The Art of Manliness - #298： The History of BBQ and Becoming a Backyard Pitmaster

00:00:00.000 brad mckay here and welcome to another edition of the art of manliness podcast well southern

00:00:18.660 barbecue is a uniquely american food and depending on which part of the south you're in you're going

00:00:22.700 to get a different answer as to what is true southern barbecue despite the differences one

00:00:27.160 thing that unites southern barbecue is its unabashed love for the humble pork butt my guest today on the

00:00:31.380 show has taken a tour of the south to find barbecue joints who are taking this traditional choice of

00:00:35.160 meat and doing new things with it while sticking to the roots of southern q his name is matt more

00:00:39.580 he's our food contributor here at aom and his latest book is the south's best butts pit master

00:00:44.300 secrets for southern barbecue perfection today on the show matt discusses the details of the history

00:00:49.200 of barbecue and explains why pork is a staple in the southern variety of barbecue he then explains

00:00:54.480 what exactly a pork butt is and no it's not the rear of a pig and why it's such an ideal meat for

00:00:59.600 smoking he then shares how and why barbecue flavors and techniques differ in different parts of the

00:01:04.120 south and highlights a few pit masters who are adding new takes on this traditional dish we then

00:01:08.680 end our conversation by going through a step-by-step process of smoking the perfect pork butt as well as

00:01:14.120 some dishes you can prepare with it at your next barbecue your mouth is going to be watering after

00:01:18.000 you hear the show after the show is over check out our show notes at aom.is slash pork butt where you

00:01:23.160 find links to resources where you can delve deeper into this topic

00:01:25.640 matt more welcome back to the show thanks so much for having me back on so for those of you who follow

00:01:35.960 the art of manliness website matt has been contributing food content for us over the years

00:01:40.840 a lot of just great recipes for guys who want to cook and host and things like that had him on the show

00:01:47.220 while that go for his book the southern gentleman's kitchen really fantastic cookbook and he's got a

00:01:51.820 new one out this time it's dedicated to the wonderful world of barbecue particularly southern

00:01:57.220 barbecue so matt what was the inspiration for you to travel around the american south in search of the

00:02:05.400 perfect barbecue pork butt you know i like to say that opinions are like butts everybody has one and

00:02:12.980 being a nashville guy i like to liken everything to music so i think in in terms of barbecue today

00:02:18.920 and you mentioned particularly southern barbecue i don't know that there's any other barbecue besides

00:02:22.900 southern barbecue that starts our first opinion for the podcast there's texas barbecue we can get into

00:02:27.740 that hey i went to texas i went to texas i went to oklahoma so i don't know that washington state

00:02:33.560 truly has barbecue sorry for any listeners up that way for me i i wanted to uh to go on a discovery

00:02:39.500 it's commonly agreed upon the barbecue belt is made up of 12 states think about the carolinas

00:02:45.660 georgia louisiana across the uh the south all the way to texas up up to oklahoma the only people that

00:02:52.000 we kind of forget about in the south is florida sorry but i wanted to go out on the road and

00:02:56.540 showcase all the different styles that regional barbecue has you know dry rubs in memphis mustard

00:03:02.540 based sauces in and south carolina white based sauces in and alabama and by doing a focus on

00:03:10.080 the pork butt that was kind of my medium through which we looked at all the different types of

00:03:14.560 recipes so you're getting a lot of recipes for woods you're getting techniques uh dry rubs whether

00:03:19.600 it's sauced or not how it's served and then of course we round out the book not just with pork butt

00:03:24.600 but we've got brisket and smoked chicken wings and all the sides and desserts that you could ever dream

00:03:29.880 of all right so for our listeners who aren't familiar what is the pork butt is it actually 0.54

00:03:34.440 the pig's butt no it's a common misconception right the pork butt actually the butt is actually

00:03:39.920 the ham cut but the pork butt as we're referring to it is actually the pork shoulder and again there's 0.91

00:03:45.480 a lot of opinions there's a lot of mystery behind where that name came from but the pork butt got its

00:03:49.860 name back in the day because they used to salt cure the shoulder cut along with all of the other

00:03:55.000 cuts and and pack them in in barrels and those barrels were sold and and the the terminology to

00:04:00.480 refer to that barrel was a butt b-u-t-t it's where we get the name boston butt so it's actually the

00:04:05.940 shoulder cut which typically is a really tough cut you know it's a lot of muscle a bit sinewy and

00:04:11.260 that's what requires such long cooking periods from anywhere from 20 hours as i discovered in st louis

00:04:16.280 all the way down to just a couple of hours and that's the unique thing about it there's kind of 20 ways

00:04:20.520 to skin a cat in the same way with a pork butt so is that why the pork butt is often used in

00:04:25.320 barbecuing because it requires you know a considerable amount of cooking time to get it nice and tender

00:04:29.960 yeah i mean barbecue traces its name most commonly to the term barbacoa which is roasting meats over

00:04:36.500 open coals on spits i think the pork butt is so popular because it's really ubiquitous sorry for the

00:04:42.140 texas and oklahomans but you know to me the pig is the cornerstone of southern barbecue and i think that

00:04:47.780 the pork butt is kind of that veritable cut that everyone goes back to you know it's a humble cut

00:04:53.720 it's cheap stretches to feed a crowd and for me it's the starting point for kind of defining cue

00:04:59.240 as i mentioned earlier you know liking and everything the music i think ribs for a long time have have

00:05:04.980 served as basically the lead singer of the band you know everybody loves ribs they're adored by all but

00:05:09.900 they're quite finicky to prepare and also when you're consuming them you know i think if you look at

00:05:13.920 texas and oklahoma barbecue brisket has come on on the spotlight it's kind of like the lead guitarist

00:05:18.300 is trying to steal some of that spotlight from the rib but the pork butt has always served as kind of

00:05:22.780 the drummer or the basis behind the scenes keeping everybody in time and i wanted to to pay homage to

00:05:29.060 it to uncover what people are doing with that cut from state to state to state right you know i've never

00:05:33.860 been a fan of ribs i mean i'll like them but like it's not like my favorite it's not my favorite thing

00:05:37.820 when there's barbecue i'm like i'll have a rib that's it but i'd rather eat you know

00:05:41.540 a great rib yeah i mean pulled pork is obviously one of my favorites but a great rib can be

00:05:47.440 transcending but you more often than not come across really really bad ribs than you do great

00:05:53.120 ribs i'll tell you uh one of the places we featured in the book is a place called b daddy's barbecue in

00:05:57.420 san antonio texas and they're known for their beef brisket and beef ribs and let me tell you what man

00:06:02.760 i ate more than my weights full of beef ribs that afternoon in san antonio gotta do it right so let's

00:06:08.220 talk about the history of barbecue it's a predominantly southern phenomenon it's it's been

00:06:12.660 transported to other parts of the country but what's the history of barbecue in the south why

00:06:16.560 is it such a big thing there it's cheap uh you know pigs were first brought over by de soto to

00:06:23.840 florida back in the 1400s and it was an animal that could survive long voyages at sea and then it

00:06:29.640 didn't need a whole lot of domestication when it came stateside they could basically let them run 0.69

00:06:33.460 wild a problem that we're dealing with still today in the south that being said to to cook

00:06:38.900 these meats it does take a low temperature and quite a bit of time so i think just regionally

00:06:43.460 it's what caused it really to proliferate throughout the south and i dig into the history of one of the

00:06:48.500 unique things that we uncovered is you know the south has had a long storied culture some of it's

00:06:52.560 more troubled than any but back in the in the plantation era one of the rare acts of humanity that you

00:06:57.620 would see amongst slave owners and slaves is they would throw and they're still called these today

00:07:01.780 pig pickings where actually you broke the bonds of social hierarchy and the slave masters would 0.70

00:07:06.920 literally dine with slaves and it was a time of celebration it was a time of harvest and that's

00:07:12.380 still a tradition that's carried on obviously not in the same bounds that it is back in the past so

00:07:17.280 you know i think it's always played an important role in the civil war it was a food that could be

00:07:20.940 salt cured and preserved to keep people fighting and cheaply served but i also love politics and i'm not

00:07:26.260 going to talk politics today but barbecue in the south is often found at political rallies it's found

00:07:31.460 at weddings it's found at funerals it's a food that everybody loves it's a food that can serve

00:07:35.860 the masses and i think it's the ultimate comfort food though in different forms you find it throughout

00:07:39.740 the south and now you're finding it throughout the u.s and the rest of the world yeah i mean i think

00:07:43.460 that's interesting the history part was really fascinating that people in the 17th century or

00:07:48.020 the 18th century were having like barbecue parties right i mean it's like it's crazy to think

00:07:53.240 like we think it's like oh it's this thing that we've been doing just for a short time but

00:07:55.840 like no it's been going on for hundreds of years yeah that whole hog style of cooking you know one of the

00:08:00.660 other things is the entomology of the word barbecue as i mentioned earlier most people relate it back

00:08:05.700 to the term barbacoa some people give credit to the french haitians that call it barbacoa which is

00:08:11.440 basically nose to tail if you will or head to tail and that's kind of to describe the whole hog method

00:08:17.180 of cooking in the carolinas and one of my favorites is beer bar cue pool which was an advertisement that

00:08:25.220 you found throughout the carolinas that daniel von cited saying that you would find inside a bar

00:08:30.420 a beer uh barbecue and pool i don't think that's necessarily where we got the name barbecue but it

00:08:37.040 happened to be one of my favorites when i was doing the research on the history of the word so you

00:08:40.540 mentioned earlier that as you go throughout the barbecue belt in the south there's the different

00:08:45.540 regions of the south have their own take on barbecue and you mentioned a few of them so how does the

00:08:49.760 flavor and the techniques of barbecuing change depending on which part of the south you're in

00:08:53.440 yeah great question the carolinas specifically north carolina is most known for cooking a whole

00:08:59.440 hog so when we visited wilbur's in goldsburg north carolina they don't actually just cook pork butts

00:09:05.320 they cook a whole hog and they chop all of that meat together so you're getting all portions and it

00:09:09.940 has a unique flavor typically a real strong hickory wood is used to smoke and they don't have really

00:09:15.700 any sauce whatsoever it's just a apple cider vinegar with crushed red pepper and salt as you make

00:09:20.740 your way down through south carolina you're starting to pick up more of a mustard based sauce and a lot

00:09:25.560 of folks give credit to a lot of the german immigrants that came over during that time period

00:09:30.060 as you go to georgia and louisiana and alabama alabama you pick up a little bit of a white sauce

00:09:35.340 which is based out of a mayonnaise and if you go up to kentucky you find not really pork you find

00:09:40.080 mutton and then as you make your way west most people typically say that you first find tomato

00:09:45.360 and a little bit of sweetness in the form of a syrup as you find memphis and st louis and kansas

00:09:52.260 city style barbecues and of course as you go all the way further west you're going to pick up more

00:09:56.680 beef in the state of texas and one of my favorites you know right there in tulsa oklahoma they called

00:10:01.700 smoked bologna they called it oklahoma tenderloin so there's a lot of different things that make up

00:10:06.400 the different styles but those are the commonly agreed upon as you make your way from east to west

00:10:10.540 so do you know why the tomato and like the more sweet is in like missouri and kansas city do you

00:10:16.060 i mean you know like you mentioned that the mustard base from the germans and the carolina

00:10:19.600 stuff is more from whatever like why the sweetness as you get west you know it's a good question and

00:10:25.440 that's one that you might have me stumped on i didn't find anything that out of particularity

00:10:29.860 would lend itself to say that tomatoes appeared more in that side of the country i think that just

00:10:35.100 tastes are different you know to me people ask all the time well what is good barbecue i think we

00:10:39.540 all associate barbecue with what we grow up on so for folks in kansas city and memphis and st louis

00:10:45.340 that tend to like a sweeter based sauce when they try carolina style barbecue which i said is just

00:10:51.560 vinegar a little bit of heat from crushed red pepper and salt they don't really consider it barbecue

00:10:56.620 because it's not the barbecue that they grew up on so it's it's still something that's super super

00:11:01.220 hyper regional but as to why you you get more maple syrup or cane syrup or something along those lines as

00:11:07.180 to what makes it sweeter i just think it naturally evolves over time as people's tastes and preferences

00:11:12.040 kind of carry on that way gotcha so i mean you mentioned i someone at people ask you like what

00:11:17.240 makes good barbecue good barbecue you can have bad barbecue like there's bad ribs is it possible like

00:11:23.740 to screw up a pork butt or is it a pretty forgiving meat piece of meat yeah i think one of the unique

00:11:28.820 things about focusing a spotlight on the pork butt it is a forgiving cut right skip steel who's a pretty 1.00

00:11:35.460 famous pit master at bogarts in st louis he said it perfectly he said you know cooking is a math

00:11:40.580 problem time plus temperature equals results he's a gentleman that uses hickory he smokes his pork

00:11:47.040 butts at 200 degrees for 20 hours that's quite a commitment right you know i found a gentleman in

00:11:54.520 leachville arkansas at big butts barbecue that will actually break down the pork butts so he cuts them into

00:11:59.900 one and a quarter inch steaks so you get more surface area and he cooks them at about 325 degrees for

00:12:06.020 just a couple of hours the results were different but they were still both delicious so i think in

00:12:11.120 terms of the other cuts it's like a brisket which you know once it's dry it's not good anymore ribs can

00:12:15.720 be quite dry or not a whole lot of meat on the bone the pork butt is one that is quite humble and

00:12:20.600 forgiving and there's a lot of different ways to approach it in this book you visit all these different

00:12:25.060 barbecue joints big ones in the south i mean what do you think they all had in common and besides that

00:12:29.940 like what what were the big differences besides the regional flavors what they're doing they have

00:12:34.220 differences in the way they approach barbecue or innovation or sticking to tradition yeah great

00:12:40.880 question i think we'll dig into it in just a bit but you know the commonality was just great people

00:12:45.580 these pit masters that show up to work at three or four o'clock in the morning to cook all day

00:12:50.020 all day long i mean they're judged more than a michelin star chef so in those instances the

00:12:55.880 commonality was just meeting great people in terms of innovation yes i think anybody can cook great

00:13:01.500 barbecue on the most expensive piece of equipment whatever that might be so if you just have a kettle

00:13:06.400 grill that you can pick up at any hardware store with some charcoal that's one of my favorite ways to

00:13:11.500 cook digging a hole into the backyard to cook a whole hog but we did find quite a bit of innovation

00:13:16.660 nowadays you come across commercial smokers that can smoke you know 20 and 30 butts at a time that

00:13:21.880 is using gas to to control temperature precisely and then they're using some actual real wood for

00:13:27.460 smoke flavor i think the rule is going back to time and temperature equals results it doesn't really

00:13:33.000 matter what you cook on or how expensive your equipment is the food is going to be quite a bit better if

00:13:38.540 you're actually a master of time and temperature control than anything else yeah i have a buddy who does

00:13:43.620 a lot of barbecue and he says you can use a metal garbage can and still cook good because it all

00:13:48.680 comes down to time and temperature absolutely all those things you're going to get a good thing

00:13:52.080 absolutely was there any places that you came across that you saw were doing something really

00:13:55.860 unique with barbecue to change things up yeah i think one of my favorite places that i came across

00:14:01.060 is called heirloom barbecue in atlanta georgia they literally the georgia department of transportation

00:14:06.200 tried to shut the restaurant down because the traffic getting into the restaurant was so bad it was

00:14:11.420 causing problems that's no joke to those in atlanta with the i-85 bridge that recently collapsed

00:14:16.300 atlanta is already a traffic-ridden city but what you find there is a husband and wife cody taylor is

00:14:21.260 originally from knoxville tennessee spent a lot of time in texas so he is a true southern barbecue pit

00:14:27.220 master he married his wife jeon lee who happens to be a korean pop star and i mean it she's like

00:14:32.960 britney spears big in south korea she wanted to get away from the spotlight tended the cordon blue in

00:14:37.860 atlanta and started cooking they got married and what you have is this harmonious flavor of true

00:14:43.260 traditional southern barbecue married with a korean influence so i don't want to say korean barbecue at

00:14:49.160 all it's it's it's nothing like that you're finding pork butts that are smoked you know 16 hours over

00:14:54.360 hickory but they're marinated in a korean red chili rub called gochujong which gives it this incredible

00:15:00.340 umami flavor they've got instead of a traditional coleslaw they make a kimchi slaw their pickles are all done

00:15:05.880 in a south korean way so to me that was a really innovative style of cooking in a barbecue where

00:15:11.680 they're really paying homage to the roots but they're making it their own but it is sort of that

00:15:16.180 innovation is baked in the dna of barbecue because it's like you're combining all these different

00:15:21.420 cultures into this new food right absolutely you know i think the thing about barbecue is we're

00:15:27.520 probably a little slow to walk towards innovation most purists might go to a place like heirloom and claim

00:15:33.380 that because of some of the influences you know it wasn't traditional southern style barbecue i i would

00:15:38.840 hotly disagree i think that barbecue is a constantly evolving space you know and that's one of the

00:15:44.760 things that i wanted to showcase in the book is a whole lot of diversity most people think of of pit

00:15:48.840 masters being uh men but there was quite a quite a few females uh helen turner in brownsville tennessee 0.96

00:15:54.220 i mean she's just as as tough as any man i've ever met i mean she's building big fires in an open pit 1.00

00:16:00.320 at four o'clock in the morning and working all day the front of house the back of house so you're

00:16:04.080 going to come across people that of all different walks of life that are carrying on the tradition

00:16:08.260 of barbecue and making their own stamp on it as they continue to carry that tradition on so besides

00:16:12.780 you know highlighting these different barbecue places barbecue joints it's a cookbook it's recipes

00:16:17.500 on how to cook pork butt and other things if you're up for it i mean i'd love to walk our listeners

00:16:22.260 through on how to smoke or cook the perfect pork butt for barbecue so let's start with the meat

00:16:28.440 like or you say pork butt's pretty forgiving but when you go and buy a pork butt is it something

00:16:33.440 you can look at the meat and say yeah this is going to be a good piece of meat to cook or

00:16:37.280 no or i should stay away from this one is anything you can tell by the meat yeah so the cool thing

00:16:43.420 about it when you go to the store these are pretty consistent uh you're going to find them most often

00:16:48.260 in a range anywhere from eight to 12 pounds i tend to like one around 10 pounds if i can find that

00:16:54.860 you'll find how much does that feed goodness gracious at least 20 people right and typically

00:16:59.800 you're going to find those and i think your listeners will really appreciate this i buy pork

00:17:03.440 butts at my local grocery store here in nashville tennessee which sometimes has higher food costs

00:17:07.700 for 99 cents a pound right so i can buy a 10 pound butt for 10 dollars and typically feed you know 15

00:17:14.540 to 20 people on depending on the method that i'm using whether it's sandwiches or just on a plate or

00:17:18.700 whatever so you're going to find those you want to look for ones that have a nice fat cap on the top

00:17:24.020 and it'll also include the bone in the shoulder that's really what you're looking for and like i

00:17:28.640 said it's super humble it's super cheap you want to find ones that are fresh but i think any local

00:17:33.200 market you can go down to or ask your butcher to source for you it's a really cheap affordable

00:17:38.120 food source that you can find basically anywhere all right let's talk about the thing that causes a lot

00:17:43.480 of consternation yeah seasoning is it wet or wet or dry seasoning what do you do i came across a lot

00:17:51.640 of different methods so i'll let you guys dig into some of the different recipes me i i prefer a dry

00:17:57.400 rub right uh what's going to flavor the butt and again i'm one that's a little bit more of a purist 0.54

00:18:03.100 i don't really use a whole lot of sauce after i've cooked my meat it's kind of more of a carolina style

00:18:08.120 where i might add a little bit of vinegar salt and pepper so by using a dry rub it's one of my first

00:18:13.740 chances besides using actual smoke to flavor the meat the dry rub is really going to be my chance so i

00:18:19.220 love a really really liberal dry rub i saw it just as simple as coarse salt and pepper all the way up

00:18:26.080 to using you know ground garlic and onion powders and mustard powders and chili powders but for me i'm

00:18:32.080 one that likes to really work a rub of which you'll find plenty of recipes in the book all throughout

00:18:37.700 every crevice of the meat before it hits the fire and if you do a a wet seasoning wet rub do you do

00:18:45.440 that after or before you start smoking it what i found yeah a good question i found a lot of people

00:18:51.160 doing kind of like a brine right so even if it was kind of a salt and water solution where they were

00:18:57.140 submerging the uh the actual pork butt overnight or i came across some that that actually would coat it

00:19:02.940 in italian dressing and let it sit overnight the one commonality though before uh whether they used a

00:19:08.980 dry rub or not they were sure to really really wipe down and dry off either the brine or the

00:19:15.020 marinade before they put it on the smoker you don't want to have a wet butt sorry for the pun there and

00:19:20.860 then add a dry rub to it because in the first few hours remember we're cooking at a very low temperature

00:19:25.360 so what happens is all that dry rub is just going to kind of steam off the meat and it kind of goes

00:19:30.560 against the purpose of giving it a dry rub so if you do do a brine or a marinade of any kind on the

00:19:34.960 you want to make sure that you wipe it completely dry before you put a rub or before you even put

00:19:39.960 it on the fire gotcha okay let's talk about actually cooking it so you smoke it right that's the that's

00:19:45.700 traditional way of cooking pork butt is smoking it right yeah true barbecue is is taking you know

00:19:51.160 wood coals i've most often came across mesquite or hickory coals oak coals as well some people prefer

00:19:57.900 fruit woods like an apple or percon that can add a little bit sweeter smoke to the meat but true folks

00:20:03.300 will tell you that you have to actually burn down logs of of wood into coals and then you shovel

00:20:08.540 those coals underneath the meat and the idea is that as the meat kind of gives up its its fatty

00:20:13.260 goodness it it kind of drips down on the fire and that smoke flavors the meat throughout the long

00:20:17.460 process that's the tried and true method you know you can also get away with using lump charcoal which

00:20:23.140 kind of makes that step a little bit easier and then use wood chips to help provide more smoke flavor

00:20:28.860 you know a lot of people are against briquette style charcoal but i came across a gentleman in

00:20:34.200 arkansas that that always used briquettes and got great results so i think there's a lot of different

00:20:38.660 methods there but in terms of the smoke what i find is that most people are trying to impart smoke

00:20:43.180 flavor for the first one to four hours so if you're looking at a pork butt that's about 10 to 12 pounds

00:20:48.760 at around 250 to 275 degrees you're looking at probably a cooking time anywhere between 12 to 16 hours with

00:20:55.800 most people adding some of the actual wood chips into the first four hours of cooking wow so you're

00:21:01.020 looking at 16 hours like so if you were like wanting to smoke something for the weekend or for

00:21:05.300 like a party like say a saturday night when would you need to start ideally hey that's the fun part

00:21:11.000 if you ask me you start the night before you turn on some waylon jennings and crack open a cold beer

00:21:14.900 you know that's one of the things where having a little bit more sophisticated smoker plays to your

00:21:19.120 advantage using a kettle style grill you're going to be up a couple times during the night to replace

00:21:23.920 charcoal if you have an egg style cooker you can you can get that thing set and it'll hold the

00:21:28.720 temperature for you for 16 20 hours so that's one advantage i will say of having a little bit more

00:21:34.160 expensive equipment or even a gas style cooker where you can absolutely regulate that temperature to a

00:21:39.140 tea and then add your wood chips for that smoke flavor but most folks are doing this uh the night

00:21:43.880 before you know one shortcut that you can use that i found throughout throughout my travels was cutting

00:21:48.720 that pork butt down maybe in half or into four portions so that you create more surface area

00:21:53.240 so that that heat can work around the meat in a shorter period of time or what i find a lot

00:21:58.040 of folks doing is the old texas crutch method uh and this is one of my favorite things that i found

00:22:03.200 people doing with ribs and brisket and even the pork butt they'll smoke it for you know four to six

00:22:08.560 hours over the fire and then they'll pull it off and they'll wrap it in aluminum foil and what that

00:22:13.280 does is it it prevents any more smoke from penetrating the meat but it creates sort of a

00:22:17.420 convection style cooking so that it continues to cook and tenderize the meat and i find that if you use

00:22:23.140 that method instead of it taking you know 16 hours you might be able to pull the whole thing off in

00:22:27.000 10 or 12 hours instead okay that makes sense then like what do you do after you smoke it what do you

00:22:33.580 think is the best way to to prepare to present them you know for me shred it slice it yeah there's

00:22:39.580 again uh thousands of opinions on it the first thing you need to do just like when you're cooking a

00:22:44.220 great steak is you need to let it rest that was another commonality that every pit master that i met

00:22:49.460 within my travels agreed so whether it was 30 minutes off the uh the heat or even up to an hour

00:22:54.180 or a few hours it's important to allow that meat to rest it gets its name pulled pork from just actually

00:23:00.180 what you do you should literally be able to pull the bone out of it clean there should be no meat on

00:23:04.480 the bone that's when you know that you've cooked it to the right temperature most folks will tell you

00:23:08.340 that you want to cook it to 200 to 205 degrees to make sure that it's going to pull correctly so it

00:23:13.160 should be super super tender and pull easily carolina style because they're typically cooking a whole

00:23:18.260 hog they tend to chop the meat so they'll work cleaver into the meat and actually have a chopped

00:23:23.300 meat and then when you mentioned sliced i didn't come across that a whole lot with the actual pork

00:23:27.760 butt up in kentucky we came across barbecued mutton which was typically chipped which would be more of

00:23:33.240 a pulled style or they would actually slice that so that was the only place that we came across a slice

00:23:37.860 style of the butt okay and suggestions on what to serve with your pork butt just like coleslaw

00:23:43.580 baked beans i mean are is baked beans a thing like for southern barbecue is that a texas thing

00:23:47.860 oh baked beans are huge i think we give you probably 75 80 side recipes for uh rounding

00:23:54.240 out the pork butt you know and so traditionally it's served on a sandwich right you can choose

00:23:58.640 whether you want to add sauce to it if you want to top it with a slaw or pickles or onions you're

00:24:03.200 going to get a lot of different recipes for the method of service i think what's really cool is

00:24:06.540 you know in texas they serve their pulled pork on tacos right i came across a pulled pork ramen where

00:24:12.940 they're actually taking the pork meat and infusing it into a a bowl of noodles and ramen so for me

00:24:18.280 however you want to serve it there's a lot of different variances and i think this is a good

00:24:21.860 point you know we've talked a lot about a pretty lengthy cooking process whether it's 20 hours or a

00:24:26.840 few hours it's a big commitment i wanted to write a book in a way that if you didn't have time to cook

00:24:33.320 your own butt you could go to your local grocery store or your local barbecue restaurant and pick up a

00:24:38.460 pound or two of of pulled or chipped pork and use that as a base to all the other recipes in the book 0.95

00:24:44.540 so if you're if your time is a pinch and you still want to make these recipes just outsource that person

00:24:49.740 that portion to uh the local store or restaurant and you can still get a lot of enjoyment out of

00:24:54.560 cooking the recipes all right so i'm from oklahoma grew up in texas a little bit we can't talk we can't

00:25:00.260 talk barbecue talking beef let's talk brisket like man i've messed up lots of briskets before

00:25:06.380 trying to cook is they're just it's such a finicky piece of meat i mean what's the secret to make

00:25:11.280 sure you get something that's just nice and tender and just just it's it's you can eat it right like

00:25:17.560 you're not like chewing a piece of leather yeah i gotta be honest with you a friend of mine who works

00:25:22.580 for the fbi told me about a place in san antonio called b daddy's barbecue you gotta be you know when

00:25:29.140 you think about it finding a pork butt in texas was really difficult but the reason i went there is

00:25:33.120 because you have so many military guys that are down there from other parts of the south 0.91

00:25:36.600 that just demanded a pork butt i went for the pork butt but i could not leave because of the beef

00:25:42.520 ribs and the brisket you know one thing about brisket is it's hard to find and source a quality

00:25:47.680 of of meat i mean you've got to really spend a good bit of money to get a great cut you know depending on

00:25:52.720 the time of the year that the cows are actually slaughtered that's going to play a big part into the

00:25:56.640 quality of the cut that you're actually going to smoke from there it is like i said time and

00:26:01.000 temperature equals results br anderson who's the pit master down there he uses salt and pepper

00:26:05.520 he smokes it low and slow and then he actually wraps his kind of in a craft style paper so it's

00:26:11.160 it's a bit of that texas crutch method but not using foil so it keeps it nice and moist but it's not

00:26:16.800 kind of convecting that heat so it's a little bit more gentle of a cooking method you know i think

00:26:21.280 brisket is a finicky meat you know you want it to be moist you want it to be fall apart tender

00:26:25.260 and there's a fine line typically most pit masters will tell you that they've got about a 30 minute

00:26:30.000 window to where it needs a little bit more cooking and then if you go too long it's going to be dry

00:26:34.760 and i think it's just something that you have to perfect every time but we certainly give you his

00:26:38.340 recipe and method for you to try out at your own home that's awesome well hey matt been a great

00:26:42.680 conversation where can people learn more about the book and your work yeah thank you for having me

00:26:47.320 back we are going to do some of the recipes on on the blog at the art of manliness and then you

00:26:52.200 can also check me out uh instagram at matt more music or uh via my site at mattrmore.com

00:26:58.280 awesome matt more thank you so much for your time it's been a pleasure hey brett thanks

00:27:02.640 my guest today was matt more his latest book is the south's best butts it's available on amazon.com

00:27:07.480 and bookstores everywhere pick up a copy also you can check out more about his work at mattmore.com

00:27:12.900 also check out our show notes at aom.is slash pork butt where you find links to resources we

00:27:17.960 delve deeper into this topic and you can find more of matt's cooking content at theartofmanliness.com

00:27:22.960 well that wraps up another edition of the art of manliness podcast for more manly tips and advice

00:27:38.480 make sure to check out the art of manliness website at artofmanliness.com if you enjoy the

00:27:42.680 show i've got something out of it i'd appreciate it if you give us a review on itunes or stitcher

00:27:45.860 that helps us out a lot as always thank you for your continued support and until next time this is

00:27:49.900 brem mckay telling you to stay manly

00:27:52.120 you

The Art of Manliness - April 25, 2017

#298： The History of BBQ and Becoming a Backyard Pitmaster

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