Ep 186 ｜ Sex Change Regret： Walt Heyer
Episode Stats
Words per Minute
173.58635
Summary
Walt Heyer used to be transgender, then he transitioned, and then he de-transitioned. He helps people who regret their transition, mostly but also people who are struggling with body dysmorphia and the different things associated with transgenderism.
Transcript
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Hey guys, welcome to the podcast. I hope everyone has had a wonderful week. Happy Friday. Today
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I'm talking to Walt Heyer. You might've heard of him. He used to be transgender, then he
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transitioned and then he de-transitioned and he helps people who regret their transition
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mostly, but also people who are struggling with body dysmorphia and the different things
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associated with transgenderism. So I am going to talk to him today. Amazing conversation,
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amazing person. I'm so excited for you to listen to it. Without further ado, here he is.
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Mr. Heyer, thank you so much for joining me. Sure. Can you tell everyone who might not know,
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although I think a lot of people, especially recently have become familiar with your story,
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can you just tell an overview of who you are and now what you do? Yeah. Well, I started out as a
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four-year-old, what we would call trans kid and went through that whole thing and they didn't have
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any terms like gender dysphoria and all that stuff in those days or just confuse kids. Yeah. And so,
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but by the time I was 42, reached out for help, actually 38, reached out for help and the gender
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clinic or gender guy that I went to said, well, you need hormone therapy and gender reassignment
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surgery. And there's nobody else around saying anything different. You couldn't find anybody.
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They just sort of scratched their head and say, oh, okay, well, maybe that's it. You know,
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this was 1981. So it was quite a long time ago. Right. So, so after two years of being on hormone
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therapy, divorcing my wife and leaving my kids and job and all that, I underwent gender reassignment
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surgery in April, 1983. And, um, then I spent my life working for the federal government at that
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time, FDIC and the postal service and lived in San Francisco and, um, went to UC Santa Cruz and studied
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psychology. And I began to realize from looking at the psychology books that people identify as a
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transgender, even many years ago, uh, they found that they had, uh, mental disorders of some type.
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Um, and, uh, some of them were sexual, some of them were social, some of them were psychological
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and some were emotional. Um, and some of them resulted from abuse or neglect or broken homes or
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all kinds of different things. There's not any one thing that you can put your thumb on and say,
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you know, if this happens, you're going to be a transgender. It's not like that. It's just that,
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um, the people who end up identifying as transgender, you really don't like who they are.
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They don't feel comfortable in their body. And then, um, and I'm one of those people. My was
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cross-dressed and as a result of being cross-dressed, I was sexually abused, emotionally abused and
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physically abused. So you wouldn't like yourself when I was young, you know? And so, um, people who have
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those things happen to themselves don't particularly like being the person who's being abused. So you
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want to be somebody different. The only problem is now that I've worked with hundreds, probably
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more than hundreds, but worked with hundreds of people. I realized that if we really gave some time,
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uh, to these people who are really struggling, um, that we could probably uncover what's going on
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and help them understand why they feel the way they feel and actually spend some time with them
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and avoid, uh, unnecessary hormone therapy and surgery. So, um, that's what I do. Mostly,
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uh, I get people who've already been through it and, uh, wish they had not done it and want help to
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detransition. I've got one right now that I'm working on. Who's just a year after he's 19,
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had surgery at 18 and he regrets it and he said it never should have happened. They started him on
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hormones when he was 15 and, uh, his life is ruined. His body's ruined. They've completely
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reconstructed his body. And so, and then I've got a 21 year old girl who's same, same thing. She
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transitioned at 18 and she regretted it at 20. And so I'm getting a lot more young people, uh, who've
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been, um, who've thought they were transgender guided to think so. Um, because there's really
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nobody out there saying, uh, maybe you should kind of reconsider that and think that it may be
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something else that we really can't have that many people who are, who really need to have their body
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remade and readjusted and all that. So there's gotta be something behind it. So I help, uh, people every
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day. And, um, and I try to raise awareness on it with the publications that I write in the six books
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about to be seven books. Um, and so that's what I do. I, I help people and I do it for free.
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They contact me and I work with them as best I can. And I work with people all over the world.
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Right. And when you were a child, it was your grandmother, correct?
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Yeah. Who cross-dressed you. Uh, at what point when you were that little, obviously you probably
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didn't really know what was going on or you didn't have the words to articulate what was going on.
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When did you start feeling confused about your gender? When did you realize, okay,
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some, something's not right. I'm not really comfortable.
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Probably, uh, you know, after a few months or a year, you start to wonder,
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you know, um, was I born wrong? What's, why does grandma only like me when I'm dressed up?
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Um, and I think people become addicted to the affirmation, you know, who doesn't like to be
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affirmed? Right. Especially children. Oh, absolutely. And, you know, children are, are, um,
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delightfully narcissistic. You know, they like to be the center of attention. They're wonderful that way.
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That's not a, that's not a harp on them as they need that attention, but they need good attention.
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They need positive attention and not, uh, somebody telling them that there's something wrong with you
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and you need to change gender. So I think that's the, the, the real point to this is that when we
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tell somebody that they can change genders or that they could be a different gender, what we're also
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saying at the very same time is without realizing it, we're telling them there's something wrong with
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you. Right. And, and I think that's where, um, I become quite disturbed about people telling their
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children or something wrong with you. You, you know, Johnny can become Judy and, you know, it's
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really kind of insane. Um, and you know, I just want to slap the parent's face. It's like, uh, stop it.
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Yeah. Do you, do you have any, any idea why your grandmother had, had that idea to cross dress you?
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I, I, well, she was, she made dresses. That was her job, her business. And so she just made me a
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purple chiffon dress. I mean, that's what she did for a living. She had her sewing machines in the
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house and she had women coming over and she'd measure them and make dresses for them. And she just
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decided to make me one. So I think we got to really, um, in, in a climate, even in the 1940s,
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where it wasn't so power driven by gender issues, um, the influence on a young child of putting them
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in a dress is really child abuse. And I think any parent who, um, puts their kid in opposite gender
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clothes and affirms them, tell them how cute they look. Oh yeah, you can do it. I personally think
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it's child abuse because the consequences, uh, of doing that causes them to move on to maybe
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hormone blockers, surgery and other things. And what we know is today that, uh, people who actually
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transition are 18 times more likely to commit suicide than, uh, the general population. We really
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need to spend a lot more time, uh, talking to, uh, these young individuals, um, and older ones is for
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that matter, uh, which I spend time doing their forties, fifties, sixties, and even seventies who think
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they've been troubled by this. But the, the, what we're really dealing with today, I'm afraid to say
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is, um, Allie is that there's, um, it's a social contagion. What we've developed is this whole,
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whole community of people who want to join the transgender movement and they don't have gender
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dysphoria. They're really not transgender, but they can get access to hormone therapy.
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And that's what's happening to the young people who are, um, sort of crashing and burning after they
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go through these, um, you know, surgical and hormonal operations. They're out of school,
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they're off on their own. And then they look in the mirror and they go, man, what have I done to my
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life? And, and my community of support, which was at school or maybe college is gone. And now they're
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left with the consequences of being a guided, affirmed, supported, and given all this direction
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to change genders. And they go, that was a mistake. And, uh, so I think I'm seeing a lot more people,
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uh, de-transitioning or wish, wishing they hadn't done it. And some of them are just staying,
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you know, without de-transition. You're just saying, man, it was a mistake and I don't know
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how to go back. I don't feel like I can go back. You know, my body's, uh, been torn apart and
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psychologically and emotionally, um, that is far worse than if they never had anything done.
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Why do you think it is? Because I think you're right there. There is, uh, actually a study out
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of Brown university that talked about rapid onset gender dysphoria and talked about the possibility
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of there being a social element to it, especially in teenagers that usually it starts with someone
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who feels misunderstood in general. A lot of times these people are on the autism spectrum.
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They find some kind of community online on places like Tumblr. And it's all, it's almost like it
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becomes a trend or it becomes a new identity for them in which they feel understood in being
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misunderstood. If that makes sense. Why is it that this is scandalous to bring up? Why is it scandalous
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to talk about? Why don't doctors say, Hey, we need to be a little bit patient with this while,
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especially while this person is young and look at the different factors that could be leading,
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leading to it. Why are we so quick to say, okay, hormone blockers and surgery?
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Yeah. Well, there's a real powerful group of people who are, uh, guiding this in the schools.
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And if you'll notice in our schools, there's no opposition to giving kids books and trying to help
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them transition. Um, so the same things happening today really has happened to me. I couldn't find any
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opposition to, uh, what I was doing when I went in 1981 to a psychologist and they've sort of held
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their ground on not allowing anybody to come in and have a different voice. And frankly, that's why
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they dislike me so much. Um, which I don't particularly care. Um, they, that's kind of
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wonderful. Actually. I feel like if they dislike me, I must be doing something right. Yes, definitely.
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So, um, so the rapid onset thing I look at a little differently. It's just, it's just a social
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contagion. Uh, kids want to join groups. I mean, you can go back and look at the goth period and,
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you know, kids were running around with all black and they lived in kids like to join groups. I mean,
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this is how they, I did, you know, when I was in school, you know, kids wore leather jackets and,
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and we all look the same, you know, isn't that, I always say this so interesting, everybody's trying
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to be different and they trying to be different. They all end up looking the same. Right. Right.
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And I'm hoping that the pendulum will swing that direction to where something like being transgender
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is no longer, no longer gives you the same political and social capital as it does today.
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It's no longer quite as unique or, uh, or attaches you to this kind of marginalized group. So it doesn't
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give you the same kind of benefits. I'm hoping that as that happens, it will be less attractive
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for people, especially people who don't have gender dysphoria at all, and are just looking
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for a social group to, to be a part of. That's my hope. Um, I'm wondering for you and your life,
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you, so you were cross-dressed as, um, as a child and then you lived though, as a man dressed like a
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man until you were 38 to 42. Well, I cross-dressed from the time that grandma put me in that dress
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publicly. Yes. Sometimes. Yeah. And did your parents have anything to say about that? Um,
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they didn't like it and you know, but that was about all they could say. I didn't, they don't
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like it. And you got, but you got married and you had kids. Yeah. And I still was cross-dressing.
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And when did you realize, okay, I'm just too uncomfortable in my body or you felt like that?
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What made you seek out help? I think there's this, when you're sexually abused as a young child
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and you've been cross-dressed for a period of time and you're confused about who you are, there's,
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there's a situation which I've run into with the vast majority of the people that I work with who've
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been sexually abused. And while this may be uncomfortable to say, it's just a fact, uh, that
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happens. Kids who are sexually abused at a young age, uh, all the way up into their early teens,
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when they're abused, whether it's a boy being abused by a man, his defense mechanism
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is to remove his genitalia so that he won't be sexually abused again. So it's not so much that
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they want to change genders. It's just that they want to remove what's being, what's being
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attracted to them as abuse situation. Girls, on the other hand, who are sexually abused,
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want to look like a man or dress like a man as a way to be, uh, show defense against anybody
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thinking that they're beautiful or attractive, uh, so that they won't be sexually abused. So
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in many of these cases, I would say nearly 50% of them, this is actually not that they want to
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become a different gender. It's more of a way to have a defense mechanism against being sexually
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abused again by a predator who thinks it's fun for them to use you as a sex toy.
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And why aren't other, why aren't other people in your field picking up on this and saying this? I
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mean, it's some, for some people, it's literally a matter of life and death. Uh, we know that this
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is what's happening, that you can transition and still not feel comfortable in your body. Suicide
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rates stay about the same after you transition as when, as before. So why, what, what's, I mean,
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I know you said that there are powerful people that are pushing this in schools, but it seems to me
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like there would be more doctors at least saying, hang on, this is a little bit too crazy. This is
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not healthy. Children are, uh, permanently maimed because of this. Let's at least take a step back
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and have a conversation about whether or not we are pursuing the best solutions. But it seems like
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you are the voice crying out in the wilderness and everyone, even this video will get censored.
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People will talk about this interview as being hateful towards the trans community. Yeah. Why?
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Yeah. Well, here's the thing you take, uh, as an example, a professor at a university had been
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there for years. He's a child psychologist and psychiatrist, and he did just what you said.
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He came out and said, you know, this, what we really need to be doing is trying to identify
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what's causing them to think that they're different and that they want to change. Now this guy has got
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credentials that are about 10 feet tall. The guy's brilliant. He's probably one of the best in the
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country. They fired him. Wow. So that's why people don't speak out. I had an endocrinologist I
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communicated with on Monday and Tuesday who I want him to help with someone who, uh, is, who is
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de-transitioning. And he says, you know, now that I've come out and said that I'm not an affirming,
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uh, endocrinologist, my practice is dying because they're, uh, they're coming after me. So they use the,
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the reason why people aren't speaking out is because their practices are being ruined.
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Their reputations are being ruined. They're being fired from jobs that they've had. I know
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two or three personal people that I've actually spoken with. There are probably some of the brightest
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minds in the country or have been fired or removed from their job in this community so that they can't
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speak out against it. And this is what is happening throughout the world on this. And the difference
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with me is I don't have a job. My boss is Jesus and nobody's going to fire him. So if they want to go
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get him, go get him, you know, um, so, you know, I can speak out. I don't have a job. I can't get
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fired. Um, I make as much money off of doing this as you're paying me to be on here. Yeah. Uh, which
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for the record, by the way, is, is nothing for people listening. He graciously has donated his time
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to this podcast. Um, can you talk to me at all about what you know about this James Younger case
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in Texas? It was actually, I think you wrote the article for the Federalist last year that I first
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read about that, uh, brought to my attention what's going on. And obviously you've probably noticed
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it's blown up in the news over the past few weeks. And there is, uh, a joint parenting agreement now
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between the two, but she seems to not be relenting. I mean, she is continuing to assist
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that it's abuse that the dad is allowing James to dress like a boy, not calling him Luna and things
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like that. Um, do you have, I don't know, any insider analysis that you can share with us?
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I have a great deal of insight on it. I was actually in Texas when the father came up to me,
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I was at a conference and he came up to me and said, can you, uh, write, uh, an article about,
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uh, my son and this divorce thing that I'm going through. And I said, yes. And that was in November
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of 2018. I wrote the article. Uh, he said he was trying to raise some money for legal fees because
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his wife, um, had called up his job and had him terminated. There's another one where he got
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terminated. They said that he was, she told his company that he was working for that he was abusing
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his child. So they fired him. Wow. And so, um, I wrote the article raised 60,000 with the first
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article published in November of 2018. Um, it, it got, they got a million hits to the server of
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save James and it crashed the server. The article had that much action. And so I've been following,
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um, uh, Jeff Younger and James and, um, his brother Jude. I've been to the house. I've, uh,
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had dinner with them. We, my wife and I have spent time with them. I've ridden in the car.
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I've gone over to the mother's house with, uh, uh, the father and spent time with the kid. The kid
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doesn't have gender dysphoria. He doesn't want to be a girl. Uh, the mom's, uh, a pediatrician who
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wants her practice to be a rainbow trans kid practice. And she wants to use James as the poster boy
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to show how you can do this. And James really doesn't want any part of it. So recently with this
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new, um, thing where they're shared custody, which never had happened before, uh, James goes to school
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as a boy. He doesn't, he never wanted to be Luna. That was mom's idea, not James's idea. So, um,
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this is probably one of the most egregious child abuse cases, uh, that I've seen. I, and the mom,
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um, really should be, um, I think should lose her license to practice. Um, she's not fit. Um,
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anybody who does this to a child and, and deliberately, um, is persuading him and to,
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to go to school at beforehand, um, she was as Luna. And you know where the word Luna came from
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to give you an idea of what the mother's like. She, um, keep in mind, these are in vitro kids.
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She's never had, um, childbearing has always been in vitro for her. So she has other children in
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vitro as well. The other children are always called, um, James a lunatic. You're a lunatic.
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You're a lunatic. So the mother decided that she would take the word lunatic and use Luna as his
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girl name. How encouraging. Isn't that wonderful? I mean, uh, if that should tell you pretty much,
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uh, the mindset of mother who thinks, uh, actually she's the lunatic, um, in my view.
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So yes, I, I think there, uh, this is still a horrible case, uh, because the kids thrown between
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mom and dad and mom is going to pursue this. And she probably has, uh, unlimited funds from
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the LGBT to fight dad in court, which dad doesn't have. So I think mom potentially, uh, if a lot of
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people don't get behind Jeff Younger potentially has a much greater war chest to battle this in court.
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Probably. So she has a louder one. I mean, there are a lot of people, if you have, uh, noticed it
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all in the last few weeks that have talked so much about this, uh, that even got the attention of,
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uh, governor Greg Abbott, the conservative side is just incensed over this. I mean, it's one thing
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we already disagree with this idea that, uh, gender reassignment surgery is the answer and the
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solution to people who are confused or uncomfortable with their bodies, but especially when it comes to
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children and conservatives have talked a long time about this fear of the sexualization of children and
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even the normalization of things like pedophilia. And we really see this as one step in that
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direction. It's not the exact same, but as you said, it is sexual abuse of a child. And what
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bothers me is not just this mother who I agree with you seems to be completely off, but also the
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people on the left who are either silent about it or who are celebrating it. When it comes to a child,
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it's one thing for you to have the view that an adult can transition when they want to, okay,
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whatever, but a child who just by nature of their developmental stage, can't really consent to
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this. And like you said, it's just doing whatever he has affirmed to do, just wants to be loved by
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his parents, just wants to be encouraged by them. I mean, I don't see how, even if you have the
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ideology that tells you transgenderism is fine, how you can condone that for a child. I mean, that's,
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that is really troubling to me. Yeah. Well, the people who started it, we have Kenzie,
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Benjamin and money and some others that started this issue back in, in the late forties, early
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fifties. And you can, you know, cheap plug for my book, but there's a great book, paper genders
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that really explains what happened, how it got started. So if you want to go back and look at
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how this got started, don't take my word for it. The documents are there in that book. And,
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and they believe those three men who were the pioneers, Benjamin actually coined the term
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transsexual, transgender back in the day. And they believed all three men believed that it was
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perfectly okay for adult men to have sex with young boys and all the better if you could make them look
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like girls. I mean, that makes sense. That makes sense. When, when you think about it, when you
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think about where this movement goes, I mean, we see there's something called drag queen story hour
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that happens at local libraries that seems to be happening more and more, even at elementary schools
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where, uh, you know, drag queens, they'll dress up and they'll go and they'll just share some kind of
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story. Or even the sex education that we're seeing for kids as young as seven to 10 years old
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about gender fluidity, homosexuality, and things like that. Um, what can parents do? I get that
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question a lot. And sometimes I just don't know. I don't have school age kids yet. Um, what can parents
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do that are afraid of what their kids are learning in school are afraid that maybe they're going to
00:25:00.540
run into a situation where they're, uh, you know, I don't know, their child pretends to be identifying
00:25:06.400
as gender or seems to be confused. They're maybe afraid of that. If they teach their kids the wrong
00:25:11.360
thing, CPS is going to be called. What do parents do in the face of all of this insanity?
00:25:16.880
Yeah. Don't put your kids in public school. Yeah. Period. Uh, you know, homeschool them,
00:25:22.840
uh, you know, start something, uh, at your church or with a group of people in the neighborhood,
00:25:27.300
find somebody that's responsible, uh, because the public school systems have just become an
00:25:33.000
indoctrination center for LGBT sexualization, whether it's transgender, lesbianism, homosexual,
00:25:39.140
you name it. Uh, these drag queens, uh, are all homosexual. They're all over the top. Um,
00:25:46.580
and they're really not transgender. I mean, that's why we call them drag queens because they're not
00:25:51.200
transgender and people need to understand that the people who identify as transgender, many of them
00:25:56.980
are what we call autogynephiliacs and autogynephilia is a whole separate condition. They, they will
00:26:04.060
identify as transgender. They're not, they're suffering from autogynephilia, which is a sexual
00:26:09.140
fetish disorder, right? Yeah. Is it attraction to the self? Is that what it is? It's attraction to
00:26:16.000
self. If, and when you're dressed up in the opposite gender, you become aroused by what you see in the
00:26:22.720
mirror and what you see in the mirror becomes the object of your sexual affection.
00:26:26.980
Hmm. And that's, is that being treated any differently in mainstream psychology than
00:26:32.500
transgenderism? No, no, because, because we have this cabal that says they're all transgender. So
00:26:38.620
nobody ever goes for treatment until they contact me and they've gone through this and they've had
00:26:45.000
their body destroyed. And then I ask them, did you get sexually aroused when you put on women's
00:26:50.200
clothing? And they go, yeah. And I said, well, that isn't transgenderism. That's autogynephilia.
00:26:55.240
And just for the record, so that you and your audience knows a real woman does not get sexually
00:27:02.380
aroused when she puts on clothing. Right. Only people with autogynephilia. And that represents a
00:27:09.420
huge portion of the population of men who identify as transgender. They don't want to admit that it's a
00:27:16.080
sexual fetish disorder. And then you have a transvestic fetish, which is similar, except they're aroused by
00:27:23.040
a particular piece of clothing or an article of clothing or shoes or whatever. And so they will
00:27:29.020
identify as transgender, but in fact, they're not, they're suffering from a sexual fetish disorder,
00:27:34.500
but because they say they're transgender and want to transition, nobody questions them. Nobody talks to
00:27:41.060
them about, well, you know, if you've got therapy, you could deal with this and understand that actually
00:27:45.820
going through the surgery would cause you to not be able to become aroused again. So why would you want
00:27:52.480
to do that? So once they get the information to go, oh, I see, it's not a good idea. Then you actually
00:27:57.940
have people who are transvestites, who are not transgender. They're just people who, you know, for the fun
00:28:04.600
of it, like to dress up and go out in public. Then you have people who are suffering from body dysmorphia
00:28:09.720
or dissociative disorder like myself or some other emotional or psychological disorder that
00:28:16.860
is never being addressed, treated or diagnosed prior to giving somebody hormones and surgery.
00:28:23.080
They only find out after the fact, because once they have the surgery and they go through it and
00:28:29.760
they've lost their job, family and everything, they go, wow, I still have gender dysphoria. Don't feel
00:28:36.000
good in my body. What was wrong? Then you go for therapy and realize, oh, you didn't need it.
00:28:40.400
You actually, you actually had bipolar disorder or schizophrenia or something else. And if we were
00:28:48.180
to treat that disorder properly, you could have avoided hormone therapy and surgery. And so this is
00:28:54.680
why today that for the proper research is unavailable because 90% of the people who go through that are
00:29:03.420
unavailable to even question about why they went through it. And so I'm trying to speak for the
00:29:11.240
people who that I know personally, who are afraid to come out after they've detransitioned and say that
00:29:18.040
it was a mistake. And I do it because I know that I've helped a lot of people who've written me and
00:29:25.040
said, you know, I looked at your website. I didn't have to talk to you. I just read the articles you've
00:29:30.060
written and I realized that, you know, I'm a, I have autogynophilia, so I'm not going to transition or,
00:29:36.420
or I have, uh, I was sexually abused. I'm not going to. So once a person takes some time, some quality
00:29:43.960
time and begins to understand what happened to them that caused them to not like who they are,
00:29:50.340
then they can avoid going to the gender clinics who won't look at anything and just give you
00:29:56.440
hormones the first day you're there and surgery whenever you want, um, and, and not ruin their
00:30:02.880
life. So that's really what I'm about. I don't dislike. I have a lot of friends who are transgender
00:30:08.080
people who, you know, tell me, please keep doing what you're doing because I know people who are
00:30:14.160
suffering a great deal. And, um, so somebody needs to speak out. I'm glad you're allowing me the
00:30:21.000
opportunity to share this, even though, uh, some people won't believe it. The people who are really
00:30:25.860
hurting will believe it and we'll get help. Yes. And thank you for taking the time. Could you,
00:30:32.500
I've just two more quick questions. Could you paint a picture of what the future looks like? If we keep
00:30:40.080
going this direction, if voices like yours are silenced, if our only recourse for people struggling
00:30:46.600
with any of these disorders that have to do with discomfort with the body or disordered thinking
00:30:51.060
about the body, if the only recourse is gender reassignment surgery, if we keep on going this
00:30:56.240
direction of not being able to even define what a man or a woman is and having a million different
00:31:01.420
genders and pronouns and things like that, what is the, what does the future look like, especially
00:31:06.200
for those who are suffering? Yeah, we're going to see a lot more people committing suicide,
00:31:11.100
young people, especially, uh, the confusion's not good. I mean, growing up, uh, I don't care what
00:31:17.600
year you grew up in, whether it's the fifties, sixties or the two thousands, uh, is tough and
00:31:23.120
kids do not need, uh, any additional confusion added to them at school about gender books and pronouns and
00:31:30.840
this crazy nonsense. Um, so I think what it's going to look like is more suicides. Uh, I do really
00:31:37.760
believe that someone with a much stronger, more powerful, more significant voice than mine is
00:31:44.780
going to come forward and blow this thing to smithereens and it's all going to crash. That's
00:31:48.340
what I believe. Hmm. That's what I hope. I, I saw some comment the other day. There was something
00:31:53.820
that went viral that, uh, mom had her young four-year-old son holding up a sign. She shared on
00:32:00.820
social media, went viral that said men can have periods too, went viral. She was saying how awesome
00:32:06.620
and wonderful it is. But I saw a comment on there, of course, people who were outraged and someone said,
00:32:12.160
I cannot wait until the pendulum swings back in the other direction. And to me that my husband and
00:32:18.780
I talk about this, that's gotta be what happens. I mean, this is, it's not sustainable. It's not
00:32:24.060
sustainable. And so it's gotta be that. Unfortunately, there are going to be victims and casualties,
00:32:30.980
fatalities, uh, due to this, but eventually it will be enough to where society has got to at some point
00:32:38.420
before we reach some kind of extinction or just absolute anarchy before we say, oh, okay, this isn't
00:32:45.520
working. We we've got to swing back. That's my hope. Um, my last question is you mentioned Jesus
00:32:52.040
being your boss during this time. Did you become a Christian or were you raised a Christian?
00:32:57.420
Yeah. My, I was, I went to church from the time I was seven years old. So, um, you know, I didn't
00:33:03.820
really understand what that was about when I was seven, just like I didn't understand all the things
00:33:08.440
that happened when I was seven. Um, so you mature with that. And, um, uh, yeah, I, I had abandoned the
00:33:15.780
idea of knowing what a relationship was like with, um, my Lord. And so when I went through this whole
00:33:22.940
process, I was an alcoholic and a drug addict and a transgender and a wacko nut job, uh, at homeless
00:33:28.920
at one time. And so the only reason why I'm, um, quite young, handsome, 79 year old man today is
00:33:36.180
because, um, I stopped drinking and 33 years sobriety and, uh, because I got my life back.
00:33:42.680
And so, um, that's what I do. And I, I just believe that, you know, this is going to swing
00:33:48.400
the other way. And, uh, I write the books that I write so that people will read them long after
00:33:54.180
I'm gone and they'll go, geez, that old guy was right. Yeah, I think so. That's what I hope. And
00:33:59.520
that's, that's what I, that's what I pray for. I don't know if you've ever read the book,
00:34:03.740
I love thy body by Nancy Piercy. If you haven't read it, I highly recommend it, but she talks a lot
00:34:10.380
about, um, what you're talking about and having really a loving view of your own body of your own
00:34:16.600
body and how we should be teaching that to our kids. And it goes in not just to transgenderism,
00:34:21.560
it also goes into issues like abortion and promiscuity and things like that. An honorable
00:34:26.780
view of the body is what we should be teaching ourselves and teaching our kids and anything
00:34:31.100
outside of that, that says exactly what you said earlier, um, that something's wrong with you and
00:34:37.220
that you're only affirmable if you change, um, that is child abuse. So it's my prayer that we
00:34:43.640
science, the already affirms that, but that the scientific community swings back in that direction
00:34:47.920
and hopefully our moral landscape changes with it. So, um, is there anything else that you would
00:34:53.180
like to add or at least tell people where they can find you? Yeah. It's sexchangeregret.com, but to,
00:34:59.080
to help support what I do, cause I do everything for free to help support what I do by my books,
00:35:04.340
go to the website, sex change regret. They're good books, uh, trans life survivors, paper genders,
00:35:10.240
uh, all those books are great resource books. So, uh, buy them, buy them in large quantities
00:35:16.500
and, uh, read them cause you'll, you'll love them. I'm sure. Sexchangeregret.com. I'm sure that's
00:35:22.460
going to be a huge resource for people who either know someone going through this or who just wants
00:35:27.240
to get more educated on it. So thank you so much for what you do, for the books you write,
00:35:31.920
for the interviews you do, for the articles you write. Um, you are appreciated in a very necessary
00:35:36.740
voice and I'm thankful to God for how he's used you. Thank you for having me on. I appreciate it