Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - Ep 615 ｜ How to Respond to Pro-Abortion Propaganda & Vitriol ｜ Guest： Alison Centofante

00:00:00.000 Hey guys, welcome to Relatable.

00:00:01.520 Happy Wednesday.

00:00:02.580 This episode is brought to you by our friends at Good Ranchers.

00:00:05.140 Go to goodranchers.com slash Allie.

00:00:07.000 That's goodranchers.com slash Allie.

00:00:18.080 Okay guys, I have a fun and uplifting and encouraging and equipping episode for you

00:00:22.660 today and I'm talking to my friend Allison Cintifonte.

00:00:26.200 Isn't that a fun last name?

00:00:28.140 We are talking about motherhood.

00:00:31.720 She has about a month old and so we are going to talk about her transition from being a

00:00:38.040 mom of one to being a mom of two. 0.87

00:00:39.700 She's going to tell us a little bit about her birth story and just some advice for new moms 1.00

00:00:44.560 and moms of little ones.

00:00:46.340 But we are mostly going to be talking about what is happening right now in the abortion

00:00:50.820 world.

00:00:51.400 We are going to talk about the reaction, the protest, the vitriol that we are seeing from

00:00:56.220 the pro-abortion slash quote unquote pro-choice left in regard to the possibility of Roe v.

00:01:03.320 Wade being overturned.

00:01:04.540 If you want more information about what exactly happened there with the leak of the draft and

00:01:08.340 all that, we'll link the previous episode on that so you can get up to date.

00:01:14.340 She's going to give us some talking points, some advice on how to engage with people from

00:01:20.060 the other side.

00:01:21.000 The fact of the matter is, is that there's a lot going on right now.

00:01:24.140 There is a lot of hatred, a lot of anger, a lot of myths and disinformation, a lot of

00:01:29.280 propaganda.

00:01:30.140 I know you guys as pro-lifers are feeling overwhelmed online.

00:01:33.720 You're feeling bullied.

00:01:34.780 You're feeling intimidated.

00:01:35.940 I've talked to some of you who have been the only one at work where you are hearing the

00:01:41.500 women that you work with talk about how important abortion access is and how dangerous 1.00

00:01:47.320 overturning Roe v.

00:01:48.340 Wade is.

00:01:48.740 And you've been afraid you've been afraid to speak up, which is understandable.

00:01:52.680 But that is exactly what the pro-abortion side wants.

00:01:58.120 They are using, as we will talk about today, really scary intimidation tactics to try to

00:02:03.160 bully you, to try to silence you.

00:02:04.820 There is this radical group called Jane's Revenge that told to send a communication to

00:02:13.100 someone named Robert Evans of iHeartMedia and basically said that anti-choice establishments,

00:02:19.720 fake clinics is what they call pro-life clinics, and anti-choice groups have a 30-day ultimatum

00:02:27.680 before they get attacked, I guess, which is really disturbing.

00:02:34.620 And we're going to talk about a little bit what that has looked like over the past few

00:02:38.240 days.

00:02:38.620 These pro-life clinics and centers have unfortunately been targeted.

00:02:42.860 Don't be intimidated.

00:02:44.300 This is worth it.

00:02:45.560 The babies in the womb who are being slaughtered, 2,000 of them on a daily basis, they don't have

00:02:50.360 a voice.

00:02:50.920 They don't have political power.

00:02:52.200 They don't have a way to protest.

00:02:53.640 They don't have a way to advocate for their own rights. 0.56

00:02:56.800 That's where we come in.

00:02:58.300 We advocate for the babies.

00:02:59.860 And as you'll hear us talk about today, we are also advocating for the moms in this.

00:03:05.400 So you guys know I'm super passionate about this.

00:03:08.580 This is as important as it has ever been.

00:03:11.600 And I hope that you leave this feeling empowered because of what Allison is going to talk to us

00:03:19.040 about and feeling encouraged and trusting the fact that if God is for us, who can be against

00:03:25.540 us and that we serve a very powerful God and that the light does have the power to push back

00:03:31.760 the darkness.

00:03:35.160 Allison, thank you so much for joining us.

00:03:37.580 For those who may not follow you on Instagram, who may not be familiar, can you tell everyone

00:03:41.800 who you are and what you do?

00:03:43.780 Oh, you're so sweet.

00:03:44.900 So I'm Allison Cenefonte.

00:03:46.280 I have been working in the pro-life movement for over a decade and have had the privilege

00:03:50.720 of working at great organizations, legal organizations in the pro-life movement, media, PR.

00:03:55.760 And now I am running my own kind of consulting company and working with other pro-life groups

00:04:00.520 because I have two babies now.

00:04:02.400 So I love media.

00:04:04.140 I love figuring out how to take this message of life and make it make sense to people from,

00:04:09.420 you know, your mom, my mom at home to like legislators. 0.99

00:04:12.820 This is the biggest, you know, human rights abuse of our time.

00:04:15.240 So I'm really, I'm in it to win it.

00:04:17.500 And we're really close to a little win here.

00:04:20.160 So it's been a very busy week, even though I have like a 25-day-old baby.

00:04:24.680 Yes, we're going to talk about all of that.

00:04:26.140 We're going to talk about Ro.

00:04:26.920 We're going to talk about the reaction and what you think it means.

00:04:29.900 You do do amazing work, especially as far as messaging and communication goes,

00:04:34.620 which is like a huge, huge chunk of the battle is making our message clear and also compelling.

00:04:40.900 And you have done a lot to advance that cause in that arena.

00:04:45.040 So I'm very thankful for that.

00:04:46.620 I want to talk first, though, about just like mom stuff and just to hear how you're doing.

00:04:51.820 You said that you have a 25-day-old and then your oldest is how old?

00:04:56.560 She's a little bit older than two. 0.95

00:04:58.000 She turned two in May or March, excuse me.

00:05:00.860 Yes.

00:05:01.180 Oh, my goodness.

00:05:01.840 Okay.

00:05:02.040 So tell me, tell us about the transition from one to two.

00:05:04.760 Most people listening to this audience or listening to this podcast are moms, and so they get it,

00:05:09.280 and they, I'm sure, would love to hear your experience.

00:05:11.540 I love it.

00:05:12.180 No, it's so fun being in like the mom motherhood club, right?

00:05:15.560 Like all of a sudden you're thrown in and it's like, okay, let me tell you everything.

00:05:19.300 Here's my advice.

00:05:20.020 Here's my best products.

00:05:21.260 It's good.

00:05:22.420 One to two has been interesting, but I feel like God gives you like a supernatural strength.

00:05:29.020 Yeah.

00:05:29.220 Um, if you had told me like we could do what we do on little sleep, uh, I wouldn't believe

00:05:35.100 you, but you know, you just, you know, God gives you strength.

00:05:38.920 Um, but yeah, I, I want to focus on the good.

00:05:41.460 Cause I think that so often as moms, it's easy to like vent on the bad.

00:05:45.360 I, I realized it's, it's like war zone mentality, right?

00:05:48.720 Like if you meet another mom that's in the foxhole, you're like, this is it.

00:05:52.920 Like, this is tough.

00:05:53.800 Like you're doing a great job, but like, this is hard.

00:05:56.120 But I never want, you know, someone who's not in the foxhole, like a young girl who's 1.00

00:06:01.180 not married yet, doesn't have a kid to be freaked out by it.

00:06:05.040 Right.

00:06:05.260 Um, I still remember being at my first pro-life event in DC and there was a mom there with

00:06:10.820 her little like baby, like infant.

00:06:12.780 And I was like, how's it going?

00:06:14.300 You know, I didn't know what to ask as a single girl.

00:06:16.940 How's it going?

00:06:17.680 And she said, this is so much fun.

00:06:20.260 Like, this is so much fun.

00:06:21.840 Yes.

00:06:22.200 And I just was like, oh my gosh, that's the first time someone's given me like a really

00:06:26.720 positive reaction versus this terrible, like sleep while you can and then like negative

00:06:33.840 thing.

00:06:34.860 So, um, it's, I just want to focus on the good.

00:06:37.400 I know it's going to go by fast.

00:06:38.780 I know that it's a season, you know, like it's not going to be forever.

00:06:42.740 And so, um, thankfully I have little amazing women like you and the foxhole with me when, 1.00

00:06:48.840 when it gets tough and when ear infections come, but like at the same time, it's the

00:06:52.940 most beautiful, happy, I mean, it brings you to tears.

00:06:56.160 Like some of these moments you get to experience as a mom.

00:06:58.820 Yeah.

00:06:59.060 I do think that the prevailing message, obviously this is something that we talk about on this

00:07:02.840 podcast a lot, this idea of toxic mommy culture and how I think that there are just

00:07:07.680 a lot of women, unfortunately on social media with a lot of influence who for likes and 1.00

00:07:13.420 affirmation joke, quote unquote, about how terrible being a mom is and what brats and 0.85

00:07:21.500 burdens their kids are.

00:07:22.740 But then they'll kind of caveat it by saying, oh, but you know, I love them.

00:07:27.500 Of course I love them.

00:07:28.420 Of course I'm going to take care of them.

00:07:30.020 But it seems like the prevailing message is that motherhood really steals your identity

00:07:36.200 and steals your purpose and steals your fulfillment, that it's like a break from who you really

00:07:42.640 are and that you have to, you're basically like a victim of motherhood when really it

00:07:48.640 should be the opposite prevailing message that motherhood is fun. 0.83

00:07:52.460 Motherhood is fulfilling.

00:07:53.760 Motherhood, once you become a mom, is who you are. 0.97

00:07:56.100 It's not just like this break from your identity and purpose.

00:07:58.780 It also, caveat, it also is hard, but it's like the opposite.

00:08:04.640 It's like the prevailing message is that it's really hard, but sometimes it's fun and you

00:08:07.920 remember that you like your kids.

00:08:09.320 Really, the dominant message should be that it's awesome.

00:08:11.520 You love your kids so much and also it can be hard, but it's a good hard.

00:08:15.640 In the same way that when you stretch and you really need to stretch and it hurts, but it's

00:08:21.640 a different kind of hurt from an injury, it's a good kind of hurt.

00:08:25.920 Stretching your muscles is a good kind of pain.

00:08:28.180 I think that's the same thing with motherhood.

00:08:30.280 It's a good kind of hurt and you're absolutely right.

00:08:34.140 The messaging, the PR around motherhood on social media is really bad and I feel like that

00:08:39.560 could contribute to a lot of the problems that we're seeing.

00:08:42.580 Yeah, and you know, when I had Grace, I kind of, at a late night nursing session, just asked

00:08:46.900 a bunch of my followers like, girls, what are you afraid of in pregnancy?

00:08:50.900 And so many girls were like, I'm afraid of not being able to travel anymore. 1.00

00:08:57.040 I'm afraid of getting fat.

00:08:59.460 I'm afraid of, you know, not getting to pursue my career.

00:09:04.160 Like there was so much fear and it made me realize like, and I felt this too a little

00:09:09.120 bit before I got pregnant.

00:09:10.160 Oh my gosh, even though I'm pro-life, even though I love the Lord and I know that I want to

00:09:15.600 have kids and I want to have a family one day, that doesn't mean that I didn't grow up

00:09:20.260 in a time where we're constantly getting this message of, you know, open any magazine at

00:09:27.480 a nail salon, Ali, you know this.

00:09:29.140 Like every fifth ad is for contraception.

00:09:31.540 And what does it say?

00:09:32.460 Like your job is your career.

00:09:33.860 You're not ready for a baby.

00:09:35.060 Like take this pill and delay.

00:09:37.280 And, and these messages still permeated my mind and my spirit so that when I even wasn't

00:09:43.220 a great, you know, married, happy, ready, I was freaking out.

00:09:46.180 Oh my gosh, this is the great unknown.

00:09:48.420 What's going to happen.

00:09:49.320 And so it's normal for us as women, even though you're pro-life and you're believers to kind

00:09:53.540 of be nervous.

00:09:54.160 We've grown up in a time where, like you said, everyone is, is giving you this negative message

00:09:58.480 and it just, it took me some prayer and some time to connect my head and my heart.

00:10:03.140 And God had to kind of really work in me to go, Alison, like, this is my created order.

00:10:08.840 This is good.

00:10:10.020 I say that this is good.

00:10:11.500 And if I say it's good, why, why would you not want to participate in it?

00:10:15.260 Why would you not want to be a part of this great commission of creating?

00:10:19.900 Um, and that I've carried that into pregnancy and to motherhood of like, I'm on a commission

00:10:25.940 with God where I can't do this without him.

00:10:30.380 Like I can't create without him.

00:10:32.600 He has hands all over this and he needs me.

00:10:34.500 And it's like this really neat partnership that men don't get to do.

00:10:38.680 And you know, I want to, I want to honor that, that that's a big role.

00:10:42.480 And, um, just like you said, you're stretching new muscles, but those muscles, I'm more confident.

00:10:48.700 Also all you young women listening that are like in your twenties, I am the third thirties

00:10:53.300 rock motherhood rocks.

00:10:54.960 I'm more confident now than I've ever been in my twenties.

00:10:57.560 Something happens.

00:10:58.500 It's really cool to step into.

00:10:59.880 So I'm excited.

00:11:01.200 I, I, I love being a mom and, um, talking to other moms, but, um, yeah, there's a, there's

00:11:07.020 also a book I'm flipping through called mom genes.

00:11:09.200 It's G E N E S. 1.00

00:11:10.760 It's how your body and your mind changes in pregnancy and motherhood and creates this unique

00:11:16.920 biological bond between mom and child.

00:11:19.060 And it's not even a pro-life book.

00:11:20.300 It's not even written by a believer.

00:11:21.420 Um, but it just kind of reaffirms the beautiful, unique moment of pregnancy and motherhood.

00:11:28.500 Yeah.

00:11:29.220 There are so many aspects to it.

00:11:30.960 There's just obviously such an intention there in the creation between mom and child and everything

00:11:37.060 that goes on in pregnancy. 0.91

00:11:39.560 Um, and then just the connections that are established and already like the formation

00:11:44.960 of a child psychology and personality and brain, all of that stuff happens inside the womb, which

00:11:50.400 kind of connects to everything that we're about to talk about.

00:11:52.520 But first, before, before we get into that, if you are willing, people love just in general,

00:11:58.880 but I would say probably my audience in particular, people love a good birth story.

00:12:04.140 And you and I have talked about it a little bit.

00:12:05.860 You can give as much or as little detail as you want, um, in your last birth.

00:12:11.480 But can you tell us just like a little bit about how that went?

00:12:15.220 Like when did the contraction start?

00:12:17.300 All of that.

00:12:17.800 How'd you feel after?

00:12:18.740 And a little bit just about how postpartum has gone.

00:12:21.580 And okay, before anyone stops listening, cause I hate birth stories.

00:12:25.460 You do?

00:12:25.980 I will not make, I do.

00:12:27.320 I have no desire to hear about the scariest moment or what went wrong.

00:12:31.660 Um, I know it's like a unique thing.

00:12:33.200 Some women love it. 1.00

00:12:34.100 Some don't like, well, if you want to fast forward, y'all can definitely fast forward.

00:12:38.080 Like if you're someone who is about to give birth for the first time and you don't want

00:12:40.900 to think about like all of the possible outcomes, that's fine.

00:12:43.180 But at the same time, I like them because I think that they're, they're educational and you

00:12:47.980 don't know what could happen.

00:12:49.120 And so I always think it's comforting to hear someone else's, like someone else's

00:12:54.000 scenario and that they did come out the other side.

00:12:56.280 Like it's always, I think it's comforting to think of the worst case scenario and to

00:13:00.060 think, okay, well that person went through that and they're okay.

00:13:02.120 So it's fine.

00:13:03.460 And I, and that's how I'm going to color it too, because I actually wish I listened to

00:13:06.740 more birth stories because I wasn't ready.

00:13:09.540 I really wasn't ready for anything to go outside of what I expected.

00:13:12.920 But, um, so with my first, um, I kind of had a moment of, of fear where she had the

00:13:19.960 umbilical cord wrapped around her neck when she was born.

00:13:22.740 And so they had to bring in the NICU and the river and it all took like a minute or

00:13:26.240 two, but it felt very long and that was a little scary.

00:13:28.780 And so, um, I remember in that moment being like, God, like I want to hear her cry.

00:13:32.580 And, um, and I named her grace in that moment.

00:13:36.200 Cause I had a couple of names, but I was like, God, give me like, give me grace.

00:13:40.120 Like I need you to be kind to me right now.

00:13:43.260 And so grace is doing wonderful.

00:13:45.200 She's my two year old.

00:13:46.400 Um, and then with hope, um, I know I'm building out a Christmas card here.

00:13:50.280 I just love these meaningful names with hope.

00:13:53.420 Um, she was born on April 13th and we, I went pretty far.

00:13:57.480 I was 40 weeks and five days and went in and had to advocate for myself.

00:14:02.800 I said, this is a big baby.

00:14:04.520 They were telling me, Allie, that she was nine pounds, eight ounces. 1.00

00:14:07.840 And for reference, for everyone who doesn't know, Alison is very petite. 0.98

00:14:12.360 Yes.

00:14:13.360 I am somewhat like close to being a midget.

00:14:15.440 I'm like five, two, um, for reference, grace was my first was five pounds, six ounces. 0.74

00:14:21.280 She was a little baby.

00:14:22.300 Yeah.

00:14:22.480 So, um, we go in and, um, everything seems to be going well, but right.

00:14:29.680 You know, any mom that has had a baby knows things can be really common.

00:14:32.940 And then all of a sudden they're like, all right, you really need to push.

00:14:34.880 This needs to be urgent.

00:14:36.140 And, um, I was pushing really hard and they said that her umbilical cord had torn at some

00:14:41.880 point and her, both her shoulders were stuck.

00:14:43.960 And so all of a sudden I just had these nurses really pushing down on my stomach to help get 0.54

00:14:48.100 her out. 0.82

00:14:48.460 And it got heightened.

00:14:49.580 Did you have an epidural?

00:14:50.380 I did.

00:14:52.260 Thank God.

00:14:53.060 Yeah, I did.

00:14:53.860 I chose to go that route.

00:14:55.280 Um, respect to anyone who doesn't, but, um, they are, you're getting her out.

00:15:00.900 They're really urgent.

00:15:01.760 Alison, you need to push, push, push. 0.96

00:15:03.260 And I'm like, I'm trying.

00:15:04.240 You're like, I am.

00:15:05.740 Try me.

00:15:07.180 Um, and you don't get practice, right?

00:15:09.180 Like all of a sudden you're told to do something your body's never done.

00:15:11.740 Yeah.

00:15:12.040 So she came out again, not breathing.

00:15:14.300 And I just thought, God, again, like again.

00:15:18.000 And, um, I couldn't look at her alley.

00:15:20.200 This is actually the first time I'm sharing this with anyone.

00:15:22.160 So, um, I just, I couldn't look at her.

00:15:24.800 I didn't know what was right in that moment.

00:15:27.660 Um, the sweetener said, you can look at her. 0.58

00:15:29.600 And I just thought, what am I looking at?

00:15:31.660 Like, what is she breathing?

00:15:33.680 Do I want, if she's not breathing and I don't get to leave with her, do I want to see, do

00:15:38.320 I not want to see?

00:15:38.940 It was really crazy.

00:15:40.860 What's going on in your head.

00:15:42.600 And, um, my husband was calm, but I could see he's crying, but like a prayerful cry,

00:15:48.740 like tearing up, you know, and I'm praying.

00:15:51.420 And I just remember saying to God, like, Lord, do not forsake me in my time of need.

00:15:56.180 Do not forsake me.

00:15:57.020 Do not turn your face for me. 0.81

00:15:58.060 Like, please, please let her cry and let her be okay.

00:16:02.620 And, um, the NICU team came in and, and they got her to breathe and she wasn't doing great

00:16:09.340 at the beginning, but by like five minutes, she was, she was breathing, like getting color

00:16:13.240 tone.

00:16:13.620 And I just was, I'm so blessed.

00:16:16.620 I'm so lucky, but it took me a week or two after delivery to process those emotions of

00:16:22.900 like all of that, that happening.

00:16:26.040 And so I was just really grateful to be in a, in, you know, in the situation where we

00:16:30.240 did have a NICU team ready to help.

00:16:32.000 And, um, and, you know, of course at the end, after all of the tension comes down, they're

00:16:36.740 like, Oh, you know, babies are resilient.

00:16:39.020 Like everyone says like, it's okay.

00:16:40.600 It's okay.

00:16:40.900 But they didn't know.

00:16:42.500 I didn't know.

00:16:43.280 Right.

00:16:43.820 At that time.

00:16:44.620 So, um, yeah, I, I think for me, it was a lesson of gosh, those desperate prayers, I

00:16:50.680 think are so powerful.

00:16:52.780 And also like I had to walk through that and I did share that some on Instagram and hopefully

00:16:59.040 with your followers and hopefully it encourages other moms.

00:17:01.420 It's normal to have to process.

00:17:03.700 Yeah.

00:17:03.900 Uh, there's a healing that happens in your body, but also I think there's a healing that has

00:17:08.340 to happen in your mind of that was a crazy, that was that, that didn't go as I planned

00:17:14.180 and the, what if game we've talked about this, you know, what if I had gone in earlier or

00:17:19.220 what if I didn't go in earlier or what if I chose to labor at home and all those what

00:17:24.700 ifs can really torment you.

00:17:25.860 So just praying and processing and saying it out loud so that other women can come around 0.96

00:17:32.340 you in this like tribe was really, it was really helpful for me.

00:17:35.920 Yeah, it is.

00:17:37.400 It is such a process of thinking back over your birth and thinking about those what ifs.

00:17:43.360 I would say one year later, I'm, I still find myself sometimes thinking about that

00:17:48.240 because both my births, people know who listened to this podcast, didn't go how I wanted them

00:17:53.240 to go to unplanned and unwanted C-sections, one more necessary than the other.

00:17:58.080 But I still think, I still think about to my first birth almost three years ago, thinking

00:18:02.080 what if I had advocated for myself more?

00:18:04.420 What if I had educated myself more?

00:18:06.240 What if I had gone with a different doctor?

00:18:08.040 There are so many different what ifs and really the thing that just comforts me and brings me

00:18:12.940 back.

00:18:13.560 It's not this idea of, well, all that matters is healthy mom, healthy baby, which is ultimately

00:18:18.600 true.

00:18:19.020 Of course, that's what you ultimately want is healthy mom, healthy baby. 1.00

00:18:22.540 But that doesn't mean that all of the other things leading up to the healthy mom, healthy

00:18:26.540 baby didn't have an impact on you that you need to really work through.

00:18:32.760 But still, even like working through those what ifs and working through like labor and

00:18:37.820 all the scary moments, I have to remember that God planned it.

00:18:42.560 I just have to, I just have to comfort myself with that, that God is sovereign over that,

00:18:47.160 that he wasn't like watching my birth and thinking, ooh, what's going to happen next?

00:18:52.660 Ooh, she should have done that. 0.99

00:18:54.100 Or how is this going to work out?

00:18:55.500 Well, that's not how God functions.

00:18:57.020 He is not on the linear timeline that we are.

00:18:59.080 He wrote every single one of our days before any of them came to be, including my children's,

00:19:03.340 by the way.

00:19:04.320 And so the birth story, as hard as they can be, they're exactly what God ordained.

00:19:12.040 And I just have to, I just have to trust that.

00:19:14.220 Like that is my comfort at the end of it when I find myself tormenting myself with all of

00:19:18.200 the different hypotheticals and all of that.

00:19:20.840 And I'm thankful for that reality, for sure.

00:19:23.280 I'm so glad.

00:19:24.000 No, thank you for sharing that.

00:19:25.340 It's so big.

00:19:26.120 I also think God can only teach you certain lessons through certain experiences.

00:19:31.440 I remember I was looking at Hope and thinking, is she looking at me correctly?

00:19:37.800 Is she okay?

00:19:38.320 Oh, yeah.

00:19:38.660 Maybe she didn't get enough oxygen.

00:19:39.780 Oh, yeah.

00:19:40.020 You know, and like in the middle of the night being like, maybe they, maybe she's not okay.

00:19:43.740 And I started freaking out.

00:19:45.100 And, and I remember thinking, God, I just want her to be perfect.

00:19:49.680 Yeah.

00:19:50.260 And just like that, he went, so did I, I wanted all my kids to be perfect.

00:19:54.300 Like, but you guys aren't, like, we aren't his creation.

00:20:00.320 Like, I'm not perfect.

00:20:01.840 Like, I'm like, God, please make my daughter perfect.

00:20:03.800 And he's like, that's not, that's, I made one perfect person.

00:20:07.160 You know, I made one perfect person.

00:20:08.820 And that, that's a lesson I wouldn't have, I wouldn't have hit in the same way unless

00:20:13.020 I went through this.

00:20:13.880 And, um, I remember just like thinking through how devastated I would be if I didn't leave

00:20:21.500 with hope that day.

00:20:22.580 And I've had to kind of struggle with God and be like, what if that was your will for

00:20:27.360 me?

00:20:27.600 Like, how would that wreck me?

00:20:30.000 My faith?

00:20:30.580 How would that trans? 1.00

00:20:31.360 Like, I know that that's a reality for some people, maybe for some people listening, like

00:20:35.120 you didn't leave the hospital with the baby.

00:20:37.140 And I, I can't even fathom the pain.

00:20:41.200 And yet God reminded me, that's what God went through.

00:20:44.260 Yeah.

00:20:44.980 God did make a perfect child and that child didn't make it that that child was killed.

00:20:50.080 I mean, like lost his life for us, you know, and God had to look away like that pain that

00:20:56.000 a parent could feel.

00:20:57.740 I mean, love makes you vulnerable, right?

00:20:59.240 Like now you're vulnerable to that level of pain.

00:21:02.520 And God's just been so good to remind me, like, I went through that already.

00:21:06.580 Like I did.

00:21:07.760 I already went through separation from my kid and I'm with every parent that goes through

00:21:13.380 that.

00:21:13.680 And I would have been with you, girl, you know?

00:21:15.440 And, um, it's just, again, in some way, becoming a mom, a parent to, to a child helps

00:21:22.640 you under, I don't know.

00:21:23.540 You just have to build a different relationship with the Lord.

00:21:25.280 He teaches you different things.

00:21:26.560 It's really neat.

00:21:27.400 On the one hand, it's like, it's, you know, it can be a little complex because obviously

00:21:36.920 God is triune.

00:21:38.360 Jesus is the son of God.

00:21:39.560 Jesus is God.

00:21:40.580 And so on the, on the one hand, it's amazing thinking about God's love, like how much would

00:21:45.360 he have to love us to send your child, to send your only son to die a gruesome death

00:21:51.000 on the cross that he did not deserve?

00:21:53.220 What I do, I don't love anyone enough outside of my family to sacrifice my child.

00:21:58.480 Like I would never do that.

00:21:59.780 So like how much does he love us that he would do that?

00:22:03.540 And then in the other sense, you think about like how much God loves us to come down, to

00:22:08.880 like sacrifice himself, um, on our, on our behalf, that he loves his children so much

00:22:15.820 that he would give himself and pay the debt that we had to pay.

00:22:19.780 So yeah, there is so much gospel significance.

00:22:21.500 And then that's also true, like in adoption, we as Gentiles, we were adopted through Christ

00:22:27.100 by God.

00:22:27.740 And that's a beautiful picture of the gospel.

00:22:29.240 And so is adoption here on earth, a picture of that.

00:22:32.100 Um, all of this kind of brings into focus everything that you talk about and what we're

00:22:36.960 really focusing on today.

00:22:38.500 And that is the gift of motherhood, the importance and the value of life inside the womb.

00:22:43.940 And what we're seeing right now in the reaction to the possibility of Roe v.

00:22:47.440 Wade being overturned from the pro-abortion, pro-choice side.

00:22:52.320 And that is what looks like total pro-death rapidity, like the, the protest, the reaction, the

00:23:00.440 vitriol that we are seeing about the possibility of abortion now just being a question of state

00:23:06.860 legislation.

00:23:08.040 Um, it's out of control and we're going to play some clips, um, just looking at some of

00:23:13.080 the, the protests and the reaction that we've seen, but like, what's your, what's your take

00:23:17.100 on all of that?

00:23:17.700 What have, what have you thought as you've been seeing the responses from the pro-choice

00:23:22.180 left after this news came out, especially as a postpartum mom, I mean, that's hormonal

00:23:26.760 and emotional anyway.

00:23:27.640 So how is that going?

00:23:30.000 Yeah, no, the, the emotions and hormones have made me think like, can someone tell Amy Coney

00:23:34.600 Barrett to go into hiding with her children?

00:23:36.220 Like, like the children protect her.

00:23:39.360 And that's, that's where my head went.

00:23:41.700 As soon as I, the leak was happened.

00:23:43.620 And now we're seeing these protests all over the country at the Supreme court.

00:23:47.520 I've got friends down there that are pro-life and are standing their ground.

00:23:50.660 It is wildly violent.

00:23:52.880 And, and, and friends have even texted me that aren't even in the pro-life movement alley

00:23:56.500 saying it feels weird in DC.

00:23:58.360 Like when you go by the Supreme court, it just feels heavy.

00:24:01.440 Cause there's a big fence in front of the Supreme court too.

00:24:04.960 Yeah.

00:24:05.460 Yeah.

00:24:05.800 They finally put up a appropriate barricade when they first put up the bike racks.

00:24:09.340 I was like, please, these are bike racks.

00:24:11.180 Like, please protect these justices.

00:24:13.040 You know, the reality is heaven, if something should happen to one of these justices, um, but

00:24:17.720 that decision at the draft that we saw would not stand.

00:24:20.720 I mean, it's, it's, that would change everything.

00:24:23.120 And so, um, I think it's outrageous that we have leaders that are not condemning what's

00:24:29.620 taking place across the country.

00:24:31.180 They're, they are encouraging violence and vandalism by their silence and by their lack

00:24:36.660 of concern for emergency resource centers, for the justices themselves.

00:24:40.680 I mean, this, the fact that even, I think Politico ran the leak is questionable knowing that

00:24:47.340 it ramp up and incite such vitriol.

00:24:51.460 Um, this, you know, these people, this groups, yeah, we know we, we face it.

00:24:56.520 I mean, anybody will tell you what it looks like outside of the court on an oral argument

00:25:00.500 day or decision day and what side is loving and winsome and kind.

00:25:04.960 And what side is real, is, is pretty hot and, and pretty sensitive to any pushback and encouraging.

00:25:13.140 Yeah.

00:25:13.420 Yeah.

00:25:13.820 Yeah.

00:25:14.120 Yeah.

00:25:14.360 Absolutely.

00:25:15.100 Yeah.

00:25:15.300 And people, people have seen it.

00:25:16.600 There were several protests outside of churches, um, over the weekend.

00:25:20.280 There was this horrible demonstration that we won't even show on here of the pro-abortion 0.98

00:25:25.980 activist.

00:25:26.520 She had some kind of like white leotard on and she had stuffed dolls like in her leotard. 0.86

00:25:32.080 She was in front of the Catholic church and she was like taking the dolls out of her leotard 0.92

00:25:36.360 saying that she's killing babies. 1.00

00:25:37.840 She's killing babies. 1.00

00:25:39.300 Um, and so, and that's not just one person. 0.64

00:25:41.660 I mean, we've seen several churches, unfortunately, protested in front of, not just like peaceful

00:25:48.120 protests, but we're talking, like you said, a lot of vitriol.

00:25:53.140 And, um, there was an organization called Ruth Sent Us, which obviously is a pro-abortion 0.92

00:25:58.940 organization.

00:25:59.780 They published the home addresses of the justices online.

00:26:04.680 The obvious intent there is not, I don't think just to get people to protest, but to

00:26:08.980 try to get those people, the justices to feel intimidated.

00:26:13.020 And Jen Psaki was asked about this last week by Fox News in a press conference.

00:26:18.240 And her response was just incredible.

00:26:21.320 She said, I think our view here is that peaceful protests, there's a long history in the United

00:26:25.260 States and the country of that.

00:26:26.520 And we've certainly encouraged people to keep it peaceful and not to resort to any level

00:26:29.860 of violence.

00:26:30.780 The president's view is that there is a lot of passion, a lot of fear, a lot of sadness

00:26:34.660 from many, many people across the country about what they saw in that leaked document.

00:26:39.180 We obviously want people's privacy to be respected.

00:26:41.500 We want people to protest peacefully.

00:26:42.980 If they want to protest, that is certainly what the president's view would be.

00:26:49.740 So she doesn't outright condemn the home addresses of the justices being published.

00:26:57.820 She does say, okay, that they want it to be peaceful.

00:27:00.740 But look, people are really sad.

00:27:02.940 People are really passionate about this.

00:27:04.940 And then she was asked about this again.

00:27:07.020 I'll play this clip when she was asked about, okay, well, what about these protests in front

00:27:13.200 of people's houses?

00:27:14.120 What do you think about that?

00:27:15.240 Here's what Jen Psaki had to say. 0.99

00:27:17.120 So I know that there's an outrage right now, I guess, about protests that have been peaceful

00:27:22.180 to date.

00:27:23.000 And we certainly continue to encourage that outside of judges' homes.

00:27:26.580 And that's the president's position.

00:27:28.220 So they're fine.

00:27:29.320 They're actually fine with these protests happening outside of justices' homes.

00:27:35.800 And I'm sorry, I'm going to let you react to this.

00:27:37.600 But I first want to play some of the clips of this happening outside of Chief Justice Roberts'

00:27:42.680 home, out of Kavanaugh's home, and out of Alito's home.

00:27:45.880 Here's what that looks and sounds like.

00:27:47.960 My choice.

00:27:49.860 My choice.

00:27:51.000 My body.

00:27:51.960 My choice.

00:27:53.620 My choice.

00:27:55.560 My choice.

00:27:56.340 My choice.

00:28:26.320 and Barrett, they've got young children. Barrett obviously has a young son, I think 10 years old

00:28:33.680 with special needs. The just absolute demonic look of these people and also the irony of what

00:28:42.320 they're saying. I think it was in front of Roberta's house saying, you don't care if people

00:28:47.500 die. Do you know what abortion is? Allison, let's just unpack this. What do you think about it?

00:28:54.240 Yeah. Yeah. No, I'm glad you're showing that, Allie, because no one is seeing that. That is not

00:28:59.660 on mainstream media. You're not hearing about what's going on and seeing how potentially dangerous

00:29:06.140 this could be. I'm so saddened to think of the state of affairs that people could actually stand

00:29:12.200 outside a Supreme Court justice's house that was doxed, essentially. We're doxing Supreme Court

00:29:16.600 justices and saying, you don't care if people die. I mean, that is what we're dealing with with

00:29:21.700 abortion and the confusion. I look at that with pity. I don't even get angry. I look at these

00:29:28.940 people with pity because there's so much misinformation out there. There's so much

00:29:32.760 that they've been lied to about and that they think that, number one, overturning Roe is going

00:29:37.420 to make abortion illegal. It doesn't. You've talked about this in depth. They don't understand what

00:29:41.540 Roe is. They don't understand what it does or what overturning it will do. And they're also following

00:29:46.580 people who don't understand. They're listening to influencers. Even some of the media has been so

00:29:51.540 bad about talking about what Roe would do and what happens if states get to pick abortion policy

00:29:57.860 based on their own constituents. So it's just blind leading the blind. And ultimately,

00:30:02.840 when I look at that mob, I think this is utter selfishness. Abortion is the ultimate act of

00:30:08.760 selfishness. And then you have these people that have to justify this act with rage. And you talk about

00:30:14.240 this in your book. You talk about how people that have had self as their ultimate God end up like

00:30:21.920 this. If something happens in the narrative that's not in line with what the leaders, the elite are

00:30:29.020 saying, you have to act out in rage. And look, everyone has a right to free speech. You have a

00:30:33.840 right to activism, but you don't have a right to violence and vandalism. And what we're seeing at

00:30:39.740 the video that you talked about, which it kind of kept me up last night, the woman, it's very weird

00:30:44.700 to have people acting the way they do and, and just threatening, you know, F Alito and all of the

00:30:51.760 anger. It's like, we could use that energy. Talk about passion, Allie. We could use that energy and

00:30:58.600 that passion to solve real problems that women face, to solve real problems that families are facing.

00:31:04.540 But instead, because the left is funded by big abortion, that energy is used to defend 0.86

00:31:11.800 the right, so-called right to dismember your child. And that's heartbreaking. Yeah. That said,

00:31:20.180 I think we in the pro-life movement have to realize that abortion is so prevalent and restricting

00:31:27.520 abortion affects people's lives in such a way that they act out like this, this selfish.

00:31:34.540 I think we're going to have to realize that our arguments are going to have to get more

00:31:38.980 individualized and more okay with tailoring it to a specific person. For example, we know prenatal

00:31:47.960 development facts change hearts and minds, right? We know talking about the abortion procedure

00:31:52.460 changes hearts and minds, but there are still people in a post-ro world who are going to know 0.96

00:31:57.820 prenatal development facts. They are going to acknowledge that this is a child. They are going

00:32:01.940 to acknowledge that they could choose life if they wanted to, that there's pregnancy resource

00:32:05.280 centers willing to support them. All of the things that we historically as pro-lifers know can get

00:32:10.840 someone to choose life that are still going to be so selfish to say, I don't care. I don't care. I do

00:32:16.240 what I want. And you've seen this. You can find it on Twitter in a second. I don't care. I know what

00:32:20.940 that is. It's my right to kill that child. And so I've been talking to some of my friends about this, 1.00

00:32:25.840 just like we evangelize to the individual, right? If someone is asking me about God,

00:32:31.360 I'm going to figure out why, why are they asking what's going on in their life

00:32:35.100 with a pro-abortion individual? I'm going to have to figure out what is their main,

00:32:41.400 what's their main concern? It's individual evangelism of the pro-life message. It's saying,

00:32:46.260 okay, you act and you did this a little bit with the, you know, quote unquote, pro-choice pastor

00:32:51.340 figuring out where do you draw the line? Okay. Um, why there? Okay. Um, maybe for a woman, 1.00

00:32:59.080 it's going to be, I am afraid of this abusive relationship. All right. Now I know where your

00:33:04.280 core concern is and I can help you with that relationship while helping you choose life.

00:33:09.220 Like we're going to have to realize there's going to be a level of selfishness to people in a post-ro

00:33:13.380 world that are proselytization of the pro-life message has to be tailored to that. I told you earlier,

00:33:20.380 I've got women in my DM say, I just don't want to get pregnant because I don't want to lose my body 1.00

00:33:24.220 or I don't want to lose out on travel. Okay. I'm going to have to learn how to talk to her

00:33:29.140 in a language that makes sense for her and helps her choose life because she's, she's focused on

00:33:33.600 that one thing, even though I think it might be a little selfish, right? Like, so I think it shows

00:33:37.940 also the humility of a, of a woman who is post-abortive and is talking about it. Anyone out there at these

00:33:44.060 protests who is post-abortive is angry because someone's threatening their ability to justify their

00:33:48.880 previous act. I know plenty of post-abortive women who are, would never be acting out like that would 1.00

00:33:54.920 never be violent. They're still, they need, you know, they're going through healing. It's the

00:33:59.360 ultimate act of humility to say, I, I had an abortion or I ate it in an abortion. It was wrong.

00:34:05.680 And I'm going to use my story to save lives. That is very hard for people to do. And we have to realize

00:34:10.620 that that's actually what we're asking a lot of these people to do is admit that they either are

00:34:15.580 post-abortive or they aided and help someone get an abortion. And that's going to be a big weight

00:34:19.740 for them to carry. And it's going to be up to us to help them through that, get healing.

00:34:27.820 We're just dealing with so many cultural trends that kind of are manifesting itself in people's

00:34:33.020 like rabid defensive abortion. I do think that that's part of it. Women who have had abortion, 0.93

00:34:37.700 it's very difficult and very vulnerable to say that it was wrong. If that's something that you did,

00:34:43.340 because then you have to deal with the guilt, like you have to deal with the fact that you did

00:34:48.420 something wrong. So it's much easier. And this is true of all mistakes that people make. It's much

00:34:52.980 easier to try to justify it, to try to rationalize it, to get validation from people who tell you that

00:34:57.860 it was not a mistake, that you did nothing wrong, that you just did what you had to do. And that is

00:35:02.960 certainly prevalent in this whole self-empowerment, what I call the trendy narcissism

00:35:08.900 culture, that there's no such thing. There's no such thing really as sin. There's no such thing

00:35:13.500 as doing something wrong. There's no such thing as you having a flaw. Everything is just kind of

00:35:18.900 a quirk. Everything is just kind of a facet of your perfection. And we can't really talk about

00:35:25.180 what it actually means to do something that is wrong. We can't talk about good versus evil.

00:35:31.520 So really, it's a very fundamentally, almost like theological conversation that we are having,

00:35:37.920 whether someone is a Christian or not. It all does come down to what you think about God,

00:35:45.380 if you believe in Him or not. So if you think that there is a bigger moral authority that we

00:35:49.720 have to ascribe to or not, it all comes down to who you think human beings are. Are human beings

00:35:55.740 just clumps of meaningless matter? Or are they individuals? Are they people with value? Are they

00:36:01.880 people with rights? It really does all come back to, no matter who you're talking to or what

00:36:06.660 situation they're in, it comes back to the baby. It comes back to humanity. It comes back to human

00:36:13.860 nature and human rights. And that's just always what I encourage people. If you can give someone

00:36:18.800 like a rule of thumb, which as you said, that's hard because every individual is different. All of

00:36:23.680 their arguments and their experiences are different. But if there is one rule of thumb,

00:36:28.000 it's to bring it back to the baby. Like there are so many posts that go around. I'm pro Becky.

00:36:33.000 I'm pro Jessica, blah, blah, blah. And they just completely ignore the reality that, okay,

00:36:40.200 no matter what justification you're trying to give, abortion still intentionally kills a child.

00:36:46.260 And that is really the only question that matters. Do you think it is okay to sometimes kill an 0.91

00:36:51.740 innocent person or not? And if you think it's okay in the instance of abortion, why? What is the

00:36:59.120 difference between a baby in the womb and a baby outside of the womb? Tell me. And I do think just

00:37:04.500 like asking those questions, getting people to think about why they justify abortion, that can

00:37:12.240 really help because the reality is most people who defend abortion have never really thought about it.

00:37:17.980 They've just never really thought about it because there's so much propaganda out there.

00:37:21.180 Mm-hmm. Yeah. I'll tell you a story. One time I was in Times Square in New York and, um, I was going

00:37:27.640 to show people the abortion procedure video. It's an, you know, animated medical animation of an

00:37:34.140 abortion. And I thought I'm going to get punched in the face. Like I'm gonna, this is going to be a 0.99

00:37:39.020 bad day. Yeah. I had this tablet, I had, you know, the headphones and I went and I said, you know,

00:37:44.520 I'm doing a project on reproductive rights. Can I ask you a few questions? You say, yes. Can you watch

00:37:49.380 this three minute video? They put the headphones on and they watch this video. I was like ready to

00:37:54.160 run. No one took the headphones off Allie. No one stopped the video. Wow. All different types of

00:38:00.960 people, black, white, young, old, female, male, no one stopped it. And I, they would, the video would

00:38:06.600 be done. So it would show it was an abortionist, you know, showing, uh, what he does through a

00:38:10.740 medical animation, what happens to the baby, integrating some prenatal facts. And at the end of

00:38:14.860 the video, I would just pause. I wanted to hear their first reaction. They take the headphones

00:38:21.260 off and they'd go, I had no idea. Yeah. To a T I had no idea. And I'd stay silent and they would

00:38:29.640 just be processing and they're going, how come I never knew this? Right. How come, what do we show

00:38:35.160 this? Do our legislators know this? Like, do teachers, like, do women know this? And that was

00:38:41.600 powerful for me to see because before I showed the video, I'd say, would you consider yourself

00:38:47.080 pro-life pro-choice or neither? And majority in New York city has said pro-choice, but then they

00:38:51.780 watch the video and they're, there's like a thorn in their side, right? There's like a stone in their

00:38:56.560 shoe. They're like, I have no idea what I'm talking about. And so I didn't get punched that day. I was

00:39:01.500 safe and sound. Thank God. But it reminds, I have to go back to that. Like you're saying, you have to go

00:39:07.840 back to the baby in every argument because people are talking about abortion without ever looking it

00:39:13.180 up, without ever watching a video of what it is. They have not thought about the child. They have

00:39:17.760 not thought about the procedure. Like, and once they get educated, they start moving down that

00:39:23.080 spectrum. And we know, we know polling actually supports this. When asked, do you support Roe v.

00:39:29.100 Wade? Um, and you hear this in the media all the time, like more people support Roe than don't,

00:39:33.920 they'll say they support it. But if you start really, you know, um, hashing that out and asking

00:39:39.500 what restrictions people are in favor of, you know, where do you draw the line? A majority,

00:39:45.060 like, I think it's 69% of women's believe that abortion should be available at most only in the 0.90

00:39:51.820 first three months of pregnancy and only in cases of rape, incest, save life, the mother. Like there's

00:39:56.980 a large group of people that would say there's restrictions that need to be in place. They're not

00:40:02.540 as pro-abortion as they claim to be. So, um, only 19%, only, only 19%, according to Pew Research,

00:40:11.700 believe that abortion should be legal in all circumstances. Now, again, a large chunk of

00:40:18.140 people do think that it should be legal in some or most circumstances, but the, the radical groups

00:40:24.900 that you hear most from only 19% believe that it should be, which is honestly way too high,

00:40:31.420 but it should be legal through nine months without any exceptions. But honestly, like that is the

00:40:36.820 position now of the mainstream democratic party. I want to play this clip of Beto O'Rourke, who was

00:40:42.060 running for governor in Texas. He's asked about this. He's asked, Hey, do you think that there should

00:40:46.780 be any exceptions on abortion, which again is a radical and rare position among Americans, but

00:40:52.660 Democrats now, this is the position that they are publicly taking, which is wild. So here's what our

00:40:57.380 friend, uh, Beto had to say, you're a progressive hero. There are so many people around the country

00:41:01.760 who admire you and your leadership. Do you believe in any limits, limitations on abortion, whether it's

00:41:07.420 the third trimester or up until even the final months, nine months, I think Roe versus Wade, which

00:41:12.340 we should remind ourselves is still the law of the land today is the, the, the reference point that I

00:41:19.000 would look to. And the way I think I can best express this is that I trust women. We should all

00:41:25.520 trust women to make their own decisions that are in their best interest for themselves, for their 0.99

00:41:30.860 healthcare and for their future. Alison, like even they are uncomfortable in stating their position. 0.89

00:41:38.920 Even they know that saying, yes, I am for abortion to the point of a baby, an eight pound baby crowning.

00:41:46.120 Like they know that they can't really say it in the same way that the pro-abortion side,

00:41:51.600 like Planned Parenthood knows that they can't say what the abortion procedure is. If you go on their

00:41:54.980 website, it says terminates the pregnancy or removes pregnancy tissue. The truth hurts the

00:42:00.280 pro-choice side. And even politicians like Beto O'Rourke, even though he is essentially saying he is

00:42:05.600 for the choice of abortion through nine plus months of pregnancy, they can't say it. Like they can't

00:42:11.960 articulate it because they know if people really knew the majority of Americans would not be for

00:42:17.300 it. Yeah. And that's why Roe being overturned is so powerful because it's the shield they hide

00:42:23.260 behind. I mean, I've been working in this long enough, you know, to, you know, you've put politicians

00:42:27.660 that are like, Oh, I'm pro-life, but you know, Roe's law of the land. Like, what do you want me to

00:42:31.000 do? Like, it's not going to go far because of Roe. And I've got, you know, I've got pro-life

00:42:35.240 Christians in my inbox saying, well, come on, what, what a big deal is if we overturn Roe, that's not

00:42:40.420 we should be focusing on, you know, stop being so political to really take care of women. And I'm

00:42:45.580 like, you clearly don't understand what we're doing, what time it is and how much has been

00:42:50.060 happening for the last 40 years to secure the ability to pass pro-life legislation. Like I get

00:42:56.440 it. Like, you know, policy isn't the only thing that matters. Like, but policy matters, like you

00:43:00.660 said, because people matter. So we want to create good pro-life policy, but these politicians pro even

00:43:05.700 pro-life ones stand behind Roe is the law of the land. What you heard Beto say, I mean, and look,

00:43:10.500 Beto's no like, you know, heroic masculine figure that's I think looking out to protect women and

00:43:14.900 children. So we shouldn't set our policies by him, but that is a revealing clip. You can add it on to

00:43:20.580 a long litany of other audio and video we have of the pro-aborts essentially not being able to say

00:43:26.060 that they would stop an abortion of a nine month old child, that they would protect a child after it

00:43:30.880 was survived an abortion. It's a callous, corrupt, it's an inhumane position that they've taken 0.94

00:43:36.780 and they all stand by it hook, line and sinker. If you deviate just a little bit, like maybe even

00:43:42.000 like a Tulsi Gabbard did, you are out, you are done. You do not get to be a part of our party unless 1.00

00:43:47.460 you are okay with abortion unlimited, fully funded by the taxpayer dollar at any point.

00:43:53.760 And I think that's because they've hidden behind these lies, like it'll save the life of the mom.

00:43:59.280 You know, women will die from back alley abortions. They've really, really, you know, messaged well to 0.95

00:44:03.800 their movement. That's why we have to protect abortion at all costs. So that's what the pro-life 0.67

00:44:07.940 movement is up against right now is us pushing back and saying, okay, you're concerned about the

00:44:13.240 life of the mother. I hear that. Let me talk to you about why abortion is not medically necessary.

00:44:18.320 Yeah. Okay. Let's talk about these high risk cases. Let's go there. So we, if we can get past

00:44:24.340 that, and I've talked to some friends in the movement who are social media directors, and I

00:44:28.480 said, what are you, what are you hearing? What's, what are you getting in your DMS? What, and they're

00:44:32.580 saying even pro-lifers are still nervous a little bit about messaging on, you know, life of the mother,

00:44:38.120 some of the rape stuff. So making sure guys that we know our answers there, that we've thought this

00:44:43.640 through, that we are compassionate in our response and truthful, and that we're protecting

00:44:48.180 both the woman and the child is going to be crucial, I think, in the year and years ahead.

00:44:53.280 Yeah. Let's walk through that just a little bit, if we can, just kind of giving some brief talking

00:44:58.500 points on that question, because I do think that that is the most difficult thing. So one thing that

00:45:04.620 we hear and we're seeing with all these protesters with like the hangers, and you're hearing them say

00:45:11.300 you can only ban safe abortion, or like legal safe abortion, you can't ban abortion. So if you ban

00:45:18.680 abortion, and that's just going to cause women to go into the back alley, and then you have two 1.00

00:45:24.140 people dying, like they probably don't even admit that it's, you know, people dying, but they would

00:45:28.360 say that harms women. So what do you say to that? Because of course, as pro-lifers, like we want to

00:45:33.260 protect the lives of women, even the women who are choosing to get abortions. So what's,

00:45:37.880 what's the response to the point that, oh, it is safer for everyone if abortion is legal?

00:45:45.260 Well, let me just say, like that question is something that was a big question mark for me

00:45:51.120 when I started, you know, in the pro-life movement. I don't know if it was a movie I saw or a show,

00:45:56.280 but I had this idea, Allie, that there could be a moment in pregnancy where the mom is in the hospital

00:46:02.460 and she's sweating and she's about to die. And the dad has to decide, does the baby die

00:46:07.840 or does the mom die? And who am I picking? Do you know what I mean? Like, I thought that that was

00:46:12.460 a reality. And I've talked to pro-life OBGYNs, our friends at the American Association of Pro-life

00:46:17.400 OBGYNs. I'm like, does that happen? Like, and they're like, no, listen, if there is a high risk

00:46:23.800 circumstance, we try and save them both. That is the goal is to save the baby and the mom.

00:46:30.820 If that pregnancy, if that child needs to be separated from the mom in order to bring her blood 0.99

00:46:34.880 pressure back down or whatever it may be, we want to separate them through early delivery or C-section

00:46:41.100 in hopes that they both live. Now, this is a pro-life OBGYN saying this. And obviously if it's

00:46:47.400 a little early in the term, if it's a 20 week old baby, their chances of survival are very slim,

00:46:52.960 but that is very different than intentionally dismembering that child

00:46:57.000 in order to separate it from the mother. And so that helps me a lot because I feel that for them.

00:47:05.520 If you're confused, if you don't understand this, you are concerned. What happens in those

00:47:10.000 circumstances? We know women get preeclampsia. We know there's hard pregnancy outcomes. 0.99

00:47:15.160 Even before viability, you know, 20 weeks, a 20 week baby probably most likely can't live outside

00:47:22.780 the womb, even with medical help. But if the mom has to live, what you're saying is that even if

00:47:29.660 the baby can't live outside the womb, you still deliver, you still deliver the baby, even knowing 0.99

00:47:35.000 that unfortunately, tragically, that baby will die. That is different than purposely stopping the

00:47:40.540 heartbeat of that child, which is typically what happens in the second trimester abortion, putting a 0.55

00:47:47.360 needle into the woman's abdomen, into the uterus and stopping the heart of that child, killing that child 0.97

00:47:52.640 and then taking the child out. That's different. That's different. One is intentional murder and one is 0.96

00:47:56.880 unfortunately the necessary treatment and consequence of trying to save the woman's life. So that's two

00:48:02.280 different things, right?

00:48:04.800 Right. And there's actually a whole field of health care dedicated to that moment. It's called perinatal and

00:48:10.640 palliative care. You prepare for that, you know, if you especially say the child has like an abnormality or

00:48:18.200 fatal abnormality, palliative care and perinatal care is treating the womb like a hospice and creating a 0.88

00:48:25.480 moment when that child is born that you can remember and provide closure to the family. So like you said,

00:48:31.820 if that child is born early, we would still try and capture pictures. We would still try and we would

00:48:37.620 try and give it a chance at life and if it can't make it, we would make memories, right? And so I'll always

00:48:42.380 remember I was at this big rally in Virginia and a nurse shared a story of two sisters that both had

00:48:48.500 a negative pregnancy diagnosis and outcome that their child would not make it long after birth.

00:48:53.980 One sister made the decision to abort and the other sister chose to bring that child to term as long as

00:49:00.680 she could and provide palliative care. So taking care of it, taking pictures, capturing its heartbeat.

00:49:06.700 You know, it was, and she said, this nurse says, I will never forget the sister that aborted said,

00:49:11.420 I have a secret and my sister has a story. I have a secret to keep. And my sister has a story to

00:49:17.900 share. And I thought that was beautiful because that is a hard moment. Again, leaving the hospital

00:49:23.660 without your, your newborn, but the data reflects that it's better for women's mental health, that

00:49:29.680 they would have those moments with their child versus allowing someone to go in and dismember and

00:49:35.960 destroy your child. So those are big cases. And so I think it's important as a pro-lifer,

00:49:40.740 you try and find some common ground there and go, yeah, that would be a crazy experience. You know,

00:49:45.100 if that were the case, but I want you to know, I've looked into it and that's not, I've talked to

00:49:49.000 OBGYNs, neonatologists, all of this information is available online. And you can say it is, you do not

00:49:55.660 need abortion to save the life of the mother. It's not medically necessary. You can separate them. 0.99

00:50:00.160 That's very different with an early delivery. Um, but it's different than the intentional

00:50:04.280 dismemberment of a child. And I think that that will help them understand that you have a heart too.

00:50:08.380 You're not just being callous saying, say la vie, the baby is more important than the mom.

00:50:12.920 No, we're just saying the baby is just as important as the mom.

00:50:20.560 And there are also a lot of, um, there's a lot of misinformation about certain state bills that

00:50:26.260 are coming out right now, um, about ectopic pregnancies and the DNC procedure that is necessary

00:50:32.980 for, um, miscarriages. Some people are saying that, oh, these bills are going to ban treatment

00:50:39.960 for ectopic pregnancies. There was a lot of misinformation from the mainstream media about

00:50:44.640 a Missouri bill that that was going to stop the treatment of ectopic pregnancies. Some people

00:50:49.440 have believed because the medical coding, um, can code, uh, a miscarriage as a spontaneous abortion

00:50:57.580 that that's going to stop DNC. Look, none, none of that is true. I actually originally thought that

00:51:03.140 the Missouri bill did ban the treatment of ectopic pregnancy. So I, as a pro-lifer who wanted to give

00:51:10.240 the benefit of the doubt, I thought that too, but then I realized that's not actually true. That's

00:51:15.220 not what's going on. There was, um, secularprolife.org. I think that's the website. They did a whole

00:51:22.860 write up on this. They did a fact check on this and basically they explained that three different

00:51:29.900 bills in Missouri are kind of coming together. And what it is stopping is outside States providing

00:51:36.480 illegal tools for a woman to perform an abortion at home. It had nothing to do with ectopic pregnancies. 0.95

00:51:43.700 It had nothing to do with miscarriages. Um, the same thing in Louisiana, this is not stopping the

00:51:50.680 treatment of miscarriages. It is not stopping the treatment of ectopic pregnancies. If these bills

00:51:56.840 were doing that, I would also be against them. Like we would also be speaking out about that

00:52:01.960 because treating an ectopic pregnancy where the baby is in the fallopian tube cannot survive. It's

00:52:06.980 very dangerous for the mother as well. That is not the same thing as purposely killing the child.

00:52:12.100 The child has to be removed. Same thing with a miscarriage in which a child naturally dies. And then

00:52:17.160 you have to move the child or remove the child who was already dead. These are not abortions. 1.00

00:52:21.480 And if anyone says that, if someone is like talking to you and says, Oh, well, this is going to ban the

00:52:26.260 care, the care of miscarriages. You tell them, you make them link the exact bill and copy and paste

00:52:33.740 the exact sentence of the legislation that bans miscarriage care or bans ectopic pregnancies. Because

00:52:41.060 most people saying that they're just throwing it out there, but you make them cite it. You make them

00:52:45.740 cite it specifically because the reality is, it's just not true. That's not what is happening.

00:52:50.300 Yeah. There's so much information floating around. I really wish there was just like a board or like

00:52:54.980 a committee that could like squash this misinformation. You know, I really wish that was

00:52:59.140 out there.

00:52:59.900 Yeah. Oh, they're not going to like it. When Ron DeSantis becomes president and that disinformation

00:53:05.580 board is still there, you and I are going to sit on it and we're going to talk about the reality of

00:53:10.880 abortion.

00:53:11.500 Wonderful. That would be wonderful. Yeah. If only someone was dedicated to saying that's not true.

00:53:15.640 That's not what this does. I mean, the ectopic pregnancy and miscarriage thing has flown around

00:53:19.800 the internet and it's so outrageous to me for a couple of reasons. One, it's a complete lie. No

00:53:24.500 piece of legislation and no pro-life leader would ever support limiting the ability to treat an

00:53:30.560 ectopic pregnancy or manage your miscarriage. I mean, we all know women who have miscarried.

00:53:36.540 We may know women who have had an ectopic pregnancy. That is never threatened by pro-life

00:53:41.900 legislation. There's either particular caveats that are written into it to protect it just to

00:53:46.180 make sure. And again, you're like you said, we would be outraged if a piece of legislation would

00:53:52.000 threaten the ability to handle a miscarriage or an ectopic pregnancy. What gets confusing,

00:53:58.320 and you talked about this with the coding, and I was talking to a healthcare professional this

00:54:01.920 morning who said, yeah, it does get confusing because the word abortion, it's a medical term.

00:54:06.280 A spontaneous abortion, though, is different than an elective abortion. And they're completely

00:54:12.320 confident in their ability to provide treatment for ectopic pregnancies and miscarriage management.

00:54:16.940 So I also want to point out, though, to the left, and this could be good for someone

00:54:22.580 arguing on this point. It's been surprising to me to see the left so focused on ectopic pregnancy

00:54:30.520 and so concerned about the so-called inability to get treatment. And here's why. And also the back

00:54:37.800 alley abortion. They've been really using those two things. They're so concerned about at-home back

00:54:42.720 alley abortions and this. Okay. Well, then why is the abortion industry the one that's advancing

00:54:48.800 the idea of at-home, do-it-yourself abortions? So true. 1.00

00:54:53.780 If they're so concerned about back alley unsupervised abortions and women dying from ectopic

00:55:03.520 pregnancies, why is the pro-abortion industry the one creating websites, Plan C, how to do an at-home 0.51

00:55:09.980 managed abortion? Abortion by male. Yeah. 0.99

00:55:12.320 Why did they, during COVID, Allie, fight the FDA to be able to get the abortion pill to women without 0.94

00:55:18.440 an in-person doctor's visit? Yeah.

00:55:20.940 An in-person doctor's visit would have made sure that you didn't have an ectopic pregnancy. Hopefully, 0.96

00:55:26.400 if you went to a good provider, it actually wasn't required, shockingly. But if you take the abortion

00:55:31.960 pill and you do have an ectopic pregnancy, you could rupture your fallopian tube, hemorrhage at home,

00:55:37.880 and you would have no idea. You'd be left to die. Yeah.

00:55:40.840 You would think this is, I mean, you tell me, what's a normal amount of blood to lose during

00:55:44.980 an abortion? Right. 1.00

00:55:46.820 I don't know. Do you know? I don't. So you would have women at home hemorrhaging, 1.00

00:55:50.940 and they'd think this is normal. And you can't drive yourself to the hospital either. Are you

00:55:56.160 going to be able to call 911? Who knows? And even if you can't call 911, they don't know what just

00:56:01.700 happened. If you're passed out, I mean, this is literally a disaster. And so many pieces of state

00:56:06.840 legislation, like abortion legislation from Maryland, New Jersey, and all of that, like one key piece of

00:56:11.840 all these pro-abortion pieces of legislation is that it deregulates it. It takes away any regulation

00:56:17.520 that would force an abortion clinic to be by a hospital, or in some cases, midwives can perform 1.00

00:56:24.100 abortions instead of doctors. So you're absolutely right. Democrats are totally in the business of 0.58

00:56:30.000 making it less safe for the woman who is getting the abortion.

00:56:34.080 Right. Right. And this kind of goes back to that, like, fine, let me talk to you about like a selfish,

00:56:38.120 it's about you now, sister. Like, it's about you. Like abortion, you need to realize is dangerous.

00:56:43.140 It is threatening to your life. It is threatening to your future fertility. And the abortion industry 0.99

00:56:48.120 that's pushing it on you does not care. Like you said, they have fought against every single type

00:56:53.640 of regulation, including, you know, making the hallways wide enough for a gurney to get through.

00:56:59.220 They've fought against that. They are right now, if you think about it, the Atlantic, all these others

00:57:04.420 are saying this is the future. The next frontier is at home abortions. That is the back alley abortion 0.87

00:57:10.600 that you are, you guys are saying you're so worried about. These women are going to be alone.

00:57:14.060 The FDA has already reported that 24 women have died at least from that abortion pill. And now

00:57:19.980 it's, you can get it more easily. You can order it online and to make matters worse. They're saying

00:57:26.300 that if you do have complications, go to the hospital, like you said, how maybe drive yourself

00:57:30.880 and say that you're just miscarrying. Wow. So now we don't even have the data. We won't have,

00:57:37.060 we don't have good data now. And we'll continue to have bad data because women are saying I miscarried. 1.00

00:57:41.520 They're not being told to say I took the abortion pill. I might be hemorrhaging. They're saying,

00:57:46.140 just say that you miscarried because we don't want them to ask questions about what happened

00:57:49.860 to your pregnancy. It's very dangerous. So I say that with ectopic pregnancies, if you're very

00:57:55.660 concerned about the ability to treat ectopic pregnancies, you're concerned about back alley abortions.

00:57:59.700 Let's talk about how risky it is for the pro abortion industry to be acting like ectopic pregnancy isn't real

00:58:06.620 by pushing the abortion pill into women's homes where they could rupture alone. They don't have 0.99

00:58:11.380 these in-person doctor's visits. And they're essentially doing what you're afraid of, which

00:58:15.240 is administering an abortion to themselves with permission and encouragement from the abortion 0.72

00:58:20.560 industry who has already killed countless women. Tanya Reeves, women at Kermit Gosnell's office, 0.94

00:58:25.600 they do not care about you like the pro-life movement cares about you and wants to protect you

00:58:29.760 from this. Yeah. I heard someone make a good point the other day that they were like, yeah,

00:58:34.320 I don't want you to have a coat hanger abortion either. That's what we're speaking out against. 1.00

00:58:39.940 We don't want you to have an abortion. And it's also, it's not a good argument because that's not 0.91

00:58:45.580 an argument for making the murder of a child legal, because then you could say that about anything.

00:58:51.220 Okay. Well, murders or theft or anything is more dangerous if you make it illegal. Like you could argue

00:58:58.160 that. So does that mean that we should make everything that is wrong legal because it is safer for the

00:59:03.180 person that is perpetrating the crime. Like that's just not, it's not even good logic, but you raise

00:59:08.360 such a good point. The democratic party is also not interested in the safety of women. And I think

00:59:13.460 Biden's treasury secretary, and we're going to have to close out, even though I'm sure we could talk for

00:59:17.920 another hour, but Biden's treasury secretary also, she kind of just spoke the quiet part out loud. If you

00:59:27.480 could even consider the quiet part in a hearing, she said that she believes that, um, that abortion

00:59:35.240 limiting access to abortion is going to hurt the country economically. Now, these are the same people 0.95

00:59:42.440 who called conservatives, grandma killers for saying, Hey, I don't think that we should close

00:59:47.180 down every small business because of COVID. I don't think that's going to protect old people. 0.98

00:59:51.760 We were told that focusing on the economy at all during COVID, that that was deadly, that that was

00:59:56.780 callous. Now these people are saying, Oh, actually you have to sacrifice children on the altar of the

01:00:02.720 economy. I don't even think this is a true statement, by the way, we both work. We have children. They have

01:00:08.880 such a low view, such a low view of women, of women's physical safety and their ability to do all of the 1.00

01:00:15.120 things that God has called us to do. Yeah. Beautifully said. I mean, two words, demographic winter,

01:00:20.240 right? Like the globe is dealing with a lack of children. It's not just us that that her statement

01:00:27.060 does not stand strong. I mean, the, the economies of other nations are being disrupted because they

01:00:31.960 don't have enough children to support their aging population. They are incentivizing conception 0.99

01:00:35.780 weekends in other parts of the world because they're like, we need children. We have too many

01:00:40.640 aging people. We don't have children to support our economy. So that, that falls flat on its face.

01:00:44.700 You can look into it. That is a fascinating, um, part I think of the pro-life movement to look at.

01:00:49.360 Like, yeah, we, it is a problem when you don't create enough children, but number two, I'm so

01:00:54.860 sick and tired of this argument that we have to solve other societal problems before we stop the

01:01:00.580 violence of abortion. Yeah. You see this going around. Oh, come on. Paid, we need paid maternity 1.00

01:01:05.460 leave, universal healthcare. We need to, you know, fix our justice system. We need to make sure that 1.00

01:01:10.680 there's health insurance, all these things before we stop abortion. Um, first off, I can probably 0.66

01:01:16.760 partner with you on half of those things. Like, yeah, let's look at maternity leave. Let's look 0.53

01:01:20.400 at the policies. Yeah. Let's work together on those things for sure. But we need to stop the

01:01:24.980 violence immediately. 2000 lives are going to be lost today to abortion. Yeah. We don't see this in 0.58

01:01:30.560 other human rights cases, Allie. We don't see this. I always challenge people to replace abortion with 0.98

01:01:35.300 like, say sex trafficking. Hey, there's a victim. She's about to be raped and tortured and abused.

01:01:40.040 Okay. But we could stop sex trafficking right now. Or should we make sure she has like a job and 1.00

01:01:44.620 health insurance and can drive and read and stuff before? No, we would say, stop this act right now.

01:01:50.920 Yeah. Right now we're done. And so I would apply that to the abortion argument and say to your

01:01:55.440 listeners to do the same. We must stop the violence against children. Let's work together on solutions

01:02:01.740 to support women and families. We're doing that. The pro-life movement is already doing that,

01:02:05.880 but we have to stop the violence. We cannot act like there's excuses, the economy or broken systems to

01:02:12.100 justify what's happening in our country. Yeah. Unfortunately, all of the work that pro-lifers

01:02:18.700 do before, during, and after pregnancy is not just ignored, but is actually actively

01:02:24.760 inhibited by some radical pro-abortion activists. I mean, we saw the Concerned Woman for

01:02:30.240 America headquarters that that was vandalized. I don't know if we might have some pictures to put up.

01:02:36.240 The Wisconsin Family Action Center in Madison, Wisconsin, that was vandalized with graffiti. It was

01:02:41.320 firebombed. Pregnancy Resource Center in Northern Virginia vandalized with graffiti. Oregon Right

01:02:46.840 to Life. There was an arson attempt there. So we're seeing domestic terrorism against pro-life

01:02:53.460 organizations. Domestic terrorism, in some ways, I would argue, or at least illegal intimidation of

01:02:59.320 the justices that's happening in front of their homes from this pro-abortion side. These pro-life

01:03:04.820 centers, all they are doing, they're doing the very things that the left accuses us of never doing,

01:03:09.980 which is going beyond being pro-birth and actually helping these women have the resources that they 1.00

01:03:16.340 need to thrive along with their children. But it really does become like you see that this is not

01:03:23.600 really a left versus right issue. This really is light versus dark. This is really the truth versus

01:03:29.440 the lies. This is pro-death versus pro-life. That's what's going on here. And I just hope and pray that

01:03:36.760 no matter what happens with Roe v. Wade, that people, that God allows people to see the sharp

01:03:41.980 dichotomy that's at play, to see the spiritual battle that's at play. This is a matter of life

01:03:47.900 versus death. This is a matter of good versus evil. And I just hope that the evil that we do see

01:03:54.260 awakens people to the reality of what's really going on here.

01:03:57.800 Yeah. Beautifully said. And, you know, I think I last saw that PRCs provide over $260 million

01:04:04.760 of resources every year. And it's very ironic that the side of the argument that's constantly saying,

01:04:11.440 take care of these children, is also bombing the places that are taking care of these children.

01:04:16.440 Right.

01:04:16.780 I mean, we are trying to get care to women, resources to women, counsel to women, and doing

01:04:23.840 it more often and for free, by the way. These are all free resources. And now the left is targeting

01:04:30.780 these very facilities, like you said, with Molotov cocktails. I was reading in Wisconsin, just to end

01:04:35.680 on a God note here, one of those Molotov, the Molotov cocktail that was thrown in did not go off.

01:04:41.620 And I read that in the article and I thought that's such a God wink. Like, that's our God,

01:04:45.360 right? He's like, okay, that's not going to go off now because it did have fire. It started a

01:04:50.160 small fire inside of it, but it could have been worse. And I just think, you know, God was looking

01:04:54.100 out for them, but the violence, the vandalism has to stop. We need to pray for these places. Like you

01:04:58.940 said, it is a spiritual battle. We've always been up against, but right now we have just a very bright

01:05:03.760 light shining in the darkness. And what happens? Preachers freak out when you shine a light in the

01:05:09.620 dark, when you're sitting over the target, the shots get really intense. My, my dad always told me

01:05:14.500 that. I know you have a good relationship with yours. You know, my dad said, when I first started

01:05:17.360 in DC, he said, look, when you're over the target is when the shots are going to get fired. And I

01:05:22.100 think the pro-lifers are feeling that right now we're sitting over the target shots are being fired,

01:05:26.380 but we got to stay strong. We're right there. And we know what we're up against.

01:05:31.100 Yeah. Don't back down, double down, be courageous in this and take the courage of other people

01:05:37.380 and allow it to be yours. Borrow someone else's courage and stand up. It really is a matter of life

01:05:43.440 and death. Thank you for emulating that for us and representing that for us and giving us so many

01:05:47.380 good points and also being vulnerable just about motherhood and everything. I think this episode

01:05:51.820 is going to be so encouraging for so many people. People can follow you on Instagram, Twitter,

01:05:57.000 all that good stuff, right? Yeah, please do. I'd love to chat with you and answer any questions you

01:06:01.680 have. This is, this is not just my job. This is my calling. I love it. And thank you,

01:06:07.400 Allie, for the way that you've just given so many, so much courage. I steal courage from you

01:06:11.480 sometimes. So thanks. Oh, well, thank you so much, Allison. Thanks for taking the time to come on.

01:06:15.940 Talk to you soon.

Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - May 11, 2022

Ep 615 ｜ How to Respond to Pro-Abortion Propaganda & Vitriol ｜ Guest： Alison Centofante

Episode Stats

Summary

Transcript