The Art of Manliness - #478： Mastering Mindset to Improve Happiness, Health, and Longevity

00:00:00.000 brett mckay here and welcome to another edition of the art of manliness podcast having a positive

00:00:19.060 mindset comes with an unbelievable number of benefits from better physical and mental health

00:00:23.040 to improved relationships and performance at work if you've got a more negative bent

00:00:26.620 you're really missing out on a lot fortunately my guest says it's possible to shift into a more

00:00:31.680 positive gear her name is dr katherine sanderson she's a professor of psychology at amherst college

00:00:36.360 in her latest book the positive shift she highlights scores of studies that show how a positive mindset

00:00:41.160 can make us healthier and happier and how that mindset can be achieved today she shares those

00:00:45.340 insights with us beginning with debunking the idea that a positive outlook means being naively

00:00:49.600 pollyannish in disposition katherine then walks through what the research says about the surprisingly

00:00:54.060 robust benefits of having a positive perspective which affect every area of your life we then

00:00:58.400 discuss specific tactics you can use to develop a more positive outlook even if you have an inborn

00:01:02.900 inclination towards being negative after the show's over check out our show notes at aom.is

00:01:07.420 slash positive shift

00:01:08.660 katherine sanderson welcome to the show thanks so much for the invitation to be here so you are a

00:01:26.860 professor of psychology and you've written this book the positive shift mastering mindset to improve

00:01:32.720 happiness health and longevity so what got you researching and writing about the benefits of

00:01:38.640 positivity or positive outlook on life so i teach a variety of classes i do research on health

00:01:44.660 psychology issues i do research on relationship satisfaction and within about the last 10 years

00:01:50.540 within the field of psychology there's been a growing movement to looking at how those things

00:01:56.660 actually interrelate that in fact the quality of our relationships has a major impact on our health

00:02:02.840 and as i started doing more and more reading and research on this topic

00:02:06.660 it really became clear to me that so much of our happiness and our health is actually within our own

00:02:13.300 control and for me someone who's not naturally positive this was actually really encouraging

00:02:19.240 yeah i found that i'm i'm sort of an eeyore at times too we'll talk about how we can control

00:02:24.860 that and how much of that's genetic but i feel your pain right but let's let's what do we mean by

00:02:29.540 positivity because i think a lot of people listening to this particularly guys they think of like

00:02:33.440 hayley mills and pollyanna you know just like it's like super super positive super cheesy is that what

00:02:41.140 positivity look like or what what does it look like actually yeah that's a really important question

00:02:45.980 because it in fact is not you know going through life like everything is perfect and it's all you

00:02:50.700 know sunshine and rainbows positivity basically means not getting bogged down in terms of negative

00:02:57.840 emotions and i think for women you're exactly right that there may be different sort of ways in

00:03:02.660 which that manifests itself women are more likely to feel anxious depressed men have other kinds of

00:03:09.460 negative emotions that are more prevalent like anger for example if you think about road rage or

00:03:14.140 something so positivity isn't about going through life just being like everything's wonderful but it's

00:03:19.160 really about reducing the experience of negative emotions whether that's anxiety depression loneliness

00:03:24.640 anger frustration etc so it looks a lot like resilience oftentimes absolutely and it's frankly

00:03:31.020 being able to bounce back when bad things happen because the reality is bad things do happen and they

00:03:37.780 happen to all of us personally professionally and so on and people who have a positive outlook are

00:03:44.680 better able to buffer these negative experiences and not sort of get stuck in negativity so you spent a lot

00:03:52.440 of the book talking about the benefits of positivity let's walk through some of those for example what

00:03:57.720 are the we often think of positivity as an emotional a mental uh the benefits there but there's actually

00:04:04.420 physiological like health benefits of having a positive outlook on life what are some of those

00:04:08.700 so that's such an important finding because what we now see in the research is that people who

00:04:14.440 have a general positive outlook on life experience lots of positive benefits and this includes as you

00:04:21.820 noted physiological changes in the body so this is things like lower blood pressure you know lower

00:04:27.760 heart rate there's evidence of lower levels of a hormone a stress hormone called cortisol and the

00:04:33.860 people who tend to be positive have lower levels of these other physiological markers that are linked

00:04:39.780 with worse health outcomes so what are some of like the worst the bad health outcomes that can come

00:04:45.160 from being like an eeyore all the time well pretty much you name it and it's there i mean from small

00:04:51.680 things like people who are more negative are more likely to acquire the common cold so there's a you know

00:04:57.840 pretty low level problem that we've all experienced but research has shown that if you measure people's levels

00:05:02.320 of positivity and then with the people's permission you inject a cold virus in their nostril people who are

00:05:09.680 positive are less likely to manifest signs of the cold later on so that's just a really clear marker

00:05:16.020 of how people who are positive have a stronger immune system and therefore can buffer negative effects of

00:05:23.240 things that would get other people down so there's a you know pretty low level problem the common cold

00:05:28.420 research has also shown that people with a positive outlook are less likely to experience more serious

00:05:34.180 problems heart attack stroke angina you know cardiovascular problems there's also evidence

00:05:39.520 that people with a more positive outlook actually live longer so really across the whole range of

00:05:46.280 different levels of health outcomes there are tremendous benefits of positivity yeah i mean it can

00:05:51.080 even affect things like obesity or blood glucose because cortisol all plays an influence on whether you

00:05:56.760 retain fat or whether your blood glucose is elevated and that can lead to type 2 diabetes

00:06:01.320 absolutely and and that's one of the ways in which the research has been so clear over the last you

00:06:07.700 know five to ten years that we're now understanding the interconnection between our thoughts and

00:06:13.420 physiological markers in the body that of course are linked to these negative health outcomes well so

00:06:18.460 you talk you mentioned aging people who have a positive outlook on life tend to live longer than

00:06:23.320 people who are negative but also having a positive outlook on life can make aging more enjoyable and filled

00:06:29.700 with vitality because people typically think of getting old as like oh like the grandma and like

00:06:34.080 movies from the 1950s where they wear a shawl and you're just like shuttling through the hallways like it

00:06:39.500 doesn't have to be like that no and and one of the things that i just think is so clear is that in our

00:06:45.140 society images about getting older are so negative i literally turned 50 about a month ago and people

00:06:53.480 were like oh you know oh 50 whatever and i'm like you know what it feels great to be 50 and i really hope

00:06:58.820 i feel that way at 60 and 70 and beyond but the reason why we have these negative images is that

00:07:04.480 exactly as you said we have this assumption that you know people shuffle along and you know people

00:07:09.160 can't drive and you know they develop you know hard of hearing and dementia and whatever all of these

00:07:15.380 stereotypes are so negative and and people with a positive outlook about aging don't buy into those

00:07:21.260 and therefore continue to be active in their careers and communities and volunteer work and so on

00:07:27.300 and very physically active because they don't buy into those stereotypes all right so they have a

00:07:32.640 positive outlook on it and so yeah even like the whole that idea that as you get older you become

00:07:37.400 forgetful that's often just a self-fulfilling prophecy right exactly and i think one of the most

00:07:42.620 interesting findings is that if it's true that neurologically you know your brain decays with age

00:07:48.560 we should see that same association across cultures and the reality is you don't so in cultures in which

00:07:55.540 there are positive views about aging you know with age comes wisdom and experience and you know older

00:08:00.740 people have so much to give you don't see those negative associations with aging and decay and memory

00:08:07.520 and that really suggests it's not just a biological process it's very much self-fulfilling prophecy and

00:08:13.220 you see that those are cultures typically in the east correct yeah it's many asian cultures

00:08:17.160 right here in the west we think you're young it's it's great to be young here in the west not so much

00:08:23.100 to be old but that's not doesn't have to be true exactly also positivity can influence things like

00:08:28.580 your career correct absolutely because part of the issue is that people who are positive when they

00:08:34.780 experience a failure disappointment you know professional rejection etc they're able to bounce

00:08:40.460 back they're able to say you know what i'm going to try harder i'm going to approach this in a new way

00:08:45.120 and so on and so when negative things happen they don't get stuck and so professionally they can bounce

00:08:51.840 back from failure they also because they know they have this ability to bounce back they're less afraid

00:08:57.840 of trying that many people go through life being afraid of failure and rejection personally and

00:09:04.760 professionally and that leads them to not take risks and of course the reality is taking some risks

00:09:11.360 can really pay off in terms of career advancement in terms of development of romantic relationships

00:09:17.840 well we'll talk about relationships here in a bit but like going but staying on the career thing also

00:09:22.200 people just your co-workers will enjoy being around you more if you have a positive outlook right i mean

00:09:27.380 that helps a lot with your career absolutely and and many careers of course involve directly working

00:09:34.340 not only with co-workers but you report to people you have clients people report to you

00:09:39.500 so we have whole big networks of people within our professional lives and so people who are positive

00:09:45.500 generally get along better with other people people want to be around them more and of course we know

00:09:51.360 that happiness is contagious so hiring happy workers really pays off and that's one of the reasons why

00:09:57.900 many of the silicon valley companies have gone out of the way to make the workplace fun because they

00:10:04.120 understand the link between happiness and professional success how does our outlook on life whether it's

00:10:11.240 positive negative influence relationship what do the studies say there people who are positive tend to have

00:10:16.800 happier relationships in terms of friendships in terms of family relationships in terms of marriages you

00:10:22.260 know long-term relationships and so on and it's very clear that there is a an association between

00:10:30.020 marriage longevity so if you look at the benefits of marriage for health there are indeed benefits of

00:10:35.720 marriage on longevity and health outcomes overall but the key is it's not just being married it's having

00:10:41.520 a happy marriage and people who are full of positivity tend to relate to people better they tend to work

00:10:49.320 through conflicts instead of just burying them or denying them or letting them build up and so when problems

00:10:55.680 or issues arise in their relationships they're able to work through them solve them and maintain strong

00:11:01.360 and healthy relationships so there's one study you talked about the book that i thought was really

00:11:05.080 interesting was that people in relationships where they feel ambivalent about it where like they both

00:11:09.740 feel positive and negative or actually like they they're like worse off than people who are in like a

00:11:15.700 completely negative relationship like what's going on yeah right that's such an interesting finding and and

00:11:21.220 again research is still ongoing to really try to unpack exactly what's going on but one possibility

00:11:26.520 may be that when you have ambivalent feelings you feel really stuck so if a relationship is all good

00:11:32.860 of course that's great if a relationship is all bad you may actually be aware this relationship is

00:11:38.120 going to end i'm not going to invest time and energy into it maybe i'm even kind of looking to get out

00:11:42.920 of it or exploring other options if you're ambivalent it may mean that you feel really stuck because you

00:11:48.940 can recognize the bad but you can also recognize the good and that means that you just really get

00:11:54.480 mired in a situation and can't really decide whether to pull yourself out and that again has negative

00:12:00.840 effects i can see that happening in jobs too absolutely and and what's interesting is that clarity

00:12:07.460 is very decisive for people right because if you know this job is horrible or this job is great

00:12:13.320 that reduces the amount of time that you have to do what we call mentalizing meaning thinking about

00:12:19.920 it should i stay or should i go and and that sort of ambivalence in fact is very exhausting psychologically

00:12:26.960 we've been talking about a positive outlook we'll talk about what we can do to create more of a

00:12:31.400 positive outlook on our life while mitigating the the negative but how much of our outlook on life

00:12:37.240 whether it's positive negative is due to genetics like just our inborn temperament

00:12:41.440 so there's good news or bad news depending on who you are but about 50 of our happiness is due to

00:12:48.120 our genes and it's not that there's one you know happiness gene there's a lot of different genes that

00:12:53.760 play a role but about 50 of our happiness is in fact determined by our genes and that means that

00:12:59.380 some people really do have a head start but also i think there's a role that plays into that is like

00:13:04.140 your environment like i guess there's like whole idea of epigenetics right if you encounter certain

00:13:08.100 stressors it might turn on those unhappiness genes but if you didn't encounter them you might they might

00:13:13.240 not have been turned on absolutely and and so that means that genes play some role but they're not

00:13:18.780 definitive and and that means that no matter where you start on this you know genetic lottery

00:13:24.200 your environment clearly plays a role and that's why people can undergo the same sort of difficult

00:13:31.120 circumstance childhood trauma or you know growing up in poverty or you know times of war etc

00:13:37.420 and some people seem to be able to bounce back from that and some people really can't okay so if

00:13:43.700 50 is determined by genetics it means we have some control right you might have this sort of baseline

00:13:48.260 but you have some control what is 50 is in your control right that is a lot so what can we do

00:13:55.680 to start expecting good things to happen like if you're typically like an eeyore what can you do to

00:14:01.480 start having a mind shift to to occur mindset shift sure so really important question two sets of

00:14:08.200 things so one is actually being aware that your thoughts matter and so for people who naturally are

00:14:14.760 are somewhat negative and and i fall into this category and it sounds like you fall into this

00:14:19.100 category for people who are naturally negative they're often not aware of it they're just like

00:14:24.080 well that's just the world and they're not aware that that's actually not the world that's their

00:14:28.860 thoughts about the world so one being aware that your thoughts matter and trying to then catch

00:14:34.400 yourself if something negative or bad happens so that you can reframe it so the first step is really

00:14:41.920 changing your thoughts but that means you have to be aware when you're having these thoughts and you

00:14:47.220 have to practice reframing them so something that used to be seen as you know sort of this horrible

00:14:52.340 disaster you're able to put a more positive outlook on instead and so that's one set of things changing

00:14:59.700 your thoughts and well and i can give an example of that would that be helpful maybe that'd be helpful

00:15:03.460 yeah that'd be very helpful yeah so so here's an example that right now many high school seniors are

00:15:09.880 waiting to hear news you know from colleges and and many students will get rejected from you know

00:15:15.180 their top choice or whatever and they can think of that as a calamity oh my gosh you know i didn't get

00:15:20.360 into my top choice school and i'm never going to be happy or employed or you know whatever and and

00:15:24.600 that's an example of course of a of the total overreaction and and people could say hey you

00:15:30.080 know what i didn't get into my first choice school this other school is great i'm gonna make a lot of

00:15:33.560 friends you know i'm gonna have a great college experience and so when you get better at sort of

00:15:38.540 saying this horrible thing happened and putting a positive spin on it over time that gets more natural

00:15:44.020 i gave a talk a few years ago on happiness and during the q a a woman raised her hand and she said

00:15:51.140 you know whenever i'm stuck in traffic i just take a minute i take some deep breaths and i look out the

00:15:57.080 window and i admire the setting sun and it was like this super positive you know view of basically being

00:16:04.020 in a traffic jam and i said well thanks for that question and you know you really didn't need to come to

00:16:09.000 the talk because she of course was already doing all the right things but we can all get better at

00:16:14.320 taking a negative experience and and trying to reframe negative experience in some more positive

00:16:21.520 way and i imagine this is something that if you have a tendency to be in your that you'll have to 0.92

00:16:25.960 work on the rest of your life there'll never be a moment where like you're just a tigger right 1.00

00:16:30.940 naturally you probably have to work on it forever i think that's true although i will also say i think

00:16:36.040 it gets easier so i look at the example of you know let's say that you know you are not a runner

00:16:40.960 and you've decided you know you want to run a 10k or something the first day that you lace on your

00:16:45.560 shoes and go outside it might be hard to run a mile you know it might you might feel out of breath or

00:16:50.000 your knees might hurt or your ankles or whatever but over time your body adapts to it and you get better

00:16:55.620 at it so again as i said i'm naturally pretty negative but i've really been working on it in part you

00:17:01.500 know through writing this book so i had a disaster in december you know a month ago my computer hard

00:17:08.800 drive crashed and i lost everything i mean including a book manuscript that i was on deadline for and

00:17:18.800 you know it crashed i went in they were like we can do nothing you know your computer's under warranty

00:17:23.880 we can get you a new computer but um but you've lost everything and you know i came home and my husband

00:17:29.880 was like you seem to be handling this very well and i'm like you know what it's you know it's not

00:17:34.600 cancer it's not and he was like i can't believe it because he like felt worse about it than i did

00:17:39.460 so you know it was a bummer and i'm you know slowly kind of you know recreating what i had been working

00:17:44.780 on but there's an example in that there are times in which if that had happened to me two three days i

00:17:50.280 like would not have gotten out of bed and i would have been you know i'm never going to write a book

00:17:54.060 again and i have no ideas and every idea i ever had that was good was on that computer and you know so on

00:17:58.580 so there's an example so yeah for some people it comes easier but for all of us we actually can get

00:18:05.540 better at doing it with practice in part because we become aware oh yeah you know this is what i

00:18:10.980 tend to do and i should stop i had the the computer crash on me thing happened to me in law school i

00:18:16.480 had a paper like a like most of it done and i lost it and i had to rewrite it basically but actually

00:18:23.380 it turned out better i think the second go around than the first go around so now and did you know

00:18:28.100 that at the time no that's the key no i didn't know that at the time yeah okay right so positivity

00:18:35.220 it's all about reframing situations let's talk about specific situations where we can reframe

00:18:39.760 to take a more positive look so one example you talk about that was really interesting is stress

00:18:44.940 because we always think of stress as this negative that we're supposed to de-stress and not be

00:18:49.700 stressed but you argue in the book that research shows that we can actually reframe stress so it can

00:18:54.860 be beneficial absolutely and i think that's one of the most important research findings because we

00:19:00.540 do have this over overwhelming perspective in our society stress is negative stress is bad you know

00:19:06.440 stress is debilitating but the reality is stress can also be viewed as exciting invigorating exhilarating

00:19:14.060 and people in fact can do their best work under stress so we can think about professional athletes for

00:19:20.520 example who you know always do their very best when the game is on the line you know when it's a must

00:19:27.000 win situation uh you know game seven world series or whatever and so the reality is that we can take

00:19:33.260 examples of stress and we can frame them as this horrible awful thing or we can be like this is

00:19:40.920 invigorating and an opportunity and a challenge and i feel you know active and alert and alive

00:19:46.360 and and that's a way of reframing a potentially negative experience and that and the research

00:19:51.900 shows that people who reframe stress in a positive way like they don't have the the downsides of what

00:19:57.780 we typically think of that are associated with stress no they they in fact have benefits in terms of lower

00:20:03.360 levels of anxiety and depression they also have better work performance so if you take workers at you

00:20:09.340 know a big fortune 500 company and you give them this information about hey let's reframe stress

00:20:14.720 they actually are more productive in their jobs so it has benefits personally and also professionally

00:20:20.240 we're gonna take a quick break for your word from our sponsors and now back to the show yeah i think

00:20:25.980 it's interesting because i think people understand that stress like in a physical way can leads to

00:20:30.120 growth like when you work out like you lift weights like you're you're stressing the muscle and

00:20:34.560 you know well it's going to grow from that stress but we don't apply that same mentality to

00:20:38.540 like our our mental work that we do yeah that's a really great example because it's exactly the same

00:20:44.120 process of like pushing yourself and and you experience you know physical or psychological

00:20:48.820 or mental or whatever growth as a result all right so the reframe with stress like this is actually a

00:20:53.420 chance for me to grow uh get better it's not going to kill me like if you don't if you think stress

00:20:58.040 is going to kill you it's going to kill you but if you think it's a chance to grow it'll be a chance

00:21:02.100 for you to grow yeah and so i think one set of things is reframing situations like that you know so

00:21:07.600 this is a you know big deadline that i'm working on you know paper in law school or you know big

00:21:11.820 project that i owe a client or whatever i think the other thing is just kind of recognize what is

00:21:17.120 and is not stress so there's a wonderful example and this is not my book but it's another fabulous

00:21:22.660 book uh called why zebras don't get ulcers and and i described this in my book but the reality is

00:21:28.680 zebras only react physiologically you know heart beating fast etc when they're being chased by a lion 1.00

00:21:34.700 like when they're actually about to die and of course humans are like oh my gosh i'm in so much stress

00:21:40.160 and it's like nothing you know it's i have a job interview i have a blind date i have a lot of you

00:21:46.080 know emails in my inbox i'm you know stuck in a traffic jam or whatever none of those are actually

00:21:51.580 life or death so it's also kind of saying is this stress or is this not really life or death stress

00:21:58.800 and and not taking things or overreacting to sort of the small stresses of daily life that we all

00:22:04.960 experience so we talked about having a positive outlook we can actually make old age filled with

00:22:10.380 vitality or twilight years so how can we reframe old age so that we get that benefit so we can think

00:22:16.200 about all of the benefits so for many people being in old age means that you have more free time so

00:22:22.500 people who are no longer you know in the peak of their careers may have more time to devote to

00:22:27.380 hobbies you know volunteer work you know time with family or whatever people who are older also have

00:22:33.560 very high quality relationships that research has shown that in our younger years we're very focused

00:22:39.080 on having lots of people in our lives so very big social networks what you see older people doing is 0.99

00:22:45.420 eliminating the riffraff like really focusing on high quality relationships and they have fewer of them 1.00

00:22:51.300 but they're with people who they really care about and who care about them and that leads to a number of

00:22:56.820 distinct benefits so there are lots of benefits to being older in terms of quality of life

00:23:02.760 right and i think one thing too is the research shows that i guess fluid intelligence does go

00:23:07.840 down as you get older basically you can't think as quick on your feet but like that wisdom like

00:23:13.380 sort of slower thinking that experience like you have more of that so that has a lot of benefits too

00:23:18.280 yes and i think one of the key examples there is that if you think about memory older people don't

00:23:24.940 have to memorize facts about you know world war ii or whatever because they actually lived through

00:23:30.780 world war ii whereas younger people are like oh yeah what were all those facts and so the reality

00:23:35.520 is that having lived longer means that you have all of these experiences and they're very accessible

00:23:42.280 and that's exactly why you see this increase in crystallized intelligence as people grow older

00:23:48.580 so let's say you're doing all these things to reframe negative experiences in a more positive light

00:23:55.400 right so you're more resilient bounce back but what do you do if you find yourself sucked you know

00:24:00.480 down this vortex of negativity because something bad happens and you start doing the catastrophizing

00:24:05.300 like you were mentioning earlier like i didn't get into this school it means i'm gonna not get a good

00:24:08.740 job i'm gonna be broke and live with my parents like how do you manage that and get yourself out of it

00:24:13.800 so i gotta be honest it's not easy initially so for those of us who are naturally eeyores it's not easy

00:24:20.860 initially so the first step is you gotta recognize what you're doing so i didn't get into the school

00:24:25.980 i didn't get this job i wanted you know i lost this client you know whatever is this life or death

00:24:31.280 is it life or death and so i think being aware okay you know this is how i'm feeling it but am i

00:24:38.040 overreacting so i think step one is really gaining this sort of self-awareness because you have to catch

00:24:43.360 yourself doing it because for people who naturally do it they're not aware they're doing it it's just

00:24:48.360 how you think and so being aware that you're having a negative thought and you maybe don't

00:24:53.580 have to have a negative thought is thing number one thing number two is you then have to say okay

00:24:59.380 could i reframe this in some way maybe i didn't like this job so much to begin with or you know maybe

00:25:07.660 this is an opportunity for me to develop skills in you know a different area of my career or whatever

00:25:12.580 so trying to reframe it in a more positive way after you have that self-awareness is really

00:25:18.420 important and besides the reframing things for that i guess i mean it's very similar like what

00:25:22.220 cognitive behavioral therapy does right it helps you like you question your assumptions you have with

00:25:26.540 your your thinking there's other things you can do too like if you find yourself in a negativity

00:25:31.140 vortex like things like go take a walk or go outside can sort of interrupt that negative those

00:25:37.180 negative thought patterns yeah so as i said before there's sort of two sets of things you can do

00:25:41.940 one are thoughts two behaviors and the key with behaviors is that some of the research suggests

00:25:49.100 actually changing your behavior can change your thoughts and that is exactly again the principle

00:25:54.700 of cognitive behavioral therapy and so yeah going for a walk standing up distracting yourself can be

00:26:00.820 useful um spending time in nature so going for a walk is good going for a walk outside is especially

00:26:06.860 good but even other kinds of behaviors can really help us so people who get enough sleep are actually

00:26:13.260 less likely to show the sort of cycle of negativity so we also know that there are behaviors that people

00:26:18.320 can do in their daily lives that can interrupt this negative cycle and increase happiness yeah the the

00:26:25.200 sleep thing is really interesting i've noticed myself i typically get like super negative at night

00:26:29.620 like right before bed like that's when you start like ruminating and like thinking how everything's

00:26:33.800 terrible and i'm like well i should just go to bed i go to bed i wake up in the morning i feel great

00:26:38.520 and i don't i'm not thinking like that anymore but yeah absolutely and i think one of the challenges too

00:26:44.160 is that many people when they have trouble sleeping uh get on social media and so there's this sort of

00:26:50.540 like cyclic thing right you're not feeling great then you go online and check you know twitter or

00:26:55.200 something and you know read an article and then you get sort of more riled up or whatever and and so being

00:27:00.580 able to sort of shut your mind off get enough sleep is a really important way of improving your

00:27:06.060 psychological well-being of course it's also good for you physically that people who get enough sleep

00:27:10.340 are less likely to get you know the common cold they have fewer arguments with romantic partners and so

00:27:16.340 on all right so you just mentioned social media what influence does social media have on our positivity

00:27:20.940 or negativity yeah so it's not good um and and one of the challenges is that lots of research has shown

00:27:28.580 that when people are on social media they overwhelmingly feel worse about their own lives

00:27:34.020 and that's because most people on social media present only the good so you know here are my

00:27:40.540 career successes here's my fabulous family vacation you know my kid's valedictorian you know whatever

00:27:45.400 and and the problem is is that when you go on social media and you see all of these illustrations

00:27:51.220 of other people having these really perfect lives you can feel worse in comparison so for most people

00:27:57.940 social media kind of brings us down besides the social comparison that happened on social media

00:28:03.600 any other aspects of it that can cause us to have a more negative outlook on life well so one of the

00:28:08.940 most interesting findings is that even the mere presence of a cell phone seems to disrupt people's

00:28:15.760 ability to focus on their here and now relationship so the other sort of challenge if you look at

00:28:21.460 a cell phone use in particular is that it can take away time that we would otherwise be spending

00:28:28.200 exercising you know talking with a friend you know doing something you know social going to a party

00:28:34.460 whatever and so it interrupts our ability to really focus on our current relationship partners

00:28:40.200 and that of course has negative influences yeah i've seen studies too this is that social media

00:28:46.280 if you use it to facilitate like in-person meetups or facilitate those those relationships you have

00:28:52.240 with people in real life like family members or close friends it can be a boon where it can like go to

00:28:57.620 negative territories when you're just like reading the about the lives of people you have no clue who

00:29:02.900 they are really um you that that's where things are going down yes and and i think the other key is that

00:29:09.900 there are times and and social media of course gets a bad rap overall but there are also times in which

00:29:14.600 social media can have benefits and i there's one example that i think you know really speaks to

00:29:20.440 that and that is when people are sharing what we call their authentic selves on social media so as i

00:29:27.060 described before lots of research shows people tend to present you know only the good but there are

00:29:31.840 times in which people are on social media and they're saying you know my kid won't sleep through

00:29:36.700 the night or you know i'm feeling really you know lonely and it's valentine's day or whatever

00:29:41.020 and there are times in which if you are on social media and you are being authentic you are expressing

00:29:48.080 what's actually going on in your own life it can actually be very supportive the example that i turn

00:29:52.740 to with this is my mother died about 14 years ago and for years i avoided a social media on mother's

00:30:01.080 day because it was just really brutal you know seeing all these moms and daughters together and you know

00:30:05.460 it was just awful and then i decided to do something new and that is that on mother's day i post a picture

00:30:12.140 of you know me and my mom and all right i'm really missing my mom today and then i will tag all of the other

00:30:20.480 people i know who i'm friends with you know who have also lost their moms which of course you know every

00:30:25.280 year is more and more people and so many people have said to me that it felt so comforting that here's a

00:30:32.700 day that's hard for them and i'm acknowledging that it's hard for me also because one of the things

00:30:38.200 is that feeling sad and alone is worse than feeling sad and like connected to other people and social

00:30:45.320 media can provide that opportunity for people to develop connections and therefore feel less alone

00:30:50.680 i think another way social media can make us more negative is that okay people tend to have a negativity

00:30:55.480 bias so that the stuff that spreads on social media is often like negative like just like unpleasant

00:31:00.720 stuff and so if you constantly see that over and over and over again in your feed you get the idea

00:31:04.920 well everything's terrible when everything's not terrible yes and and and we actually probably are

00:31:11.480 evolutionarily like hardwired in the brain to respond more quickly to negative events because the reality

00:31:17.740 is if you know at an evolutionary level if there's a threat you know there's a snake there's a poisonous

00:31:23.160 spider you know there's a lion or whatever you needed to be able to adapt very quickly and respond

00:31:28.780 to those negative threats in a way that like oh there's a pretty rainbow or a flower

00:31:33.080 evolutionarily you didn't need to recognize those so quickly to survive so there's some evidence in

00:31:38.240 fact that our brains are hardwired to pay attention to negative stuff more than positive so again you

00:31:44.340 have to override that by thinking like questioning like okay is it really as bad as my brain says it is

00:31:50.480 probably not yes exactly so you mentioned comparison on social media but comparison can also happen

00:31:56.300 offline how i mean i think you meant you quoted theodore roosevelt who said that comparison is

00:32:00.880 the thief of joy how can you how can we manage that tendency for us to want to compare ourselves to

00:32:06.900 others and when we usually do that it ends up making us feel terrible so what can we do about that

00:32:11.660 so it's really important to recognize that when we compare ourselves to other people on social media

00:32:17.440 or in other ways we're not really comparing ourselves to other people because all we're doing

00:32:22.780 is comparing ourselves to what we're seeing of them and we don't actually know what goes on in

00:32:28.140 their real lives so often when we do this comparison we're thinking oh everything in their life is so

00:32:33.260 perfect and they just got this great job or you know whatever and i feel worse but we're not actually

00:32:38.680 recognizing all that they're going through and i think that's really important for us to keep in

00:32:43.440 mind that we understand all that's bad in our own lives in a way that we don't recognize what's bad in

00:32:50.040 other people's lives so these comparisons in effect aren't really accurate and being able to disengage

00:32:56.660 from that comparison and focus on yourself and your own goals and achievements and not how do they

00:33:03.640 compare to other people is essential yeah i think that's important because when we compare it's

00:33:08.080 typically relative right like you might be doing great like you're in your career you're making a good

00:33:12.580 salary you know an absolute salary but then you compare it to like the people in your

00:33:17.900 neighborhood and because they're making a little bit more than you like well i'm not maybe i'm not

00:33:22.060 doing as great even though you are doing fantastic right there's something that i think is really

00:33:26.980 illustrates that finding and it's an economics principle which is called the wealthy neighborhood

00:33:32.160 paradox and and this example in fact illustrates that people who live in wealthy neighborhoods so

00:33:38.200 neighborhoods that have been identified as having you know very um high mean incomes based on zip codes

00:33:43.680 people tend to feel less happy and the challenge is these are people who are living in really

00:33:48.180 wealthy places in which you know they're not worried about basic survival or you know food or you know

00:33:53.880 safety or whatever they have lots of money but the issue is they may not have as much as their next

00:34:00.260 door neighbor who has a nicer car or you know a second home or a pool or you know whatever it is

00:34:05.900 and so the challenge is yes that we stop saying am i okay and we start saying oh my gosh these

00:34:13.000 people are doing so much better than i am and that's not the reality because the reality is you

00:34:18.700 can be doing just fine and you should be happy in that there's a whole like big fish in a little

00:34:24.740 pond or a little fish in a big pond if you're the big fish in a little pond you actually might do

00:34:28.820 better like or feel better than you would yeah there's actually really interesting research i think

00:34:33.280 published last year that shows that high school students who go to like really elite you know private

00:34:38.420 schools prep schools can sometimes feel much worse because the comparison is like all around them

00:34:44.040 whereas people who are in you know less selective schools actually have higher self-esteem because

00:34:49.180 they're not forced to do that kind of comparison all the time and because you have you're feeling

00:34:53.420 better you probably will perform better right so it's sort of this vicious cycle yeah right exactly

00:34:58.760 and be happier i mean all of the benefits right so another interesting thing the research you found

00:35:03.460 is that the way we spend our money can influence whether we have a negative or positive outlook on

00:35:08.500 life what's some of the research there so what i think is so interesting about that is that people

00:35:13.340 often assume more money more money more money you know then i'll be happier that's you know very very

00:35:18.140 common belief in our society and the reality is that once you have achieved you know sort of a basic

00:35:24.260 standard of living that you're not you know worried about basic survival there's very little data

00:35:28.700 suggesting that you know greater and greater wealth is going to lead to greater happiness

00:35:33.060 happiness and what matters far more than how much money you have is actually how you spend that

00:35:38.220 money and people who spend money on experiences so tickets to the big game or you know travel or

00:35:45.120 you know concert or broadway show or whatever have higher levels of happiness than people who spend

00:35:50.080 money on belongings you know expensive watch purse you know car shoes whatever so it's not how much

00:35:57.180 money you have it really seems to be how do you spend that money and i imagine spending on

00:36:01.860 experiences with other people like compounds the positivity absolutely and one of the interesting

00:36:07.240 findings of course is that we're more likely to spend money on belongings that are for ourselves

00:36:12.200 you know we often you know don't share our you know coat or laptop or you know whatever with somebody

00:36:17.820 else but when we talk about experiences we often are doing those you know with family members or

00:36:22.780 friends so oh let's all go out and try this new restaurant or you know let's take a family trip to

00:36:27.140 italy or whatever and so spending money on experiences lets you anticipate them lets you

00:36:32.660 reflect back on them and also lets you do them with other people which which adds to the enjoyment

00:36:37.780 and some other interesting research that you highlight and i've seen other places too is that

00:36:41.620 people who just thinking about money can like put you in a negative mindset just like thinking about

00:36:48.020 cash like like a scrooge mcduck is going to turn you into a scrooge mcduck

00:36:51.640 absolutely and in fact even like very subtle primes about money increase people's focus on

00:36:58.540 acquiring possessions and materialism all of which is associated with lower levels of happiness

00:37:04.060 and the the sad thing is that i think millennials and like gen z like they're like this research shows

00:37:10.860 they're very materialistic like they'd rather have lots of money and stuff than like i think the study

00:37:15.220 they said like make a difference in the world or something like that and that's leading to that could be

00:37:19.920 leading to a lot of young people feeling anxious and depressed and there's probably other factors

00:37:24.060 there but that's that could be a factor too absolutely there's been research that has examined

00:37:28.760 the level of narcissism so sort of self-focused on college seniors you know for many many years

00:37:34.920 and research shows that narcissism is rising and narcissism of course is the opposite of empathy and

00:37:41.720 connection and so on and yet what we know brings people happiness the quality of their relationships

00:37:47.980 not how much money they have well speaking of the quality of your relationships that can have a

00:37:53.100 big factor on your positive route your positive or negative outlook on life what is what role do

00:37:58.820 our relationships how can that influence our our outlook on life so the single best predictor of

00:38:04.900 happiness is the quality of our relationships and as i said before it's not how many relationships you

00:38:09.740 have it's whether they are high quality relationships and the people who have high quality relationships

00:38:14.760 again with family members friends dating partners spouses whatever have very consistently higher

00:38:20.820 levels of happiness in part because when we have those high quality relationships we can be our

00:38:26.100 authentic selves we don't have to pretend that we're something we can be who we really are it also allows us

00:38:31.720 to have meaningful conversations and that really provides a boost in happiness and i think this could also

00:38:38.520 mean that if your relationships are terrible like there's like toxic people in your life it may mean you have

00:38:43.040 to cut those off because they're just dragging you down too much and that could be hard yeah there was actually

00:38:47.760 a piece in the washington post you know within the last few weeks about that and the reality is that when you have

00:38:54.160 toxic people in your life it's bad for your own physical and psychological well-being and what i say is if there

00:39:02.660 are people you can cut out try to cut them out but if there are people who you can't cut out you know it's your

00:39:07.700 sister you know or something and and you just can't avoid it try to minimize contact and to try to make

00:39:14.160 sure that after you spend time with that person spend time doing something that you know is going to bring

00:39:19.860 you out of it so i'm going to see my sister at thanksgiving but you know after thanksgiving i'm going

00:39:24.920 to go for a run and then i'm going to go see a movie with my best friend and you know whatever because i know

00:39:30.180 i'm going to need that lift after i have to spend time with this toxic person you can also reframe it like 1.00

00:39:35.560 well it's an opportunity for me to practice my empathy and grow as a person by spending time with

00:39:41.340 this person oh so you're very good at this how are you naturally in eeyore that's such a good example

00:39:46.160 i've read lots of books on it so i i know i know the tricks putting into practice the hard part

00:39:52.980 putting into practice the hard part well katherine this has been a great conversation where can people

00:39:57.780 go to learn more about the book so i have a website which is sandersonspeaking.com

00:40:02.720 and that website provides information about this book and some audio courses i've done

00:40:07.840 they're copies of my speeches that if people want to watch a video and learn more about me

00:40:13.040 well fantastic well katherine sanderson thanks for your time it's been a pleasure

00:40:15.900 take care have a nice rest of your day my guest today was dr katherine sanderson she's the author

00:40:20.500 of the book the positive shift it's available on amazon.com and bookstores everywhere also check

00:40:24.820 out our show notes at aom.is slash positive shift where you find links to resources where you

00:40:29.440 delve deeper into this topic well that wraps up another edition of the aom podcast check out our

00:40:46.560 website artofmanliness.com where you find thousands of well-researched thorough articles on personal

00:40:51.200 finance personal development how to be a better family man health and fitness you name it we've got

00:40:55.800 it and if you haven't done so already i'd appreciate if you take one minute to give us a review on itunes

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00:41:03.460 show with a friend or family member who you think can get something out of it as always thank you for

00:41:07.260 your continued support and until next time this is brett mckay encouraging you to not only listen to

00:41:10.980 the aom podcast but put what you've learned into action

00:41:25.800 so

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The Art of Manliness - January 30, 2019

#478： Mastering Mindset to Improve Happiness, Health, and Longevity

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