Ep 179 ｜ Penny Nance
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Summary
Penny Nance is the President and CEO of Concerned Women for America, the nation's largest public policy women's organization. She talks about the Supreme Court, abortion, marriage, sexual exploitation, local control of education, and more.
Transcript
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Hey guys, welcome to Relatable Happy Friday. I hope you guys have had a wonderful week. Aren't
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you glad that it's Friday? If you've had a long week like I have, I am just, I'm just grateful.
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I'm grateful. I'm grateful that it's Friday. I'm excited for the weekend. I hope you guys are too.
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But before we get into the weekend, you have to listen to this conversation with Penny Nance. She
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is awesome. She is the head of Concerned Women for America. We're going to be talking about
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what's going on with the Supreme Court, all the legislative issues that matter to us as women and
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as Christian and as defenders of religious liberty. Okay, without further ado, here is Penny Nance.
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Penny, thank you so much for joining me. Oh, it's so fun to be on with you. I love what you do and
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I love your podcast and I really am excited to be here with you. Thank you so much. Well,
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we are so excited for you to be here and to glean wisdom from you. Will you tell everyone who may
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not know who you are and what you do? Great. I am the president and CEO of Concerned Women
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Women for America. My name is Penny Nance. I've been in this position almost 10 years now.
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Wow. We're the nation's largest public policy women's organization. We're unabashedly pro-life,
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pro-family. And, you know, think about the Women's March. We're the opposite.
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Yes. Tell everyone a little bit of what you guys do behind the scenes because some people may not know
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just what tremendous work and influence you guys do and have.
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Oh, thank you for that. You know, Concerned Women for America has been around for about 40 years. I
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mean, we're not the new kids on the block. We have really been at this work in public policy now
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for a very long time. We are a grassroots, legit grassroots, heels on the ground women's organization.
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We have members in all 50 states. We have 36 state directors. We have, but we have chapters in
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every state. And we have about half a million members around the country. We have seven core
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issues, the issue of life, the issue of marriage, the issue of sexual exploitation, national sovereignty,
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local control of education, religious freedom. And then our last issue that we added about four years
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ago is support for Israel. We're full portfolio conservatives. And it's really essential,
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Ali, you know this more than anyone, at this point in history to have women trained to speak into the
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hard issues of the day, to bring our perspective. Because if we don't speak for ourselves, other
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people define us and pretend to speak for us. And really, that was the beginning of CWA, back during
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the ERA, when Beverly LaHaye, our founder, was a pastor's wife in California, who got sick of
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hearing, you know, the feminist of the day, speaking on behalf of all women, demanding abortion on
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demand and other issues. And so she said, they don't speak for me. We're still there. We're still
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saying, AOC, you do not speak for me. You know, Elizabeth Warren, you do not speak for me.
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There's a wide group, a broad group of women around this country who still believe in traditional
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values, still believe in the sanctity of human life, and still love our families, believe in
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economic freedom, and again, support the nation of Israel and are more hawkish on foreign policy.
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Yes. And the media, most of the media would like to pretend that we don't exist, that certainly women
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don't have these kinds of values, maybe a few old white men, some of the media would say, but
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not women, not young women, not a wide variety of women. It just doesn't happen. Women are only
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third wave feminists. They only believe in abortion on demand and socialism and all of these radical
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things that are becoming more and more mainstream. What are some of the things that you guys do in the
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face of what I am sure is a lot of pushback from people, you know, in the women's march and even
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just in the mainstream of the Democratic Party? How do you guys fight on the front lines of these
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things? Yeah, right. And for instance, Sanja Smith, our state leader leader in Louisiana, finds it
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surprising when she's told that, you know, that only white people believe X. You know, she's an
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African-American leader. We have a very diverse group of women, both racially, economically,
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socioeconomically, in every way. But we are women of faith and we passionately believe in biblical
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values and we back up everything we say. And by our Christian worldview, we don't apologize for it.
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We are strong women with solid policy, solid theology, and absolutely no apology for what we believe.
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So explain to me, because I worked with you guys when it came to Kavanaugh and that all of that
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drama that happened a year ago, that was just absolute madness. And you guys rallied a ton of
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women in support of Kavanaugh and against the just onslaught of opposition and unfair opposition,
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really, that he was receiving. Can you kind of talk about the process of how you go about rallying
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support and bringing people together and kind of getting the word out about particular issues to
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women? Absolutely. And I think this is so great because it really sort of explains how we work,
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how we function. Again, we work, we support the president and strongly agree with his position on
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only appointing constitutionalist judges. In fact, for most of our history, we worked on confirmation
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of constitutionalist judges and been front and center on that. So Neil Gorsuch was no different.
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And then, of course, came Brett Kavanaugh. We were working in favor of him. We had a national
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bus tour that was going around the country to key states that were carried by President Trump,
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because, again, we need to be strategic about what we do. States that were carried by President
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Trump and the Senate seats were held by Democrats. So we knew we were going to need their votes for
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confirmation. So we were doing a Women for Kavanaugh bus tour around the country, building support for
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him, explaining, doing rallies, doing events. I mean, I can't even tell you how many state fairs I was at
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a couple of summers ago. Was it last summer? Last summer. And, you know, and Chick-fil-A parking lots
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and larger rallies. We were just really, like, places like Indiana and Missouri. You're welcome,
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Josh Hawley. And other, like, key states, we were, you know, getting the word out about him. In fact,
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we could watch while we're out on the road with our state leaders who are active in their state
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legislatures lobbying and also doing media, because that's the other thing, like I'm doing with you
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today. You sometimes can see me on Fox and other national news, but our state leaders are on local
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media. And so we're doing education more broadly. And then, of course, we come back and all the
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allegations hit. So we go through those with our own counsel. We look at them and we're like,
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there's nothing to this. But this man, we believe, is being unfairly and justly accused. And by the way,
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what is the standard going forward for any man or any woman that is accused, but there's no
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corroboration. There must be equal justice under law. So we went forward, actually, Allie, not knowing
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how our base would react, because we thought we knew that had the facts and we knew what was true.
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But that's leadership sometimes, right? You've got to move forward. And thankfully, people agreed and
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strongly rallied to his side. And our members were like, thank you. Somebody had to say it. And so we
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moved forward. We did rallies of women that you didn't see, hundreds of women, at least 500 women
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at one point in a rally outside the Senate. Women were inside lobbying. And we have all sorts of video
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of that, of us being screamed at and defamed by other women, by the way. Because we dare go win
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against the narrative that George Soros had spent $240 million on with the Women's March in order to
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allege. And so we were, as you know, history tells the truth, you know, tells the story. He was
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confirmed. And Women for Kavanaugh, you know, did great work. And I'm so proud of our members around
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the country who rallied to his side, who contacted their senators. And, you know, some of those senators
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paid the price for their positions. Right. You guys are having a tangible impact. So y'all are
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on the ground across America. Y'all are in the media, on social media, basically just representing
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conservative, biblical values, and also not just showing support for the people who might feel
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isolated, who also share those values, but persuading people who may be on the fence, or
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they don't know, or they disagree. And that is such important work in a time when it seems like people
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just yell at each other rather than talk to each other. It seems like Concerned Woman for America is
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actually trying to have a productive dialogue and make real differences, not just, you know,
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getting clicks by saying talking points, but saying, here are the facts, here's the argument,
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and you're not afraid to represent that. Tell me how you guys are doing that with what's going on
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with the Supreme Court right now. And sorry, I know this is a long question, but what is going on with
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the Supreme Court right now? First, maybe if you could tell that. I love everything you said there. I mean,
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I think the key point, as we explain who we are, is we are the voice for conservative women. We are
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the voice leaning into the issues of the day, the hard issues of the day, and speaking up. Another
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example, of course, Kavanaugh, you just talked about. The other issue is we just, and this isn't
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odd for us, we are often rallying in front of the Supreme Court on key issues for life and other
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issues. We were just there, I think it was, was it a week ago, two weeks ago, on the Harris case. And
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the question in that case has to do with the definition of sex. There's a whole movement within
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our country to redefine sex and civil rights, the Civil Rights Act of 1964, which defines sex as male and
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female. And that has served as the basis of law of all sorts of things. Privacy rights, issues of,
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you know, we're talking about sports, Title IX, women's sports teams. And so if we change, and there's
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a whole group of people who thinks we should, that sex should just mean whatever you feel. It should
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be redefined as gender. The social justice warriors, the woke left, strongly disagrees that
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biology matters. We've said, and we've said it, interestingly enough, by linking arms together
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with radical feminists, self-described radical feminists, Women's Liberation Front, who said,
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wait a minute, what's happening here? We work so hard to protect women's sports, to give them an
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opportunity for fair play. We believe that women that are incarcerated and women that are in
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domestic violence shelters should have their privacy protected. They shouldn't be forced to
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shower with men. These are real legal cases that are going on right now, both in sports,
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both in domestic violence shelters. There's two cases around the country right now, one in California,
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one in Alaska, Naomi's house. And it's so interesting that at this moment, the left has gone so far that
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people within their own coalition are saying, you have betrayed me. Women are saying, you have betrayed me.
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So together with Women's Liberation Front and Concerned Women for America, two groups who hardly agree on
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anything, rallied in front of the Supreme Court. We did media. And then when the case was over, when the
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attorneys got done arguing, they came for and spoke at our microphone and explained what happened. That case won't
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be decided until the summer, probably at the end of June. And we'll be out there. But it's really
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essential that our voices are heard in that case. We filed amicus briefs, again, arguing behalf of the
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uniqueness of women, the dignity of women that must be respected in law, because there's unintended
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consequences. It feels nice to say, yeah, just let everybody do what they want to do. But unfortunately,
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women in prison don't have a say on whether a man is put in the cell with them or not. And by the way,
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biologically, they're at an advantage if you're on a sports field. Selena Sowell in Connecticut,
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who's a young woman who's a track and field star, who's spent most of her high school career winning,
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suddenly two men are now competing in her state. And guess what? All the women lose. All the women lose
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because they have an unfair advantage that, by the way, Martina Navajalova has even addressed
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and said is cheating. So it's really interesting at this point in history, where we're seeing how far
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the other side has gone, that even people that don't necessarily agree with us are coming together
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to say, we have got to get some sanity here. Right. Because it is resulting in not just the
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diminishment of what it means to be a woman, because no longer we can even define, we can't even define
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what a woman is according to leftist standards. We can't define what a woman is. It's not just their
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diminishment and their disappearance, but it's also the exploitation of women. It's the possible abuse
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of women. When you talk about women in prison cells and when you talk about women in shelters who
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need protection from certain men in that case, we're talking about the degradation, not just the
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diminishment of women. And I'm just confused, I guess. I guess I just don't understand any feminist
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who does stand on the side of this. Why are they okay with obscuring women altogether? Why are they okay
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with the exploitation of women? Do you have any kind of understanding? I have no answer for that,
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Allie. But this is what I know to be true. I'm older than you. And I know that it took a long time.
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Women before me worked really hard to teach women in my generation that that gut instinct that you have,
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that you're in danger, that you feel fearful, that you don't have to be nice. If a man makes you feel
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uncomfortable, it's okay to push back and say, stay away from me, cross the street, leave an elevator,
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do whatever, say something in a parking lot. Yeah, whatever. It doesn't matter if it hurts
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someone's feelings. Now we've gone the other way, where we've said, you have no right. If a man walks
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into your dressing room, your locker room, your restroom, you're a bigot if you have a problem
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with it. I'm sorry, that makes me angry. As a woman who has lived through an assault, a physical
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assault, an attempted rape. I've testified before Congress on the issue. We fought hard on the
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Debbie Smith Act in order to clear up the DNA backlog. It makes me angry that people, because
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of their re-education of society, because they want things a certain way, are willing to put women and
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children at risk. It's not right. And we're not going to back down. And we're going to speak into it
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immediately and loudly. And I think what people don't understand, but I know that you understand
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and Concerned Women for America understand, is that really it's all, all of this is connected
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with this increase in godlessness as well that we see in society. Because you and I know that the
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creator of the universe made them male and female, and that's really obvious whether or not you believe
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in the Bible, just biologically speaking. But because we know human beings are made in the image of God,
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because we know that he purposed their bodies for a certain function, we can recognize that this is
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going to end in chaos and confusion. That no, our bodies are not arbitrary. It's not that your sex
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has no indication of your gender. That we were actually made a particular way for particular functions.
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And when we veer outside of that, there is chaos, there is injustice, there is abuse, there is
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exploitation always when we go outside of God's standards. And so that's why I always emphasize
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on this podcast, Christians, the time is coming on for you guys not to care about politics. The time
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is coming on where you can sit back and just assume that your government leaders are going to base their
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decisions on the Bible. That's not happening anymore. Well, and there's real consequences if you don't
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speak up, by the way, you know, the Christian groups, and we're, we're fighting this on college
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campuses around the country. So we're saying to university students, if your teacher is forcing
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you to identify your pronoun, and this is happening, by the way, in order to test. If you are being
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coerced, and it is happening, and I've written about it in The Federalist, I would urge your viewers and
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listeners to read my piece in The Federalist on this. Definitely. It is essential that we speak up,
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because that has to do with Gnosticism and, and sexual nihilism. That's the philosophy underneath
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that. And you can't just go along with it as a Christian, because it is in direct conflict of
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Christian principles and what the Bible says. That doesn't mean you have to be mean. We should
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always be kind, but we can speak truth, and we certainly need to speak truth to power, which is
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the school administrations. And so that's what we're trying to do. Equip our, our, our members and
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people who are interested in to, to have good statistics, science information, talking with us
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in order to share something in a way that brings other people to our side. Clearly, and you know
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this, of course, Allie, that there are people who struggle. There are people who struggle with
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dysphoria, and we love them. We love them no matter what. Jesus died for them just like he died for me.
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Right. We all have struggles in life, and we recognize that, and we welcome them to anything we do
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in our churches, in our homes, whatever that is. But we're talking about the policy of the U.S.
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We're talking about what we're teaching our kids in college, but also what we're teaching them in
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elementary school and younger. So this is really important, because we cannot just ignore things
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that are in direct conflict with biblical principles that is not even true science.
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Right. It's really shocking when the math and science schools like Virginia Tech bow to pressure
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from the woke left and start to indoctrinate students with speech codes. We can't just ignore
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that. Or yet we have 40 young women for America chapters around the country. They're taking this
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head on because they must. They must protect themselves, and they must tell the truth to people.
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It's not kind to allow a lie to continue and to fester. I sometimes feel like we are, you know,
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in that story of the emperor has no clothes. Sometimes we're the little boy on the side of
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the parade saying, he's naked. The emperor is naked. He has no clothes on, and we refuse to pretend
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otherwise. Right. And we see that not saying something has consequences, like you said. But for the next
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generation, there's this tragic case out of Texas that I know you've heard of, of the seven-year-old
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boy caught in a custody battle between the mom who insists that this boy, who identifies as a boy,
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as far as we know from the psychologist and the dad and friends, this mom wants the boy to be a girl,
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to dress up like a girl, to go by the name of Luna. When this little boy is with his dad, he says,
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I'm, you know, I'm a boy. My name is James, and I dress like a boy and all of this stuff. And so
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unfortunately, it looks like the court is ruling in the mother's favor in this case for no other
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reason that I can see than political correctness and fearing the mob of the left who says, yes,
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as young as six and seven years old, we have to start this social transition that ends in hormone
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blockers and chemical castration because this kind of new social standard of gender bending is now what
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we all have to accept and celebrate. And anyone who stands in the way of that is wrong and is a bigot
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it must be stopped. And we if we care about our children, go ahead, they're so punitive about it,
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right? You can't just have a disagreement. Somehow that makes you evil. If you disagree.
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We would all do better if we can just take a minute and take a breath and recognize
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the statistics show that over 80% of kids that struggle when their kids grow out of it.
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Yeah, 75 to 95%. We're rendering these kids infertile. We're inhibiting their ability to
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develop. We're changing their vocal cords. And God help you, if you're a young woman,
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you have top surgery, you change your mind. Because now we have people that are already
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detransitioning. This has been around a while. And so, you know, the courts have got to start taking
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that into account. We, we, there was a case in Ohio where parents lost custody of their kid over
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this. Right. And so, because the state said, no, she, you know, she wants to detransition. She wants
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to transition and she must. And they said, no, we're her parents. We think that's not the right
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thing. We think she'll grow out of it. And so, um, this is complicated. It's not going away.
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Um, but Christians don't do people, don't do anyone, don't do our society, don't do future
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generations any favors by just closing their eyes, looking away and refusing to weigh into the hard
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story, the hard facts and the hard, um, issues of our day, whether it's abortion or other, other
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issues. Amen. Can you talk to us just a little bit about, um, the Equality Act? I've talked about
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this a little bit on my podcast, but I get questions about this all the time. And I get a lot of pushback
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actually from people saying, no, it's totally fine. You can be on the left side of the political aisle.
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You can be a mainstream Democrat and believe in the Bible and be a Christian, but that's
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getting increasingly impossible, especially when you look at legislation like the Equality
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Act. What are some of the effects that that piece of legislation could possibly have?
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It's exactly the same of what I just, just talked about with a court case. It's basically
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statutorily trying to do what they're, what the less trying to get to in the Harris case. And that is
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to, to redefine sex, to not mean male and female, but to mean anything. And so then of course it has
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implications for the safety, privacy and opportunity. I mean, the few little set asides
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that women have in, in business no longer will just be for women. So, you know, again, that's why
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like, you know, you have people that on the left and the right are like, wait a minute, it sounds
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really good, but in practice there's consequences and the people that lose are women. And so, you
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know, I understand that people, and I think that what people feel, you know, the most compassionate
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about, and they should, are employment cases. And let me just say, I'm not in favor of firing
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someone because of their sexual orientation or because of how they present or whatever, but
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you do have to recognize that there's real life consequences to changing the, you know,
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changing the law and redefining sex. And so it's really important that we, we take into
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account everything that's going to happen, every, all the fallout from it. And you don't
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get anywhere by, um, by penalizing women and denying the uniqueness of us, both, um, you know,
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biologically, physiologically, and reproductively.
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Yes. Especially for, I mean, the implications for religious organizations, for private schools,
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for churches, for adoption centers are huge, are huge. And I think we saw this probably,
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this is a little bit of a, of a different subject talking about the redefinition of marriage is not
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just between a man and a woman, but, um, anyone of any gender or sex. Obergefell really has precipitated
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a lot of this, a lot of this change. The sexual revolution has gone really fast. And we saw when,
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uh, Obergefell said that marriage is a human right, no matter your sexual orientation,
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we saw that there was going to be conflict between that belief, which you are free to believe in this
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country and religious liberty, that there was going to be tension. And we are seeing that come to blows
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right now. Right. So the Barinella Stetsman case that's getting ready to go before the Supreme Court
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is, um, is the woman who, I believe it owns Arlene Flowers. I think I'm getting that,
00:24:57.100
that all correct. Um, and she was a florist. She had a long time, uh, client that she loved.
00:25:03.780
And she, he said, and she had, she had done flowers for him and during the courtship with,
00:25:08.800
with his now husband. And he, she, you know, she continued to give him flowers and then it came to
00:25:13.020
their wedding and he wanted her to do their wedding because she'd been part of the courtship.
00:25:16.380
And she said, you know what? I love you. And when this is all over, I hope you'll come back to me,
00:25:20.800
but I can't be part of your wedding because of my Christian beliefs. But here's three other,
00:25:24.540
other florists who would love to do it. And, um, I think it was actually the spouse that was the
00:25:30.040
most upset about it and put a post out. And the next thing you know, of course, the ACLU has their
00:25:35.080
case and, um, and now she's in court and she, the woman has been harassed nonstop. And she just simply
00:25:42.300
wanted to live out her belief and not allow, um, the government to compel her speech, compel her art.
00:25:50.200
And, and by the way, it is art, what she does. And we saw that similar case with the cake baker.
00:25:56.380
He said, look at this. And by the way, um, the, the Colorado case of the cake baker,
00:26:02.980
the owner of a masterpiece case, no one thinks that he doesn't mean it. Like this is a guy
00:26:08.560
who refuses to make Halloween cakes or bachelor party cakes. Like he's very clear. He can say,
00:26:14.880
he paints with a brush on his case. Um, he hosts, um, meetings for AA and his bakery and uses his
00:26:23.080
bakery for all sorts of black Christian ministry, cares for the homeless. Like this is a guy who's
00:26:28.040
very sincere and yet he's been harassed and is still being harassed by the Colorado Civil Rights
00:26:34.420
Commission. So it, it, one, by the way, I can't, I, I know this may have been Scalia that predicted
00:26:42.300
in a virgin fail that there would be consequences for believers. Now we're trying to work out what
00:26:46.940
does that mean? Is there space for people who are about believing, believing Christians in, in,
00:26:53.200
in living out their faith in their workplace? We say, yes, there is. And there must be the first
00:26:58.560
amendment guarantees it. Uh, according to Beto O'Rourke and really in one sense or the other,
00:27:05.220
I would say most, if not all of the democratic candidates, no, there's really not a place they
00:27:11.840
believe. Of course we know there is, but they believe that there's not a place for Christians
00:27:16.500
who actually believe the Bible actually live out their faith in modern society. Sure. You can be
00:27:23.260
a functioning agnostic and kind of believe in the Bible, but reject most of its premises and just
00:27:29.440
say, oh, you know, we can just tolerate everyone. Um, but you can't be, you cannot be a Christian who,
00:27:36.100
who follows, who follows biblical principles according to the left. You need to be silenced
00:27:41.260
and demonized and your organization needs to have your taxes exempt status taken away.
00:27:46.420
Oh, they would love that. Yeah. That's not going to happen though. Are there, are, are there any,
00:27:50.820
first off, Beto, like, are y'all going to come back to Texas when this is all over? Cause I really,
00:27:56.420
I think he's disgraced himself. I don't know. It's kind of confusing. Right. Um, but you're right.
00:28:01.340
I mean the, the whole, you know, the, it's amazing. I don't recognize Joe Biden anymore. He was a
00:28:07.300
different guy when he was a Senator and he has gone farther and farther to left. They no longer
00:28:11.860
supports the Hyde amendment and he's changes his position on so many things. I don't even recognize
00:28:17.140
him anymore. Um, but you, but it's right there, there's, there's a group and, and actually I don't
00:28:23.160
think they're mainstream. I think that the majority of people, whether you're a Democrat or Republican
00:28:28.200
recognize that people with sincere, sincerely held beliefs, um, need to be respected and there needs
00:28:36.180
to be a way to live that out and whatever, you know, whatever venue you're in, you don't check your
00:28:41.920
faith at the door when you walk into the schoolhouse. So when you walk into your businesses,
00:28:45.680
the Hobby Lobby case proved, or whether you're the little sisters of the poor, you need to be
00:28:50.640
able to live out your faith, whether it's through your, the way you spend your money, I would say
00:28:55.920
through your tax dollars, whether it's through, um, how your art is, uh, is, is spent and done or
00:29:03.640
whatever you do. Um, and the funny thing I think is though, Allie, and, and I'd be just in
00:29:09.540
what you say about this. I feel like they like it on some levels. Like they want us to mean
00:29:14.640
it when we read the Bible on some levels, but they, but not, not the parts that they disagree
00:29:19.820
with. So they love it that Christians think we should care for the poor, that we should, um, you
00:29:24.840
know, build hospitals, that we should care for orphans, that we should, you know, do all the things
00:29:29.820
that prison ministry, even, even prison ministry. I work for prison fellowship ministries and they
00:29:35.360
didn't really even mind us like sharing the gospel in prison because it's people that were
00:29:39.520
icky and they didn't care about them. Um, but, but when it comes down to when you kind of get up
00:29:45.140
against, again, sort of the leftist ideology, they just want us to be quiet. And then you have people
00:29:51.260
who are among us who are even our ilk that say, yeah, I think we should just be quiet. We can't say
00:29:56.400
anything. Right. I think that they're okay with Christians caring for the poor as long as the means
00:30:02.840
by which Christians care for the poor is voting for bigger government and higher taxes on the rich.
00:30:09.120
That's the kind of quote generosity, which is not generosity at all because it's coerced. That's the
00:30:14.700
kind of so-called Christianity that they think is correct. Communism in a lot of senses is what many
00:30:22.320
people, not all, but many people on the left view as, um, as Christian is really taking the wealth from
00:30:28.780
the top and giving it to the bottom. They don't really believe for the most part that individuals
00:30:33.940
are responsible for charity and taking care of other people that kind of diminishes their whole
00:30:39.300
totalitarian worldview. I've got one more question for you. Can you tell everyone who may not be aware
00:30:45.720
what the Trump administration has done in the way of, uh, religious liberty that, uh, Christians
00:30:52.780
should care about? So much, so much for one thing, and this is no small thing, they have liberated and
00:31:01.360
worked on behalf of Christians that are prison imprisoned around the world. Mike Pompeo and the
00:31:06.440
president have worked, whether it's, uh, um, pastor Brunson in Turkey, or whether it's Asia Bibi in
00:31:13.000
Pakistan, or, uh, we, there's a pastor now in China, pastor cow, who's being imprisoned, uh, Christians in
00:31:20.380
North Korea. They have been relentless in advocating for them, but also for our first amendment rights,
00:31:26.680
um, through executive order on campuses through, uh, they, they have entered into court cases on our
00:31:33.220
behalf. And unlike the Obama administration who did the opposite, whether, you know, the cake,
00:31:39.280
the masterpiece cake of it. So they have been very clear on the position of the, of our, uh, of the
00:31:45.880
Trump administration really taken the position that we've just talked about. That is our first
00:31:51.640
amendment rights to practice our faith, no matter where we are in this country, we must do it with
00:31:56.780
kindness. We must do it with charity, but also we still have values that we must protect and we must
00:32:02.840
have the ability to live that out in our day-to-day life. And they, the Trump administration has been
00:32:08.320
a champion. Um, did I mention the Duke, the, the Duke case, um, that Duke university just kicked young
00:32:16.000
life off their campus, right? Because of their position on marriage. Um, we're going to see more
00:32:22.040
and more of that, right? And there's going to be more and more of these cases. Again, Christians need
00:32:27.360
to understand, read up. If you don't understand, um, come to our website, read things that you've
00:32:34.100
written and, and others, uh, Ali, and just really understand and be able to lean in and advocate
00:32:40.820
strongly for our position. We're on, we are on the right side and we must speak up for ourselves.
00:32:47.460
Nobody else is going to do it. Then by the way, whether you're a Christian or whether you're a
00:32:51.160
Buddhist, whether you're Muslim, whether you're Uyghur, religious freedom is a first freedom in the
00:32:57.120
United States. And we have to stand firmly in favor of it. Yes. Can you tell everyone where they can
00:33:02.860
find you and Concerned Women for America? Um, ConcernedWomen.org. You can also follow us on
00:33:09.100
Twitter and Facebook and Instagram. And, you know, we just are so appreciative of what you're
00:33:14.180
doing. Thank you so much for having us, Ali. And I just, again, I love your podcast. You do a great
00:33:19.040
job. Thank you. And thank you for everything that you do. It makes a huge impact and I'm,
00:33:24.380
I'm very grateful for it. Thanks for joining me.