Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - Ep 831 ｜ Chrissy Teigen’s Surrogacy Announcement & No More Affirmative Action ｜ Guest： Steve Deace

00:00:00.000 The Supreme Court has just ruled affirmative action policies at universities unconstitutional.

00:00:08.240 This is great news, but what does it really mean?

00:00:10.880 Also, Trump's indictments, what are they?

00:00:14.120 And what do those really mean?

00:00:16.340 And Chrissy Teigen announced that she has a new baby that has just been birthed via

00:00:23.560 surrogate.

00:00:24.520 I will share my thoughts on that at the end of this episode.

00:00:28.200 This episode is brought to you by our friends at Good Ranchers.

00:00:31.680 Go to GoodRanchers.com.

00:00:33.220 Use code Allie at checkout. 1.00

00:00:34.320 That's GoodRanchers.com, code Allie.

00:00:45.400 Hey guys, welcome to Relatable.

00:00:47.100 Happy Thursday.

00:00:48.060 Hope everyone's had a wonderful week.

00:00:50.420 All right, we're going to get into some new stuff that we have been not putting off for

00:00:55.240 a while, but there's just been some other subjects that we have wanted to talk about.

00:01:00.060 I wanted to bring Steve Dace in to give us his hard-hitting analysis of everything that's

00:01:05.280 going on.

00:01:05.760 So we'll get into that, but I'm going to set us up with some context of what's going on

00:01:09.520 with these Trump indictments.

00:01:10.800 Before we get into that, however, exciting announcement that you guys have been waiting

00:01:15.560 for ever since I posted, if you're watching this on YouTube, ever since I posted these

00:01:20.520 shirts on my Instagram and said, these are just for the women going to Young Women's

00:01:26.200 Leadership Summit.

00:01:27.320 I got a million messages from you guys saying, oh my gosh, please sell these online.

00:01:32.860 Please sell these online.

00:01:33.900 And I knew something that I couldn't tell you then.

00:01:36.380 And that was that I knew that we were going to try to make it possible to sell these online

00:01:42.100 for everyone.

00:01:42.960 So I've got this and we'll put up some graphics, but I do have, I've got the razor

00:01:48.320 respectful, raucous one right here.

00:01:50.980 So this one says, if you're just listening, do the next right thing.

00:01:54.100 And then on the back, it says in faith with excellence and for the glory of God, which

00:01:58.160 is something that we say all the time.

00:01:59.960 It's kind of an addition to an Elizabeth Elliott quote that she always said, do the next right

00:02:05.240 thing for the glory of God.

00:02:06.700 We added some words to that.

00:02:08.160 We love Elizabeth Elliott.

00:02:09.600 Unrelatable.

00:02:10.080 And then the razor respectful ruckus, that's just an alliteration that we came up with.

00:02:16.060 And then the back is super cute too, but we've got some graphics that we will put up on YouTube.

00:02:20.820 The brand, since a lot of you are asking, I think it's, it doesn't even say because it

00:02:25.560 just says relatable on the tag, which is cool, but I think it's Bella Canvas.

00:02:29.160 I think that's what it is.

00:02:30.640 So it's a nice thin material, but it's really high quality.

00:02:34.700 I'm wearing an XL, but that's also because I'm seven months pregnant.

00:02:37.980 You'll hear Steve Day say that I'm eight months pregnant in our interview.

00:02:41.000 I'm not eight months pregnant.

00:02:41.880 I'm seven months pregnant.

00:02:43.260 I'm a little over, but so I'm wearing an XL.

00:02:47.280 My husband will probably wear an XL, which leads to my next part of this announcement

00:02:53.960 is that Related Bros, we have stuff for you.

00:02:56.740 So these are kind of girly, kind of a girly design, a girly color.

00:03:02.400 But we have the Do The Next Right Thing t-shirts in a cream with black writing and then a black

00:03:09.320 with white writing.

00:03:10.920 So they're nice and masculine.

00:03:12.480 The text is even masculine just for you, Related Bros, because I had been getting feedback

00:03:18.220 from y'all saying, hey, where's the merch for us?

00:03:21.680 Just because we're in the minority doesn't mean that we shouldn't get merch.

00:03:25.620 So there you go.

00:03:27.260 All available on alimerch.com.

00:03:31.600 alimerch.com.

00:03:33.020 I know that you guys are excited about this.

00:03:35.620 I'm excited for you.

00:03:37.000 These are absolutely my favorite shirts that we have.

00:03:40.140 And they're really special because these are phrases that I say a lot.

00:03:43.420 Raise a respectful ruckus for the things that matter.

00:03:46.060 Do the next right thing.

00:03:48.100 We have so many phrases, so many phrases that we have come up with on this show.

00:03:52.980 So toxic mommy culture, a cult of self-affirmation. 1.00

00:03:56.060 Politics matter because policy matters because people matter.

00:03:58.960 I love sayings.

00:04:00.120 I love phrases.

00:04:00.880 And I especially love alliteration.

00:04:02.820 So here you go.

00:04:03.660 Take advantage.

00:04:04.860 alimerch.com.

00:04:05.740 They're already selling like hotcakes.

00:04:07.240 So make sure that you get yours.

00:04:08.600 This should be at your house in a few days.

00:04:12.340 All right.

00:04:13.720 Let me give you some context.

00:04:15.440 Let me give you some context of what we're about to talk about with Trump.

00:04:18.420 And then we've got some stories after the Steve Dase interview, too, that I want to make

00:04:22.060 sure that we get to.

00:04:24.180 But because he kind of dives right into his analysis, I want to make sure that we know

00:04:28.640 what's going on.

00:04:29.920 We talked about last week, I think, that this just hasn't been something that we've been

00:04:34.200 following closely.

00:04:35.660 We just hear, oh, Trump's indicted.

00:04:37.040 Trump's indicted again.

00:04:38.020 This is really bad.

00:04:38.840 There's a two-tier justice system. 0.89

00:04:40.300 If you're a progressive, you're not going to bear the brunt of the law the way that a

00:04:43.820 conservative is.

00:04:44.760 Basically, this is Joe Biden trying to go after his potential political rival in the

00:04:51.000 2024 election.

00:04:52.940 This is terrible.

00:04:53.760 But like, what exactly is going on?

00:04:56.900 So we're going to look behind the scenes when we talk to when we talk to Steve.

00:05:01.500 He's going to give us also like what I think is a very insightful and fair analysis of Trump

00:05:06.160 and then Governor DeSantis and what their chances are, what they bring to the table, what some

00:05:10.440 of the weaknesses are.

00:05:11.760 But also in talking about like, why is this happening to Donald Trump and what does it actually

00:05:16.220 mean?

00:05:16.560 What is its real impact?

00:05:17.560 So let me get into some of the details, the details of these cases.

00:05:23.760 All right.

00:05:36.880 So let's talk about these Trump indictments just briefly.

00:05:39.720 I don't need to give you a lot of details about what's going on.

00:05:44.400 Steve is going to provide some of those for us, and you'll hear him say at the top of our

00:05:47.540 conversation, don't look at media coverage of this.

00:05:49.800 But Politico does lay this out really easily because there's just confusion.

00:05:53.600 Like how many indictments, how many investigations are going on?

00:05:56.980 Where are they?

00:05:57.780 Why are they happening?

00:05:58.840 So let me just break this down a little bit, according to Politico, because they do give

00:06:03.960 us some good context.

00:06:05.660 For the first 234 years of the nation's history, no American president or former president was

00:06:10.140 indicted.

00:06:10.660 That changed in March 2023 when former president Donald Trump was charged with 34 felony counts

00:06:16.640 in connection with hush money payments to a porn star.

00:06:20.120 That would be Stormy Daniels.

00:06:22.200 Less than three months later, he was indicted again, this time on 37 felony counts for mishandling

00:06:26.560 classified documents and impeding investigators and two other ongoing criminal probes, both

00:06:32.680 related to 2020 election interference.

00:06:35.100 may prompt further indictments of Trump and his allies.

00:06:39.480 So the classified document case, federal prosecutors led by special counsel Jack Smith have accused

00:06:45.700 Trump of taking highly sensitive national security documents when he left the White House in January

00:06:51.180 2021.

00:06:52.160 You'll remember when Mar-a-Lago was raided.

00:06:54.280 They said it was because of these classified documents.

00:06:56.480 A lot of people on the right were saying this is absolutely ridiculous.

00:06:58.980 There was no need for this raid.

00:07:00.800 They were just trying to show off.

00:07:02.140 They were trying to intimidate Trump, trying to intimidate Trump supporters.

00:07:06.100 Apparently, there have been other presidents, other politicians who have taken classified

00:07:10.640 documents or haven't handled them exactly correctly.

00:07:14.740 But there has been some audio leaked about this where Trump allegedly said, as president,

00:07:20.500 I could have declassified it.

00:07:21.800 Now I can't.

00:07:24.100 And adding to the document he was displaying to others was still a secret.

00:07:27.920 So he was showing these classified documents that he had tomorrow.

00:07:30.760 They had at Mar-a-Lago to people and saying, you know, saying things that he, I guess,

00:07:36.480 shouldn't have said.

00:07:37.120 So he has been indicted on June 9th, 2023.

00:07:42.400 That indictment was unsealed, charging Trump with the 37 felonies.

00:07:47.620 And Trump pleaded not guilty at an arraignment in Miami on June 13th, 2023.

00:07:53.900 No further court dates have been scheduled.

00:07:58.040 And then if we look at the other one of the other indictments, the hush money case, this

00:08:04.620 is the New York state court.

00:08:06.700 Trump is accused of falsifying business records in connection with a payoff to Stormy Daniels,

00:08:11.620 who claimed that she had a sexual encounter with him by buying Daniels silence.

00:08:17.100 The payoff avoided a possible sex scandal in the final weeks of the 2016 presidential campaign.

00:08:21.680 Michael Cohen, Trump's personal attorney at the time, paid one hundred thirty thousand

00:08:26.300 dollars to Daniels in October 2016, according to prosecutors.

00:08:30.700 And then Trump reimbursed Cohen on March 30th, 2023.

00:08:34.860 A Manhattan grand jury voted to indict Trump.

00:08:37.640 Remember, I had my dad on and we talked about whether he was going to be perp walked.

00:08:42.760 Five days later, local prosecutors unveiled the criminal charges.

00:08:46.340 Thirty four felony counts of violating New York law on corporate record keeping.

00:08:51.000 Steve is going to also tell us what he thinks the likelihood is of these things actually

00:08:56.800 going through of these indictments actually succeeding the Georgia election interference

00:09:02.740 investigation.

00:09:03.280 This is in the Georgia state court in December 2020.

00:09:05.920 In January 2021, Trump sought to overturn the result of the presidential election in the

00:09:11.060 state of Georgia.

00:09:12.020 Two recounts confirmed that President Joe Biden narrowly prevailed in the race for the state's

00:09:15.760 16 electoral votes.

00:09:18.260 But Trump and his allies, Politico says, spread lies about voter fraud, urged Georgia officials

00:09:23.380 to reverse Biden's win and plotted to send fake electors to Washington on January 2nd, 2021.

00:09:28.980 Trump called Georgia secretary of state and urged him to find eleven thousand seven hundred

00:09:34.100 votes for Trump.

00:09:36.760 This is still just an investigation.

00:09:38.820 So this is not to the indictment level.

00:09:40.980 I can't remember if I accidentally said indictment.

00:09:42.740 This is just an investigation.

00:09:43.900 In February 2021, Willis opened the criminal investigation in January 23 after hearing evidence

00:09:50.440 for seven months.

00:09:51.140 A special grand jury released a report recommending potential indictments.

00:09:55.940 And then there's the January 6th insurrection investigation, which is still just an investigation.

00:10:03.580 They're investigating federal prosecutors are investigating Trump's attempts to subvert

00:10:08.840 the results of the 2020 election, including his role in the Capitol, quote unquote, insurrection.

00:10:14.920 I call it a riot on January 6th.

00:10:18.240 So that's what's going on right now.

00:10:21.180 Investigations, indictments, more things coming down the pipeline.

00:10:24.420 What is really going on?

00:10:26.500 Why does this matter?

00:10:28.360 And then you'll also hear you'll also hear at the end of our conversation, just some brief

00:10:33.620 commentary on the Hunter Biden situation, the Biden crime family and the Hunter laptop,

00:10:40.020 something else that we've been talking about for a long time.

00:10:42.740 So there is a lot of information, a lot of details when it comes to the Hunter laptop situation.

00:10:48.740 He is now being charged with tax evasion, gun charges, and he is going to have his first

00:10:53.620 court appearance on July 26th.

00:10:56.120 Rather than get into all of that right now, because I want to give you sufficient detail,

00:11:00.400 I'm probably going to wait until around the date of the court appearance to kind of lay

00:11:05.600 out the timeline of everything that's happened.

00:11:07.860 Why people are saying that this is a two tiered justice system, or maybe we'll get into it in

00:11:13.820 the next couple of weeks.

00:11:14.840 Maybe we'll bring a guest on who has been following this closely.

00:11:17.460 But rather than laying this all out right now, since I didn't have time to get analysis from

00:11:22.160 Steve, I'll just say he's being charged with some bad things that's really just scratching

00:11:27.740 the surface of everything that he seems guilty of.

00:11:30.600 And actually, Biden's President Biden's involvement in all of this is a huge part of the story,

00:11:35.360 too, that the media is trying to say, oh, no, that's just a father's unconditional love,

00:11:39.740 which is ridiculous.

00:11:40.600 So we'll get into all of that in detail in the coming weeks.

00:11:44.360 But you will hear Steve talk about it just slightly at the end of our conversation.

00:11:49.200 All right.

00:11:50.220 Like I said, we've got a couple of stories that I want to talk about independently after

00:11:53.700 Steve has to leave and prepare for his show.

00:12:09.360 All right, Steve, thanks so much for joining us again.

00:12:12.800 And break it down for us.

00:12:14.500 What is going on with Trump and these indictments and what do they really mean?

00:12:20.960 You know, here's one thing I would say to audiences like ours.

00:12:24.920 Don't pay attention to any media coverage of these criminal cases at all.

00:12:28.400 I mean, what what happened just earlier this week where CNN obtains the the audio of the

00:12:39.940 most incriminating evidence entered into the indictment in Miami against Trump?

00:12:44.100 And then the next day, Catherine Herridge from CBS comes out and says, well, that's actually

00:12:47.840 not even a key part of the evidence, even though it's in the indictment.

00:12:50.600 And then kind of backtracks that report the next day.

00:12:53.340 And and we're still sitting here, by the way, at the time that you and I are having this

00:12:57.820 conversation on Thursday morning.

00:12:59.960 It has been 72 hours.

00:13:02.060 And still, the Trump legal team has yet to file for a mistrial or a motion to dismiss with

00:13:08.360 prejudice because of the leaking of information from an indictment to the media.

00:13:13.320 The whole thing is so convoluted.

00:13:15.480 I don't know you can trust anybody to tell the truth about the other side on a consistent

00:13:20.540 basis.

00:13:21.080 So if you're looking for the truth, I would really at this point just look at from a 0.84

00:13:24.980 legality standpoint, what is actually filed and in the court documents themselves and

00:13:30.700 then what the courts actually do. 0.93

00:13:33.040 If you look in Miami, Judge Cannon has shown to be at least somewhat sympathetic to Trump

00:13:37.740 so far.

00:13:38.680 And by sympathetic, meaning like not out to, you know, martyr him.

00:13:42.080 So actually maybe practicing law.

00:13:44.180 And so I think that there's a chance for the former president to get some form of a fair

00:13:49.680 trial there.

00:13:50.360 I think it's possible that you could find a couple of patriots in Miami-Dade County where

00:13:55.120 DeSantis won last election.

00:13:56.680 And in 2020, Trump got about 46 percent of the vote that if his attorneys have an IQ above

00:14:01.800 14, they can probably get two or three jurors on that bench to hold firm against all the

00:14:09.040 Karens that the Department of Justice will make sure gets appointed and maybe hang that 1.00

00:14:13.300 jury.

00:14:14.300 In Manhattan, he has no chance for a fair trial there.

00:14:17.260 He got 12 percent of the vote.

00:14:19.340 I mean, he'll be found guilty of being Donald Trump on a sunny day.

00:14:22.740 The same thing goes for the case that's still to be filed.

00:14:26.040 And that's the most dangerous one, Ali. 0.66

00:14:28.420 That's the Department of Justice case that they're working on with January 6th and insurrection

00:14:33.060 and the Espionage, I'm sorry, the Espionage Act is the other case.

00:14:36.180 But the insurrection and the kinds of things that put a lot of his nonviolent supporters

00:14:41.780 indefinitely detained since January 6th, they are working their way up the food chain.

00:14:47.220 And I believe later this summer he will be indicted in that case and before the gulag that

00:14:52.700 Washington, D.C. calls a jury.

00:14:54.700 And I think that's the most problematic one for him moving forward for sure.

00:14:58.660 How do you think this is going to affect his chances in the primary?

00:15:03.300 Or, I mean, what does this even look like for him?

00:15:06.700 I think these are questions that we have to be asking.

00:15:09.980 And hey, when I got into this business, man, I never thought I would use the term.

00:15:14.660 I mean, my number one prime directive when I started my show was to, you know, I was inspired

00:15:20.600 by what Rush Limbaugh did with conservatism to bring it into the mainstream.

00:15:24.300 And I was kind of hoping to do the same thing with a biblical worldview.

00:15:27.060 I never thought that I'd be daily using terms like demonic in my analysis, however.

00:15:32.540 And yet here we are.

00:15:33.900 I also never thought I was going to say, hey, I think we really need to vet these candidates,

00:15:38.280 the leading candidate right now.

00:15:40.420 And what's his plan to stay out of prison?

00:15:42.220 I just wasn't on the, you know, when I got the conservative broadcaster handbook over at

00:15:49.260 the talkers convention, when I got into this business 15 years ago, there wasn't a chapter

00:15:52.980 on how to handle that.

00:15:54.320 So, you know, I don't know what to do with that, but I do think we need to find out.

00:15:59.720 I think we need to ask questions.

00:16:02.720 And him and his team have to answer them, Ali. 0.52

00:16:05.240 I mean, what would be his plan to run for office under, say, house arrest at Mar-a-Lago?

00:16:11.740 He couldn't hold rallies, couldn't travel the country.

00:16:14.460 Because I think that's a distinct possibility.

00:16:17.620 What legal strategy does his team have prepared for when he is found guilty of felonies because

00:16:24.620 his name is Donald Trump and blue secretaries of state and key swing states like Michigan,

00:16:30.500 Wisconsin and Arizona.

00:16:33.240 Two of those are Wisconsin, Arizona are must win states for Republicans in the next election.

00:16:37.240 Cannot get to 270 probably without them.

00:16:38.940 And so when you when they get blue blue secretaries of state that may say, you know, now that you're

00:16:44.020 a convicted felon, I don't think you should be you should have ballot access because we

00:16:47.880 have seen for a generation, Ali, Democrats just do things they they guess is probably unconstitutional

00:16:52.880 and just dare us to find a judge somewhere to overturn it.

00:16:55.880 Just this morning, it's taken 50 years.

00:16:58.080 But finally, affirmative action, which is basically just cost shifting racism from one class to

00:17:03.740 another, finally got struck down by the courts today.

00:17:06.340 It's taken 50 years to do this.

00:17:08.280 All right.

00:17:08.500 And so that's their game plan.

00:17:09.740 You know, if you can find a court to do it in the meantime, we'll just, you know, wreak

00:17:13.700 havoc with what we want to do.

00:17:15.260 And so go out there and play federal judge roulette on whether you can get on the ballot in enough

00:17:20.220 states to get to 270.

00:17:21.480 What's the game plan for that?

00:17:23.060 And then here's a here's the most uncomfortable question of them all.

00:17:26.120 But, you know, you're eight months pregnant.

00:17:29.080 I've got three kids and all all of them are either adults or on the brink of adulthood.

00:17:35.980 And so their futures are at stake up against a political party that wants to watch their

00:17:40.080 futures end.

00:17:41.380 And we're and you're asking me right now.

00:17:43.640 The date today is June 29th.

00:17:45.940 So we're we're we're we're 496 days away from the election.

00:17:52.300 You are asking me right now to put my full faith and credit.

00:17:56.120 And Donald Trump, who's on his third marriage for bankruptcies.

00:18:00.220 And on March 16th, 2020, had this country humming.

00:18:04.100 And the minute Fauci and Birx walked into his office and said, you're going to kill two

00:18:07.480 million people if you don't shut the country down, just ended his entire presidency and

00:18:11.320 handed it to them.

00:18:12.220 OK, you're asking me to trust that guy not to cut a deal with the feds next summer, next

00:18:18.560 fall after he's the nominee.

00:18:20.080 And the whole process is over that says, OK, you can stay out of prison for the rest of

00:18:24.540 your natural life, because if you look at what he's on the hook for in Miami alone, he'd

00:18:28.440 be in prison for the rest of his natural life if found guilty.

00:18:30.660 And even a couple of those counts, you're going to you're going to you're asking me to

00:18:34.220 and you're asking all of us, you're asking everyone with the sound of my voice to trust

00:18:37.560 a guy who promised two women he would stay married to him forever and didn't.

00:18:41.080 And you're asking us at this age that he would not cut a deal with the feds and say, OK, then

00:18:47.880 I have to drop out, never seek national office again, and I get to stay out of prison and

00:18:52.000 have this scrubbed from my record.

00:18:54.200 I'm not willing to you know, I love what Donald Trump did with his presidency until March 16th,

00:18:59.380 2020.

00:19:00.200 But asking me to trust him on that personal level, I'm not comfortable with it.

00:19:04.620 We're unevenly yoked there.

00:19:05.680 I think at least, Allie, we should say to him, we will we will make it so that the RNC

00:19:11.100 does not forbid someone who is under indictment or convicted of being a nominee, provided

00:19:16.240 you sign some pledge that says under no circumstances will you drop out of the race no matter what

00:19:21.400 they offer you.

00:19:22.240 Maybe that's also not worth the paper it's printed on with him, but at least it would

00:19:25.740 be something.

00:19:26.800 And I think these are the kinds of questions that we need to be asking right now and his

00:19:30.440 people need to be answering, frankly.

00:19:31.840 You know, it really is amazing how popular he still is among Republican voters.

00:19:37.200 I mean, he's leading the primary field, which is not all that surprising right now.

00:19:42.420 DeSantis has pretty has pretty impressive numbers, too, but he is leading the pack.

00:19:47.520 According to an NBC voter poll and a hypothetical Trump-Biden battle, President Biden came out

00:19:53.880 on top with the near majority level, 49 percent to Trump's 45, 45 percent support.

00:20:00.460 Honestly, considering everything that Trump has been through, considering everything that

00:20:05.720 the media has thrown at Trump, considering everything that Trump himself has actually

00:20:09.680 done, all the unforced errors, that's pretty incredible that in this NBC poll, it's just

00:20:16.920 one poll, but that he's coming out with apparently 45 percent support.

00:20:22.960 I mean, honestly, that's kind of something beyond my own comprehension.

00:20:26.640 I also I voted for him twice, supported a lot of what he did, but I didn't fully understand

00:20:33.460 everyone's excitement and their enthusiasm about him in the 2016 primary.

00:20:39.380 I didn't get it.

00:20:40.720 And still now I have I have a little bit of trouble wrapping my head around how this guy

00:20:46.540 is still leading the pack so drastically at this point in his career, not based on the

00:20:53.400 indictment stuff, not based on the media stuff, because Republicans, you know, we can kind

00:20:57.240 of conservatives can see through that.

00:20:59.560 But based on the covid stuff that you just listed, based on the other things that make

00:21:03.280 it difficult for us to trust him, it's pretty amazing that he still carries this much weight.

00:21:09.020 If there's one thing you can say about Donald Trump and go back to the the problematic character

00:21:13.080 issues that I just mentioned, you could turn that the other way, too.

00:21:16.280 And you can say scandals, failures that would have broken a lot of other men he has persevered

00:21:24.660 through.

00:21:25.260 I think if Donald Trump has one unique gift within his his his portrait of masculinity,

00:21:33.280 it is a tenacity to to survive.

00:21:37.260 And and that's why we have seen him rise over and over again from the ashes, from the kinds

00:21:42.520 of things that have ended the careers and and and the ascensions of many others of the

00:21:47.980 last era.

00:21:49.260 Now, his detractors will call that not tenacity, but shamelessness.

00:21:52.820 I suppose I suppose if is he using is he using that if he's using that tenacity to enact

00:21:59.000 policies you disagree with, it's shamelessness.

00:22:01.500 If he's using that shamelessness to enact policies you agree with, it's tenacity.

00:22:05.860 Right.

00:22:06.160 OK.

00:22:06.720 I was thinking with Joe Biden.

00:22:08.000 I mean, he's overcome, he's overcome a lot of the accusations and that's a great point

00:22:12.240 of accusations of lying, of making up all this stuff about his life.

00:22:17.200 And I mean, he just keeps going, man.

00:22:19.220 So, yeah, I just just it depends on what you think of these people.

00:22:23.000 I think August 24th.

00:22:26.140 When this is all said and done from a political standpoint and when when we get to next year's

00:22:32.780 convention and we see who or whom is standing up there and giving the acceptance speech

00:22:38.400 for the 2024 nomination for the Republican Party, I think August 24th is going to go a

00:22:43.780 long way into determining that.

00:22:45.560 I think that if I think if Ron DeSantis is polling profile right now, we're the perception

00:22:51.760 of it was better.

00:22:53.060 But he goes on to the stage and it looks like he is not yet ready to even fit into King Saul's

00:22:58.700 armor that he's he's he's mortally wounded there.

00:23:02.720 And it looks like because there's two King Saul's Ali, there's the early King Saul.

00:23:07.340 That's the champion of the realm.

00:23:08.800 And then there's the King Saul of latter years who gets swallowed up in his own narcissism

00:23:12.580 and goes and visits the witch of Endor.

00:23:14.280 OK, and so we're kind of trying to figure that out.

00:23:16.820 And then on the other hand, if you want to follow the analogy the other way, you're

00:23:19.760 looking at Ron DeSantis and what he did in Florida with which is not an insignificant

00:23:24.300 proving ground.

00:23:25.060 That is the largest swing state in the union.

00:23:27.080 It's the it's the second largest governing stage in the country other than the White 1.00

00:23:30.640 House.

00:23:31.500 And and you're wondering, OK, is David ready to go into the Valley of Elah yet?

00:23:36.120 Is that shepherd David or is that King David?

00:23:38.540 And one way to find out is to put him on a stage together and find out.

00:23:42.540 And if they get on the stage together and if Ron if Ron DeSantis were polling better today,

00:23:47.380 but got on that stage and it looked like he's the JV team and is not yet ready for prime

00:23:51.540 time, it would flip the narrative overnight.

00:23:53.920 Likewise, if they get on that stage and it looks like King David.

00:23:57.080 It is ready to replace Saul and go down into the Valley of Elah and take on Goliath.

00:24:01.240 It'll flip that narrative overnight as well.

00:24:03.860 And and I think that if I were advising the DeSantis team, I would tell them to game plan

00:24:08.000 as if this might be your only chance at Trump, that that if I were advising Donald Trump,

00:24:12.780 I would tell him you have to go to that first debate.

00:24:14.600 First of all, I think he wants to.

00:24:16.020 That's too big of a spotlight to stay away from.

00:24:18.680 I think you don't want to look at you don't want to give DeSantis a free shot up against the

00:24:22.500 other dwarf candidates there.

00:24:23.880 And he now looks like the alpha male in front of 20 million people.

00:24:26.480 So you need to go.

00:24:27.700 But I would also tell him if you go there and you punch him in the throat, you don't need

00:24:31.640 to go back.

00:24:32.100 You made your point.

00:24:32.760 Don't do any more.

00:24:33.500 We're done here.

00:24:34.400 And I learned in Iowa when I was on the Cruz campaign, we did a debate right before the

00:24:38.520 there were two debates right before the Iowa caucuses.

00:24:40.640 And in the penultimate one, Cruz really embarrassed Trump in that debate badly.

00:24:45.200 And and Trump stammered and had no comeback and then bothered to didn't even bother to

00:24:50.200 show up for the last debate.

00:24:51.080 And that's when I knew we were going to win Iowa is when he didn't show up, because I think

00:24:54.320 that will happen as well.

00:24:55.340 I think if they if they go into that debate and DeSantis makes it look like Trump has passed

00:24:59.520 his prime, I don't think Trump will show back up again.

00:25:01.480 And so if I were the DeSantis team, I would be I would be prepping as if that might be my

00:25:05.900 only crack at the old man.

00:25:07.520 Yeah, I think that that is exactly right.

00:25:09.740 I think that's a good analysis of trying to show DeSantis's strategy should be trying

00:25:15.480 to show that he's passed his prime, that he doesn't really understand the issues.

00:25:19.100 He's not really connected to what parents are feeling that.

00:25:22.560 And of course, I think that he should be punching from the right, whereas we've seen Trump

00:25:27.780 try to punch DeSantis from the left, like using the same kind of tactics that the left

00:25:32.500 does and accusing him of being too radical when it came to abortion, too radical when it

00:25:37.640 came to even, you know, the vaccine, which Trump himself still claims to be very proud

00:25:41.740 of.

00:25:42.820 And so I think punching Trump from the right could be good.

00:25:45.380 But you're right.

00:25:46.100 If DeSantis comes across his JV team, which to Trump's credit, his campaign has tried to

00:25:51.240 cast DeSantis as as, oh, he's just a little he's just a little brother.

00:25:55.600 He's just a little annoying brother of Trump.

00:25:58.000 And he's just getting in the way.

00:25:59.380 Maybe it'll be his time later on, but he doesn't really know what he's doing yet.

00:26:02.760 But yeah, that is I mean, as superficial as that might be, of course, we would like to

00:26:06.700 think, no, people are really going to think, think about the policies.

00:26:09.340 People are really going to consider the history.

00:26:11.400 That's not really what happens at the debates.

00:26:12.980 You look at the debates and you think, how did these people make me feel?

00:26:17.460 Do they make me feel emboldened?

00:26:19.260 Do they make me feel strong?

00:26:21.180 Do they make me feel like I could trust them, like I could follow them into battle or not?

00:26:26.280 And so I think that's I think that's a good analysis that I mean, that's tough.

00:26:29.480 That's tough for both of them, because it could go either direction.

00:26:33.040 But it's a tough job, Ali.

00:26:34.700 There's this is the hardest job on planet Earth.

00:26:36.840 And only one person gets to hold it, you know.

00:26:38.920 And so every every cycle, we ought to be like Heath Ledger's Joker,

00:26:42.760 cracking the cue stick in half and saying, we're going to have tryouts.

00:26:46.200 That's what's at stake.

00:26:47.240 I mean, the future of the country is at stake.

00:26:49.560 The future of our children is at stake.

00:26:52.020 And I have hated saying this my whole career.

00:26:54.160 I have laughed at it as if the electing Mitt Romney or John McCain was the most important election of my lifetime.

00:27:00.860 OK, I hated that crap.

00:27:02.660 But given where we're at right now, I mean, I don't know what comes after they're castrating the kids.

00:27:10.280 The guidance counselors will suggest you euthanizing them.

00:27:13.000 I don't know.

00:27:13.800 We're at so many brinks right now, Ali.

00:27:16.260 I don't like I don't know what the next step down other than is bottom.

00:27:19.340 You know, hell, that's the next step is hell itself.

00:27:21.660 And so I'm flirting with the idea for the first time, as much as I pilloried this and panned it my whole career,

00:27:29.040 that this next cycle might be the most important one of our lifetimes.

00:27:33.560 I know this.

00:27:34.440 It's the most important one of Trump's lifetime.

00:27:37.060 If if if himself or someone sympathetic to him, that style of Republican does not win the next election, Ali.

00:27:43.760 He is going to spend the rest of his natural life in prison.

00:27:46.560 I promise you that's where this is going.

00:27:48.240 Yeah.

00:27:48.460 So he needs someone that can that can pardon him, whether it's himself or someone else that can win.

00:27:53.200 Yeah.

00:27:53.920 My simplistic analysis that I've given that I gave a few weeks ago that a lot of people agree with, a lot of people have said, too, is simply that.

00:28:02.280 I mean, I understand that Trump is leading the primary field and that he's popular.

00:28:06.900 I don't think that he can win against Biden.

00:28:09.120 I don't know if he can even even if all of the if everything was in his favor, if everything was totally neutral and everything was very fair.

00:28:16.660 I don't think that he could win against Joe Biden.

00:28:18.780 I do think someone like Ron DeSantis could.

00:28:21.040 I think, honestly, there are other candidates that can't win the primary that could probably win against Joe Biden.

00:28:26.600 I think Tim Scott could probably win against Joe Biden.

00:28:29.500 Nikki Haley.

00:28:29.860 Provided Joe Biden is the candidate, of course.

00:28:31.980 Yes.

00:28:32.060 Provided he is the candidate.

00:28:33.260 Yes, that's true.

00:28:34.260 That's true.

00:28:34.720 I think there's a lot of people that could win against Joe Biden.

00:28:36.620 And I think Trump is one of the only people who could not win against Joe Biden.

00:28:40.540 Something else that kind of that worries me about Trump.

00:28:43.500 You talked about his trustworthiness is and some people like this.

00:28:47.060 They see this as him championing their concerns, too.

00:28:52.120 But I think he is so caught up on his own personal vendettas, which, you know, I can't really blame him for.

00:28:58.180 But he's so concerned with how he's been treated and how he's been unfairly maligned that his only goal when he gets in office is to try to enact revenge on the people who have unfairly treated him, whatever.

00:29:13.440 And he's not as concerned with the plight of everyone else who has supported him or the plight of conservatives or the plight of parents.

00:29:21.460 I think that he is so Trump minded that that's going to be his main focus.

00:29:27.640 And I like I really want him to kind of move past that and to say, OK, but how is everyone else being mistreated?

00:29:34.040 How about these parents over here who are being cast as domestic terrorists?

00:29:37.740 And I'm just not sure he has the the vision, the wide enough perspective to be able to see the importance of that.

00:29:45.140 I think, you know, when you look at.

00:29:50.060 I have said on my show many times over the years, Ali, the most destructive manifestation of human sin is the fragile male ego.

00:29:56.600 Yeah.

00:29:57.560 There has been no more destructive manifestation of human sin in the history of our species than the fragile male ego.

00:30:04.460 And it's a razor's edge.

00:30:06.200 OK, what's the difference between a MacArthur who loses early in World War Two and vows, I shall return and wants and wants.

00:30:15.140 And wants revenge on the Japs who did it to him and and is single minded in purpose to walk out of Manila, the victor later in the war to King Saul, who goes and visits the witch of Endor, who goes to look for to extract vengeance, but in order to satiate his ego. 0.78

00:30:34.940 And I think the difference is to what end, to what end?

00:30:39.300 And you have seen like I'm like for me, I love the idea of Donald Trump with with a taste of blood in his mouth.

00:30:47.300 And I'm someone that I don't like his personality most days.

00:30:50.000 I find his branding and many of his branders beyond obnoxious.

00:30:53.480 OK, but I love the idea of a guy with a chip on his shoulder and something to prove.

00:30:57.840 But there's two ways to execute this.

00:31:00.100 There's the MacArthur way that I talked about.

00:31:02.900 And he has demonstrated that a couple of times.

00:31:05.160 Yeah.

00:31:05.420 The speech that he gave at CPAC, the speech he gave the other day at Faith and Freedom Coalition.

00:31:09.600 I am your retribution.

00:31:11.400 Yeah.

00:31:11.580 OK, I am your symbol.

00:31:13.540 That's powerful messaging.

00:31:15.460 OK, then there is the way he behaves a lot of the days in between those kinds of speeches.

00:31:20.400 You know, he's over there doing poop lib videos on truth social, dimly lit, you know, coming up with stupid nicknames for Ron DeSantis because he just can't believe Fox News covered his press conference again.

00:31:31.520 That kind of stuff is and it goes back to the good and bad of his presidency.

00:31:35.920 The first fight of the Trump presidency, remember, is when he enlisted Sean Spicer to go after the media about how many people actually attended his inaugural compared to Obama's.

00:31:45.360 And that's the thing.

00:31:46.760 I want a guy with I want a warrior with an ego.

00:31:49.440 Give me one.

00:31:50.400 But but it can't come with a ruler.

00:31:52.420 If you get the if you get the crude analogy I'm making here that we're all just going to drop, trow and measure ourselves all the time.

00:31:58.420 It can't be about that.

00:31:59.740 What to what end or is the ego that someone has to pay for this?

00:32:05.220 This injustice must be rectified.

00:32:07.760 Right.

00:32:08.020 There's the Samson. 0.94

00:32:09.300 In many respects, I've I've I've compared Trump to Samson.

00:32:12.440 I think biblically they are very similar.

00:32:14.560 There's the Samson that has a rewards card at the red light district with over in Canaan.

00:32:19.040 He walks into the Canaanite brothel.

00:32:21.320 It's like Norman cheers Samson. 0.50

00:32:22.820 They know who he is.

00:32:23.500 Everybody knows him.

00:32:24.320 All right.

00:32:24.760 And then there's the Samson who tears down the temple of Dagon, the pillars of that temple to plunge the fish demon as worshippers face down into the dirt. 0.84

00:32:33.200 All right.

00:32:33.480 And we saw Trump smash the idol of Roe v. Wade.

00:32:36.800 We saw Trump smash the idol of we have to deal with the Palestinian question to have Middle East peace. 0.92

00:32:42.020 He said, no, we don't.

00:32:43.180 And he was right.

00:32:44.460 And then we have seen Trump also get smashed by his own insecurities and his own ego.

00:32:49.940 He is a very Samsonite figure.

00:32:51.860 And I think that also is very Saulian.

00:32:55.480 And that's the difference.

00:32:56.640 There are days where it looks like, OK, I can see why when the people went to the Lord and said, give us a king so we can be like everybody else.

00:33:03.980 Saul, that's your king.

00:33:05.460 That's a champion of the realm.

00:33:06.880 And then there are the days that he visits the witch of Endor.

00:33:09.660 He doesn't have a cohesive worldview.

00:33:11.100 He's demonstrated that many times.

00:33:12.720 His worldview is largely art of the deal.

00:33:14.820 If you look at, you know, you know, a tree by its fruit, basically his art, his thing is, if I can make a deal, you can make a deal.

00:33:21.000 There were a lot of sheiks in the Middle East, Ali, who pretended to care about Wahhabism when really they just wanted to make money. 1.00

00:33:26.940 Trump knew that, called the bluff and was able to get Mideast peace deal done.

00:33:30.480 But then he tried to cut deals with Pelosi, Schumer, and they're like, those are demons.

00:33:34.220 There's no deals to be made.

00:33:35.480 They're here to end you.

00:33:36.700 And that's what Fauci and Birx and they try to do with COVID.

00:33:39.780 There was no deal to cut there.

00:33:40.960 Hey, you know what, Fauci, you go out there and be the prime minister of Democrat America so we can save the country from this virus.

00:33:46.300 And I'll speak to the rest of the country.

00:33:47.960 We'll be one big happy partnership.

00:33:49.680 Meanwhile, Fauci's over there creating his own Vichy government right underneath Trump's nose and ends up usurping his authority altogether repeatedly.

00:33:58.000 And he never got it back.

00:33:59.580 And so this is, again, where are we with him?

00:34:02.860 And I think, if nothing else, it is vital for Ron DeSantis to be in the race to help us get an answer to that.

00:34:09.160 Because if you think keeping Trump on message is difficult now on a daily basis and not making it all about himself now, if he didn't have a legitimate opponent, if his opponents were all the other dwarf candidates who are irrelevant, then this would only be about him all of the time. 0.93

00:34:26.100 And so I think when you're, you know, it is good to have competition.

00:34:30.480 Okay, let's analyze for a second one of Trump's recent posts on Truth Social that, you know, I started thinking about this.

00:34:54.000 I have thoughts on it.

00:34:55.020 I know you have thoughts on it.

00:34:56.440 And my first reaction was, this is dumb, but it does present an interesting question.

00:35:00.380 So here's what he posted.

00:35:02.620 President Joe Biden and every living president except Donald Trump are direct descendants of slaveholders. 0.72

00:35:08.480 Jimmy Carter, George W. Bush, Bill Clinton, and through his white mother's side, Barack Obama.

00:35:14.740 This is from Reuters.

00:35:15.840 He says, I hope that every African-American in our country is reading this right now.

00:35:21.520 All caps, remember.

00:35:23.260 Okay, so my first thought is that, wow, that is so dumb.

00:35:28.280 That's so dumb.

00:35:29.440 We spent all of 2020 saying, no, we're not on the hook for the sins or even perceived sins of our ancestors.

00:35:37.520 Obviously, slavery, chattel slavery was an egregious sin.

00:35:40.680 But some of the things that, you know, white people are accused of, of, you know, systematically being responsible for all oppression of black and brown people, ridiculous assertion.

00:35:50.900 But then saying, you know, we're on the hook for our ancestors, not just even our ancestors, but just people who might have looked like us a long time ago in the same relative region.

00:36:05.220 Like, so we've spent a lot of time saying that's not biblical, that's not moral, that's not practical.

00:36:10.560 We shouldn't try to inculcate that in our legal system.

00:36:14.480 And here is the here is the former president, Republican president of the United States saying, no, actually, it does make me better.

00:36:23.280 It does make me better.

00:36:24.240 It makes me worth voting for black people because apparently his ancestors were not slaveholders.

00:36:31.140 So on that end, it's dumb.

00:36:32.960 But on the other hand, I'm like, OK, but what would a progressive say to this?

00:36:37.480 Why wouldn't they care about this?

00:36:39.260 Because they've also been saying for the past several years that this kind of stuff absolutely does matter, that we are condemned because of the sins, not just of our ancestors, but white people who lived in America 200 years ago.

00:36:51.820 And we need to dismantle everything that had a hint of white supremacy in it 300 years ago, except for Planned Parenthood and except for Joe Biden, I guess.

00:37:01.080 So in that sense, it is kind of interesting.

00:37:03.360 Like, how would progressives respond to this?

00:37:05.340 Why doesn't it matter in his case and why does it matter in other cases?

00:37:09.700 But on the surface, it's really just kind of dumb.

00:37:13.160 It's not an effective tactic.

00:37:14.300 It's not going to make black people vote for him.

00:37:15.940 I think this is symbolic of the potential and the pitfalls of Donald Trump and Ali worldview is destiny.

00:37:27.700 If your audience remembers nothing else I'm going to say on your episode today, remember that worldview is destiny.

00:37:34.320 No man can rise above their own worldview.

00:37:37.080 No one can run from their own worldview.

00:37:40.140 Worldview is destiny.

00:37:41.180 And so there is potential in this statement, as you articulated in the second half, and that would require, though, you'd have to pivot to an outcome.

00:37:48.820 You'd have to have a capable staff.

00:37:50.440 Right now, Donald Trump's inner sanctum at Mar-a-Lago is Lindsey Graham and Laura Loomer.

00:37:54.280 Good luck with that.

00:37:55.220 All right.

00:37:55.720 So a complete and total sellout and a nutter.

00:37:58.600 OK, that's essentially his staff, his inner circle, those types of people, people who will feed his worst instincts and then people who will actually try to take his best instincts.

00:38:08.180 And and make them null and void.

00:38:11.720 That's who he's surrounded by.

00:38:12.900 And there's no cogent because he has no cogent worldview.

00:38:15.400 So it's the it's the it's the it's the it's the the commentary that Tucker mentioned the other night that Donald Trump is subject to his being flattered, to letting people in who will just flatter him and tell him what he wants to hear.

00:38:26.400 That's a very Saulian instinct, by the way.

00:38:28.860 And and and so because of that, he could that statement could be used to say to then have a campaign, a team, then turn and message that and say, so why did no wonder voting for these people for the same party decade after decade, generation after generation didn't work.

00:38:46.780 OK, no wonder it didn't work.

00:38:48.780 Why did you think by your own standard?

00:38:50.260 It doesn't work.

00:38:51.100 They're the ones actually connected to the very systemic white supremacy that you claim to be against.

00:38:55.520 And here are the itemized policies that you keep voting for.

00:38:59.160 They don't care about you ever leaving your station in life or improving it.

00:39:02.960 They don't care about you.

00:39:04.080 You're chatteled.

00:39:04.960 You're just another form of chattel to them. 0.70

00:39:07.220 You're you're a political slave.

00:39:08.860 You're a political indentured servant.

00:39:10.540 You're just there to serve on their plantation every election day.

00:39:15.140 And then the rest of the time they don't care about you.

00:39:17.520 You could do that with with a staff or in a worldview that with precision executes your belief system.

00:39:26.200 He doesn't have that.

00:39:27.560 And he didn't have that very often during his own presidency.

00:39:30.740 And so instead, these things often this is an example of something he will say that will absolutely max lit the other side, put them on max lit.

00:39:39.680 They're constantly fired up.

00:39:41.600 But then there's no deliverance to us.

00:39:44.280 And so our base energy never responds to theirs.

00:39:47.240 Instead, he will follow this up with jailbreak, the first step back.

00:39:50.940 Right.

00:39:51.500 Exactly.

00:39:51.740 OK, so now we're just going to do mass purging of people in prison to show I'm not racist.

00:39:55.660 OK, which is it here?

00:39:57.380 And I think that that again, there's no the worldview is art of the deal.

00:40:02.160 Whom whom offers Trump the best deal as but it's but it's but it's plumb line is what's best for Trump.

00:40:08.880 Most of all, I think at his core, if you look at the long and he's had a long life and a lot of it in the public, I think there are there are two principles that guide Trump's art of the deal.

00:40:19.700 Number one, himself and his own self-interest.

00:40:22.680 And then number two, I do think he loves America.

00:40:25.080 I've described I think he's a patriotic narcissist.

00:40:27.100 And and thankfully, there are plenty of times where what's in his self-interest also happens to be in ours.

00:40:35.420 But but ultimately, transactionalism is not any.

00:40:39.460 You can't have any form of long term relationship based on that because someone will come along without conviction in their worldview.

00:40:46.260 Some pressure will be applied like what happened with covid.

00:40:49.200 Some better deal will be offered like his previous wives experienced. 0.70

00:40:54.800 Some better deal will be offered.

00:40:56.380 Some external pressure will be applied.

00:40:59.100 And that same ego will say, well, it's within my self-interest to take this offer and this deal now.

00:41:05.440 Exactly.

00:41:05.920 It's the lack of the cogent worldview.

00:41:08.340 And so no moral foundation or transcendent reason to do the right thing.

00:41:13.020 The right thing.

00:41:13.900 Correct.

00:41:14.360 Changes based on his own interest.

00:41:16.160 It's all based on instinct.

00:41:17.400 It's based on instinct.

00:41:18.380 What he's offended by at that time.

00:41:19.860 Right.

00:41:20.040 Yeah.

00:41:20.320 Right.

00:41:20.580 He's not the only politician.

00:41:22.060 Certainly.

00:41:22.460 He's not unique in that in that way.

00:41:25.580 And then the other one is, as you mentioned, caring too much what people think.

00:41:29.280 Honestly, at the end of the day, I still think he cares what The New York Times thinks.

00:41:32.820 I still think he cares about what people would have said if he had fired Dr. Fauci.

00:41:38.380 Like, I don't think that.

00:41:39.760 I don't think there's any question.

00:41:40.840 I don't want to break a confidence.

00:41:41.980 I won't.

00:41:42.280 But I will say, I will say, first, I have firsthand knowledge, firsthand knowledge of

00:41:47.060 how much Donald Trump craves the approval of Maggie Haberman at The New York Times.

00:41:51.240 Yeah.

00:41:51.440 And I'll just leave it at that.

00:41:52.500 I've witnessed it firsthand and I won't say anymore.

00:41:55.240 And you know what?

00:41:56.180 I mean, I'm not sure that I like with that's one thing that people love about DeSantis is

00:42:02.200 that it doesn't seem like he does care.

00:42:03.800 I mean, it seems like he got a lot of flack from donors over the Disney thing, over the

00:42:08.820 abortion thing, over fighting these culture wars. 1.00

00:42:11.720 And I've heard people say, oh, we don't want him to fight the culture wars.

00:42:14.880 But he has a really good finger on the pulse of what most voters actually want.

00:42:20.460 And he's willing to say to some donors, look, I know you don't like this Disney thing.

00:42:24.240 I'm sorry.

00:42:25.040 You're going to have to stuff it.

00:42:26.140 I know you don't like this abortion law.

00:42:27.680 You think it's too extreme.

00:42:29.280 I'm sorry.

00:42:29.820 You're going to have to stuff it.

00:42:30.660 Like we've already we've already seen Donald Trump say, oh, that abortion law in Florida,

00:42:35.300 it's just a little too radical because he saw some pushback that DeSantis got.

00:42:40.860 And he's thinking, how can I ingratiate myself to the people who are mad at DeSantis for that,

00:42:45.120 which is stupid.

00:42:46.020 It's a stupid strategy.

00:42:47.300 Those people aren't going to vote for you, Donald Trump.

00:42:49.780 So that's that's my fear.

00:42:51.260 That's my fear that this whole personal vendetta thing.

00:42:54.020 You said that you liked the idea of him having, you know, blood in his mouth,

00:42:56.800 chip on his shoulder.

00:42:57.440 I do, too.

00:42:59.680 But if it's directed to the right outcome, the right outcome, exactly.

00:43:04.300 That's that's what matters.

00:43:05.320 And also, if your vendetta ends in destroying bad things.

00:43:08.560 Yes.

00:43:09.120 If your vendetta is to make those people like you who tried to destroy you.

00:43:14.340 Well, then I'm not interested in your vendetta.

00:43:16.240 I'm not interested in that.

00:43:17.420 OK, can you very I know we're I know we're I know we're getting to the end of time.

00:43:21.060 Can we let's talk about DeSantis for just a second?

00:43:23.280 Probably more than one.

00:43:24.360 Go ahead.

00:43:24.740 OK, because I think the challenge for Ron DeSantis is the is is the quote unquote vision thing is what's the vision for America?

00:43:36.180 And I say this as someone who was is a it was absolutely an endorsing of him running as a candidate because it's the most he has he has proven to succeed with the most ruthless, ruthlessly efficient deployment of my worldview politically.

00:43:53.140 I've ever seen, maybe like in modern history.

00:43:55.880 Yeah, here's the problem, though, on the flip side.

00:43:58.140 And and I tend to look at things.

00:43:59.720 I'm both an ideologue, but I'm someone that's worked on campaigns.

00:44:01.940 And so I look at it both from the nuts and bolts on the on the ideological side.

00:44:05.700 He's like the fulfillment of prophecy.

00:44:07.760 OK, but if I were working in that campaign, my frustration would be I can't put ruthlessly, efficiently deploys your worldview on a sign.

00:44:17.420 Now, I can't put his I can't put his seven step comprehensive immigration plan on a sign.

00:44:24.100 I can put build a wall on a sign.

00:44:26.160 I can put what he said the other day, stone cold dead.

00:44:28.980 I can put that on a sign.

00:44:30.600 The crowd will cheer stone cold dead.

00:44:32.820 The crowd will fall asleep with your seven point plan.

00:44:36.580 Now, you better have that to execute it.

00:44:38.520 But you can't.

00:44:39.080 That's that's not a that's not a campaign message.

00:44:41.560 And I think he's got to he's got to figure out ultimately what is the rallying cry like build a wall, make America great again, forward, putting people first.

00:44:54.860 OK, you know, a chicken in every pot.

00:44:57.300 What is the rallying cry of the DeSantis campaign?

00:45:00.360 Like to me, I look at I look at what he has done.

00:45:03.320 I'll just tell you what he's done.

00:45:05.220 He's the political embodiment of mess around and find out.

00:45:08.400 OK, Disney messed around, found out.

00:45:10.540 Democrats messed around, found out.

00:45:13.220 Lots of people in Florida messed around.

00:45:15.060 Republicans who didn't want to do any of this stuff when Rick Scott was governor and for the last 20 years in legislature, they messed around.

00:45:20.360 They found out, dude, I would I would take mess around and find out.

00:45:23.560 I'd not only put that sign in my yard alley, I'd mow it into my yard.

00:45:26.740 I'd mow that into my grass so that when you flew over it, you could see it on Google Earth.

00:45:31.260 He's got to figure out what is the rallying cry, not what is the purpose, not what is the the the the the the the the policy.

00:45:41.000 Outcome. But what is the rallying cry for my candidacy to capture the imagination?

00:45:47.000 And he's and he's up against someone who's masterful at casting that kind of vision.

00:45:52.340 Yes. OK, I've got you for maybe a minute and a half left.

00:45:56.340 Hunter Biden, go.

00:45:57.420 I don't even know what to say to watch from Nicholas Kristoff and to what's your face on the view.

00:46:05.880 And this is an act of of, you know, this is a father's love.

00:46:09.680 Indeed. I mean, how many crack addicts just couldn't help themselves to shake the shy comms down for even.

00:46:15.640 I mean, this is it's beyond cultic.

00:46:19.260 It's disturbing. And and I go back again to, you know, not hiring the best people.

00:46:25.620 Bill Barr, you know, he defied an opportunity to appoint a special counsel in a hundred.

00:46:30.360 Biden didn't think the evidence was there despite the existence of that laptop.

00:46:33.760 And so here we are. And and in many respects, Trump's greatest benefit as a candidate are his enemies.

00:46:42.640 And this is an example.

00:46:44.900 OK, thanks so much, Steve. Thank you for your analysis.

00:46:48.020 Everyone go check out Steve's show, the Steve Dates show.

00:46:52.000 Amazing insight, as always. Thanks so much, Steve.

00:46:55.420 You bet anytime, Allie. God bless. Take care.

00:46:57.120 OK, so big news out of the Supreme Court this morning.

00:47:13.600 A Supreme Court affirmative action case was just decided at about 915 a.m.

00:47:22.300 Central 1015 Easter time.

00:47:24.000 The U.S. Supreme Court handed down a major ruling on affirmative action, rejecting the use of race as a factor in college admissions as a violation of the 14th Amendment's equal protection clause.

00:47:37.440 Guys, we have had affirmative action in this country for decades.

00:47:41.040 You heard Steve mentioned that briefly.

00:47:42.860 So this is a huge deal.

00:47:45.140 Students for Fair Admissions, a student activist group, brought cases against both Harvard and the University of North Carolina.

00:47:51.380 The group initially sued Harvard College in 2014 for violating Title VI of the Civil Rights Act, which prohibits discrimination on the basis of race, color or national origin in any program or activity that receives federal funds or other federal financial assistance.

00:48:07.440 The complaint against Harvard alleged that the school's practices penalize specifically Asian American students and that they failed to employ race neutral practices.

00:48:16.660 Of course, I mean, entities have been doing this for a very long time and legally.

00:48:21.380 The North Carolina case raised the issue of whether the university could reject the use of non-race-based practices without showing that they would bring down the school's academic quality or negatively impact the benefits gained from campus diversity.

00:48:38.060 So the six conservatives, Chief Justice John Roberts, if you can call him a conservative, not really, but he's kind of unpredictable.

00:48:48.060 The associate justices Clarence Thomas, Neil Gorsuch, Brett Kavanaugh, Amy Coney Barrett voted for the decision striking down those schools' race-conscious admissions policies,

00:49:00.280 while the three liberals, while the three liberals, Kagan, Sotomayor, Ketanji Brown-Jackson, dissented.

00:49:06.280 Justice Ketanji Brown-Jackson recused herself from the Harvard case, actually, due to her previous role on Harvard's Board of Overseers.

00:49:17.240 So this is really, really interesting and exciting.

00:49:23.880 Now, I saw Oren McIntyre point out that universities have already been anticipating this decision.

00:49:32.940 And so they have started to shift their standards.

00:49:37.640 They've started to lower their standards and say, oh, we are no longer, I saw this, actually, several Ivy League schools are saying, we're no longer going to allow things like the SAT to carry so much weight.

00:49:49.640 Instead, we are going to be placing more weight on things like extracurricular activities.

00:49:54.220 Now, who does that indirectly or, I guess, directly but in a non-overt way penalize?

00:50:02.820 It typically will penalize the Asian-American students who do have, in general, a heavy emphasis when it comes to their academics on the actual scholastic academic portion of their education rather than the extracurriculars.

00:50:21.280 And that's a general statement that has actually been made by some of these administrators and some of these people on these college boards at these Ivy Leagues.

00:50:30.180 And so they are already trying to change the standards to ensure that they can still, without saying that they are, give preferential treatment to black and brown students who statistically, okay, don't get mad at me, statistically do not score as well on these standardized tests and even have as high of a GPA as the white and the Asian students who are applying.

00:50:57.360 And so as the universities start to shift the standards around, they can say, well, it has nothing to do with race, but really they are considering all of the factors that would help the black and Hispanic students get in and would actually make it a little bit more difficult for the white and Asian students to get in.

00:51:15.060 And Clarence Thomas said this, I saw Samuel say, tweet this out, it is not even theoretically possible to help a certain racial group without causing harm to members of other racial groups.

00:51:28.980 And of course, what he means by that is what Thomas Sowell talks about in the quest for cosmic justice, which I could not recommend to you more.

00:51:37.780 If you've been listening to this podcast for any amount of time, then you know that you've heard me say that a million times, as well as discrimination and disparities by Thomas Sowell.

00:51:47.860 But he makes this case that basically the social engineering that comes from the top down that says, oh, we are going to lift up the marginalized, we are going to lift up the black and brown in this country.

00:51:58.780 They've never been able to accomplish that without trying to hold back the groups that they see as privileged, that they see as having too much opportunity, too much success, too much wealth, too much safety.

00:52:11.780 In order to lift this one group up that they say have been victims of the system, they have to hold this group back in an attempt to not make an even playing field, but to provide equal outcomes, which is not only wrong, it's immoral, it's showing partiality.

00:52:30.880 It's also impossible.

00:52:32.200 It is impossible to force equal outcomes, certainly without penalizing one group.

00:52:37.700 But also, I mean, it's just it never works.

00:52:40.920 It never works without supreme oppression of everyone.

00:52:45.220 That's why communism never works.

00:52:47.280 Forcing individuals, forcing groups to only be able to reach a certain outcome is a form of communism.

00:52:53.000 It's also known today as social justice that is impossible without oppression and repression of certain people.

00:53:00.560 As Thomas Sowell points out, if you cannot even guarantee the equal outcomes of two siblings, of the same ethnicity, of the same upbringing, of the same background, the same socioeconomic class, how in the world are you going to guarantee the equal outcomes of two people who live totally different lives from across the country from each other with different backgrounds, different upbringings, different talents, different strengths?

00:53:27.480 Individuals bring different things to the table.

00:53:30.680 We're not all the same.

00:53:32.640 And so the only fair thing that you can do is to say, this is the standard, no matter your skin color, no matter your background, this is what you have to reach.

00:53:41.640 Now, we can provide tools to help you reach this standard.

00:53:44.940 We can do everything that we can to help you work hard, to make sure that you are completely prepared to excel and to reach the standards that we have set for admissions or for employment or for passing this test, whatever it is.

00:54:00.560 But we are not going to lower the standards so that you can reach them, because that takes everyone down to the lowest common denominator, which, of course, it has implications in everything.

00:54:12.860 It has implications of what kind of doctors we get, what kind of nurses we get, what kind of teachers we get, what kind of lawyers we get, what kind of politicians we get.

00:54:20.660 If the standards are lowered in college, they have to be lowered than in employment.

00:54:23.960 They have to be lowered than in everything.

00:54:25.980 And you see the ripple effect there, that we end up being a cake-istocracy. 0.57

00:54:30.200 A cake-istocracy is a society that's run by idiots. 0.97

00:54:34.200 That's not good, right?

00:54:36.720 So Clarence Thomas, I knew that he would have a lot of great insight on this, because he is amazing, and I love everything that he says.

00:54:49.920 Probably not everything.

00:54:50.920 I'm sure that there's something that he said that I disagree with, but I haven't read it yet.

00:54:55.900 Here's something else that Justice Thomas said in his concurrence.

00:55:00.680 He said this.

00:55:01.760 Both experience and logic have vindicated the Constitution's colorblind rule and confirmed that the university's new narrative cannot stand.

00:55:09.460 Harvard and UNC now forthrightly state that they racially discriminate when it comes to admitting students, arguing that such discrimination is consistent with this court's precedence.

00:55:19.040 And they, along with today's dissenters, defend that discrimination as good.

00:55:23.860 More broadly, it is becoming increasingly clear that discrimination on the basis of race, often packaged as affirmative action or equity programs, are based on the benighted notion that it is possible to tell when discrimination helps rather than hurts racial minorities.

00:55:38.700 So before we end this segment, let me just give you an example.

00:55:41.980 And this is this was tweeted out by Greg Price of just how insane these admissions policies had gotten, particularly at Harvard.

00:55:53.560 An African-American student in the 40th percentile of their academic index is more likely to get into Harvard than an Asian student in the 100th percentile.

00:56:06.480 Black students in the 50th percentile are more likely to get in than white students at the very top.

00:56:14.220 Harvard's admissions data revealed astonishing racial disparities in admission rates among similarly qualified applicants.

00:56:20.180 So, I mean, that's that's part of what created this decision is the obvious racism, the obvious discrimination.

00:56:31.200 And all of us have to pay the price for that.

00:56:33.880 Again, the ripple effects are devastating when we think about that people are allowed into these Ivy League schools who really have no business being there because they weren't able to reach the standard.

00:56:43.340 And then they fulfill professions that have an effect on all of our lives, like in really, really impactful ways, especially when we're talking about surgeons and things like that.

00:56:53.120 OK, so I just wanted to briefly cover that.

00:56:56.100 Crazy story.

00:56:57.500 Good.

00:56:58.300 I don't know how actually it'll shake out at the end of the day, but absolutely a win for actual equality rather than the newfangled equity that progressives are always trying to push.

00:57:10.500 And never, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever works.

00:57:13.920 OK, I just wanted to briefly talk about this Chrissy Teigen story, which you guys have probably seen, that she announced that she had her fourth child birthed through surrogacy just the other day.

00:57:25.920 Now, you may be a little bit confused because she actually birthed her own child or she she birthed her own child herself five months ago.

00:57:35.480 And now she has another child that was birthed via surrogacy.

00:57:40.300 She has two other children.

00:57:41.820 You may remember a couple of years ago, she went through this very tragic loss, such a tragic loss.

00:57:47.380 It was far into her pregnancy.

00:57:50.560 Her body just wouldn't cooperate, apparently, according to what she said.

00:57:54.960 And she lost her baby.

00:57:56.260 Absolutely terrible.

00:57:57.360 People were very cruel to her online about this, basically saying you're making it all about you.

00:58:01.960 Why did you post these pictures?

00:58:03.740 I really hated that for her.

00:58:05.080 I felt for her.

00:58:05.940 I don't know her at all, but I really felt for her during that time because that is just one of that.

00:58:11.640 That's the worst pain, really, that I can even imagine as a parent.

00:58:15.140 And even though I haven't been in that exact situation, because I'm a mom, I can imagine how much pain she went through.

00:58:21.820 And so she felt that I guess she had to get a surrogate this time.

00:58:26.220 So here's here's how she explains it.

00:58:29.000 She said that she's always wanted four children.

00:58:31.280 And she says, after losing her baby, Jack, I didn't think I'd be able to carry any more babies on my own.

00:58:36.020 To be honest, I've personally blocked out a lot of my mindset during that time.

00:58:39.620 In 2021, we reached out to a surrogacy agency with our first correspondent inquiring about perhaps having two tandem surrogates to give us a healthy boy and a healthy girl.

00:58:49.960 So twins, so two wombs to be rented there. 1.00

00:58:53.420 At some point early in our surrogacy journey, I came out of a therapy session and she decided she told her husband, John Legend, that she wanted to actually try to carry a baby again.

00:59:02.860 And so they started the IVF process.

00:59:05.340 They went through IVF with their first two children and they made new embryos.

00:59:12.100 They did a transfer.

00:59:13.620 They were so happy to learn that it worked.

00:59:16.020 They were pregnant with their little girl that they had a few months ago, Esty.

00:59:20.240 But around the same time, they also met a surrogate.

00:59:23.860 Her name is Alexandra.

00:59:25.700 The surrogate agreed to work with them.

00:59:30.540 The first embryo that they tried to transfer with the surrogate didn't survive.

00:59:36.420 And then she said that the surrogate fought so hard to get her body ready for a second transfer.

00:59:43.960 And then around the end of Chrissy's first trimester with her pregnancy, they found out that their surrogate was also pregnant.

00:59:53.660 She said that they've become friends.

00:59:55.100 And then she said just minutes before midnight on June 19th, I got to witness the most beautiful woman, my friend, our surrogate, give birth amidst a bit of chaos, but with strength and pure joy and love.

01:00:07.280 And so precious child made in the image of God, as all of her children are.

01:00:12.380 I'm sure Chrissy and John very much love their children.

01:00:15.340 And I'm sure it did seem like a very beautiful and redemptive process.

01:00:19.760 But the fact of the matter is, is that surrogacy is still the exploitation of female bodies. 0.94

01:00:26.620 It is still prioritizing the wants of adults over the well-being of children.

01:00:31.280 Because for nine months, like we know this from psychology, from physiology, we know this from scientific studies,

01:00:39.260 that there is a bond that is created between the child and his mother or the woman carrying him during gestation.

01:00:48.020 That he feels her heartbeat, knows her smell, knows the sights and the sounds of the life that she is creating around her.

01:00:56.880 And that the immediate instinct, that primal instinct, when that baby is born is to attach himself or herself to the mother,

01:01:06.240 to rest on the chest of the mother, to feel again that heartbeat that had become the familiar background thumping of that child's life for nine plus months.

01:01:18.220 And in surrogacy, you are ripping that child purposely intending to, from conception, rip that child away from the woman,

01:01:28.620 the body that he or she has bonded with for the previous nine months because you wanted to create a child, because the adult wanted to.

01:01:38.140 And I don't think that we even put any thought into the psychological, mental, emotional, physical well-being of a child who is created in this way

01:01:51.960 and then gestated in this way and then given to people who, as far as the child knows, are strangers.

01:01:59.380 And it's even worse, of course, when you have to buy the eggs from one woman, which this doesn't, this is not Chrissy Teigen,

01:02:05.260 it's her own eggs, but you have to buy the eggs of one woman, rent the womb of another woman, 1.00

01:02:09.580 as you do when it's two men going through the surrogacy process.

01:02:13.840 And then you take that child away, not just from the biological mother who sold her eggs 0.95

01:02:18.580 and not just from the woman who gestated the child with the womb that was rented,

01:02:23.480 but you also take that child away from the possibility of ever having a mother at all.

01:02:29.920 And so there are even more ethical and moral problems when it comes to that.

01:02:34.160 But even when it comes to this form of surrogacy, like it is still buying a body.

01:02:40.880 It is still going through a process intentionally, intentionally going through a process that you know is a breakaway from the ideal for the healthy development of a child.

01:02:52.680 And the only justification is that the parent wants to.

01:02:56.240 I don't think that's a good enough reason to rent a womb and to take a child away from that natural process of birth and gestation. 0.96

01:03:05.640 And the whole surrogacy industry is wrought with corruption.

01:03:10.180 The contracts are very, they can exploit these women. 1.00

01:03:15.720 I don't know if that's true of this surrogacy.

01:03:18.160 Obviously, this surrogate situation sounds like they had a good relationship, but even so, I'm against surrogacy. 0.99

01:03:25.860 I can sympathize absolutely with wanting to have a child by whatever means possible.

01:03:30.860 I can sympathize with that.

01:03:32.260 I can sympathize with the women who become surrogates who think that they are doing something that is selfless. 0.97

01:03:38.240 But at the end of the day, this still is a process that we are manufacturing to fulfill adults' wants at the expense of children's needs.

01:03:52.800 And there's also, I mean, there are ethical issues too with IVF.

01:03:57.480 I mean, it's a very high attrition rate.

01:03:59.360 You are putting this living embryo, this little image bearer of God, at a very high risk through the creation and the transfer and the gestation process.

01:04:08.480 And that's a risk that adults, again, are willing to take with these little lives simply because of the desire to become parents.

01:04:17.140 I'm very thankful for Katie Faust, for Jennifer Law, who have been spearheading this issue for such a long time.

01:04:23.640 I've had them on my podcast several times before.

01:04:26.740 I will give a shout out to Relatable because we were one of the, and I'm very thankful for this,

01:04:34.340 we were definitely one of the first conservative podcasts to talk about this.

01:04:39.760 Back in 2020, we talked about birth control, IVF, surrogacy, and then have been beating this drum with the help of people who have been talking about it for a long time for the past few years.

01:04:51.000 And when we first started talking about this, oh my gosh, oh my gosh, the conservatives that thought that I was crazy,

01:04:58.880 the conservative Christians who thought that I was cruel and lacking compassion for talking about the ethics behind this stuff at all.

01:05:06.480 And now it seems to have shifted.

01:05:09.080 There's a lot of major conservative commentators that are now willing to talk about it, who a few years ago, I know,

01:05:15.240 thought that I was a little crazy for talking about it, or I was, it was just like too much.

01:05:20.900 Why would you care about that?

01:05:21.960 Isn't it just pro-life to want to bring babies into the world?

01:05:25.300 And now it seems like this is becoming a real conversation.

01:05:27.760 So kudos to those who were talking about it long, long, long before I was.

01:05:31.980 And kudos to those who have had the courage to start asking really tough questions.

01:05:35.420 Not to condemn these babies, certainly, or even the parents involved, but to say,

01:05:41.560 there are questions that we're not asking, and for the sake of children, we need to.

01:05:45.480 All right.

01:05:45.840 I know that was a lot to cover today, but next week is going to be a little bit different

01:05:49.120 because we've got pre-recorded interviews with Nancy Piercy on Monday and Wednesday.

01:05:55.100 Tuesday, we won't be here for the 4th of July celebrating the freedoms that we have

01:05:58.620 in this still beautiful country that, yes, is broken, but we should still celebrate and be thankful for.

01:06:04.860 And so we won't have a lot of days over the next week or so to talk about all these.

01:06:09.680 And so I had to fit it into one episode.

01:06:11.740 And then next Thursday, we'll be back with our regularly scheduled programming.

01:06:16.700 And I'm sure that we'll have a lot to get into then.

01:06:18.820 So that's what you have to look forward to next week.

01:06:20.560 I hope everyone has a wonderful weekend.

01:06:22.960 We will see you back here Monday with Nancy Piercy.

Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey - June 29, 2023

Ep 831 ｜ Chrissy Teigen’s Surrogacy Announcement & No More Affirmative Action ｜ Guest： Steve Deace

Episode Stats

Summary

Transcript