to open up your Bible and pray

00:53:28.800 that God would show you the answer just by like moving your finger around, which I guess

00:53:33.580 was something that we were all doing.

00:53:35.020 I'm sure that sounds like a very middle school thing to do.

00:53:37.520 But that was how we were trying to interpret God's will, that God is going to mysteriously

00:53:41.920 show me.

00:53:42.720 And I just remember him saying, the Bible is organized like it is for a reason.

00:53:47.000 Come on.

00:53:47.700 Right?

00:53:48.180 Read it like that.

00:53:49.480 And that actually took a huge burden off of me that I didn't have to be this, you know,

00:53:56.860 basically this sorcerer using this as like a magic eight ball or like a crystal ball.

00:54:01.260 And then the second thing, and I would be so curious to hear what you think about this

00:54:05.800 as we close out, because I'm not sure it's really the most theologically true thing.

00:54:09.680 However, I do think it again, relieved this burden of anxiety for me in making decisions.

00:54:14.480 Junior year Bible teacher, he said this, and he was kind of one to just say something to

00:54:19.280 shock you, but he said, God doesn't care what college you go to.

00:54:24.240 I know.

00:54:25.100 Interesting, right?

00:54:26.100 He said, as long as you, but he was kind of saying what you're saying.

00:54:30.120 Go through this process of making the decision, neither one is sin, both will be fine in light

00:54:36.320 of like the sovereignty of God.

00:54:37.800 I don't know if the initial statement was correct, but I understand what he was trying

00:54:42.040 to say.

00:54:42.800 Was he a professor?

00:54:43.940 He was, no, he was, this was junior year of high school.

00:54:46.660 Okay.

00:54:47.480 So no, but I think he was like in seminary.

00:54:50.340 He was an interesting guy.

00:54:51.160 He was a teacher?

00:54:51.720 Yes, he was a teacher.

00:54:52.660 This is a teacher.

00:54:53.240 So, but those two things kind of helped me also, like brought me to the understanding

00:55:00.880 of the sovereignty of God, but in less formal and sophisticated way, helped me kind of understand

00:55:08.000 that this is not something that I'm searching out through my own emotions and feelings, because

00:55:12.880 that is a really big burden for people to carry.

00:55:15.700 And the sovereignty of God, people see that as scary.

00:55:18.020 It's actually a huge relief for us, right?

00:55:19.820 It's a comfort.

00:55:20.360 It's a pillow.

00:55:21.160 You lay your head on at night and I go, oh, I can sleep because you are in control.

00:55:25.240 I'm so glad I'm not.

00:55:26.940 Okay.

00:55:27.340 Two, two things as we land the plane.

00:55:29.200 Yeah.

00:55:29.480 So we used to, I call it now the Bible thumb game. 0.98

00:55:33.100 And I've done this in the pulpit at our church, like church, this is not how you hear from

00:55:37.940 God.

00:55:39.100 Lord, what do you want me to hear from you today on?

00:55:41.440 Boom.

00:55:41.700 You open it up and it's like the curses of your forefathers.

00:55:45.500 You're like, yeah, not that.

00:55:46.500 Let's try again.

00:55:47.460 They open it up again.

00:55:48.400 And it's like, I will bless you and pour out it.

00:55:49.980 You're like, that's my, that's the word from the Lord for me today.

00:55:52.400 Oh, this is so Bible thumb game, not the way to do it. 0.96

00:55:57.240 But second, I would say our teacher friend was being provocative on purpose to get you

00:56:04.560 guys to think.

00:56:05.460 That's why I asked, is he a prof or a teacher in these seminary guys?

00:56:08.220 So typically when guys have a good handle on this and gals, the way they'll come at 0.75

00:56:12.820 the thing is go, did you know that God doesn't necessarily, I would qualify a bit, you know

00:56:18.060 that God's not as interested in which house you buy as interested in other things?

00:56:24.540 What are those?

00:56:25.440 Or did you know that God doesn't necessarily care which state you move to?

00:56:28.880 There's other things that are higher on his priority list, like say more.

00:56:32.640 Well, he cares about your heart.

00:56:36.140 He cares about your head, your mind, the mind of Christ.

00:56:39.140 He cares about the process.

00:56:40.520 He cares about your priorities.

00:56:42.040 He wants you, not necessarily what you're after.

00:56:46.060 He wants you.

00:56:46.760 And in that I would say my premise in the book is, and not in some legalistic false formula

00:56:53.480 or false promises, if you do these things, if you walk through this, and really by do

00:56:58.000 I mean get an understanding of the gospel, who Jesus is, what God's Word says, who you

00:57:03.640 are, and then what God's Word has for you by way of wisdom, then you can make whatever

00:57:09.700 decision is in front of you, and trust that you're walking in His will.

00:57:15.340 The final chapter, it's like an epilogue basically on the book, is encouragement for

00:57:22.400 the road ahead.

00:57:23.460 And I basically tell people, you're not going to get it right all the time.

00:57:27.020 It's not going to be perfect.

00:57:28.140 It's not always going to be pretty.

00:57:29.560 You're going to make mistakes.

00:57:30.800 But guess what?

00:57:31.800 If you walk through that road or you take the directions and it's a biblical direction,

00:57:37.680 then you're going to be able to even course correct by going back to God's Word.

00:57:42.540 So I would say, if people walk closely with the Word of God, then yeah, I believe strongly

00:57:49.320 that He will bless you in your going there, and He'll bless you in your going there.

00:57:54.080 He'll bless you in your staying.

00:57:55.680 He'll bless you in your changing if you follow a biblical process.

00:58:00.880 I genuinely believe you could have stayed and finished the girls' Bible study until they're

00:58:04.840 senior, and you could have moved here.

00:58:06.860 I believe that I could have moved different places.

00:58:10.280 I believe there are other options, and yet we chose to do something, and we see it now

00:58:14.780 and go, I can't imagine my life any other way.

00:58:17.700 God wants your heart most of all.

00:58:20.840 He wants your eyes on Him.

00:58:22.200 And in that, yeah, make your decision, and He'll work it out.

00:58:26.640 And I love what you said earlier, that God is not sitting out there saying, gosh, I didn't

00:58:31.380 see that coming.

00:58:32.200 Now the whole plan has unraveled.

00:58:34.260 You messed it up.

00:58:35.040 Yeah, I remember a friend telling me that I got a bad grade on a final in college, and

00:58:39.140 she said, do you really think this grade is going to be the thing that thwarts God's will

00:58:43.580 for your life?

00:58:44.500 Like, thanks.

00:58:45.580 Okay, I don't feel bad anymore.

00:58:47.200 Relatable would have never happened because you failed.

00:58:49.980 I know.

00:58:50.740 No, I didn't fail.

00:58:51.720 I'm sorry, I'm sorry.

00:58:52.540 It's just mediocre.

00:58:54.520 But, I mean, it's beautiful to think of that.

00:58:56.680 And this book really does, it's a perfect word, demystify God's will, because God is

00:59:02.500 not a God of confusion.

00:59:03.700 He's a God of peace, and He has so graciously revealed Himself to us, yes, through the Holy

00:59:08.220 Spirit, who's our helper, through Jesus Christ, Word made flesh, but also through the Word

00:59:13.180 of God.

00:59:13.740 And, gosh, He's gone through, He's gone to a lot of lengths to make sure that we can know

00:59:18.080 who He is and what to do.

00:59:18.860 It's clear and easy.

00:59:19.840 The question is, are we eager or are we lazy?

00:59:23.200 Yeah.

00:59:23.420 And are we passionate to pursue everything else that will tangibly give us what we want?

00:59:28.440 Or have we paused and said, God, what do you want?

00:59:31.920 Yeah.

00:59:32.200 And what have you laid out?

00:59:33.160 That's so good.

00:59:33.880 Okay, walking in God's will, demystify God's plan for your life, and make decisions with

00:59:38.500 confidence.

00:59:39.120 Kosti, thank you so much.

00:59:40.320 Allie Beth, thank you.

00:59:53.420 Kosti, thank you.

Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - March 17, 2025

Ep 1157 ｜ What’s God’s Will for Me？ Here’s How You Know ｜ Guest： Costi Hinn

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