Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - Ep 623 ｜ Depp v. Heard, MeToo, & What Women Want ｜ Guest： Alex Clark

00:00:00.000 Hey guys, welcome to Relatable. Happy Thursday. This episode is brought to you by our friends

00:00:04.060 at Good Ranchers. Go to goodranchers.com slash Allie. That's goodranchers.com slash Allie.

00:00:18.920 Okay, today we are talking to my friend Alex Clark. She hosts the Instagram show Poplitics.

00:00:25.360 She talks about pop culture from a conservative perspective. She also hosts a show called The

00:00:30.300 Spillover, which is a long-form interview podcast that comes out once a month. A lot of you guys

00:00:35.900 already know, follow, and love Alex Clark, so you can kind of know what to expect from that

00:00:40.760 conversation. Some of you may be unfamiliar. It's going to be super fun. She is a fun, bubbly, very

00:00:46.820 smart, entertaining, funny person, and you're just going to love this podcast. It's a little bit of

00:00:51.500 a lighter episode, which is good. We talk about some heavy things. If you haven't listened to

00:00:56.620 Tuesday's episode, Wednesday's episode, Tuesday's episode was about everything that happened in

00:01:01.780 Uvalde. I highly recommend going to listen to that. And then yesterday's episode was the Christian 0.89

00:01:07.960 response to Pride Month. And we talked about a few of the crazy things going on in the Biden

00:01:12.640 administration, in public schools, around this kind of sexual revolution and how it is affecting

00:01:19.080 our kids. Go listen to that. Today, we're on a little bit of a lighter note. We are talking about

00:01:24.920 the Johnny Depp-Amber Heard trial. You guys know we have not discussed that on Relatable. I have only

00:01:31.160 started following it a little bit over the past couple of days. The verdict came out. You guys probably

00:01:37.760 know there were accusations of abuse toward Johnny Depp. Johnny Depp said that's not true, sued Amber Heard

00:01:46.260 for defamation. And so this whole thing has just been an ugly mess. The trial has been six weeks. Most

00:01:52.600 people on social media have been on Johnny Depp's side. It's just a whole crazy thing. I just have

00:01:58.340 not had the capacity to follow along. But Alex is going to tell us why this matters, why this is

00:02:05.040 important. She's going to summarize what happened. And then I'm going to give my take on it just from

00:02:10.660 kind of an outside observer. I think it's a unique and, dare I say, nuanced opinion about the

00:02:17.940 conclusion of this whole trial and how it kind of went down. We're also going to talk about

00:02:22.320 friendships, how to make friends with like-minded people. Also, when to know to not be friends with

00:02:30.540 someone anymore because of some very serious disagreements. We're going to talk about relationships

00:02:34.780 and dating. She's going to give us some insight into her experiences in that world as a conservative 1.00

00:02:41.660 Christian in this wild dating space that we are in right now. So I know that you're going to love

00:02:47.600 this conversation. It's going to be upbeat, but also insightful. And I just hope encouraging for you

00:02:53.320 guys. If you love this podcast, I'll end the week on this. If you love this podcast, would you please

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00:03:13.240 love Relatable. Also, another announcement before we get started. We've got lots of merch on our

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00:03:56.400 Alex, thanks so much for joining Relatable again, this time the first time in studio. We're going to

00:04:04.260 talk about a few things. We're going to talk about YWLS. We're going to talk about women and

00:04:08.480 conservatism and all that good stuff. But first, I want to talk about kind of the pop culture drama

00:04:13.960 that's going on this week that we have not talked about at all on Relatable. I really haven't discussed

00:04:18.640 it because I haven't had the capacity to care. But I thought it would be interesting to talk a little

00:04:22.100 bit about the Johnny Depp, Amber Heard verdict that came out yesterday. Can you just give us

00:04:26.940 like a brief rundown? What the heck happened? And why should we care about this at all?

00:04:31.700 Okay, we actually should really care about this. It's very, very big, not only for pop culture,

00:04:36.680 but I just think culture in general what happened here. Because in 2018, Amber Heard wrote an op-ed

00:04:42.560 for the Washington Post. And she basically said without saying Johnny Depp's name, and everyone knew that

00:04:47.160 they had a very long-term relationship, that she was a survivor of domestic abuse and domestic

00:04:52.240 violence. And so he sued her for defamation. Because he ended up losing a ton of movie deals

00:04:58.220 after that. Everybody in Hollywood started to hate him. They labeled him this abuser, this terrible

00:05:02.920 person. So he sues her. She countersues him for defamation. And so they end up in this trial with a jury

00:05:10.660 and everything, suing each other. He wanted, I believe, 50 million. She countersued him for 100

00:05:16.600 million, I think. And what ended up happening was they both ended up getting money. They were both

00:05:21.620 found, I don't know if guilty is the right word, but they were both found like they had defamed each

00:05:26.820 other in certain aspects. He got more money in the end than she did. He got like 15 million. And she got

00:05:32.320 two. Okay. So essentially, in the public's eyes, Johnny Depp wins. But what's really interesting is that

00:05:39.300 she really tried to brand this as, well, this is me too. This is me speaking out. This is for women

00:05:44.520 everywhere. But in the trial, it comes out that really, she was just as much of a verbal abuser,

00:05:51.820 physical abuser, even maybe more so than him. She's on tape talking about punching him. She also pooped 0.98

00:05:58.720 in his bed. So that's the biggest part. But she said that she didn't. So I followed a little bit of

00:06:03.320 this. And she said, no, I would never do that. That's disgusting. That was our Yorkie. But then the

00:06:07.760 driver testified on the stand and said that she told him in the car after it happened that

00:06:15.240 she did. Oh, yeah. And that it was a practical joke gone wrong. She 100% did. The defecation was 1.00

00:06:21.460 like a surprise that she left for Johnny Depp. So I feel like that in itself may have just like ruined

00:06:28.240 her credibility in general with the jury. If I'm the jury, I'm like, okay, that's disgusting. What else

00:06:32.260 would you do? Well, she did all kinds of weird stuff. She was whatever Johnny would wear the next day

00:06:36.600 in court. She would copy. Tell me why. Tell me why you think she did that. Because it's a weird

00:06:41.860 psychological manipulation. She's a crazy person. You know, you think, you know, I mean, 0.79

00:06:46.400 she's literally the psycho girl, the girlfriend, you know, the ex-girlfriend that like goes and keys 1.00

00:06:50.080 your car and and poops on your bed. I mean, yeah, crazy. So I think that's kind of her way is just a 1.00

00:06:55.740 petty kind of thing to do. Yeah. But nothing she did in trial made her look good. Right. Okay. So 0.78

00:07:03.320 one thing, though, that I will say is that there was some evidence that he was an abuser,

00:07:09.260 not necessarily all of the allegations that she made against him, like physical abuse. But we do

00:07:15.360 have some tape that apparently she leaked to TMZ, but then she lied and said that they didn't leak to

00:07:21.600 TMZ, where he was at least like attacking the cabinets, which might not be physical abuse towards

00:07:27.220 her, but is kind of abusive because you're making this kind of intimidating environment. And he is

00:07:34.500 verbally abusing her. And there is some evidence that he was not a great guy, not a great guy towards

00:07:43.600 her, that the marriage counselor, which was his witness, went up on the stand and said, yeah, I think

00:07:50.820 that they mutually abused each other, at least emotionally and verbally abused each other.

00:07:55.440 100%. It was a super toxic relationship.

00:07:58.180 But when she sued, because there was another case, like he so Depp filed in 2018, a libel claim

00:08:06.520 against newsgroup newspapers, the owner of The Sun, because The Sun ran an article a few years ago

00:08:13.280 calling him a wife beater. And he lost that case because The Sun argued, well, there is credible

00:08:19.540 evidence that he is a wife beater. And the court in the UK found that, yeah, there is credible 0.60

00:08:25.220 evidence against him. And so this is not a valid case of libel. So I don't know what to make all

00:08:31.540 that. I don't know if she is completely, totally lying. There seems to be some evidence to act

00:08:36.340 against him.

00:08:36.800 There's definitely evidence against him. They were toxic for each other. They both said things to

00:08:41.080 each other, you know, talked horribly to each other. She, at least on tape, admitted to physically

00:08:46.000 abusing him, punching him and said, don't be such a baby about it. Who cares? I punch you in the face.

00:08:50.040 So what? You know, that kind of stuff. So they both were awful. The thing is, though, that's

00:08:55.000 interesting is that what this really showed is that, you know, men can be victims of domestic

00:08:59.580 abuse, too. It can go both ways. And so this whole mentality of, you know, believe all women, 0.94

00:09:05.260 no matter what, without hearing both sides, it's just there's a little bit more nuance to this

00:09:09.460 than that. And I think even liberal Hollywood with this case was faced to look in the mirror and say,

00:09:15.200 OK, maybe all the stuff that we've been saying, you know, with Me Too and all this and always

00:09:18.660 believe all women. Maybe that isn't always the case. You should listen to men, too, because they

00:09:23.620 can be victims as well. Yeah, I do think that that's important to know. I was a little bit

00:09:28.020 uncomfortable as just kind of an outside observer with the number of people that seem to exclusively

00:09:33.900 be mocking Amber Heard and almost like lionizing Johnny Depp as just like this sweet, genteel

00:09:39.880 Southern gentleman who has never done anything wrong. And look how wonderful his past girlfriends

00:09:44.240 say that he is. And he is just a victim in this case. Look, he might be a victim of defamation.

00:09:51.520 Apparently he is. But that doesn't mean that he is completely innocent. Like this really doesn't

00:09:56.460 mean that he they didn't rule him some perfect guy. And so I did think that that dichotomy was weird.

00:10:03.720 Like, let's totally malign Amber Heard and pretend like this guy is perfect. I think that that speaks to

00:10:10.160 social media's pressure to pick a side. Like, do we really have to pick a side and say that he is a

00:10:16.040 perfect guy? I'm not really sure that we do. And I think that's why social media exists in general,

00:10:20.720 not only with just cultural phenomenons and pop culture, things like this, but also in politics

00:10:25.260 is to push people into extremes and picking a side like that. But, you know, his team, his PR team,

00:10:32.160 their goal with this trial was not to win money. Obviously, he doesn't care about that. It was totally

00:10:36.160 to revamp his image because he has lost so much in the last few years. And so I think that they

00:10:42.540 succeeded. So it'll be interesting, you know, what jobs and things that he gets after this if he really

00:10:47.640 does start making a name for himself. I don't know if Amber is going to be essentially broke after 0.99

00:10:51.860 this because she does not have that much money. She's not worth anything now. And now how's she 1.00

00:10:57.100 even going to pay this 15 million? Well, her team is saying that they want her to appeal. So maybe

00:11:01.540 she's going to appeal and try to ask for if she can pay less. Yeah. See, I was a little I'm a little

00:11:06.560 uncomfortable about this whole PR push for Johnny Depp because I was looking at a thread and it was

00:11:11.780 from like a liberal journalist. So they have their own perspective. But they're basically saying that

00:11:16.040 this really has been affected by TikTok and by Instagram and just like the little edited clips that

00:11:22.480 people see online. And it's become kind of a sport to only make fun of Amber Heard, which I think a lot

00:11:27.880 of the criticism, as we've already said, is totally valid. And then, like I said, to try to

00:11:32.160 almost deify Johnny Depp. And I don't want our justice system to work that way. I don't want a

00:11:38.980 jury to be affected. I don't want a ruling to be affected by the decontextualized clips and narratives

00:11:46.000 that you see online. Even if she is guilty, I don't think that's how we want our justice system to go

00:11:52.500 outside of the whole like Me Too conversation. I'm not even talking about that. I'm just talking about

00:11:56.460 justice in general. I don't know. The whole PR aspect of this for him, it just made me

00:12:00.420 uncomfortable. Well, it begs the question in this day and age of social media and TikTok and Instagram

00:12:05.520 and Twitter, is there even the possibility truly for people to have a fair trial anymore if you're

00:12:11.380 ever in that situation? And that is very scary to me. Yeah, that's super scary. But I do think that

00:12:17.140 it is important that we realize that accused people have rights, that you are innocent until

00:12:23.700 proven guilty. I wish that we functioned more like that on social media. We typically don't.

00:12:29.000 And there's also like, there's a biblical aspect to this. Like if you look at the Old Testament and

00:12:33.540 like God's law giving to Israel, you see that there are rights for the accused. It's not just the

00:12:40.120 accuser. And that was like the fatal flaw of the Me Too thing. The believe all women like really 1.00

00:12:45.020 subverts that principle of innocent until proven guilty. It's guilty until proven innocent. And that

00:12:49.960 really can ruin someone's life. And the Bible actually required in ancient Israel that the

00:12:54.960 person who falsely accused someone else, say it was, of murder and would have sent that person to

00:13:00.880 execution actually had to suffer the consequence that the accused would have had to suffer if they

00:13:08.400 made a false allegation. And so the whole idea of someone making a false accusation of being punished

00:13:15.820 for defamation. It goes all the way back thousands of thousands of years. And it's I mean, it's a good

00:13:20.620 thing. It's a good thing. There should be accountability for false accusations. Absolutely. I agree.

00:13:30.140 All right, let's move on to the next thing. I want to talk a little bit about YWLS and what it is for

00:13:37.420 people who don't know. Starts today. I'll be there tomorrow. But let's transition into it by I guess

00:13:44.180 continuing our conversation about women. So I think that the left thinks that I think they thought

00:13:50.780 that back in 2018, when the whole Kavanaugh thing was happening, the Me Too was really blowing up,

00:13:55.640 that all women would be affected by that. And then in the midterms, they would vote Democrats. 0.99

00:14:01.460 And they kind of think that about like a lot of things like, oh, abortion, a women's issue.

00:14:05.980 Me Too. All women are going to think the same way and feel the same way. That's how we're going to 0.99

00:14:10.980 get them to vote Democrat. That didn't really go the way that they thought it would in 2018.

00:14:15.740 I'm wondering if you think it's going to go that way this year in the midterms, not just when it

00:14:22.560 comes to Roe v. Wade, but you've also got people saying, oh, we're going to kind of exploit suburban

00:14:27.600 women's fears for their kids lives with the whole gun violence thing in order to get them to vote 1.00

00:14:32.480 Democrat. What do you think? Well, first of all, I think it's interesting hearing the left harp on

00:14:36.840 things like women's issues because they want to have this super broad definition of what a woman 1.00

00:14:41.960 is, right? Anyone can be a woman. So are things really women's issues at this point? I don't

00:14:46.320 really think that's fair. But it's interesting to me to say, we're the side that really cares about

00:14:52.140 your children and wants to keep your kids safe unless we want to abort them. That doesn't make

00:14:56.560 any sense to me. They're always contradicting themselves. And you have been really, I think,

00:15:02.220 on the forefront and on the cusp of understanding the super important issue and need for the

00:15:10.520 conservative movement to really be targeting suburban women voters. I don't feel like enough

00:15:15.980 people in the conservative movement talk about that. You've done a really good job. If we had

00:15:19.400 100 million Ali Stuckys that were really targeting this demographic of voters, I think we would be in 1.00

00:15:25.380 a better position. It is interesting to think, OK, with the Roe v. Wade stuff happening this year

00:15:30.140 and the push on gun control, which way are people going to sway in the midterms? I am really hinging

00:15:37.760 and hoping that the economy status is going to push people a certain way, regardless of how they feel

00:15:44.620 on those issues because of how bad things are and how dire and the formula shortage and all of those

00:15:49.620 things. I hope that that ends up really swaying suburban moms more. But it's just really, really hard

00:15:55.700 because you have so many women saying things like, you know, this is why when the left talks about, 1.00

00:16:01.320 oh, well, yes, most majority of voters are pro-choice. It's like, well, when you really

00:16:04.960 dive into that, they're, you know, pro-choice technically. But then you start asking questions

00:16:09.600 like, well, not past the first trimester. I don't agree with these things. It's like we really have

00:16:14.220 to educate people on those things, educating them on hardening schools. There are other solutions

00:16:19.800 as opposed to just gun control. And that takes time to really change that mindset. Can we do that

00:16:26.480 by September or November? I don't know. Yeah. I think that a lot of suburban moms, not all of them,

00:16:32.680 but a lot of suburban moms have at least Christian sentiments towards things. And I think like this

00:16:37.600 monopoly that the left has said that they have on compassion and empathy, I think that's really what

00:16:43.180 gets a lot of suburban women. No one wants to be called a bigot. No one wants to be accused of

00:16:49.160 lacking empathy. Plus like the biggest influencers that they follow on Instagram, Glennon Doyle,

00:16:55.460 Brene Brown, I would say one other one that claims that she's unbiased, but is not.

00:17:01.540 Gosh, can I just say Brene Brown is a snake in the grass. I will say that. 0.92

00:17:05.100 Oh, say it. Go.

00:17:06.320 I will say that. But I have so many girls that will, you know, look at this video, 0.99

00:17:11.240 this snippet of her speech and stuff. I'm like, that is, she is totally in that very,

00:17:16.060 you know, tiptoeing around like the new age stuff and everything.

00:17:18.700 Oh, she 100% is. And she's very pro abortion. She's pro every left wing issue that she can 0.99

00:17:24.320 possibly think of, including transitioning kids. So is Jen Hatmaker. And these are the people that

00:17:29.200 a lot of suburban women are going to. And they think that they're informed because they read an

00:17:34.360 infographic of decontextualized data, pseudo data from someone like Brene Brown. And I think all of us,

00:17:41.220 myself included, are susceptible to emotional manipulation. But when those are the only people

00:17:46.300 that you go to, I think it's very easy to be swayed into voting Democrat because you think that's

00:17:51.420 compassionate. And that drives me crazy. I mean, that just drives me wild.

00:17:54.800 When they have this fear of, you know, so for example, this week with obviously gay pride month 0.99

00:18:00.740 starting, Poplitics, my daily show, we posted a graphic that said, you know, men are not women

00:18:05.640 or men cannot be women, something like that. And we, I purposely, I said, let's use hashtags

00:18:10.720 like pride and pride month. So that to gin up some controversy. Oh yeah. And it did. So what were

00:18:15.400 some of the comments? So some of the comments were, wow, this is a cool take. Yeah. You just

00:18:20.420 want people to die. You, you're pro trans kids dying. And it's like, okay, you know, one of my 0.97

00:18:26.320 favorite people who has really tackled this issue is a journalist, Abigail Schreier, who you've talked

00:18:30.660 to on your show and I've talked to her and she's so good about talking about, you know,

00:18:34.500 the left and especially the alphabet mafia preys on these suburban women telling them like, of 1.00

00:18:41.580 course, you don't want kids to commit suicide, right? By not affirming their transgender identities 1.00

00:18:46.760 and all of this different stuff. And she's like, there is zero data to prove that once they

00:18:51.560 transition, that all of a sudden, you know, their suicidal thoughts and ideations go down. It stays

00:18:56.280 the same. And I brought this up. I was thinking the other day, I thought, you know, whatever happened

00:19:00.440 to that jazz Jennings girl, TLC, I am jazz or guy heart. Yeah. And so jazz Jennings transitions.

00:19:07.520 His parents have him transitioned before puberty. And now he is in college, uh, has full sex 0.98

00:19:14.340 reassignment surgery. So they made him a vagina. Okay. And he has to dilate it every day, every day 0.96

00:19:22.400 and doesn't like doing it all the time because there was an episode where the mother, where jazz's

00:19:27.480 mother said, you better be doing this. We paid all this money on for your surgery and you're not even 0.82

00:19:30.940 really keeping up with it. Uh, morbidly obese, severe depression, binge eating disorder, all these

00:19:36.440 different things that jazz has been open about lately. And it's like, how can you look at that

00:19:40.320 and say like, they're living the picture perfect life now. Nothing has gotten better for him. Um,

00:19:45.340 but that's just one of many issues. But I think that's the sad thing is again, one of those

00:19:49.220 lies that we have to be better about explaining to people. It's not compassionate to transition these 1.00

00:19:54.980 kids before puberty. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And there was something, I don't know if you've

00:19:59.720 seen Matt Walsh's what is a woman documentary. I have been, as soon as YB less is over, I've been

00:20:05.480 like swamped in this. I am so looking forward to watching it. I mean, it's laugh out loud,

00:20:08.840 funny on some parts just because he is like, you know, his dry humor is so funny. And then other

00:20:12.800 parts are super sad and I don't want to give too much away. I want people to go watch it. We talked

00:20:16.700 about it yesterday, but at one point he talks to, um, uh, a person who is a woman transition into a

00:20:24.040 man, I think regrets the transition very much. She was just always told by people, you know,

00:20:28.900 you're more like a guy, you're an alpha female, whatever. So transition said that she has infections 1.00

00:20:35.020 every year. She's gone through 17 rounds of antibiotics because she had like a failioplasty 0.97

00:20:40.220 where basically they make a penis out of like the skin in her arm said that she's probably going to 1.00

00:20:46.420 die early just because of the health complications that she's had. And she said, look, this entrapped me

00:20:52.480 when I was 42 years old, I believed the propaganda and the manipulation that people are telling me

00:20:57.140 like young kids, kids do not stand a chance because kids are extremely malleable. They're

00:21:02.940 extremely open to influence. If someone in authority, like a teacher says, you know what,

00:21:08.060 I've noticed that you like playing with dolls. Why don't you come in here in the closet and try

00:21:11.480 on a dress and see how you like it? You might actually be a girl, which is something that is 0.97

00:21:15.160 happening on a daily basis in the United States. Then of course that kid, the power of suggestion

00:21:19.600 is so strong. And then as you said, the manipulation for the mother that, well, you have to affirm this

00:21:26.040 or you're going to have a dead kid. There's no data showing that the suicide rate for trans people

00:21:31.960 is most seven to 10 years after transition. It's very, very interesting. And you know,

00:21:37.840 Jazz Jennings too, he has had to have multiple, after he had his first sex reassignment surgery,

00:21:42.340 he's had to go back and had multiple other ones because it's not going right. Things are getting

00:21:47.140 infected and stuff. Yes. And your body is going to be infected. And just a note for people,

00:21:52.300 maybe you're watching this for the first time. We do use biological pronouns on this show because

00:21:57.200 we don't, we don't believe that it is loving to lie about someone. And because I believe that people

00:22:02.120 are made male and female in God's image and people's bodies and biology and DNA is really good.

00:22:07.220 That's what I want to affirm. I'm not going to be forced to affirm a lie and something that I

00:22:11.200 actually think is very destructive for the individual and for society. I think the hard thing is,

00:22:17.000 for conservatives, is that we have such an uphill battle to explain to people why something isn't

00:22:23.080 compassionate. It's easy to just say, well, for the left, they can just say, this is what it means

00:22:27.480 to be a good person. And then conservatives have to say, well, well, well, sit around while I'll

00:22:32.680 explain and give you facts and data. And it can be harder to grab people's attention for that.

00:22:37.540 Well, we know based on scripture that obviously, Jesus talks about how it's not going to be easy

00:22:42.540 being a Christian. It's also the same. I'm being a conservative. And so I talk about this

00:22:48.320 whole thing in my YWL speech that comes out tonight. I don't know when this podcast is coming

00:22:53.000 out. It's coming out today. Okay, perfect. So today, so when I speak tonight, I'm really going

00:22:56.960 to talk about this is that it is, we are going to have a bullseye on us. We are going to have a

00:23:02.660 target on us. You have to start being comfortable living with that bullseye on you. Be proud to have a

00:23:08.460 bullseye on you that people are going to be coming after you. If they're not coming after you, if

00:23:12.100 they're not hating you, then you're not doing something right. We are going to be hated and

00:23:16.680 we're going to be misunderstood. But standing for truth, sometimes that's what it's going to take.

00:23:22.400 And I think a lot of times, young conservative women, especially, we still struggle with that.

00:23:27.860 We want to be liked. We don't like people that we went to high school with that actually know us

00:23:31.040 personally. And it's always the people that know you personally. That's who hurts you the most.

00:23:34.500 It's the people that you went, you know, that you were in biology class with in ninth grade.

00:23:37.760 It's the people that, you know, you were a nanny to their kids growing up. That were in your wedding.

00:23:42.360 That happens. And it's when those people say you're a bad person, you're like, but you know me.

00:23:46.920 You know, I'm not. You know that I'm not. And so that's where it's like, ah, should I be saying

00:23:51.780 the wrong pronoun? Should I do this so that people don't think that about me? And we have to be

00:23:56.260 comfortable losing a few of those people in our life. But you will gain more. You will make other

00:24:01.860 friends. And, you know, that's happened with me, too. Just working at Turning Point. I lost so many people.

00:24:07.200 And then have gained now so many.

00:24:13.240 Yeah. So talk a little bit more about that, because it's hard in the moment. I've experienced

00:24:19.160 that, too. Someone that, you know, actually, someone said something because I was talking

00:24:23.860 about someone that I knew I was, you know, very close to in college and then just ended up she

00:24:29.280 was so rude about me publicly saying things that just, like, weren't true, maligned me because we

00:24:34.940 disagreed on abortion. And it was wild. And I actually tried to reach out and reconcile with

00:24:38.560 this person and talk to this person. No response. And so that was very hurtful. People have walked

00:24:43.740 through that. There's a couple people, actually, that I can think of that were like that. And then

00:24:47.360 someone messaged me because I kind of talked about this on Instagram the other day and said

00:24:50.660 something that I actually think is true. She said, you know, a lot of times with those friends that you

00:24:54.700 used to think were friends, there were red flags along the way. There were some red flags before

00:25:00.000 they turned your back. You kind of knew that they were snooty. You kind of knew that they were

00:25:03.400 gossipy. You kind of knew that maybe they weren't a good friend. And thinking back on this person,

00:25:07.700 I'm like, yeah, actually, there were people who told me that she, you know, was a jealous,

00:25:13.880 gossipy, not good friend person. And I held on for who knows what reason. So also remember

00:25:18.880 that these lost friendships because of what you believe could also be the grace of God

00:25:22.860 protecting you. I think that's absolutely true. And I also think one thing I'm 29. So I'll be 30

00:25:29.220 next year. And one thing that I've really learned in my 20s is that there's an art to knowing how to

00:25:35.300 respectfully and lovingly break up with friends. Yeah. How do you do that? I think sometimes they'll

00:25:41.540 break up with you. And usually they're not very graceful. But I think there's just a way to,

00:25:48.140 you know, slowly but surely just kind of, you're not inviting them to things, you know, but it's

00:25:53.220 not a mean, like, I'm going to block you and unfollow you and do all these things. You can

00:25:56.540 still follow each other on social media and maybe you like their posts. How do you know when to do

00:25:59.560 that? Like, how do you know when to say, okay, yeah, we disagree on this, but we're going to

00:26:03.420 remain friends because we're both Christians or we, you know, whatever the commonality is. And when

00:26:07.620 do you know that's like, you know what, this is just not a good, it's not a good friendship

00:26:11.440 anymore. Well, I think it's, you know, are they, are you sharpening their iron? Are they sharpening

00:26:18.340 yours? Are you making each other dull? Are you feeding into each other in a good way? Do you

00:26:24.420 feel uplifted after you hang out with this person or do you feel drained? Those types of things. Do

00:26:28.880 you, do you feel better about yourself? Do you feel encouraged? Is this person encouraging you on

00:26:32.600 your walk with Christ? My best friend Lauren is here watching us film. And I mean, Lauren is the first

00:26:38.580 person in my life to call me out when I do something good and encourage me to be like,

00:26:42.040 that was awesome. I'm so proud of you. Or to be like, what were you thinking? This was a terrible

00:26:45.140 decision. I mean, she is, she is like that, but that's a true friend. And I think, you know, do

00:26:49.380 you feel like you have to walk on eggshells in front of that person? Or can you be honest with each

00:26:53.160 other and hold each other accountable in things? Because even as Christians, we all sin, we all make 0.95

00:26:58.060 mistakes, but is your other Christian friend willing to have those conversations with you? I know Lauren

00:27:02.180 and I are willing to have those conversations, but if you have friends that you feel like I can't even be

00:27:05.860 honest with them, you know, that's probably not a good, mature, healthy friendship. Yeah. Yeah. And I

00:27:11.800 think it is like, it goes on a kind of a case by case basis. And I think that's a good distinction

00:27:16.700 that you just explained. You're not saying that friendships should be absence of conflict. You're

00:27:21.100 actually saying, what does the conflict actually look like? How are you working through it? Yes. Is it

00:27:25.040 in a way that is toxic and that is, you know, degrading to you or is just not healthy? Or is it a way

00:27:33.240 that you work through the conflict and you're actually stronger because of it? Because I do

00:27:36.920 think the world kind of tells us secular psychology says, oh, as soon as you don't feel good in a

00:27:41.140 relationship or as soon as a friendship isn't perfect or as soon as someone doesn't tell you

00:27:44.920 everything you want to hear, cut that person out of your life. That's not what we're saying.

00:27:49.280 We're saying, is the relationship actually healthy? How are you working through disagreements

00:27:53.020 and conflicts? There's a way to do it. There's a way not to do it. How, what other advice would you

00:27:58.980 give someone who maybe they're on a college campus, maybe they're in high school, maybe they're just,

00:28:02.780 you know, a mom in the neighborhood. They really want like-minded friends, but they're struggling

00:28:07.660 finding that community. I think it can make all the difference, but where does someone start if

00:28:11.620 they don't know where? It is so awkward, but I am dead serious. You will just see a girl that 0.97

00:28:16.600 looks cute. Maybe you're at the park. I mean, it's almost like how you pick up, you know, a guy or

00:28:21.100 something or, you know, they pick up you like you got to almost like go out there and go on little

00:28:25.980 girlfriend dates. You know, Lauren and I, I was on the radio before I worked for Turning Point. I did

00:28:31.880 radio and Lauren was a listener of my show and just emailed me. He was like, I'm a fan of your show

00:28:36.900 and whatever. And I was like, let's go get brunch. It is awkward as adults. It is very hard to make

00:28:41.360 friends as adults, but sometimes it is really just, Hey, you know, I, you're always at the park here.

00:28:45.480 And, um, I know you don't know me or whatever, but I live around the corner and like, would you ever

00:28:49.560 want to go get a latte together sometime? And we can get to know each other. And look, just like when

00:28:54.020 you're dating guys, you might go on a friend date and be like, I have nothing in common with this

00:28:58.420 girl. I'll never talk to her again, but you know, I know her name. If I need, you know, if I need help

00:29:02.360 at the park or something or, uh, at the grocery store, she's a neighbor. I can go get sugar from

00:29:06.200 if I need it. Like you can at least, you know, make acquaintances that way, or you might go out

00:29:10.440 with somebody and be like, Oh my gosh, like I have so much in common with this girl. You know,

00:29:14.060 I'd love to hang out there saying hi to people at gym class, uh, linking up in your local Republicans

00:29:19.900 clubs. Um, I think that's super important. All of those different types of things. Um, you know,

00:29:25.240 there's a lot of really good local Facebook groups for people where they live. And that is

00:29:31.220 how I've made a lot of friends. And a lot of my friends have made friends is, is based on interest

00:29:35.480 like the local, you know, running group for your town or a mommy and me group or homeschool group.

00:29:40.380 They all have Facebook groups and they're usually all getting together. And that's a really good,

00:29:43.660 easy place to start. But also, um, you know, it's a really good, uh, little tip is like,

00:29:49.760 if you follow Ali Stuckey and Ali posts a video, just like click on people that are commenting on her

00:29:54.640 stuff. And like, I always look at people's profiles who are interacting on the same accounts

00:29:58.500 that I do. And then just, you know, what if you click on somebody's profile and it's like, Oh,

00:30:01.700 they live in Scottsdale where I live. And then I just DM them like, Oh my gosh, you're a fan of

00:30:05.320 Ali. I am. This is so random, but I live in Scottsdale. I happen to find your profile. We should

00:30:09.160 get together sometime. We're both relatable fans. Like that's a very easy, you know, in with somebody.

00:30:14.100 And of course, coming to events like the young women's leadership summit, which by the way,

00:30:18.040 is not just for young women. It's just for all ages.

00:30:20.660 Yeah. There's like a broad definition of that. Yes. All as long as you're a biological woman, 0.61

00:30:24.700 you can come. Yeah. But anyone is welcome at these turning point events. And these are the

00:30:28.420 best ways to meet friends. Yes. Yes. Okay. Speaking of dating, we only have a few minutes left,

00:30:34.360 but speaking of dating, how is that as a conservative Christian woman in this world of dating apps and

00:30:42.100 everything is hyperpolitical and online, what's that been like? I know you're in a serious relationship,

00:30:46.780 but I'm in a serious relationship, but I have been, Oh my gosh. I mean, I've talked about on

00:30:50.320 my podcast, the spillover. I have had some crazy dating experiences throughout my twenties. I've

00:30:54.640 dated any type of guy you can think of and dealt with every single thing you can think of.

00:30:58.160 And one thing I've learned is that I know that it was like an old taboo that on the first date,

00:31:02.080 you never bring up politics, religion. I absolutely disagree with that. Yeah. On the first date,

00:31:06.480 you should be saying what you were looking for, what your political beliefs are. Hey, I am really,

00:31:11.820 I, it is important to me to get married and I want to have kids. You know,

00:31:15.080 what is your timeline looking like? What are you looking for? Are you looking just to date casually

00:31:18.920 or are you dating for marriage? I bring all that up. And you know what, if that scares them and

00:31:23.080 freaks a guy out, then he isn't ready and that's okay. And then you're just like, okay, cool. I

00:31:27.120 didn't waste my time, but guys will make it very clear and intentional. I am ready for dating only

00:31:34.480 just a casual dating relationship, or I am looking to date and find someone to marry. And I'm looking for

00:31:39.320 that, you know, in the next year or so, two years. And I think it's okay to ask those things and say

00:31:43.320 what you want. Yeah. So with this current relationship, y'all talked about that on the

00:31:46.640 first date. Oh yeah. Yeah. Well, you already knew his political leanings. I knew his political

00:31:50.880 leanings because he worked at Turning Point. So that was easy. That was easy. So that was easy. But

00:31:54.780 no, we, we did talk about all that stuff. And, um, we ended up, we, we were out, we were out at the

00:32:01.720 same restaurant bar situation. I was there with girlfriends and he and his friend showed up and we

00:32:06.500 just started talking because we knew each other from work. And then after that night, he immediately

00:32:10.980 texted me the next day and said like, Hey, I want to take you out to dinner. And ever since that he

00:32:15.940 called me every single night at dinner to ask me about my day, um, you know, pursued me, made it

00:32:21.620 known what his intentions are. And then even still now we're talking about a timeline of, okay, when

00:32:26.560 would it be realistic for us to be engaged? He's in California. I'm in Arizona. So there's a, well,

00:32:30.880 we're trying to figure that out because my show and everything, my shows are filmed in Arizona and he

00:32:34.940 has to live in orange County. So that's one of those things that we're like, we're figuring out what we

00:32:38.660 would do with that. But you know, it is something that we're discussing. It's not like it's the

00:32:42.680 elephant in the room. He knows that I'm like, Hey, I'm 29. I always make the joke. I'm like,

00:32:47.880 I'm drying up. My eggs are drying up. We need to, I need a plan. But, um, so no, he knows I really

00:32:54.240 want to get married and have kids. So it's very open and that's good. But you know, if he started

00:32:58.420 hesitating on that and stuff, it would be very sad and it would break my heart, but I'd have to

00:33:02.720 figure out how to, how to cut the ties. Yeah. So advice for here, I want two different kinds

00:33:14.380 of advice. One advice for the single girl who is just demoralized by dating. Okay. So she's on her 0.99

00:33:19.700 dating apps, people on there, sometimes they say they're a Christian, but then you meet them and

00:33:23.960 you're like, not really. You're not on the same page with me theologically. And so they just feel

00:33:27.980 like, Oh my gosh, I want to give up. So one advice for that, just some like motivation and

00:33:31.860 encouragement for that person. And also for the girl who's in a relationship. And I love talking

00:33:37.420 to this kind of person who's in a relationship because you've gone through a lot of breakups

00:33:40.760 too. She knows it's wrong. She knows this is not the right person, but she's scared to end it

00:33:46.380 because maybe she's 29, 30, maybe she's 35 and she's afraid that she's not going to find someone.

00:33:52.780 Where does she get the courage to just not settle? So let's start with number one,

00:33:57.400 the demoralized dater. All right. For the demoralized dater, I would say

00:34:00.860 that we really have to stop looking in this as I'm talking to myself, but we have to stop looking

00:34:07.260 at singleness as a curse and look at it as a gift. Sometimes for that period in your life,

00:34:12.980 I think God really wants us to own our singleness and there's work for the kingdom that he is wanting

00:34:18.040 us to do. And that's going, you have to think about like, maybe that's something that needs to be

00:34:21.840 done now because obviously when you're a mom and when you're a wife, you're going to have other 0.92

00:34:26.120 responsibilities and things you need to do. But now is the time that you can go out on the mission

00:34:29.740 field or you can start a new podcast or, you know, change your career up or whatever it is that God

00:34:35.500 has planned for you. And you need to do that now. And that's something that I really had to,

00:34:40.460 in the time before I was in a serious relationship, really be in prayer and thinking about that.

00:34:45.680 So I struggle with that, number one. So I will be the first one to say that. So I would, I would be,

00:34:50.180 you know, in prayer and thinking about that. And then for the person who's in a relationship

00:34:54.940 that is just knowing that this isn't the right thing, you really should be leaning on your other

00:35:00.520 Christian girlfriends for this and be like, Hey, I need you to hold me accountable that I'm having 1.00

00:35:04.760 these conversations with him. Um, and being respectful to him also in your breakup and being

00:35:10.560 honest, so honest, because if you are having the whole right now thing. Yeah, it is not. I would say

00:35:16.000 this and I'm at that age where it's like scary. Like I really feel like I need to be getting

00:35:20.520 married soon and having kids soon because I don't want to be an older mother personally.

00:35:24.040 That's just not my choice. Some people that is their choice, but I would like to have all that

00:35:27.960 sooner rather than later. But you know, if the day came where my current boyfriend, for example,

00:35:32.580 all of a sudden something changed and I thought this isn't right, even though I'm at the age where I

00:35:36.340 really want to get married, I would rather break up with him instead of jumping into a marriage,

00:35:41.260 which we believe obviously is for a turn or, you know, till death that I am miserable or things

00:35:47.340 are wrong. Um, and so you really have to, is it going to be, you know, a few months or maybe a few

00:35:52.040 years of uncomfortable versus being with the love of your life, the God, the guy that God has planned

00:35:56.340 for you forever. I mean, that's better, more of a better trade-off. I think it's better to be single 0.88

00:36:03.360 than sad, single and sad than married and trapped. Oh, well, you know, and there's, you know,

00:36:10.620 somebody that I know that is in that type of situation, uh, where she does is starting to

00:36:15.540 feel married and trapped and like, Oh no, I ignored so many red flags. I've made a huge mistake.

00:36:20.860 And that is that I would say, arguably she has the kids and she does have a beautiful home and she has

00:36:26.780 the husband, but she is so miserable. And so as miserable as you feel single and like, I would

00:36:30.720 just die to have a husband and kids. You don't want to have the wrong husband. You don't want to

00:36:35.120 settle. No, because that really is for life. You're also marrying their family. And I will say for the

00:36:40.240 person who is in that position, like God can redeem anything. Even if you are in a marriage where you

00:36:45.760 feel trapped, like you have no idea what God can do in and through that. So I don't want you to think

00:36:51.420 that it's total lost cause. You're just going to spend the rest of your life like miserable and

00:36:55.380 trapped. Maybe not. You have no idea how God can work through that season. Marriages go through

00:36:59.460 different seasons and different feelings and things like that. So be careful also, because Satan will

00:37:03.980 also use those feelings to tempt you to infidelity and to covetousness and things like that.

00:37:08.540 So make sure that in those situations that you are still seeking the Lord and seeking

00:37:12.340 Christian community, but also for the person, as you said, who is engaged, even if you're

00:37:16.760 engaged, even if your wedding is tomorrow and you've had that conviction from the Holy

00:37:20.780 Spirit, something's been telling you. I had that at a previous relationship. There was nothing

00:37:24.980 on paper, but something was telling me from the very beginning, this is not right. This

00:37:29.080 is not right. This is not right. You, and I just, I wanted it because it looked good on

00:37:34.160 paper. I always wanted to get married right after college and thank the Lord. I look back

00:37:38.960 and I'm like, Oh my gosh, thank you, Lord. But do not ignore that conviction. Do not ignore

00:37:44.180 it.

00:37:44.900 You know what I think actually would be really helpful that I don't think a lot of, uh,

00:37:48.260 enough Christians anyway are talking about is I actually think premarital counseling before 0.60

00:37:51.740 getting engaged is a good idea. If you're dating seriously and you're like, I think we want

00:37:55.200 to get engaged. I say do the premarital counseling before the engagement, because that's a lot easier

00:38:00.240 to break up before the engagement than being engaged and then break up before the marriage.

00:38:03.700 Yeah. If you're in a serious position, there are some churches that have like programs like

00:38:08.580 that, or at least like if you know a godly couple, at least have them like informally sit

00:38:13.680 down with you and ask you some questions or like the campus minister of like an organization

00:38:19.000 at your college or pastor, even if you can't afford to like pay a counselor to sit down with

00:38:24.300 you in a formal way, I think you're right. Get some godly, older, wise people to ask you

00:38:28.860 some tough questions so that y'all can have some soul searching. I think that's a really good

00:38:32.520 piece of advice. All right. Um, one, do you have anything final to say about why WLS, what people

00:38:40.300 can expect, what you're excited about, and also where can people find you in your podcast if they

00:38:44.800 don't already listen? Turning Point USA's Young Women's Leadership Summit is an event that happens 0.71

00:38:49.320 every year exclusively for women in the conservative movement. It's so fun. It is so fun. And if you've

00:38:55.420 never been to an event for conservatives before, I'm just telling you, if you've never been to a

00:39:00.560 Turning Point event, it is night and day. We've got pyrotechnics and confetti shooting. And why

00:39:06.800 WLS is fun? Because every year is a different theme. And so last year, it was like pink and Barbie. The

00:39:12.300 whole thing was capitalist Barbie. Like Barbie in America gets to live in her dream house and do all

00:39:16.300 these things because she lives under capitalism. And so that was last year. This year, the theme

00:39:20.880 is darker and edgy. There's lots of black and then pink and purple and, you know, storms and

00:39:26.220 lightnings. And it's like, we are angry in the last, uh, definitely, you know, since President

00:39:31.560 Biden, uh, came into office, we're angry. We're not happy with the direction things are going. Okay.

00:39:36.260 So now we're really mad. Now, how are we going to channel that into activism and really make a

00:39:41.340 difference and how it's okay to be angry, but then what do you do with that? Um, and especially in a

00:39:45.760 midterm year, how important that is. So that's really the theme this year. So I told Allie and you know how

00:39:49.920 Allie is. I mean, look at her, look at her set. If you're watching on her YouTube channel, like

00:39:53.340 Allie is so bright and cheery and soft and pastels and all this. And I was like, you got to bring out

00:39:58.980 your inner, like angry kind of emo Allie chick. Emo Allie. Oh, people know I can. Yeah. She told me

00:40:05.420 a couple of months ago, I told her what I was planning on wearing and she was like, oh, the theme

00:40:08.580 is black. And I was like, oh, dang it. Okay. But no, I've adjusted. I've adjusted for it. She's going to 1.00

00:40:13.120 look great. She showed me what she's wearing. It's super, super cute. So anyway, that's going to be

00:40:16.900 really fun. Um, but if you didn't get to make it this year, you really, really should try

00:40:20.960 to make it next year. And, um, it's just people leave these events, uh, at least the turning

00:40:26.460 point women's one, especially with lifelong friendships. Like we were talking about the 0.97

00:40:30.540 girls that are going to be, you know, your future bridesmaids and stuff. It's incredible.

00:40:33.140 So I recommend that I have two shows, a daily show called pop politics on Instagram, where

00:40:38.720 I cover pop culture from a conservative perspective. And then I have a weekly podcast called the

00:40:44.120 spillover anywhere you get your podcast. And I interview, uh, dynamic personalities and

00:40:49.100 people that have jaw dropping stories. Allie was one of them. And we talked about the dark

00:40:52.520 side of the birthing business. Yes. So fun. I've interviewed all kinds of people from serial

00:40:56.800 killer survivors. And she really do have like such incredible interviews. I love listening

00:41:03.080 to them. I mean, I love both shows, but like, it's so interesting, the guests that you have

00:41:07.020 and, you know, Alex does, if you don't already know, you don't already follow her, which I know

00:41:11.080 that we have huge crossover in our audiences. So a lot of people are already familiar, but

00:41:14.680 for those who don't like Alex really does a very unique thing. I don't know if there's

00:41:18.540 anyone that talks about pop culture, especially as consistently and as well, and as interestingly

00:41:23.740 as Alex does. So if you don't tune into her stuff, like I really, really recommend that

00:41:29.340 you do because it's such a unique angle. And I think it's so important for us. We don't

00:41:33.840 just have to be like academic and dry and philosophical all the time. I love that stuff. I love,

00:41:41.060 I love talking about that. And there's a time and a place for that, but look, that's not

00:41:44.100 for everyone. And so like, we need different kinds of voices, different kinds of people,

00:41:48.680 different kinds of angles to appeal to like the wide range of people that are out there.

00:41:52.380 Alex does that really well in a very bold way. So thank you for that.

00:41:55.240 Thank you, Allie. And Allie kills it with, you know, theology and talking about politics

00:41:59.240 and all that stuff. She owns that space. And I think that's a fun thing. If you're,

00:42:02.860 if you're somebody that desires a career in the conservative movement or media

00:42:06.700 in the conservative movement is figuring out what your niche is and, you know, Allie has found hers 0.82

00:42:11.460 and owning that one specific thing. You don't have to be a catch all person that talks about

00:42:15.880 anything and everything. I don't do that. I'm not talking theology. That's not my strength.

00:42:19.480 That's Allie's, but I love talking pop culture and I love true crime and all that. So I kind of do

00:42:24.600 that and you can still be a conservative and, you know, have more of a fun or entertaining show

00:42:29.560 and stuff like that. So I like being able to be that person. And I kind of explain it as like,

00:42:33.540 I like being a hostess to the conservative movement. Like I like welcoming people in that

00:42:37.580 are very scared of conservatives and are weary of super deep, you know, conversations. I just

00:42:42.220 welcome them in. I'm like, look, we're fun. We're normal. We like all the same stuff. And then,

00:42:45.960 you know, people like Allie and Charlie Kirk and Ben Shapiro, you guys can do the full red pill.

00:42:49.960 You're the gateway. I just like being the gateway drug to conservatism.

00:42:53.120 The gateway drug. You get to the hard stuff.

00:42:55.140 Yeah, I'm the pink pill. Allie's the red pill.

00:42:57.620 Yeah, that's so funny. Well, thank you so much for what you do. Thanks for taking the time to come on.

00:43:01.220 Super excited about YWLS. It's going to be amazing. And yeah, everyone can find you on

00:43:05.800 Instagram, Twitter, all the good stuff. Yes. At Real Alex Clark and the Spillover Podcast.

00:43:09.740 Thank you. Awesome. Thanks so much.

Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - June 02, 2022

Ep 623 ｜ Depp v. Heard, MeToo, & What Women Want ｜ Guest： Alex Clark

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