Ep 943 ｜ Alistair Begg Doubles Down on Gay Wedding Advice
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Summary
Pastor Alistair Begg doubles down on his counsel to Christians to attend same-sex weddings. As you can imagine, there has been a lot of backlash to this. We are going to cover it all today on this episode of Relatable.
Transcript
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esteemed pastor Alistair Begg doubles down on his counsel to Christians to attend same-sex
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weddings. As you can imagine, there's been a lot of backlash to this. We are going to cover it
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all today on this episode of Relatable, which is brought to you by our friends at Good Ranchers.
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Go to GoodRanchers.com, use code ALI at checkout. That's GoodRanchers.com, code ALI.
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Hey, guys. Welcome to Relatable. Happy Wednesday. Hope everyone is having a wonderful week so far.
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Man, oh, man. So much to talk about, especially since Taylor Swift took our entire episode
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Let's get into it. Pastor Alistair Begg is in a controversy over his comments about attending
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same-sex weddings. Now, this is surprising. This is a surprising conflict to be talking about
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because typically when we are discussing comments, progressive comments being made by those who are
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Christians, those who profess to be Christians, we are talking about people that we kind of expect
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to be on the fence about these things, that we anticipate having a more quote-unquote nuanced,
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caveated take on these biblical, moral, and even what some people would call culture war issues.
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This comes as a shock. If you don't know who Alistair Begg is, he is a pastor, an author. He is the
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senior pastor at Parkside Church in Cleveland. You will hear when we play a little video, his accent.
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He is Scottish, and he has been a prominent name in the American Reformed Protestant space for a long
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time. And I have appreciated his work. I've done at least one devotional from him. I believe it was
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an Advent study. And I've read other things that he's written. I've listened to him several times,
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and I have appreciated so much of what he said. And I think everyone who is reformed would probably
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say that they have benefited in one way or another from the work of Alistair Begg. And so it came as a
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shock when he recently said on a podcast that Christians should attend a same-sex wedding,
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that we should go, that we should celebrate, that we should give the couple a gift. And in this way,
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we are basically sharing the gospel to them and showing Christ to them. Now, I have answered this
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question on this podcast before in a Q&A episode because this is a question I get a lot. Should
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Christians attend a gay wedding? And as I will explain more thoroughly in a few minutes after
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we go through what happened here, my answer is no. And so you've got Alistair Begg saying,
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yes, you should. And let's look at his reasoning behind that and then what the response has been
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to that and then what his response to the response was. So he is, as I said, senior pastor,
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Parkside Church in Cleveland. He also has a radio ministry called Truth for Life. It's carried by
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nearly 1,800 radio stations nationwide. He's been in pastoral ministry since 1975. He became the senior
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pastor at Parkside in 1983. And the comments that he made that are at the center of this controversy
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were made in a podcast for his ministry, Truth for Life. And they were made almost three months ago,
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but they've only now started circulating again on social media. And that is what caused the
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backlash. So here's what he said in the September 1st, 2023 episode, which was focused on his latest
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book, which is called The Christian Manifesto. So someone was interviewing him and they asked,
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Begg this. As you think about this book and your prayer for this book, what do you hope will be
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different? How do you hope people will be different after they have read this book and they've meditated
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on this sermon? And so he answers that. And then he gives a specific example of, I guess,
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what he hopes people are getting from it as they try to apply Christian principles to how they live
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their life. He says, and in very specific areas, this comes across. I mean, you and I know that we
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field questions all the time that go along the lines of, my grandson is about to be married to a
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transgender person. And I don't know what to do about this. And I'm calling to ask you to tell me
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what to do, which is a huge responsibility, he says. And he said that his response would be,
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okay, as long as he knows that this family member knows where you stand as far as your faith goes,
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then I suggest that you do go to the ceremony and I suggest that you buy them a gift. And he explains
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that the person he was talking to was really taken aback by his answer. Then he says,
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here's the thing, your love for them, this couple that's getting married, may catch them off guard,
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but your absence will simply reinforce the fact that they said, these people are what I always
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thought, judgmental, critical, unprepared to countenance anything. He says, it's a fine line,
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isn't it? It really is. And people need to work out their own salvation with fear and trembling.
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But I think we're going to take that risk. We're going to have to take that risk a lot more if we want to
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build bridges into hearts and lives of those who don't understand Jesus and don't understand that
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he is king. So people were taken aback by this after they saw this clip circulating on social media.
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And really what I saw from a lot of the reformed Christians that I follow, pastors, theologians,
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authors, just commentators was, wow, I really disagree with this, but I'm going to give him the
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benefit of the doubt. Considering that he has been very clear in his sermons and in his work about
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the reality of sin, about the need for holiness, the need for repentance, sexual immorality of all
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forms, being a sin that people have to repent of, we're going to give him the benefit of the doubt.
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This commentary, this conversation about these comments has been going on for a while now.
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I didn't weigh in. And the reason I didn't was because I wondered about his use of words here and
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if he meant what everyone assumed that he meant. Everyone assumed that he meant that Christians
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should attend a gay wedding. And yet he said a transgender person. He didn't necessarily say
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a gay wedding. Now, maybe I missed some context where he specifically said, yeah, he's talking
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about a gay wedding, so-called, but he said transgender person. And so I thought, okay, maybe
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he's not talking about a union of a man and a man and a woman and a woman. Maybe he is talking about
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a man and a woman, but one of the people is trying to pretend to be the opposite sex, which of course
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we know is actually impossible. And so maybe there is some discussion and debate to be had whether or
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not it would be right to attend that kind of wedding because you've got someone who is, yes, in active
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sin, but the wedding of a man and a woman, an actual man and actual woman, no matter what they identify
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as, like, okay, that would actually be a marriage. And so, of course, we don't affirm that person's
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confusion or the deceit that they're displaying about their gender, but is it possible for a
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Christian to faithfully attend that wedding? So I thought that, okay, people are just assuming that
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he meant gay wedding, but maybe there are some actual nuances there because he's talking about
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transgenderism. So I didn't weigh in because I thought, okay, I bet he's going to come back and
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he's going to clarify what he actually meant by that. And so I just kind of stepped back and I
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waited to see what he said. And he did actually respond to a lot of the critics because this ended
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up kind of blowing up. It wasn't just that people were criticizing him or disagreeing with him. And
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all the criticism and disagreement I saw was very respectful, but it turned into a kind of a big deal.
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American Family Radio, which has been playing his sermons and distributing the work of his ministry
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for a while, they made the decision that after 10 years of amplifying his message that they would
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no longer air his Truth for Life program. So American Family Radio, because of his comments about
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attending same-sex marriage, they decided to cut ties with him. They said it has come to our
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attention that Pastor Begg made statements that were unbiblical, failed to line up with the decades
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of faithful adherence to scripture that listeners have come to expect from him. In essence, when the
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question was asked of him whether or not a family member should attend an unbiblical wedding ceremony
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between two homosexuals, Pastor Begg counseled Christians to attend and take a gift. And this is what
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they say their stances. At American Family Association, we believe it to be an act of
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unfaithfulness to God to attend a ceremony that celebrates in a union outside of the biblical
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model of marriage as being between one man and one woman. Members of our leadership team held a call
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with Alistair Begg's team and were unsuccessful in convincing them of his error. As a result of this,
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we will no longer air Pastor Alistair Begg's Truth for Life program. So I don't know much about
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American Family Radio, but I know it takes a lot of strength to take a stand like this,
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especially against someone who is popular. And it sounds like they did the best that they could
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to first talk to them directly and to say, hey, you know, we are giving you the benefit of the doubt.
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We do appreciate what you have offered the church. We do appreciate your messages of clarity and
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courage that you've given us and to our listeners. But here's where we think that you're wrong,
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and we're going to point to scripture to try to sway you. And they say they were unsuccessful in
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doing that. And so they had to make what I'm sure was a very difficult decision. It sounds like they
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went about this the right way. And I happen to agree with their reasoning. If you are talking about
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same-sex unions. And again, I wanted to wait for the clarification from Alistair Begg on that.
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And he did. He did give us, I guess, a form of a clarification. So let me get into that before I give
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you my full response. Okay, so Alistair Begg responded to the criticism that he has received
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in a Sunday sermon. This past weekend, people are not happy about what he had to say. They're not
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happy about it at all. The message was taken from Luke 15. That is the message of the prodigal son,
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which I'm sure almost all of you are familiar with. And the sermon was titled Compassion versus
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Condemnation. He warned about our inclination toward Pharisaism that is alive and well within all our
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hearts, quote unquote. So he is defending himself here. And while I can't play you the entirety of
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the sermon, I can give you a summary. And this is not me attempting to take things out of context
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or to put words in his mouth. I do kind of have to paraphrase it. I believe that the entire sermon
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is available online. Yes, the sermon audio is available online. We can link it in the description
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of this episode. So you can go listen to it yourself to make sure that I'm not taking things out of
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context. But in my listening of the sermon and also seeing the backlash that this sermon response
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has gotten, I think I'm giving you an accurate rendering of not only what he said, but also what he
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meant. So he defends himself saying, in that conversation with that grandmother, I was concerned
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about the well-being of their relationship more than anything else. Now, I think that's very telling.
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He was concerned about the well-being of their relationship more than anything else. Hence my
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counsel. Don't misunderstand that in any way at all. And I will just say the BOD that I had given
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that maybe he wasn't talking about a same-sex wedding, a same-sex ceremony. Well, that has gone
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out the window because he emphasizes and clarifies that, yes, that is what he meant. He never says,
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oh, no, I didn't mean two people of the same sex. I was talking about two people of the opposite
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sex. One person who is confused about their identity in the same way that a lot of people
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are confused about their identity in different ways. No, that's not what he says. He did mean
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a same-sex union and a same-sex wedding. He does believe that Christians should attend that
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because it may, from his perspective, help seal the relationship, help maintain the relationship
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between a believer and then this non-believing family member who is entering into this homosexual
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union. He says that he might not have given that answer to another person if it had to do with another
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kind of situation. But in this case, with a believing grandmother, he wanted to make sure that he was
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helping this grandmother maintain this relationship. And he says, look, I'm not wrong on this, basically.
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He said, the fact of the matter is, I am not ready to repent over this. I don't have to. I don't have
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to repent over this. And he goes to Luke 15, as I said, to look at the prodigal son. He said, God is
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a seeking God. And the father in the story who represents God himself is running after the sinner and
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running after his prodigal son who had squandered his inheritance, who had been living among pigs. And he is
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making this point to say that has to be the kind of love that we emulate. And that is the support that
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he uses to say, yes, Christians should attend this gay wedding because we have to go after sinners in
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this same way. He also says that the problem with the Pharisees, or one of the problems with the
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Pharisees, was that they were grumbling at Jesus because of the easy way in which he hung out with
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sinners, that he congregated with people that the Pharisees thought were too unclean, were too
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much on the margins of society, had done too much wrong for Jesus to be around him or to be around
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them. And so he says that those who disagree with him, those who are saying, no, Christians should not
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attend this gay wedding, that they're like Pharisees, that they're like the older brother,
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the judgmental brother, the unforgiving brother in the story of the prodigal son. He says,
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you got a problem with the grandmother showing up, sitting on the front row and buying a Bible for
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her grandchild that she hopes will become a believer. And he says, you know, if you've got a
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problem with that, then basically you're like the Pharisee. You are condemning, you are reviling,
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you are like the older brother in the prodigal son story. So here is sought to where Alistair Begg is
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saying, look, I'm going to come down on the side of compassion here. If I've got to go down on the
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side of one or the other, I'll go down on this side. I'll go down on the side of compassion with
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people actually accusing me of just weakness rather than go down on the side of condemnation,
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which closes any doors of opportunity for future engagement with those who know exactly what we
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believe about the Bible and about Jesus and about so on.
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Um, okay. So this is shocking to me. There are a few things that are shocking to me. One,
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it was shocking to me that Alistair Begg doesn't actually engage with any of the biblically based
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critiques, criticism, and pushback that he received. He basically throws all of his opposition under the
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bus and condemns them, ironically, with ad hominem attacks, calling someone who disagrees with you
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biblically, a Pharisee or legalistic or an older brother or judgmental. Again, that's something
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that I expect from progressives that don't believe in the need for repentance and don't
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really believe in the authority of scripture. It is not something that I expect from someone like
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Alistair Begg. And just to clarify, he has been extremely consistent and extremely clear
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on what the Bible says about sexuality, what the Bible says about marriage, what the Bible says about
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gender roles. I have no doubt that personally, he holds to a biblical sexual ethic. But here,
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I not only believe that he's wrong, but what I'm very disturbed by is his unwillingness to,
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I think, in good faith, engage with those who have disagreed with him. And what those of us who disagree
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with him believe, and I can't speak for everyone, there's been a variety of arguments that have been
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put out there, very eloquent, kind, articulate, biblical arguments that have been published
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contra Pastor Begg. But the point that I think all of us have is that we do not have to affirm,
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and we should not affirm and celebrate sin in the hopes that affirming and celebrating what God calls
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wrong, what God calls destructive, what God calls harmful to a person's body and soul in order to
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show them that we are loving, in order to show them the gospel, in order to show them the love of Christ.
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We do not have to affirm and celebrate that which God calls sin to be ambassadors of Christ, to be the
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aroma of Christ. That is a very, again, progressive and worldly way of thinking of evangelism, a very
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worldly way of thinking of compassion. That is exactly what the world tells us compassion is. The world
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tells us that compassion means celebrating someone's sin, affirming someone's sin. And I know that Pastor
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Begg wouldn't say that this is affirmation, but it is a form of affirmation. It is. To celebrate a
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ceremony in which what God calls abominable, what God calls unnatural, what God calls, again, destructive to
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a person's body, heart, mind, and soul, that is wrong. It's not only wrong, but it is completely
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unnecessary to show the gospel to someone. Yes, he is right that the grandchild in this situation will
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be offended, that maybe all of the bad things that he's thought about Christians for a long time, that
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they're just judgmental and bigoted and exclusive, that all of those things might be confirmed in his
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mind. But there are a lot of things that could confirm that in his mind that Christians are still called to do.
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And I know that Pastor Begg knows this, right? I know that he knows this. I know that he knows that there are sins
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that we cannot affirm, that we cannot celebrate, that we cannot go along with, even if those in our lives that we are
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trying to reach think badly of us. I mean, that's not the point of all of this, right? Like, that's not the
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point of the Christian faith to ensure that the people in our lives, whether we're related to them
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or not, think highly of us, or that we fit their definition of loving, or their definition of
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compassionate, or empathetic, or virtuous, or whatever characteristic they want us to be. That's
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not our goal, right? Our goal is to glorify God. Our goal is to honor God. And here's what I always say.
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We cannot out-love God. We can't out-love God. 1 John 4, 8. God is love. God is love. So I cannot
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out-compassion him. I can't out-love him. I can't out-empathy him. God is love. I am not. Therefore,
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the most loving thing that I can do at all times is agree with God. That's the most loving thing
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that I can do at all times is agree with God. I will never be more loving than God by disagreeing
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with him or celebrating that which he calls sin. Don't you think that there is a clearer way to
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communicate to that grandchild that I love you so much and I want what is best for you? And of course,
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there is so much of me that wants you to be happy, but more than anything else, I want to honor God
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and I want you to honor God with your life. And I know that God's ways are better. I know that they're
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healthier and I want them for you. I want what is best for you. And because I believe that God's ways
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are best, I can't celebrate that which God makes clear is bad for you. Wouldn't that be a better way?
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And of course, an unbeliever is going to hear that and think, wow, I'm angry. That's so hateful.
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That's wrong. That's unloving. But that's not really our responsibility. What someone thinks
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about us, that's not any of our business. Our business is to go about trying to glorify God
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the best that we possibly can. And he also, there's another logical fallacy in addition to ad hominem
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that I think that he is employing here. And that is this false choice of the compassion that he
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defines as going to the wedding versus condemnation that he defines as not attending the wedding.
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And number one, I think that we should be condemning the sin. But I also think that we
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should be compassionate towards someone, knowing that as Ephesians 2 tells us, we were all once dead
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in our sin apart from Christ. And it is only by grace through faith that we have been made alive
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in him. So yes, we can have compassion for all kinds of people, for all kinds of sinners, with all
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kinds of different forms of depravity and disobedience and all of that. Yes, we can.
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Does compassion require us to attend this wedding? That's what it seems like he's saying. He presents
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this false binary, this false choice of saying either you are compassionate and you go to the
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wedding or you are condemning like the Pharisee, like the older brother. And that's not actually
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the choice that scripture presents to us, that we can love, that we can have compassion and still agree
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with God and still refuse to celebrate what God calls bad for a person, what God calls sin,
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what God tells us is wrong and destructive and deleterious to everyone involved. That's not
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something that we can go and pretend to be happy about. Can't this grandmother gift the Bible to
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this couple without attending the wedding? I mean, I do wonder too. Now I'm curious what he thinks about
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pronouns. Like, should we be calling someone by their preferred pronouns because that might help
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solidify a relationship with them? Should we call a man she because that's what the man wants to
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be called? Should we assent to that delusion? Again, something that God calls a lie?
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A complete deception from Satan is bad for that person's body, is bad for that person's heart and
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soul, and bad for society at large because of what it gives us in the way of confusion and the
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infringement upon rights and safety and protection of women and children? Like, are we supposed to
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affirm that because the well-being of that relationship is supposed to take precedence
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over truth, over health, over God's Word? I'm just curious. I'm curious what he would say about that.
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I'm curious. And I do just want to point to some problems that I see with using the story of the
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prodigal son and using the example of Jesus congregating with sinners to try to support
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his case. Again, this is something that I expect from progressives that we see from progressives all
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the time that is shocking to see from someone who is conservative in so many ways. Jesus didn't hang
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out with sinners for the sake of hanging out with them. He certainly wasn't celebrating what they were
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doing. He wasn't attending ceremonies that would be celebrating their sin, right? That's something that
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we see a lot in society saying, well, Jesus hung out with sinners, so therefore you shouldn't say
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anything wrong about someone's sin. Well, Jesus wasn't just hanging out with sinners, as Pastor Begg knows.
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He was calling them to repentance. That was the purpose of his hanging out. That was the purpose of
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his congregating with them, his congregating with them, is to call them to repentance and to show
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them the radical repentance-inducing love of God that the Pharisees, of course, were not willing to do.
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I think that we can do that. You can even spend time with people who are in sin without going to a
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ceremony that is celebrating their sin, right? We know how to do that. I'm sure this grandmother knows how
00:27:23.780
to do that. There is something different about a wedding. There is something different about that
00:27:28.420
ceremony that I don't think that we should be affirming at all. And then this story of the
00:27:33.740
prodigal son that God is a seeking God and therefore we have to go to that gay wedding. Well, he wasn't
00:27:42.300
celebrating his son's sin. He was celebrating that the son came back. He was celebrating that the son was
00:27:51.200
running towards him. He was celebrating that that son had repented. The ceremony that the father and
00:27:57.640
the prodigal son's story gave was because the son had repented, right? Because the son had returned.
00:28:09.620
So if this were a ceremony in the story of the grandmother that celebrated repentance,
00:28:16.360
celebrated something that honored God, then sure, maybe that would be a relevant story to
00:28:23.040
point to. But that's not what's going on here. And so I don't really see the connection. I don't
00:28:29.580
really see the support in any way. And so I'm concerned about this. I'm surprised by this.
00:28:39.360
Um, I think that this shows a really, I think it shows really poor exegesis, a very progressive
00:28:47.680
understanding of these stories and emphasis on trying to maintain relationships, even if it means
00:28:54.680
affirming sin rather than, um, prioritizing our holiness before God. It also shows, um, I think
00:29:05.120
the wrong priorities when it comes to, um, when it comes to wanting someone's repentance versus,
00:29:14.280
uh, just wanting their happiness and caring too much what an unbeliever thinks about us.
00:29:22.120
And I was ready to hear his arguments. I was ready to hear his support for his case because again,
00:29:30.100
I respect him a lot and I respect a lot of the work that he has put forth, but I was thoroughly
00:29:38.240
unconvinced. And not only that, but I was extremely disappointed by how he categorized opposition
00:29:44.820
and the logical fallacies that he employed to basically condemn the people that disagree with him
00:30:00.100
All right. So my friend Samuel say he wrote an article in response and he said, Alistair Begg should
00:30:14.120
be corrected and rebuked for what he said. Um, he said what he said is indefensible. If a Christian
00:30:19.300
attends a gay wedding and the marriage officiant says, if anyone sees any reason why these two should
00:30:23.280
not be wed, let them speak now or forever hold their peace. Wouldn't the Christian be obligated to
00:30:27.760
speak? I think that's a really good point. And he also says, many of us need to stop acting like
00:30:32.760
we're commanded to disobey God in order to win the world's approval. Well said. He says, we're not
00:30:38.600
called to be like politicians. We don't win our race by gaining the world's approval. We're not
00:30:42.360
supposed to worry about how the world reacts to righteousness. We should only be concerned about
00:30:47.580
what unbelievers think about our sins. Sins like attending a gay wedding. That's so true. I remember
00:30:55.660
what Laura Perry Smalt said when she was on this show. Uh, she was, or is a woman who at one point
00:31:02.460
tried to identify as the opposite sex. She took testosterone. She went by the name Jake and she
00:31:07.060
lived her life presenting as a man for several years. And her, uh, conservative Christian parents
00:31:12.840
refused to go along with it. She was an adult. And so there wasn't much they could do about it, but, um,
00:31:18.480
they prayed for her. They continued to share the gospel with her. They refused to use her new name,
00:31:23.660
her new pronouns. They just weren't going to lie. This was their daughter. They loved her. They named
00:31:28.240
her Laura. And that's what they were going to continue to affirm. And they continued to maintain
00:31:34.420
a relationship with her. I'm sure that it was difficult. I'm sure that, uh, Laura was closed off
00:31:39.480
to them because they weren't affirming. But over time, the Holy Spirit through their love, through
00:31:45.040
their persistent truth, like chipped away at Laura's heart. And it was actually through transcribing
00:31:49.760
Bible verses for her mom, for a Bible study that Laura or that her mom was leading that
00:31:55.140
the Lord really spoke to Laura. It was through the power of his word. It was through the insistence
00:31:59.880
upon the Christians in Laura's life to continue telling her the truth. I'm sure the truth made
00:32:05.540
her angry at times. Do you remember when I had Daisy on this show, Daisy Strongin, and at one point
00:32:12.840
she also tried to identify as a man. And she talks about listening to this podcast,
00:32:19.360
Thank the Lord, by the grace of God. She heard us talk about the reality of gender. Also heard us
00:32:24.400
talking about the Bible and the gospel. And she said that she was trying to rebut what we were saying
00:32:29.660
on this podcast in her head, and she was unable to do so. Now, I'm sure that what I was saying made
00:32:36.440
her mad at one point. But she wasn't won over. First of all, she wasn't won over by me. Of course,
00:32:43.400
it was the Holy Spirit working in her heart. But she wasn't won over by someone skirting around the
00:32:50.080
truth, or being wishy-washy about it, or being affirming in any way and trying to hide what God's
00:32:56.820
word says in layers and layers of caveats and nuances. We told it like it was. Laura's parents
00:33:04.200
told it like it was. And even though it hurts, even though it's a little offensive, even though
00:33:10.060
like the prick of a heart can be painful, of course, we've all been there, by the way,
00:33:15.120
as people who have all been unrepentant at one point. Yes, it's offensive. Yes, it hurts. But God
00:33:21.000
can work through that faithfulness. God can work through that obedience. Here's something I always
00:33:26.040
say. God doesn't need to be let off the hook. God does not need to be let off the hook for what his
00:33:30.980
word says. We don't need to apologize for God. Again, we don't need to try to out-love God.
00:33:38.300
Owen Strand, theologian, he also wrote an article in response. He says, I believe Begg's counsel is
00:33:45.240
unsound. Christians should not attend, quote-unquote, transgender ceremonies. Again, I think, like,
00:33:52.160
I don't even know. The transgender part is, like, odd to me that that's even part of this
00:33:56.860
conversation. But again, since Begg did, I mean, he did emphasize that he does mean same-sex ceremonies,
00:34:05.580
the criticism is still appropriate. Strand says, the matter surveyed here is not small. It is not
00:34:11.140
a tempest in an evangelical teapot. It is a serious matter indeed. Simply put, the line on Christian
00:34:16.340
participation in ungodly ceremonies cannot move. Like the men at Lot's door in Sodom, we are urged with
00:34:22.400
great intensity to cave here, but we cannot do so. The church cannot capitulate to the culture. In
00:34:28.420
love, we must take our stand and not give the devil a foothold he so desperately craves. And I agree
00:34:36.580
with that. Again, I think it is similar to using someone's preferred pronouns. It's the same thing
00:34:42.000
that a lot of professing Christians say about trying to affirm someone's gender confusion in the hopes that
00:34:48.740
you can maintain a relationship. And as Samuel say, so articulately said, we should not be convinced
00:34:55.240
that we have to disobey God in order to be effective Christians. I mean, think about that.
00:35:00.480
That's essentially what is being said. We have to affirm sin to try to show people that sin is wrong.
00:35:06.720
What? Like, okay, what if this person who is getting married, who is in sin,
00:35:12.420
reads this Bible that was given to them, or later in life starts to understand what Scripture
00:35:18.480
says about sexual sin and the need for repentance, holiness, and all of that, and they look back to
00:35:23.780
the grandmother and say, but gosh, my grandmother, she was the godliest person that I knew. And she
00:35:29.040
was the most Christian person I knew. And even she attended my wedding. Even she affirmed this union.
00:35:34.500
So it can't be all that bad. What if that's the direction that his mind goes? Are we still like
00:35:41.380
the Pharisees? Are we still like the older brother in the story because of that pushback?
00:35:49.300
Robert Gannon, I'm so sorry if I mispronounced your last name. He's a professor of theology
00:35:56.580
at Houston Christian University. And I thought that he gave a really good response. It's pretty long,
00:36:02.940
so I won't read the whole thing. But he makes some really good points. So he talks about what we
00:36:08.860
talked about, the ad hominem attacks that I think Begg launched at his critics. And he basically says
00:36:16.860
that Begg doesn't even try to reckon with the arguments that were being given to him. He says
00:36:24.780
he attacks all those who criticize him as the product of American fundamentalism. And he says,
00:36:30.200
unlike them, I come from a world in which it is possible for people to grasp the fact there are
00:36:34.340
actually nuances in things. And again, that's patronizing. That's condescending. Just because
00:36:40.220
people are criticizing you doesn't mean that we don't understand nuance. We just don't think that
00:36:43.960
you are biblically correct. He also says that Begg's ironic lack of nuance in describing Jesus's
00:36:50.300
outreach to sinners is a problem. He says the failure to recognize that there is a world of
00:36:54.820
difference between Jesus fraternizing with sexual sinners and exploitative tax collectors who express
00:37:00.540
interest in his message on the one hand, and Jesus attending a ritual celebration either of a tax
00:37:05.500
collector's economic exploitation or of a sexual sinner's grossly immoral and a natural sexual union
00:37:10.720
on the other hand. He says that that is a lack of understanding the nuances of the difference between
00:37:18.340
what Jesus was doing and what Christians are called to do today. He also says that Begg has a
00:37:23.160
misapplication of the parable of the prodigal son, as we talked about. He says the older son refused to
00:37:28.460
attend a celebration of the younger son's penitent return from a dissolute and immoral life. That was
00:37:33.760
the problem with the older brother, not that he refused to attend a ritual celebration of a permanent
00:37:37.720
commitment to a dissolute and immoral life. Exactly correct. A better text that Begg might have chosen
00:37:44.000
than the lost son parable, and I didn't think of this, so this is interesting. He says that it comes from
00:37:52.700
Genesis 22, the binding of Isaac, where God taught Abraham not to make an idol even of his only son,
00:38:02.260
the son of the promise. We can't make holding on to a family member who is memorializing what the
00:38:06.820
writers of Scripture and Jesus deemed to be egregious the most important thing, even if we catch it in
00:38:12.480
terms of staying in evangelistic contact. He also says that Begg has a very narrow perspective
00:38:21.560
of this. Begg said, all I was thinking was, how can I help this grandmother not lose her
00:38:28.420
granddaughter? It's a little confusing because it keeps going back and forth, whether he's a
00:38:33.120
granddaughter or grandson. And what he should have been thinking is, how can I help this grandmother not
00:38:41.460
offend God? How can I persuade her not to speak affirmation to behavior that can get her grandchild
00:38:47.260
excluded from God's kingdom? Am I recommending that she do something that will stumble others by her
00:38:55.300
actions? Good question. Leaving them to affirm such immorality. Begg's failure to use good analogical
00:39:03.380
reasoning. This again goes to his apparent, Begg's apparent lack of understanding of what these
00:39:10.980
parables and biblical passages really mean. They do not mean affirming ceremonies that celebrate
00:39:17.140
someone's sin. So he goes on. There are several things that he says in response to Alistair Begg.
00:39:24.900
And I would like to see Alistair Begg actually respond to the criticisms that are being put his way,
00:39:31.940
that are being placed in front of him. That's what I would like. Even if he doesn't change his stance,
00:39:37.040
really wrestle with it and show us that you're wrestling with it.
00:39:40.980
Show us that you are actually taking seriously the biblical criticisms that people are being put
00:39:48.080
before you. Because again, I'm just disturbed. I'm disturbed by the response that he gave. Very
00:39:52.760
disturbed. And I gave the benefit of the doubt. But then when I saw him double down and honestly
00:39:57.820
misuse scripture to do that, I was really discouraged by it. And look, I'm not saying that I
00:40:04.140
have as much theological wisdom as Alistair Begg. I don't think anyone's saying that. I think all of us
00:40:09.520
can say that we really respect what he has contributed. And obviously, he's a very wise
00:40:14.460
and godly person. And I think everyone's just a little confounded of how he came to these conclusions
00:40:19.000
and then how he used the scriptures that he used to support those conclusions and condemn those who
00:40:24.200
disagree with him. I don't know. Really interesting. And again, there's a lot of projection here.
00:40:29.800
He accuses us of lacking nuance when really he lacks nuance. He accuses us of being condemning when really
00:40:36.720
he is being condemning of us when we're just trying to give our position. So I guess that he
00:40:44.520
will continue to that he will be speaking at the Shepherds Conference. I'll be interested to see how
00:40:50.180
this kind of develops over time. I would be happy to have Pastor Begg on this podcast if you were
00:40:56.860
interested in that. And I'm sure that he could school us on a lot of things and teach us a lot of
00:41:01.520
things even if we really seriously disagree on something that I find really, really important.
00:41:18.900
Okay, once again, we did not get to anything else that we wanted to talk about. There was so much to
00:41:25.740
talk about here. And I want to talk about other things. We will. We will. We will. We will cover the
00:41:30.580
other things in due time. But tomorrow we have on Krista Kolstad. And Krista Kolstad is the mother
00:41:37.040
of a young girl in Montana who has been removed from her parents' custody because she says that she
00:41:44.820
is the opposite sex. And her parents, being the same people that they are, have said, no, you're not.
00:41:50.100
You are our daughter and we are going to love you and we will get you help, but we are not going to
00:41:55.000
allow you to medically transition. We're not going to. The state got involved in Republican-run
00:42:01.700
Montana, by the way, and took this child from her parents' custody. Oh my goodness. So we'll be
00:42:09.860
talking about that tomorrow. We'll be talking with that mother tomorrow. And we will also be talking
00:42:15.660
about this horrific story of these peaceful pro-lifers being finally convicted of the crime
00:42:25.060
of singing hymns and praying in front of an abortion clinic. It's just insane what's going on. But we
00:42:31.860
got to know. We got to know what we are facing. Just remember, though, God is in control. He is
00:42:38.440
completely sovereign. His word is unchanged. And Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever.
00:42:44.500
And He is faithful. He is completely faithful and completely good. And as Monday's episode especially
00:42:51.820
reminds us, He is always doing the work of advancing His kingdom. No matter what's going on in our
00:42:58.200
political space or what's going on with disagreements between Christians and the church, that mission
00:43:04.040
remains totally unhindered and unfettered. God's plan of redemption is always going off without a hitch.
00:43:13.180
And that's what we can trust in. That's what we can rejoice in. And we can simply do the next right
00:43:18.040
thing in faith with excellence and for the glory of God. All right. That's all we got time for today.