Ep 806 ｜ Justice for Maple： A Story of Pit Bulls & Political Corruption ｜ Guest： Holly Simon
Episode Stats
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172.37097
Summary
In this episode, we talk with Holly Simon, owner of a small farm in Arkansas. She shares her story of how she and her husband bought two cows, Maple and Oates, from a local breeder and raised them on their 25 acres of land.
Transcript
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Horror struck an Arkansas farm when two pit bulls mauled a family's cattle and the owners of these dogs refused to take responsibility.
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And thanks to a corrupt city prosecutor, these owners still go unpunished and their deadly dog is still free to continue to terrorize the neighborhood.
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You will be on the edge of your seat during the story and at the end of this gut-wrenching conversation, you will actually have the opportunity to help this family seek justice, not just for themselves, not just for their own family, but also for their community.
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I want you to listen closely and also do everything that we can once we give you the information to raise a respectful ruckus, because as we will talk about and explain, this thing really matters.
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This episode is brought to you by our friends at Good Ranchers.
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All right, Holly, thank you so much for taking the time to join us.
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Before we get started and we hear your story, can you just tell us a little bit about who you are and what you do?
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Yeah, so my name is Holly Simon, and I actually live out here in Arkansas.
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And for a long time, we have just been sharing our little farm out here and our hobby farm lifestyle.
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We blog, we do, you know, social media, and that is primarily, you know, where I draw my income, just sharing our lives with people.
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You've recently, within the past year, bought two cows, correct?
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They're Scottish Highlands, and they're the ones, they've actually become very, very popular.
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If you go to Hobby Lobby, there's probably 50 paintings of a Scottish Highland.
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They're the ones with the really pretty long hair.
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Generally, they're in all the art at Hobby Lobby, but they're really unique animals.
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They're, for a cow, they're very, as far as if you're going to have a pet cow, this is the breed.
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And they're just super, they're super special, super docile.
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Because they're not as common in the U.S. as some other, you know, types of cattle here, right?
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If you're looking for a true registered Scottish Highland, they're very hard to find.
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And we have people, we have actually a huge waiting list for calves, and we were excited
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The reason it's hard with Scottish Highlands is they actually even take longer to breed
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They take at least two years because they're so tiny.
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And that's what makes them very appealing as well, is they're very small minis compared
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So we got Maple, our first Scottish Highland, in October of 2021.
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So she was coming up on two years this October.
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And then we had a really awesome situation occur.
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We actually, her breeder called us last fall, 2022, and said, hey, we just had her first
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And so we actually acquired her full-blooded sister this year in January.
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We joked around with our followers when we were looking at this, at buying her, and just
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I made a joke, like, we're going to have to eat oatmeal for at least a year to afford this
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And so everyone said, you should name her Oatmeal.
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These are the only cows that you guys have on your property, right?
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We do have some other cows, but they're not pets.
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These are the ones that we spend all of our time with.
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You can lay with them, take a little nap with them.
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I could see why you and your children got attached to them.
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Someone shared it to me because I've talked about these kind of scenarios before,
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we actually had my whole family down all weekend long.
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And I had actually just saw my sister and all my nieces and nephews off that Monday morning
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And we were actually just kind of putting our lives back together after a big family weekend.
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So we had gone into the library, which my home is actually a very long ranch style home.
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We had put our small mini herd with maple and oats.
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We also have a mini donkey that is named Merle that hangs out with them and loves them.
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And we had just put them down five days prior into our lower pasture.
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And where we were sitting, we were in our library, which is on the complete opposite side of the home.
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Um, and we were just doing some schoolwork that morning.
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I was listening to a little speech my daughter was giving, um, cause we homeschool.
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And, um, my daughter had gotten up to go to the back to get something.
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And she came jogging back to the library and said, mom, I hear, it sounds like maple.
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She specifically said maple is right outside the house.
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Um, cows, if you're around them, you would know that they don't move really, unless you're
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walking around and they think you have grain, you know, or it's feeding time.
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So to have a cow, not only mooing, but mooing so loudly that one of my daughters thought it
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So we immediately got up and ran out the front door, which is right by our library.
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And I heard it and I turned the minute I heard it.
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Like I've never heard before personally, and we've owned cattle, um, for many years, we
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owned cattle in Kansas city, uh, for five years.
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And so we ran to the back of the home and we have a pool that overlooks the entire bottom
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And, um, I saw, when I looked, I saw a bunch of commotion on the bank of our pond.
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And I saw that it was oats, the little sister of maple mooing like her head off as well as
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And they were just kind of running in circles, but I didn't see, that's where my eyes went
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I didn't see anything else, but my daughter, my youngest daughter yelled out dogs.
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And before I could even see what was happening, the girls took off running down through a gate
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It is a very long ways to get to where I, where the, the incident was happening that I
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So I just immediately assumed this was a normal country dog situation.
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And something else that people need to know is that we bought our property in the city
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when we did that, because there's advantages to that rather than just, you know, living
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We're actually surrounded by very, very nice homes, small little, you know, three, four
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acre properties, um, dogs are not an issue out here.
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We've actually never had dogs on our property, um, before the last six months, which we'll,
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I thought it was just some country dogs running our cattle, which if you have cattle or you're
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familiar with that, you know, that that alone can cause a lot of problems.
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They can run them through fences, but never in my mind did I realize or even,
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did it cross my mind that these were vicious dogs?
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And so we took, I took off running after the girls, but it's a massive hill.
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So I'm looking down at my feet, just following the girls thinking we're just going to scare
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And I get halfway down the hill and looked in the pond and that is when I saw maple and
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my mind was just kind of trying to catch up, you know, when you're in a situation like
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that with what is actually happening, um, because you're in the, you know, it's still
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ongoing, there's still an emergency, but your brain is also trying to comprehend the facts.
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And when I saw maple and the way she was floating, it was just her body, but no head.
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I knew, you know, my brain is telling me, wait, wait, wait, what is this?
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And I looked and Mia, my girls are very athletic.
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And so she was already rounding the far side of the bank.
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And so I, my eyes went to her cause my brain was obviously like, okay, something is very
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And when I saw her, she was already around the bank and my middle daughter had stopped
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as well down at the edge of the pond when she saw maple cause she was like paralyzed, but
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my other daughter kept going and she was almost to where the attack was occurring.
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I saw they had had our other cow under the water and this was our biggest steer that we
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So everyone understands what you saw with maple.
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And I know it's painful to think about and to talk about.
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So maple was floating in the middle of this pond, I guess her head, it wasn't severed,
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She was floating there and you were just trying to take in what actually was happening.
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And at that point, when you saw maple just floating lifeless in the water, you didn't,
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did you think at that point the dogs did this or were you just like going on adrenaline
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trying to figure out what in the world was happening?
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I was definitely going on adrenaline, but at that point I knew that the dogs killed maple
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and my, at that moment, my adrenaline, all of the things that flooded me was for my daughter.
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And I knew it was way too late for me to get to her as well before a serious damage would
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And so she was coming down the bank and I saw the cow come up out of the water.
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And what was happening is every time the cow would lift his head up out of the water,
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When he came up out of the water for breath, the dogs would be on, would re-attack the face
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And so Mia, I'm screaming, just screaming like I've never screamed before because I
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knew we have an ex-sheriff that lives across the street from us.
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He's not ex, he's retired, but he'll be home and he'll be outside.
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So I was screaming help because I also knew my neighbor right next to us.
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And so I was thinking maybe someone can hear because I didn't know what to do, Allie.
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We were in the situation and we were very much vulnerable.
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And so I just started screaming and my daughter, as she was coming down, was waving and yelling
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and just, you know, making as much bigness as she could with her little body.
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And that is when the first dog came up out of the water and stood and stared at her.
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When I saw, when I realized that it was a pit bull, I, I started just crying out in my
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soul really to God, because I didn't know what to do.
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You don't expect that, you know, you just don't.
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And so the dog stopped, they locked eyes, her, him and my daughter.
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And then for whatever reason, instead of attacking her, he just took over the bank.
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And Jen, you can see our neighbors who own the dogs, you can see their driveway from
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And then the white one that was still attacking the cow, let go and followed when the black
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And they both ran directly into my neighbor's driveway.
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Mia stopped the one, my daughter who went to the dogs.
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She ran back up the bank and just stood there and just was watching.
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And I was, I was very much, if you heard the 911 call, I have never, ever been in any
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situation where I've had to call 911 like this.
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I, I, it, it was the most, I don't know how to describe something like that.
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You know, if you've never been in a situation like that, it's very hard to talk and to process
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So at that point I just called 911, um, because the dogs, it was, it's hard to tell the story,
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And so I felt safe to pick up my phone and call 911.
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Um, I've got to go, you know, and so they, I knew help was coming at that point.
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Um, and we decided to follow where the dogs went and when we were going across our property,
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again, you can see the neighbor's driveway, the owner pulled into his driveway while we
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And so I'm thinking, okay, I can get over there and tell him what just happened.
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And, um, so we climb our gate, we're screaming our heads off for help from him.
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Um, and he just stood there in his driveway staring at us, which I thought was odd because
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I know, you know, if, if my husband saw, I mean, I'm five, two, I'm pretty tiny.
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Um, but if my husband saw a woman and, you know, two children screaming and running and
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asking for help, he, he would definitely at least break into a jog, you know?
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I honestly, Ali, this sounds ridiculous, but I thought I was going to have a heart attack.
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Like my heart, we had to, this is a long way we had to go.
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We were, we had to go through like a swamp area of our land.
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And finally we got to his, basically almost to his driveway.
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And, um, I just said, your dogs just killed our cows, you know, and, or killed one of my
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You know, I'm bawling, uh, but I was at this point, my main focus was to know where those
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Um, and I looked up on the porch and the wife was up there and I didn't see the dogs anywhere
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And what a lot of people don't know as well is that this has been going on for about six
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These dogs, when they first moved in, these, our neighbors, these particular neighbors have
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Um, but they had been getting out since September, these dogs, and, um, they had bit another neighbor.
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Um, they had went over to welcome them to the neighborhood and they had talked for about
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This is the sheriff that the retired sheriff I told you about his wife was bitten.
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So the neighbors had went over there, uh, to introduce themselves when they first moved
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into the neighborhood and she had just rusted her fence.
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You know, it was a normal neighbor conversation and, um, the dog, the white dog jumped up and
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And she rested her, she rested her hand on the fence and the dogs, just one of the pit bulls.
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So the pit bulls were fairly new to the neighborhood you're saying.
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Uh, maximum they've been there, I think like seven months.
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Have they gotten in trouble with the County or with the, with the city for their dogs getting
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You, you said that you saw the wife on the front porch.
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Like you're sobbing, you're running after them.
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As you said, the guy is just standing there kind of blankly staring at you, not doing anything,
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not looking like he's worried or asking if you're okay.
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What, so what was his response when you said your dogs attacked our cattle?
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And he went up to confer with his wife up on the front porch.
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And it's now known, which I didn't know at the time, I knew the dogs were already up and
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There had to have been, and honestly, Allie, we were screaming so loud.
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I don't know how she pulled them in and couldn't hear that.
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But I knew that they had to know, she had to know that something had definitely went
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And for all she knew, by the way, for all she knew, they could have killed you.
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Like they could have killed her literal neighbors.
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And there she is pulling her dogs into her house and just sitting on the front porch like
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She's actually on video going out to get like coming down her driveway and getting them.
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And that must have been a part I missed because we were down like in the swamp lands of our
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So, um, yeah, she had to, I don't see how she didn't hear us screaming or know something
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Um, but anyway, so, uh, what happened after that was he came back down to talk to me and,
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um, cause I asked for them to, I kept asking where the dogs were, um, because I knew that
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And he said, uh, well, if that, he said something to the effect of, well, it, we talked in, I
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think maybe it was our seven year old that let him out.
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And at that point I felt myself getting not only I was, my anger was starting to elevate
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cause I realized this is going to be a problem.
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This is not going to be just neighbors who say, oh my gosh, I'm so sorry.
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They immediately went into this, like trying to take the narrative mode.
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And so I felt myself on top of what I had just experienced now in a situation where I'm dealing
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with people who are trying to deny the fact that me and my daughters just fought off their
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Um, he said, well, if that's what happened and at that point I, and I didn't, I didn't
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tell you this, but I basically collapsed kind of on the grass, right by the road in front
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And I peed myself, which is honestly, I didn't know this either, but I guess that is another
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thing when you're, when you go through a traumatic situation, that's never happened to me ever.
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What, you know, that's sort of a lack of control, but, and then I just was sitting there crying.
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And so when he said that, you know, they're going back and forth and talking.
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And when he told me, um, if that's what happened, I stood up and I said, you will not twist this.
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And I started walking across the street to get away from him, to go to my other neighbor's house,
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And her, she is the one, her name is Sarah Ligon.
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She'll text me when their dogs get out, their dogs have tried to kill their animals.
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She has a bunch of poultry, geese, ducks on her, on her pond.
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Um, her husband almost shot the dogs one time because they called and warned them and just said,
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And they were in the pond, both dogs attacking their animals.
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So I went to, I was thinking, get to her yard, which is on the same side of the street as ours.
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I didn't feel safe being on their lawn at that point.
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And, um, when I was walking across, um, he, they were still saying the wife started coming
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down the driveway and she started saying again, that how are you, this is the country.
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How are you going to get upset at children, you know, like making it out to be her children's
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And I said, no, this has been going on for six months and this is, you are the adults.
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And she, and I was, you know, obviously I'm across the road.
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I'm, I'm, my voice is very elevated and I'm very upset.
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And she said, she called me, you know, a, the B word.
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She said, if you're going to get loud, I'm going to get loud too.
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And then I just plopped down and I actually texted my neighbor, the one whose lawn I was
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And that actually became very, very important because when she got there, uh, the police
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as well kind of arrived and, um, they, when the police confronted them, they, the wife
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Um, and they, you know, the police is asking me for my statements.
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They asked my daughters for a statement, which was hard.
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I mean, they were crying, um, but they asked, they asked for descriptions of the dogs.
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And, you know, my youngest that got the closest to those dogs described them to a T.
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They wouldn't show the police officers because the officers told them, if you'll just show
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us the dogs, we'll be able to see whether, you know, there's evidence or not.
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And if there's not, we won't take them, but they would not.
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So even there was probably, Allie, I don't know, four or five animal control officers.
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There was by the end of it, three, uh, Fort Smith city police officers.
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And then there was also deputies from the County.
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Um, and they actually went up to windows trying to see the dogs.
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Cause they would not, no matter what, let anyone see those dogs.
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Uh, they were all like, I think they're arranged from anywhere from three to seven years old,
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And, um, you know, my neighbor was asking to do a welfare check.
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The officers wanted a welfare check because those animals just took down a thousand pound
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animal, you know, and they're in the home with little kids.
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But at one point, um, the wife actually was, they were, uh, outside in the, one of the children
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And this is about two hours into this like situation out front of their house.
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And the pit bull, the black pit bull ran out onto the porch and the wife just started screaming
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Don't you let that dog back out, lock the door, don't open the door for anyone.
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Um, so it was just an absolute mess and an ongoing nightmare.
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I just want to make sure before we run out of time that we get into the connection with
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the local prosecutor and the, um, and the corruption that went on there.
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So, um, if you could lead us in that direction too, that would be great.
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So I had said it was important that my other neighbor showed up.
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She went and got, she actually had cameras all over.
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So she got the video footage and the video footage clearly showed within a minute of me calling
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9-1-1, a black dog running first from our pond and a white dog following when the video
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was produced on scene, the Sergeant watched it and he immediately put them in handcuffs
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and said, you have one more chance to give us the dogs or you're going to jail for obstruction
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And they, they tried to, at the scene, the husband tried to say, I'll write you a $10,000
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And the, they said, they accused all of us of having no empathy.
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And, you know, the officers were just like, no, you're doing this.
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So, um, anyways, we were told at the scene that after they were taken to the police department,
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I've talked to, I've talked to the prosecuting attorney and, um, she's going to issue the
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We have the evidence, you know, all the things.
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So he said, we're going to leave animal control here and they're going to stay.
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They, uh, the dog owner's mom had come to sit with the children and we're going to leave
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So they can't take the dog or, you know, hide it or anything like that.
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So at that point we went home with all of our neighbors and we, our main goal was to get
00:28:10.960
Um, and also get her buried before nightfall, of course.
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And so that's what we went to go do thinking this was a done deal.
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The warrant is getting, the warrant's getting written.
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Um, about three hours later, it was about six to 7 PM at night.
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We got a phone call from the Sergeant and he said, I don't know what's going on, but I,
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she has decided she's not going to sign the warrant.
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She said that he could take quote, she said, you can take the black dog,
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I think he's the bad one, but leave the, let the Harmons keep the white one.
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And so we all were left like, what just happened?
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We were, the Sergeant was very, uh, he was, you could say he was very like, this is not
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This is abnormal, you know, enough to the point to where me and Tyson were like, something
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And so long story short, the next day, um, we started digging and our neighbors joined
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And we found out the next day, um, through social media, actually that, um, they had done
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Uh, the prosecuting attorney, uh, the prosecuting attorney, as well as the dog owners, um, he
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had said she is very near and dear to his heart.
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He had campaigned for her, for her circuit judge position in 2020.
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And so we knew right there, the fact that she knew the dog's name, the fact that she was
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The wife was saying the whole time, which is let me keep my white one.
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The white dog didn't do it, you know, all those things, um, we knew something was wrong
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And we were very suspicious that they had in some way, um, intervened in those dogs being
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I did not even know, I'll be real honest, who our city's prosecuting attorney was.
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Um, and, and, um, so anyway, so we, our neighbors requested through the Freedom of Information
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Act, any communication regarding, uh, Rita, the, the Harmons, which are the neighbors, um,
00:30:50.540
This started really getting elevated at a city level.
00:30:54.280
Um, you know, when the County got involved, the County told us that the city had never
00:31:03.060
And so we were being told that Rita couldn't do anything.
00:31:07.240
She was telling everyone she couldn't do anything because the dogs were in the County.
00:31:15.660
The attack happened in the city and she could have taken those dogs.
00:31:19.340
And we were told that by multiple law enforcement officers, as well as people on the County side.
00:31:27.400
And then she told the city board, she told everyone that she didn't have jurisdiction.
00:31:34.640
And when we got the text messages, it took us two weeks of advocating for them, speaking
00:31:43.820
So that day when we got the text messages at 2 15 PM, Josh and Hannah Harmon were taken
00:31:54.580
The mom of Hannah texted Rita Watkins personally, and basically let her know what was happening.
00:32:02.880
We've put all these messages out publicly for people to read, but she just told Rita what
00:32:07.860
was happening, that her daughter and her husband had been arrested, that the white dog is a
00:32:17.300
You know, what are you, she asked Rita, what are you going to do about these dogs?
00:32:22.420
Um, there was a missing piece between the first text and the second one at 6 PM that said,
00:32:29.460
can I get an update from the mother of the dog owner?
00:32:32.300
And so there was obviously a phone call in there.
00:32:36.020
Also, it needs to be said that Rita had went home sick at some point and the sergeant couldn't
00:32:43.340
get ahold of her after she had said she was going to sign the warrant.
00:32:47.280
Um, so when the dog owner's mom call or texted her, they obviously had communication on the phone
00:32:55.400
And then, uh, Rita responded again by text for the update that she wants to leave the
00:33:05.580
And we also got the text messages between Rita and the sergeant.
00:33:10.680
So at 3 15 PM, she reverses course with Sergeant Brents and text him and says, the text I told
00:33:19.660
you, just take the white, just take the black dog, but let the Harmons keep the white dog.
00:33:23.760
That was sent one hour later from when the dog owner's mom texted her.
00:33:29.540
So she did a complete U-turn on what she had said prior to the officer.
00:33:35.580
And, um, yeah, and it just kept all the messages kept ongoing.
00:33:39.640
Um, and let me, let me pause just to kind of clarify that we've got all of the, all of the
00:33:46.320
I want to make sure that I'm keeping it straight and that the audience can keep it straight.
00:33:50.720
They've included several points that you are, that you're reporting here, but also pictures.
00:33:55.600
I just want to make sure that we know who these people are.
00:34:04.900
They're a married couple, I guess, that, um, had these two dogs.
00:34:09.060
And, um, they also, so they co-own Harmon real estate company and they share three children
00:34:16.480
together and they are well-connected with Rita Watkins, the city prosecutor.
00:34:22.340
We'll put up a picture of Rita Watkins as well.
00:34:25.220
And we also have pictures and footage of Josh Harmon, the owner of these pit bulls, um, interviewing,
00:34:32.480
affectionately interviewing, might I add, Rita Watkins when she was running for a city prosecutor.
00:34:38.920
So they obviously had, um, a previous relationship.
00:34:43.620
We don't know really how far back I'm guessing that relationship was, but as, as you said,
00:34:48.580
you have seen the screenshots of the text messages come out between the city prosecutor and this
00:34:56.800
I don't know if Rita Watkins felt that she owed these people something, or if there was
00:35:03.260
A lot of the messages between this family and Rita Watkins are very familiar.
00:35:07.780
Like, oh my goodness, it's, they're talking about this whole terrible, tragic scenario.
00:35:11.760
And they're also saying, oh my goodness, it's your birthday.
00:35:19.480
So basically the bottom line is, is that what it looks like at least is that they, um, they
00:35:27.260
She did not want to get really herself involved or she wanted to prevent them from, um,
00:35:32.920
being punished in any way because they have a prior relationship.
00:35:36.760
She could have recused herself from this and said, you know what, I've got a special interest
00:35:41.980
I know these people and because I care about integrity, I cannot get involved in this, but
00:35:47.640
She's trying to finagle this in some way so that she can protect her friends.
00:35:56.780
They're at home and, you know, every day there, I mean, that dog is out front having, you
00:36:05.140
know, she's having coffee with the dog out front in the front yard.
00:36:28.760
Like what's happening is Rita Watkins going to be held liable for the evidence that you
00:36:33.980
have that she obviously is working in a corrupt way based on the relationships?
00:36:38.400
Is there anything that can be done to punish these owners or to punish Rita Watkins?
00:36:46.080
So we have my neighbors, both the retired sheriff and the neighbor directly across.
00:36:56.840
We've produced all the text messages, the police timelines, everything we could possibly
00:37:03.880
The city administrator, Carl Geffkin, the way our city is ran, he is responsible for hiring
00:37:11.300
So that is why we went to the board, because the board is responsible for hiring Carl.
00:37:21.160
But it seems like the game that's being played is that, well, the county can do something.
00:37:27.160
And the thing that people need to know is that Fort Smith has an ordinance that they did
00:37:37.700
County can only deem them vicious and quarantine them.
00:37:43.860
And so once it was kicked out to county, the county did everything they could.
00:37:47.600
We had to, we had, we were the ones who had to actively see that transition from city to
00:37:54.980
In fact, she said the county wasn't going to do anything, but that wasn't true.
00:37:59.000
The county, the minute we got it to them, did everything they could in their power to
00:38:04.340
So they have to put up signs saying, you know, vicious dogs, all these things, but the dog
00:38:09.920
So what we, where we're at right now is that we finally submitted a complaint to the Arkansas
00:38:19.780
And that's the first step in getting some ethics investigations opened.
00:38:23.780
We also got a call from the Arkansas Attorney General's office, and they have all the evidence
00:38:32.260
They have all the text messages, the police reports, they're making phone calls.
00:38:42.020
She did recuse herself because of all the pressure.
00:38:47.420
We're not going, we're not doing anything until she recuses herself.
00:38:50.560
So there is another prosecuting attorney now that the Attorney General's office is handling,
00:38:57.080
you know, the current obstruction charges, because those still have to be prosecuted.
00:39:05.520
So, but that was all, we had to do all of that.
00:39:08.040
We had to force all of that information in those situations.
00:39:19.560
So her boss, yeah, her boss is the city administrator.
00:39:30.340
And you've already, you already tried to talk to, was Carl helpful at all?
00:39:35.700
Carl just, he would, he would say things like, well, I'm going to write a letter to the
00:39:41.700
And we're like, that's, that's not what we need.
00:39:49.500
And then you went to the board and they didn't really do that much.
00:39:55.720
So several of the board members are helpful, very helpful, but a lot of them just remained
00:40:03.300
One of them at the board meeting actually said this was racially motivated.
00:40:12.720
And they said that to you, they told you, you are racist because the city prosecutor
00:40:19.960
Rita Watkins, also one of the owners, the husband happens to be black.
00:40:25.620
So this one of the city board members is calling you racist.
00:40:34.060
So when our neighbor at the first board meeting, she talked and he really just basically went
00:40:41.920
on a rant about how this, this is before we got the text messages where we could prove
00:40:46.880
anything, we, we were just coming with the police timeline and really coming to the board
00:40:51.180
that the city did not enforce their own ordinance.
00:40:53.660
And now this whole neighborhood is living in danger.
00:40:57.860
So we were coming to the board to appeal to the board that the city did not even enforce
00:41:05.180
And at the end of that, um, he, he, his name is Andre good.
00:41:10.600
He kind of just went on a whole thing where he said, this isn't a conflict of interest.
00:41:20.580
And so people in the audience, when he started talking about race, none of us had even thought
00:41:27.260
Like we weren't even the, it doesn't, it has no relevance.
00:41:30.940
Um, he started like saying, I'm the, I know how this looks.
00:41:36.120
And people had that kind of a reaction in the audience.
00:41:40.680
It was all on the news and stuff this as well, but he turned to the audience and just said,
00:41:45.200
whether it's racially motivated or not, you know, and just basically implying that
00:41:49.640
my neighbor who was speaking as well as all of us who were saying she needs, we were calling
00:41:55.120
for Rita to resign because of this were racially motivated.
00:42:01.120
Andre good, the city director ward two of, uh, the city of Fort Smith, Arkansas.
00:42:07.000
So rather than looking at the facts, which are very obvious, you have done a really good
00:42:12.060
job and you shouldn't, you shouldn't have to be the person to do this, but you and your
00:42:15.540
family have been the ones to exhaust all your, you know, so many resources and so much energy
00:42:20.660
and to putting all these pieces together, uncovering corruption, trying to get some answers.
00:42:25.640
And it's not just about the cows, although they absolutely matter.
00:42:32.540
I mean, they still have a deadly animal over there.
00:42:38.820
That could at any point get out of their property and kill people.
00:42:43.900
And the city is doing nothing because there is a prior relationship there.
00:42:51.960
If something does happen, if something does happen where this dog gets out and hurts a person,
00:42:57.780
every single person in this process who refused to do something should go to jail.
00:43:08.080
And in the text messages we got as well, there is a series of text messages between Rita and
00:43:14.540
Hannah, the owner of the dog, where she is basically saying she's scared for Josh living
00:43:23.940
And this was this, they were upset that I had publicly posted the police reports and the timelines
00:43:33.600
And so she's also implying, the city prosecutor is implying that this side of town is the fort,
00:43:41.000
the south side of Fort Smith is racist, you know, and that it's dangerous for him to be
00:44:03.660
So again, it's very important to keep the city board and the city administrators feet
00:44:11.300
to the fire because they have, they're, the city is the one who refused to move the dogs
00:44:19.740
And they as well are the ones who control and can, we have had one board of director call
00:44:31.240
And she immediately started asking questions when all this happened.
00:44:36.160
And she realized very quickly that yes, malfeasance has occurred.
00:44:40.860
And so she has called for the resignation of Rita.
00:44:44.840
So what we need really is we need the board members to call for her resignation because
00:44:50.680
what that does is Carl Geffkin is actually the city administrator who hired Rita.
00:44:55.560
He's actually up for review in, I think, a couple months.
00:44:59.820
And so he's the one, though, who has full control over whether she resigns or, you know,
00:45:14.700
I don't know if you have the phone number that people can call.
00:45:17.020
And obviously, I'm telling people to raise a respectful ruckus.
00:45:20.440
Absolutely no nastiness, no name calling, nothing like that.
00:45:28.020
And so his his email is cgeffkin, G-E-F-K-I-N at fortsmithar.gov.
00:45:36.280
We'll put that in the description of this podcast.
00:45:38.880
There's also just board of directors at fortsmithar.gov.
00:45:46.140
I don't know, though, at this point, if that's helpful.
00:45:50.220
Yeah, I don't think her phone number is helpful at this point.
00:45:54.580
Concerning her, you know, we are pursuing ethics charges.
00:46:00.960
And we're pretty confident that that is going to occur.
00:46:08.120
And I just I just want to reiterate to the attorney general of Arkansas that this is a matter of public safety.
00:46:18.900
I guarantee you if she is doing this in this case where human life was threatened, where animal life was taken.
00:46:29.300
If she is doing it in this case, she is also corrupt in other ways, too.
00:46:33.940
I guarantee you this is not an isolated incident that she is a corrupt city prosecutor and a prosecutor is in charge of helping execute justice.
00:46:43.060
If you want to live in a just area, if we care about the truth, if we care about impartiality, which we all should, then this woman needs to be needs to resign.
00:46:53.880
She needs to be made to resign because it's not just about the pit bulls.
00:47:00.360
So I'm just very thankful that you're championing this.
00:47:07.500
You know, it's felt like layers of complexity, you know, for our family.
00:47:11.700
And I'll be real honest, you know, the first couple of nights, my youngest, who anyone who follows our family online knows she is our farm girl.
00:47:21.920
She'll she won't clean her room, but she'll be up early in the morning painting fences and, you know, mucking out barns.
00:47:27.700
And one of the things that was really hard is, you know, the first couple of nights she actually wanted to sell the farm.
00:47:34.560
And so there's complexities and layers as a mom that I wasn't just able to deal with the loss, you know, and just kind of pick up all of that emotionally for us.
00:47:45.860
But it's just been ongoing feelings of unsafety and another attack, you know, impending, as well as, of course, finding out all of these other things about the city prosecutor's misconduct.
00:47:58.340
Yeah. Yeah. Well, thank you so much for taking the time and the energy to share your story.
00:48:03.920
I know, again, it's not an easy thing to do, especially to relive for your family.
00:48:08.200
I hope that just emotionally and spiritually you guys are able to heal.
00:48:12.480
And as terrible as this whole situation is, I am so thankful, one, that you guys were not physically harmed.
00:48:18.580
Like, I'm just thinking of that as a mom myself.
00:48:20.700
If I saw a dog that had just killed an animal, seriously maimed another animal, locking eyes with my daughter, I mean, and some people are going to say, you know, why didn't you have a gun?
00:48:31.980
Well, you didn't realize what was happening at this point.
00:48:34.340
You couldn't even see from the point of your house what was going on.
00:48:43.300
And so obviously that would have been different if you knew exactly what the threat was.
00:48:49.060
But I mean, we're talking about like human life here versus the desires of owners of pit bulls to get their way.
00:49:03.740
And I am thankful that God seems to be using this to expose things that need to be exposed.
00:49:10.260
Who knows what tragedy this is actually going to prevent from happening or what subversion of justice this whole situation may prevent from happening
00:49:17.840
because you are pursuing an ethics complaint, an ethics charge.
00:49:23.700
I really do believe that we might not see the light at the end of the tunnel yet.
00:49:27.200
We might not see what God is doing through all of this yet.
00:49:31.940
But I really believe that you guys are being courageous and obedient.
00:49:35.280
And so I just encourage everyone listening and watching to support y'all to, you know, follow you.
00:49:41.160
And we'll put all that information in the description and just to pray for y'all and to encourage y'all because I know that this has been really tough.
00:49:48.080
Is there any last thing that you want to share?
00:49:53.620
I'm so grateful you said that because I do see God's grace on this entire situation from beginning to end.
00:50:03.500
They have actually gotten a lot done as far as getting eyes and ears on this.
00:50:08.120
You know, even the fact that I'm talking to you right now is because people are trying to help us and our community has been sharing it.
00:50:14.680
And so very grateful to all the people that have helped us, to my neighbor, Sarah Ligon, who has just been relentless in trying to protect this neighborhood.
00:50:26.840
And thank you for allowing us to share this story here, Allie.
00:50:32.140
I really appreciate you taking the time to come on.
00:50:53.040
This story is much bigger than the problem of pit bulls.
00:51:04.160
And so it has a lot bigger themes, a lot deeper themes than just the issue of pit bulls.
00:51:07.860
But I like to take the opportunity to remind people that pit bulls are a scourge.
00:51:12.740
That it's not just that the it's not just the owners.
00:51:17.440
It's not just that they're trained in a wrong way, but actually they are different.
00:51:24.540
Golden retrievers inherently know how to retrieve.
00:51:37.040
And yet you would think by the arguments put forth by pit bull defenders that pit bulls are
00:51:43.560
the only dogs that are born totally blank slate and have no inherent characteristics whatsoever
00:51:49.300
that everything they do has to actually be taught.
00:51:54.680
I cannot tell you how many messages I receive, how many stories I see on a weekly basis from
00:51:59.840
people saying we loved our pit bull from puppyhood.
00:52:11.220
My kids used to lay on my pit bull and then one day they snapped.
00:52:16.320
One day I was walking out the door and my pit bull just latched onto my arm and wouldn't
00:52:20.720
One day they turned around and they grabbed onto my neighbor's face without any warning whatsoever.
00:52:28.900
You remember that Nashville story when a family lost their two kids, their five-month-old baby
00:52:36.800
and their two-year-old little girl because their two pit bulls mauled these children to
00:52:43.320
And then as the mom was trying to defend these kids, she was also mauled.
00:52:47.300
She went into the hospital, but her babies died.
00:52:50.160
I mean, I can't imagine how absolutely devastated they were.
00:52:53.440
But if you look back at their previous posts, as has been reported by places like New York
00:53:02.880
And they believed that the fear-mongering about pit bulls was totally misguided, that they loved
00:53:10.520
their pit bulls named Cheech and Mia, that they would never harm a fly, and that no one
00:53:18.120
And that's what the Facebook post of the dad of these two now mauled and murdered children
00:53:29.540
Well, these dogs bite actually more than pit bulls.
00:53:35.180
There was actually a vet tech who went back and forth with me on this on Twitter saying,
00:53:40.880
Tell me how many children have gone to the ICU because of their chihuahua bite.
00:53:44.400
Tell me how many funerals people have attended because their toddler was mauled to death by
00:53:57.860
Pit bulls are deadlier because they were bred to do this.
00:54:12.540
Some of the gnarliest stories that you've ever seen before because people elevate animals
00:54:29.380
But because more deaths by dog bite or because of pit bulls than other dogs by proportionality,
00:54:37.200
then I guess that just means the owners are disproportionately responsible.
00:54:44.480
But apparently pit bull owners disproportionately suck.
00:54:51.000
But whenever I talk about this, like the level of denial that I see from pit bull apologists
00:55:03.580
So I'm just asking you, I'm pulling you back to sanity, back to earth to show you yet again
00:55:12.540
And these dogs are disproportionately inherently dangerous.
00:55:20.680
Apparently there is a certain percentage of pit bull that you have to have in a dog that
00:55:25.480
makes you, I think, more inherently aggressive.
00:55:30.200
Does it mean that all pit bulls are going to maul someone to death?
00:55:33.600
But do I think that we should take our chances on that?
00:55:36.720
I happen to believe that human life matters more.
00:55:40.060
I mean, I saw this terrible story the other day.
00:55:42.460
A 46-year-old woman, she was, I think she was a deputy, actually.
00:55:49.000
And she, her child went into a neighbor's garage.
00:55:56.980
The dogs, the dog started attacking the nine-year-old.
00:56:00.000
And so this was in Indianapolis, eight-year-old son, actually.
00:56:04.920
And she went in there to protect her child like all of us would.
00:56:09.120
We would rather be mauled to death than our child harmed.
00:56:12.520
And she was mauled to death by these three pit bulls.
00:56:16.140
You don't see these headlines about cocker spaniels.
00:56:19.160
You don't see these headlines about Dalmatians.
00:56:32.620
We can put some links to resources so you can read it for yourself.