Russell Brand travels to the Florida Panhandle to talk to people about the Epstein scandal, the Super Bowl, and the current state of a broken culture. Cracked On with Russell and Joe and Dave are back with a new show called Crack On, where they talk about recovery and the 12 Steps.
00:00:29.000But in crack on, we talk about recovery and the principles of recovery, 12-step recovery.
00:00:33.000And although we're not affiliated with any particular 12-step group, we often reference this, the masterpiece that is the Alcoholics Anonymous big book.
00:00:41.000I'll also be bringing you a variety of content, and this is something we've not done before.
00:00:47.000I'm going out into the Florida panhandle like a rogue redneck and talking to people about the Epstein files, about the Super Bowl, about Minneapolis, about a culture that's falling apart.
00:01:00.000One of the things that we say all the time is that we've become remote, lost in the black mirror and in the cracked screens, isolated and atomized.
00:01:08.000So if I go out and get face-to-face among people, talk to them directly, particularly since it's Florida, and everyone here agrees with one another anyway.
00:01:16.000It's more likely that there'll be a bit of human connection.
00:01:19.000If you're not watching us on Rumble, get over to Rumble and join us here.
00:01:23.000The truth is, actually, I was going to be interviewing Mike Benz, but Mike Benz, I mean, from the first time I met him, I thought this guy's going to get murdered if he keeps starting saying stuff like this.
00:01:32.000And he has kept saying stuff like this.
00:01:34.000So he's either been murdered or I pray that he's all right.
00:03:32.000In the fellowship of Narcotics Anonymous, they use the idiom the pink and the green, men do at least, meaning the money and the honey.
00:03:41.000It's often relationships or finance-related issues, and that's probably that's the same for life in or out of recovery.
00:03:48.000Resentments are when you have some resistance or objection to, or some negative or otherwise negative feeling about the events and facts of your life.
00:03:58.000My favorite bit of writing about that, which I've mentioned before in this podcast, is when we have a resentment, we usually find at some point in the past we've made a decision based on self that's put us in a position to be hurt.
00:04:10.000And every time I know, have I got resentment?
00:04:13.000Yeah, I do always find I've made a decision in the past based on self that's put me in a position to be hurt.
00:04:17.000So, Joe, do you have any obvious resentments right now that you can talk about?
00:04:25.000Yeah, I mean, at the minute, a lot of stuff, man, a lot of stuff's come back around from my past that's you know, like previous convictions and stuff.
00:04:35.000Like, due to my alcoholism and drug addiction, I ended up going to prison twice.
00:04:42.000And, you know, that stuff don't really go away.
00:04:45.000I mean, in terms of like spent convictions, they're spent and all that.
00:04:52.000But when you try and progress in life, sometimes you have to declare that stuff or in, you know, certain jobs or like even trying to get into the States.
00:06:08.000A DBS is where you like a government check on your criminal past.
00:06:14.000And then, like, you know, if it's a job or whatever, they'll get a print out of your convictions, custodial sentences, and charges, even if they're spent, even if it was 10 years ago, 15, whatever it was.
00:06:28.000So that stuff can still cause problems.
00:06:30.000And like the work I was moving into, like the security stuff, and that there's like a creditors that want to do checks before they license you and this and that.
00:06:41.000So it's been a bit of a problem there.
00:06:45.000With right, so you know enough about recovery now to know I reckon where what you're experiencing, where it lies in the principles of our program that are solution-oriented, right?
00:07:01.000Actually, I don't yet, other than it's probably a bit eight and nine, we're in a probably, we're probably in an eight and nine thing.
00:07:08.000There's like there's like it's a because it's wreckage of the past.
00:07:32.000Yeah, so like, so it's, it's travels from 83.
00:07:34.000So these are the famous Alcoholics Anonymous promises.
00:07:38.000If we're painstaking about this phase of our development, so it's talking about doing step nine, and step nine is you make amends where appropriate to all the people you've harmed in your life.
00:07:49.000If we're painstaking, if we risk pain about this phase of our development, we will be amazed before we are halfway through.
00:07:58.000We're going to know a new happiness and a new freedom.
00:08:03.000We will not regret the past nor wish to shut the door on it.
00:08:07.000We will comprehend the word serenity and we will know peace.
00:08:12.000No matter how far down the scale we have gone, we will see how our experience can benefit others.
00:08:21.000That feeling of uselessness and self-pity will disappear.
00:08:27.000We will lose interest in selfish things and gain interest in our fellows.
00:09:10.000Perhaps, Joe, there's a couple of things I'd love to do in our time together today.
00:09:15.000One is I'd love to hear a version of your story.
00:09:18.000And in particular, because you've got such a positive message to share for men that have served custodial sentences and of course men that are in jail still, I'd love you to focus on that aspect of your story.
00:09:32.000Before we do that, let's break down these promises together, mate.
00:09:38.000Anything you notice or you want to tell me, tell me as we go for it.
00:09:43.000If we're painstaking about this phase of our development, obviously the word.
00:10:12.000But if you are painstaking, if you are like, I've dealt with my biggest harm caused, that was the first one we went for, I remember.
00:10:23.000And I thought I'd be told, nah, look, leave that one alone because step nine is make direct amends wherever possible, except when to do so would cause harm to others.
00:10:33.000So I kind of thought, oh, maybe this will bring up too much pain for the victims here, I guess, you know.
00:10:41.000And it's not one that I've been able to make yet.
00:10:44.000Although the person is, they know that I'm willing to, and at some point they may want to sit down and have a chat, but it's a very serious one.
00:10:53.000We can't make this content without the support of our partners.
00:10:56.000I don't think we actually can yet because we're in a sort of contractual related.
00:10:59.000Yeah, we can't make this content without the support of our partners.
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00:12:12.000What's the best ever painstaking amends you've ever heard in the since you've been involved in AA?
00:12:19.000Like most painstaking one I've heard a whole lot of time.
00:13:08.000And he's like, all right, so let's do it then.
00:13:10.000So the guy goes up and down that street, knocking on doors, telling people, listen, your house, I used to rob your house in between this era and this, you know, this date and this date.
00:13:24.000Anything I took, I don't have very much money right now.
00:13:27.000But if you can remember anything that I've stolen, and people like, a lot of people are like, whoa, okay.
00:13:34.000You know, like mostly that sort of stuff.
00:13:36.000People are baffled and confused by it.
00:13:38.000Because what I love about it, Joe, is like when you're on that journey, you're like, who are you?
00:13:43.000Like a person that's like that, you might as well be Frodo or someone in the Shires, innit?
00:13:48.000You've like elected to step out of reality and you're on some quest.
00:13:53.000And like it doesn't, unless you meet someone else, like a fellow traveler, like Neil, like, oh, you're on the trip, man.
00:14:00.000Like, you know, people are just like, what are you doing?
00:14:02.000Because your whole, the whole world is geared to get whatever you can get, take whatever you can take, get away with whatever you can get away.
00:14:09.000Anyway, one door this geezer knocks on.
00:14:12.000They say, the woman answers the door and goes, our son is a drug addict.
00:15:07.000Like if it's like, I can make amends, it doesn't cost me.
00:15:10.000And I've got to be honest, Joe, I spend so much of my time in that territory generally.
00:15:15.000Like, you know, it's sort of, you know, giving a homeless person some money, but it don't cost me nothing.
00:15:22.000Being nice to the people that are in my immediate environment.
00:15:25.000That's no different than cleaning your teeth, being nice to the people you interact with.
00:15:30.000It's just, if you don't do that, you're an idiot.
00:15:32.000Like if you, you know, like it says, like our Lord, love your enemy.
00:15:36.000Like, because even the tax collectors love their friends, you and you hate them and despise them.
00:15:41.000Are we going to raise the bar on the general sort of responsible ethics of being pleasant to people that you have to interact with regularly.
00:15:52.000So step nine and the painstaking component of step nine is an invitation to step outside of the rules of reality.
00:15:59.000And it's an extremely Christian idea because it's you are, I think, signaling to reality that you are no longer operating on the level of worldliness.
00:16:12.000Painstaking says taking pains, showing care, taking pains, showing care, dictionary definition.
00:16:21.000If we are painstaking about this phase of our development, we will be amazed before we are halfway through.
00:16:27.000We are going to know the new freedom, freedom.
00:16:45.000Because you think both you and I, like, I'm still in the sort of judicial process that requires sensitivity for me and carries a degree of complexity because as I've said before in this show, I recognize that, particularly as I learn more and more about the particularities of the case, that my moral responsibility,
00:17:13.000my moral responsibility is great and the burden of guilt is significant as a man that's awake and lives in the world and doesn't want to interact with people in a way that's detrimental to them.
00:17:28.000But because I'm not in the box of morality, I'm in the box of judicial criminal proceedings.
00:18:07.000That's now we're in, you know, we're in this business.
00:18:10.000So like, but what I want to say is we will not regret the past nor wish to shut the door on it.
00:18:17.000It's very hard, isn't it, Joe, to sort of say, I don't regret the past when you know for a fact there are people that have been hurt by you because there's a sort of a callousness in saying, well, I don't regret it.
00:18:29.000How do you with the step nine that when me and you were sort of talking about and around like, you know, talk about it in a way that's sensible, like your step nine is.
00:18:43.000Like, so I completely agree with what you're saying there.
00:18:53.000Like when you're sat in them meetings and like slowly like the fog's starting to clear and you're getting a, you know, a better perspective on the harms you've caused.
00:19:02.000I find that I've found it near impossible not to regret my whole fucking life up to that point, to be honest.
00:19:32.000And I told my story and I explained like the first serious consequence for me was a custodial prison sentence for GBH or intent, which is like, it's one step down from attempted murder.
00:21:17.000And all of a sudden, in a weird way, you think, well, if I hadn't had that experience, would this geezer be able to open up to me in the same way?
00:21:28.000So I think that's where it comes in, you know.
00:21:30.000I think there's no way people could open up to you because I think even the price of entry is that recognition between people.
00:21:39.000The other side to the identification that you were able to share while doing service in a prison is the person that suffered as a result of your actions and the ongoing consequences.
00:21:58.000Now, what measures have you taken or can be taken sensitively and within the sort of suggested terms of the program?
00:22:10.000What do you think needs to be done and could be done?
00:23:25.000I want you to know how I was affected.
00:23:27.000Now all this you're getting that it could go anyway, but we're clearing the.
00:23:32.000This is really clearing the records of the past and it might not be the way I want it to go, but ultimately, once it's said and done, if I bump into them in Tesco's or another shop or whatever, like we've cleared it up, we've cleared it up and you can move on.
00:23:47.000And not only that, you're for yourself, you're doubling down on.
00:23:52.000This is not the man I am today and I'm willing to do whatever it takes to set this right with the actions, not just words and not just sitting in meetings and all that stuff.
00:24:04.000It's a spiritual program of action and this is me acting like the man that I want to be, that I should be like with um.
00:24:18.000With um, when you've done that, like when you do do that approach someone and say to them, um, like it's I think it's like casting a spell and I don't mean that in a deceptive way, I mean summons in like almost prophetically, one might say the presence of God.
00:25:26.000I don't drink, I don't take drugs and I don't engage in other forms of addictive conduct that like that.
00:25:32.000That's not the man that I am and I, in order for me to continue on the path, I have to let you know that's how I feel and tell you that I'm willing to make amends.
00:25:43.000Is there anything that I've not said that you want to add, and is there anything I can do for you?
00:25:47.000I'd like to suggest that I can do this.
00:25:51.000Is there anything you'd like to suggest?
00:25:52.000Right, I think that's like the kind of territory that you want to be in and I'm what's mad Joe is like, say with like, your situation, which I consider is perhaps somewhat unresolved with regard to the matter we've been discussing eh, and with mine, it's pretty obvious that what I'm talking around is see, I'm in a situation where, as a result of criminal criminal, judicial proceedings, I've got to be,
00:26:22.000I've got to keep my mouth shut right and I think anyway everyone, I mean you know, as soon as you say not guilty, that's your position and that's my position.
00:26:33.000But it also forecloses on the possibility of like.
00:26:38.000You know is, Is this the best way to resolve?
00:26:41.000This is, through this, the theater and drama of, you know, the sort of situation that that I'm participating in, and of course I'm willing.
00:26:56.000But what I mean to say is that isn't it interesting to see the intercession of human institutions in a place of the spirit?
00:27:05.000Indeed, how can you even have law without God?
00:27:09.000You can't have law without God because you can't have justice, you can't have right, you can't have wrong.
00:27:14.000So when human beings attempt to sort of marshal these powers, these principles of these ideas, they're in the territory of God, like human institutions are in the territory of God when making a claim to justice or right and wrong or the arbitration of the difference between right and wrong.
00:27:30.000Human beings are in that role now, and of course, human beings.
00:27:33.000Well, it's not gonna be an angel or a cloud or a vapor, or Jesus, Jesus Self, till the second coming.
00:27:40.000But there has to be tangible, verifiable, measurable standards via which we know, straight as an arrow, clear as day, you're dealing with God.
00:27:52.000And anything that appears to get in the way of that, that's some murky gear right there because it's in God's domain.
00:27:59.000And the very fact that I can't have a, I guess I suppose I could have done, like, you know, when I'm thinking of the people that have been so harmed by.
00:28:10.000by my conduct that they are willing to participate in criminal judicial proceedings, about which my views are clear.
00:28:22.000The fact is that maybe if, at some point in the past, if I'd gotten on and found a way, found a way of contacting, reaching out, making clear because I've had a couple of those ones, like like you described mate where, where I've made amends to people, I'm having an NAD shot right now, an NAD well drip in fact.
00:28:46.000It's sort of okay, like Nurse Nikki's administering it when it kicks in like what I feel is a bit sort of like Swallowy kind of finally you'd like it.
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00:31:43.000There's films, there's tours, there's all this stuff going on.
00:31:47.000And like, so if people weren't doing what needed to happen when it was happening, it was all just very, you know, I'd had like a little group of people that revised it.
00:31:54.000I'm not trying to, I suppose I am perhaps trying to mitigate responsibility.
00:31:59.000But what I want to say is that choices were made somewhat in committee with me in the lead.
00:33:34.000You know, but and I don't know what he feels, but I do know that I've, I suppose, I wonder, I suppose, Joe, if you're on a spiritual path, it's nothing to do with, well, I hope he thinks I'm a nice person because then you're still in the game, aren't you?
00:33:49.000You're still in the game of what people think.
00:33:52.000Like, there's been a lot of it because if you've moved fast through life doing a lot of stuff, and the fact is with alcoholics and addicts, is it's a, you've got a lot of energy.
00:34:03.000You've got a lot of, like, what that is spirit.
00:34:08.000Like, when Jung says, as we talk about a lot, spiritus contra spiritum, and it, like, you know, it's part of what we're doing is we're sort of dampening down this kind of force in you.
00:34:19.000And that force, when it's out there, you're throwing things down your neck.
00:34:23.000People are getting smacked in the mouth.
00:34:25.000You've having it off all over the gaff.
00:35:21.000It's annoying that there are sort of these systems that are like, but that's it.
00:35:25.000I mean, we, I guess we have to recognize God in all this.
00:35:31.000We have no choice but to locate God and say, this is what these are, you know, well, like it says, like I said at the beginning of our conversation, at some point in the past, we've made a decision based on self that's put us in the position to be hurt.
00:35:57.000The whole period of my life was based on self.
00:36:02.000Like the basis of it, the foundation, like we even think of that, you know, Matthew, the verse, like, you know, the famous almost nursery rhyme, like the child, the, you know, build your house on a rock, not on sand.
00:36:19.000My identity and life was built on self.
00:36:21.000And the rain came tumbling down and the floods came up and the house came a tumbling down.
00:36:28.000If you build your house on the rock of Christ, the rock is ain't going nowhere.
00:36:33.000But you, you know, you know, like any great metaphor and symbol, there's a great deal packed into that.
00:36:39.000And to know what you're, you know, what you're saying no to, isn't it interesting that the rock is a solid thing that's standing the test of time and sand is a zillion billion uncountable number of different little molecular things, molecular things, not one God, one God.
00:37:02.000I actually didn't comprehend the word serenity.
00:37:05.000I actually didn't understand what, I mean, I knew serenity, serenity, but like, you know, like that's a lot of us know in early recovery, what's this feeling where I'm sort of a bit bored kind of thing?
00:37:22.000Like sometimes now, like, you know, the sound of like God, I don't know if you hear it where you live, but sometimes like you hear a wood pigeon, you get him in America, you get him in England.
00:37:32.000Like just like this morning, I could hear one.
00:37:57.000We will see, like, it's not that, no matter how far down the scale we've gone, we will see how our experience can benefit us, how our experience can be turned into a tidy fortune.
00:38:09.000How it can be used to impress sexual partners to make a business, benefit others, benefit others.
00:38:19.000Like, i.e., the goal of going far down the scale is your, as you demonstrated in your story of doing service in a jail, is to benefit others.
00:38:29.000And then I really, what I like about this bit of writing coming up is what all good writing, I suppose, has to do in essence, what scripture does, you know, sort of beyond compare to the level of the sublime, at the level of the sublime.
00:38:44.000And what this book does, you know, at points, I see this as a sort of a piece of obviously folk religious writing.
00:38:52.000That feeling of uselessness and self-pity will disappear.
00:39:40.000Like it's just like a phrase, that you feeling of uselessness and self-pity.
00:39:46.000And then this Sandy Beach does this bit beautifully.
00:39:50.000Sandy Beach, like a notorious, famous, I suppose you'd say, within AA circles speaker, died recently.
00:39:57.000He's mostly lived in Tampa, Florida, but he was what's called a circuit speaker.
00:40:01.000I meant that people would fly him in to hear him.
00:40:05.000And he did, with this bit of the promises, I one time heard him on a tape say that note, the language here is very sort of not rational or logical.
00:40:18.000That feeling of uselessness and self-pity will disappear.
00:40:23.000What happened to that feeling of uselessness and self-pity?
00:41:10.000Now, in Scripture, when you hear words like immediately, when I noted this for my little old self, was in the temptations of Christ.
00:41:22.000Like, I think in Luke, like Satan, it says, like, the devil took him in an instant to the top of a high mountain and says, these are the kingdoms of the world.
00:41:31.000And I reckon, and I've not had this verified by a theologian, but I reckon, this is what I reckon about the Bible, is that when it says things like instantly or immediately, it's outside of time.
00:41:45.000It's not saying really, really quickly.
00:41:49.000Because if Christ and the devil are in some sort of deadly game, a cat and mouse, where Christ is using scripture on the devil, as he will later with the Pharisees before his execution, if he's using scripture, which he himself has written, to bat away the devil, God the Son, God the incarnate Son, the man, as he's immediately been immediately, urgently,
00:42:19.000directly after he's been identified as the Son of God, he's tempted.
00:42:43.000Then in the one I like Luke, although there's differences in in different accounts he's offered, I can make you ruler over all the kingdoms of the earth.
00:42:54.000Authority has been given to me and I can give it to ever I want.
00:43:36.000And I like reading Job in conjunction with the passion in particular.
00:43:42.000You get the idea, mate, like, because it describes Job very vividly.
00:43:45.000Like, he's got worms in his skin and he's unrecognizable as a human.
00:43:49.000And when you think of, and I know you Catholics love this, to think of him right bashed up, that our beloved Lord and Savior, like not recognizable as human.
00:43:59.000I think that's what like Job has sort of gone through.
00:44:02.000That you're not, he's not human anymore.
00:44:03.000He's been so debased that he can't even know his own face anymore.
00:44:09.000And anyway, so like in that instant, in that instant of temptation, the reason I think that Golgotha, the sacrifice of Abraham, the sacrifice, potential, the offering of the sacrifice of Isaac by Abraham, the offering of atonement by David and the eventual site of the temple that Solomon, where Solomon builds the temple, are the same place.
00:44:37.000course because all these stories happen in one geographical reason region but i think also to let you know that god is outside of time yeah this is good This is good, Liam.
00:45:22.000You know, the big pharma only advertise on the mainstream media so that the mainstream media don't tell you the truth about their stinking products.
00:47:38.000I really appreciate you allowing me to do stuff like that.
00:47:41.000So my whole life I felt like, oh, you're not allowed to do stuff like that.
00:47:49.000So I think really where you get with the amends process, like you said a minute ago, that it's not about you, it's about them.
00:47:56.000And I am one of those people that sometimes thinks I'm doing this.
00:48:01.000I don't want it to be a I don't want to double down on the selfishness that's caused this mess, but it's not, but what it's about is like, it's not about the other person.
00:48:10.000It's not, meaning it's not about the result, I suppose.
00:48:12.000It's not about everyone that you do a step nine to going, you're a fine fellow.
00:48:29.000It's about so, but where I think it gets to from a scriptural, and I mean, of course, the Gospels, but additionally, the text of AA, is you're being invited to step outside of the bounds of reality as defined not only by you, the alcoholic or the addict, but by the individualistic, materialistic, fallen world at large.
00:49:34.000Like that's different from a transaction.
00:49:37.000And I think where we're being taken when it says fear of people and economic insecurity will leave us, we will suddenly realize that God is doing for us what we could not do for ourselves.
00:52:00.000I understand when people say that it is for you.
00:52:04.000It's so you can hold your head high and that you don't have to fear the past.
00:52:08.000I've faced the past so that I'm all right.
00:52:10.000But I just feel like to be sincere, really, it is about the other person getting an opportunity to heal from the harms that you've caused them.
00:55:03.000It's so beautiful that what else is there to do?
00:55:06.000I was thinking about how, like, in the early days of the 12th step, and I'm actually thinking, not of the early days, I'm thinking of day one.
00:55:14.000You know, like Bob and Bill, the founders of AA, when they embarked upon the, I suppose, still Oxford group oriented process of restitution, I feel like Bob Justa, just Bob and the people that Dr. Bob sponsored, I think it was understood to be saying they'll take half a day in its entirety.
00:55:40.000Like you just go around, I'm never so sorry about that.
00:56:06.000And anyway, they sort of, they like, they know all the names of like, you know, it's like someone will like this big book study and they'll go things like they'll know that.
00:56:15.000That's Bob D and that's L of C so and so on.
00:56:29.000And, you know, like with like I've heard you say, like, you know, they're like with the alcoholic number three there beating up the nurse in the war.
00:57:03.000I heard that Dr. Bob did all of his step nines pretty much straight away because he couldn't stop drinking previous to that.
00:57:09.000He was getting little spells of sobriety.
00:57:11.000But it wasn't until Bill Wilson met and he said, all right, tonight, you know, get on your knees, give your life to God, bang, write your inventory, clear all your resentments.
00:57:21.000Now let's list the people you've harmed and go out and making amends.
00:57:25.000And you've done it all in that night and never drank since.
00:57:28.000I remember you said to me, it was the best thing you said to me, actually, around that time, step nine, was to become the person you wouldn't otherwise be, you need to do the things you wouldn't otherwise do.
00:57:53.000Like if you do things that you wouldn't do, I mean, that's in Romans, our beloved Saint Paul says, you know, what I don't want to do, I do.
00:58:59.000There is no, oh, I go to church and I'll pray and then hopefully I'll get a family and hopefully I'll get some money.
00:59:05.000There is no, I'll stop drinking and taking drugs and then hopefully I'll get a job and da da da.
00:59:09.000No, it's like you get to the point where it's like we got to be, we got to be like willing to live in some sort of cold stone monastery in bliss.
00:59:18.000And sometimes I think that would be bliss.
00:59:20.000Sometimes I think that would be bliss.
00:59:22.000Just tend to the allotment, pray, listen to nature, Bruce, brew up some monks.
00:59:28.000Well, probably be best not doing the brewing.
00:59:30.000I thought immediately set us up with cooking up with special meth that monks make.
01:00:04.000Oh, Heavenly Father, Lord God, thank you for the opportunity to be alive first and foremost and for us to have the principles of recovery laying before us.
01:00:14.000And thank you for the gift of life and thank you for your church and for your son.
01:00:20.000And thanks for the opportunity, Lord, that we may live in your spirit, in harmony with your spirit.
01:00:26.000Lord, help us to align our will with your will and not to lament that our human, worldly, contaminated will can't be fulfilled, for that's impossible.
01:00:37.000Lord, here on this plane, all of our schemes, our petty plans and dreams are nought and doomed to fall forever into naught.
01:00:45.000Help us to stay in you and in your always adjacent, all-powerful glory.