Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - Ep 427 ｜ The Hidden Corruption of the United Nations ｜ Guest： Hillel Neuer

00:00:00.000 Hey, guys, welcome to Relatable. Today, I am talking to Hillel Neuer. He is the executive

00:00:13.800 director of UN Watch, United Nations Watch. And we are going to talk all about the UN today,

00:00:21.600 why it is not just this innocuous body that is trying to preserve human rights and peace

00:00:27.860 throughout the world is actually rife with corruption that we need to know about. And

00:00:32.180 there are things that we can do about this. And the first step is awareness. And he is going to

00:00:36.520 make us very aware of what is going on in the United Nations, even in the WHO, its attached

00:00:43.840 bodies and where the United States comes in in all of this. And then at the end, I also want to give

00:00:49.580 kind of a worldview application to all of this, because there was so much I was thinking about

00:00:54.920 in this conversation that I wanted to talk about just quickly from a biblical perspective.

00:01:00.560 I've been following Mr. Neuer for a very long time, have been wanting him to come on the podcast

00:01:06.080 for a very long time, just an amazing, insightful and brave person. So I'm very, very excited for

00:01:12.900 you to listen to this conversation. Without further ado, here is Hillel Neuer.

00:01:16.260 Mr. Neuer, thank you so much for joining me. For people who may not be familiar, can you tell us

00:01:26.900 who you are and what you do? Sure. My name is Hillel Neuer, and I direct an organization called

00:01:32.680 UN Watch, which is based in Geneva, Switzerland. And our mission is to monitor the United Nations

00:01:39.200 and hold it accountable to the yardstick of its own charter. We also promote human rights for all.

00:01:46.260 And how did you get into this line of work?

00:01:50.580 Well, my training is, I was a lawyer before that. I was in New York City for a few years working for

00:01:58.920 a large firm doing litigation, commercial litigation, but also civil rights work. And before that,

00:02:05.280 I had studied law and politics and was active working at a think tank and writing about political

00:02:12.880 issues. So human rights, law, politics, international affairs were always a fascination for me. And this

00:02:20.440 job was available and it was the right thing for me. A lot of people, when they think about the United

00:02:27.080 Nations, probably the average person, average American thinks about it in very neutral terms that,

00:02:32.600 or maybe even in very benevolent terms, that it's just this, you know, body of countries coming

00:02:38.020 together for the well-being of the whole world. But in following you, I have learned that there's a

00:02:43.440 lot that goes on behind the scenes at the UN that we don't know about. Can you talk about kind of just

00:02:49.700 the mischaracterizations that people have about the United Nations in their head? And why just in

00:02:57.580 summary, those assumptions about the UN being this good force for humanity is wrong?

00:03:06.700 Well, you know, the United Nations was founded with great ideals, with great vision. Franklin

00:03:14.140 Eleanor Roosevelt was not alive when it was created, but it was people surrounding him who had the

00:03:19.220 vision to create the United Nations. So it came out of World War II in a time of genocide and war and

00:03:26.120 destruction and mass murder. And the United Nations was supposed to be an end to that. And it was founded

00:03:32.380 to reaffirm faith in human dignity and fundamental freedoms and human rights. And actually, Eleanor

00:03:38.440 Roosevelt was the founding chair of the UN Commission on Human Rights. And there was this

00:03:42.720 thing called UNICEF, which is the UN Children's Fund, which people who grew up in the 50s would go

00:03:47.780 around in their neighborhoods with little blue boxes and raising money for UNICEF. So it began with

00:03:52.560 great ideals and actually with idealistic people. I mentioned Eleanor Roosevelt, founding chair of the

00:03:57.260 UN Commission on Human Rights. And I think that the UN still benefits in many ways from that, from that

00:04:03.140 idealism. But the reality is that if Eleanor Roosevelt was the founding chair of the UN Commission on Human Rights in

00:04:08.820 1946, in 2003, the chair was the representative of Colonel Gaddafi's mass murdering Libyan regime. So 1946, Eleanor

00:04:18.000 Roosevelt, 2003, Colonel Muammar Gaddafi, the rise and fall of human rights at the UN. Many people around the world

00:04:24.740 today, especially in Europe, but in other countries in Canada, and I think it's parts of the United States, still when

00:04:30.320 they hear the words, the United Nations Human Rights Council decided they imagine men in white robes with long white

00:04:38.720 beards, strolling along Mount Olympus, making their decisions based on facts, logic or morality, when Ali, nothing 0.98

00:04:46.760 could be further from the truth, sitting around the table today at the United Nations Human Rights Council, which is the new and

00:04:52.460 improved, supposedly improved version of what Eleanor Roosevelt chaired back in 1946, sitting around the

00:04:58.360 table are not Aristotle, Socrates or Plato, but in fact, Gaddafi, Castro and the House of Saud. The members today that 0.93

00:05:06.320 have just joined recently include the Chinese Communist Party is one member of the Human Rights Council, Russia's

00:05:12.340 Putin regime, Venezuela's Maduro regime, and Cuba's communist regime. These are 60% of today's Human Rights

00:05:20.480 Council at the United Nations. Tell me how this happened. I know there's probably a lot that goes

00:05:26.460 into it, but how did that happen over a span of just a few decades, going from Eleanor Roosevelt to the

00:05:34.580 representative of a terrorist regime being the head of the United Nations Human Rights Council?

00:05:41.060 Well, you know, a couple of things happened. First, I think when the UN was founded, they didn't exactly

00:05:46.120 know how, let's say the Human Rights Council would work. So they allow these eminent idealists to be sitting on the Human Rights

00:05:52.100 Commission. But very quickly, politics came into it, the UN is a political body. And so rather than it, rather than being

00:05:59.640 Eleanor Roosevelt sitting there, it was the chair held by the US. And eventually, it was countries that held the chairs. And as that body

00:06:07.120 actually accumulated more influence, not just adopting the Universal Declaration on Human Rights, which is

00:06:13.000 generally a very good document or the Covenant on Civil and Political Rights in the 1960s, also a good document that

00:06:19.460 protects freedom of speech, and other civil and political rights. But as it acquired the power to name names to, to

00:06:27.100 conduct an investigation into a specific country, what we call the United Nations naming and shaming, which is very

00:06:32.480 significant power at the UN countries do not want to be shamed on the on the world stage. And so as the UN

00:06:41.880 accumulated that power, the worst regimes wanted to make sure they would not be singled out. So China became 0.77

00:06:47.620 a member of the Human Rights Commission, Sudan, which was committing genocide became a member of the Human

00:06:51.900 Rights Commission. And as I mentioned, Gaddafi's Libyan regime in 2003, becoming the chair of the Human Rights 0.92

00:06:57.680 Commission. So as that body accumulated more influence, and it doesn't have any binding power,

00:07:04.300 but it can shame a country on the world stage. And the more unelected and illegitimate you are, the more

00:07:10.280 you are fearful of being called out and exposed as being illegitimate by a world body. And some people

00:07:16.140 in the United States, some of your followers will think the UN is silly. But around the world, the United

00:07:21.520 Nations carries with it, the imprimatur of international legitimacy, they can give you a badge of international

00:07:28.300 legitimacy. So China, Russia, Cuba, Venezuela, Libya, today, all members of the Human Rights Council, because they want to

00:07:35.240 wear that false badge of international legitimacy, and they will trade stuff. China has enormous reserves, financial,

00:07:44.140 capital assets, political assets that they can trade to your country, in order for them to get a seat on that body

00:07:51.440 because they really need and want that false badge of international legitimacy. And they'll trade

00:07:57.380 whatever they need, they'll pressure whoever they need to win those seats on that body. 0.72

00:08:03.080 And you just kind of answered the question, how does this happen? I mean, you said that Russia and China,

00:08:10.860 Libya, they want a place for that false badge of legitimacy. But it's hard for me to believe that the 1.00

00:08:17.260 majority of countries at the UN would approve of that would say, yeah, that's totally fine. Let's put

00:08:22.520 these people in charge of human rights in the UN. And yet it just happened. So are you saying it just

00:08:27.880 happens through bargaining? Or is there something? Is there something else also beneath the surface,

00:08:33.240 some ideology or some other level of corruption that goes on that allows these brutal regimes to take

00:08:39.040 these seats?

00:08:39.620 Yeah, look, it's completely outrageous. It's hard for myself and regular folks around the world to

00:08:46.200 understand. The sad thing, Ali, is that if you speak to United Nations diplomats, this is normal.

00:08:51.760 The fact that Saudi Arabia about four years ago was elected to the UN Women's Rights Commission,

00:08:56.540 which is the technical name is the Commission on the Status of Women, but it's the UN Women's Rights

00:09:00.140 Commission. The fact that Saudi Arabia was elected, countries defended that, okay? They think it's normal.

00:09:05.560 You know, we revealed it was a secret ballot. So we don't know who voted to elect Saudi Arabia. But

00:09:11.420 we do know at least five EU countries voted yes to Saudi Arabia on the Women's Rights Commission.

00:09:16.500 Saudi Arabia is one of the world's worst regimes when it comes to women's rights. Women up until a 1.00

00:09:21.180 couple of years ago were not allowed to drive a car. They need a male guardian's permission to go to

00:09:26.160 the hospital, to leave the country. They're completely subjugated. And we know that possibly Belgium, 0.53

00:09:33.260 Sweden, Norway, Ireland voted for Saudi Arabia to be on the Women's Rights Commission. When we exposed

00:09:39.860 this, what we heard from certain countries, like the Swedish foreign minister, was that, oh, well,

00:09:45.520 we need a big tent. And we need all kinds of countries from all regions to be there so they

00:09:52.140 will learn and improve, said the Swedish foreign minister. The reality, though, Ali, is it's very cynical

00:09:58.220 business? There's a lot of vote trading that goes on. So the worst dictatorships will trade votes. 1.00

00:10:05.100 They'll say, I vote for you, you vote for me. It was revealed that Belgium, not only did we discover

00:10:10.420 that Belgium actually voted for Saudi Arabia, but a cable, a diplomatic telegram went from Brussels to

00:10:17.060 New York, telling the Belgian ambassador in New York, vote for Saudi Arabia and make sure you tell

00:10:23.420 the Saudis that we voted for them. Why did they want the Saudis to know? Because Belgium was running 0.52

00:10:28.100 for the Security Council and they wanted Saudi Arabia's vote. Maybe they wanted Saudi oil. Maybe

00:10:32.520 they wanted Saudi money. So it is routine at the UN to have vote trading. We uncovered a letter where

00:10:38.900 Saudi Arabia and Russia, Russia is a rival to Saudi Arabia in the Middle East. And yet there was a

00:10:45.100 letter from Russia to Saudi Arabia saying, Russia, you vote for us onto the Human Rights Council,

00:10:50.660 we'll vote for you. So I would say that it's cynical vote trading. And as an excuse,

00:10:56.040 apologists for the UN, diplomats who are part of the UN system will try to give you an ideology.

00:11:01.520 They'll say, no, no, we need all countries. And I agree, all countries, all regions should be

00:11:06.400 represented. But guess what? In the Middle East, in Africa and Asia, there are many countries. In Latin

00:11:11.800 America, there are many countries that could serve that aren't the worst of the worst. Okay, if you go in

00:11:16.860 the Middle East, you can have, you know, United Arab Emirates is far better than Saudi Arabia, 0.77

00:11:21.920 when it comes to women's rights. And if you're talking in Africa, you don't need Zimbabwe or 0.83

00:11:27.300 Somalia or Libyan. There are many African countries that are not the worst of the worst. The same goes 1.00

00:11:32.240 in Latin America. You don't need Venezuela and Cuba, you can get many other countries, Costa Rica and

00:11:37.220 others. So the UN will tell you, we need to have the worst dictatorships there as part of an ideology. 0.60

00:11:42.640 But the reality is that many of these European countries who claim to care about international

00:11:47.140 law are actually selling their soul, Ali, because we know even the UK made a deal apparently with 0.88

00:11:53.600 Saudi Arabia to vote for them. They're selling their soul to do cynical vote trading, but then

00:11:58.400 pretending it's out of some ideology.

00:12:00.200 Well, that was also my question is, is there any kind of cohesive ideology that drives these kinds

00:12:08.000 of decisions? Or is it just cynicism? Like, is it some is it some form of moral relativistic

00:12:17.080 progressivism that says, you know, we don't feel like we can condemn these countries, it's cultural

00:12:23.840 relativism, whatever, let's just be progressive and inclusive. Or is it really just about, you know,

00:12:30.180 what you can bargain for and what you can get for the reputation of your own country?

00:12:36.920 I think it's primarily cynical vote trading, because we've actually seen the vote trades

00:12:42.180 documented in letters. I said we have a letter from Saudi Arabia to Russia, documenting the vote

00:12:46.740 trade, and they'll sometimes announce it. But it's true, there is an ideology that you mentioned of

00:12:51.820 cultural relativism. And I would say that when you speak about organizations that are not voting at

00:12:56.440 the UN, but play a very significant role, groups like Amnesty International, which are rife with

00:13:01.320 cultural relativism, they have a very hard time saying that you shouldn't vote for Russia, China,

00:13:07.560 Cuba, Saudi Arabia, Venezuela, they feel as kind of Western colonials, if they dare to say that you

00:13:14.920 shouldn't vote for certain countries. So as opposed to, you know, saying that that countries like the US,

00:13:21.360 Canada, France, which have problems, every country has human rights violations and problems. But

00:13:26.800 obviously, you know, I believe in my organization, you would watch these very strongly with George

00:13:31.200 Orwell said, that there's, there's a huge difference between half a loaf of bread, and no bread at all.

00:13:37.240 And a country like Britain, France, Canada, that has blots on their system, and of course, they have

00:13:44.360 blots on their system is completely different than a country where the blot is the system. And if you live

00:13:50.560 in China, if you live in Cuba, if you live in Russia, the blot is the system. If you dare to speak out

00:13:56.120 against one of these regimes, they'll throw you in prison, they'll kill you, they'll silence you, 0.98

00:14:00.440 you'll be disappeared. And in the countries that I mentioned before, you can, you know, be elected

00:14:05.620 to parliament and go on live national TV 24 hours a day condemning your government. They have, you know,

00:14:11.840 all democracies have human rights violations. But systems that have checks and balances and have

00:14:16.520 functioning free and liberal democracies have nothing in comparison with oppressive dictatorships.

00:14:23.900 And the latter should not be sitting on the Human Rights Council. And by the way, this isn't just me

00:14:28.940 making up this as a rule, the United Nations, when they created the Human Rights Council, they said

00:14:33.340 there should be standard, they said members should shall, I'm going to quote, shall uphold the highest

00:14:38.920 standards of protection and promotion of human rights. And in Article 8 of the founding document that

00:14:43.560 created the Human Rights Council, Resolution 60 slash 251 says that countries that commit gross and

00:14:48.660 systematic violations can be removed. So when you have the Dutch ambassador in Geneva giving an

00:14:54.000 interview recently saying, oh, we need all countries there, she's going against actually what the United

00:14:59.060 Nations itself decided. So there is an ideology, I would say groups like Amnesty International,

00:15:04.320 and some diplomats have imbibed that ideology. But it's actually against what the founding

00:15:09.020 resolution of the Human Rights Council says, which is that there should be membership criteria.

00:15:13.560 So it's this very harmful, like intertwining of postmodernism and cynicism that I guess has

00:15:21.320 made the UN what it is. And what I always find in this kind of postmodern, morally relativistic

00:15:28.040 mentality is that there are contradictions. They say, you know, we need to bring everyone to the

00:15:32.940 table. But they are willing to condemn some countries for what they see as human rights infractions,

00:15:39.220 while they turn their eye from other countries like Israel, there seems to be just another level

00:15:45.940 of criticism that we see often coming from the UN towards Israel. Why is that? And how does that kind

00:15:53.140 of fit into this whole, oh, big tent, let's just tolerate everyone mentality?

00:15:57.580 Yeah, I think you have identified an important point of hypocrisy and contradiction. Israel is the object of a pathological obsession at the United Nations. These are resolutions, I'll give you give you a few statistics. At the General Assembly, which is the World Parliament of the United Nations, every year, as we just had last year in 2020, there was one resolution on Iran, one on North Korea, one on Syria, one on Myanmar, and one on Myanmar. And I think that's the

00:16:27.580 one on Myanmar, one on some other country, and 20 on Israel. I think last year, maybe there was 17 or 18 on Israel. And typically, there's 20 on Israel, 17, 20. And there's zero resolutions on China, Turkey, Pakistan, Venezuela, you know, Zimbabwe, you go down the list at the General Assembly, one on Iran, one on North Korea, 20 on Israel, 17 on Israel. At the Human Rights Council in Geneva, where I'm based, there is one agenda item for the whole world called Agenda Item 4.

00:16:57.580 or human rights situations around the world, and one agenda item only for Israel, meaning one day for 193 countries, one day for Israel alone. There is not an agenda item for North Korea. There's not an agenda item for Syria, where millions have fled and maybe half a million have been killed. There's not an agenda item on Sudan, where there was genocide, only agenda item on Israel. Who's behind it? The Palestinians, together with the Arab League and the Islamic countries. Islamic countries are 56 countries at the UN, very influential.

00:17:25.780 They're represented in Asia and Africa. They put forward the resolutions. But who votes for them? Well, actually, EU countries vote for 75% of them. And if you ask me, I think part of it is a kind of anti-Semitism.

00:17:40.400 Yes, some of it is vote trading. Arab countries will say, historically, if you don't vote for us, we won't give you oil. We can threaten terrorism against you. We'll vote against you. But why do so many European countries willingly go along with the scapegoating of the world's only Jewish state?

00:17:56.160 If you ask me, part of it has to do with certain archetypes, as today we might call memes, where in the Middle Ages, if you wanted to blame someone for problems in the world, if there was the plague in the Middle Ages, you scapegoated the Jews.

00:18:08.740 The Jews poisoned the wells. And today, when you sit at the United Nations, and if you're at the Human Rights Council, at the General Assembly, at the Women's Rights Commission, at the World Health Organization, often the only country being condemned at the World Health Organization, at the Women's Rights Commission, is Israel for violating women's rights or violating health rights. 0.99

00:18:24.540 It's so absurd and pathological, Ali, that it really seems like a scapegoating. The world gathers, they're silent on most of the world's worst abusers, and you pick up the Jew, and you scapegoat the Jew. That's what I see in many cases, both pragmatic, cynical vote trading, but also something that is not based on realpolitik, but seems to be based on ancient prejudices. 0.54

00:18:49.860 And would you say that these kind of prejudices are also at times leveled against the United States, or no?

00:19:00.660 Absolutely.

00:19:01.480 Not in the way of anti-Semitism, but just the anti-United States kind of mentality that it seems like these kinds of bureaucratic bodies often have.

00:19:11.540 Well, I think it ties into what you said before. You know, the United Nations is sometimes, we're speaking about the pathologies, is a toxic combination, mix of realpolitik, where worst dictatorships have a majority, and a post-colonial ideology that took over Europe in the 1960s,

00:19:36.740 which became anti-Western, anti-capitalist, also anti-Israel, and anti-American. It's kind of all in the mix.

00:19:44.200 And so there is an anti-Americanism that is very strong in Europe, and is very powerful.

00:19:48.560 And I mentioned groups like Amnesty International. They don't vote, but they represent the ideology of the UN.

00:19:53.840 Many of their people have worked at the UN, will be working at the UN, and that ideology is very powerful at the UN.

00:19:59.960 And the Soviet Union was very clever, Ali, in fueling the anti-Western and anti-American alliance. 0.84

00:20:06.920 They were behind this group called the Non-Aligned Movement, which actually was very aligned against America.

00:20:12.000 And they tried to turn African and Asian countries against the United States. 0.71

00:20:16.140 So there is definitely a very powerful anti-Americanism that ties in with anti-capitalism, anti-Westernism, blaming, accusing the West of being against the rest.

00:20:26.760 It's a very strong ideology at the United Nations, and it goes together with dictatorships who want to single out America in various ways.

00:20:35.040 And we're seeing that America is being accused of racism.

00:20:38.560 When last year in America, you had the Black Lives Matter and George Floyd protests.

00:20:42.820 The United Nations Human Rights Council held an emergency session in some of the most racist countries in the world, like Mauritania, which has slavery.

00:20:50.100 According to The Guardian newspaper, according to CNN, it's one of the last bastions of real slavery.

00:20:54.400 Hundreds of thousands of people in Mauritania were Black slaves, and they were accusing America of slavery.

00:21:00.760 China, which has herded one million Uyghur Muslims into camps and is committing at least a cultural genocide against them, accuses America of racism.

00:21:09.420 So there is something very cynical going on there.

00:21:12.040 Has the United States done a good job at all of standing up against this or calling this out, trying to say, hey, we don't want to legitimize these kinds of not just hypocritical actions, but these kinds of hostile regimes?

00:21:28.500 Or have we kind of just gone along to get along?

00:21:31.240 Look, I think there's two approaches, and I'm not sure if either one was the best.

00:21:36.600 The democratic approach, historically, has been to support the UN.

00:21:40.460 I wouldn't say blindly.

00:21:42.420 The various democratic administrations have criticized the UN.

00:21:45.980 They voted against anti-Israel resolutions and so forth.

00:21:48.800 But there was a tendency in recent years under the Obama administration to support the Human Rights Council.

00:21:54.220 America joined the Human Rights Council and said, you know, it's doing good things.

00:21:57.540 And my concern is the Biden administration, as they intend to rejoin the Human Rights Council, we're not against engagement.

00:22:04.260 We think U.S. leadership is very important.

00:22:05.780 If you want to keep out the Chinas and the Russias who are trying to take over the UN, you need to be there. 1.00

00:22:11.100 But you shouldn't necessarily be giving out false praise for the institutions.

00:22:14.740 So I'd say the democratic approach was too inclined to maybe go along to get along.

00:22:20.860 Not 100 percent, but definitely in that direction, the way the Europeans do it in a much more significant way. 0.91

00:22:25.600 And then if you ask me, the Republican administrations, the problem was that sometimes they said, well, we're just going to walk out and we're not going to deal with it.

00:22:32.920 And the problem doesn't go away.

00:22:34.400 China taking over the World Health Organization or taking over large swaths of the human rights system at the UN.

00:22:39.640 You need to be there to fight back.

00:22:41.400 So I think the Republicans need to be much more sophisticated about what's going on in the UN and how to push back, how to fight back.

00:22:47.700 Do so cleverly, strategically, articulately.

00:22:50.560 And the Democrats need to have more backbone in fighting back.

00:22:53.180 So I think there is a happy middle that both administrations should be getting to because the United Nations is not going away.

00:22:59.400 The Human Rights Council is not going away.

00:23:01.120 They influence parts of hundreds of millions of people.

00:23:04.640 And if you want to push back against China trying to subvert the meaning of human rights, we need to know how to do so cleverly and effectively.

00:23:13.940 What tangible power does the UN have?

00:23:17.400 Well, there's different parts of the UN.

00:23:21.380 I'd say the Security Council deals with war and peace and some conflict.

00:23:25.560 Some wars have ended when the UN Security Council passes the resolution, which, if it does so under Chapter 7 of the UN Charter, is considered binding under international law.

00:23:34.740 The General Assembly, the World Parliament, in theory, not binding.

00:23:38.560 But in reality, they control a budget of billions of dollars.

00:23:42.000 The U.S. pays for a large part of it and has enormous influence around the world.

00:23:46.000 When a UN Secretary General announces something, makes a statement, that goes around the world.

00:23:50.820 People regard that as a credible and legitimate statement.

00:23:55.580 When the General Assembly adopts a resolution, the world will regard that as a credible statement.

00:24:00.680 So the UN doesn't really have boots on the ground, but, you know, Stalin famously, apocryphally, someone said to him, well, the Pope said something.

00:24:12.320 And Stalin said, oh, well, how many divisions does the Pope have, right?

00:24:17.300 The Pope doesn't have tanks.

00:24:18.740 Well, in the end, the Pope remained and the Soviet Union, that evil regime, disappeared in, you know, around 1990. 0.97

00:24:26.500 And the Pope and the Vatican remained.

00:24:28.680 Sometimes having legitimacy and influence and credibility can be more significant than having all the tanks in the world.

00:24:35.940 The Soviet Union had thousands and thousands of tanks and nuclear warheads and it disappeared.

00:24:40.280 So moral power or the appearance of moral legitimacy is very significant.

00:24:44.160 The United Nations has incredible legitimacy around the world.

00:24:49.100 And so the Human Rights Council, the reason that Russia, Cuba, China, Venezuela struggled very hard, and Venezuela actually had to fight against Costa Rica, which was a late candidate, then they beat them.

00:24:59.880 The reason they invest so many resources, Ali, is because it's moral power, perceived moral power, international legitimacy is very significant on the world stage.

00:25:09.560 So I would say that UN decisions can't change everything in the world.

00:25:13.500 And if you want to stop a genocide, you need the US Marines to do it.

00:25:16.420 The UN can't do it.

00:25:17.840 But UN statements, UN resolutions, UN reports, UN commissions of inquiry that get sent to the International Criminal Court can be very influential and can change the way people think.

00:25:28.060 And thought is thought and word, would you say that China and the legitimization of China through the UN, even through the WHO, would you say that that is our biggest threat, the biggest threat to the Western world, the domination that China seeks, especially through these kinds of organizations? 0.84

00:25:52.300 I think the UN is becoming an arena for superpower conflict.

00:25:58.940 China has identified the United Nations as a very important arena.

00:26:02.740 They're now heading agencies in Montreal, the UN's ICAO, the Civil Aviation Agency, headed by a Chinese representative in Geneva, the Telecommunications Union, which governs things like frequencies, internet, cell phones.

00:26:19.000 There's a Chinese representative heading that.

00:26:20.680 You can be sure he gets his orders from Beijing.

00:26:23.440 The Food and Agriculture Organization in Rome, another agency in Vienna.

00:26:26.960 China, they're taking over agencies.

00:26:29.060 They are now members of the Human Rights Council.

00:26:31.000 They're on the five-member group that I revealed in April, the consultative group that names 17 international human rights investigators of the Human Rights Council, the expert on disappearances when someone magically, forcibly disappears, or the expert on arbitrary detentions, things that China is committing is the greatest perpetrator of. 0.77

00:26:49.320 China is now naming the individuals who will be the investigators.

00:26:51.900 So China is methodically, systematically, strategically taking over large parts of the United Nations. 0.70

00:26:57.980 They want the influence.

00:26:59.080 They want the legitimacy.

00:27:00.020 You mentioned the World Health Organization.

00:27:02.260 You know, China, Ali, I'll be honest with you, I didn't realize it as much, but there was a Hong Kong, a woman from Hong Kong, Margaret Chan, who headed the World Health Organization for a decade up until 2017.

00:27:17.460 She was from Hong Kong.

00:27:18.200 I didn't realize, but she's actually controlled by China. 0.98

00:27:20.640 If you look back at her candidacy more than a decade ago, China was her sponsor.

00:27:25.260 When she finished being 10 years as head of the World Health Organization, she was put on the Chinese Politburo, on a leading Chinese government body, as a reward for what she did, which was helping China.

00:27:37.660 The World Health Organization has two goodwill ambassadors.

00:27:41.320 One of them is the wife of the Chinese dictator, Xi Jinping.

00:27:44.220 The other one is a guy named James Chow, who's a presenter on Chinese television.

00:27:48.460 He's a full-time paid propagandist of Chinese TV, and he's a World Health Organization goodwill ambassador.

00:27:54.880 China is subverting these UN institutions like the World Health Organization.

00:27:58.860 The reason that Dr. Tedros was so hesitant to say anything about China when the coronavirus began out of Wuhan was because China was behind his candidacy as well.

00:28:08.260 So if we want to push back, we need to be there and to do so cleverly and effectively.

00:28:14.320 And I hope the U.S. and other countries work in concert to push back against the Chinese communist regime.

00:28:20.200 They're trying to take over everything.

00:28:21.600 The level of corruption and depravity and these kinds of organizations, I think, makes a lot of people just feel completely helpless and desperate.

00:28:34.060 Like, there is no hope for the future because how can we, you know, just average people push back against this kind of stuff except for just talk about it?

00:28:44.400 Like, what's your recommendation or what's your encouragement if you have any to people who say, OK, like, I stand against this stuff.

00:28:52.640 I want transparency. I want integrity.

00:28:54.640 I want the UN to at least somewhat be an organization that we can trust and we can look to.

00:29:01.000 What do I do? How do I push back against all this?

00:29:04.400 Yeah, Ali, I think there is reason for pessimism, I'm afraid, because sadly, I've been at this in this business for for some time now.

00:29:13.940 And the United States isn't what it used to be.

00:29:15.640 You know, United States used to be the number one superpower.

00:29:18.240 And today it's far weaker economically, politically and otherwise.

00:29:23.440 So the ability of the U.S. to shape the U.N., which was the case in the 1950s, the U.S. really could shape the U.N.

00:29:29.940 And that's changed a lot. However, the U.S. is still very important, still paying for a large part of the U.N. budget.

00:29:36.060 At least 22 percent of the U.N. budget is paid for by the United States.

00:29:40.360 And they pay for much more involuntary contributions.

00:29:43.760 So the U.S. plays an important role.

00:29:45.120 And I think your viewers who are primarily in the United States have a responsibility to make sure the United Nations does not subvert the principles of human rights and international peace and security that we all believe in and we'd like to see the U.N. live up to.

00:29:58.040 And what they need to do is first, regular folks need to know what's happening at the U.N.

00:30:02.780 They can do so by following the news.

00:30:04.380 They can follow organizations like ours.

00:30:06.420 Our website is unwatch.org.

00:30:09.320 Unwatch.org.

00:30:10.060 You can go there, sign up.

00:30:11.460 You will get once a week, get updates on terrible things that are happening, things that you need to know about.

00:30:16.080 And when you have the information, you're empowered.

00:30:19.240 Citizens should write to their congressperson, write to their senator, write to secretary of state and say,

00:30:25.160 I just heard that the that China is running to be on the Human Rights Council.

00:30:30.020 Is the U.S. going to fight back and push them off?

00:30:32.600 I heard that James Chow is still at the World Health Organization as a goodwill ambassador.

00:30:37.720 And if the Biden administration rejoined the World Health Organization to engage well and good, but use the engagement, demand that WHO fire James Chow,

00:30:47.240 who's an out-and-out Chinese propagandist, using this WHO title to legitimize his lies about the coronavirus. 0.65

00:30:55.300 So I think citizens can push the U.S. government, Republicans or Democrats, push the administration to demand accountability, transparency at the U.N.

00:31:06.780 And I've seen it happen when the U.S. ambassador to the U.N., when congresspersons, when senators demand action from the U.N., I've seen changes and reforms by U.N. bodies.

00:31:18.560 So, frankly, it's only going to come from the U.S. That's where it's going to begin. 0.86

00:31:23.300 And your viewers should be the first ones to get the information and to demand action and reform from the U.N.

00:31:30.980 Yes, absolutely. And how can they support you? How can they support U.N. Watch?

00:31:36.960 I know that you gave the organization's website, which we will put in the description of this episode, but can they follow you?

00:31:44.800 Is there any monetary support that they can give?

00:31:48.400 Sure. Thanks, Allie, for a very important question.

00:31:50.840 Folks who want to help the work that we're doing, which is to make the United Nations live up to the original founding principles of its charter,

00:31:57.920 which are about upholding real human rights, fighting genocidal dictators, making sure that they don't corrupt U.N. bodies,

00:32:05.060 they can follow us. I mentioned www.unwatch.org and sign up there.

00:32:10.620 They can follow us on Twitter, U.N. Watch on Twitter.

00:32:14.080 My name, Hillel Neuer on Twitter can follow us.

00:32:16.680 We're also on Facebook, U.N. Watch.

00:32:18.640 We're on Instagram, United Nations Watch can follow us on there, can like our posts that will empower us.

00:32:23.800 They can donate. Our funding comes entirely from private contributions, and we're a nonprofit organization in America.

00:32:32.100 You get a tax receipt for it.

00:32:33.580 They can go on our website, www.unwatch.org, and make a donation and make sure that we continue our important work to support real human rights victims.

00:32:41.960 One of the things that we do at U.N. Watch is we bring human rights victims from China, Cuba, Russia, Venezuela, Pakistan, Iran,

00:32:48.580 to testify at the U.N. so that actually the voiceless who are being shut out by the U.N. bodies,

00:32:54.420 as they're electing their oppressors and dictators, we bring the victims and those who've just come out of prison,

00:32:59.700 political prisoners, amazing, courageous people, we bring them to testify to the United Nations.

00:33:04.340 And folks who support us will be supporting not just U.N. reform and U.N. accountability,

00:33:09.600 but we'll be supporting real human rights work to help the real victims.

00:33:13.400 Thank you so much, Mr. Neuer, not just for coming on this show, which I am appreciative of,

00:33:18.680 but also for all the work that you do and that U.N. Watch does.

00:33:21.860 I know people learned a lot from this conversation, so thank you so much.

00:33:25.740 My pleasure. Thank you.

00:33:31.900 All right, guys, I know that you enjoyed that conversation.

00:33:35.000 I know I did.

00:33:35.780 I learned a lot as I was listening to him, especially that line about Orwell,

00:33:42.280 a whole or a half a piece of bread is better than no bread, 1.00

00:33:44.920 and just how moral relativism and cultural relativism forces us to be very stupid 0.99

00:33:51.900 when it comes to understanding right and wrong, 0.97

00:33:55.700 that we are so afraid of criticizing certain countries because of this idea of Western privilege

00:34:03.400 and our guilt about Western colonialism or imperialism that we are unwilling today

00:34:11.940 in this postmodern mentality that all of us have just been affected by in the West.

00:34:19.860 We are so afraid of criticizing regimes outside of the West for any bad they have done.

00:34:25.380 We try to draw some kind of equivalence between what happens in China today,

00:34:31.980 enslaving people, colonizing other countries, getting them in debt traps to be able to control them, 0.98

00:34:39.280 taking away or refusing to acknowledge any idea of objective human rights in their own country.

00:34:46.400 We try to draw some equivalence between that and then what happens here in the United States,

00:34:51.820 and there is no equivalence, but that's what postmodernism,

00:34:55.100 that's what a disbelief in absolute truth, an objective reality, an objective morality,

00:35:02.100 that's what moral relativism, cultural relativism does.

00:35:05.440 And that is the result of rejecting the idea of a supreme moral lawgiver,

00:35:10.780 as C.S. Lewis puts it in Mere Christianity,

00:35:13.400 the idea that all of our rights come from somewhere.

00:35:15.920 They're not given to us by governments, but they're recognized by governments,

00:35:20.520 in particular in the United States, by the Constitution,

00:35:23.100 and that there is an authority that is higher than earthly authorities.

00:35:27.800 That is where we get any kind of agreement on an objective,

00:35:32.820 inherent human right that needs to be protected.

00:35:35.620 Once you take away the idea of a source of human rights,

00:35:39.460 then everything is up for grabs.

00:35:41.280 We all become our own gods.

00:35:43.100 Everything from truth and morality to science becomes subjective.

00:35:51.120 It becomes up for interpretation,

00:35:52.720 and you can see the chaos and the confusion that that would wage.

00:35:56.220 And there's always going to be contradictions within that,

00:35:58.760 that simultaneously you see some countries saying,

00:36:01.240 well, I can't criticize, you know, what's happening in some countries in Africa

00:36:05.020 or what's happening in Russia because, you know,

00:36:07.400 we've got our own problems here in the United States,

00:36:09.980 whatever it is, but I can absolutely criticize the United States

00:36:13.920 and I can absolutely criticize Israel. 0.74

00:36:16.720 It's this leftist, moral, relativist, contradictory, postmodern mentality

00:36:23.680 and worldview that is constantly tripping over itself to make any sense

00:36:28.140 and in the process actually looks over real human rights atrocities.

00:36:34.320 And it has real consequences, as we talked about with Mr. Neuer.

00:36:39.380 And so when I asked him, hey, you know, what can we do?

00:36:42.640 Of course, I encourage you to do all the things that he told us to do,

00:36:45.960 but also as Christians, like preach the gospel.

00:36:49.460 Of course, not just to change things politically,

00:36:52.720 but the only way people are going to realize,

00:36:56.120 oh, we have to look to an objective, supreme, transcendent moral lawgiver

00:37:00.040 in order to tell us what right and wrong is,

00:37:02.820 in order to give us any kind of idea what morality is,

00:37:07.900 then hearts have to change.

00:37:09.960 Hearts have to be softened by the gospel.

00:37:12.260 People have to be seeking after truth.

00:37:14.560 They have to be looking towards the source of truth.

00:37:17.480 I mean, there are two things that I think could change culture very powerfully.

00:37:22.560 The first one is piety, the seeking after God, the obeying God,

00:37:27.540 a longing for relationship with God through Jesus Christ and obedience to him.

00:37:33.540 And the second is patriotism, caring about your country,

00:37:37.600 caring about the values of your country,

00:37:40.640 caring about the ideals upon which you were,

00:37:43.500 upon which your country was founded.

00:37:46.340 Patriotism and piety have so drastically deteriorated

00:37:50.520 over the past few decades in the United States

00:37:53.920 and have been replaced by postmodernism,

00:37:56.820 that we no longer care.

00:37:58.600 We no longer want to fight for our ideals 1.00

00:38:00.780 because critical race theory and all the stupid academic theories 1.00

00:38:04.880 that are being pushed down our throats from kindergarten through grad school 1.00

00:38:08.560 are unfortunately, they are convincing us

00:38:13.740 that those things aren't worth fighting for,

00:38:17.060 that America is so bad, that the Constitution is so corrupt,

00:38:21.760 and that we don't represent any kind of virtue whatsoever, 0.50

00:38:25.380 that it really doesn't matter if these corrupt regimes take over.

00:38:29.320 And it really doesn't matter if we lend legitimacy

00:38:31.660 to somewhere like Saudi Arabia or China or Russia.

00:38:35.920 That is unfortunately what moral relativism does.

00:38:39.260 It makes hearts of stone and brains of mush.

00:38:42.080 And the only way to rectify that is to return and repent to God,

00:38:48.380 the creator and sustainer of all things,

00:38:50.880 the source of morality and truth.

00:38:52.820 And so there's a spiritual aspect certainly to all of this.

00:38:56.260 Well, I just wanted to finish with that

00:38:59.360 because I was thinking about that as he was speaking,

00:39:01.460 but I hope you enjoyed this episode and enjoyed this conversation.

00:39:03.860 And we will be back here soon.

00:39:05.200 Bye.

Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - May 26, 2021

Ep 427 ｜ The Hidden Corruption of the United Nations ｜ Guest： Hillel Neuer

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