Russell Brand is joined by Russell Brand to discuss the rise of Big Tech in alliance with globalist governments and how this is becoming the dynamic that will control information, data and surveillance, your ability to observe, imbibe and consume potentially dissenting voices, or dissident views, for the next few years, and how there s a raft of laws being ushered through right now in my country, in your country, and across the world that will make free speech and even opposition and free thought basically impossible. It s an incredible story, and a companion piece to our conversation with Dr. Robert Epstein, where he talked about how he s observed and demonstrated the degree of corruption that is demonstrable and the impact it s having on everything from elections to perception itself. Also, Lee Fang is coming on the show to talk about Lockheed Martin and the Ukraine-Russia conflict. Remember, join us on Rumble if you can, and become a member of our community by clicking the red button on your screen now. If you can t get enough Rumble, please do that by becoming an awakened wonder and support us by becoming a patron of the show, by subscribing to Rumble and becoming a member. You re gonna get a whole lot more than you thought you d dived in to on Rumble, and you re gonna love it! Thank you so much for your support, and if it s possible for you can't get enough, please support us, become a supporter of us by following us on RUMBLE. and become an awakened Wonder. by clicking that, too. And if you re-join the RUMBERRUPTER, by becoming ANEWING WON'T-WON'EASILY on Rumble. on your favorite streaming platform, and help us keep up to date with the latest episodes on Rumble and so much more! You can t have it all, you re not just one more awakening wonder . You ve got the chance to be a woke, woke, free, you ve got it, you have to be woke, you can be free, right? ? And you can do it, we re-free, you don t have to have it, can t be that? and it s not just that s gonna have it? And they re free, they re not, they can t just be that, they have it that way, right, right can be it, right ?
00:00:01.000Thank you so much for joining me today for Stay Free with Russell Brand.
00:00:04.000We've got some fantastic things to talk to you about.
00:00:07.000One, the state versus rumble, and curiously, the power of big tech in alliance with globalist governments and how this is becoming the dynamic that's going to control information, data, surveillance, your ability to observe, imbibe, consume potentially dissenting voices or dissident views for the next few years, how there's a raft
00:00:30.000of laws being proposed, being ushered through right now in my country, in your country
00:00:34.000and across the world. They're going to make free speech and even opposition and free
00:00:38.000thought basically impossible. It's an incredible story. You're going to love it. It's a good
00:00:42.000companion piece to our conversation with Dr. Robert Epstein, where he talked about how he's
00:00:46.000observed and demonstrated the degree of corruption that is demonstrable and the impact it's
00:00:52.000having on everything from elections to actually perception itself. Also, Lee Fang's coming on the
00:00:58.000show. Now, in order for us to house these voices, we need your support. If it's possible
00:01:03.000for you to support us by following us on Rumble, please do that. And if you can become an awakened
00:01:07.000wonder and support us directly, That would be incredibly appreciated now more than ever.
00:01:11.000Fang's going to be talking about stuff like a Zimpik and revelations around that obesity drug that's going to stagger you, profits from Lockheed Martin and how they benefit from the ongoing Ukraine-Russia conflict, and indeed free speech itself.
00:01:24.000Remember, join us on Rumble if you can and become a member of our community by clicking the red button on your screen now.
00:01:31.000Do you know what I think we need at the moment more than anything?
00:01:38.000If I could just look at Hillary Clinton rendered in oils, not oil that was gleaned after the Gulf War conflict, paint oils, I think that would really soothe me at a time like this.
00:01:52.000Let me start by thanking Secretary Blinken.
00:01:57.000I am incredibly grateful to you for your leadership, the tremendous job you're doing.
00:02:04.000If we had been in this room in its former much gloomier kind of look... A portrait of Hillary Clinton is guaranteed to lift the ambience of any room unless it's a room sort of somewhere in Syria or anywhere frankly where she's backed illegal wars.
00:02:20.000Anthony Blinken said of this, the walk to the secretary's office on the seventh floor is a little bit awe-inspiring.
00:02:25.000down the wood-panelled mahogany row surrounded by portraits of our predecessors,
00:02:29.000all of them white men, Blinken said before the unveiling.
00:02:33.000A couple of years ago, and talked about an invasion of Ukraine that, instead of driving
00:02:41.000a stake between us and our allies, brought us closer together in order to support the
00:02:48.000right of the Ukrainian people to defend their liberty and freedom and democracy.
00:02:57.000It's funny that Hillary Clinton refers to the dark times as the before-war times, and when she talks about allies and friendships, it's not the Care Bears, it's a bunch of people coming together to get involved in a profitable war.
00:03:07.000What are we going to do now, a picnic?
00:03:09.000Yeah, a picnic's fine, we'll do that after the war though.
00:03:26.000With our allies and our friends, so reinstating a foreign policy that plays to the best of American values.
00:03:34.000What are the American values that benefit in here?
00:03:37.000Profiteering, sustaining an unwinnable war, lying to people, using taxpayer dollars to sustain a war that can't be won, instead of supporting the people of Hawaii in their evident need and suffering.
00:03:49.000Are these the American values that you voted for?
00:03:51.000That puts our Interests and security front and center, but does it in a way that actually brings people to us, not pushes them away, would have been thought to be extremely difficult.
00:04:05.000And indeed it was, but it was accomplished.
00:04:08.000And we have seen the continuation of a lot of the values and priorities that we worked on into the Biden administration and In looking across the globe, defending democracy in Ukraine, expanding NATO.
00:04:28.000Democracy where there are going to be no elections.
00:04:36.000Or we brought it on you by expanding NATO.
00:04:38.000This could not be a happier occasion and thank you so much for hosting us.
00:04:43.000Yeah, it's like we're exchanging a spectacle for reality and any alternative vision is likely to
00:05:00.000be shut down according to legislation that's being ushered through.
00:05:05.000Extraordinary that this is what state's personship looks like now, offering war instead of peace, celebrating alliances that are ultimately dedicated to bringing about death and profit, And presenting it as if it's just a congenial celebratory affair.
00:05:23.000What an extraordinary demonstration of how far from the values of ordinary Americans the values of elites have become.
00:06:21.000We've talked about it as an emergent new drug that's going to conquer, that's conquering new markets, that's extraordinarily profitable, and that has been presented perhaps in ways that are, if not disingenuous, just dishonest.
00:06:36.000Can you tell me what the story you've just broke on Azempic is, please?
00:06:41.000Well, look, first, just to introduce it, you know, these are a new class of drugs.
00:06:45.000These GLP-1 drugs, they kind of imitate a hormone, the GLP hormone that regulates insulin levels in the body.
00:06:57.000They were first approved for diabetes.
00:07:01.000And look, there are many benefits for people struggling with diabetes.
00:07:08.000And this is one of the number one killers.
00:07:12.000But the issue here is that drug makers, Novo Nordisk, is the first big company to come out with a class of these drugs.
00:07:21.000Many other big pharma companies are rushing to bring products to market.
00:07:25.000In addition to regulating insulin and helping diabetics, patients have found that you rapidly lose weight on these drugs.
00:07:36.000So Ozempic, also known as Wigovi, There are others that are coming.
00:07:42.000They have blown up as a weight loss silver bullet.
00:07:46.000And the companies that produce these drugs see a gigantic financial windfall.
00:07:54.000The drugs not as a diabetes drug, that's part of the story, but the big part of the market is treating obesity.
00:08:02.00044% of adult Americans are overweight, something like 100 million people.
00:08:09.000It costs over $10,000 a year to take these injections, these drugs.
00:08:16.000So to seize this financial opportunity to get Americans using Ozempic or Wegovy, what have you, There's a coordinated campaign by Novo Nordisk and other big pharma companies to reshape the public discourse, to plant dozens if not hundreds of media stories talking about, hey, if you're struggling with obesity, if you're struggling with body image issues, you're struggling with obesity stigma issues, if you're concerned about the racial disparities in obesity, you should consider this class of drugs.
00:08:52.000don't feel concerned about asking your doctor for these drugs.
00:08:56.000And in a lot of areas of medicine and in public policy, there are disclosure requirements.
00:09:03.000If you publish a scientific paper, if you air a television advertisement,
00:09:08.000at least in the United States, you have to disclose that,
00:09:10.000hey, this was paid for by a drug company.
00:09:12.000But those types of disclosure requirements don't exist for the media.
00:09:16.000So for the biggest newspapers in the country, for the Washington Post, USA Today,
00:09:20.000for the biggest broadcasters, for CBS News, NBC, and even for small local television outlets
00:09:27.000and local news outlets, we're seeing a flurry of news articles
00:09:32.000quoting physicians, experts, patient advocacy groups, celebrities, community activists, civil rights groups.
00:09:40.000I mean, the list goes on of groups that are encouraging the use of these drugs for weight loss, where I think there are still questions to be answered if this is an effective treatment for most people struggling with obesity.
00:09:52.000But there is this kind of coordinated campaign to get Americans on these drugs for obesity, And there's a lack of disclosure that these experts being quoted that are going to the media, shaping the public discourse around how we see these drugs, how Americans view whether they should take them, whether our insurance companies should provide them, should the government change the law, and should the government be paying for these drugs?
00:10:18.000There's no disclosure that these experts are being paid for by Novo Nordisk and other drug companies that stand to gain from the explosion of this market.
00:10:27.000It's extraordinary how reality could be so carefully cultivated that a story like this, a narrative like this, can be constructed around a product which is plainly being engineered, I don't mean pharmacologically engineered, but I mean as a phenomenon and as a commodity in order to be highly marketable.
00:10:50.000My understanding is that Azempic and the class of drugs require lifelong usage once you embark on them and it seems to me that you're saying that they are known to be effective for diabetes, that there is evidence that they are effective for weight loss but perhaps not sufficient evidence when it comes to potential side effects of long-term usage.
00:11:13.000And in any event, the way that we are being sold the idea of this class of drugs is not objective.
00:11:21.000There are undeclared interests and undeclared financial ties.
00:11:26.000Can you give us some examples of those financial ties, Lee?
00:11:32.000Yeah, just to give you a few examples.
00:11:34.000There are many doctors that are being quoted almost on a daily basis.
00:11:39.000There's a doctor in Texas named Deborah Horn.
00:11:41.000Who's appeared in many different media outlets.
00:11:43.000You can Google her name, look at Google News or what have you.
00:11:48.000I highlight her quotes in a recent CBS News article.
00:11:54.000She discusses the need for insurance companies to start paying for Ozempic and Wigovi.
00:12:02.000She's pretty much the only physician quoted by this news article.
00:12:05.000What's not disclosed is that she has received about a quarter million dollars from Novo Nordisk On the last few years.
00:12:19.000That same news article talks to a think tank, the Urban Institute, and that basically, that the study looks and says, hey, we don't have enough states paying for Ozontic and Wygovia.
00:12:35.000I mean, this is almost like an entire marketing release from Novo Nordisk, but with no But it's framed as news.
00:12:44.000It's only positive about the company, but there are no fingerprints showing that everyone quoted in the story was funded by the company.
00:12:51.000It's extraordinary to note how frequently we find these days that news media is nothing of the sort.
00:12:59.000It's merely the broadcast arm of corporate interests that are in many cases evident, traceable and observable if you're willing to undertake the research or watch for the relevant and ongoing It's not surprising to learn that such a potentially profitable drug is marketed not in a direct, plain way in terms of its utility and efficacy, but through various rather more insidious means i.e.
00:13:29.000It's presented academically and scientifically as beneficial.
00:13:33.000Apparently independent think tanks are offered as giving objective information, which is
00:14:13.000Profit driven motive that just has to pull into its vacuum any necessary information in order to meet those ends.
00:14:20.000It's unlikely that people are going to do studies on long-term impact of a Zempik or what happens if you suddenly stop taking it and don't want to take it anymore because the findings of such clinical trials would potentially be Unprofitable.
00:14:35.000So even, and I feel like we saw some of this in the pandemic period, information that's presented as science is actually a very carefully curated and managed reality that often is sort of the opposite of science, i.e.
00:14:51.000I mean, even the internal studies from Novo Nordisk, these are the company's own studies, show that almost immediately, if patients get off these drugs, the GLP drugs, It's almost instantaneous.
00:15:10.000Just to put this in perspective, Pfizer had one of the most profitable pharmaceutical products of all time in 2021.
00:15:20.000You know, releasing their vaccine, that was something like $80 billion in one-year revenue just from this one product.
00:15:27.000Well, recently, bankers, JP Morgan and other investment banks, put out some estimates for the GLP market for Wegovy, Zempik, and then, you know, there's many other competitors coming out very soon.
00:15:39.000Within the decade, on an annual basis, these drugs will bring in about 70 to 80 billion
00:16:10.000For weight loss, you know, I think the benefits are not clear.
00:16:12.000I mean, we're seeing very serious side effects.
00:16:15.000I mean, very common side effects are the nausea and vomiting and other issues, but very serious, less common side effects are stomach paralysis, people who can't digest their food.
00:16:26.000The food just kind of sits there in their digestive system, not moving.
00:16:30.000There are other effects that, you know, you look at this drug and you say, this is not a panacea for weight loss.
00:16:39.000I mean, there are so many other interventions that many patients need, but for many policy makers,
00:16:45.000for the drug companies and others, this looks like an easy, quick fix
00:16:49.000to just throw money at a problem, to make enormous amounts of profit
00:16:53.000for a small number of companies, and not look at the bigger picture.
00:16:57.000You know, the issues around our food system, the issues around our agricultural policy,
00:17:01.000the issues around the American culture and way of dining and eating, you know,
00:17:06.000These are much more complicated, less lucrative issues to solve, right?
00:17:11.000So it kind of, it does get back to profit.
00:17:13.000Novo Nordisk is one of the most valuable drug companies, one of the most valuable companies in the world right now, just on the back of this one product, which is still taking off.
00:17:23.000I mean, if they win this campaign right now, they're lobbying furiously.
00:17:28.000to allow Medicare, the main kind of health insurance public program for older people in the United States, to cover
00:17:35.000That's over $10,000 a year. That's a lot of potential profit.
00:17:51.000It makes you identify how we have to recognize and analyze unconscious assumptions that, or in any sensible world, remain relatively unconscious.
00:18:04.000What I mean, Lee, is the idea that the motivation behind the pharmacological industry is
00:18:55.000Because if that were the mindset, as you have just said, there would be a soup to nuts,
00:19:00.000forgive the analogy, analysis of the food industry, the way that big food lobbies, the
00:19:06.000type of foods that we eat, the unconsciousness around diet.
00:19:10.000It's far more convenient to have one arm of the corporate state machine fill you food of processed, carcinogenic, diabetes-inducing food than another arm strap you up and lash on a machine that injects you with
00:19:25.000drugs to reduce the fat for as long as you take it forever. What's behind even an enormous
00:19:31.000story like this is almost more alarmingly the idea that the system itself is guided by malign
00:19:37.000principles. I'm fearful of using language like profiteering or some kind of zombie
00:19:46.000capitalism or a monstrous undemocratic, anti-American, anti-human ideology but it seems like the
00:19:54.000only way to describe it, this kind of cart before the horse mentality.
00:19:58.000It exists throughout cultural, social and even geopolitical life because I know elsewhere we have companies such as and specifically Lockheed Martin able to offer a positive outlook for the future of their investors and shareholders based on an assumption that the Ukraine-Russia war will continue.
00:20:21.000Now of course this is another situation that's presented as Humanitarian intervention because there's a criminal war and it has to be resolved.
00:20:28.000The narratives around it are highly censored and edited.
00:20:35.000Can you tell us a little more about Lockheed Martin's relationship to the potential for an ongoing Ukraine-Russia conflict?
00:20:44.000Well, I took a look at some of the recent investor reports and there was a conference hosted by the investment bank Morgan Stanley here in California earlier this month.
00:20:57.000It was a kind of a opportunity for the big companies to make presentations.
00:21:27.000And so, for that very simple reason, at this investor conference in Southern California, recently Lockheed Martin and others discussed the business opportunities presented by the conflict in Ukraine.
00:21:41.000Now, the US is escalating this war incrementally along with its NATO allies in terms of the types of weaponry they are providing.
00:21:49.000Just last week, the Biden administration announced that they're releasing a long range missiles
00:21:55.000produced by Lockheed Martin that are going to carry cluster munitions
00:22:00.000and providing those to Ukrainian forces.
00:22:03.000We've had the steady increase in the types of weaponry that we've provided to Ukraine
00:22:08.000now that we're training F-16 pilots in Arizona and preparing for NATO allies to provide those planes
00:22:46.000stockpile and provide new contract deliveries to Ukraine, and given the escalation, we're seeing more business opportunities.
00:22:53.000I'm paraphrasing here, but they use incredibly explicit language, and I think that this is important to see that there are Many different interest groups shaping public policy and the dynamics around this very complicated conflict between Ukraine and Russia.
00:23:09.000And these businesses have a lot of say in Washington.
00:23:14.000These companies underwrite the politicians.
00:23:17.000They underwrite the biggest think tanks.
00:23:18.000They also have a lot of influence in the media.
00:23:21.000So they're shaping the contours of how we discuss this debate in a very subtle way.
00:23:26.000You know, it's not like the Ozempic issue where you have all these talking head doctors and, you know, obesity activists appearing in the media without disclosing their ties.
00:23:38.000But if you look at the largest think tanks, the largest kind of institutes that advise on national security priorities, that help write As well as the policy being directed, as you say, by lobbying, donations, shared financial interest, there's also the perception of this war.
00:23:50.000funded by the defense lobby, particularly companies that stand to benefit like Lockheed
00:23:56.000As well as the policy being directed, as you say, by lobbying donations, shared financial
00:24:02.000interest, there's also the perception of this war.
00:24:06.000I was struck, Lee, when you said that in very plain language, you can hear in the discourse
00:24:11.000between Lockheed Martin and their investors, the projections, requirements, and agenda
00:24:19.000of that particular financial entity or corporation that, as you say, has only a fiduciary duty
00:24:25.000to its investors rather than any moral obligations.
00:24:27.000The moral obligations are supposed to belong to the government and the media.
00:24:33.000And those moral obligations are fulfilled not through integrity, authenticity and rigorous self-examination and transparency, but instead by a kind of propagandist endeavor that prevents you from ever being able to regard the war as anything other than unprovoked and unjust attack.
00:24:53.000And of course, you know, every time I mention this, so as not to be guilty of lacking nuance myself, I always I don't want to mention that it appears to be a criminal invasion and I'm not like a Putin apologist.
00:25:04.000I'm simply a person trying as best as I can to understand the dynamics behind this war and why it is being sold to us in such a reductive simplistic and unhelpful manner and why people are not talking about peace.
00:25:18.000The media, the dominant mainstream media, the legacy media, call it what you will, appear to be Heavily committed to presenting this conflict in a very simplistic way.
00:25:29.000Photo opportunities that lead to bizarre incidents like a Nazi being applauded in Canadian Parliament.
00:25:36.000The simplification of the history between Ukraine and Russia and some of the factions fighting in the Ukrainian army.
00:25:44.000How do you suppose it is When you say it's not so simple or blunt as the Azempic example, talking heads with clear financial ties, giving you a narrative that's plainly beneficial to their own financial interests.
00:25:59.000How is it that it's so difficult to present alternative stories or even to aggressively inquire as to the origins of this conflict and the potential malign reasons for its perpetuation?
00:26:16.000I mean, that's an extended conversation, but if you look just kind of broadly speaking, you know, almost for any complicated policy issue, you need kind of an interest group. You need, for lack of a better term, a
00:26:31.000lobby. I use that term broadly, whether that's organized citizens or organized business
00:26:35.000groups or what have you, to represent a perspective and to go argue for that perspective to the
00:26:42.000media and to policy makers and make a case.
00:26:44.000In the case of Ukraine-Russia, there's no real interest group that's lobbying for peace, right?
00:26:54.000There's no one that gains financially, really, from peace.
00:26:57.000I mean, perhaps, you know, there are, you know, interrupted grain and trade ties with the war in Ukraine.
00:27:07.000But generally speaking, there's a lot more people making money than there are losing money, especially in the United States.
00:27:16.000And then you not only have the defense contractor lobby that's very influential, But you have kind of the permanent Washington blob of, you know, the military, the intelligence agencies that go on the Sunday talk shows and are quoted headline news talking about the, you know, kind of glorious victories that Ukraine will have in their counter offensive every day in the media.
00:27:40.000This is kind of more of a imperial mindset in the American media that just sees a very black and white, almost Cold War era, conflict with Russia and an opportunity to bleed.
00:27:53.000I mean, this is in their terms and what people like Senator Lindsey Graham
00:27:58.000and others have said, an opportunity to bleed Russia,
00:28:01.000to kill Russian soldiers, to diminish and destroy Russian military assets.
00:28:11.000You know, and just looking at this as an interest group story,
00:28:14.000the blob in DC, the defense lobby has the biggest platform.
00:28:20.000The peace lobby, for lack of a better term, does not.
00:28:24.000And so you really have one side that's taking up all the oxygen, and we don't have a sober-minded discussion of what are the ramifications of escalation?
00:28:35.000What are the incentives for negotiation?
00:28:38.000Who's pushing these leaders to do that?
00:28:40.000At the end of the day, Ukraine is heavily relying on the United States.
00:28:44.000I would love a situation where Ukrainians have full agency and can negotiate on their own, but for many reasons, the United States is in the driving seat right now.
00:28:56.000Ukraine is militarily and financially dependent on the United States.
00:28:59.000The United States has a role in setting any kind of peace negotiations, but we're not seeing that.
00:29:05.000We're not seeing anyone really push for that, and we've seen the few voices on Capitol Hill.
00:29:09.000There was that small effort last year by a number of progressive House Democrats to just write a letter saying Pending to the Biden administration saying, hey, can we please have peace negotiations as an option, not saying we need this or we're going to cut off aid or anything kind of, you know, dramatic.
00:29:28.000And just by drafting that letter, someone leaked the draft.
00:29:32.000You know, people went apoplectic and the lawmakers who are even drafting that letter apologized for even considering that as an option.
00:29:39.000So, you know, we just have a very one sided debate right now in Washington.
00:29:42.000Yeah, it's terrifying and becoming more terrifying.
00:29:56.000Like even the possibility that it could be discussed or that there could be an opposing argument anywhere in Congress or the Senate was sort of closed down.
00:30:07.000Also watching Hillary Clinton with Jen Psaki able to Sort of blithely reiterate points about Putin's election interference, Putin as a authoritarian dictator, their imperialist goals and you could sort of just watch live facts being denied, lies being told, simplification being offered as news and they just sort of nodded together as if what was being reached was
00:30:44.000We're sort of living, it seems to me, perhaps at a pivotal moment because of some of the laws that are being passed like the online safety bill in the UK, but I know there are sort of comparable laws throughout the world that are going to grant governments the power to essentially shut down dissent as always under the auspices of safety and the kind of reasonable censure that most people would anticipate around hatred and pornography involving minors.
00:31:08.000But Actually, it seems that with the vast power of Google now, we spoke to someone very interesting the other day, Dr Robert Epstein, who told us about the ability of Google to manipulate information and sway elections, and his studies were pretty, I would say, persuasive, and he's certainly someone who I'll be talking to more.
00:31:30.000I wonder, What you feel with perhaps, I guess, one of the emblematic stories that demonstrates this ability of the media to manage, control and manipulate information is that remains the Hunter Biden laptop story.
00:31:44.000The way that his role at Burisma has been reported on.
00:31:48.000Can you tell us a little more about that, Lee, and what it says about media reporting in particular?
00:31:56.000Well, you know, this story that I wrote recently, it's complicated because there are a couple dynamics here.
00:32:04.000One is just the traditional way that the elites, powerful people in the media and in politics and business spin the press every day.
00:32:14.000I mean, there's just a cottage industry of crisis PR firms and, you know, fancy consultants that help spin lies and make sure that
00:32:24.000reporters never kind of get the truth when they're asking tough questions. And then there's this
00:32:28.000kind of algorithmic, deep state, I suppose, censorship that we've seen also in this story
00:32:34.000where, because of partisanship, because of power, you know, there's been efforts to push
00:32:40.000the story out of public view and kind of falsely claim that it's an example of Russian disinformation.
00:32:46.000I know this is something that you've covered a lot, especially the Hunter Biden New York
00:32:52.000But you know, what's interesting to me for the Hunter Biden laptop...
00:32:57.000You know, I took a look at the emails recently and I've been writing some stories around it.
00:33:02.000I think this is true for both Republican and Democrat and other elites, but we just have this special portal, this window to see the kind of sausage making and the inside.
00:33:11.000So I've been doing a couple of these stories, looking at the Biden laptop emails and looking at how Hunter Biden for 10 years managed his public image in ways that I think all the elites do.
00:33:22.000We just have a special window into Hunter Biden.
00:33:24.000So in fairness to him, I think this is true for many elites.
00:33:28.000But he was hiring special consultants to airbrush his Wikipedia, to airbrush the Wikipedias of his foreign business partners in Ukraine.
00:33:38.000and these are very expensive, $4,000, $5,000 a month firms that they use fake accounts,
00:33:45.000a whole network of fake accounts that go in and edit the negative stories out and add all
00:33:53.000Hunter Biden's charity work and all the awards into those pieces.
00:33:58.000And, you know, also working with these consultants when he was dealing with stories, with questions from the press, when the New York Times, when Time Magazine, you know, the biggest outlets, Wall Street Journal, were asking questions when he was hired to this Ukrainian company, you know, this Ukrainian company that was under investigation that was kind of notoriously corrupt.
00:34:17.000Had hired him in 2014 at a time when the US was working with Ukraine and promising anti-corruption reforms, when Joe Biden was the liaison from the Biden administration to work with Ukraine to institute ethics reform.
00:34:33.000His son was hired by one of the most notorious oligarchs.
00:34:36.000I mean, this was a kind of obvious story.
00:34:43.000I've had my own personal blog writing about Hunter Biden.
00:34:45.000It was refreshing to see my own stories being circulated in his emails back in 2014, because I was looking at these conflicts of interest.
00:34:52.000A lot of people were asking these questions, and even back then, you can see the emails where Hunter Biden was spinning these reporters saying, you know, this is, and he was using his spokesperson, you know, he was saying, you know, these, this board thought, you know, the compensation level is completely normal.
00:35:10.000It's what every company kind of provides a typical board member.
00:35:44.000because of their corruption issues, helping them kind of dislodge a prosecution in Ukraine and kind of work on various kind of lobby efforts to influence the U.S.
00:35:56.000And that brings me to the other thing, you know, a lot of Reporters very reasonably asked, are you lobbying?
00:36:12.000And that answer was reprinted in all the biggest media outlets in the US.
00:36:16.000But the emails show that again, this was plainly not true.
00:36:19.000They were setting up meetings with John Kerry, who at the time was heading the State Department.
00:36:25.000John Kerry's staff, I should say, with his top deputies, you know, it's kind of ironic when you look at some of these email threads with Hunter Biden, you know, they're talking about how to respond to the New York Times.
00:36:38.000And the New York Times said, you know, are you working with any lobbyists?
00:36:41.000And the person who helped coordinate the response to the New York Times was one of the lobbyists they just hired the previous month.
00:36:49.000And they said, of course, no, we're not.
00:36:51.000So, you know, again, I don't want to Unfairly beat up on Hunter Biden, because I think this dynamic exists for the elites across the board, Democrats and Republicans.
00:37:00.000But we have this window into his emails, and it just really shows the spin cycle, how reporters respond every day, how the elites shape both social media and mainstream media, and it's very difficult to get the truth.
00:37:13.000Do you think that this is an issue that's sufficient to destabilize Biden's presidency?
00:37:20.000And I ask that really only to demonstrate that we appear to be living in a deeply fragmented world.
00:37:27.000It's been commonly said really since the advent of immersive social media that we live in silos and that there are numerous cultural fissures.
00:37:35.000But now it appears that I can't envisage a 2024 election where whoever is victorious
00:37:43.000is hailed by both sides as the noble and righteous winner.
00:37:48.000I can't really see how this kind of sentiment of deep hatred now towards legacy media, towards
00:37:56.000the government, this total lack of trust in almost every institution that people fund
00:38:03.000through their tax dollars or pounds or whatever the relevant currency is.
00:38:06.000I can't see now how this can be sustained, other than unless there is going to be an
00:38:13.000attempt to centralise and control information to such a degree that to be a dissident becomes
00:38:22.000I wonder what you feel about this fragmenting space?
00:38:25.000I wonder what you feel about your own role as a journalist that, based on what I know of your work and you as a man, are committed to telling the truth when telling the truth is a difficult thing and allowing people the dignity and honour of determining for themselves what to do based on the facts that are available.
00:38:43.000How do you feel that this space is going to evolve?
00:38:46.000How difficult do you feel it's going to be to be an independent media voice in this evolving space?
00:38:52.000Do you have any sense that we're approaching anything like an endgame based even just on the various rafts of legislation that are being globally passed?
00:39:01.000I mean, I feel conflicted, to be honest with you, because I see multiple perspectives, and I have my own personal role as someone who works in independent media, but I'm also, you know, I'm a citizen, I'm an American, I want good things for the public interest, I want good laws passed, and shared prosperity, whatever, you know?
00:39:23.000Because we can't just have a completely fractured dissident media.
00:39:29.000We need high quality newspapers that shine a light on corruption and tell you what's going on on a day-to-day basis.
00:39:37.000In addition to that, we do need an outside voice questioning the media and questioning power.
00:39:45.000How do we maintain a balance is very difficult because if you look at the major mainstream institutions of the media, they've lost credibility.
00:39:54.000They've shifted to a subscriber model desperate for revenue.
00:40:00.000Because they've lost so much revenue to Facebook and Google that they're captured by their subscribers.
00:40:07.000They don't have enough reporters and editors.
00:40:09.000So when you're a powerful public relations firm or corporation or powerful government official, it's very easy to go to a newspaper that doesn't have a lot of fact-checkers and a lot of adversarial reporters and spoon-feed the media to give them a prepackaged news story And, you know, they're under budget and overworked and they say, OK, this looks like a scoop and they basically republish it.
00:40:32.000Um, and they're under increasing pressure from government agencies to censor, to say that, hey, look, if you publish, you know, the wrong narrative or the wrong person, um, that's a form of disinformation or hate speech or what have you.
00:40:44.000And, you know, that's going to lead to, you know, you being shadow banned on the social networks on Google and the internet platforms and Facebook, that means less advertising dollars and they're already being pinched.
00:40:56.000Um, you know, that's not a great dynamic either, because how are you going to have an open society and public debate now for independent media?
00:41:29.000While we need an independent press, a dissident media to constantly criticize and shape institutions and to provide more relevant news to our viewers and to our readers, that's not a sustainable business model either.
00:41:43.000I wish I had the resources to provide all my news articles for free.
00:41:48.000I have a paywall on most of my my content because I need to make a living and pay rent.
00:41:54.000But it's, again, not a sustainable business model for just people like me or you to be an independent press.
00:42:00.000We need kind of a broad public interest that informs everyone.
00:42:04.000And how to shape that isn't clear, especially in the age of the internet.
00:42:07.000No, man, you made me feel like it's a very complex issue, indeed, but also that your personal integrity
00:42:16.000and the possibility that the support of integrity like you demonstrate could create new pathways,
00:42:23.000could create accountability, and could amplify the voices that I believe desperately need amplifying.
00:42:29.000Lee, thank you so much for joining us today.
00:42:32.000It's always a great pleasure to speak to you and to see you.
00:42:57.000Of course, she's married to Julian Assange, and she's an activist whose very life is consumed Well, actually she's a mother, so her whole life can't be consumed by it, but primarily she's trying to campaign for Julian Assange's freedom for publishing information that was unfavourable to the state, and you all know the condition that Julian is in now.
00:43:16.000From our conversation with Glenn Greenwald, it seems that there's been some evolution, blessedly, in that story, and that the Australian government Mostly because of activism among their citizenry are demanding some justice for Julian Assange.
00:43:27.000So we'll be talking about that in particular with Stella.
00:43:29.000Now, if you want to support us and you know now how important it is, please become an Awakened Wonder if it's within your means.
00:43:35.000If it's not, please stay with us and enjoy this content for free.
00:43:38.000It's much more important that we have you than we have your resources.
00:43:41.000But as this situation evolves and develops, surely we shall need both ultimately, because we are committed to building something here.
00:43:48.000We are committed to going beyond independent media and into an independent movement for true freedom, for truth, integrity and freedom.
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00:44:00.000I'm sure the situation will evolve and we will certainly do our very best to provide you with as much as we can and I'd like to welcome Our new members Uncle Tony, BadMonkey61, LaLaKetchup, HumptyDumpty and JediFish, all now reveling in the glory of the Awakened Wonder movement.
00:44:16.000Please join us tomorrow, not for more of the same, that'll be no good, not after a day like today, but for more of the different.