Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - Ep 527 ｜ Healing from Abortion & Using Your Story for Good ｜ Guest： Victoria Robinson

00:00:00.000 Hey guys, welcome to Relatable.

00:00:10.780 I've got a treat for you today.

00:00:12.180 I am talking to a pro-life activist and advocate, Victoria Robinson.

00:00:18.820 She works with women who have had abortions.

00:00:22.000 She also helps men heal from the experience of abortion that the mother of their child 0.99

00:00:30.820 went through.

00:00:31.540 And she just has so much wisdom, so much godly encouragement for us today.

00:00:36.280 I'm really excited for you to hear her story, how she became such an outspoken advocate,

00:00:41.900 how she came to do what she does now.

00:00:43.900 She's also going to give us some tools for us who are pro-life and who have relationships

00:00:50.340 with people who have had an abortion, or we have friends who are dealing with an unplanned

00:00:56.700 pregnancy, how we love those people, how we balance accountability through the law with

00:01:02.100 love and nurturing for people who have experienced or who are considering abortion.

00:01:06.580 So without further ado, here is my friend, Victoria Robinson.

00:01:11.940 Victoria, thank you so much for joining us.

00:01:14.640 Can you tell everyone who you are and what you do?

00:01:16.480 I would love to.

00:01:17.320 First, thank you for having me.

00:01:18.760 Of course.

00:01:18.920 I've always been a big fan.

00:01:20.340 I am Victoria Robinson, and I have been working in pro-life issues.

00:01:24.580 I guess you'd say I'm an activist, a pro-life activist for 25 years now, I think.

00:01:29.200 Wow.

00:01:29.720 I've been working with men and women as well who have had abortions with recovery from

00:01:34.620 the trauma that happens after that.

00:01:36.600 So I speak at different events across the country, fundraising events for pregnancy resource

00:01:41.180 centers, and I'm just anything pro-life, I'm involved in it somehow, or I try to be.

00:01:47.280 And I want to talk a little bit more about that because you do work with women who have 1.00

00:01:51.980 had abortions, and you've also talked to a lot of men who's the mother of their child

00:01:56.820 had an abortion.

00:01:57.620 So you know a lot about the trauma aspect of it, which we don't talk about quite as much

00:02:01.900 because we're so dedicated to changing people's minds beforehand.

00:02:05.720 But that's a big aspect of it, the post-trauma.

00:02:10.240 Before we get into that, though, I want the people who don't know a little bit about your

00:02:13.960 story, why you got into this pro-life work, if you could just fill us in on that.

00:02:18.240 Okay.

00:02:19.760 Unfortunately, I got involved because I chose abortion over 30 years ago.

00:02:23.420 I was a single mother with two little girls.

00:02:25.780 They were nine months and three months old when, or three years old when their dad decided

00:02:30.560 he didn't want to be married anymore.

00:02:32.420 So he left.

00:02:33.560 So here I was, this desperate single mother who had to work two jobs just to feed them and

00:02:38.860 take care of them, dropping them off at daycare every morning at six, picking them up every

00:02:43.180 night at six.

00:02:43.800 I was working as a real estate paralegal.

00:02:46.500 And also on the weekends, I worked at a health club.

00:02:49.320 So I tell you that because it was a really tough time in my life, Allie.

00:02:52.880 And I met a guy at my second job.

00:02:56.440 We fell madly in love.

00:02:57.680 My self-esteem had already been shot to pieces from my husband leaving.

00:03:01.980 And nine months later, I was pregnant.

00:03:04.120 I called the abortion clinic in Charlotte, North Carolina, told her my story about my

00:03:09.500 husband leaving, about now being pregnant.

00:03:12.860 I'm unwed.

00:03:13.700 I have these two little girls. 0.65

00:03:15.060 And she convinced me that there was nothing there, but nothing more than a blob of tissue,

00:03:19.700 a clump of cells.

00:03:20.580 And I'd be really selfish, is what she said, to have another child when I could barely take

00:03:25.960 care of the two I had.

00:03:26.980 My boyfriend was saying, let's do this.

00:03:29.060 We can have kids later when we get married.

00:03:31.760 All of those things that, you know, when you're so desperate, you're very vulnerable.

00:03:36.480 And I bought into the lies.

00:03:39.200 So on a Saturday morning, I drove myself to an abortion clinic, same one in Charlotte, and

00:03:44.580 chose abortion.

00:03:45.580 It wrecked me.

00:03:46.680 It changed who I was.

00:03:48.560 The woman I was that walked in wasn't the same one who walked out. 0.98

00:03:52.060 I knew my life was never going to be the same.

00:03:54.360 But I kept that secret for over a decade before I finally walked into a pregnancy center and

00:04:00.620 spoke to the director there, told her my story, and asked her for help.

00:04:04.360 And she said, let's get you an after-abortion recovery. 1.00

00:04:07.080 And that's what she did.

00:04:08.000 And it changed my life.

00:04:09.400 So I knew after that that I had no choice but to share what I'd been through for other

00:04:16.100 women, first of all, to not make the same choice and realize there are other options 1.00

00:04:20.240 besides abortion, much better options.

00:04:23.420 And that if they'd already chosen abortion, they could find healing through recovery.

00:04:29.300 What was the motivator to go to the pregnancy center after a decade of secrecy and silence?

00:04:38.520 Was there something that happened that made you realize, okay, I've got to talk to someone

00:04:42.880 about this?

00:04:43.960 So many things.

00:04:45.120 I would say in those 10 years, I felt such guilt and shame.

00:04:49.380 I got involved in my church.

00:04:50.680 I became a Christian, if you will, and thought, if I say enough to the church, yes, I'll lead

00:04:56.900 worship.

00:04:57.960 Yes, I'll work in the nursery.

00:04:59.440 Yes, I'll do whatever you need me to do.

00:05:01.520 I would stop feeling those feelings of pain and regret.

00:05:06.320 And then I felt so rejected by God that I knew if people knew my secret, they would reject

00:05:11.000 me for sure.

00:05:12.160 So nobody knew.

00:05:13.800 So all of these years, I started getting more and more involved in church.

00:05:17.300 And women started coming to me, Allie, telling me about their abortion story.

00:05:20.680 Not knowing I had my own.

00:05:23.340 For whatever reason, I know now why, but at the time I didn't.

00:05:27.040 I felt like God was torturing me, basically.

00:05:29.600 They would come and whisper in my ear and say, I had an abortion.

00:05:33.560 Can you help me?

00:05:34.740 Can you pray with me?

00:05:35.780 I can't get over it.

00:05:37.140 And I get so angry, Allie, honestly, with God.

00:05:40.100 And I did.

00:05:40.880 I got really mad, more mad at him, thinking, you hate me so much that you want these women 1.00

00:05:46.780 to always signal or choose me and seek me out to tell their stories so that I can continually

00:05:53.960 be reminded of what I'd done.

00:05:55.700 Well, there was a woman in my church named Mary who was the director of the pregnancy 0.98

00:06:00.780 center.

00:06:01.200 And for about three years, she kept approaching me at church saying, you should come volunteer

00:06:06.360 at our pregnancy center, Victoria.

00:06:08.480 And you'd be so good.

00:06:09.800 You're really good with the youth groups here.

00:06:12.320 And I'd say, yes, sure, Mary, I will.

00:06:14.720 And then I'd go back to God and say, what are you?

00:06:17.380 There you go again.

00:06:18.260 And for about three years, that went on.

00:06:21.920 And there was a particular woman that came to me at a women's event.

00:06:26.140 And I was standing at the altar to pray with women because I was part of the women's ministry

00:06:30.640 team, even though I felt like a fraud, Allie, because they didn't know about my abortion.

00:06:36.400 But once again, trying everything I could to make me not feel so bad about myself.

00:06:41.560 And so this woman came to me, and she was a prominent person in the community and whispered

00:06:48.440 in my ear again, like so many before, telling me her story.

00:06:52.040 And she was so broken.

00:06:54.600 And I just, at that moment, I prayed with her and watched God transform her, as he had

00:07:00.620 with many others before.

00:07:01.840 But for whatever reason, this particular time was the one that got me.

00:07:07.400 And I went home, and I had it out with my creator.

00:07:12.360 I mean, it was pretty ugly.

00:07:14.720 And I kept putting my fist up to him and saying, why, why, why, why do you heal everyone but

00:07:21.220 me?

00:07:21.700 When is it going to be my turn to find the same freedom and healing they're finding?

00:07:26.420 And I felt like he impressed upon my heart to think about Mary.

00:07:32.980 And Mary's face came to me.

00:07:34.640 And I just thought, wow.

00:07:36.460 And I felt like he was trying through Mary. 0.59

00:07:40.700 So I called her the next day.

00:07:42.520 I'm ready to volunteer.

00:07:43.940 I went to her center.

00:07:45.000 It took me a few more months before I actually confessed to her.

00:07:48.340 But when I did, she looked at me and said, now we're going to take what the enemy meant

00:07:53.880 to destroy you and turn it into good. 0.84

00:07:55.900 And God's going to use your voice, Vic, to talk to the nations about what abortion really

00:08:00.500 is.

00:08:00.860 So let's get you in after abortion recovery. 0.99

00:08:03.960 And she signed me up.

00:08:05.580 And that was 25 years ago.

00:08:07.660 So when did you know, OK, this is what I want to dedicate my life to?

00:08:11.580 Oh, gosh.

00:08:12.200 The moment I walked out of that retreat, it was a three and a half day retreat, Allie,

00:08:16.000 that I now conduct myself today.

00:08:19.000 In three and a half days, what I had tried to do in 10 years on my own, tried to do on

00:08:24.920 my own, God in three and a half days transformed my life.

00:08:28.180 So on Thursday night, when I got there to that retreat, I can remember looking at those

00:08:32.060 two facilitators and I had such a bad attitude even then and just said, I don't know why

00:08:37.680 I'm here.

00:08:38.800 This is probably a waste of my time and your time.

00:08:41.480 But Mary said I needed to be here.

00:08:43.060 So I'm here.

00:08:43.780 I don't know how you're going to help me.

00:08:44.960 I've been in church.

00:08:45.780 I've been begging God all these years.

00:08:47.960 And nothing's going to take this pain and this regret and this guilt from me.

00:08:52.040 And they were like, we're just happy you're here.

00:08:55.020 That moment, I wanted to hit them.

00:08:56.960 You know, they're sweet church ladies. 1.00

00:08:58.720 And I just thought, oh.

00:09:00.060 But on Sunday at noon is when it was over and I had gone through the process and trusted

00:09:06.400 the process.

00:09:08.100 I looked at them and said, every woman who's had an abortion needs to know about these

00:09:12.100 kinds of healing retreats.

00:09:14.140 Every woman that's had an abortion needs to know there is redemption, that she can find 0.99

00:09:19.080 healing, and that God does forgive even for abortion.

00:09:23.280 And they looked at me and said, we know, and we're going to train you how to do it.

00:09:27.420 So those two facilitators trained me, and I've been doing these retreats ever since.

00:09:32.140 Sounds like you had a very redemptive and healing and welcoming, accepting church experience when

00:09:38.180 you came to people in your church and said, this is what I did.

00:09:41.420 It sounds like they were very quick to extend grace to you or show you God's grace and then

00:09:47.280 have you be a part of other people's healing process.

00:09:49.680 But we're hearing a lot from Christians and maybe people who would consider themselves

00:09:55.880 ex-Christians that the church doesn't do a good job in helping women who have had abortions,

00:10:00.660 that there's only condemnation.

00:10:02.380 I imagine that probably both are true, that some people have had really bad experiences and

00:10:07.840 some people have what sounds like a really good experience like you.

00:10:11.220 Can you talk about just kind of what you've seen, not just in your own life, but maybe other

00:10:15.500 women who have gone to people in their church, maybe they haven't had the same experience,

00:10:19.520 or do you think the church in general is doing a good job?

00:10:22.540 What's really kind of the truth there?

00:10:24.460 I'm glad you asked that, because unfortunately, I do not think as a whole in general, the church

00:10:29.420 is doing a good job.

00:10:31.140 I practically have to beg pastors to let me have five minutes of their pulpit time on a

00:10:36.560 Sunday morning to talk about this issue.

00:10:38.900 And I hear things like, we don't have that issue here, Victoria.

00:10:41.900 I know we have people here who are pro-choice, they may be offended, people who had abortions,

00:10:47.460 they may be hurt and offended.

00:10:49.240 And I look at them and say, okay, first of all, that's asinine to me, that you're not

00:10:55.100 speaking about this issue from the pulpit.

00:10:57.600 Because what I want them to understand is that those, their congregants who are sitting

00:11:02.820 there, Allie, one out of three people has had an abortion in this country.

00:11:05.940 They're sitting in churches every Sunday.

00:11:07.520 When the pastor refuses to talk about the issue, they're internalizing that.

00:11:13.300 And they're feeling like, see, even my own pastor won't talk about it.

00:11:16.660 That's how bad it is.

00:11:18.260 So that continues to put them in this place of rejection and no hope.

00:11:25.680 And that's the one thing God can't forgive for because he won't, or she or whoever is 0.63

00:11:30.480 in that pulpit won't even speak about it.

00:11:32.260 So I tell pastors, if you're afraid of the issue, bring someone in like me.

00:11:36.200 It doesn't have to be me, but bring someone in to talk about it.

00:11:39.520 They need to hear it.

00:11:40.840 Those churches that have been brave enough to bring me in, when men and women approach

00:11:45.160 me afterwards, they say, thank you.

00:11:48.120 Thank you for coming.

00:11:49.460 I'm so thankful my pastor's addressing this because I didn't understand why we've never

00:11:53.720 addressed it.

00:11:54.520 Or even the pastors will say to me, you know what?

00:11:57.640 I should have done this a long time ago.

00:11:59.280 I had no idea this many people were hurting from abortion.

00:12:01.920 Well, I challenge pastors and say, they are.

00:12:05.880 They're sitting in your church every week.

00:12:07.480 So it's your responsibility.

00:12:08.880 If you're preaching about other sin, you should be preaching about abortion and hope and healing 0.99

00:12:14.720 as well.

00:12:15.720 So it's not, we're nowhere near where we need to be.

00:12:19.140 Unfortunately, if we were doing what we should be doing in the church alley with this issue,

00:12:24.120 let's be honest, we wouldn't be in the shape we're in today in this country.

00:12:26.820 Yeah, with 2,300 plus children being aborted each day and with the abortion laws that are 1.00

00:12:32.540 being passed.

00:12:33.400 And I'll take it a step further with the candidates that are being put in positions to continue

00:12:38.680 voting for these pro-abortion laws.

00:12:41.200 I think one problem that some people have is they feel like if they condemn abortion as wrong,

00:12:50.640 then they are not dealing with people's feelings and people's so-called lived experiences.

00:12:57.420 And they are being unempathetic and unkind.

00:13:00.220 And so it's a kind of a false dichotomy.

00:13:02.460 It's like either you're condemning abortion as bad and you hate the women who have had abortions,

00:13:07.240 or you say abortion should be legal and fun and fine in order to love the women who have

00:13:12.900 had abortions.

00:13:13.480 But that's kind of like a false binary, right?

00:13:15.560 How do we do both?

00:13:16.580 How do we condemn abortion, but also unequivocally say, like, we want grace and redemption and

00:13:23.500 hope for the women who have had abortions? 1.00

00:13:26.600 You can do it with grace.

00:13:27.560 You can do it with literal grace by, you can't, okay, so, and this is the real million dollar

00:13:35.640 question because it can be done.

00:13:37.340 I do it every single day.

00:13:38.920 And I never condemn the woman who's had the abortion.

00:13:42.040 First of all, she's been manipulated at the most vulnerable time of her life.

00:13:47.200 People have to understand that those who do hate women who've had abortions, when I go

00:13:51.440 speak at different events, Allie, I know there are some people in the audience thinking,

00:13:55.380 who is this woman telling us about abortion? 1.00

00:13:58.120 She's had one.

00:13:58.860 I've had people write me on social media and say, who do you think you are telling me I

00:14:03.080 can't have an abortion when you got to have your abortion? 1.00

00:14:06.520 So these are pro-choice people saying this?

00:14:08.620 These are pro-choice people or people that are hurting.

00:14:10.940 I'm convinced, Allie, as well, that many, I would go so far as to say almost the majority,

00:14:17.120 but many, let's say many for the sake of argument, of people who are adamantly pro-choice either

00:14:22.920 have had an abortion or someone close to them has had an abortion.

00:14:26.620 So exactly what you're saying.

00:14:27.940 They feel if they become pro-life or condemn abortion, they're condemning themselves or

00:14:33.820 the person.

00:14:34.640 So we're not condemning anyone for having the abortion.

00:14:38.560 Do I condemn abortionists who know exactly what they're doing?

00:14:41.140 Sure do.

00:14:41.820 I have no problem with it.

00:14:43.240 When the Praise God for Texas with your heartbeat law came out, I was asked the question, do

00:14:47.940 you think someone should have the right to sue these women from their abortions? 0.99

00:14:52.000 I said, I'll put it to you this way.

00:14:53.800 If I could go back 30 years and sue that abortionist who lied to me, sue the woman who took my money 0.69

00:14:59.240 who lied to me and said it was nothing more than getting a tooth pulled, when you leave

00:15:03.260 here, never think of it again.

00:15:04.940 If I could go back and sue these people who lied to my face that this would not affect my

00:15:09.880 life in any way, I'd be the first in line.

00:15:12.140 Yeah.

00:15:12.840 And people don't realize, people like to say that the woman with this Texas law is being 1.00

00:15:17.740 sued.

00:15:18.000 It's actually not the woman.

00:15:18.880 It's all the people that you just listed.

00:15:20.660 There's a ton of misinformation, as there always is, surrounding abortion law about that.

00:15:25.840 And I think you're right.

00:15:26.580 I think some people feel like they're either going to condemn themselves by saying abortion

00:15:30.800 is wrong, or they're going to condemn someone that they love.

00:15:34.340 And like we were saying earlier, it's that false binary of saying, I can't say this is

00:15:37.580 bad without being hateful towards the person who did it.

00:15:41.060 And you are walking out how to balance both of those things.

00:15:43.880 I do find myself more on the side of just trying to desperately convince people that

00:15:50.280 abortion is wrong, that abortion is bad. 0.98

00:15:53.500 Not that obviously I don't believe that there is grace and redemption and acceptance for people

00:15:57.400 who have had it, because of course I do.

00:15:59.200 But I think it also gets more and more difficult as we see just some of the rabid, truly pro-abortion

00:16:05.020 rhetoric, even that we're seeing from Hollywood, but also activists who are now saying there's

00:16:10.140 nothing wrong with abortion.

00:16:11.260 It's not safe, legal, and rare anymore.

00:16:12.760 It's without apology through nine months.

00:16:14.660 We saw that New York law in 2019, the buildings lit up pink for abortion through nine months.

00:16:20.820 And this was a celebratory thing.

00:16:23.060 Sometimes I think it's hard for me to look at that and think that, okay, are all women 0.94

00:16:31.440 who have abortions, are they all truly victims of manipulation and deceit?

00:16:36.620 Or is there a point where it's like, okay, some people are celebrating this and they're

00:16:41.200 proud of the fact, or they say that they're proud of the fact that they did.

00:16:45.000 It's hard not to be just completely adversarial towards the pro-abortion side when you see

00:16:49.240 that kind of attitude.

00:16:50.780 So how do we deal with that?

00:16:53.540 You know, that's really good because I've been involved in this work for a long time,

00:16:57.560 and even that can be difficult for me.

00:17:00.640 And I've counseled and met these women throughout my career.

00:17:03.620 I had someone recently who went through a retreat who felt her baby kicking on the way to the

00:17:09.620 abortion.

00:17:10.580 So that's hard.

00:17:12.480 That's hard, man.

00:17:13.480 It's hard.

00:17:14.140 I'm human.

00:17:15.080 I mean, that's hard.

00:17:16.300 But I'm telling you, this woman is a good woman.

00:17:21.800 She's not a horrible, wicked, mean, evil person.

00:17:25.640 She's a woman who was in terrible pain, which is why she chose from her background.

00:17:32.020 But she had to disassociate herself with it.

00:17:35.280 But what happens and what I try to get women to understand is right now, you're here because

00:17:40.980 you need to be here for whatever desperate situation you think you're in of why you're

00:17:45.840 choosing to have an abortion.

00:17:47.060 And you're right.

00:17:47.780 There are those women that I have met who said, I'll just have it again. 1.00

00:17:51.620 Didn't bother me at all.

00:17:52.780 And I watch their attitudes about things and think, you don't think it bothered you

00:17:57.160 at all.

00:17:57.740 But this is the person you are.

00:18:00.140 If you weren't defensive about it, that'd tell me a lot more.

00:18:02.940 One of my friends, before I chose abortion, I would have said I was pro-life.

00:18:06.860 She had had seven abortions. 0.86

00:18:08.620 Wow.

00:18:09.300 And it ended our friendship because I'd watch her sleeping around and going out every weekend 0.96

00:18:14.020 saying, what are you doing?

00:18:15.680 What are you going to do if you get pregnant again? 1.00

00:18:17.480 I'll just have another abortion. 1.00

00:18:18.380 Now, that person and I, our friendship ended, but I've kept through circles, I know what

00:18:23.920 she's up to.

00:18:24.800 She's become a full-fledged alcoholic and drug addict. 0.99

00:18:28.760 And her life has been a train wreck.

00:18:31.840 I know part of that, maybe not all of it.

00:18:34.520 She had a pretty rough childhood as well.

00:18:36.040 But a lot of that stems from seven abortions. 0.76

00:18:39.280 And who knows, maybe she had more after I saw her.

00:18:41.940 So it is hard.

00:18:43.140 So I try to, I can't not condemn the abortion, Allie. 1.00

00:18:46.680 I condemn abortion.

00:18:49.200 I don't condemn the woman because of my experience with these women who come to me so broken

00:18:57.140 and so feeling lied to and manipulated and all those things I've already mentioned that

00:19:03.520 are genuine.

00:19:04.240 There are those who say as well to my face, I don't really care what you say.

00:19:08.680 I have been fine and I'd choose it again.

00:19:10.780 And I just say, well, if you ever need me, here's my card.

00:19:14.560 There's not really more I can do than that.

00:19:17.160 But the majority, even though the pro-abortion side wants us to believe that abortion does

00:19:23.620 not affect a woman in any way, they're lies.

00:19:26.140 Recently, again, I had another woman here in Texas that went through a retreat. 0.90

00:19:31.300 And we started on a Thursday night.

00:19:33.400 And by Friday afternoon, she said, 18 and 19 years ago, I had abortions.

00:19:39.020 She boarded her two baby boys.

00:19:41.220 She was in her first trimester.

00:19:43.040 So 18 years ago, 19 years ago.

00:19:45.160 She said all these years since then, and it had been probably 15 years since her abortions.

00:19:51.400 I have Googled or went online to put in, am I doing this because I had two abortions?

00:19:57.340 Is this why I'm depressed?

00:19:58.560 Because and everything that came up, no correlation between depression and abortion.

00:20:02.860 There's no issues from abortion for women. 0.94

00:20:06.000 All these lies, because it's all propaganda from the pro-abortion side to make sure that's

00:20:10.660 what a woman finds. 1.00

00:20:11.680 But it's simply not true.

00:20:13.400 And she sat there and said, all these years, I have felt like I was crazy.

00:20:18.120 Now, listening to all your stories in this group, I've realized those things were from

00:20:24.060 choosing abortion because you've all experienced the same things.

00:20:27.760 And that's what infuriates me about the abortion side.

00:20:31.280 They try to paint this picture like you said, oh, big deal.

00:20:35.080 We're sitting, someone was telling me earlier that women were sitting in the room, girls 1.00

00:20:39.280 on their phones, laughing and giggling there for abortions.

00:20:42.800 It's just this narrative they paint that everything is cool and it's okay.

00:20:48.660 Just like sleeping around is cool and doing this is cool.

00:20:52.080 So is having an abortion. 0.88

00:20:53.280 Have you had your first abortion yet?

00:20:54.860 It's almost become this badge of honor.

00:20:57.840 So demonic.

00:20:58.180 It's demonic, completely demonic.

00:21:00.240 You cannot walk into an abortion clinic and not feel a sense of oppression there.

00:21:05.300 Totally.

00:21:05.760 Because it's there.

00:21:06.920 How can you walk in and kill babies every day without that sense of being like this?

00:21:13.940 So I think what I'm hearing you say is that not every single woman who has an abortion

00:21:18.160 is necessarily a victim.

00:21:20.060 There are some, a minority maybe, but there are some who know what they're doing.

00:21:24.860 And they do it anyway.

00:21:26.540 They either disassociate themselves from it.

00:21:28.520 Like the woman that you said, she felt her baby kick and she still chose it. 0.97

00:21:32.060 And then there are some that they don't have to disassociate themselves.

00:21:36.300 They truly do have like, they've completely calloused hearts.

00:21:39.020 They have hearts of stone and they can just go through with something like that.

00:21:42.680 Most women do feel it. 1.00

00:21:44.680 They do feel a sense of trauma.

00:21:46.180 And something that I'm thinking, because it just, it truly does make me so angry because

00:21:51.320 as pro-lifers, we are so inclined to think of the baby because no one else is thinking

00:21:55.600 about the baby.

00:21:56.400 And so just thinking about that precious child kicking and being killed, it is hard for me.

00:22:01.920 I'll just be honest.

00:22:02.960 Like it's hard for me to feel bad for the mother.

00:22:05.900 It's hard for me.

00:22:06.860 Not that I don't feel bad for the circumstances.

00:22:08.860 Like she could have come from abuse.

00:22:10.360 I don't know.

00:22:10.880 So many different things, but I still am like, how could you, how could you do it?

00:22:17.980 You know, can you take us into kind of that mindset?

00:22:21.320 Cause you've talked to these women more than I have. 0.91

00:22:23.600 Can you take us into your conversations with women who have ultimately made that choice,

00:22:28.960 but has still evokes just that feeling of sympathy and compassion from you?

00:22:32.420 How do you not just take them by the shoulders and say, how could you do that?

00:22:36.480 You know?

00:22:37.320 Because I'm one of them.

00:22:38.760 Yeah.

00:22:39.000 Because I had two children already.

00:22:42.020 I knew the outcome of a pregnancy yet at six weeks, I chose abortion.

00:22:47.980 And knowing that conception at conception, that baby was a human being with their own unique

00:22:53.600 DNA, whether I was six weeks or six months, I get what you're saying.

00:22:58.360 That was still my baby.

00:23:00.100 So for me, I think I can empathize and sympathize because your mindset, it's hard to describe

00:23:07.600 to someone who's never experienced an abortion or felt that's her only option.

00:23:13.360 And they do come from all walks of life.

00:23:15.460 There's no way a girl who walks in at six, seven months or long, or even four or five months 1.00

00:23:20.820 doesn't have trauma to bring her to the place where she could walk into an abortion clinic, 1.00

00:23:26.460 lay on a table and let an abortionist who cares nothing more than for that paycheck to end 1.00

00:23:31.860 the life of her child.

00:23:33.940 So that's probably the best answer I can give for me because I've been there.

00:23:39.420 And on the way to the abortion clinic, Allie, I hired a sitter to take care of my older girls. 1.00

00:23:46.120 And I told her I was going shopping.

00:23:48.720 And my boyfriend couldn't even take me.

00:23:50.820 He went out of town and wasn't even driving me.

00:23:53.020 So I had to drive myself 20, 25 minutes to that abortion clinic from my apartment. 0.85

00:23:58.380 And I can remember vividly having my hand on my stomach, telling this blob of tissue that

00:24:07.520 I was told that that's all that it was.

00:24:11.080 I'm really sorry for what I'm about to do, but this is the best choice for you because

00:24:15.100 my life is a wreck and I'm struggling to take care of your sisters.

00:24:18.820 And I'm having this conversation with this blob of tissue.

00:24:22.300 So you would think that would be enough of a revelation for me driving there to go,

00:24:27.740 what are you doing?

00:24:29.620 But it wasn't.

00:24:30.780 I got there and convinced myself as well as others convincing me around.

00:24:34.760 But I take responsibility.

00:24:36.360 No one put a gun to my head.

00:24:38.100 But there were definitely influences around me to convince me this was the best choice.

00:24:42.900 When you're that desperate and you're a mom that has other children or you're a girl

00:24:47.640 who knows your parents are going to throw you out if they find out you're pregnant because 1.00

00:24:51.680 they've threatened you with disowning you.

00:24:54.720 And whether they do or they don't, and many of them don't, that's just their threat.

00:24:58.600 They don't understand the damage they're doing, though, to their daughters when they say this.

00:25:02.840 They're convinced.

00:25:04.120 And when I'm sitting there saying to them, they won't, honey, I promise you.

00:25:07.220 And if they do, I'll find the resources for you.

00:25:09.720 You're going to be OK.

00:25:10.700 No, you don't understand what my family means to me.

00:25:12.860 I can't be without my family.

00:25:14.220 This is the I have to choose this because I got to save my all these different stories

00:25:18.760 that I hear.

00:25:19.780 So I think that's probably a long answer to your question, because that's why.

00:25:26.880 Now, I said earlier, and I can't lie either.

00:25:29.880 It is difficult for me to meet someone who's had a late term abortion.

00:25:34.760 Even in the back of my mind, I'm going, would I have done that?

00:25:41.320 Could I have felt my baby's hiccups and felt my baby kicking me and still gone through with it?

00:25:50.260 I would like to believe there's no way.

00:25:52.800 I truly believe had I seen the ultrasound, even at six weeks, he told me I was six to eight

00:25:58.300 weeks, the abortionist, because as he was walking out the door and I was a wreck, I called

00:26:03.600 after him and said, was it a girl or a boy?

00:26:07.860 And he just turned around and said, I don't know.

00:26:09.780 You're too early for me to tell.

00:26:11.180 I don't have time for this.

00:26:12.320 And he walked out.

00:26:14.140 And even even lying on the table, Allie, at the moment that I heard the machine turn on.

00:26:21.720 And I wanted to scream, I've changed my mind.

00:26:28.640 I was saying to myself, what are you doing here, Vic?

00:26:31.880 Get out.

00:26:33.180 What are you doing here?

00:26:35.340 I was so paralyzed with fear.

00:26:38.880 And all of the thoughts, everything everyone had been saying to me was going through my

00:26:44.520 head.

00:26:44.960 You'd be selfish to bring another child in.

00:26:47.200 You can barely take care of these two.

00:26:49.120 It's not really a baby.

00:26:50.660 Let's get it done before it's a baby. 1.00

00:26:53.000 I mean, all the lies that I was told.

00:26:56.320 And I allowed them in 10 minutes to end my child's life.

00:26:59.980 And they took my baby that day, but they never took the memory of my baby that day.

00:27:08.480 And like I said, it almost destroyed me.

00:27:10.820 But I knew I had to go on for the two I had.

00:27:14.020 And then I felt like getting involved in abusive relationships is what I deserved.

00:27:19.720 Because I did not deserve any form of happiness when I killed my baby.

00:27:24.620 So I was in relationships that weren't good for me, that were abusive and cheating on

00:27:31.440 me or calling me names.

00:27:33.020 Well, you know, I deserve it.

00:27:34.600 What else do I deserve but that?

00:27:37.580 Because my self-esteem was gone and I had no sense of worth until I met Mary.

00:27:43.340 And until Mary said, Vic, God loves you.

00:27:46.280 God will forgive you for that.

00:27:48.180 He wants to redeem your life.

00:27:49.740 And I didn't believe her.

00:27:50.900 That's why I still had an attitude that Thursday when I showed up.

00:27:53.440 And she was right.

00:27:55.840 And God transformed my life and showed me, hey, I got you.

00:28:01.280 And I'm taking care of your baby.

00:28:03.620 Your baby's with me.

00:28:05.100 Now you need to do the work I've called you to do so that other women don't make the same 1.00

00:28:08.820 choice, which is why I will always, always fight for the unborn.

00:28:13.040 And now you're going to help those people who have made the choice so that they know I

00:28:17.580 love them too.

00:28:18.660 Because Christ didn't just die for these unborn children.

00:28:21.680 And as you're talking, you, you know, the main thing that you said, the reason why you

00:28:31.680 can't judge and condemn these women is because you've been there too.

00:28:34.520 But the reality is whether or not we have experienced an abortion, whether or not we've

00:28:40.280 gone through with that, Jesus says, if you hate someone in your heart, you are a murderer.

00:28:44.360 And we've all hated someone in our heart.

00:28:47.980 And so that means we really don't have a place of condemnation.

00:28:52.040 That doesn't mean that we can't say, as you've said very clearly, hey, that was wrong.

00:28:56.260 That was wrong.

00:28:56.960 It was murder.

00:28:58.020 That ended the life of a child.

00:28:59.160 We don't have to use, as pro-choicers or pro-abortionists do, euphemisms to try to cover

00:29:03.940 up what an abortion is.

00:29:05.720 We can be so clear on that while also saying, hey, I am the worst of sinners too, because

00:29:13.360 that's what the Bible tells me.

00:29:14.380 I've hated someone in my heart.

00:29:15.940 I've lied before.

00:29:17.000 I've cheated before.

00:29:17.820 I've been a blasphemer before.

00:29:19.760 And all of those things, God says, that's enough to condemn you to hell, but God, but

00:29:24.860 God.

00:29:25.320 So they're in the same place of the need of redemption that we have all been at one point.

00:29:29.920 And so that, I think, is where we can all come from to say, as angry as I might be at

00:29:35.500 that situation, as hard as it is for some of us to understand, there are all different

00:29:39.100 kinds of sin that maybe we haven't experienced and that it's so hard for us to understand.

00:29:43.080 But hey, we've all been murderers in one sense, but God, right?

00:29:47.120 And you know what, Allie?

00:29:48.260 Here's another thing I would say about those women who it is difficult for those that aren't 0.99

00:29:52.980 involved in the work I am or with meeting these people on a weekly basis is that these

00:29:58.520 women are going to go through much more than we could ever do to them with any condemnation 1.00

00:30:06.920 we might put on them.

00:30:08.280 What they have to live with, especially those, and I don't want to say especially if they're 1.00

00:30:13.040 late term, but there's definitely a difference when a woman says to me, I actually felt my

00:30:17.940 daughter kicking and still chose, than for me who didn't feel or look pregnant.

00:30:22.340 I'm not going to deny that there's definitely a difference.

00:30:25.060 But what she has to live with, oh my gosh, they condemn themselves every single day.

00:30:32.900 And I just want any woman who's gone through an abortion to know, even those that are saying

00:30:36.960 I'm okay with it, and some, not all, are lying to themselves, that there is help.

00:30:43.740 And once you walk in the truth and you realize the truth, I handed a woman the embryonic stages 0.93

00:30:48.280 when I was doing the retreat.

00:30:49.420 That's part of the healing.

00:30:50.880 And she threw it at my face. 1.00

00:30:52.260 Why do I have to look at that?

00:30:53.520 I know how far along I was.

00:30:55.500 I know my baby had arms and legs, and when I committed an abortion, I know all of that.

00:31:00.220 Why are you doing this to me?

00:31:01.780 And I just said, look at it when you're ready.

00:31:04.400 Then the next day, it was different.

00:31:06.740 And she said, I get it now.

00:31:09.100 I had in my mind there was nothing there.

00:31:11.680 So I could continue to live in that denial.

00:31:14.320 But now I saw in my face, and now I'm hurt.

00:31:17.840 I'm so in pain, and I hurt for what I did.

00:31:20.520 But can I say I'm also excited now because I believe I'll see her in heaven?

00:31:25.760 And I said, yeah, you can.

00:31:27.580 Yeah.

00:31:28.000 And you understand all those emotions because you felt that anger.

00:31:30.680 You felt that defensiveness.

00:31:32.220 Even after you were a Christian, I think maybe that might be where some of the shame comes from

00:31:38.080 for women who maybe since they had an abortion, they became a Christian.

00:31:41.220 So they think that, OK, I'm not supposed to be angry about this anymore, or I can't be defensive

00:31:49.160 about this.

00:31:49.920 Or even after they become Christian and pro-life, they still don't want to talk about their abortion

00:31:53.740 because, well, now they're a Christian.

00:31:56.180 And you're supposed to say the right things and feel all the right things about that.

00:32:02.260 And so they don't want to come across as hypocrites.

00:32:05.620 So maybe if there are Christian women out there who haven't admitted that they had an abortion 0.97

00:32:09.700 and who are feeling maybe even more shame and guilt than they did before, which I would

00:32:14.320 say is the conviction of the Holy Spirit, if you're feeling like, wow, that was wrong

00:32:17.820 for the first time.

00:32:19.180 How do you encourage them to go about revealing this to someone?

00:32:23.040 How do they start seeking healing if they're feeling that defensiveness that you did?

00:32:27.060 I would say, honestly, reach out to your pregnancy resource center, your local pregnancy

00:32:30.840 center, and you can do that anonymously because that's the greatest fear.

00:32:35.560 When I counsel or meet with people at retreats, they always say, do I have to do what you're

00:32:39.340 doing now because I've told you guys I had an abortion?

00:32:42.720 I'm like, no, because I don't want to do what you do.

00:32:44.520 I don't want the whole world to know.

00:32:46.640 No, I've been called to do this.

00:32:49.880 I mean, I couldn't even look in a mirror and say I had an abortion by myself in my bathroom

00:32:54.100 before I went through healing.

00:32:55.480 Now, God's taken me everywhere.

00:32:57.460 And it's like, I mean, I'm telling everybody.

00:32:59.960 So, but I let people know that it's not something you need to have fear about because that is

00:33:04.500 one of the greatest things.

00:33:05.340 Well, if I start talking about it, does that mean I have to tell everyone?

00:33:08.500 No, it doesn't.

00:33:09.580 I would say call your local pregnancy resource center.

00:33:12.320 Get in touch with someone like me.

00:33:14.620 Share that for the, many people have shared with me for the first time and I'm the first

00:33:19.400 person they've told because they feel safe.

00:33:21.580 So find that safe place.

00:33:23.840 Pray.

00:33:24.200 If you're a Christian, then pray.

00:33:25.320 God, send someone to me that I can talk to who won't judge me and condemn me because

00:33:30.820 that's their greatest fear, Allie, is being judged and condemned.

00:33:34.260 I hear from women all the time. 1.00

00:33:35.680 I don't want this person to know this.

00:33:37.280 They won't want to be my friend anymore.

00:33:39.060 I was that person.

00:33:40.240 I was on a team of 12 women involved heavily in my church.

00:33:44.440 None of them knew.

00:33:46.200 And post-abortive men and women will keep people at a distance because if I let you get 0.98

00:33:50.620 too close, you're going to know my secret and if I can't tell you that secret.

00:33:55.780 So that's what I want people to know is there are places available to reach out to that are

00:34:00.560 safe, that will keep your secret and walk through that with you through after abortion 0.98

00:34:06.200 care.

00:34:07.060 And like with men, men are the ones who we want to say, shut up, sit down.

00:34:13.280 It's not your body.

00:34:14.940 Well, here's a scientific fact.

00:34:16.740 It's not her body either.

00:34:18.080 And these children had mothers and fathers.

00:34:21.040 So one of the things we have done that I'm determined to put an end to, we've got to

00:34:25.820 talk about these fathers.

00:34:27.340 And these fathers are hurting too.

00:34:29.540 After my book came out, okay, I called the father of my aborted child.

00:34:34.160 Allie, we hadn't spoken in over 10 years.

00:34:36.900 And I'd gone through after abortion recovery.

00:34:40.180 My book was getting ready.

00:34:41.740 I knew we had a lot of the same friends in the same circles.

00:34:44.600 I wanted him to know I didn't give any identifying factors about him in the book.

00:34:49.400 I called and said, hey, it's me.

00:34:51.960 That's all I said.

00:34:53.120 He began to weep.

00:34:55.060 Wow.

00:34:55.680 Where I couldn't understand him.

00:34:57.100 Wow.

00:34:58.420 He said, I've been waiting for this call for over 10 years to beg you for forgiveness for

00:35:03.080 what I made you do.

00:35:04.500 It's haunted me all these years.

00:35:05.940 And I've been in therapy eight years dealing with it.

00:35:08.280 Wow.

00:35:08.560 Can you please forgive me?

00:35:10.440 I should have protected you and our baby and I failed you both.

00:35:14.540 In that moment, I realized two things.

00:35:16.600 One, oh, this good little Christian I thought I was had not fully forgiven him.

00:35:22.900 And I forgave him on the spot.

00:35:24.760 And it was like full circle for me for my healing.

00:35:27.680 The second thing that I realized was I felt Holy Spirit spoke to my heart and said, do not

00:35:33.160 forget these men.

00:35:34.500 These children had fathers.

00:35:36.340 Never forget to talk about them.

00:35:38.280 Yeah.

00:35:38.440 And I have ever since.

00:35:40.580 And I'm telling you, as I've opened that door up, when I speak, wherever I speak, and

00:35:46.200 I mentioned men and talk about, the men are coming to my book table saying, thank you.

00:35:51.360 Nobody ever talks about us.

00:35:53.300 I talked her into it.

00:35:54.720 I paid for it.

00:35:55.780 I lied to her to get her to do it.

00:35:57.400 I drove her there.

00:35:58.280 I didn't know.

00:35:59.360 Whatever their stories are, they say the same thing.

00:36:02.200 Thank you for finally recognizing that we're hurting too, but we're just not allowed to

00:36:08.540 say we are.

00:36:09.400 Yeah.

00:36:09.740 And I want to talk a little bit more about the men.

00:36:12.620 And the book, just so everyone knows that you were referring to, it's called They Lied 0.93

00:36:16.260 to Us, and you've got another book coming out, They Lied to Us Too, about men's stories.

00:36:19.880 And I want to talk about that more in a second.

00:36:21.820 But kind of going back to what you were talking about, about someone who has had an abortion

00:36:26.020 in the church, they want healing from it.

00:36:28.240 Or maybe they're not even Christians yet, but they want healing from it.

00:36:31.220 And your direction there.

00:36:32.100 What about the friend of someone who has had an abortion?

00:36:37.560 Or people have come to me and said they don't even know me.

00:36:42.220 And they said, I am thinking about this, or I have an unplanned pregnancy.

00:36:48.200 I don't know what to do.

00:36:48.840 And I've come to you and been like, Victoria, what do I do?

00:36:51.960 And you're a great resource for all of that.

00:36:53.940 But not everyone, not every friend of someone who is considering an abortion or who has had

00:36:58.000 an abortion has anyone else to turn to. 0.56

00:37:00.260 And they don't feel like they are equipped to help this person.

00:37:04.200 So I guess the first, the friend who has a friend who is considering an abortion, what

00:37:10.400 does she do?

00:37:12.000 Okay.

00:37:12.520 If you're a friend and one of your friends comes to you and says, I'm having an abortion

00:37:16.560 or I'm thinking about it, first of all, listen.

00:37:19.160 Just listen.

00:37:20.700 Don't react.

00:37:21.920 The last thing you want to do, even if you're 100% against it, just listen.

00:37:26.400 Because right now, what she just needs is to talk and share what's going on and let her

00:37:31.900 continue to talk.

00:37:32.860 When she's done, hug her.

00:37:34.780 I mean, these things are little simple things, but that's what she needs.

00:37:37.920 She needs support.

00:37:39.520 Look at her and say, hey, I love you.

00:37:41.660 You're my friend.

00:37:42.300 We're going to get through this together.

00:37:43.340 You are not alone.

00:37:44.640 That is the biggest thing, Allie, that young women feel or older, whatever age, they don't 0.99

00:37:50.140 want to feel alone.

00:37:51.340 I had to drive myself to an abortion clinic.

00:37:54.540 How more alone could I have been that he couldn't even take the time to take me and

00:37:59.900 go with me?

00:38:01.760 Women need support. 1.00

00:38:03.140 They need to know they have support.

00:38:04.340 So that just reiterated to me, see, nobody's helping me.

00:38:07.860 And I didn't tell anyone, you know, I wasn't going to tell your mother.

00:38:10.860 Girls, if you're not telling your mother something, that's called a clue, by the way.

00:38:14.020 But listen to her.

00:38:16.100 Show her support.

00:38:16.960 The next thing I would do, and I keep going back to it, but I will, until I can never shut

00:38:23.740 up, I'll never shut up about it, is what I should say.

00:38:26.620 Pregnancy resource centers are one of the greatest resources in your area for these kinds

00:38:32.240 of situations.

00:38:33.320 They have compassionate women and men who are working there, who are volunteering there,

00:38:38.400 who that's what they're waiting for is a call like that.

00:38:40.660 They're not there to condemn and judge.

00:38:42.180 And if they do, if you called one out of the blue, um, that was one that was doing

00:38:46.860 that, hang up and call me, get in touch with me or call the next one.

00:38:51.080 The majority, if not all of them are not going to have that kind of response.

00:38:54.960 No, I've never, I've never seen that.

00:38:56.540 And you have, you know, you've worked with a lot of them too.

00:38:59.160 And I have met.

00:38:59.920 They have incredible compassion for people in this situation.

00:39:03.220 So if you're the friend, call them.

00:39:05.020 They may say, well, we got to talk to your friend to schedule that ultrasound or the appointment.

00:39:08.600 That's protocol, but at least be on the phone and then hand the phone to your friend.

00:39:13.160 Call with her.

00:39:14.380 Don't just say, well, let me know what you decide and leave.

00:39:17.000 Yeah.

00:39:17.220 Because what she's going to feel is isolated and alone.

00:39:19.760 So support, support, listen, and then find that resource, which if you don't know it,

00:39:26.780 well, if you're listening to Allie, then she's telling you right now, um, reach out to Allie

00:39:31.720 if you have to, sorry, Allie, Allie will get in touch with me like you have it already

00:39:35.700 in the past and we'll help you find the resources.

00:39:38.760 Don't believe the lie.

00:39:40.160 There's no help available because it's simply not true.

00:39:42.700 Yeah, that's absolutely right.

00:39:44.040 And then for the friend who found out that a friend had an abortion, how does she help

00:39:50.520 her heal? 0.50

00:39:52.400 Same way.

00:39:53.220 You got to listen, listen and don't react.

00:39:56.140 Um, whatever you do, you don't want to look at her and go, how could you?

00:39:59.840 Yeah.

00:40:00.680 That's the last thing you want to do because then if she had more to tell you, she's going

00:40:04.460 to shut down.

00:40:05.080 She's not going to tell you.

00:40:06.060 If you're her, if you're truly her friend, for one thing, you're, you're a good friend

00:40:10.540 if she's willing to open up to you to tell you something she's probably not told many

00:40:13.840 people.

00:40:15.060 Listen, hug her, support her, and then tell her, I'm going to walk through this with you.

00:40:20.280 I know there's got to be help for people like you and I'm going to help you find it.

00:40:24.380 And I, I'm telling you the floodgates open up.

00:40:27.580 Yeah.

00:40:27.680 A lot of times when a friend tells you she's had an abortion, that may be a time for you to

00:40:32.280 tell her, so you, so have you.

00:40:33.800 That happens a lot.

00:40:35.960 When people feel safe, um, they feel more, they have more courage.

00:40:41.260 And my prayer always is when someone says, I need to tell somebody, pray about who that

00:40:47.400 person is.

00:40:48.100 And if you don't have that person, call your local pregnancy center. 0.76

00:40:51.520 Let them be the first one.

00:40:52.880 Because the worst thing that can happen is if you go to that judgmental friend or that

00:40:58.300 friend who's going to condemn you, that's just going to put her 20 steps back. 1.00

00:41:02.700 And it seems like from the stories that I've heard of women who were considering an abortion,

00:41:11.040 I asked, um, I just asked people on Instagram who follow me, tell me how you became pro-life.

00:41:16.860 And I got just a couple messages of people who had unplanned pregnancies when they were

00:41:21.060 a teenager and, um, the reasons why they changed their mind in not having an abortion.

00:41:26.900 One, I saw a lot of people say, um, that the boyfriend stepped up, that the guy stepped

00:41:32.560 up and said, don't do that.

00:41:34.000 That can be an absolute game changer.

00:41:35.920 And also the parents said, you don't have to go through with that.

00:41:39.580 We're going to support you.

00:41:40.440 So it seems like lack of support could be a reason why a lot of women have an abortion 0.96

00:41:45.200 and just support someone saying, you're not doing this alone.

00:41:49.280 Parents stepping up and saying, I'm sad that you're in this position, but we're going to

00:41:53.900 do everything we can to support you and gosh, the men, the men stepping up and saying, you

00:41:59.880 don't have to do it.

00:42:01.160 You're not going to do this alone.

00:42:02.580 Right?

00:42:03.040 No question.

00:42:03.760 No question.

00:42:04.500 Had my boyfriend walked into that abortion clinic and I was sitting in the waiting room

00:42:08.860 to be called back and said, Hey babe, let's go.

00:42:13.820 I'd have gladly took his hand and walked out.

00:42:16.600 Um, support is everything.

00:42:19.540 The last thing we want women to feel is that they're alone.

00:42:22.300 So men do need to step up. 0.72

00:42:24.840 But the problem is they don't know what to do or say because they've been told, shut

00:42:29.960 up, sit down.

00:42:30.880 Yeah.

00:42:31.180 It's not your body.

00:42:32.140 No opinion.

00:42:32.960 Exactly.

00:42:33.800 And so then I want to see men rise up and I'm convinced Allie with the millions upon millions

00:42:40.920 of people that are post-abortive men and women, once they find healing from having and choosing

00:42:46.840 abortion, it's going to change the landscape of pro-life. 1.00

00:42:50.660 I truly believe it because a lot of these people are keeping their mouths shut.

00:42:55.320 They don't want to tell anybody they're not healed.

00:42:57.380 When you're healed, you can't help it.

00:42:59.160 And that is not to say you have to do, go travel and speak like I do.

00:43:02.840 That's not what I mean.

00:43:03.560 Or telling everyone your story.

00:43:05.000 It may be your neighbor.

00:43:06.520 It may be that one coworker.

00:43:08.380 But 72 million abortions, I believe, since Roe v. Wade and counting, 140 million for the 0.88

00:43:16.160 sake of math that are out there that have had abortions.

00:43:19.560 If a percentage of those people found healing and then told one person, it would change everything.

00:43:25.600 I'm convinced after abortion recovery is a backdoor approach to how we're going to make 0.93

00:43:31.320 abortion unthinkable.

00:43:32.360 Yeah, dealing with the healing.

00:43:34.740 And like you said, when you're healed, you can't help it.

00:43:37.300 It changes things.

00:43:38.340 It changes your life.

00:43:39.240 It changes how you see things.

00:43:41.260 It changes what you talk about.

00:43:43.960 Talk about some of the lies, as you already touched on just now, but some of the other

00:43:48.820 lies that men are hearing or that we have believed that this is just a women's thing. 1.00

00:43:53.880 This is just a women's movement. 1.00

00:43:55.940 Men are totally unaffected by abortion, we hear.

00:43:59.460 But that's not true, as you've already touched on.

00:44:02.100 That's not true.

00:44:02.780 As I touched on with the father of my aborted child and how that conversation with, I spoke

00:44:07.520 at an event a couple years ago.

00:44:10.360 It was a men's event called It's New Canaan Men's Society, if you're familiar with that.

00:44:14.360 And they did their big conference in Orlando, Florida.

00:44:16.920 And they very rarely have female speakers.

00:44:19.420 And I spoke at their event.

00:44:22.180 After I spoke and shared my story, shared the story I shared with you about the father,

00:44:26.980 these men stood in line, Allie, for over two hours just to talk to me.

00:44:33.620 And some of them, for the first time, saying they had an abortion in their past because

00:44:38.200 they always felt they weren't allowed to say anything because that's what they've been

00:44:40.960 told.

00:44:41.680 This is a women's issue, not a man's issue.

00:44:44.600 Men who said, this is why I can't.

00:44:46.540 I have an issue committing.

00:44:48.120 I've never been able to commit.

00:44:49.260 When a woman gets too close, I break up with her. 1.00

00:44:51.400 Men telling me, this is why I'm a workaholic.

00:44:53.460 This is why I'm an alcoholic.

00:44:54.460 This is why I abuse drugs.

00:44:56.280 This is why I don't feel like I can relate or connect with my own children because of

00:45:01.500 fear.

00:45:02.500 All of these different things, same kinds of things I hear as well from the women. 1.00

00:45:07.100 Not a whole lot of difference.

00:45:08.840 I look at it like this.

00:45:10.040 When a woman finally comes to the realization she ended the life of her child, when God made 0.99

00:45:15.240 us to be nurturers, to be mothers, to care for our young, et cetera, it's devastating for

00:45:21.500 us to know that we ended the life of our child.

00:45:25.540 But for a man, men were made to be protectors.

00:45:29.160 Men are made to look after their women and their children. 0.71

00:45:32.480 When they did not protect their child and they participated in the death of their child,

00:45:37.640 they're just as devastated.

00:45:39.380 So there are men and women walking around with wounds all over this country.

00:45:44.280 And the fact that this is only about women infuriates me.

00:45:49.920 I had a man recently, I spoke in California last week, and this gentleman came to me and

00:45:55.600 said, you know, your keynote was a full package.

00:45:59.800 I said, how's that?

00:46:00.720 He said, you're not just pro-unborn and pro-life.

00:46:03.800 You're pro-woman and you're pro-man. 0.96

00:46:06.340 Because I mostly hear how much women hate men because it's their fault these women are 1.00

00:46:11.540 having to choose abortion.

00:46:13.300 And I said, that's just a lie and propaganda that they've been fed to keep their mouths

00:46:18.780 shut.

00:46:19.300 Because think about it.

00:46:20.020 If men rise up and say, no, babe, you're not doing that, or they walk in that waiting

00:46:24.820 room, hey, let's go.

00:46:26.060 You don't belong here.

00:46:28.580 The abortion industry knows when men take their place in this issue, their business is going 1.00

00:46:35.220 to be hurt very badly.

00:46:36.960 They're a multi-billion dollar business.

00:46:39.660 And many times people tell me, Allie, I never thought of the abortion industry as a business.

00:46:45.360 Oh, wake up.

00:46:46.680 It's a multi-billion dollar business.

00:46:48.860 It has nothing to do with women's health or women's rights. 0.90

00:46:52.820 It has to do with their bottom line.

00:46:54.580 Oh, I think we, even people who are aware of that, we probably don't even know all of

00:47:00.880 the evil that goes on.

00:47:02.460 Thankfully, there are great journalists.

00:47:04.720 David Daleiden is one of those undercover journalists.

00:47:07.160 We saw the University of Pittsburgh doing these horrific experiments using baby scalps

00:47:14.000 funded by our tax dollars.

00:47:18.020 And I think that's just what we know.

00:47:20.760 There's so much and people just don't understand because of the euphemisms and the propaganda

00:47:25.420 that, you know, you talk about often that's surrounding abortion, what it actually, what

00:47:31.560 it actually is.

00:47:33.060 So SBA, which is the bill that became law in Texas, as we kind of already mentioned earlier,

00:47:42.040 it would allow a citizen to sue, say someone like your boyfriend, if he helped you in any

00:47:50.640 way or someone who helped the abortion, aided and abetted the abortion financially, even I

00:47:55.860 believe it would if the babysitter who babysits the woman's other children while she's going 0.90

00:48:03.340 to get an abortion, all of those people are not condemned under the law.

00:48:06.700 They can just be sued for, I believe it's up to $10,000.

00:48:10.120 Now, you're talking about this being a men's issue where, for example, your boyfriend realized

00:48:16.560 years later, wow, this was wrong.

00:48:18.860 Now, I wonder if SB8 had been in place and someone had sued him into what may have been

00:48:26.100 at that point financial ruin, like, do we think the redemption that he then experienced and

00:48:31.740 the healing that he then experienced would be possible?

00:48:34.020 I guess what I'm asking is, as someone who is supported, I support pro-life laws.

00:48:38.260 I support SB8.

00:48:39.620 Um, but do we think that it can be counterproductive to the healing process that you and I both

00:48:49.500 believe is important to people who have experienced abortion?

00:48:53.840 I don't know.

00:48:54.180 I'm kind of putting you on the spot, but what do you think about that?

00:48:57.780 I support it as well.

00:48:59.420 Um, for sure.

00:49:01.160 Do I think it would be counterproductive had it been in place then is what you're asking

00:49:05.280 me?

00:49:05.440 Or do you think it could be counterproductive for men now, say a man is sued because they

00:49:10.700 helped their girlfriend get an abortion?

00:49:13.460 Um, do you think that it could be counterproductive in his healing process and ruin his life in

00:49:19.260 some ways?

00:49:20.220 I mean, what do you think about that?

00:49:21.920 Or do we just kind of have to live in that tension of not really?

00:49:24.820 I think we have to live in it.

00:49:25.980 I think that the law is, I'd love to see this law in every state.

00:49:29.800 Um, I think that if people are so concerned about it, they should get educated and pay attention

00:49:34.900 and ask it, look, if you're going to drive someone to go drive a car and they're going

00:49:38.900 to go in and rob someone, but you didn't, you know, well, Hey, I didn't, I didn't go

00:49:43.140 in there and they killed them.

00:49:44.320 You're going to be held accountable.

00:49:46.280 Yeah.

00:49:46.480 So, um, I think that, um, I just, I don't want it.

00:49:51.020 I think it's a great law.

00:49:52.380 I don't want it to change.

00:49:53.520 I think more people have got to start taking responsibility instead of sticking their heads

00:49:57.840 in the sand or saying, that's not my problem.

00:49:59.880 Yeah.

00:50:00.040 I don't want you to have a baby. 0.99

00:50:01.080 So you're going to go have this abortion. 1.00

00:50:02.320 You know, they're not thinking about what it's going to do to her, um, because they

00:50:07.220 don't care or they, they do know, and they still don't care.

00:50:10.220 Yeah.

00:50:10.720 So no, I think, I think part of the healing is going to come because you're so desperate

00:50:15.560 and you're so vulnerable that you get to a place where you're sick and tired of feeling

00:50:18.900 that way.

00:50:19.440 Allie, I've had people that are atheist and agnostic who at least profess they are.

00:50:24.360 Tell me, I want to go through your healing retreats because I don't believe like you do, 0.99

00:50:29.400 but I cannot live this way anymore.

00:50:30.980 I have been seeing a, a doctor for years and years.

00:50:34.520 I've been on different antidepressants.

00:50:36.380 Nothing is changing how I feel.

00:50:38.580 What they don't know that I know is that our children were, were created before in our,

00:50:45.960 in our mother's womb, you know, he knitted us in our mother's womb, knew us before we

00:50:49.980 were even knitted in our mother's womb.

00:50:51.460 So it's only a spiritual God that can fill that void that you feel from abortion.

00:50:58.780 And that's why I think so many people looking at other ways to find healing aren't finding

00:51:03.300 it.

00:51:03.800 Yeah.

00:51:04.320 And that's the reason because the secret is only God can do it.

00:51:07.640 Yeah.

00:51:07.840 There has to be that balance of accountability because the accountability that is placed

00:51:13.880 on people who aid and abet and perform abortions is for the protection of the child.

00:51:19.380 We care about the protection of the child, even as we care about the healing for the men

00:51:22.980 and women who have had abortion in their lives.

00:51:25.300 But we can't say that healing and accountability are mutually exclusive.

00:51:30.720 Yes.

00:51:30.940 I mean, they, they have to go together if we care about the right to life for the baby,

00:51:35.040 which we unequivocally do, even as we care about.

00:51:37.620 Absolutely.

00:51:37.980 We can't say, well, this may hurt your healing.

00:51:40.320 So we're going to make an exception for you.

00:51:42.940 Yeah.

00:51:43.240 I agree.

00:51:43.800 I hear, I hear exactly what you're saying.

00:51:45.280 I totally agree because the unborn child has rights as well.

00:51:49.020 Yeah.

00:51:49.320 And so you can't.

00:51:50.760 That's what's so often forgotten in these conversations.

00:51:52.540 It is.

00:51:53.060 Not our conversations, but pro-choice conversations for sure.

00:51:56.280 It's just.

00:51:56.600 Oh, it's not forgotten.

00:51:57.340 They know.

00:51:57.980 Yeah.

00:51:58.140 They know.

00:51:58.620 They just paint the narrative the way they need to, to keep that

00:52:00.920 multi-billion dollar industry alive.

00:52:02.820 Yeah.

00:52:03.140 They know.

00:52:04.140 Abortionists have even know they're aborting children. 1.00

00:52:06.340 They've said it.

00:52:07.460 They know exactly what they're doing, but if they can convince enough people to believe

00:52:11.840 it's not, the child has no rights because there's nothing there.

00:52:16.400 Yeah.

00:52:16.640 They'll keep their business going.

00:52:18.600 Yeah.

00:52:19.400 So it's a sick business.

00:52:20.680 It's a sick business.

00:52:21.740 Sick, evil, wicked business.

00:52:23.240 You're doing amazing work from all different sides, convincing people that abortion is wrong

00:52:27.880 while also offering help afterwards.

00:52:31.100 A lot of people, I won't say a lot of people aren't doing that because I think there are

00:52:35.100 so many pregnancy resource centers that are doing that, but a lot of people don't know

00:52:39.160 that that is what is being offered.

00:52:42.760 Can you tell people, like, how can they get in touch with you?

00:52:45.360 How can they learn more about these healing retreats?

00:52:47.340 I know there are people out there that are saying, wait, I need that.

00:52:50.360 Where can they buy your book?

00:52:51.540 All that good stuff.

00:52:52.360 You can go to reassemblelife.com and find out about the retreat, send an email through

00:52:57.760 there, and you can get my book right now on Amazon.

00:53:02.360 Apparently, Amazon bought my publishing company, so it's on Amazon now, but I will be offering

00:53:07.060 it as well on the website because a lot of people tell me, can I get your book a different

00:53:10.940 way?

00:53:11.700 So reassemblelife.com is a way to get in touch with me.

00:53:14.420 I'm on social media, Instagram, Facebook.

00:53:17.040 I deleted my Twitter account.

00:53:18.860 Yeah, I understand.

00:53:19.680 During the election period, but find me, and I will make sure and help you find the resources

00:53:25.680 you need, whether it's a reassemble retreat or a different kind of retreat.

00:53:29.940 Whatever works for you, I will help you get the help you need.

00:53:33.580 Okay.

00:53:33.980 Well, thank you so much.

00:53:35.100 Thanks for taking the time.

00:53:36.140 Thank you, Allie.

Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - November 22, 2021

Ep 527 ｜ Healing from Abortion & Using Your Story for Good ｜ Guest： Victoria Robinson

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