Paul Saladino MD is a carnivore. He's written books about being carnivores, and he convinced me to go from vegan all the way to carnivore - it's brilliant. In this episode of Stay Free With Russell Brand, we talk about the science behind why we should all eat meat again, and why it's good for us.
00:00:35.000It's a fantastic conversation that covers the kind of holiness that comes to mind when you hear the intricate beauty of the way that the human body works right down to the subcellular level and what I would have to describe as a kind of demonic evil in institutionalized food production.
00:02:03.000Well, I'll tell you the science and then I want to hear more about how you feel because I remember seeing you in DC and you told me in January of this year that you'd start eating meat again.
00:02:17.000Humans throughout our history have always treasured meat.
00:02:20.000You look at any group of hunter-gatherers on the planet now and they treasure meat.
00:02:25.000It's at the top of their sort of hierarchy of foods they want to eat and they eat animals from nose to tail.
00:02:31.000And so on the first podcast that we did, we talked a little bit about these nutrients in meat, but there are so many unique nutrients in animal foods, whether you're eating chicken or beef or fish or whatever, that just don't occur in plants.
00:02:45.000Plants are great, but a lot of nutrients don't occur in plants or they don't occur in any appreciable quantities in plants.
00:02:51.000So when you are not eating meat as a vegan, which is, you know, that's you're right.
00:02:59.000It's very, very hard to get these nutrients that are central to human thriving, right?
00:03:05.000And I listed them out last time and I'll give you a sense of them again.
00:03:08.000Things are things like creatine, which gets a lot of press today, but whether things like carnitine or anserine or taurine, all of these nutrients, they're critical.
00:03:19.000No, I'm really focused because in a sense, what's fascinating is this is a time where people are reluctant to make essential or universal claims, i.e., well, at the chemical level, a man is a man, a woman is a woman.
00:03:34.000And I suppose, like, as we discussed previously, I was a vegetarian from the age of 14 because I love Morrissey and I love the Smiths and someone showed me footage of abattoirs and the way that animals are treated, which I thought was appalling then and I think is appalling now.
00:03:52.000And I suppose there's been a spike of documentaries, even within the last five years, that sort of made the claim that you don't need meat.
00:04:02.000And it's actually, oh, your arteries and cholesterol.
00:04:06.000But what I can tell you empirically is since like, you know, what I always felt when I was a vegan is I like the fucking, excuse my language, taste of meat.
00:04:14.000So I was always eating, like, I was a sucker for all that beyond stuff, which I now kind of would regard as a sort of a globalist imperialist consumer like scam.
00:04:23.000Like, you know, I liked all that fake meat.
00:04:26.000Even earlier versions, like Linda McCartney, God rest her eternal soul.
00:04:29.000I was always chomping down on a Linda McCartney sausage, the late wife of the great Beatle Paul McCartney.
00:04:34.000They had a brand of vegetarian sausages.
00:04:36.000Then when I went from vegetarian to vegan, Paul, it's like, oh my word, I can't eat anything.
00:04:41.000I was making these bizarre concoctions to get like some sort of paste that had meatiness to it.
00:04:46.000It's like I was trying to synthesize it the whole time.
00:04:49.000Now, I still have the kind of moral quandaries, but I suppose that's sort of separate from diet.
00:04:54.000But and in a way, what is morally and ethically suggested is that you should be eating meat that is reared locally and killed respectfully.
00:05:04.000Even though death is always terrible and there's something brutal about, you know, death, life eats death.
00:05:28.000It's a true story, I believe, is he was apprenticed to this Apache Indian gentleman who sort of gave him Native American philosophy, ways of life, and hunting.
00:05:37.000And he told this Native American elder told Tom Brown something that in order for something to live, something else must die.
00:05:44.000And so this ethical quandary around eating meat, I think is, I think that we have it because we are removed from nature.
00:05:53.000If you and I were in a tribe in the jungle here in Costa Rica or in the forest of, you know, the northern United States where Native Americans were, wherever, we would not have an ethical qualm about eating meat.
00:06:04.000What we would do is we would hunt it respectfully.
00:06:07.000And because we hunted it, we would eat it from nose to tail.
00:06:29.000You go to the grocery store, you have a disembodied steak, and we've lost, dare I say, the spirituality of eating meat.
00:06:36.000It was part of, it was, I mean, perhaps it may sound overblown, but it's sacramental in some ways.
00:06:43.000And the nutrients in meat, like I said earlier, are so unique for humans that when you go from not eating meat to eating meat, you have a step function change in the way that you think, the way that your energy is, your libido, your vitality.
00:06:56.000And the other thing I would mention here is that I think that as much as humans have an ethical imperative to re sort of re-participate in that cycle of life and understand and respect the nutrients that these animals give us and to live accordingly, I think that as humans, and I think this, you know, this is very, this is sort of a Christian perspective.
00:07:19.000Like our purpose is also to do the most good in the world.
00:07:23.000And so how do you do the most good in the world?
00:07:25.000How are you the best conduit for the ideas that you believe need to go into the world?
00:07:39.000We don't know each other that well personally yet, but I'm very intentional about the way that I live my life across all aspects because I sort of see so many aspects of my life as sacred and I want to I want to protect this vessel.
00:07:54.000You know, like I'm trying to be a good vessel for something bigger than me, for something in the world, and to put ideas into the world that help people.
00:08:06.000And so there is this other ethical side of it that, hey, if you are a more lit up human, if you are a more energetic, clear thinking human, you're doing good in the world.
00:08:14.000That's what, that's really, I think, a very high purpose for these animals in your life.
00:08:19.000They're nourishing you and you're putting it back into the world.
00:08:22.000And one day you will die and go back to the earth too.
00:08:26.000And I think your early remark that we are detached from nature is an important one, that we've been decoupled from a deep reality that we have to live in harmony with because of recent deep education into how systems of control operate.
00:08:45.000I know that whether it's the choice that was made to use blue light instead of red light behind these screens or any number of nutritional choices, I know that what you talk about, a kind of nutritional state of subjugation, is what's required by the systems that seem to emulate, seek to emulate and counterfeit the divine power that you're describing is not an accident, but deliberate.
00:09:12.000It's deliberate that you eat food that makes you tired and bloated and ineffective.
00:09:17.000It's deliberate that you stare at screens that hypnotize you and dumb you down.
00:09:22.000That certain chemicals are to be found in the water sources.
00:09:25.000You can see that while looking at your bright face that you're a person that's coursing with creatine and nutrition and collagen.
00:09:34.000And for all I know, methylene blue and tallow.
00:09:40.000Not methylene blue, but the other ones, yes.
00:09:42.000Tell me why I know methylene blue, Paul.
00:09:51.000You know, I think that it's a very sinister reality that we're living in if there are powers that be that are actually trying to subjugate us and make us dumber.
00:10:13.000I think that nourished humans are likely to be free thinking humans.
00:10:19.000And free thinking humans are a little more difficult to control than tired and, you know, humans that are just fatigued.
00:10:27.000And they're, yeah, I mean, that humans that are thinking clearly are going to question the system.
00:10:32.000So there's a very sinister potential reality there.
00:10:36.000As far as the methylene blue conversation goes, so methylene blue is a complex molecule that actually moves electrons down the electron transport chain in the mitochondria.
00:10:47.000So I don't want to get too technical here, but the way that we make energy as humans is we harvest electrons from the food that we eat.
00:10:54.000We pass those electrons through a transport chain in the inner mitochondrial membrane of every cell of our body, except the red blood cells.
00:11:02.000And at the end of that mitochondrial electron transport chain, those electrons end up in water.
00:11:08.000And that electromotive force, so passing the electrons down the chain creates a gradient of hydrogen, basically protons, hydrogen ions.
00:11:17.000And then moving down the concentration gradient creates ATP.
00:11:20.000So there's a little nanomotor inside your mitochondria.
00:11:23.000And the hydrogen, the protons moving back down their concentration gradient creates ATP.
00:11:29.000It's a really exquisitely elegant system.
00:11:31.000But the movement of electrons between all of those complexes and they're numbered is how we create an electromotive force to move protons and to create a concentration gradient.
00:11:42.000Now, methylene blue will move the electron down the electron transport chain, which is a good thing if you have a blockage in your electron transport chain.
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00:14:34.000I enjoyed very much your description of the elegance of the mitochondrial system and the complexity of electron manipulation and conveyance.
00:14:44.000And whenever I hear something articulated by someone who understands it, I feel the approximate awe of a heavenly creator.
00:14:54.000I think such complexity could not occur as a result of randomized events, even over billions of years.
00:15:02.000Elsewise, why would we regard patterns with such wonder, whether in mathematics, which by the way, why would it exist if there was no intelligence, and music and symmetry and art, the hallmark and presence of God is evident in all God's creation.
00:15:17.000And I am just in awe of the wonder of that.
00:15:20.000And thank you for explaining it so beautifully and clearly.
00:15:23.000Now, when you said that about the potential impact and like that methylene blue might make you feel better, but it might not necessarily be doing it in a way that's ultimately beneficial.
00:15:35.000It reminded me of once someone telling me that what caffeine is doing is kind of stretching you and creating a sort of a stimulated state that you're going to pay a price for down the line.
00:15:47.000I mean, in the Buddhists say, borrowing from your future self.
00:15:51.000Do you think it belongs in that kind of category?
00:16:50.000So when I was in, when I was in my medical training, I used caffeine some and I would get like heart palpitations, heart fluttering, and I stopped it many years ago.
00:17:03.000So there are a few things about caffeine.
00:17:04.000The first is to know that the half-life of caffeine is five to six hours.
00:17:09.000So the caffeine that you're drinking now, Russell, will not be even, it will perhaps be half metabolized by the time you go to sleep in 10 hours, depending when you go to sleep.
00:17:20.000I mean, it's, you know, it's probably three or four o'clock wherever you are.
00:17:24.000You know, if you go to sleep in eight hours at midnight, the caffeine you're drinking now is not even half metabolized.
00:17:42.000It's just how our bodies are telling us you are awake.
00:17:44.000We have this wake-sleep cycling and while we're sleeping, our brains are regenerating in some ways.
00:17:50.000We have this incredible network of lymphatic drainage in the brain called the lymphatic system that pulls waste products out of our brain.
00:17:57.000And so it's important that we know when we are sleepy.
00:17:59.000Caffeine is masking that, but your brain is still sleepy under the surface.
00:18:04.000And so if you're drinking caffeine at eight in the morning, by the time you go to sleep, you may have a quarter of that caffeine in your system, which can still disrupt sleep architecture.
00:18:13.000Drinking caffeine at three or four in the afternoon is a little bit more of a dangerous proposition in terms of sleep architecture.
00:18:18.000So that's just the first thing to consider about caffeine.
00:18:21.000There was a recent study that I saw that talked about in sleep deprivation, which is a time when a lot of people use caffeine.
00:18:30.000If you don't give someone caffeine, there are changes in the gray matter in the brain, right?
00:18:34.000So you have white matter and gray matter in the brain.
00:18:36.000And there are certain regions of the brain where the gray matter sort of expands when you are sleep deprived.
00:18:41.000It's just probably the brain trying to heal itself and push back against the damage that sleep deprivation is doing to your brain.
00:18:50.000So the concern here is that if you're using caffeine to ameliorate your sensation of a sleep deprived state, you could be preventing your brain from doing the necessary healing that it's trying to do when you are sleep deprived because caffeine is blunting the expansion of gray matter in certain parts of the brain when you are sleep deprived.
00:19:10.000So it's a very powerful substance for humans that I think has been used throughout history for good and bad.
00:19:18.000I mean, I think I'm no history buff, but I think a lot of amazing, beautiful art and things have happened throughout history because of caffeine and coffee.
00:19:26.000And so great, fantastic, and other compounds related to caffeine, methyl xanthines that occur in chocolate and things like this.
00:19:32.000It can certainly put humans into ecstatic states or creative states, but we just need to be very honest with ourselves about what it might be doing to our brains long term if we use it for sleep deprivation or if we're using it too close to sleep, it could be causing issues.
00:19:45.000The last thing I'll say is that the coffee that a lot of people drink caffeine and not necessarily tea, but the coffee can be moldy, right?
00:19:52.000So you want to find a coffee that's mold-free, pesticide-free.
00:19:55.000You got to be careful with the vessel through which you're drinking the caffeine.
00:20:01.000When people hear me talk, they just say, oh, you ruin everything for me.
00:20:04.000There are certain tea bags that are made from plastic.
00:20:07.000So if you're using a caffeinated tea, please do not use a tea bag made from plastic because those are known to release millions or sometimes an order of magnitude greater than that billions of microplastics into your water.
00:20:19.000So putting plastic into hot or boiling water is the worst thing we could do for microplastics.
00:20:24.000And so there are all sorts of considerations around caffeine that I just, thanks for letting me share that.
00:20:29.000But when we have this like level of individual diligence that you are blessedly offering us the opportunity to be that aware of, well, are you sure that this, do you want to eat this tea back?
00:20:42.000You know, I like, I can imagine that if I spent, and I'm going to actually, maybe like, you know, I'm going to say if I spent an hour listening to you or a week listening to you, and I know there's far too much knowledge in you for you to get across in one podcast, but I suppose really I've sort of changed my agenda in the course of just the first 20 minutes to I'm going to need to maximally benefit from this time that I have with Paul.
00:21:03.000Because I remember you saying before, like, even if you only ate McDonald's meat, that's better than not eating meat at all.
00:21:10.000That's one of the things that kind of struck me about our last interaction.
00:21:15.000What I would say, I'd like to learn now is like, you know, I do like, say, I've got a boy, my little boy, he's two.
00:21:34.000Like, anyway, my little boy comes up to me and my wife don't like him to have chocolate, but he knows what chocolate is now.
00:21:40.000And so, you know, the genie's out of the bottle.
00:21:42.000I'm letting him have, like, I'm giving him like bits of this Tony's chocolate, which I feel like is kind of branding itself as, this is good for you, chocolate.
00:21:49.000If I knew everything that you know about chocolate, would I give my son with a heart condition?
00:21:58.000Would I give him like, would I give him chocolate or not?
00:22:01.000What time was it that you were giving him chocolate?
00:22:03.000Was it early in the day or late in the day?
00:22:05.000It was like, oh, gosh, I'm sorry to say that it might have been, it was 8 p.m.
00:22:13.000Late in the day is tough for kids because like I mentioned, chocolate does have these methyl xanthines, which are the same compounds, similar compounds to caffeine.
00:22:23.000So it can affect his sleep, which is then going to affect your sleep if he's not sleeping well.
00:22:33.000There definitely are studies suggesting that chocolate has compounds, flavonoids, that could be beneficial at a vascular health level at the endothelium in your blood vessels.
00:22:46.000Most chocolate is packaged with processed sugar, which is a little tricky, right?
00:22:50.000We can pretty confidently say that a processed sugar sucrose is not a great thing for humans.
00:22:56.000I think the Tony's chocolate, all these chocolates have sucrose.
00:23:00.000If you really wanted to make chocolate the healthiest way you could, you could get a 100% dark chocolate and combine it with something like honey.
00:23:10.000And I think there's a really interesting divergence between the outcomes in humans and the way that natural sugars like honey and fruit affect us versus a processed sugar like a sucrose or a table sugar.
00:23:23.000And so if you took a dark chocolate and you combine it with honey, I would argue that's better for humans than it is than like a processed sugar containing chocolate.
00:23:34.000The other considerations with chocolate are that chocolate can be fairly high in heavy metals.
00:23:42.000And we're talking about things like lead, mercury, and arsenic and cadmium, cadmium especially in chocolate.
00:23:47.000But if you eat a lot of chocolate, it's just meaning check your heavy metals because the seeds of plants, and chocolate is made from plant cacao seeds that are roasted, the seeds of plants do tend to concentrate heavy metals.
00:23:59.000And again, I don't mean to be a killjoy.
00:24:02.000I'm just, I'm equipping people as much as I can with the tools to make their own sovereign decisions in their life.
00:24:09.000So if you're eating a chocolate, just check that it is tested for heavy metals and these kind of things also.
00:24:15.000And potentially be aware that the sucrose in there, the processed sugar in the chocolate is not great, but there's an easy way to fix that, which is you take 100% dark chocolate and you combine it with honey.
00:24:26.000And I can speak about that if you'd like.
00:24:27.000But there are ways to make it better and there are some considerations with chocolate as well.
00:24:32.000You know, even though I know it's sort of like partly shtick, I am actually getting angry with you because you're one by one like removing so many of the sort of you're demolishing the architecture of my comfort with your every announcement.
00:24:54.000So like you've already, you were a significant factor.
00:24:57.000You and bear grills were probably the most significant influences in me deciding to start eating meat.
00:25:04.000And it was kind of concomitant with my coming to Christ as well.
00:25:08.000So, you know, I'm so quite actually interestingly having listened to the earlier part of the conversation when you've talked about the sacraments and sanctity with the idea of the flesh and the blood and the blood of Christ, that there is some kind of spiritual correlative to this incontrovertibility, not incontrovertibly, but somehow inextricably.
00:25:36.000I know there's probably microplastics in this.
00:25:39.000If at an individual level, we're like being polluted, even if you're someone like me who's economically advantaged, albeit autodidactically educated, like what chance have we got?
00:25:53.000And I mean this in a Maha context, I guess it was a DC event where we encountered each other briefly other than our interview there.
00:26:01.000Like what should be the role of make America healthy again?
00:26:05.000What should be the role of government in facing up to big food, big agriculture, and I guess big pharma as well, of course.
00:26:15.000But like if we lived like just you explaining to me as an individual, well, this is what you should feed your children.
00:26:20.000I'm immediately thinking, don't give your children anything other than organic whole food.
00:26:25.000And we've thankfully got a really good water filter in our house already for even the shower water and the drinking water.
00:26:31.000Probably there's got to be some supplementation.
00:26:34.000If that's what, you know, you can do that as an individual and we can do that as a family.
00:26:38.000But what does that tell us our culture where what's been normalized is junk food and food dyes and preservatives and pesticides in the food chain.
00:26:51.000Aren't we like ultimately poisoning and toxifying ourselves beyond an industrial level, almost at a universal level?
00:27:34.000Or foods with labels that your great grandmother would recognize everything on the label.
00:27:39.000That's that's sort of just my working framework for food for humans.
00:27:43.000If you do that, and you know, based on our previous part of the conversation, this is important to share with your audience.
00:27:47.000Like, I'm not trying to take away things from people or make it impossible.
00:27:51.000So the food for humans framework is quite broad, but I want people to understand this.
00:27:55.000I strongly believe, and this is something that I am so passionate about at this moment in my life and my career.
00:28:00.000And I think this is in line with the Maha movement.
00:28:03.000The Western medical system will not tell you this, but I believe that if you eat food for humans, you can correct or reverse the majority of chronic illness that we suffer from as humans today.
00:28:16.000I mean, I'm writing a book about this now, and I want to get that message out there because as a traditionally trained medical doctor, I have an MD that was never taught to me in medical school, that so many of the chronic health conditions that we suffer from from autoimmune conditions like multiple sclerosis, type 1 diabetes, chogrens, autoimmune thyroid conditions.
00:28:40.000Chronic illnesses like obesity, diabetes, atherosclerosis.
00:28:44.000So many of these conditions that we suffer from chronically as humans are fixable if we just eat food for humans.
00:28:50.000And so this is wild to me that the Western medical system is not doing this.
00:28:54.000And I think this is exactly the intersection of the government and Maha in this problem is that, hey, look, if you're making it okay, or you're not at least telling people, hey, if you eat food that is not for humans, which is this, you know, this myriad of ultra-processed foods, you are going to be sick.
00:29:13.000I think we've been trying, I think that in some ways the calories model has been quite misleading for people.
00:29:19.000We've thought, oh, as long as I just don't eat too many calories, I'm going to be okay.
00:29:24.000No, you cannot out-exercise the toxins and the sort of artificial, confusing ingredients and compounds in an Oreo simply by doing the amount of exercise that burns off the calories in an Oreo.
00:29:37.000These things get stuck in our cells and our membranes.
00:29:39.000They affect our gut flora, which is the problem with sucrose, processed sugar.
00:29:42.000It affects your gut flora in a negative way.
00:29:44.000So we need, I want people to understand that, hey, you can, if you, you have the right as an American to go to Dunkin' Donuts and to and to eat a donut, right?
00:29:56.000But if you, you simply cannot just exercise to burn off those 200 calories.
00:30:03.000All those toxins are negatively affecting your cells and your body in a way that has amplified effects long term, or at least reverberating effects long term.
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00:31:27.000There's actually good data with doses of two to three grams of colostrum per day in terms of gut health, immune health.
00:31:33.000Yeah, colostrum is the first milk from cows.
00:31:36.000And usually when they're collecting colostrum, I mean, they always leave enough for the calves.
00:31:39.000It's just, it's interesting that across species, the immunoglobulins and colostrum are beneficial for humans, probably for the gut and recovery in general.
00:32:02.000There's been a lot of buzz about creatine recently.
00:32:04.000Doses from five to 20 grams a day have been studied to find benefit.
00:32:07.000Five grams a day of creatine is beneficial probably for muscle strength, recovery, explosivity.
00:32:14.00010 grams a day has been studied for osteoporosis in women.
00:32:18.000So I think about this from my mom, who's 75 years old.
00:32:21.000So if you have someone in your life who has bone density issues, you might go up a little bit, eight or 10 grams of creatine a day.
00:32:27.00020 grams of creatine is a mega dose that I wouldn't do every day, but there is some evidence that in the setting of sleep deprivation, 20 grams of creatine might push more creatine across the blood-brain barrier and help with cognition.
00:32:38.000Now, I mentioned creatine earlier in the podcast.
00:32:41.000What's cool about this is that creatine is something that only occurs in animal foods.
00:32:46.000But in order for you to get five grams of creatine a day, you'd have to eat probably two pounds of meat per day.
00:32:52.000Most of us are not eating two pounds of meat per day.
00:32:54.000So it's a valuable compound that is made by the body, but supplementation appears to be very beneficial for humans and it's incredibly safe.
00:33:02.000There's really no evidence that it has any issues with the kidneys or anything.
00:33:06.000Because I was a bit worried about my kidneys.
00:33:08.000I went to have a test to see whether or not I should get supplemented testosterone and it came back that I had a word that sounds a bit like creatine, but isn't creatine.
00:33:49.000Join us over there for the rest of this conversation with that frankly handsome and vascular man.
00:33:54.000So one of the breakdown products of creatine is creatinine, but creatinine is not harmful to the body itself.
00:33:59.000Creatinine is a compound that we use to estimate your glomerular filtration rate.
00:34:06.000So in kidney disease, people's creatinine will go up.
00:34:09.000Creatinine is a breakdown product from the muscles, from the creatine in the muscles.
00:34:13.000But creatinine is just a marker for kidney function.
00:34:16.000So if you're eating more meat, if you have more muscles or you are taking more creatine, your creatinine will go up, but that doesn't mean you have any issues with your kidneys.
00:34:24.000Your doctor needs to get a separate test.
00:34:26.000It's called a cystatin C, which doesn't, it's not affected by creatine at all.
00:34:30.000So creatine will falsely elevate creatinine.
00:34:33.000Creatinine is not harmful for you, but because we use creatinine levels to estimate your glomerular filtration rate, the glomeruli are these little, these little apper, these little cellular organelles, you know, macrocellular organelles in the kidney where you filter your blood and it turns into urine.
00:34:49.000But the amount of sort of plasma that the glomeruli in your kidneys can filter is how we estimate how well your kidneys are functioning.
00:34:58.000And creatinine can cause confusion there, but it's not harmful.
00:35:46.000This is called like the peroxide index of an oil.
00:35:50.000And so, seed oils, one of the reasons seed oils are problematic is that they're highly polyunsaturated.
00:35:56.000And polyunsaturated fats per se are not bad for humans in the right amounts.
00:36:00.000Historically, I don't think humans have eaten a lot of polyunsaturated fats.
00:36:05.000If you look at hunter-gatherer tribes like the Chimine of Bolivia or other tribes, they get maybe, you know, a very, very small amount of their calories from polyunsaturated fats, one, two, three percent.
00:36:16.000Because we are swimming in seed oils, almost literally today, we're getting 10 to 15 percent of our calories from soybean oil, canola oil.
00:36:24.000They're in salad dressings, they're in bread, they're in cookies, they're in cakes, they're in their, you know, McDonald's fries are fried in a mixture of four different seed oils, canola and soybean, and all these things.
00:36:34.000When we're getting that many polyunsaturated fats into our bodies, we have to work, our body has to work really hard to keep these fats from oxidizing because of all the unsaturation points, which are double bonds in the molecules.
00:36:47.000So, it gets a little technical here, but fats are long chains of carbons.
00:36:51.000And at one end, it's a carboxylic acid.
00:36:53.000But the long chain of carbons, if there's a double bond between two of those carbons, it's called an unsaturation.
00:36:59.000A double bond between two of the carbons makes the molecule kinked and it makes it more susceptible to oxidation, which is a loss of electrons.
00:37:06.000This is just to say that polyunsaturated fats are more fragile, and saturated fats are more robust.
00:37:12.000And so, what have humans eaten throughout all of our history?
00:37:15.000A pretty significant amount of saturated fat.
00:38:14.000There's a crazy study, I'll just say this and then I'll pause, where they actually looked at seed oils in the fryers of restaurants that made french fries.
00:38:22.000And when you heat a seed oil, whether it's corn or canola or soybean, they break down into molecules that are found in cigarettes.
00:38:31.000One of these molecules is called acrolein.
00:38:33.000These are known carcinogens, they're aldehydes.
00:38:36.000And the amount of these carcinogenic compounds found in a large serving of french fries was equivalent to smoking 20 cigarettes.
00:38:46.000So, people lose their mind when I say this and they misquote me and say, you know, I'm saying seed oils are worse than cigarettes.
00:38:52.000But if you are eating French fries cooked in seed oils, which most of the U.S. population is, you are essentially getting an equivalent dose of smoking a pack of cigarettes of many of these carcinogenic compounds.
00:39:05.000This is the problem with heating seed oils.
00:39:13.000In a minute, I want to ask you how much we'll get away with, but I just want to run through the rest of my brand because I'm never going to get the opportunity for this consultation with you again.
00:39:20.000Well, I will, I hope I will, but I want to take this one.
00:39:23.000So these are tallow balms for the face.
00:39:26.000This one's a nighttime one with lavender essential oils, and this is morning with vanilla and citrus.
00:39:33.000Is there any evidence to suggest it's good for the skin?
00:39:36.000Is that a good idea for us to use these?
00:39:46.000There's a lot of anecdotal evidence now for people putting tallow on your face.
00:39:50.000The idea here is interesting to me because if you, I mean, you know, if you live in a place that's that has humidity, you can tell that your skin is hydrated and it has oils in it.
00:40:01.000And the cell membranes of your cells are made from essentially oils or derivatives of oils.
00:40:06.000So when you put an oil onto your skin, those oils become incorporated into the epidermis.
00:40:11.000And the concern here is that if you're putting things on your face that are full of these polyunsaturated fats, is that affecting the epidermal skin, the cell membranes, and making those membranes more fragile?
00:41:27.000This is not, you know, when you make tallow, you just heat beef fat and there it is.
00:41:31.000When you make olive oil, you press olives.
00:41:34.000The same way that when you were talking earlier about the complexity of the mitochondria, I felt the presence of God in the evident ingenuity.
00:41:42.000Indeed, what is ingenuity other than the felt presence of some divine power that seems to supersede even the upper echelons of our great gift reason?
00:41:52.000I feel when I hear you describing seed oils, like the presence of actual evil, because I don't think that even if Procter ⁇ Gamble with that first early seed oil, even if it was just blunt profit at the beginning of it, once we know these are like, you know this, why is Paul Saladino not working for the UK government or the US government?
00:42:15.000Why is this information not being implemented at the level of policy?
00:42:20.000The answer, obviously, is profitability, but perhaps it's something even darker than that.
00:42:26.000They say wisdom is acting on knowledge.
00:42:29.000Once you know that seed oils have a carcinogenic component, why would you not immediately say, right, well, we better stop that?
00:42:37.000And then you only have to look at the way that they behaved around Johnson ⁇ Johnson baby powder, the way that they behaved around Purdue and the opioid crisis, what seems to be the obfuscation of truth around the pandemic era and the issue of various vaccines.
00:42:53.000Paul, can I ask you what seems in this crazy climate to be, I suppose, a personal question.
00:44:35.000And so the thing about vaccinations is that the more that I learn about the history of illness and the potential negative downsides of vaccinations, the more concerned I am about vaccinating, the more concerned I am about giving my children vaccinations.
00:44:55.000I think that there is a lot there for me to learn increasingly.
00:45:00.000And I think that there are people who know much more about this than I do.
00:45:13.000I think that anytime that people are not allowed to talk about side effects from medications or vaccinations, there's something sinister going on beneath the surface.
00:45:26.000Why is it that during COVID and during even now, anyone that talks about vaccine-related side effects or negative consequences is immediately silenced and derided.
00:45:43.000So there's a lot to question about these for humans.
00:45:47.000And I think that no matter what we decide about vaccinations for our families, we should be very clear about the fact that there do appear to be some children that are harmed negatively by vaccinations.
00:45:59.000And I think we need to try and understand how we know which children those might be, how we treat them in those situations.
00:46:05.000And we need to give presence to those voices in society and say, why are these, you know, why are these voices being silenced?
00:46:11.000Like if a mother really thinks that their child was harmed by a vaccination, we need to learn about that and try and understand if there's something about that child's history or physiology or physiognomy that is making them more susceptible to these things.
00:46:25.000I think that there are many children that receive vaccinations that don't appear to have any negative consequences.
00:46:30.000But how tragic is it when a child is vaccinated and that could cause a negative thing for the child?
00:46:35.000So there's, it's a very, I think it's a more complex road to navigate than it's made out to be.
00:46:41.000Yes, I think you're quite right about that.
00:46:43.000This book, Forbidden Facts by Gavin DeBecker, is an extraordinary series of beautifully, beautifully rendered accounts of, among other things, the way that the Institute of Medicines has been used to verify a variety of harmful commodities and chemicals, starting with Agent Orange and maybe going all the way up to the COVID vaccine.
00:47:08.000And what Gavin DeBeker has done rather brilliantly as an author is provide all of his working out access through QR codes to all of the studies that he's using.
00:47:18.000And also, when it comes to the manufacture of vaccines, which you alluded to your own studies of the inception and development of, he points out how many extraordinary chemicals, aluminium, mercury, and a variety of other sort of Macbeth, well, you know, Macbeth-like sort of substances that have been, I'm an actor still at heart, deployed, excuse me, peculiar chemicals and concoctions that have found their way into vaccines.
00:47:46.000And yeah, the very fact that there's so much heat around it, Paul, indicates something's going on, doesn't it?
00:48:05.000On the personal level, then, because I want to make sure that I don't leave this conversation without the full benefit of your excellence, when it comes to me and my wife and my three children, whole foods, organ, whole foods, organic, minimum amount of chemical intervention is what you would suggest.
00:48:30.000And if that's true, and I know that it is, I know, I know, can see actually just from looking at you, one, that you're extremely healthy, and two, that you're telling the truth.
00:48:39.000If that's true, what does that sort of suggest?
00:48:42.000Doesn't it sort of suggest that we are sort of designed to be in total harmony with nature and that our attempts to counterfeit, manipulate, control, synthesize are, if not demonic, because it's such a loaded word, certainly bad for us and maybe bad beyond that, that once we have this knowledge base, that we don't act on it.
00:49:13.000I would say eat food for humans, you know, and like we said, you know, that's single ingredient foods, foods with labels your great grandmother would recognize, eat food for humans.
00:49:21.000And that's, that's really, that's the first step, but that's a huge step.
00:49:40.000And I mean, I, you know, I didn't see your abs when you were a vegan or vegetarian, but like, this is amazing.
00:49:45.000And I just want people to understand that so much of what we are suffering from as humans is fixable by simply going back to eating food for humans.
00:49:54.000So eating like humans and living like a human.
00:49:56.000Which, and, you know, living like a human is more obvious, but we could, you know, mention like go outside, get sunlight in your eyes, you know, be careful of, you know, your screens and touch the earth with your bare feet every once in a while and play with your children outdoors.
00:50:08.000Live like a human, have community, but then eat like a human.
00:51:25.000Like I've been told by you and other friends in medicine, you spend very little time in your medical training focusing on food because the medical profession has been captured by pharmacology, it seems, and industrialized aspects of medicine for reasons that are plain, profitability and perhaps something beyond that.
00:51:41.000I'm getting right back on the creatine.
00:51:45.000I want to touch before I get, I would love to touch on methylene blue once more.
00:51:49.000Like when I heard about SSRIs and how ineffective they were and how potentially dangerous they were and for how long SSRIs and various other antidepressants dominated the marketplace and was prescribed, it makes me wonder about what you said about methylene blue, which, by the way, I'm bringing up again because I have some of those in my brand.
00:52:07.000What it makes me think is that I'm probably one of those people that you say would potentially benefit from it even with even when you account for its complexity, Paul.
00:52:21.000Because, you know, I don't know how to best describe it.
00:52:26.000I've had a lot of problems with addiction.
00:52:27.000I've had a lot of problems with mental health most of my life.
00:52:31.000Listening to you, I feel like, oh my God, if my mum hadn't been feeding me on Finders Krispy pancakes and burgers, frozen foods, the food that everyone ate where I grew up and the food we were all told that we were supposed to eat when I grew up, you know, then maybe it would be different.
00:52:44.000But in the same way that when you were talking about veganism then, I sort of thought that there probably should be a priest class of like almost Jain people that, you know, wouldn't literally wouldn't hurt a fly or a flea and don't eat meat because it's their religion.
00:52:58.000I can see why some people would be that devout in a kind of Greta Thunberg way, like someone that's just super devout and really believes in what they believe in.
00:53:21.000I said to the people making my brand, I need electrolytes.
00:53:24.000But like, yeah, like that's what it's like.
00:53:27.000Do you think that it's possible that people say with addiction issues or people that are marginal, what do you think is the difference when it, because we've talked a lot about nutrition and observable anatomical health.
00:53:38.000Now, I know mental health is obviously a subset of overall health because it's all in the body.
00:53:43.000All these systems are obviously holistic and interconnected.
00:53:47.000But I wonder what you feel, like people that have had addiction issues and mental health issues.
00:53:52.000Do you think there's a dietary or supplementary component that needs to be specifically addressed?
00:54:16.000And there definitely are people who have, let's just say, like impaired mitochondrial cellular respiration for whom methylene blue can be helpful.
00:54:25.000I just think it's important to understand the mechanism.
00:54:28.000And so, yeah, these things are possible at the cellular level and it's very individual.
00:54:33.000That's another thing that's a piece of this.
00:54:35.000And this is humbling for me because I've sort of changed my mind about this over the years.
00:54:39.000Like, I don't think there's any one size fits all formula for people other than just eat food for humans, right?
00:54:45.000Like love your family, be outside, do something that makes you feel awe and just eat food for humans.
00:54:53.000But otherwise, there are definitely individual differences between humans.
00:54:57.000What works for me may not work for you and vice versa.
00:54:59.000So there is some sort of a process, which is a beautiful thing of every human going through this individual hero's journey to understand what your body needs to be most optimally healthy at a cellular level.
00:55:11.000I can't believe the success of your books, the Carnivore Code and the Carnivore Code Cookbook.
00:55:16.000And now, what is your latest book and what are you tackling?
00:55:20.000How are you going to change society now?
00:55:21.000You've turned me from a vegan to a carnivore with your meddling.
00:55:25.000Now, where are you dragging us next, Saladino?
00:55:30.000So, you mentioned it earlier in the podcast.
00:55:32.000There are too many propaganda vegan documentaries.
00:55:38.000It's going to be out next year, probably in the summer.
00:55:42.000And it's a documentary about eating food for humans.
00:55:45.000And I, you know, it's a documentary about how returning to what we've always known as humans, how remembering where we've come from can really heal us.
00:56:02.000And I just, I'm excited about those things because there is a need, I think, for humans to just have some sort of guidance there.
00:56:09.000And I want more people to understand that their medical issues are fixable with simple means, you know, not with pharmaceuticals, but by just returning to real food.
00:56:18.000More specifically, here at home in Costa Rica, I just bought a sort of run-down hotel on the beach and I'm going to renovate it.
00:56:28.000And I'm going to make it into what I think will be the most based hotel in the world.
00:56:33.000We're going to have red lights and sauna cold plunge, a pool with no chlorine, ozone.
00:56:38.000We're going to serve grass-fed meat and raw milk.
00:57:12.000I didn't buy like a freaking, you know, four seasons, but I bought a small space for people to come together and just be united around shared values on the beach here in Dominicao, Costa Rica.
00:57:37.000I do an animal-based gathering every year, which isn't really a retreat as much as it is just a community building thing here in Costa Rica.
00:57:56.000But I do sort of like a retreat type thing every year in Costa Rica.
00:58:00.000I think I want to do them quarterly at the hotel, but I also just want to have a space where people can just arrive and you're you, the chances that you're going to meet people that have shared values around living a certain way and prioritizing health, community, nutrient-dense foods and probably other values of living, getting out of the matrix, non-digital, you know, life.
00:58:24.000That's exciting to me because I think that that would be cool to me.
00:58:27.000You know, if I knew there were somewhere in the world, whether it's Costa Rica or Sweden or wherever, that I could go and there's going to be people that are just there that have shared values, that's amazing.
00:58:37.000You know, meeting new people is so valuable for humans.
00:58:41.000I'd like to do a retreat for our whole organization at your hotel when it opens and cover.
00:58:46.000Because for me, that's like I spend all my time, like when I'm traveling or touring, I'm like, I want to be able to have saunas.
00:58:51.000I want to be able to have cold plunges.
00:58:54.000And it's nice when you find yourself in an environment where these kind of synthesized versions are not required, where you can't just get in cold water because it's cold or you can be outside because it's warm or whatever it is.
00:59:05.000But I've got to say that since I got cleaned from drugs, since I've come to our Lord, like these things are, these kind of obsessions, it almost shows me what the addiction was if it had been correctly directed.
00:59:25.000Like if you have a lot of spirit and you live in environments where it's like, oh, probably you should just watch porn and eat chocolate, then you're going to eat chocolate and watch porn in a very kind of capacious and enthusiastic manner.
00:59:39.000Really, if we're directed towards health and vitality, then we will flourish and thrive.
00:59:44.000So thank you, Paul Saladino, for taking responsibility for that, for en masse and reaching so many people, changing so many lives, including my own.
01:00:22.000You know, I grew up Catholic and I certainly appreciate beauty, you know, and I think that's the first step.
01:00:32.000I don't think that I've completely gone away from Christianity.
01:00:36.000I tend to be more of just church's nature, but I definitely believe in something bigger than me.
01:00:43.000You know, when I'm out in the ocean, I'm in the jungle and in these places, I hope you do come to Dominical and I can show you the river below my house and these ocean and the waves that I surf in.
01:02:46.000I tell you, you're going to make even more.
01:02:48.000I know you've made an incredible impact and had incredible success already.
01:02:51.000I know that you righteously understand it to be something that's kind of flowing through you, but I'm very, very interested in seeing what future success you have and what else you do.
01:04:06.000I'll just tell you this, guys, because we don't even, the hotel is so new.
01:04:09.000I don't even have a website, but it's going to be called Humano, like human in Spanish.
01:04:14.000So the hotel is going to be called Humano.
01:04:17.000So if you just search Humano, Dominicao, Costa Rica, eventually we will have a website and people will be able to come in a few months once we get it renovated.