Russell Brand is joined by Majid Nawaz to talk about Islam, assimilation and integration in the UK, and why it's important to have conversations on the subject of integration. Plus, Russell talks about why we should all vote 'No' to Donald Trump. (birds chirping) (upbeat music) by Birds Chirping. (Upbeat Music) by P.I.D.P. In this video, you're going to see the future. In this episode, you'll be introduced to Majid and learn more about his views on Islam, immigration and assimilation, as well as some of his thoughts on the current state of the UK media, and the need for a referendum on the topic of Islam and integration. (Bird's Chirp) by Pfizer in this video is a tribute to the late American civil rights activist and anti-racist activist, John Singleton, who died on the streets of New York City fighting for civil rights and human dignity in the 1960s and 70s. (Song: "I'm Sorry" by The Smiths) (Music: "In Need of a Savior" by Ed Sheeran) (Video) by Fountains of Wayne and "You're Gonna See The Future (feat. Andrea Thomas) (Video): "I Don't Know" by David Bowie (Video: "Out Of My Mind" by Fergie) (Trauma Queen) (Videographer: "Let's Talk About It" (Video). (Music copyright: "Goodbye" by John Colleolo) . (Feat_) (Birdschirping ) . (Song by: "You Can't See the Future" by ) (Music by & ) is a production of - The Good Lord & The Good Omens (Songs by ). (Blessings) (YouTube: "The Good Lord and The Bad Lord ) . (Vocal: "Chirping" (A Song by . ) (Trailblazers: "We Don't Have a Good Day" , ) & (Crispy & ), (The Good Morning ) and ( ) (Voting For Us (Votes For Us? ) in this episode (Vlogging For Us ) by
00:02:38.000Because our guest, Majid Nawaz, has walked a peculiar path in UK media.
00:02:44.000If you're American, you may not have heard of him, so let me just give you the headlines.
00:02:48.000He's been cancelled from Legacy Media.
00:02:51.000He's at the forefront of the conversation when it comes to subjects like Islam, assimilation and integration, and the subject of migration.
00:03:03.000It's important to have conversations on the subject of integration.
00:03:08.000I spoke to Majid as honestly as I could about my belief that at some point in order to bring about peace, actual peace, there would have to be some kind of referenda on the subject of migration.
00:03:21.000At least that would happen in a representative republic or in an electoral democracy.
00:03:26.000People would say, look, we might believe in mass migration, but what do you guys think?
00:03:34.000And I wish I'd covered this a little more because I think this is important.
00:03:39.000We talked a little bit about the unique example of the country of Ireland and how Ireland was condemned as racist in the same way that countries like yours, the United States of America and mine, the United Kingdom would be because of our imperialist colonial past, because of our foreign misadventures, because corporations in our name and under our flag have exploited the continent of Africa and nations across the world and therefore contributed to the migration crisis.
00:04:04.000I wonder if you've seen the fantastic conversations on, what was it, breaking points I saw, where talking about the subject of Haitian immigration into your country, America, the important points of the way that that nation has been destabilized by aspects of American imperialism isn't often enough explained.
00:04:56.000What I liked about it is when you look thoroughly at the subject of migration, you realise how it benefits elites everywhere and it is detrimental to ordinary people everywhere.
00:05:09.000And unless we're able to have the sophistication of thought and the power of spirit to overcome their diversionary and divisive tactics, we're in a lot of trouble.
00:05:20.000Before we get into magic noirs and this fantastic conversation, remember it's been up ...on locals for a month now, as well as brilliant little meditations.
00:05:28.000If you want to become an Awaken Wonder, you can just click the link that we're posting now on Rumble, and if you're watching this on YouTube, we're going to be there for about another 10 minutes before leaving you, because it's too crazy over there on YouTube, too much censorship.
00:05:40.000I just want to show you the sort of stuff we do over there.
00:05:42.000Look, this is a little meditation that I did on, uh, what book was it?
00:05:57.000Sadness, anger, despair, boredom, irritation, agitation, love, joy, anything, offer it all to him where he sits at the right hand.
00:06:05.000You can use an image here, of course, another helpful thing.
00:06:08.000So we're not praying to a diffuse, non-temporal, aspatial entity, but to Jesus Christ, God made flesh, sacrificed that we may be atoned Oh, I looked so much smarter that day, didn't I?
00:06:34.000Hey, the election campaign continues to be giddy, divisive, and scary, but Donald Trump is at least doing what he does rather well, entertaining at rallies.
00:07:53.000Responsible behaviours among everybody in the community and just because you legally possess a gun in the sanctity of your locked home doesn't mean that we're not going to walk into that home and check to see if you're being responsible and safe in the way you conduct your affair.
00:08:13.000I think they think that's the normal way of talking.
00:08:16.000We've all been kind of schooled in it and the pandemic kind of Augmented the idea that you want the state to take care of you, or that you will permit the state to take care of you.
00:08:29.000That the state can enable corporations to take those kind of diabolical liberties.
00:08:35.000But it's always been there, the tendency.
00:08:37.000You can see it in that rhetoric there, just because, you know, we might be able to come in your home and check your gun.
00:08:41.000Something like, you know, I don't own a gun, but, you know.
00:08:45.000Who knows what the future holds, guys?
00:09:09.000Not only is she positive, and does she bring hope and optimism, but as a black woman, the product of a mixed marriage.
00:09:17.000It's so funny to see this guy say, I don't know who he is, a former senior military official, you know, it's good though, isn't it?
00:09:25.000I've had conversations like that sometimes, when I've been talking to advisors that try to encourage me, you know, you're great, you, come on, you're a good guy, they're lucky to have you and this contract with you.
00:09:35.000It's very, like, that doesn't ring true.
00:09:40.000He will inspire millions of people throughout the world.
00:09:44.000Our credibility as a nation, that we would be able to allow, our country is so great that we're allowed to win.
00:09:50.000Probably won't mind, you know, all of the imperialism, and the colonialism, and the ransacking of their resources, or the backing up of NATO as there are endless wars, or the extraordinary mismanagement of the Middle East.
00:10:01.000All of that's going to fade into the background when they see the different types of people that confront up For globalist, corporatist interests.
00:10:10.000A woman like that to become the Commander-in-Chief, the President of the United States, that is going to send a powerful message all over the world.
00:10:18.000People like Vladimir Putin are going to say, hey wait a minute, these guys, you know, they truly have democratic country, they truly are representative, they truly are fighting for all their people, and Kamala Harris is a manifestation of that.
00:10:53.000We can't make this content without the support of our many partners, and we certainly can't continue to make it on YouTube.
00:10:59.000If you watch us on YouTube, click the link in the description and join me for my conversation with Majid Nawaz, commentator, pundit, cancelled and banned man.
00:11:09.000Articulate, brilliant speaker, is the kind of conversation that makes me believe that there could be alliances that would mean we could finally oppose globalism.
00:11:17.000Click that link in the description, join us over on Rumble, where free speech is acceptable and celebrated.
00:11:22.000You're gonna love this conversation between us.
00:11:26.000Now, let's have a quick look at a message from our partners.
00:12:36.000Take control and ensure that you're protected against whatever comes next because you know they've got stuff coming next.
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00:13:20.000That energy really affected me as a stand-up comedian.
00:13:23.000Sometimes when I used to do stand-up in small venues, if someone went to the toilet, I'd get the whole audience to leave and go and, like, hide.
00:14:00.000And remember, if you are on Awake and Wonder, if you email me at tickets at russellbrand.com, we can sort out for you some pairs of tickets to see me in Florida with Tucker Carlson.
00:14:09.000Just email us if you want to be considered for that.
00:14:13.000Magid Nawaz is a British activist, former radio presenter and founding chairman of the think tank Killian.
00:14:18.000In January 22, he was sacked from his job on LBC radio for posts about COVID-19 vaccinations.
00:14:27.000He was born in Southend-on-Sea in Essex, near me.
00:15:14.000I mean, look, as a Muslim, the way we open any event or begin any action, whether it's eating, whether it's a chat such as this, we begin with the words, Bismillah, which in Arabic translates to, in the name of Allah.
00:15:28.000Allah is the Arabic for the Aramaic Allah, which is the word that Jesus Christ used to reference the same one source of life, permanent, infinite source of life.
00:15:41.000So, that's how we begin, usually, with the words, Bismillah.
00:15:45.000And it's an absolute honor and a pleasure to be here.
00:15:47.000Thank you very much for your invitation.
00:15:50.000In the name of the Heavenly Father, Lord Jesus Christ, I pray that we can have a beautiful, open conversation together in the spirit of unity and good faith together, and that my dog don't bug us too much.
00:16:25.000To be meeting a prominent British outspoken Muslim at a time where our country seems to be somewhat riven by precisely the relationships between at least a portion at the periphery of both the British working class and by at least by the rhetoric that's available to us.
00:16:48.000or should we say people at the periphery or outliers within Islam, I don't know what your
00:16:53.000favoured lexicon would be, but it's no question there's tension and that the tension between
00:16:57.000these communities is being used to legitimise whether it's like street protest, but certainly
00:17:04.000the ultimate aim and the exploitation that concerns and interests me most is the ability
00:17:09.000of the state to legitimise further authority by focusing on and targeting this unrest.
00:17:16.000How do you stay true to your own affiliation, alliance, faith, culture and community, while recognising that something quite exploitative is happening in our country when it comes to censorship, control, jail sentences for tweets here in the UK, people across the world saying that we've Well look, we both, you mentioned, come from the same area.
00:17:37.000I wonder what you in particular feel about that and how you're facing it.
00:17:41.000Well, we both, you mentioned come from the same area, we're both from Essex.
00:17:46.000Back in those days, and we're kind of roughly, I think a couple of years older than me, but
00:17:50.000rough same generation, there weren't too many people that are like me in Essex.
00:17:55.000I was born in Southend, grew up on the front, played about in Kurzweil State, Clooney Estate, in Pitsy and the Council Estates there.
00:18:02.000I had mates across the area and it made for a different upbringing to then if I would been raised in say East London where there was a concentration of Muslims.
00:18:10.000So I had a very interesting perspective on what it felt like to be somebody that whose I'm up until about teenage years exclusively when my friends were white English.
00:18:24.000Then I ended up mixing with the West Indian group of friends and we got into hip-hop together from my teenage years until I left home at 16 and then I moved to East London.
00:18:32.000But it's very interesting for me to see the way in which the UK has changed and you're right to identify these fissure points.
00:18:38.000Whereas it used to be about racism in the old days and the bad old days of racism in this country up until the whole Stephen Lawrence case and you know that kind of led to a bit of a catharsis moment for the for the nation.
00:18:50.000Now it's less about race and more about cultural identity.
00:18:54.000and migration. And I think integration and what it means to be British has led to certain
00:19:01.000tension points. And what you've just alluded to, the riots that we just experienced, sadly
00:19:06.000in this country, two refugee hotels were torched, a mosque was attacked, all based off of a
00:19:13.000false online rumour that the attacker was a Syrian Muslim refugee, when in fact the
00:19:18.000attacker was born in Wales. These point to modern new points of tension and again, without
00:19:26.000beating around the bush, a lot of that comes down to the place of Muslims in Britain. And
00:19:31.000I think it's really important that everything that I've been trying to do and with working
00:19:36.000with a wider network, what we've been trying to do up until this point is to try and navigate
00:19:42.000that space. What does it mean to be a Muslim in Britain today? What does it mean to integrate?
00:19:49.000Integrate into what? Is it a one way street integration?
00:20:18.000What I'll say in conclusion to these opening thoughts, Russell, is that it is understandably going to be a challenging conversation because it's the first time in history it's been done.
00:20:32.000You could never before have a conversation with a Muslim who spent his entire life engaged in what it means to be a Muslim, including going to, as a political prisoner, going to jail for it in Egypt, right?
00:20:43.000For attempting to overthrow the Egyptian government.
00:20:45.000We can get to that if you like in a moment.
00:20:47.000But you would never be able to have a conversation with a Muslim in Britain who can say to you, oh yeah I was born in Essex, we kind of grew up in a similar environment, I'm British and what does it mean to be a British Muslim today?
00:21:01.000Because this is the first time in history we've had this kind of migration where people have been, Muslims have been born and raised in the West and feel part and parcel of that society and want a stake in having that conversation.
00:21:14.000We go back to medieval times, it was all conquest.
00:21:17.000It wasn't like, oh you've been born here, what does it feel like to be British if you're not You know, if you're a Muslim here, right?
00:21:22.000So it's the first time these conversations are happening, so naturally they will be new, it'll be new ground.
00:21:32.000On the subject of assimilation, and I suppose touching on the riots, whilst of course the flashpoint was the murder and subsequent erroneous and false reporting about a perpetrator of that murder, I think it's fair to say that in the last 10 years there have been escalating tensions More widely and deep concern about migration that's not being addressed.
00:21:50.000I would say Muslims in Britain and migration are in a sense separate subjects, although you probably argue well, I suppose at some point But I would see it separate because Well, what my faith and hope is, is that there's the possibility for indigenous white, or sort of, it wouldn't be just white, would it?
00:22:12.000It'd be black and a variety of cultures, Sikh, etc.
00:22:15.000Various cultures that are within Britain to get along with respect and regard for their own cultures and faiths.
00:22:22.000One thing I'm thinking about is that for, for want of a better term, working class British, which includes, I would say, Muslims, Christians, atheists, any conceivable faith.
00:22:36.000But in particular, say people like, you know, white British whose identification with the country would perhaps be conventionally connected to pre-war and post-war Britain and whatever cultural ephemera comes out of that.
00:22:53.000And the fact that I find it hard to define, I reckon, Magid, is part of the problem.
00:22:56.000Because when we talk about assimilation, what is the culture that we're assimilating into?
00:23:26.000That there's an annihilation of the values of the people of Britain, but also France,
00:23:31.000everywhere, like in the United States of America.
00:23:34.000When I'm having conversations, say, with conservative Americans, say, whether it's Ben Shapiro or
00:23:40.000Tucker Carlson or whoever, I'm always talking to them about the potential for alliance.
00:23:45.000And I'm always talking about the potential for us to live in communities that are decentralised
00:23:52.000and respectful and united in our opposition of the kind of state corporatism and global
00:23:58.000commercialism, that I think has stripped us of the kind of values that, as we discussed
00:24:03.000prior to getting on camera, would likely bring us together.
00:24:06.000As a recent Christian I believe that the values of Christianity are obviously personally very powerful.
00:24:14.000I'm not in like full evangelist mode yet where I'm thinking, oh, why don't the state take back on board these values?
00:24:19.000That's not where I'm sort of coming from.
00:24:21.000I'm wondering on the subject of assimilation that whether or not if the people, indigenous people, felt their culture was respected generally, I don't mean by migrants, I mean by the forces of government and forces of control, which I believe increasingly and I know that you do, are not even national powers but international and therefore global powers.
00:24:44.000If there was some sort of sense of preservation and respect for the culture, if the culture was being nourished and was thriving or even just bloody left alone to a degree of autonomy and respect, the possibility for assimilation would be more potent What do you feel about that?
00:25:02.000Right, so let's address two points from what you've just said there.
00:25:06.000One is, of course, there are long-serving, legitimate grievances that were festering that led to these riots.
00:25:14.000And whenever you see riots, I mean, I remember as a teenager, before the gentrification of Shoreditch, I used to live in Whitechapel, and I was there when the Brit Lane riots took place, because Al-Trabali was murdered in what's now a park named after his name there in Whitechapel.
00:25:28.000Now, at the end of the day, whether it's those riots or whether it's these recent ones that we've just mentioned, there's always going to be legitimate grievances behind them.
00:25:37.000And migration is one of those legitimate conversations.
00:25:40.000And it links to integration, which is the second point you've just raised there about what is the culture that we're all assimilating into when we're in this country.
00:25:49.000Now, on that point, what I'd like to say is that it becomes incredibly important If we're expecting migrants and people that are from minority communities to integrate in Britain, for us to know what that means, right?
00:26:02.000And as we kind of alluded to before coming on air, integrate into what?
00:26:07.000Because when I look at recent political social history in not just the UK but around the world, in the Western world in particular, what I'm finding is a state-heavy culture That is asking not just minority communities, not just Muslims, but everybody to integrate into the kind of culture that says that you can be coerced to take medical experimental injections against your will or get sacked.
00:26:32.000That you can be coerced against your parental better knowledge to have your children transition gender without your consent.
00:26:41.000That you can be coerced off or out of work, booted off your only means of earning a living for wrong think, right?
00:26:52.000That you can be detained under legislation that criminalizes thought and speech.
00:26:58.000And so, do I want to integrate into all of that?
00:27:01.000Do I want to integrate into a culture that says I can be jabbed against my will?
00:27:22.000I boycotted the booster shots and all other shots after that point saying that this is ridiculous when they implemented the no jab no job thing for the NHS staff and I came out against that and they basically sat me on Twitter which was a very interesting way to do it and it was I had three months left on my contract.
00:27:42.000There's no kind of doubt that it was a sacking.
00:27:45.000And we had a new contract negotiated, ready to sign, but the COVID thing was such a censorious, kind of machine-driven policy that it could tolerate no dissent.
00:27:57.000So on that point, again, is that what we're integrating into?
00:27:59.000So it comes down to what is it you want people to subscribe to as part of our culture?
00:28:05.000And then that becomes a discussion of values.
00:28:08.000So talking about migration, for example, If you want them to integrate or assimilate, doesn't matter for me, the semantics are less important, because it matters what values we're asking people to subscribe to.
00:28:19.000Now, I, for the better part of the last two decades, whether it was through the counter-extremism work that I've been involved in, having founded an organization called Quilliam, that has its faults because nothing's perfect.
00:28:30.000We tried, but that's a previous chapter.
00:28:35.000But whether it's the counter-extremism work, whether it's the work on Global's LBC through the talk radio, I'm advocating for certain core values that I believe would have done us all good, which were fundamentally resting in civil liberties and a respect for the individual and for freedoms and free speech.
00:28:50.000But if we can agree on what those values are, we then have a mandate to ask migrants and other new arrivals to this country to integrate into something.
00:29:01.000And also, we then have a criterion by which to judge.
00:29:05.000So, for example, if we say like, okay, it's not racist to say that I want to curtail immigration.
00:29:12.000Because to understand a nation has an identity and has a certain set of values around which it coalesces, that cannot be sustained with an open border policy because you can't create that kind of community around those values if people are coming and going At will.
00:29:31.000You have to have a place called home that people settle in.
00:29:34.000And that requires points of entry and points of exit.
00:29:42.000Which is built around a set of certain values.
00:29:45.000So, if we were to assume freedom of speech is one of those values, every value that I think you and I could agree on, that we'd want this word integration to apply to, free speech, individual liberties, free conscience, spiritual values, whatever those values are that I think we could probably agree on, I think we'd also agree that they've almost universally all come under attack.
00:30:07.000Recently and so that's the key thing there is that whatever we want people to integrate into is is currently facing a head-on Assault by certain powers that do not have a sense of belonging in our nation because they are global I call them globalists and they have a vested interest in Undermining those values so that the nation cannot stand on its own two feet why because then corporate power comes in from abroad and And it fills that void.
00:30:35.000And it fills that void for the sake of profit.
00:30:38.000And that's what we've been seeing and feeling.
00:30:40.000Everyone in our generation, kind of in their 40s, remembers what life used to be like.
00:30:44.000And remembers what communities used to be like.
00:30:49.000about the past we just know certain things that used to happen because i remember when youtube was invented i remember when mobile phones were invented so we know what it used to feel like to go outside and play until sunset and our parents had no way of getting hold of us other than come home for dinner and we'd say all right mom i'll come home for dinner right We can't continue to bring you this beautiful content without the support of our partners.
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00:32:20.000So we've got a certain experience in life that wasn't what I call now the atomized online culture where literally you're connected to the entire world but you've never been more alone because you're sitting there hunched over a device Imagine what we're getting into is some pretty existential and essential areas that transcend cultural arguments and lead us back to the area where I reckon we have a consensus that globalism
00:32:51.000And, like, just to define that term as I'm using it, is that there are a set of institutions and powers that are not subject to electoral democracy nor even national sovereignty.
00:33:00.000In fact, via which national sovereignty is subjugated is the main way in which people of all religions, cultures and races are oppressed, if necessary.
00:33:11.000And the freedoms that we are granted are only freedoms that can exist within the remit of their agenda being fulfilled.
00:33:19.000See, the way What I get, even from the first part of our conversation, is that were we able to openly talk about, even to the point of having a referendum, where are most people in the UK or the United States, you know, in any nation, where are we as a people on the subject of migration?
00:33:41.000Do people want a net migration bigger each year?
00:33:44.000But one of the fears that I have is that once that was established as a principle, and it seems like a necessary one, people across the cultural, religious and political spectrum are beginning to identify it.
00:33:53.000Certainly in the dog-eat-dog of bipartisan, uniparty politics, it's been accepted that you at least have to parrot the right points on it.
00:34:00.000Like whether you're Kamala Harris, you've got to say, build the wall, or whether you're Keir Starmer, you've got to say, migration is an issue, and attack Rishi Sunak, former leader, on that very subject.
00:34:09.000Where my concerns are is, would that be the beginning of a kind of a purge, of like, right, we've stopped migration now, and now what we're going to do is we're getting into deport and send them back territory.
00:34:20.000Now what I was interested in when you touched on Quilliam, which was what I was aware of and what I was familiar with, Is this, you talked about it was an anti-extremism thing, and extremism is not particular to any ideology.
00:34:32.000Often when we talk about extremism, the phrase that I'm even reluctant to use because of my background is like, Islamic extremism.
00:34:40.000But probably we could use a different or at least a more particular type of language, say like, violence.
00:34:47.000We could just talk about like now what any community that's using violence against another community for me has transgressed against that community and if the conditions that led to the riots in our country were to a degree brought around because of the tensions around migration and the well-publicized issues that as you are imagining we're referring to mate when you said stuff was festering And we touched on it a bit before, like grooming gangs and, you know, if we're talking about like the communities where there are ongoing social tensions between, for want of a better phrase, white working class communities and Muslim communities, there's a sense that there's a separation, a sort of kind of voluntary segregation and an ongoing tension.
00:35:28.000I try and look ahead and think, like, well, say if there was a consensus in Britain, like, right, we're going to go for net zero migration, and that, by the way, means whatever colour you are or whatever race you are, you know, you could be coming from Sweden or Iceland or America, or you could be coming from Libya or Sudan or wherever, and we're not having no more people because we feel that we can't handle it no more for the economic reasons that are outlined by, broadly speaking, People on the right we would when is the conversation going to take place about well, there are Muslim communities here now What are we saying when you say something like anti-extremism?
00:36:01.000What is the extremism that you're referring to in?
00:36:05.000Now not native but you know, I don't know what the right word is Muslim communities that are here and settled and have been here for ages and are part of the community.
00:36:13.000What would you term extremism with them communities?
00:36:16.000Would you mean that it's not congenial, convivial?
00:36:19.000Is it that like, you know, if you have a Muslim population as significant as we have in Britain, you've got to have Muslim schools.
00:36:25.000You're going to have Muslim neighborhoods.
00:36:27.000And if that is the way it's going to go, how are we going to do that so that people do feel a sense of Whether it's integration or assimilation, you touched on the semantics and I was trying to think of what the difference is in my mind, and integration is almost like an interlock and overlap, and assimilation is somewhat more diffuse, and that idea of the melting pot.
00:36:45.000But indeed, what perhaps brings these tensions to the forefront is that Islam does offer a set of values, does offer prescriptive roles for males, females, families, communities, food, diet, festival, ceremony, etc.
00:36:58.000All things that I would be totally like, I'm like, I admire.
00:37:02.000and revere, and perhaps part of the problem is that Christianity has been so attacked,
00:37:06.000and the family has been so attacked, and maleness has been so attacked, and in some ways femaleness
00:37:12.000has been attacked, certainly that would be the arguments of feminism, that the host culture
00:37:16.000has been annihilated by globalism and corporatism, and what is the most easy sort of shadow appearance
00:37:23.000or opposition appearance is a strong, formerly migrant, but I would now say, you know, settled
00:37:29.000community, and what my prayer is, and I'm guessing this is what you were going for with
00:37:34.000Quilliam, is to say, like, what is our plan so that, you know, white or integrated white,
00:37:39.000black, Afro-Caribbean, whatever the right terms are, working class communities and middle
00:37:43.000class communities feel like, well, we know what the deal is now, because one of the things
00:37:49.000that sort of tends to go along with, say, moderate or not extreme is secularism, and
00:37:54.000yet I now see secularism as the actual extreme force, the extreme force is when you strip
00:38:00.000away God, when you place the state at the centre, indeed your list, Majid, was about
00:38:04.000the state's got too much power, the state is coercing us in a sort of medical way,
00:38:09.000We sort of see, don't we, what the root is here.
00:38:11.000CBDCs, authoritarianism, 15-minute cities, and even though people still like to ascribe that to be conspiratorial thinking, what I reckon another area that where you and I have total consensus is through the pandemic period we got a glimpse of what seemed like, if not a plan, although I think it was a plan, a kind of an inert force and an inert intention to regulate and citizen manage to
00:38:56.000These are the areas that are of cooperation.
00:39:00.000So we know what areas we've got to work on.
00:39:02.000What do you reckon, within the Muslim community, them areas of tension are?
00:39:06.000What are the outliers or, forgive me if I'm saying the right word, what is the extreme part?
00:39:12.000It is the bit, you know, because say on the Sky News with the lads with the machetes and all that, that's what they're saying.
00:39:17.000When people are going two-tier policing, they say, what about these lads with machetes up in Brum, going around the bullring, all tooled up?
00:39:23.000Like they're saying, they're not doing that.
00:39:25.000Sky News are on saying, why extremist this?
00:39:27.000But check out these geezers in the background.
00:39:29.000But I can see why that would happen if you're a Muslim communion, there's riots going on, there's your grandmothers and your daughters and all that kind of stuff.
00:39:37.000Well, I mean, let's start with this, is that globalist corporate power has every incentive to keep our communities divided, right?
00:39:44.000So when you look at it from that angle, you understand that there's a vested interest to break up communities, to turn our culture away from traditional values, And towards corporate values.
00:39:57.000And what I mean by corporate values is having a highly mobile workforce that isn't rooted in anywhere so that it can be moved about for the purposes of profit, including labor migration, which is what the open borders policy is about.
00:40:10.000It's about cheap labor for big corporates.
00:40:13.000When they outsource everything, it's about getting lower wages to have lower overheads so they can produce cheaper products.
00:40:21.000Now to succeed in consumerism, you need to be able to destroy communities.
00:40:25.000Because if you've got a community, what does that mean?
00:40:27.000It means everything working from within that community.
00:40:30.000You've got all of the amenities made in that community.
00:40:34.000You've got local produce of food, you've got perhaps connections with farmers, and everything's coming from an existing network in that community.
00:40:44.000So it needs to break all of that down so it can bring in cheap labour for cheap goods, keep overheads low.
00:40:49.000That requires a highly mobile workforce.
00:40:52.000That's why it suits consumerism, global corporate power, to keep us divided and conquered, because community is the opposite of divide and conquer.
00:41:01.000When you understand that, that's the starting point.
00:41:03.000When you look at it through that framework, you can then understand What perhaps drove the tension between certain communities in this country over the last couple of decades, including the tension between Muslims and everyone else during the War on Terror?
00:41:18.000I mean, let's not even go to the fact that it was all built upon a lie, because that's now pretty much out there in the open with Blair, and we're going to get to Blair in a second, I believe.
00:41:27.000Apart from all the lies it was built on, you can see just from that framework why it suits people to create the tension.
00:41:33.000So what we need to do, I think, and what I think is perhaps going to be a generational challenge, which I'm happy to work with you on, Russell, is try and do the opposite of what globalism is trying to do to our communities.
00:41:49.000and try and work to get communities to begin with what we share and what we have in common, rather than define ourselves by how we're different.
00:41:58.000There's a professor in Georgetown University called Fathallah Muqaddam, and he has a theory because a lot of people... I just got used to Majid!
00:42:08.000A lot of people are critical of multiculturalism because everything you just described over the last decade that's happened to our communities, yeah?
00:42:14.000So he's come up with this paper called Omniculturalism and what Omniculturalism is about is to say that is that let's begin by what we share, what we have in common and focus on that rather than focusing on our differences because where multiculturalism perhaps went wrong in the 90s under Blair and perhaps some of the excesses of the left is and what at the time through Quilliam and the work we were doing we faced a lot of criticism for raising this stuff but I think in hindsight people seem to be alright and that is We ended up in this country as communities growing together apart.
00:42:59.000His name's Gabriel, because in Arabic that's Jibril, and at the end of the day, you know, Muslims anyway, or we marry Jews and Christians, it's something that's been established from the beginning because they're known as Ahlul Kitab, People of the Book.
00:43:12.000There's a lot of potential there in terms of what Muslims have in common with Christians.
00:43:17.000As a starting point, for example, the majority of this country is at least nominally Christian.
00:43:20.000But let's not even take it from a religious lens and look at it from a cultural lens.
00:43:24.000Because religiously, I could talk to you a lot about Jesus and being a prophet, being a messiah, being according to the Quran, being the word of God, the spirit of God, being the messenger that we wait, the prophet of God that we wait to return as well, as in the second coming.
00:43:41.000All of this in doctrine Muslims share with Christians.
00:43:45.000But even if we don't approach it from the religious lens, yeah the virgin birth for example, even if we approach it just from the political and cultural lens, right?
00:43:54.000People will realize this because it's all from recent, very recent experience.
00:43:59.000If you take the Covid period for example, Muslim communities were among those that were in the front lines opposing all the mandates.
00:44:07.000And that's because Whether it's Muslims or generally minority communities including African Americans with the Tuskegee experiments, ethnic minorities have been on the receiving end of medical experimentation by the state.
00:44:18.000I too was jabbed against my will in an Egyptian torture facility and prison where I was held, right?
00:44:24.000So when the COVID mandates came along, one of the things I said on the LBC show that I had
00:44:28.000was, "I have been an amnesty-adopted prisoner of conscience for thought crimes when I was jailed in Egypt for five
00:44:34.000years, dragged through a torture dungeon, and injected against my will. So I've got something to say
00:44:40.000Now, Muslims and generally minority communities were in the front lines on that,
00:44:45.000and everybody that lived through that COVID experiment, who was also opposed to COVID mandates,
00:44:51.000That's point number one that you can find immediately similarity and commonality and common ground on and that is to oppose medical forced coerced medical experimentation.
00:45:01.000Whether you look from that to the woke kind of transgender stuff, right?
00:46:44.000Another area, traditional values, the desire for community, grounded in some form of spiritual experience, is another area that Muslims and wider society can very easily see eye-to-eye on.
00:46:57.000So if we approach... That's four areas we've just named, right?
00:47:00.000And that's not even from the religious lens.
00:47:02.000We're talking about doctrine and the status of Jesus Christ in Islam, and Muslims awaiting his second coming, the reverence for the...
00:47:09.000For Mary, the mother of Jesus, an entire chapter named after her in the Quran.
00:47:14.000There's so much we can go into even from the theological side.
00:47:19.000When you realize that, Russell, you begin thinking, bloody hell, how have they been on opposite ends of so much?
00:47:26.000And the answer there, despite everything they share in common, they meaning Muslims and everyone else, the answer is because of divide and conquer.
00:47:33.000There are certain vested interests that basically benefit from sowing the seeds of distrust and from exaggerating the points of difference.
00:47:42.000So despite me saying to you there's an entire chapter in the Quran named after Mary, And it's the most honored woman in Islam.
00:48:13.000Do you think that we have generally allowed ourselves to be corralled into points of fissure and tension when through moral fortitude and spiritual fortitude we might have remained open and remained in good faith.
00:48:31.000But when we are dealing with centralized and censuring power such as we are, it's easy to see how online incendiary language and invective translates into incendiary action and tension on the streets.
00:48:48.000Now part of my question to you earlier, Majid, was like in what area would you be commending that Muslim communities were altered, amended, changed the process of integration to soften these edges which might indeed actually conversely involve More autonomy in the communities.
00:49:14.000Let me, if I may, extrapolate and expand on that.
00:49:20.000I will be saying that in the event that we were able to have a mandate, a consensus around the subject of migration, saying that if people across the United Kingdom, and I would say that the type of politics that might interest me is Whilst one admires visionary politicians that present the electorate with a purview that we might all be able to get behind, that's part of it, ultimately what excites me is the possibility of a discourse along the lines of, this is what we believe the function of migration is, and of course I agree with your assessment, it's about flooding labour markets and disempowering indigenous or native or current communities to the point where they can't negotiate.
00:50:05.000And what I feel like is something I often have recourse to is a statement that Gandhi made prior to the partitioning of India after the end of British rule.
00:50:16.000So there's no point in us kicking out the British only to emulate the systems that they hoisted upon us.
00:50:22.000India is a country of 70,000 villages where each should be fully autonomous and independent,
00:50:28.000where possible trading only where necessary, and we should be sure to maintain our cultures
00:50:33.000right down almost to the smallest communal level.
00:50:36.000Now when I've had conversations prior that I alluded to, mate, with like American conservatives for want of a better,
00:50:42.000I've said, "Would you like, even to Ben Shapiro, would you be on a platform say with BLM type folks,
00:50:48.000or proper trans activist folks, if the ultimate point was we want to be able to run our own community
00:50:53.000and just be left alone by the state and run our community our way?"
00:50:57.000And they're like, yeah, ultimately that would be a better deal.
00:50:59.000because I think that all of us have become compromised by the evolution and
00:51:04.000excesses of the nation-state and how the nation-state is graduating clearly into
00:51:09.000globalism without any consultation, without any election.
00:51:13.000We're at the point where Britain itself is being compromised and I wouldn't
00:51:17.000say, but this is just my particular perspective, I know people would see
00:51:20.000this differently, I wouldn't say that the dominant threat has been migration.
00:51:24.000It's clearly, and you yourself have acknowledged that it is part of the decline
00:51:28.000of national identity and the kind of economic and labour market impact of that
00:51:33.000and indeed the impact it would have on the cultural identity, but I would
00:51:37.000say, you know, I've I've always said, if we're talking about power, how can some of the least powerful groups be the perpetrators of your loss of power?
00:51:52.000Like, leaving their countries because of economic reasons or because of war, even if it's like the worst case scenario, and I'm talking from the perspective of, you know, sort of closed border nationalism, of like, young working age, military age, they might even say, men flooding our borders, even then I'd say, wouldn't a policy of like, you know, net zero migration have to be accompanied, and here's perhaps part of the problem, With less rampant globalist corporatism and capitalism that's unsettling and exploiting the nations either through war or corporatism that's leading to the refugee crisis and migration in the first place.
00:53:50.000I would say one of the main sort of conflagrations, certainly on the basis of what we've seen in the last six months or whatever, is the problems on actual streets.
00:53:59.000Between Muslim communities and largely white British people, who are being sort of called racist and criminalized, and to your point about extremism, no doubt!
00:54:09.000Like, same as you're presumably saying within Muslim communities, there's people pushing it extreme, you'd say the same thing in white indigenous communities.
00:54:18.000And what I suppose ultimately we want to achieve, in much the same manner you've said between Islam and Christianity, is to look at what our points of... the points where we can coalesce and unite are, and then surely what we would have is something approaching a force that could oppose globalism.
00:54:34.000The only way to oppose globalism indeed is going to be through mass protest, mass disobedience, mass non-compliance, and a previously inconceivable degree of unity that could only be brought on by the kind of crisis that
00:54:47.000are currently being utilised to double down on authoritarianism.
00:54:50.000We're going to have to bang people up for tweets now because they're rioting in the
00:54:54.000streets and setting on fire migrant hotels.
00:54:55.000So if people are racist or whatever online, they're getting lumpy little jail sentences
00:55:19.000If you're constantly carrying a credit card balance each and every month with a rate in the 20s, American Financing can show you how to use the equity in your home to get you out of debt.
00:55:55.000And the way through this, because you've touched on the idea of like, even those who want to stop migration have to recognize that a lot of the migration patterns are coming from countries that we've invaded, right?
00:56:04.000So the way through this, because look, Afghanistan and migration, Iraq and migration, Syria and migration, Yemen and migration, these are all countries where there's been wars that we've either directly been involved in, in the case of the first of those three, four, and then the last one, Yemen, where we've been indirectly involved by Saudi Arabia.
00:56:21.000So, at the end of the day, this requires honest conversation.
00:56:50.000We are called all manner of pejorative insults like conspiracy theorists.
00:56:55.000So, to even speak about globalism is a bit easier now than it was even three years ago when I got kicked off LBC, right?
00:57:03.000To speak, for example, now, as we just discussed, Russell, it's no longer controversial to talk about the heart vaccine harms.
00:57:10.000It's just within the space of the last two, three years, right?
00:57:13.000It's no longer controversial to oppose all COVID mandates.
00:57:15.000It's no longer controversial to talk about Hunter Biden's laptop.
00:57:19.000I was on air when Twitter banned the entire account of the New York Post for posting that story and yet raised it on LBC and interviewed a New York Post columnist.
00:57:58.000Well, it brings me nicely to I think, I think where we are, if you look at the online culture now versus what people used to call mainstream media, but I call corporatist media, because I don't think it's that mainstream anymore, to be honest.
00:58:10.000And if we look at where we are, we've ended up with, I think we've co-created as a society, two very different realities.
00:58:18.000And there's the online reality, and there's the corporatist controlled reality of so-called mainstream.
00:58:24.000And if you're in that bubble, of the corporatist bubble, you can watch the very same event like the Kamala Harris-Trump debate recently, and you can come out entirely convinced that Kamala won and Trump lost.
00:58:34.000Well Harris won and Trump lost if you're on the online bubble
00:58:37.000You can watch exactly the same thing and come out and say that was three against one and Trump still beat them
00:58:41.000Right because it was the ABC broadcasters and Kamala Harris against Trump
00:58:45.000It was stacked against him and he still came out strong the very same reality can be interpreted in polar opposite
00:58:51.000Perspectives because people are living in very very different worlds. One is the
00:58:55.000post cancellation online alternative space hmm, and the other is pre cancellation still going kind of
00:59:01.000corporatist media space that you and I used to both be involved as
00:59:05.000And the funny thing is, for the last few years, it feels like they've been going in opposite directions, almost like a fork, right?
00:59:11.000People that opposed the Covid mandates, that opposed the war in Ukraine, that opposed or exposed the Hunter Biden laptop story and all the other censored news ended up in one space and they generally tend to be people that are anti-establishment, anti-globalist.
00:59:25.000It doesn't matter too much if they're openly pro-Trump, but they certainly feel that Trump was discriminated against.
00:59:30.000I mean, one of the things the Observer, which is our Sunday Guardian, when they wrote the article about my being cancelled,
00:59:36.000they put "Conspiracy theorist raises alarm" as a headline on coronavirus and US elections.
00:59:42.000Because at the time in 2020, I was trying to raise the alarm
00:59:46.000about what I felt was interference in the US elections against Trump.
00:59:50.000And I don't believe you have to be a supporter of Trump To raise that alarm.
00:59:55.000And then there's this other parallel reality where people think, genuinely think, we're mad for having those, like, we're insane, actually insane, for believing that the elections were interfered with, that Trump's being kind of discriminated against a bit, which I believe very thoroughly, having looked into it the way I do, that he has been, um, elections were, there's a Time magazine article About a cabal that interfered in the elections and fixed it against Trump.
01:00:25.000But people think we're insane for saying that.
01:00:27.000Meanwhile, we're looking at people still stuck in the corporatist media world and thinking, how are they not woken up yet?
01:00:33.000How are they still claiming, like the mayor of New York, that they suddenly were tested positive for COVID?
01:00:36.000Who the bloody hell is still testing for COVID?
01:00:39.000They think we're mad and we think they're mad.
01:00:41.000What I think we need is, and that's been done deliberately, again, so that we're talking cross purposes.
01:00:45.000We're no longer talking the same language.
01:00:47.000In the end, that's a recipe for civil war, right?
01:00:50.000Which suits globalists because it goes back to divide and conquer.
01:00:53.000The fault lines in our society isn't just Muslims against others.
01:00:59.000It's alternative media against traditional kind of corporatist media.
01:01:02.000It's in Northern Ireland Catholics and Protestants.
01:01:04.000There are many fault lines, but the globalists benefit from exploiting all of them.
01:01:08.000It just happens to be that a headline one at the moment is Muslims and others, right?
01:01:12.000It must be true, because otherwise why would you have seen this bizarre inversion of principles in American politics between the left and the right?
01:01:19.000That the left is now pro-censorship, that the left is anti-free speech, that the left is pro-war.
01:01:25.000What's happening is there was no anchor of virtue, merely facilitation and expedience for the way the culture was operating at that time.
01:01:35.000What do we need to say at this point to maintain power?
01:01:42.000Like, see, like, you would have to agree that in a country like Britain, with its colonialist past and the legacy of that, that there is a tension that exists that warrants a degree of compassion when it comes to the subject of migration.
01:02:01.000It don't seem right that the people that suffer most of that are the Sort of working-class people that are just fodder in the same way that countries that are colonized and subject to imperialism were fodder.
01:02:12.000They just sort of moved on, found new markets, found new commodity.
01:02:15.000And the same in the United States of America, for its rather more corporatized colonization of the world.
01:02:21.000Somewhat more insidious, not so plain, not planting flags but planting logos.
01:02:28.000I wonder though, with the recent disturbances in Ireland, mate, I like, because I was talking about that when it happened, of course, and I was like, it's weird because Ireland don't have a colonial history, and when Ireland has social disturbances as a result of a migration crisis, and it was obvious that those, whilst them riots, people were way off To say that it would be an undocumented migrant and all that, it's almost like the the tinderbox was so ready to go, people are so agitated and I don't reckon it's a coincidence that it was just after the election when Keir Starmer sort of marches to power with 30% of the of the voting public but it's still a landslide and all of us know in our heart hearts this is a slide to WEF style globalism.
01:03:09.000This is not a Labour Party that's interested in representing working people.
01:03:13.000This is like the kind of political movement like say Justin Trudeau, Macron, Yeah, he's a Blairite.
01:03:36.000It's more simple because Ireland Has been colonized by again by the British of course and has been subject to being a subjugated power.
01:03:46.000How does that, what does that reveal about the problems incumbent within migration when they don't have the same sort of debt or sort of duty that you could say well bloody hell America's caused all these wars, Britain's caused all this grief.
01:04:00.000Gotta take it on a chin when it comes to... The thing is, those problems are natural.
01:04:03.000So yes, in the case of mainland UK, there is the historical kind of guilt, yeah?
01:04:08.000But wherever these mass migration patterns take place, and whether it's in the East or the West, natural tensions will eventually arise because they're competing over the same markets for the same housing, for the same jobs, for the same places in schools.
01:04:22.000But again, back to globalists benefiting from exploiting all and every fault line, That's another example there, because the same powers that want to encourage open borders and mass migration will then exploit the division that occurs from it.
01:04:51.000Even these recent UK riots we just came through, right?
01:04:53.000Keir Starmer immediately, the very next day, which you probably remember, Russell, came out and said, right, we're going to basically start clamping down on posts online and all this online hate.
01:05:01.000The state of our law at the moment, which Americans may or may not understand, but we should lay it out for them.
01:05:07.000If you said something to me on this show, like, there's a point I do want to get, you asked me a question earlier, which I do want to answer, by the way, about what could Muslims be doing to address extremism.
01:05:16.000If I, if I, if I, you asked me that question, if the current state of British law is, if a third party watching this show took offence at you asking me what could Muslims do to address extremism, right?
01:05:29.000If they took offence on my behalf and said that your question was offensive, That third party can complain to police under our current state of hate crime laws, and you could get done for hate speech.
01:05:41.000Because a third party is taking offence.
01:05:42.000Even if I'm here chilling with you, right?
01:05:44.000The state of our legislation at the moment is, hate speech isn't just what I think you said to me, but what a third party thinks I may have found offensive.
01:05:52.000And that's how all these people are getting arrested.
01:05:54.000Because it's so amorphous at the moment.
01:05:57.000But again, how does that benefit corporatism?
01:06:00.000Because again, it's more power to the state.
01:06:02.000And whenever a piece of legislation is that wide open, there is only one way to implement it, and that is inconsistently.
01:06:09.000Because if law can be applied to every given scenario, then by definition, it will only selectively be applied.
01:06:16.000Because it can be applied to everything, right?
01:06:18.000So then it's a political decision when to apply it.
01:06:21.000And then you have the people in power, their politics, Keir Starmer, gets to define when to implement hate speech.
01:06:29.000And that's where it's become politicized.
01:06:30.000We've got such a wide, our legislation is so wide, every tension, whether it's the stuff, the migration in Northern Ireland, which yep, or here in the mainland, or across Europe.
01:06:40.000All of these tensions, Muslims and wider communities, but not just Muslims as we're saying earlier, but the tensions that exist across society.
01:06:47.000At the moment, elderly and young kind of, you know, with the Labour Party cancelling the whole kind of winter fuel allowance.
01:06:53.000All of these tensions, the elderly with the midazolam story that during the Covid period, where the elderly and all evidence points to the fact that we've got peer-reviewed statistical research done by Dr Wilson Tsai, that the elderly during COVID were basically given midazolam and their deaths were deliberately sped up by the state to get rid of them because they were a burden on the state.
01:07:14.000These are all points of tension and fissure, you know, basically fault lines in society.
01:07:19.000The state benefits from all of this, right?
01:07:21.000So what we got to again come back to is how do we pull back from this kind of, it feels like this kind of octopus that is using every opportunity to only gain more and more power for itself while we're stuck fighting each other.
01:07:35.000And I think the answer there, first of all, comes back to that values point that we have to first discover what we stand for.
01:07:40.000And it's why I think your spiritual journey is very important in that regard.
01:07:45.000Because if we first stand for something, we can then call others towards a certain set of values that we all share in common.
01:07:51.000And free speech is a key one on that note.
01:07:54.000Because ubiquitous criminalization requires almost a kind of ubiquitous virtue as a response.
01:08:00.000It's like that we have to become virtuous and in a sense the kind of spiritual values that creates We've talked about consumerism, commodification, a lot, and when a component of this corporatism is that our only value and our core identity is on the basis of how we consume and how we interface with corporatism, that we're losing any identity other than our individual identity.
01:08:31.000And if you have become your own deity, if you are your own internal Pamphian, worshipping your aspects of your own psyche, with no higher or ulterior God that is guiding your principles, guiding your practices, then the state is free to be God, free to tell you, this is our new credo, we believe in this, we don't believe in that.
01:08:51.000And I love your point about the sort of broad, diffuse criminalisation of speech that can be legislated for generally and deployed specifically.
01:09:50.000And like you were saying, you indicated as your very personal and particularly sounds pretty harrowing and amazing background would make you take a particular stance against the Japs.
01:09:57.000My position was like, don't tell me what to do.
01:10:09.000I didn't trust them 10, 15 years ago when they were telling me, I hate all Muslims and they're all terrorists and all that kind of stuff.
01:10:15.000And now that the tensions and the dynamics have changed and the reporting is ordered, I'm still cynical and suspicious about what they're doing.
01:10:22.000But I do know that the solution has to be some kind of congeniality.
01:10:26.000And I wish you would answer that question, even though I'm scared of the question now.
01:10:30.000So one of the reasons you're suspicious of authority is naturally where you're from, right?
01:10:35.000You're from Essex, you're not from Kensington, right?
01:10:37.000And I think there's a different upbringing there.
01:10:39.000And I think, so those two spheres that we mentioned earlier, so one of the projects I'm trying to do and be involved in, in fact the next big project I'm working on, is to try and bridge those two audiences, the online and the so-called kind of corporatist media worlds, the kind of way in which conversations are forked, where they're not really, they're talking cross-purposes.
01:11:00.000So I'm working on a project as a show called Cancelled that seeks to address Those that kind of have been cancelled or there's an effort to cancel their voices or to suffocate their voices and try and have that show back on a corporate platform But with the conversations that we've been having over the last four years in the online space to try and bridge that again
01:11:20.000Yeah, and you could almost show, I suppose, the teleology of issues like COVID in particular.
01:11:24.000You were saying this stuff was, now look at where we are.
01:11:26.000What are you saying about myocarditis now?
01:11:28.000What are you saying about lockdown now?
01:11:29.000What are you saying about six feet now, masks?
01:11:31.000Somebody's got to try and bridge those two audiences.
01:11:59.000So we've come through a whole period of the war on terror era where ISIS was a problem, Al-Qaeda were a problem, other such groups.
01:12:06.000There was a tendency within our communities to seek to impose any given version of Islam over society, right?
01:12:13.000isn't a majority desire, but there was an organized group within our communities that
01:12:18.000ended up in its worst case manifesting as ISIS. So where we identify or are able to
01:12:24.000identify that tendency, it needs to be dealt with, it needs to be addressed, it needs to
01:12:28.000be challenged. But that again brings us back to honest conversation, where we may not be
01:12:35.000having honest conversations on grooming gangs, on kind of Al-Qaeda/ISIS-based extremism.
01:12:41.000Where we may not be having honest conversations on that stuff, wider society also needs to start having honest conversations on, for example, the global Mossad VIP pedophile ring that was run by Epstein.
01:12:58.000They weren't doing it in a chicken shop!
01:13:00.000Right, so a bridge that kind of brings together those worlds that aren't mixing at the moment is what I'm all about.
01:13:06.000As I said, I'd be more than happy to continue working with you on that in conclusion, because I know we're running out of time.
01:13:12.000But yeah, so as I said, looking forward to this show cancelled.
01:13:15.000There's extremism in these communities.
01:13:18.000I felt it actually around 9-11 and the subsequent tensions that grew out of that, not to mention the mad, giddy and unjust wars that have caused yet more extremism and yet more pain and yet more suffering that goes on to this very day.
01:13:30.000How come we're letting the polarizing voices dominate the discourse?