The Anchormen Show with Matt Gaetz - Episode 76 LIVE： Ban TikTok (feat. Gavin Wax) – Firebrand with Matt Gaetz

00:00:01.000 The embattled Congressman Matt Gaetz.

00:00:03.000 Matt Gaetz was one of the very few members in the entire Congress

00:00:06.000 who bothered to stand up against permanent Washington on behalf of his constituents.

00:00:10.000 Matt Gaetz right now, he's a problem for the Democratic Party.

00:00:13.000 He could cause a lot of hiccups in passing the clause.

00:00:16.000 So we're going to keep running those stories to keep hurting him.

00:00:20.000 If you stand for the flag and kneel in prayer,

00:00:23.000 if you want to build America up and not burn her to the ground,

00:00:26.000 then welcome, my fellow patriots.

00:00:29.000 You are in the right place.

00:00:31.000 This is the movement for you.

00:00:33.000 You ever watch this guy on television?

00:00:35.000 It's like a machine. Matt Gaetz.

00:00:38.000 I'm a canceled man in some corners of the internet.

00:00:41.000 Many days I'm a marked man in Congress, a wanted man by the deep state.

00:00:46.000 They aren't really coming for me.

00:00:48.000 They're coming for you.

00:00:50.000 I'm just in the way.

00:00:54.000 A colleague of mine said this in a committee hearing a few weeks ago.

00:00:58.000 Mr. Gaetz.

00:01:00.000 He said, when is the FBI going to quit interfering with elections?

00:01:03.000 2016.

00:01:04.000 They spied on President Trump's campaign.

00:01:06.000 2018.

00:01:07.000 It was the Mueller investigation.

00:01:08.000 2020.

00:01:09.000 They suppressed information about the Hunter Biden story.

00:01:11.000 2022.

00:01:12.000 They raided the president's home.

00:01:13.000 91 days before the election.

00:01:14.000 Maybe it'd be nice if the FBI, the Justice Department just stayed out of it and let

00:01:19.000 we the people decide who we think should represent us, who we think should lead us.

00:01:23.000 That's supposed to be how America works.

00:01:25.000 So this is the focus on the Judiciary Committee, the political nature of the Justice Department,

00:01:29.000 and the linkage now to what was happening with the Hunter Biden story.

00:01:33.000 Again, just 15 days before we have a presidential election.

00:01:40.000 We are live here on the Firebrand podcast broadcasting from the Longworth House office building in Washington, D.C. in the Capitol complex.

00:01:49.000 And that was Jim Jordan talking about the hunted becoming the hunters.

00:01:56.000 That's right.

00:01:57.000 We're going to go after a politicized Department of Justice and FBI. 0.93

00:02:00.000 And the best evidence that they are infected by politics is how they treated the Hunter Biden matter.

00:02:07.000 This will not be an investigation merely of Hunter Biden.

00:02:10.000 It will be an investigation of Joe Biden, how Joe Biden was financially enriched, how Joe Biden used his role as an international power player to sell out America's interests for foreign interests,

00:02:23.000 and how Joe Biden himself was actively involved in the cover up of these matters through his government and through some of the worst actors at the FBI and the DOJ.

00:02:34.000 That's a preview of coming attractions.

00:02:35.000 I'm sure we'll have Jim Jordan on soon to discuss it.

00:02:38.000 We've got big news, though.

00:02:41.000 We've got one of the leading voices in the FCC talking about the need to ban TikTok.

00:02:48.000 The threat to our country from the Chinese Communist Party manifested through an app that is widely used in almost every American home that has the capability to get facial recognition, 0.97

00:03:01.000 to get audio voice recognition, and to compromise our youth.

00:03:06.000 Now, joining us, I can't imagine a better person than New York's Gavin Wax.

00:03:10.000 Gavin Wax is the president of the New York Young Republican Club.

00:03:13.000 He is also in the technology field working at Getter, where we are simulcast streaming right now.

00:03:20.000 Gavin, thanks so much for joining Firebrand.

00:03:22.000 I want to get to TikTok.

00:03:23.000 I want to get to the Chinese Communist Party, how you see the big tech environment in the United States now.

00:03:29.000 But first, I have to ask you about the Empire State.

00:03:32.000 All over the country, you saw Republicans underperform, but yet in Florida and in New York, Republicans did better.

00:03:41.000 And I want to get a sense from you.

00:03:43.000 Was it the candidates?

00:03:45.000 Was it the issue matrix?

00:03:47.000 Wasn't the political environment somehow different?

00:03:49.000 What was so different about New York this last election cycle that resulted in your great state sending us a whole lot more Republicans to the Congress?

00:03:58.000 Well, thank you for having me on, Congressman.

00:04:00.000 It's great to be here.

00:04:01.000 And as far as New York is concerned, the Empire State, I think we can attribute a ton of our success politically and electorally here simply to the environment.

00:04:10.000 The environment for a Republican Renaissance and resurgence in this state has never been better in decades, generations even.

00:04:17.000 When you look at issues like crime, quality of life, the list goes on.

00:04:23.000 Things have really hit rock bottom here, and I think it's presented a very fertile ground for a resurgent GOP to take advantage of that to win a series of congressional, state Senate, assembly races, and, of course, come within five points statewide of the gubernatorial race.

00:04:39.000 So hopefully we can build off of this coalition, these trends, these realignment, these realigning factors here in New York and turn that into a potentially governing majority in years to come.

00:04:51.000 It wasn't too long ago we had control of the state Senate as recently as twenty eighteen.

00:04:56.000 So we can certainly bring some two party, you know, sensibilities, if you want to use if we can use that word back to the Empire State, because I think many New Yorkers of all stripes, moderates, liberals, lifelong Dems even are getting really sick of the monopoly Democrat rule up in Albany.

00:05:14.000 And they're looking for some two party consensus building on a range of issues, as mentioned earlier, from crime to cost of living, et cetera.

00:05:22.000 When you look at some of these new Republicans that will be joining us in the next Congress, people like Nick Langworthy, George Santos, Mr. Lawler, is crime going to really be the take home for them?

00:05:36.680 Is the eroding safety and security situation in New York what really drove a realignment in politics?

00:05:43.560 Because we saw really entire groups that had previously been reliable voting blocks for Democrats.

00:05:50.180 They were up for grabs and Republicans got a lot of those votes.

00:05:53.260 So is it is it crime first or how are some of these economic issues also hitting these New York districts where financial services issues, the flow of capital inflation?

00:06:04.100 I mean, these are very much kitchen table issues still.

00:06:06.600 Absolutely. I mean, look, all politics is local, as the old saying goes.

00:06:11.380 And there were certainly a litany of issues on the table here in New York that created new coalitions and certainly a realigned many voting groups.

00:06:19.600 And, yes, there was many ethnic realignments going on in New York from Asian American voters to Hispanic Americans to Jewish Americans.

00:06:26.920 All of these different blocks of votes that were historically within the Democrat camp were shifting over to Republicans.

00:06:34.920 And the reasons varied.

00:06:36.440 And I do think, you know, while many of these newly elected members of Congress that you cited are going to D.C.

00:06:42.980 and going to represent their constituents on a variety of different issues that go well beyond crime.

00:06:48.100 I do think what made New York unique and different in terms of its political environment for many other states where we did not see a red wave, a red tsunami or even red at all, despite the fact that many of these states have been historically more competitive.

00:07:04.620 You're looking at Pennsylvania, Michigan, et cetera, places that, you know, were won statewide by Trump as recently as 2016.

00:07:11.300 New York outperformed them in terms of our competitiveness and in terms of the success of our Republican candidates, again, because the the the on the ground situation, which is unique to New York in many ways, is very bad.

00:07:25.460 I think, you know, we have seen since the covid crisis that the state of the state have continued to decline the the the the the decline that we were witnessing prior to covid was only exacerbated.

00:07:39.640 And this goes into economic issues.

00:07:41.480 As you mentioned, we're having tons of financial sector jobs going down to your home state in Florida, in Miami in particular.

00:07:48.520 So we're losing jobs.

00:07:49.960 We're losing people.

00:07:51.320 Criminals are running free and the situation only continues to get worse.

00:07:55.080 And I think that's why we almost saw a surprise win for Lee Zeldin back on Tuesday, November 8th.

00:08:01.620 And hopefully we'll continue to see wins going into next cycle, 2024 here in New York.

00:08:07.520 And I do think with the delegation we are sending to D.C., they're going to do their state proud.

00:08:12.520 And we're going to have a lot of great champions of the Empire State down in Washington to serve with you.

00:08:16.960 We love it when patriotic New Yorkers choose to make Florida their forever home.

00:08:22.820 But I've got to tell you, America is a better place when the Big Apple is a dynamic, iconic city.

00:08:30.740 And I've traveled there a number of times, had the great privilege to speak to the members of your club.

00:08:36.300 And it astonishes me to see how quickly New York could change.

00:08:41.360 I mean, you and I had to go grab, I don't even know if the statute of limitations has passed on this, but you and I had to go grab dinner somewhere during the pandemic.

00:08:48.240 And it felt like we were doing a drug deal.

00:08:50.340 We had to go down into a basement and bring only cash and look nobody in the eye.

00:08:54.700 And all we wanted was some good ravioli.

00:08:57.320 And then I did see a rebound after things started to open up.

00:09:02.020 There was a new energy there.

00:09:04.360 But that criminal activity, the feeling that you're not safe on the subway, walking down the street, standing at your bodega, it's really overwhelming.

00:09:14.420 And as much as I appreciate the migration of great people and great capital to the Sunshine State, I want the Empire State to be a leading icon of America.

00:09:24.160 I just think it's a great thing when New York is a great city and there's still a lot of great folks who live there.

00:09:28.920 Gavin, you're the president of the New York Young Republican Club.

00:09:31.940 And I want to get into some of the areas where we underperformed.

00:09:35.700 We overperformed with New Yorkers, but we underperformed with Gen Z. 0.99

00:09:41.060 And I wanted to get your perspective on why Republicans are doing so bad with people under 30.

00:09:48.460 Well, look, I think we're in an uphill fight.

00:09:50.640 All the institutions are working against us, particularly institutions that shape and mold young minds.

00:09:57.500 You know, you're talking about higher education.

00:09:59.560 You're talking about pop culture.

00:10:01.220 You're talking even about corporate America, where many young professionals get their first start in their careers.

00:10:06.820 All of these institutions are working against conservatism and the Republican Party, and it just makes the situation even worse for us.

00:10:15.800 And we've always had a disparity in terms of the age bracket, you know, division between the parties.

00:10:21.180 You know, typically the older you get, the more Republican and conservative you are and the younger you are, the more liberal and Democratic.

00:10:26.580 But it's never been a worse situation than we're facing right now.

00:10:31.180 And I think, you know, this is an issue that's going to continue until Republicans can present a holistic vision to the next generation, to the younger generations about the future.

00:10:41.100 And how their prosperity, their well-being are being robbed from them by globalism, by a lot of the neoliberal institutions that dominate the Western world and how their quality of life, their standard of living, the wealth and prosperity that they are going to enjoy is going to be less than that of their parents for the first time in modern American history, for sure.

00:11:04.080 So unless we can begin to properly convey and articulate those problems and also obviously offer a whole range of solutions to them, you know, putting forward ideas and policy proposals that will enable young people to start businesses, to own their own homes, to start families, all the things that, say, the boomers took for granted, but which is now being denied mainly for economic reasons to Gen Z and millennials.

00:11:30.060 Is there a malaise setting in from that, Gavin?

00:11:33.600 Because what I worry about is you have a Gen Z that is more willing to live with their parents well into their years of majority.

00:11:44.240 And, you know, when I was a young person, I couldn't wait to go and find the world on my own, be my own man, have my job, have my own source of income.

00:11:56.240 And increasingly we do see in Gen Z, you know, maybe an acceptance that life's just going to be worse and going to be different. 0.96

00:12:04.500 I mean, we see the suicide rates, we see the drug addiction rates.

00:12:07.980 How do you go from malaise to, like, patriotic activity on behalf of a country that Gen Z is going to inherit? 0.51

00:12:16.060 Well, this is certainly beyond political, it's spiritual, it's cultural.

00:12:20.640 I mean, the left has certainly imported European style living at home with your parents to your mid-30s to the United States.

00:12:27.840 They always wanted to be like Europe, and we've sure gotten it that way. 1.00

00:12:30.500 But you also bring up, you know, how this, you know, is impacted by, you know, the use of different antidepressants and our highly medicated, you know, society.

00:12:40.440 And it's just, it is certainly inducing a societal malaise, particularly on young people who are the most disadvantaged, who have issues rising the corporate ladder because there's a lot of boomers who refuse to retire and are clinging on to their institutions. 0.54

00:12:54.640 I mean, look no further than, you know, the leadership of the Democrat Party, the Republican Party.

00:13:00.120 You know, it's dominated by the old, certainly not the young firebrands such as Matt Gaetz.

00:13:04.220 And I think this just plays society-wide, and I do think this malaise is setting in, and I think there's a sense of, you know, conformity that's going with it.

00:13:12.160 But I do think deep down people realize that they want more, and they're looking for more.

00:13:16.840 And until the Republicans can give alternatives, we're going to continue to lose.

00:13:21.100 I mean, give credit to the Democrats where credit is due.

00:13:23.900 They're cynical, but they'll come out prior to the election and say, we're going to pay off, you know, your student debt.

00:13:28.280 I mean, it was an interesting, crazy proposal, but it certainly got people to the polls.

00:13:32.400 And it got them to vote for them, and of course, they pulled it right after.

00:13:35.280 Yeah, I mean, I think that it successfully bought some votes, that they went and put that shiny lure out regarding student debt.

00:13:44.040 But the reality is, that is just a burden shift to a lot of working people in our country.

00:13:49.600 And frankly, we've got too many people going to college.

00:13:51.720 I know that's not always a popular view, but we have indebted an entire generation of people with philosophy degrees and psychology degrees,

00:13:59.740 and I'm probably part of the problem, political science degrees, the degree that I have.

00:14:04.960 Part of that malaise is facilitated by an addiction to big tech.

00:14:10.060 And I really wanted you on the program today to talk about the threat of TikTok.

00:14:14.600 Big news, we're seeing voices out of the FCC talking about the danger of TikTok, its utilization by the Chinese Communist Party. 0.96

00:14:22.660 Now, I know you work in the technology field.

00:14:25.480 What's your assessment of the role that TikTok is currently playing in American life and American politics?

00:14:31.600 TikTok is a behemoth.

00:14:33.200 It is the biggest name in social media.

00:14:36.000 Facebook is, you know, struggling and declining.

00:14:39.020 Twitter obviously has all its issues.

00:14:40.880 Instagram is a close second, mostly because they are replicating TikTok with their version of Instagram Reels.

00:14:48.940 But TikTok is the new big dog on campus, and it just so happens to be a company completely beholden to the Chinese Communist Party out of Beijing.

00:14:58.260 And this obviously poses a major, major national security risk.

00:15:02.180 I mean, TikTok is unique in how addictive it is and how personalized it is, how it caters to you based on, you know,

00:15:10.000 all the data that it collects from your interests to what you're searching, to how you're liking, to how long you're watching.

00:15:16.160 I mean, the data that they are gathering from American citizens is massive.

00:15:20.960 And in the wrong hands, like in the hands of the CCP, it could be used for extremely effective intelligence gathering and other types of intelligence operations.

00:15:30.020 I mean, they can see what's pasted, what's saved in your clipboard.

00:15:33.940 They can gather your biometric data.

00:15:35.800 They could gather your location data, your facial recognition.

00:15:38.160 I mean, all this data is now in the hands of the Chinese Communist Party out of Beijing,

00:15:44.300 and they can potentially have that data on elected officials, their staff, military personnel, you name it.

00:15:50.500 Now, look, we have a lot of issues in big tech, and many of it are from companies that are incorporated and founded and based in the United States.

00:15:58.460 So it's certainly not an issue that stops at our national borders, but we can certainly step up to the plate here and reach a consensus

00:16:06.260 where I think there may be some consensus to be formed across parties that TikTok is an issue from a national security standpoint.

00:16:13.980 I also agree it's an issue from a deeper cultural and psychological standpoint.

00:16:18.780 I definitely think it's perpetuating a lot of the societal rot that we're seeing among younger generations in the country as a whole.

00:16:25.200 It's addictive, probably the most addictive of the social media platforms, and I say that with experience.

00:16:31.540 I've used it. It's certainly very addictive.

00:16:33.280 Oh, are you still on TikTok, Gavin Wax? Are you a current TikToker?

00:16:38.060 I don't post TikToks. I think I have an account still, but I'm trying to use Getter's Visions, which is a competitor, and, of course, Instagram Reels.

00:16:46.580 But I could admit from my past use that I've taken a few hits of TikTok.

00:16:52.000 There you go, a recovering TikToker. 0.92

00:16:53.720 Sure. You know, it's maybe easy for people to understand, okay, if you work at a national research laboratory or a university

00:17:01.680 or in the United States Congress, that having TikTok could be a threat.

00:17:05.700 But if you're just a regular family, a fireman and a teacher in Branson, Missouri,

00:17:11.400 and, gosh, you know, the TikTok machine has your kids, you know, doing some harmless dances

00:17:16.260 and looking at what their friends are up to, like, why should it worry just regular Americans, you think?

00:17:22.000 Well, I think twofold.

00:17:24.000 I think, one, the amount of data that they're building up en masse, it's going to give them the information necessary to manipulate society.

00:17:32.820 I mean, we're in a new type of warfare.

00:17:35.960 It's certainly, you know, there's no guns or artillery being fired,

00:17:39.460 but people are in the midst of psychological warfare and demoralization campaigns and how, you know, people are socially engineered en masse.

00:17:48.980 We saw it with COVID and the Chinese are becoming experts at it. 1.00

00:17:52.720 They're experts at it on their own population.

00:17:54.380 And the data that they're getting from TikTok will enable them to become masters of social engineering,

00:17:59.580 the American people, if we don't stop them. 0.98

00:18:01.540 So we should not, you know, cede ground in any possible way to them for them to, you know, advance their geopolitical interests against our own.

00:18:10.880 And, you know, they're doing this, you know, beyond just big tech.

00:18:13.600 I mean, they're buying property up across the entire country.

00:18:16.380 You know, they're taking over entire nation's telecom through their 5G networks and Huawei.

00:18:21.780 So, I mean, they are playing a multifaceted game here.

00:18:26.840 They're playing on a multi-front war in terms of their global dominance from the Silk Road to their investments in Africa, etc.

00:18:33.820 So TikTok is just one of those fronts and we certainly shouldn't cede ground.

00:18:37.900 So that's the geopolitical front.

00:18:39.200 But again, you know, for the average American, I think this goes beyond politics.

00:18:43.840 And this is what goes back to winning over younger voters and younger people.

00:18:48.060 It's that we are in the midst of a spiritual and cultural war.

00:18:51.060 And I think social media is perpetuating the worst, you know, facets of leftism and this nihilism and all these other social and societal ills that are really destroying the core fabric of our society.

00:19:05.080 And this is not an electoral issue, but this is something deeper.

00:19:08.040 And I think, you know, social media at large, it's a new development, obviously, in the human story, you know, only, what, 20 years old, if that.

00:19:16.200 But it certainly led to a radical change in how people interact with each other, how people engage with society, how people feel about themselves and see others.

00:19:24.060 And it's leading to a litany of, you know, social and psychological ills that we're not fully able to grasp just yet because the science is still out.

00:19:32.300 But TikTok is part of that.

00:19:33.860 And if we have an opportunity to knock it off the market, getting a win against China and maybe also a win in the battles I just mentioned that are nonpolitical, then I say, why not do it?

00:19:42.540 But you're so right about how fast this has developed.

00:19:46.240 I mean, I remember being in high school and initially the only way you could communicate with someone digitally is you had to sit there and pound out a text message on a Nokia phone.

00:19:56.260 And, you know, if you wanted the C, you had to hit A, B, C on the, you know, on number two.

00:20:01.160 And that would give you one letter.

00:20:02.440 And then you'd go on and, I mean, it would take several minutes to construct a message of just a few words.

00:20:07.640 And then the transformational revolution was when AOL Instant Messenger would allow you to open up multiple screens and talk to, like, three or four people at one time with a keyboard.

00:20:20.080 And it was just captivating.

00:20:21.960 You could have a few conversations going at once.

00:20:24.280 You could have friends all over the country and be sharing ideas or thoughts with them.

00:20:28.900 And to think about, you know, how exciting that was and groundbreaking it was, but how it was really nothing compared to turning every American into a content producer, which is really what these social media platforms do.

00:20:44.240 And there can be a lot of good in that.

00:20:45.860 And I want to talk about that later in our discussion.

00:20:48.180 But when you've got the Chinese Communist Party in charge of it, you need to know what the goal is.

00:20:54.920 Chinese Communist Party did not set up TikTok to make money.

00:20:57.840 They want to control what you see and how you think so that they can control how you behave.

00:21:05.480 And throughout the history of great power competition, the idea was you want to influence the leaders, the civil society elite, the military elite.

00:21:15.240 But what China has done has been to convert technological expertise into totalitarian control.

00:21:23.580 Like we were all promised that the social media revolution would cause great threats to major power and it would embody the body politic to have exciting ideas and to organize together and to push back against totalitarianism.

00:21:38.880 But what we've seen from the Chinese Communist Party is that they have used technology to become more effective in totalitarian control. 0.61

00:21:47.640 And while in China, that means a social credit score and drones flying around telling you when you're allowed to go outside, here in America, it's more subtle, but it's just as pervasive to the core.

00:22:02.520 And I think TikTok is central to that.

00:22:05.600 We talked earlier in the discussion about how we change our thinking over time in politics.

00:22:10.100 Anybody who says that their political ideology doesn't evolve and doesn't deepen and doesn't have additional contours as they gain more experience on the planet Earth is not being honest.

00:22:21.700 And what I can tell you is, as a younger man, I was far more libertarian.

00:22:25.500 I just thought, well, you know what?

00:22:26.980 The government doesn't do very much right.

00:22:28.800 And so if the government does less and people do more, that's kind of a good thing.

00:22:32.820 And that's the construct to build a philosophy off of.

00:22:35.840 But as I got into Congress, I became perhaps a little less libertarian and a little more populist because I started to see that if government doesn't do anything for people and we just debate, should government be smaller or larger?

00:22:49.080 I've seen throughout my life that government has grown bigger, borrowed deeper against the future of our fellow Americans.

00:22:56.340 And yet the right doesn't seem to try to get the government to do anything proactively, positively for our people to improve quality of life.

00:23:04.260 And one of the things we ought to do is ban TikTok and look more aggressively at some of these other social media platforms.

00:23:11.960 You know, Gavin, you have been a commentator on the impact of this meta concept and the revolution that Twitter is going through right now.

00:23:23.680 How would you assess the social media environment broadly in the United States domestically?

00:23:29.960 And then I want to get to some of the exciting new things that Getter's doing as well.

00:23:34.260 Well, domestically, it certainly hasn't been great.

00:23:37.900 Obviously, we've seen now over the last few years that big tech is largely an extension of the intelligence apparatus in this country.

00:23:47.000 And that intelligence apparatus has been turned against the American people, in particular conservatives and anyone who goes against the establishment.

00:23:54.540 It's been turned against them frequently.

00:23:56.140 So big tech domestically is not much better than big tech from China.

00:24:01.780 You know, we may have an easier time going after TikTok because of its foreign entanglements and its ties to the CCP.

00:24:08.940 But we shouldn't we should certainly not rest on our laurels as it comes to the threats emerging out of Silicon Valley and the boardrooms of Meta and formerly Twitter, I suppose, and all the rest.

00:24:19.920 I mean, because there is a lot of insidious elements that have crept into big tech, along with all the other other institutions that we've talked about earlier.

00:24:27.600 It's the sort of Fabian style left wing takeovers of the corporate boardrooms.

00:24:33.080 And they found out that big tech are the arbiters of the modern town square and how all information and media is, you know, disseminated across society.

00:24:43.440 And having that, you know, power lever under your control, under your, you know, under your grasp is a massive, massive, you know, necessary tool for the sort of totalitarian societies that the elites in the West want to imitate from China.

00:24:58.140 And we talked about you talked about the high tech totalitarianism we see in China.

00:25:02.940 That's exactly what, you know, the Western elites at Davos and, you know, the Great Reset.

00:25:10.560 That's all they're trying to build here.

00:25:11.900 Maybe they're trying to do it more subtly, as you mentioned, but they're certainly looking to Beijing for inspiration.

00:25:17.240 And that's why when given an opportunity to stop it through TikTok or even through domestic regulations on big tech, we should certainly do that.

00:25:24.520 And I fully agree with you.

00:25:25.500 I originally was a libertarian, and I definitely have now embraced a sort of populism, nationalism, national conservative type of political ideology.

00:25:33.940 And I think if you have two different political parties, one which is willing to use its power to effectuate its own ends, and the other that it's only willing to step back and do nothing, it's the party and the political ideology that's willing to use power to effectuate its own ends that's going to win.

00:25:49.700 And that's bringing a gun to a knife fight, and we're going to continue to lose until we know and realize that we must wield power, you know, when we have the opportunity, because they will use it against us in a heartbeat.

00:26:02.340 And sometimes we have to put down some of these sort of ideological roadblockers and understand that when it comes to governing, we need to be pragmatic, we need to be dynamic, and we need to understand that action is necessary and not just falling back on theorems and maxims and talking points.

00:26:19.080 But when we're in office, you know, we should use the power of that office to advance our agenda, our conservative America first agenda.

00:26:27.340 And I don't think there's anything anti-American about that.

00:26:29.360 I don't think there's anything wrong with that.

00:26:31.320 That's how society has always progressed.

00:26:33.020 That's the history of human interaction and human power dynamics.

00:26:37.160 So it's only recently that Republicans found an excuse for some of their fecklessness and some of their weakness.

00:26:43.520 But I think that there's a paradigm shift going on in the way that many on the right think about power, think about government.

00:26:49.480 And I think they realize in order to preserve our way of life, our traditional American society, our freedoms, our liberties, we're going to have to, you know, roll up our sleeves a bit and wage some asymmetrical warfare that the left has been doing against us for decades.

00:27:04.220 Yeah, it would be symmetrical with the way a lot of us have been treated.

00:27:07.460 But you're right. As a conservative, at your core, you have to want to conserve something, to keep something, to hold as precious American citizenship, American sovereignty, American culture, American language.

00:27:23.100 And you've seen far too many conservatives believe that, well, we're doing our job just so long as we deal those things away more slowly.

00:27:31.960 And the reality is we have to conserve, we have to protect, and then there are hills we've got to climb.

00:27:37.720 And there's power that we have to be willing to take when it is given to us by the voters in elections.

00:27:44.380 You know, part of the debate that we will have in the Republican Congress is about how to break up big tech.

00:27:51.080 There are some who say, well, you can eliminate some of the immunities that they enjoy, and there'll be a judicial process that then they'll have to go through.

00:27:58.040 That might bring a few of the bad actors down. 0.96

00:28:00.500 There are some who would simply say, reshape these companies.

00:28:03.500 By force of law, go in and reshape the companies.

00:28:07.600 Force Instagram to be sold from Facebook.

00:28:11.700 Force Google to separate search and email.

00:28:14.940 And that's really the Elizabeth Warren perspective.

00:28:17.460 And so I might be more in line with the Elizabeth Warren perspective to break up big tech,

00:28:23.400 rather than maybe the Republican Kevin McCarthy perspective of eliminating some of the shields that big tech has been allowed to build in the law.

00:28:33.660 That'll be one of the very important debates coming up.

00:28:35.820 But, Gavin, you made a critical point about the relationship between big tech and the intelligence apparatus,

00:28:41.960 and it bears drawing a fine point on it and repeating it.

00:28:45.840 You said big tech is part of the intelligence apparatus, and people need to understand that that has a human feature, too.

00:28:55.020 There is a revolving door between the Department of Justice, FBI, CIA, NSA, and a lot of these big tech companies.

00:29:03.420 They go cash out working for big tech.

00:29:06.060 And you know what?

00:29:06.820 One reason why you haven't seen the Department of Justice actually enforce antitrust laws against big tech

00:29:13.360 is because they ultimately want to sell the antidote.

00:29:17.280 These guys at DOJ that end up going to work at big tech, well, they want to be able to create the risk and the fear of antitrust action,

00:29:26.280 but they don't really want to do it because then they want to go from being the prosecutor to being the defense counsel

00:29:32.880 or the advisor or the board member or the security official or whatever at these big tech companies.

00:29:38.760 And so I don't think people really get how corrupt that is where DOJ will say, okay, we'll go initiate an action.

00:29:45.060 But that's not sincerely to achieve the outcome.

00:29:47.780 It's just to create a marketplace for the talents of the people at DOJ when they want to go work at big tech.

00:29:53.480 And they are walking, springing leaks.

00:29:56.640 And I think one of the areas where that manifested in the most corrupt activity was around the Hunter Biden laptop

00:30:03.060 when our good friend Vish Burrow, who's come on this program and talked about what it was like to break that case

00:30:09.100 and to be a part of the chain of custody of that laptop to get that information before the American people.

00:30:14.680 And there you had big tech and our intelligence apparatus working hand in hand

00:30:21.480 to try to deprive the American people of that information.

00:30:24.700 This is a critical point for Republicans to investigate.

00:30:29.200 And, you know, I guess I'm here in Washington in my congressional office.

00:30:33.280 You're out there interacting with our activists and our fellow Americans.

00:30:38.640 Do people really think that we're going to do it?

00:30:40.800 Because when I go places, I hear folks say, yeah, yeah, Matt, you know, we've heard before how everybody,

00:30:47.060 you know, Trey Gowdy was going to get Hillary Clinton and Benghazi, and then that didn't happen.

00:30:51.920 And then we were going to hold people accountable for the Russia hugs. 0.58

00:30:54.880 But because Jeff Sessions was such a weakling, that didn't happen.

00:30:59.300 And I sense there might be some concern that this is all talk and bluster,

00:31:03.240 but that the actual results of these investigations won't result in true criminal process.

00:31:09.920 Do you sense that that's a concern?

00:31:12.260 Oh, absolutely.

00:31:13.220 There is a palpable sense of apathy among the base.

00:31:17.300 And I think that tied into our, you know, less than ideal election results for the midterms.

00:31:23.640 I think there's a lot of people that realize that many, particularly in our own party,

00:31:27.680 particularly Republicans, will campaign on one thing.

00:31:30.220 And the second they get to D.C., it's business as usual, and they fall in into line with the dictates of the swamp.

00:31:36.260 And I think, you know, people are sick and tired of, you know, sort of the, you know,

00:31:40.440 the trimmed videos from the House floor where they're speaking to no one and they're pounding their fists,

00:31:46.560 or even in committee hearings where they talk a big game like former Congressman Gowdy,

00:31:50.860 and then there's little to no results.

00:31:52.540 I think people have become quite accustomed to that.

00:31:54.760 And I think it's set in this sort of apathy for any real change to actually happen.

00:32:01.700 And I think this is one of the biggest problems facing the Republican Party electorally,

00:32:06.300 because we play a lot of theatrics and we play footsies and we rarely do anything.

00:32:11.360 And I think that's why so many people loved President Donald Trump, because he actually shook things up.

00:32:15.820 He got things done and he moved the needle forward.

00:32:18.080 The Overton window certainly shifted.

00:32:19.560 He certainly could have done a lot more with the Cooperative Party and D.C. bureaucracy.

00:32:24.920 But I think that's what people are looking for.

00:32:26.600 And I think the Republican establishment, the Republican leadership does not give many people,

00:32:31.660 certainly in the grassroots, certainly myself, certainly people that I talk to,

00:32:34.800 a lot of confidence that they're willing to do much.

00:32:37.740 I mean, you mentioned earlier, you know, the McCarthy style, you know,

00:32:40.700 removing some of these protections and these shields from tech,

00:32:44.540 which I think would be, you know, a good logical first step.

00:32:47.200 But I even doubt he would be willing to do that, if anything.

00:32:50.880 I mean, you know, the Elizabeth Warren approach you mentioned, while drastic, is even further away.

00:32:55.820 I think nothing's on the table until we really begin to see some sizable paradigm shifts within the party structure of both parties,

00:33:04.640 because the unique party controls everything and they're going to move at a snail's pace.

00:33:08.480 And they're only going to give crumbs when people demand cake.

00:33:11.880 And I think that's an issue at large with D.C.

00:33:15.160 You discussed the revolving door, the rent seeking that goes on, how it's, you know, totally corrupted our institutions.

00:33:21.340 And it's created this sort of, you know, capital of an empire where nothing gets done unless you're willing to spend enough money to grease the wheels.

00:33:28.620 And obviously the American people don't have that largesse to do that, but certainly foreign actors do, certainly corporate interests do.

00:33:35.940 The American people only have their votes and their votes are seemingly beginning to matter less and less,

00:33:41.660 because even though they'll elect Republicans time again, those Republicans or Democrats even will do nothing.

00:33:47.480 So it's a systemic issue we're facing, and I think it's creating a political environment that is full of apathy,

00:33:56.280 and it's not good for the future of our republic.

00:33:58.620 We need action.

00:34:00.500 Ban TikTok.

00:34:01.900 Break up big tech.

00:34:03.580 Create the space for startups and new technology companies to be able to service the needs of the American people.

00:34:11.400 And that's where I want to get together, because when we initially proposed some of these ideas, folks said,

00:34:18.740 you know what, if people don't like Facebook, if people don't like TikTok, let them sign off.

00:34:23.040 Let them deactivate their account.

00:34:24.400 Go start your own social network, conservatives and pro-America patriots,

00:34:29.620 if you don't like our woke, leftist, foreign-infected options that we have available for you right now. 0.85

00:34:36.760 And really, the first foray into that was Parler.

00:34:39.940 Conservatives set up a social media platform.

00:34:42.240 It had millions of users, but they weren't smart enough to be vertically integrated.

00:34:47.660 They got functionally canceled.

00:34:49.340 They lost all their momentum when Amazon Web Services pulled them.

00:34:53.420 Getter built in, I think, more resiliency on the front end to cancellation.

00:34:58.580 When Getter started, it was all abuzz.

00:35:00.900 Millions of people joined.

00:35:02.760 And now it's a great place for our office to get messages to constituents.

00:35:08.840 There's programming schedules you can check out on Getter so that you can get the content you want from some of the voices that you trust.

00:35:16.520 So maybe give folks who might be watching this on one of the other social platforms or streaming services a sense of what the experience is like on Getter,

00:35:25.540 how that might differ from what they're seeing on other platforms.

00:35:27.980 Look, I think it's better on Getter, no pun intended.

00:35:31.920 But, you know, the all-tech space has certainly come a long, long way from the early days that you referenced where people said,

00:35:39.360 well, go make your own social media platform.

00:35:41.240 We have, obviously, many of the failures that were associated with Parler, a lot of the censorship that happened with sites like Gab.

00:35:48.620 But I think now the all-tech space with Rumble and Getter and even Truth is really beginning to come into its own.

00:35:54.600 They're beginning to see a critical mass of users and community formation.

00:35:59.380 The features of the tech are beginning to either be on par or even surpass, in some instances, that of big tech.

00:36:07.060 I mean, you look at Getter.

00:36:07.920 Getter had an edit button before Twitter did.

00:36:10.480 Getter had – when Twitter was deprecating live streams and periscopes, Getter was bringing on live streams.

00:36:17.060 So there was certainly even a tech and features disparity growing between all-tech and Twitter.

00:36:23.720 And I think that forced Twitter prior to Elon Musk taking over.

00:36:27.380 It forced Twitter to start integrating new features like Twitter Blue and undoing tweets and the edit button and all these other things.

00:36:35.000 It started to create the first sense of competition in this space.

00:36:39.460 And even if some of these all-tech companies don't win, quote-unquote, ultimately in this battle of companies,

00:36:45.980 they are certainly creating an environment and incentives for these companies to innovate, continue to innovate,

00:36:52.980 and continue to have policies that are designed to encourage a larger user base.

00:36:59.140 And I think we're seeing massive upticks on Twitter's daily active users and activity engagement.

00:37:04.400 I know Elon is bragging about that constantly.

00:37:07.400 And that's due just sort of to the notion that it's a little more free, that it's a little – there's a little less censorship.

00:37:15.920 It doesn't even have to actually be a reality.

00:37:17.660 But the mere notion that Twitter is going to censor less and ban less has led to a resurgence of activity on that platform without even seeing any substantive changes from the policy side yet from Elon.

00:37:30.520 So I think it's showing the market that there is a massive demand there for free speech, for alternative platforms.

00:37:37.740 And if you build it, they will come, and maybe there will be some short-term downsides with advertisers and other things that I know Elon and the new Twitter board is experiencing with many of these left-woke companies trying to pull their advertising dollars.

00:37:52.600 But he's looking to monetize other facets of the platform to move away from an advertising model.

00:37:58.720 Maybe the rollout of the Blue Check $8 verification system wasn't ideal, but it shows a willingness to test the waters and to move away from an environment where corporate woke entities can determine company policies because of their advertising spends.

00:38:15.460 And I think Getter and others are showing that you can build really reliable, self-sustaining platforms with growing communities without having to go woke.

00:38:24.740 And I think the more of this that happens, it will begin to set precedent.

00:38:27.400 We'll see more people enter in to the alt-space marketplace and to the alt-space, you know, sector.

00:38:33.500 And the more competition, the better, and the more tech and the more features, the more innovation, the better, because I think we definitely had a period of malaise, to reuse a word from our earlier discussion, in the tech space for many years.

00:38:46.100 And I think it culminated with the banning of Donald J. Trump, President Donald J. Trump from Twitter.

00:38:51.040 And I think we're kind of emerging from that dark age now.

00:38:53.660 We're seeing a lot of possibilities, both reforming big tech from inside, which I believe Elon is attempting to do, and of course building separate parallel platforms like Getter, like Rumble, like Truth, which are going to build their own spaces, but also force change in big tech through the process of market competition.

00:39:13.580 So it's an interesting time.

00:39:15.020 We're entering certainly a wild west, and I think it's only positive from here.

00:39:18.600 And any regulatory changes that come out of D.C. come out of Washington.

00:39:22.540 We talked about those protective shields.

00:39:24.360 We talked about maybe breaking up some entities.

00:39:26.440 Anything that comes out of Washington will only help this process and will weaken what I believe is the monopolistic control of big tech on several of their social media verticals, whether it's, you know, Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, et cetera.

00:39:40.540 It is the wild west.

00:39:43.080 It is a new frontier, and I am here for it.

00:39:45.900 Gavin Wax is the global marketing director for Getter.

00:39:48.880 He's the president of the New York Young Republican Club.

00:39:51.600 Gavin, how can folks follow your postings and commentary?

00:39:55.400 Well, thank you again for having me on, Congressman.

00:39:57.580 You can follow me at Gavin Wax.

00:39:59.740 That's Twitter, Getter, Instagram, Facebook, everything.

00:40:03.280 You can check out my website, GavinWax.com.

00:40:06.240 You can check out the New York Young Republican Club, which is the oldest and largest Republican club in the country, www.nyyrc.com, NYYRC at NYYRC on social.

00:40:17.800 We have our upcoming gala December 10th.

00:40:19.720 It's going to be a blast.

00:40:20.780 You were obviously a past speaker when we got banned from the Garden State, so we're looking to make as big of a splash as that prior gala.

00:40:28.440 And, you know, that's pretty much where you can find me.

00:40:30.540 Oh, and my articles are available.

00:40:31.720 We're still under criminal investigation in New Jersey.

00:40:34.500 I'm not sure, but the governor of New Jersey said that because we held a socially distanced dinner without masks that, you know, we were, like, putting people's lives in danger.

00:40:44.740 Phil Murphy has put more people's lives in danger than you and I have for holding an upscale political event.

00:40:50.980 Who would have thought?

00:40:51.980 Gavin, thanks so much for joining us on Firebrand.

00:40:54.220 Thanks for your great work.

00:40:55.460 I'm excited for the new frontiers we're going to conquer together, my friend.

00:40:59.120 Thank you, sir.

00:40:59.880 Have a good one.

00:41:00.480 Thanks.

00:41:02.300 He's the best.

00:41:03.400 Follow Gavin and make sure you're following us on Getter because it's a great place for us to be able to stream this content.

00:41:09.360 If you weren't paying attention these last few days, you might have missed that we almost stumbled our way into a nuclear war with Russia over an accident that wasn't actually Russian.

00:41:20.980 Put up the headline that we get from Fox News.

00:41:23.560 Here was a Fox News headline, an actual headline.

00:41:26.680 For those of you who are listening to the pod, it says, Russian missiles cross into NATO member Poland, kill two, senior U.S. intelligence official.

00:41:36.560 So this isn't true.

00:41:38.620 Those weren't Russian missiles.

00:41:40.840 They obviously were Ukrainian anti-assault measures.

00:41:46.760 And when you've got the shield, essentially, the defensive mechanism to stop missiles from landing into your territory, you shoot stuff at those missiles.

00:41:56.760 And so it was what Ukraine had deployed in their own defense, admittedly, but what Ukraine had deployed that landed in Russia.

00:42:04.440 But how irresponsible for news organizations, for intelligence officials to just start by saying, we have to invoke NATO protocols that require us to all go and defend Poland to the death when the reality was there was no Russian attack on Poland.

00:42:23.600 Take a listen to some of the worst takes in this fog of war.

00:42:27.440 I have no doubt that this is not our missile, not our strike.

00:42:34.280 There is no sense for me to trust them.

00:42:36.620 I went through war with them and with you.

00:42:40.780 I don't, to put an end to it, but I have my opinion.

00:42:45.500 I believe this is a Russian missile based on our military reports.

00:42:48.840 When it comes to our security commitments and Article 5, we've been crystal clear that we will defend every inch of NATO territory.

00:42:58.180 We're still gathering information, but we have seen nothing that contradicts President Duda's preliminary assessment.

00:43:26.820 That this explosion was most likely the result of a Ukrainian air defense missile that unfortunately landed in Poland.

00:43:35.940 And whatever the final conclusions may be, the world knows that Russia bears ultimate responsibility for this incident. 0.75

00:43:45.520 That was the voice of your Secretary of Defense, Lloyd Austin, probably one of the worst people to wear the uniform in a while.

00:43:57.620 He's done a lot of harm.

00:43:59.560 These aren't guys who are going to win you any wars, but they might stumble you into some as a consequence of their ineptitude.

00:44:06.540 And before Lloyd Austin, it was the voice of Mark Milley who said, this war is fought by the Russian people. 0.95

00:44:13.320 And I've just got to ask, like how stupid does one have to be to try to provoke the Russian people over Ukraine having some of their materiel accidentally land in Poland? 0.86

00:44:29.700 It seems like a weird time to try to escalate and accelerate the fight with the Russian people. 0.99

00:44:36.040 This war was Putin's choice. It was a bad choice. It's a war I hope Putin loses.

00:44:41.800 But it's certainly not the Russian people that Americans have a beef with.

00:44:47.480 The Russian people are doing everything they can to run out of the country, escape, avoid being drafted into this war. 0.96

00:44:55.740 But with military leaders like Milley and Austin, the American people should have little confidence that we are being led by the A-team.

00:45:05.460 We undeniably are not.

00:45:06.980 There's going to be a lot of questioning and investigation of their role in the botched Afghanistan withdrawal,

00:45:13.820 their role in not being able to assess the will to fight, frankly, from Afghanistan to Ukraine,

00:45:19.460 the materiel and cash that we have sent endlessly into the most corrupt country in Europe, Ukraine, 0.94

00:45:28.020 the third most corrupt country in the world, according to a Goldman Sachs analysis.

00:45:33.180 We can do better than this. We could do better than them.

00:45:36.240 And the next time there's a potential accident, maybe before we go and leap to blaming the Russian people

00:45:42.100 and starting a nuclear war with Russia that would be devastating to the entire world, 0.89

00:45:48.120 we ought to check the facts, do investigation, thorough review.

00:45:51.820 That's what the American people deserve.

00:45:53.840 And it's too often not what they get from a Pentagon that is so reckless,

00:45:59.060 they blame the Russians when it wasn't the Russians who even launched this materiel.

00:46:03.860 And then they don't get it right when they're drone-striking families in Afghanistan. 0.99

00:46:09.760 It really is a parade of horribles, and it's one that we must correct in the coming Congress

00:46:14.860 with aggressive and robust oversight.

00:46:17.280 And I will be right there on the House Armed Services Committee getting the job done.

00:46:21.440 Thanks so much for joining us today.

00:46:23.080 Thank you again to my good friend Gavin Wax for his leadership at the New York Young Republican Club

00:46:27.880 and his work in the technology sector.

00:46:29.920 We appreciate you joining us.

00:46:31.160 Have those notifications turned on.

00:46:33.760 You never know when we're going to go live.

00:46:35.520 And make sure you're subscribed so that you can always catch up on the news from Firebrand.

00:46:40.080 Roll the credits.

00:47:01.160 We'll be right back.

00:47:07.620 A lot of the stories about this year.

00:47:10.120 We'll be right back.

00:47:11.080 We'll be right back.

00:47:12.160 And we'll be right back.

00:47:12.580 We'll be right back.

00:47:21.720 We'll be right back.

The Anchormen Show with Matt Gaetz - November 17, 2022

Episode 76 LIVE： Ban TikTok (feat. Gavin Wax) – Firebrand with Matt Gaetz

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