#298： The History of BBQ and Becoming a Backyard Pitmaster
Episode Stats
Summary
Southern barbecue is a uniquely American food, and one thing that unites southern barbecue is its unabashed love for the humble pork butt. My guest today on the show has taken a tour of the south to find barbecue joints who are taking this traditional choice of meat and doing new things with it while sticking to the roots of southern barbecue. His name is Matt Morehouse, and he's our food contributor here at The Art of Manliness and his latest book is The South's Best Butts: Pit Master Secrets for Southern BBQ perfection.
Transcript
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brad mckay here and welcome to another edition of the art of manliness podcast well southern
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barbecue is a uniquely american food and depending on which part of the south you're in you're going
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to get a different answer as to what is true southern barbecue despite the differences one
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thing that unites southern barbecue is its unabashed love for the humble pork butt my guest today on the
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show has taken a tour of the south to find barbecue joints who are taking this traditional choice of
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meat and doing new things with it while sticking to the roots of southern q his name is matt more
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he's our food contributor here at aom and his latest book is the south's best butts pit master
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secrets for southern barbecue perfection today on the show matt discusses the details of the history
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of barbecue and explains why pork is a staple in the southern variety of barbecue he then explains
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what exactly a pork butt is and no it's not the rear of a pig and why it's such an ideal meat for
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smoking he then shares how and why barbecue flavors and techniques differ in different parts of the
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south and highlights a few pit masters who are adding new takes on this traditional dish we then
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end our conversation by going through a step-by-step process of smoking the perfect pork butt as well as
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some dishes you can prepare with it at your next barbecue your mouth is going to be watering after
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you hear the show after the show is over check out our show notes at aom.is slash pork butt where you
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find links to resources where you can delve deeper into this topic
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matt more welcome back to the show thanks so much for having me back on so for those of you who follow
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the art of manliness website matt has been contributing food content for us over the years
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a lot of just great recipes for guys who want to cook and host and things like that had him on the show
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while that go for his book the southern gentleman's kitchen really fantastic cookbook and he's got a
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new one out this time it's dedicated to the wonderful world of barbecue particularly southern
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barbecue so matt what was the inspiration for you to travel around the american south in search of the
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perfect barbecue pork butt you know i like to say that opinions are like butts everybody has one and
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being a nashville guy i like to liken everything to music so i think in in terms of barbecue today
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and you mentioned particularly southern barbecue i don't know that there's any other barbecue besides
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southern barbecue that starts our first opinion for the podcast there's texas barbecue we can get into
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that hey i went to texas i went to texas i went to oklahoma so i don't know that washington state
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truly has barbecue sorry for any listeners up that way for me i i wanted to uh to go on a discovery
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it's commonly agreed upon the barbecue belt is made up of 12 states think about the carolinas
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georgia louisiana across the uh the south all the way to texas up up to oklahoma the only people that
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we kind of forget about in the south is florida sorry but i wanted to go out on the road and
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showcase all the different styles that regional barbecue has you know dry rubs in memphis mustard
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based sauces in and south carolina white based sauces in and alabama and by doing a focus on
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the pork butt that was kind of my medium through which we looked at all the different types of
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recipes so you're getting a lot of recipes for woods you're getting techniques uh dry rubs whether
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it's sauced or not how it's served and then of course we round out the book not just with pork butt
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but we've got brisket and smoked chicken wings and all the sides and desserts that you could ever dream
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of all right so for our listeners who aren't familiar what is the pork butt is it actually
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the pig's butt no it's a common misconception right the pork butt actually the butt is actually
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the ham cut but the pork butt as we're referring to it is actually the pork shoulder and again there's
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a lot of opinions there's a lot of mystery behind where that name came from but the pork butt got its
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name back in the day because they used to salt cure the shoulder cut along with all of the other
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cuts and and pack them in in barrels and those barrels were sold and and the the terminology to
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refer to that barrel was a butt b-u-t-t it's where we get the name boston butt so it's actually the
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shoulder cut which typically is a really tough cut you know it's a lot of muscle a bit sinewy and
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that's what requires such long cooking periods from anywhere from 20 hours as i discovered in st louis
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all the way down to just a couple of hours and that's the unique thing about it there's kind of 20 ways
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to skin a cat in the same way with a pork butt so is that why the pork butt is often used in
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barbecuing because it requires you know a considerable amount of cooking time to get it nice and tender
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yeah i mean barbecue traces its name most commonly to the term barbacoa which is roasting meats over
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open coals on spits i think the pork butt is so popular because it's really ubiquitous sorry for the
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texas and oklahomans but you know to me the pig is the cornerstone of southern barbecue and i think that
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the pork butt is kind of that veritable cut that everyone goes back to you know it's a humble cut
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it's cheap stretches to feed a crowd and for me it's the starting point for kind of defining cue
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as i mentioned earlier you know liking and everything the music i think ribs for a long time have have
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served as basically the lead singer of the band you know everybody loves ribs they're adored by all but
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they're quite finicky to prepare and also when you're consuming them you know i think if you look at
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texas and oklahoma barbecue brisket has come on on the spotlight it's kind of like the lead guitarist
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is trying to steal some of that spotlight from the rib but the pork butt has always served as kind of
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the drummer or the basis behind the scenes keeping everybody in time and i wanted to to pay homage to
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it to uncover what people are doing with that cut from state to state to state right you know i've never
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been a fan of ribs i mean i'll like them but like it's not like my favorite it's not my favorite thing
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when there's barbecue i'm like i'll have a rib that's it but i'd rather eat you know
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a great rib yeah i mean pulled pork is obviously one of my favorites but a great rib can be
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transcending but you more often than not come across really really bad ribs than you do great
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ribs i'll tell you uh one of the places we featured in the book is a place called b daddy's barbecue in
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san antonio texas and they're known for their beef brisket and beef ribs and let me tell you what man
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i ate more than my weights full of beef ribs that afternoon in san antonio gotta do it right so let's
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talk about the history of barbecue it's a predominantly southern phenomenon it's it's been
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transported to other parts of the country but what's the history of barbecue in the south why
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is it such a big thing there it's cheap uh you know pigs were first brought over by de soto to
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florida back in the 1400s and it was an animal that could survive long voyages at sea and then it
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didn't need a whole lot of domestication when it came stateside they could basically let them run
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wild a problem that we're dealing with still today in the south that being said to to cook
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these meats it does take a low temperature and quite a bit of time so i think just regionally
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it's what caused it really to proliferate throughout the south and i dig into the history of one of the
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unique things that we uncovered is you know the south has had a long storied culture some of it's
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more troubled than any but back in the in the plantation era one of the rare acts of humanity that you
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would see amongst slave owners and slaves is they would throw and they're still called these today
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pig pickings where actually you broke the bonds of social hierarchy and the slave masters would
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literally dine with slaves and it was a time of celebration it was a time of harvest and that's
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still a tradition that's carried on obviously not in the same bounds that it is back in the past so
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you know i think it's always played an important role in the civil war it was a food that could be
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salt cured and preserved to keep people fighting and cheaply served but i also love politics and i'm not
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going to talk politics today but barbecue in the south is often found at political rallies it's found
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at weddings it's found at funerals it's a food that everybody loves it's a food that can serve
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the masses and i think it's the ultimate comfort food though in different forms you find it throughout
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the south and now you're finding it throughout the u.s and the rest of the world yeah i mean i think
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that's interesting the history part was really fascinating that people in the 17th century or
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the 18th century were having like barbecue parties right i mean it's like it's crazy to think
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like we think it's like oh it's this thing that we've been doing just for a short time but
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like no it's been going on for hundreds of years yeah that whole hog style of cooking you know one of the
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other things is the entomology of the word barbecue as i mentioned earlier most people relate it back
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to the term barbacoa some people give credit to the french haitians that call it barbacoa which is
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basically nose to tail if you will or head to tail and that's kind of to describe the whole hog method
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of cooking in the carolinas and one of my favorites is beer bar cue pool which was an advertisement that
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you found throughout the carolinas that daniel von cited saying that you would find inside a bar
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a beer uh barbecue and pool i don't think that's necessarily where we got the name barbecue but it
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happened to be one of my favorites when i was doing the research on the history of the word so you
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mentioned earlier that as you go throughout the barbecue belt in the south there's the different
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regions of the south have their own take on barbecue and you mentioned a few of them so how does the
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flavor and the techniques of barbecuing change depending on which part of the south you're in
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yeah great question the carolinas specifically north carolina is most known for cooking a whole
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hog so when we visited wilbur's in goldsburg north carolina they don't actually just cook pork butts
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they cook a whole hog and they chop all of that meat together so you're getting all portions and it
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has a unique flavor typically a real strong hickory wood is used to smoke and they don't have really
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any sauce whatsoever it's just a apple cider vinegar with crushed red pepper and salt as you make
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your way down through south carolina you're starting to pick up more of a mustard based sauce and a lot
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of folks give credit to a lot of the german immigrants that came over during that time period
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as you go to georgia and louisiana and alabama alabama you pick up a little bit of a white sauce
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which is based out of a mayonnaise and if you go up to kentucky you find not really pork you find
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mutton and then as you make your way west most people typically say that you first find tomato
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and a little bit of sweetness in the form of a syrup as you find memphis and st louis and kansas
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city style barbecues and of course as you go all the way further west you're going to pick up more
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beef in the state of texas and one of my favorites you know right there in tulsa oklahoma they called
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smoked bologna they called it oklahoma tenderloin so there's a lot of different things that make up
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the different styles but those are the commonly agreed upon as you make your way from east to west
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so do you know why the tomato and like the more sweet is in like missouri and kansas city do you
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i mean you know like you mentioned that the mustard base from the germans and the carolina
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stuff is more from whatever like why the sweetness as you get west you know it's a good question and
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that's one that you might have me stumped on i didn't find anything that out of particularity
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would lend itself to say that tomatoes appeared more in that side of the country i think that just
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tastes are different you know to me people ask all the time well what is good barbecue i think we
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all associate barbecue with what we grow up on so for folks in kansas city and memphis and st louis
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that tend to like a sweeter based sauce when they try carolina style barbecue which i said is just
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vinegar a little bit of heat from crushed red pepper and salt they don't really consider it barbecue
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because it's not the barbecue that they grew up on so it's it's still something that's super super
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hyper regional but as to why you you get more maple syrup or cane syrup or something along those lines as
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to what makes it sweeter i just think it naturally evolves over time as people's tastes and preferences
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kind of carry on that way gotcha so i mean you mentioned i someone at people ask you like what
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makes good barbecue good barbecue you can have bad barbecue like there's bad ribs is it possible like
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to screw up a pork butt or is it a pretty forgiving meat piece of meat yeah i think one of the unique
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things about focusing a spotlight on the pork butt it is a forgiving cut right skip steel who's a pretty
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famous pit master at bogarts in st louis he said it perfectly he said you know cooking is a math
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problem time plus temperature equals results he's a gentleman that uses hickory he smokes his pork
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butts at 200 degrees for 20 hours that's quite a commitment right you know i found a gentleman in
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leachville arkansas at big butts barbecue that will actually break down the pork butts so he cuts them into
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one and a quarter inch steaks so you get more surface area and he cooks them at about 325 degrees for
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just a couple of hours the results were different but they were still both delicious so i think in
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terms of the other cuts it's like a brisket which you know once it's dry it's not good anymore ribs can
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be quite dry or not a whole lot of meat on the bone the pork butt is one that is quite humble and
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forgiving and there's a lot of different ways to approach it in this book you visit all these different
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barbecue joints big ones in the south i mean what do you think they all had in common and besides that
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like what what were the big differences besides the regional flavors what they're doing they have
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differences in the way they approach barbecue or innovation or sticking to tradition yeah great
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question i think we'll dig into it in just a bit but you know the commonality was just great people
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these pit masters that show up to work at three or four o'clock in the morning to cook all day
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all day long i mean they're judged more than a michelin star chef so in those instances the
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commonality was just meeting great people in terms of innovation yes i think anybody can cook great
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barbecue on the most expensive piece of equipment whatever that might be so if you just have a kettle
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grill that you can pick up at any hardware store with some charcoal that's one of my favorite ways to
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cook digging a hole into the backyard to cook a whole hog but we did find quite a bit of innovation
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nowadays you come across commercial smokers that can smoke you know 20 and 30 butts at a time that
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is using gas to to control temperature precisely and then they're using some actual real wood for
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smoke flavor i think the rule is going back to time and temperature equals results it doesn't really
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matter what you cook on or how expensive your equipment is the food is going to be quite a bit better if
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you're actually a master of time and temperature control than anything else yeah i have a buddy who does
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a lot of barbecue and he says you can use a metal garbage can and still cook good because it all
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comes down to time and temperature absolutely all those things you're going to get a good thing
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absolutely was there any places that you came across that you saw were doing something really
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unique with barbecue to change things up yeah i think one of my favorite places that i came across
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is called heirloom barbecue in atlanta georgia they literally the georgia department of transportation
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tried to shut the restaurant down because the traffic getting into the restaurant was so bad it was
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causing problems that's no joke to those in atlanta with the i-85 bridge that recently collapsed
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atlanta is already a traffic-ridden city but what you find there is a husband and wife cody taylor is
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originally from knoxville tennessee spent a lot of time in texas so he is a true southern barbecue pit
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master he married his wife jeon lee who happens to be a korean pop star and i mean it she's like
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britney spears big in south korea she wanted to get away from the spotlight tended the cordon blue in
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atlanta and started cooking they got married and what you have is this harmonious flavor of true
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traditional southern barbecue married with a korean influence so i don't want to say korean barbecue at
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all it's it's it's nothing like that you're finding pork butts that are smoked you know 16 hours over
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hickory but they're marinated in a korean red chili rub called gochujong which gives it this incredible
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umami flavor they've got instead of a traditional coleslaw they make a kimchi slaw their pickles are all done
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in a south korean way so to me that was a really innovative style of cooking in a barbecue where
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they're really paying homage to the roots but they're making it their own but it is sort of that
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innovation is baked in the dna of barbecue because it's like you're combining all these different
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cultures into this new food right absolutely you know i think the thing about barbecue is we're
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probably a little slow to walk towards innovation most purists might go to a place like heirloom and claim
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that because of some of the influences you know it wasn't traditional southern style barbecue i i would
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hotly disagree i think that barbecue is a constantly evolving space you know and that's one of the
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things that i wanted to showcase in the book is a whole lot of diversity most people think of of pit
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masters being uh men but there was quite a quite a few females uh helen turner in brownsville tennessee
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i mean she's just as as tough as any man i've ever met i mean she's building big fires in an open pit
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at four o'clock in the morning and working all day the front of house the back of house so you're
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going to come across people that of all different walks of life that are carrying on the tradition
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of barbecue and making their own stamp on it as they continue to carry that tradition on so besides
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you know highlighting these different barbecue places barbecue joints it's a cookbook it's recipes
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on how to cook pork butt and other things if you're up for it i mean i'd love to walk our listeners
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through on how to smoke or cook the perfect pork butt for barbecue so let's start with the meat
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like or you say pork butt's pretty forgiving but when you go and buy a pork butt is it something
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you can look at the meat and say yeah this is going to be a good piece of meat to cook or
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no or i should stay away from this one is anything you can tell by the meat yeah so the cool thing
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about it when you go to the store these are pretty consistent uh you're going to find them most often
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in a range anywhere from eight to 12 pounds i tend to like one around 10 pounds if i can find that
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you'll find how much does that feed goodness gracious at least 20 people right and typically
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you're going to find those and i think your listeners will really appreciate this i buy pork
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butts at my local grocery store here in nashville tennessee which sometimes has higher food costs
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for 99 cents a pound right so i can buy a 10 pound butt for 10 dollars and typically feed you know 15
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to 20 people on depending on the method that i'm using whether it's sandwiches or just on a plate or
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whatever so you're going to find those you want to look for ones that have a nice fat cap on the top
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and it'll also include the bone in the shoulder that's really what you're looking for and like i
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said it's super humble it's super cheap you want to find ones that are fresh but i think any local
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market you can go down to or ask your butcher to source for you it's a really cheap affordable
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food source that you can find basically anywhere all right let's talk about the thing that causes a lot
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of consternation yeah seasoning is it wet or wet or dry seasoning what do you do i came across a lot
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of different methods so i'll let you guys dig into some of the different recipes me i i prefer a dry
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rub right uh what's going to flavor the butt and again i'm one that's a little bit more of a purist
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i don't really use a whole lot of sauce after i've cooked my meat it's kind of more of a carolina style
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where i might add a little bit of vinegar salt and pepper so by using a dry rub it's one of my first
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chances besides using actual smoke to flavor the meat the dry rub is really going to be my chance so i
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love a really really liberal dry rub i saw it just as simple as coarse salt and pepper all the way up
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to using you know ground garlic and onion powders and mustard powders and chili powders but for me i'm
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one that likes to really work a rub of which you'll find plenty of recipes in the book all throughout
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every crevice of the meat before it hits the fire and if you do a a wet seasoning wet rub do you do
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that after or before you start smoking it what i found yeah a good question i found a lot of people
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doing kind of like a brine right so even if it was kind of a salt and water solution where they were
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submerging the uh the actual pork butt overnight or i came across some that that actually would coat it
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in italian dressing and let it sit overnight the one commonality though before uh whether they used a
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dry rub or not they were sure to really really wipe down and dry off either the brine or the
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marinade before they put it on the smoker you don't want to have a wet butt sorry for the pun there and
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then add a dry rub to it because in the first few hours remember we're cooking at a very low temperature
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so what happens is all that dry rub is just going to kind of steam off the meat and it kind of goes
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against the purpose of giving it a dry rub so if you do do a brine or a marinade of any kind on the
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you want to make sure that you wipe it completely dry before you put a rub or before you even put
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it on the fire gotcha okay let's talk about actually cooking it so you smoke it right that's the that's
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traditional way of cooking pork butt is smoking it right yeah true barbecue is is taking you know
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wood coals i've most often came across mesquite or hickory coals oak coals as well some people prefer
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fruit woods like an apple or percon that can add a little bit sweeter smoke to the meat but true folks
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will tell you that you have to actually burn down logs of of wood into coals and then you shovel
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those coals underneath the meat and the idea is that as the meat kind of gives up its its fatty
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goodness it it kind of drips down on the fire and that smoke flavors the meat throughout the long
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process that's the tried and true method you know you can also get away with using lump charcoal which
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kind of makes that step a little bit easier and then use wood chips to help provide more smoke flavor
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you know a lot of people are against briquette style charcoal but i came across a gentleman in
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arkansas that that always used briquettes and got great results so i think there's a lot of different
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methods there but in terms of the smoke what i find is that most people are trying to impart smoke
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flavor for the first one to four hours so if you're looking at a pork butt that's about 10 to 12 pounds
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at around 250 to 275 degrees you're looking at probably a cooking time anywhere between 12 to 16 hours with
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most people adding some of the actual wood chips into the first four hours of cooking wow so you're
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looking at 16 hours like so if you were like wanting to smoke something for the weekend or for
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like a party like say a saturday night when would you need to start ideally hey that's the fun part
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if you ask me you start the night before you turn on some waylon jennings and crack open a cold beer
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you know that's one of the things where having a little bit more sophisticated smoker plays to your
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advantage using a kettle style grill you're going to be up a couple times during the night to replace
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charcoal if you have an egg style cooker you can you can get that thing set and it'll hold the
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temperature for you for 16 20 hours so that's one advantage i will say of having a little bit more
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expensive equipment or even a gas style cooker where you can absolutely regulate that temperature to a
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tea and then add your wood chips for that smoke flavor but most folks are doing this uh the night
00:21:43.880
before you know one shortcut that you can use that i found throughout throughout my travels was cutting
00:21:48.720
that pork butt down maybe in half or into four portions so that you create more surface area
00:21:53.240
so that that heat can work around the meat in a shorter period of time or what i find a lot
00:21:58.040
of folks doing is the old texas crutch method uh and this is one of my favorite things that i found
00:22:03.200
people doing with ribs and brisket and even the pork butt they'll smoke it for you know four to six
00:22:08.560
hours over the fire and then they'll pull it off and they'll wrap it in aluminum foil and what that
00:22:13.280
does is it it prevents any more smoke from penetrating the meat but it creates sort of a
00:22:17.420
convection style cooking so that it continues to cook and tenderize the meat and i find that if you use
00:22:23.140
that method instead of it taking you know 16 hours you might be able to pull the whole thing off in
00:22:27.000
10 or 12 hours instead okay that makes sense then like what do you do after you smoke it what do you
00:22:33.580
think is the best way to to prepare to present them you know for me shred it slice it yeah there's
00:22:39.580
again uh thousands of opinions on it the first thing you need to do just like when you're cooking a
00:22:44.220
great steak is you need to let it rest that was another commonality that every pit master that i met
00:22:49.460
within my travels agreed so whether it was 30 minutes off the uh the heat or even up to an hour
00:22:54.180
or a few hours it's important to allow that meat to rest it gets its name pulled pork from just actually
00:23:00.180
what you do you should literally be able to pull the bone out of it clean there should be no meat on
00:23:04.480
the bone that's when you know that you've cooked it to the right temperature most folks will tell you
00:23:08.340
that you want to cook it to 200 to 205 degrees to make sure that it's going to pull correctly so it
00:23:13.160
should be super super tender and pull easily carolina style because they're typically cooking a whole
00:23:18.260
hog they tend to chop the meat so they'll work cleaver into the meat and actually have a chopped
00:23:23.300
meat and then when you mentioned sliced i didn't come across that a whole lot with the actual pork
00:23:27.760
butt up in kentucky we came across barbecued mutton which was typically chipped which would be more of
00:23:33.240
a pulled style or they would actually slice that so that was the only place that we came across a slice
00:23:37.860
style of the butt okay and suggestions on what to serve with your pork butt just like coleslaw
00:23:43.580
baked beans i mean are is baked beans a thing like for southern barbecue is that a texas thing
00:23:47.860
oh baked beans are huge i think we give you probably 75 80 side recipes for uh rounding
00:23:54.240
out the pork butt you know and so traditionally it's served on a sandwich right you can choose
00:23:58.640
whether you want to add sauce to it if you want to top it with a slaw or pickles or onions you're
00:24:03.200
going to get a lot of different recipes for the method of service i think what's really cool is
00:24:06.540
you know in texas they serve their pulled pork on tacos right i came across a pulled pork ramen where
00:24:12.940
they're actually taking the pork meat and infusing it into a a bowl of noodles and ramen so for me
00:24:18.280
however you want to serve it there's a lot of different variances and i think this is a good
00:24:21.860
point you know we've talked a lot about a pretty lengthy cooking process whether it's 20 hours or a
00:24:26.840
few hours it's a big commitment i wanted to write a book in a way that if you didn't have time to cook
00:24:33.320
your own butt you could go to your local grocery store or your local barbecue restaurant and pick up a
00:24:38.460
pound or two of of pulled or chipped pork and use that as a base to all the other recipes in the book
00:24:44.540
so if you're if your time is a pinch and you still want to make these recipes just outsource that person
00:24:49.740
that portion to uh the local store or restaurant and you can still get a lot of enjoyment out of
00:24:54.560
cooking the recipes all right so i'm from oklahoma grew up in texas a little bit we can't talk we can't
00:25:00.260
talk barbecue talking beef let's talk brisket like man i've messed up lots of briskets before
00:25:06.380
trying to cook is they're just it's such a finicky piece of meat i mean what's the secret to make
00:25:11.280
sure you get something that's just nice and tender and just just it's it's you can eat it right like
00:25:17.560
you're not like chewing a piece of leather yeah i gotta be honest with you a friend of mine who works
00:25:22.580
for the fbi told me about a place in san antonio called b daddy's barbecue you gotta be you know when
00:25:29.140
you think about it finding a pork butt in texas was really difficult but the reason i went there is
00:25:33.120
because you have so many military guys that are down there from other parts of the south
00:25:36.600
that just demanded a pork butt i went for the pork butt but i could not leave because of the beef
00:25:42.520
ribs and the brisket you know one thing about brisket is it's hard to find and source a quality
00:25:47.680
of of meat i mean you've got to really spend a good bit of money to get a great cut you know depending on
00:25:52.720
the time of the year that the cows are actually slaughtered that's going to play a big part into the
00:25:56.640
quality of the cut that you're actually going to smoke from there it is like i said time and
00:26:01.000
temperature equals results br anderson who's the pit master down there he uses salt and pepper
00:26:05.520
he smokes it low and slow and then he actually wraps his kind of in a craft style paper so it's
00:26:11.160
it's a bit of that texas crutch method but not using foil so it keeps it nice and moist but it's not
00:26:16.800
kind of convecting that heat so it's a little bit more gentle of a cooking method you know i think
00:26:21.280
brisket is a finicky meat you know you want it to be moist you want it to be fall apart tender
00:26:25.260
and there's a fine line typically most pit masters will tell you that they've got about a 30 minute
00:26:30.000
window to where it needs a little bit more cooking and then if you go too long it's going to be dry
00:26:34.760
and i think it's just something that you have to perfect every time but we certainly give you his
00:26:38.340
recipe and method for you to try out at your own home that's awesome well hey matt been a great
00:26:42.680
conversation where can people learn more about the book and your work yeah thank you for having me
00:26:47.320
back we are going to do some of the recipes on on the blog at the art of manliness and then you
00:26:52.200
can also check me out uh instagram at matt more music or uh via my site at mattrmore.com
00:26:58.280
awesome matt more thank you so much for your time it's been a pleasure hey brett thanks
00:27:02.640
my guest today was matt more his latest book is the south's best butts it's available on amazon.com
00:27:07.480
and bookstores everywhere pick up a copy also you can check out more about his work at mattmore.com
00:27:12.900
also check out our show notes at aom.is slash pork butt where you find links to resources we
00:27:17.960
delve deeper into this topic and you can find more of matt's cooking content at theartofmanliness.com
00:27:22.960
well that wraps up another edition of the art of manliness podcast for more manly tips and advice
00:27:38.480
make sure to check out the art of manliness website at artofmanliness.com if you enjoy the
00:27:42.680
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00:27:45.860
that helps us out a lot as always thank you for your continued support and until next time this is