Ep 484 ｜ Bombshell on Dr. Fauci & the Wuhan Lab Explained ｜ Guest： Steve Deace
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Summary
Steve Dacey breaks down a bombshell report from a left-wing outlet called The Intercept about the funding of gene engineering research at the Wuhan lab in China, and how possibly, probably, it's looking like Dr. Francis Fauci lied to Congress when he said he was not directing the funding for this kind of dangerous research.
Transcript
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Hey guys, welcome to Relatable. Happy Wednesday. Hope everyone is having a wonderful week today.
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In just a little bit, I'm talking to Steve Dace. You've heard him on the podcast at least a couple
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times before. He is going to break down this bombshell report from a left-wing outlet called
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The Intercept about the funding of gain-of-function research at the Wuhan lab in China and how
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possibly, probably, it's looking like Dr. Fauci actually lied before Congress when he said that
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he was not directing the funding of this kind of very dangerous research in Wuhan that very well
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could have led to the coronavirus outbreak. I mean, it's crazy, crazy. It does kind of seem like the
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dam is breaking in some ways, and Steve Dace is going to break that all down. I do have a couple
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other things to talk about before we get to that conversation in regards to COVID. And look, I
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understand. I'm sometimes tired of talking about COVID. We took a long break. We decided not to talk
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about COVID for several months because it just seems like there were other things going on,
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and there was really nothing new to report. But now, over the past few months, it's kind of gotten
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interesting again just because we are seeing some people on the left side of the aisle start to
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question the mainstream narrative that this came from bat soup and that there was nothing that we
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could do to treat it. And the only people that we should be listening to are the bureaucrats at the
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NIH and the CDC who have never actually treated any patients, that Dr. Fauci can do no wrong,
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that the only thing that we can hang our hats on is the vaccine, and everyone should absolutely be
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forced to get the vaccine, that young children are dying in droves. All of this we have been told to
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accept for a very long time. And if you question the mandates, if you bring up freedom, personal
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liberty at all, if you bring up the economy, if you bring up other factors that maybe our politicians
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and representatives should consider when they are deciding on public policy, you are called an
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anti-vaxxer, you are called an anti-masker, you're called a conspiracy theorist who just wants old
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people to die. Never mind the fact that governors like Andrew Cuomo and other Democratic governors
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actually enforced policy that allowed older elderly hospital patients who tested positive for coronavirus
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to be placed back into nursing homes before they actually recovered, spreading COVID and killing
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thousands of elderly people in New York and in other states where this happened. We had to ignore
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that. And instead, COVID and COVID policy has really just been used as a political tool to bludgeon half
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the country or not even just conservatives. It's not just about your political affiliation, but really
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anyone who questions the mainstream dogma on all of this. You got censored a year ago if you were
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talking about, hey, maybe this was actually a lab leak from Wuhan and now it's come out, yeah, it was
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probably most likely a lab leak. Like this probably didn't happen naturally in nature. I mean, you got
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your YouTube videos taken down, you got kicked off Twitter. If you were talking about the possibility
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of something other than natural origins being the start of this disease. And you certainly have been
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written off as a kook if you are a doctor who is actually treating patients who have who has talked
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about any kind of therapeutic other than the vaccine. I mean, we are talking about doctors who I
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think are raising very legitimate questions asking, hang on, why are people in these bureaucratic
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entities at the NIH and the CDC dictating what doctors on the ground are doing rather than the
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other way around? Dr. Fauci has never actually treated a COVID patient. Shouldn't we be listening
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to, for example, these ICU doctors who are saying, OK, here's the protocol that I've actually used on
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patients that I've actually seen work? These are doctors who are certainly not anti-vaccine and
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they're probably not even anti-COVID vaccine, but they're just saying, hey, there are therapeutic
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options that have worked. I mean, we've seen such an assault on something like ivermectin. And like I
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said yesterday, I am not promoting ivermectin. I've never taken ivermectin. I have personally never
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recommended that someone with COVID take ivermectin. I'm not saying that. I'm not a doctor. I am not
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trying to tell you to get medical advice from me. I am saying that there is a legitimate debate to be
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had around ivermectin and around other kinds of therapeutics that is not being had. Instead,
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it is just being written off as exclusively horse paste or a dewormer in dogs and horses and is not
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considering that it actually has been. A form of ivermectin has been used on millions of people
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throughout the world, yes, to treat parasites, but some doctors, and again, I'm not even endorsing this.
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I'm just saying there are some doctors who have treated their patients with this who have said,
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okay, yes, it is primarily an anti-parasite drug, but it also has these properties that are actually
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helping people recover from COVID. I'm just saying maybe we should also listen to people
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that have actually treated people. I'm just saying maybe we should have an open debate and people
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shouldn't be scared. Doctors on the ground who are treating their patients shouldn't be scared to
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come forward and say, here's my experience. Here's what I have done to try to save people's
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lives. Maybe those people shouldn't be censored. Maybe we should be allowed to listen to those
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people. Maybe their testimonies before Congress shouldn't be taken off YouTube. By who? Okay,
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I don't have medical expertise. I'm not pretending to, but neither do the people at YouTube.
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What do they know? And again, why is the CDC dictating YouTube policy that is then dictating what you
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and I can hear from doctors who have actually treated patients with COVID? It doesn't make
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any sense until you see that I'm not saying all public health policy or all push for vaccines or
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all push for masks has to do with control. I'm not saying that's everyone's motivation who is
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pushing for those things. I am not. As I've said many times, I am not an anti-vaccine person. I'm not
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even in every single situation, anti-wearing a mask. I am pro looking at the data. I am pro
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common sense. I am pro debate. I am pro listening to actual experts, not just bureaucrats. That's what
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I am pro. And yes, I am pro liberty when it comes to a lot of the policies that just don't seem to
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align with actual mitigation of the spread of COVID, as we've talked about many times. And I am,
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I am, I will say, I am hopeful that maybe the dam is breaking in some ways. You know, we talked and
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have talked several times about how the science just does not support kids wearing masks. And the
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counter that I typically get to that is, well, kids can get COVID. Yes, kids can get COVID. Kids are
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less at risk of dying from COVID than the 40 year old who has been fully vaccinated. As we talked
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about and cited our source on last week, kids are still at very low risk. And still you get the CDC
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coming out and saying, oh, you know, the, the rate of deaths, pediatric deaths from COVID are much
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higher. They say that, but then when you actually click on the link, they tweeted about this and Matt
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Walsh actually pointed this out that we'll know the rate isn't actually higher. The overall number
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is higher, but the rate itself isn't higher that even with the Delta variant, we're not seeing kids
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get sicker than usual. What we are seeing is a surge of RSV. And so some kids, unfortunately, very sadly
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are dying from RSV. RSV is much more serious statistically for young kids, especially infants under the age of
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six months, six months than COVID is. Some of those kids are going to the hospital, going to the ICU
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and dying from RSV. They happen to be testing positive for COVID. They could be asymptomatic as
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far as COVID goes, but they're getting a serious case of RSV. And yet those kids are still counted
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as COVID cases. How do I know this? Because if you actually look at the statistics from the CDC on
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pediatric deaths, what you will see is that there have been a little over 400 kids who have died,
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their words, with COVID. So that means we don't know if they died of COVID. They just died with COVID.
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And so all of these things are things to consider. And I am hopeful that, like I said, that the dam is
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breaking and that people are realizing that a lot of the policies that we have implemented in the U.S.
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to try to, quote, mitigate the spread of COVID among kids is not actually founded in any real logic or
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data that a lot of it has to do with control. A lot of it has to do with fear-based reflexes. A lot of it
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has to do with teachers' unions. We already know the teachers' unions have dictated some of what the CDC
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has tried to set as policy. We are the only developed nation that I know of that requires kids to wear
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masks as young as two. You're not going to see that in Australia where there are very strict measures for
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COVID. You don't see that in the U.K. You don't see that anywhere in Scandinavia. You don't see that
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in the Netherlands. You really don't see that anywhere because even the WHO says that, you know,
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you're not supposed to mask kids under the age of five. And yet for some reason in the United States,
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we have pushed it down to babies, babies wearing masks. And some people thankfully are waking up to
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how ridiculous that is. We already quoted the New Yorker, which is a left-wing, it's a left-wing
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publication that a couple of weeks ago came out, looked at the CDC study that shows that mask
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mandates at schools is not making any difference whatsoever in the lowering the spread of the virus.
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There was another article in The Atlantic, which I would say is center-left. I think it sometimes
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it has some, you know, it allows for more conservative takes on things, but I certainly
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would not call it a conservative outlet. And they had an article run on September 2nd by Vinay Prasad
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that says the downsides of masking young students are real. It goes through what we've already talked
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about, that we really aren't seeing kids get sicker from the Delta variant than from the original
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variant. And says this, no scientific consensus exists about the wisdom of mandatory masking rules
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for school children. The World Health Organization, as we already stated, which recommends that children
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12 and older wear masks under the same circumstances that adults do, specifically advises against masking
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kids age five and younger. Many European nations have been taking the agency's advice. But for
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some reason, the American Academy of Pediatrics and the CDC here in the United States calls for kids
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age two and up to wear a mask. And as the author of the New York Magazine article noted, that author
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tried to reach out to the CDC and the American Academy of Pediatrics asking, hey, what's your data?
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Like, what's your science behind kids two years old wearing masks? And they didn't respond. They sent some,
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you know, some PDF about, oh, well, you know, kids can't get the vaccine yet. And so they need to wear
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masks. I don't understand the motivation behind this. If it's not science. Is it really just some
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sociopathic need for control? I truly can't relate to that. I've talked to my husband about that. People
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who just want control, who just want power for the sake of having power and for the sake of having control
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over other people's lives. First of all, that's a telltale sign of an abuser. I'm talking about these
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bureaucrats, sociopaths who just want power for the sake of power. I just can't relate to that.
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That's why one reason why I find it so ridiculous when people say, oh, pro-lifers just want power over
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women's choices. No, I don't. No, I don't. I don't care what you do as long as you're not
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killing a child. Yeah, then I care. I feel an obligation to speak up for the voiceless. But I truly
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don't understand what could be the motivation behind, if it's not science, two-year-olds wearing
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masks against all reason, against all data that we have, unless it's just this sick obsession with
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controlling people. I really don't understand. And I do think that there is this kind of
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propaganda push. It's a little subliminal right now. They're making the preliminary case that
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children should also be forced to be vaccinated. And so they're talking about pediatric hospitalizations,
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leaving out the context of why kids are actually being hospitalized. They're talking about COVID cases
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rising among students, and they're talking about the masks. And they're also talking about how the
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people who are unvaccinated are harming the kids under the age of 12 who haven't been vaccinated yet.
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When again, that just doesn't make sense. They're really not at risk. Statistically,
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they're not at risk of getting serious cases of COVID and dying from COVID. Really, like I said,
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they are less likely to die from COVID than the fully vaccinated person over the age of 30.
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So this idea that those who are not vaccinated are the ones that are hurting those who are vaccinated,
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it really just doesn't make sense. Knowing what we know, if the vaccine is effective at all,
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even if it's losing some efficacy, if it is effective, the way that we've been told that it's
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effective to prevent you from getting seriously ill. But if you can still get COVID, and you can still
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spread COVID, if you're vaccinated, then number one, how do you know that it's the unvaccinated
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getting people sick, if you can still get and spread COVID? And number two, why do you care?
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If the vaccine works, then why do people who are vaccinated, if I'm vaccinated, why do I care if
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you give me COVID? Because if I believe that my vaccine works, then I shouldn't care whether or not
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you choose to get vaccinated or not. Like, it doesn't make sense. It's all you'll use as this
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political bludgeon against people that you disagree with, and people that you want to try
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to demonize. And yet, as we have mentioned many times, this is not, I know the New York Times and
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CNN, they want you to think that it's only, you know, white evangelical Trump supporters who are not
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getting the vaccine. And yes, I think that probably makes up a good proportion of people not getting the
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vaccine. But the lowest vaccination rate that we have by race is they're Black Americans. And I'm
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not condemning that at all. I think it's your choice. But people should probably keep in mind when you're
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talking about the unvaccinated being scum and not being able to get the health care that they need if
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they get sick and not being allowed into certain spaces. As for example, journalist Max Boot has argued
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for that everyone needs a smartphone with their vaccination status on an app on it. Like, you are
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talking about disproportionately discriminating against Black Americans because disproportionately
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they're unvaccinated. That's just the truth. And here's one trick that I have seen the media do
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when they're talking about vaccination rates. So they'll go through all of the races to say who has
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not been vaccinated. And the only subcategory that they will use is white evangelicals. So they won't
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talk about the subcategory of Asian evangelicals or Black evangelicals. They'll say, okay, here's the
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vaccination rate amongst Asians, which is, by the way, highest of any group in the country, by the way.
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Here's the vaccination rate among Hispanic people. Here's the vaccination rate among Black people.
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Here's the vaccination rate among white evangelicals. Why white evangelicals? Because it helps them
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make their case, because I guess there is a greater proportion of white evangelicals who haven't been
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vaccinated than Black Americans as a whole. And so again, you see how this is just used as a political
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tool. And it's really just, it's such a shame that all of this is being politicized, that some people
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won't let go of the so-called mitigation measures because it has become a measure of holiness for them.
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And it's become a way to tell other people that they really love their neighbor, that they're really
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compassionate and that other people who don't wear two masks and don't get three vaccines and don't
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keep their kids home from school and don't double mask their two-year-old are unholy. It's really such
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a shame that we have allowed these things to become symbols of virtue. And again, I'm not saying that we
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shouldn't take any measures or that you shouldn't personally take any measures. You might feel compelled
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to get a third vaccine and that's all well and good, but you don't get to use that to call the rest
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of the country bad or stupid or selfish when the data just isn't there to say that those things are
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the only way to stop the spread of the virus and to try to encroach on other people's liberty. Other
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people can read too. Like other people can look at data. I'm not saying that people should just rely on
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their own hunches when it comes to public health, but other people can look at scientific data, can
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look at the studies, can listen to doctors on the ground and make their own decisions. And if you're
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not allowing for people to have liberty in that way, then I have to question whether or not you really
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care about liberty at all. And I certainly think that for some people who want to put the strictest
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restrictions on people in the name of public health truly don't care about liberty, not just in the
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United States, but also around the world. All right. That was just a random monologue that I
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wanted to get off my chest, but we're going to talk to Steve Dace again about this bombshell from
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The Intercept. And he's got a lot to say as usual. It's going to blow your mind without further ado.
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Steve, thank you so much for joining us again. Every episode that you are on of Relatable, people
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rave about. They're always some of our most popular episodes. So thank you so much for-
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Yes. Thank you so much for talking about this. I just want to hear your whole take on The Big
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Intercept story and what it all means. Well, I think the first thing we have to do is set
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the context of who The Intercept is. I mean, Politico accused The Intercept back in 2019 of
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trying to start a democratic civil war. It's kind of known for attacking the Democratic Party from
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the left. It's an uber-progressive site. One of its co-founders is a sort of an Andrew Sullivan
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type of gay activist named Glenn Greenwald. He ended up resigning from his own publication back
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in 2019, I think it was, because they didn't want to print the truth about stuff, just Democratic Party
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propaganda. And so now you see him on Tucker Carlson on a regular basis. So this is not a
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right-wing publication. Allie, I would guess in you and I's combined careers, the amount of times we
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have affirmatively cited The Intercept as an entity to base any of our show content off.
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We can probably count on all of our single-hand digits here, appendages. So it's not something we
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typically go to. This is from the other side. And what they found through a FOIA, Freedom of
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Information Act, what they found through over 900 documents is that it's very clear that Anthony
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Fauci and Francis Collins, head of the NIH and NIAID, that they, through a company called EcoHealth,
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directly funded gain-of-function research that was occurring not just at the Wuhan Institute of
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Virology, but at a third previously unknown lab where this was taking place specifically to inject
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mice with bat coronaviruses in order to find out what would cause these things to spill over. That's a
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term I use in Fauci and bargain when we talked about the Wuhan lab and we wrote this book. It
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came out six months ago. It wasn't just the gain-of-function research. Everybody's focused
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on that term, Allie, but it's the purpose of it. They were specifically provoking bat coronaviruses
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to find out what would cause them to mutate into humans. They wanted to know this. So it's not just a
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dangerous methodology, but the purpose of it as well. And I think the best analogy that I can give
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is it's a little bit like not just testing an atom bomb on Bikini Island back in the 40s,
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but actually leaving the people on the island in order to find out, hey, what would cause radiation
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sickness and poisoning? Because remember this, more people live in Wuhan, China than live in all of
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Israel or all of Sweden. It is more populated than the state of Michigan, and that's just the city of
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Wuhan. And yet they were conducting these experiments, so dangerous, in a lab in such
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a heavily, densely populated area. And Dr. Fauci lied about this, it seems like, before Congress,
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correct? I don't see how there's any possible doubt that he is guilty of lying in perjury to Congress,
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given the information that is in the intercept. The only way I would see that this would not be the
00:22:06.300
case is if they just manufactured these 900 documents, specifically the two, or the ones
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that implicate the two agencies that he's a part of. Remember, NIH oversees Fauci's organization,
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NIAID. Gotcha. And is anything going to happen to Dr. Fauci? Will he actually be held to account for
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this, do you think? Well, I mean, this is the same thing we saw, whether it's the Brett Kavanaugh
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hoax, the Russian collusion hoax. And I say this to my audience all the time, Allie, we are not a
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nation of laws, and we never have been. We are a nation of political will, and we always will be.
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Does anyone have the will to do something about this? And ultimately, that's, you know, that comes
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down to not just when Democrats are in control, but, you know, we watched a Supreme Court justice's
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character absolutely slammed and smeared with no evidence whatsoever. And even under the previous
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Republican president, Julie Swetnick, who went on national TV and accused Brett Kavanaugh of being
00:23:05.620
a marauding gang rapist, she's still out walking the streets free as a bird, just as you and I are,
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at least as free as you can be in COVID stand. So ultimately, that comes down to a question of
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political will. Right. And I think that the political will, or at least some Republicans are
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asserting to have the political will, but it does make you question, like, how deep does this
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corruption and secrecy really go? How many people knew about this funding of the gain of function
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research just didn't say anything about it? I mean, is the bureaucracy just out to protect the
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bureaucracy, no matter whether they have an R or a D by them by their name? Is it really the people
00:23:47.500
against the system? Or are there some people in charge who actually care enough to push for
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accountability? I think the answer to that question is clearly yes. The fact that a lot of regime or
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state-approved media has completely ignored this report from a very left-wing publication,
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I think that just answers your question as well. The fact that he faced no questions from
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any legacy, talking about Anthony Fauci, from any legacy media apparatus that I'm aware of
00:24:19.140
yesterday during the news cycle, I think answers that question. Keep in mind, here's what's
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fascinating about this. And I think this needs to be hammered home to audiences like yours and mine.
00:24:29.660
This is not, the virus doesn't care how you voted. Three of the top four states for deaths in America
00:24:35.800
are governed by Democrats. 11 of the top 20 states for deaths in America by COVID are governed by
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Republicans. It doesn't care. Politicizing this doesn't matter. People are suffering right and left,
00:24:47.040
both from the virus, but then also from the mitigation efforts and the backside impact of
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those like depression and suicides. Again, the tragedy doesn't care what your political stance
00:24:59.600
is. And the fact is that the two major media entities that have provided us the greatest and
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most thorough glimpse of the true origins of the virus are both from the left. It was Vanity Fair
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earlier this year and now from The Intercept. And yet still, and this is why I don't think
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things are just as simple anymore as our right-left paradigm that we're used to.
00:25:20.400
This is what you just said. It's really the system and what I call a spirit of the age and a certain
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narrative versus really the people of Western civilization. And that's why you're seeing certain
00:25:31.120
things, even if they come from the left. I mean, right now the Biden administration is drowning
00:25:35.660
in its COVID policy. Tomorrow it plans on launching a new initiative for how to confront Delta variant.
00:25:41.460
In a normal political environment, they would have blamed their lack of success and the waning efficacy
00:25:48.820
of these vaccines from what we saw in the human trials. They would have found a scapegoat. They
00:25:53.240
would have used a story like The Intercept to blame it on Anthony Fauci. They'd have thrown him
00:25:57.420
under the bus by now in order to save their own political hides, brought somebody else in who was
00:26:02.840
newer and shinier and started over. That's what a Bill Clinton would have done. That's what a lot of
00:26:08.100
politicians would have done up until this most recent era, where it's very clear that something
00:26:13.300
is happening in our culture beyond the normal ebbs and flows of politics. This is cosmic. This
00:26:19.740
is spiritual. And I think that you can see that even when people will not act in their own political
00:26:24.840
self-interest, something else is occurring here.
00:26:35.880
It's very strange how many different levels there are to this. And some of them seem specific to
00:26:42.220
America. Some of them don't. Obviously, we've seen draconian lockdowns elsewhere, especially in
00:26:47.520
Australia. And yet Australia is a little strange because at the same time, we've seen Australian news
00:26:53.040
outlets actually try to dig into the origins of coronavirus in the way that the mainstream media
00:26:58.000
here in the United States simply have not. And yet at the same time, they are basically reverting
00:27:04.940
back to their original police state by locking people down because of, you know, one case or one
00:27:12.540
death. And then also they are not forcing kids under the age of 12 to wear masks. They are following
00:27:19.700
the WHO's guidance on that. And yet here in the United States, two-year-olds are supposed to wear
00:27:24.380
masks. And so actually, it seems like even though there are some states in the U.S. that have allowed
00:27:30.160
some freedom for their citizens, it really seems like a lot of the confusion, a lot of the politicization
00:27:37.860
of all of this, a lot of the just lack of logic and correlation to any real data is specific to the U.S.
00:27:47.380
And it reminds me of something that you said. I talked to you on the show after January 6th,
00:27:52.800
and I remember you saying that there is something strange going on in this country. And the minds of
00:28:00.000
a lot of people in this country, they just don't want to know the truth. Like they just don't want
00:28:04.860
to see the truth about things. And I just, that stuck with me because I think it's true. What do you
00:28:10.140
think that is? Why do you think so many people are afraid of looking at what's happening in the United
00:28:16.460
States, especially as it comes to the kinds of policies and the terrible reporting that we've
00:28:20.500
seen surrounding all of this? Let me just put a finer point on the fine point that you just made.
00:28:26.160
When, if I want to get data for vaccinated versus unvaccinated, for example, I got to go to
00:28:30.940
the Israeli dashboard and translate Hebrew. I have to go to the United Kingdom dashboard. I can't get
00:28:37.180
that from my own CDC here in the United States. Most states won't even let you go on their own
00:28:43.380
Department of Health dashboards and let us know what that data indicates. A few do like Oregon.
00:28:49.540
And what they're showing is about one out of four hospitalizations are unvaccinated. But over and
00:28:54.660
over again, I've had to, over the last 18 months now of going down this COVID stand rabbit hole,
00:29:00.280
I've had to use countries like Denmark and others to actually get real data that I have not been able
00:29:05.720
to get from my own country, at least not at the same speed that other countries are offering it.
00:29:10.880
And I think the greatest example of what you're talking about is Sweden. You know, it was,
00:29:15.100
it was not maybe 10, 15 years ago, early in my career, moving from sports to politics. I did a
00:29:20.840
debate in Wichita, Kansas. This was during the Occupy movement and I debated an occupier and his
00:29:27.120
entire point was he wanted America to be more like Sweden. My whole career in this business,
00:29:32.200
I've heard lefty say Sweden is what America needs to be more like. And now you can't, you can't get a lot
00:29:37.720
of these people to acknowledge at least ones in the network in legacy media. It's like Sweden does
00:29:43.280
not exist. Sweden has reported a total of 42 COVID deaths this summer, the whole summer. That's what
00:29:51.420
they've reported. And it's the least masked country in Europe. They are undergoing a vaccination
00:29:56.500
surge right now, but they're barely over 50% of their population vaccinated. They never did mass
00:30:02.720
lockdowns last year, as everyone knows, like the rest of the world did. And so I really believe,
00:30:07.760
and I used a phrase earlier here with you, and it's what I use on my program frequently.
00:30:12.740
I believe that you're seeing a spirit of the age at work and this level of deception, this level of
00:30:18.620
double-mindedness where you walk into a room and when a, when a room is chloroformed, you can't
00:30:23.680
breathe. It has no oxygen. And that's really what's happened to the truth in our culture. It's been
00:30:28.640
chloroformed. It's like absent. We're not immoral either. We're like amoral. It's like absent any
00:30:33.620
standards, absent any objective reasoning or truths. To me, that's all demonic. And I use the
00:30:39.800
phrase spirit of the age as sort of a colloquialism to kind of describe basically the physical
00:30:46.100
manifestation of what I really believe is the demonic intrusion and invasion of our culture.
00:30:52.480
And people, I guess, how do you, the question is, how do you know when you're being deceived? You
00:30:57.460
don't. That's the nature of deception. But even trying to wake people up by saying, you know,
00:31:03.140
for example, I went back and forth with a pediatrician who listens to the show, very kind
00:31:07.900
woman who was upset when I was talking about the different studies that show that, hey, kids don't
00:31:12.420
really need to be wearing masks. And a bunch of our peer countries don't force kids to wear masks.
00:31:17.260
The WHO, which I think is a corrupt organization, even says that kids under five should absolutely not
00:31:22.360
be wearing masks. And, you know, here's the data. Let's look at the different, you know, the
00:31:27.920
different statistics supporting this assertion that kids shouldn't wear masks. And, you know,
00:31:33.100
she came to me and she was very upset about this. And so I said, OK, what contrary data kind of do you
00:31:39.420
have? Do you have to support your argument that kids as young as two should be wearing masks? This is
00:31:44.480
someone who is a Christian, a conservative, and she did not have any. What she kept on coming back with
00:31:49.700
is, well, you know, kids are getting it or kids can spread it to older people. And I kept on trying
00:31:56.060
to go back to, OK, but what does that have to say about masks? Are you telling me that you've seen
00:32:00.880
data that masks work? And she just kept avoiding the question. And what I realized is that people
00:32:05.440
who accepted at the very beginning that everyone has to be masked, they cannot let that go because
00:32:11.600
it's just become a part of some people's worldview. It's become, for some people, a religion,
00:32:17.260
an outward sign of their virtue that it does not matter. It doesn't matter how much data you show
00:32:23.420
them, especially now when it pertains to the vaccines. That's another tier of holiness that
00:32:27.140
people feel like they have accomplished and they can use to bludgeon, you know, the unholy people
00:32:32.220
who don't get the vaccine. They won't let it go. And that's what I fear, that this is truly never
00:32:37.420
ending, because like religious zealots, we've got about half of the country that is clinging to this
00:32:43.700
stuff and no data can change their mind. What you just described, to use an old-fashioned
00:32:48.640
stained glass window term, that's classic idolatry. Right. If you walked into this pediatrician's
00:32:54.460
office and demanded that she remove the spleen of your child and said that the spleen and pointed to
00:33:03.480
your child's arm and said, hey, my child has a really bad sore on their arm. That's their spleen.
00:33:10.200
Remove the spleen from their arm. She would say, ma'am, sir, your child's spleen is not in their
00:33:16.340
arm. You don't know what you're talking about. She would, she would maybe take you to an anatomy
00:33:20.120
book. She would show you an objective framework to prove to you that your psychosis, your fear is
00:33:27.200
not rational, is not backed by any reason, science, or data that your child doesn't need their spleen
00:33:32.580
removed because they have a sore on their arm. Right. That's, that's what she would do in another
00:33:36.960
context. And yet, when it comes to this symbol, this talisman, she reverts to a form of humanistic,
00:33:45.580
emotion-driven dogma, sentiment that isn't backed by any of that objective information
00:33:51.080
whatsoever. It's the same thing you get when you, this is why I said earlier, the, the traditional
00:33:57.740
Venn diagram here doesn't add up because I used to go after, um, you know, lefty physicians that would
00:34:04.320
come on my local show back in the day and argue for abortion. And, and they would say, and I would
00:34:09.360
say, well, how do you know when life begins? And they had no answer for me. And I said, how come
00:34:13.080
when you walk into an OR, you accept objective truth? You understand that you cannot operate on
00:34:19.980
the patient based on what you think the patient's anatomy is, but instead what the anatomy actually
00:34:25.880
is. And if you act on your own instinct, as opposed to objective truth, you're going to kill
00:34:30.320
someone and be sued out of business. But when I ask you a point blank question, does that being
00:34:34.640
with a heartbeat, is that person alive? You can't answer that when there's no more objective standard
00:34:40.280
for determining life or death of a human on this planet than the existence of a heartbeat. It's
00:34:45.540
because there's idolatry there and there is no objective reason or data that you can get to reason
00:34:51.980
with people that ultimately is a spiritual problem. And a lot of our people are in the grips of this.
00:34:59.220
They don't want to let this go. This has provided a form of meaning. It also shows,
00:35:03.640
hey, was I had, was I fooled by something? That's, this is the amount of idolatry that is at work and
00:35:10.420
at stake here. It's, it is absolutely breathtaking. And when it comes to kids, let me throw this stat
00:35:16.540
at your audience. This will blow your minds. Okay. Last month, CDC reported a little over 400
00:35:23.900
children had died so far. A little over 400 minors had died so far with COVID. And now keep in mind,
00:35:30.760
that just means that when they died, they tested positive for COVID. It doesn't mean it was the
00:35:34.800
underlying cause of their death, but we'll count them over just a little over 400 children died.
00:35:40.320
About a week later, NASA announced that a meteor, there was the odds of a meteor coming to earth and
00:35:49.020
creating an extinction level event in the year 2300. I ran the math on this. Now this is data from two
00:35:55.960
government organizations. All right. There is, Ali, 12,000 high percent odds higher that a meteor will
00:36:04.280
strike the earth and create an extinction level event in the year 2300, according to NASA. Then there is
00:36:11.420
a child in America will die with COVID according to CDC, 12,000% odds higher, 12,000%. The data here,
00:36:23.220
and when you point this out to people, their reactions all too often demonstrate right away,
00:36:29.900
it's a, it's, it's a withering, it's a winnowing fork, you know, right away, who is still open for
00:36:34.600
business when it comes to reason and data. And then who is closed off because of idolatry right before
00:36:39.640
you and I began taping Robert F. Kennedy jr. Noted leftist said that at this point, if we continue
00:36:46.800
on with COVID stand, we're going to kill all critical thinking in America. And I thought to
00:36:50.180
myself, I cannot believe this. I've, I've lived long enough to see everything. I, when I was state
00:36:55.440
are going to both be ranked top 10 teams on Saturday, never thought I'd see that in my home state.
00:36:59.040
And now I'm like, amen to RFK jr. But that is, that's where we are right now.
00:37:05.480
Yeah. And that's surprising, you know, not just on, on politics. He says several things. I would say
00:37:10.660
that probably you disagree with, and I disagree with, but anyone who says that critical thinking
00:37:15.920
is going to die either a slow or a swift death is absolutely true. That pronouncement is true.
00:37:21.540
There are a lot of things that I want to keep talking to you about, but with the limited time
00:37:34.140
that we have left, I'm wondering based on the data that we have, especially like you said,
00:37:38.320
data coming out of Israel that shows that natural immunity is much better, much stronger than the
00:37:44.260
immunity that we are seeing from the vaccine. Knowing that bit of information and knowing what
00:37:48.800
you know about theology, I would love to hear your reaction to David French's article from a
00:37:55.100
couple of weeks ago that says, you know, if you don't get the vaccine, you are not loving your
00:38:01.260
neighbor. You are selfish. And I think basically came out in favor of at least employer level
00:38:10.200
I make it a, just a policy in general to mute, ignore, and tune out anyone who makes a moral
00:38:20.880
liberty-based case for mentally ill men dressing as women and, uh, and grabbing stripper poles in
00:38:29.720
front of children and twerking in front of them at a public library. Let me, let me specify that
00:38:35.700
really fast. So people know what you're talking about. What he is talking about is David French.
00:38:40.720
And I brought this up to David French as well. He said a couple of years ago, um, I think it was a
00:38:44.720
couple of years ago that basically the fact that a drag queen can do drag queen story hour in a library
00:38:51.000
is, um, a blessing of Liberty, but this is something we have to accept. Yes. We just have to accept that
00:38:57.920
contribution to delinquency of our minors. We just have to accept that. I think there's just some
00:39:02.800
things you say or do in life that until you acknowledge their repugnancy and make amends for
00:39:10.840
them, you just become automatically disqualified for being taken seriously. And I think that is
00:39:17.780
one of them. Now, if someone in general who hasn't made such an asinine and absurd claim has a question
00:39:25.040
along those lines, this would be my answer. If you look at the 10 command, first of all, the first
00:39:30.200
commandment, all right, is to love the Lord. You're the greatest commandment. Jesus says the Lord,
00:39:34.820
love the Lord, your God, while I heart, soul, mind, and strength. So that comes first in order to do
00:39:40.120
that. How do I do that? Well, a key component of that is faithful obedience. Jesus says, why do you
00:39:45.340
call me Lord? If you do not do what I say, if you look at the commandments, they include things like
00:39:50.920
don't bear false witness. Um, they include things like don't turn, don't fashion false gods.
00:39:57.520
All right. The vaccines do still, even in their waning efficacy, I'm confident enough to say
00:40:04.040
that it will lessen the risk of you. If you get it, you, you yourself, you yourself of contracting a
00:40:12.060
severe reaction to COVID nowhere near what they promised us in the human trials last year.
00:40:17.980
But I still say, particularly if you have no natural immunity, meaning you've not had it before
00:40:22.020
and recovered that you would be given additional benefit. However, we have, we have, Ali, in the
00:40:28.380
month of August, we had 4 million, I'm sorry, 3 million more cases in the United States for COVID
00:40:33.400
than we had last August. Did you hear me right on that? 3 million more cases this August than last
00:40:39.700
August. CDC director herself admits, Rochelle Walensky, that they do not provide efficacy,
00:40:45.800
transmission efficacy any longer. Meaning you're not really doing much of anything, getting
00:40:50.280
vaccinated and stopping you from spreading it to someone else. Therefore, this whole idea of,
00:40:55.380
of loving my neighbor as I love myself, that is not what these, these are therapeutics. They are not
00:41:00.520
magical elixirs that immunize you against transmission. All the data real time shows this.
00:41:06.480
Our own CDC director is admitting this. Israel is seeing its greatest case explosion ever. And over
00:41:13.180
about 80% of everyone over the age of 16 has been fully vaccinated with two doses of Pfizer in the
00:41:19.100
nation of Israel. So even what he's asserting from a premise standpoint doesn't line up with data. He
00:41:25.180
and others who make this claim are breaking the commandment against bearing false witness. They
00:41:31.160
are claiming something in the public square that is clearly not true. And, and then you have to
00:41:36.800
question the motivations for doing so. And one could just be, they're just deceived or deceivers
00:41:42.260
themselves. The other could be, they have turned this process of looking virtuous or the vaccines
00:41:48.080
or the masks into their own, they fashion them into their own idols. And if that is the case,
00:41:53.000
then they have actually broken the second commandment, not to worship false gods. So do this for me. I
00:41:59.260
think this is a simple thing we could all agree to. Make sure you yourself are not currently breaking
00:42:05.740
any of God's commandments before you start giving other people advice on how to honor God.
00:42:12.560
That would be the whole log in your own eye, speck in the other person's eye principle. Well,
00:42:19.120
I hate to end there. There's so many other things I could ask you, but thank you once again for
00:42:22.960
breaking down things for us so clearly and in such a compelling way. Everyone needs to go out and buy
00:42:29.700
your book, The Fauci and Bargain. You're coming out with another book. You write books like every three
00:42:33.740
months, it seems like. And check out your show, The Steve Dace Show. Thank you, Ali. Always good to see