The Art of Manliness - #70： Modules for Manhood With Kenneth W. Royce

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00:00:19.700 And now, to the show.

00:00:30.000 Brett McKay here, and welcome to another edition of the Art of Manliness podcast.

00:00:40.620 Now, if you were to make a list of all the skills, know-how, information that every young man should know before he leaves his parents' home, what would you put on that list?

00:00:52.640 Well, our guest today has set out on that epic journey to create such a list.

00:00:57.080 His name is Kenneth W. Royce, and his book about this list of everything that a man should know is called Modules for Manhood, What Every Man Must Know.

00:01:07.160 Kenneth W. Royce, he's a writer, adventurer, hunter.

00:01:10.200 I'm sure many of our listeners are familiar with this Boston's Gun Bible.

00:01:14.160 Well, anyways, in our discussion, Kenneth and I talk about modules of manhood, things that he thinks every man should know,

00:01:19.840 why there's such a decline in manliness and masculinity in our culture today,

00:01:24.740 and what young men can start doing now, today, to become better men,

00:01:28.920 and what fathers and mothers can do as well to help shape good, solid men for our culture. 0.96

00:01:36.160 It's a really interesting discussion, fascinating, a lot of fun.

00:01:38.980 You're going to enjoy it, so stay tuned.

00:01:45.780 Kenneth W. Royce, welcome to the show.

00:01:48.260 Hey, it's a pleasure, Brett. Thanks for having me on.

00:01:49.800 Okay, so let's start off by talking a bit about your background before we get into your book,

00:01:54.640 because when you emailed me and I looked into it, I was like, man, this guy's pretty manly.

00:02:00.060 So tell us a bit about your background.

00:02:02.220 Well, I grew up in Texas, so manliness is part of the scheme down there, or at least we like to think so.

00:02:10.280 Grew up in a small town.

00:02:11.620 I had fathers who hunted and had outdoor stuff for us to do, lots of travel, domestic and international,

00:02:22.000 and lived near the Gulf Coast, so we were on sailboats a lot, too.

00:02:26.500 So I think I had a pretty good upbringing that is good for a boy getting into manhood.

00:02:33.120 Yeah, and what do you do now?

00:02:34.960 I mean, you do some pretty cool – I mean, as a grown man, you've done some pretty cool stuff, too.

00:02:39.280 So I've been a motorcyclist for a long, long time, and I've been overseas with motorcycles and done trips there.

00:02:47.820 So I still do that.

00:02:48.940 I have 2,000 cc European machines.

00:02:53.020 One's on off-road, one's more of a street bike.

00:02:56.180 I hunt a lot, and I enjoy safariing in Africa, and I've been over five times.

00:03:01.440 After the third time, I wrote a book, kind of a how-to for the American deer and elk hunter

00:03:06.680 who's always thought about going to Africa but didn't know if it could swing it.

00:03:09.880 That's called Safari Dreams, and I'm into flying quite a bit, single-engine land, some rotorcraft, glider.

00:03:21.500 I'd like to get a seaplane rating this year and a couple of other things.

00:03:26.180 So let's see.

00:03:27.620 What else?

00:03:28.340 Guns.

00:03:28.800 Guns have always been a part of my life. 1.00

00:03:30.220 Yeah, went to some of the big box shooting schools back in the 90s such as Thunder Ranch and Gunsight

00:03:37.340 and then became an instructor, sort of an ad hoc instructor, nothing very formal with a school or anything like that.

00:03:46.240 But I'd go to wherever someone could accumulate six or more students,

00:03:53.560 and I'd travel to their state and put on a personalized weekend of instruction.

00:03:57.480 And I enjoy doing that very much because in order to really know something, you have to teach it.

00:04:02.000 So it's good for me to be a shooting instructor because it just hones my skills also as I pass them on to others.

00:04:09.560 So basically guns, hunting, shooting, flying, motorcycling.

00:04:14.260 I'm not a rock climber, so my manliness can still bump up a notch or two with some other things.

00:04:20.860 No, that's pretty cool.

00:04:22.120 I mean it's a life of adventure.

00:04:24.000 It's really neat.

00:04:24.800 Yes, that's right.

00:04:25.640 Okay, so your book is called Modules for Manhood, What Every Man Must Know.

00:04:31.160 And it's geared towards younger men, like teenagers, early 20s.

00:04:35.680 What inspired you to write this book?

00:04:38.280 Well, growing up, maturing as one does through manhood, and it's a journey, not a destination.

00:04:45.320 I still have a ways to go at my age.

00:04:48.440 But growing up, I noticed things that, you know, I didn't have squared away or things that were just plain missing, you know, modules of my own manhood.

00:04:57.540 So, you know, it was a personal remedial and maturity process.

00:05:01.520 I tried to get rid of those along the way.

00:05:03.800 And something that Jeff Cooper wrote, the late Lieutenant Colonel Marine Corps Jeff Cooper was the founder of the Gunsight Training Academy in Pauldon, Arizona.

00:05:15.380 And it was the first shooting academy for civilians in the country, formed in, I think, the early 70s.

00:05:23.420 And just before he died in 2006, in his commentaries, which is online, if you search for Jeff Cooper commentaries, you'll find it, he wrote something basically about what every man, young man should know before he leaves his father's household, you know, before he's 21 or even 18.

00:05:45.160 And he had a long list of things, and they're pretty disparate, but, you know, they make a lot of sense if you read them.

00:05:53.280 It's basically understanding history, understanding how, you know, finances work, knowing how to speak a language, being capable in unarmed and armed combat, being able to ride a motorcycle, fly a light airplane, some computer skills, knowing how to write all sorts of different kinds of letters,

00:06:12.220 whether they're a letter of condolence, a letter of job application, a letter of complaint, etc.

00:06:18.020 And he basically said that fathers need to make sure that their young sons, before they leave the household as young eagles, are not fledglings and falling out of the nest, but can actually soar on their own young wings and be able to cope with the world in a competent fashion.

00:06:36.440 And that was Cooper's overarching advice, was that men should know how to cope.

00:06:42.660 And he lamented the fact that the modern man cannot cope except for one or two narrow areas of which they're, you know, usually in a profession for.

00:06:51.000 Interesting. So you kind of took that idea and then expanded upon it.

00:06:56.800 Yeah. In 2006, he wrote that quote. And by 2008, I was a couple of hundred pages into what became volume one of three of modules for manhood.

00:07:07.860 All right. That's awesome. So how did you decide on the topics you covered in this book?

00:07:13.020 Was it just sort of like life experience or looking at the young men that you know in your life?

00:07:18.620 How was the decision process?

00:07:19.980 Actually, both. The second part of that, looking at young men and seeing what they needed, you know, a lot of what they needed are stuff that, you know, I already have because I'm older and I come from, you know, not a Gen X or millennial generation.

00:07:34.980 So some of those things, you know, back then in the baby boomer age were just more often, you know, imparted to a young man and they're not now.

00:07:44.900 So what was difficult was understanding, you know, not being egocentric about, OK, I know this, but I don't know this.

00:07:53.140 So I'm going to write a book about what I don't know because I figure everyone else doesn't know that either.

00:07:57.860 Some of that plays out, but a lot of it doesn't.

00:08:00.880 You know, young men, basic manners, basic courtesy, you know, the social graces, incredibly lacking. 0.85

00:08:09.500 And I make the point in the book in volume one that, you know, if you learn some basic manners in life, you will be way ahead of your peers.

00:08:18.400 I mean, you'll look like a suave James Bond if you pull a lady's chair out at a dinner or if you know how to speak to the hostess properly or if you know how to check into a hotel without looking like a rube. 0.75

00:08:29.340 And it doesn't take much. So I would say the social graces will go very far.

00:08:33.840 And that's the one thing that I've seen that young men just don't have just a sense of style, a little bit of class.

00:08:40.000 It just wasn't it's just not part of the generation. It's not really their fault.

00:08:44.760 But why is that? I mean, so, yeah, I mean, you talk about there's sort of this kind of decline in manhood in America.

00:08:50.240 And you know, you mentioned that, well, you know, a lot of the stuff that is in this book, it was sort of just imparted like naturally to young men.

00:08:59.040 But I'd like to hear more. Like, why do you think there's a decline of manhood in America?

00:09:03.280 I mean, what's your take on that? Because everyone's got a take on it. Everyone's got an opinion on it.

00:09:07.360 Sure. I think there's a decline generally in humanity across the world.

00:09:12.200 It's not just an American thing. It's just it's not a contemporaneous thing.

00:09:16.620 And it's not even a male thing.

00:09:19.200 You know, if you go back to the Spanish philosopher Ortega y Gasset, his book called Revolt of the Masses, written in 1930.

00:09:27.580 And what he described and lamented was the rise of the so-called common man, meaning that the average person in Europe or America is now specialized enough and his labor is worth enough in that specialization of a career that he can afford a middle class existence.

00:09:51.000 He can afford international travel. He can afford nicer homes and so forth.

00:09:57.080 But he's not really – there's a phrase in Poland and I'll be nice about it. 0.94

00:10:08.000 He defecates above the level of his sphincter. 0.87

00:10:12.600 And that can be translated as you wish. 0.90

00:10:15.500 And this was y Gasset's theory that the common man defecates higher than his sphincter.

00:10:24.580 And he doesn't know it.

00:10:25.460 He thinks he's – he is a more complete and whole person than he really is.

00:10:31.520 And he takes civilization for granted when basically civilization becomes so complicated that not one man can comprehend it.

00:10:39.480 So this has been going on for nearly 100 years.

00:10:42.180 Now, as far as why I think, you know, lately, especially since World War II, since the 60s, even to focus more upon it, I think there are a lot of pressures.

00:10:56.420 There's a lot of carrots and a lot of sticks to lure people out of quality of their humanity, to lure people down the easy path, the wide path, the downhill path, the well-lit path.

00:11:12.580 When the struggle to be a complete and mature and loving person, you know, that is a narrow path.

00:11:22.780 It's uphill.

00:11:23.340 It's tangly.

00:11:24.100 And you'll feel quite alone doing it.

00:11:26.300 So there's a lot of peer pressure to go, you know, the public way and the common way.

00:11:30.180 And very few individuals, I think, inherently just have the nature in them to find their own uphill, difficult path as an individual.

00:11:40.580 Most people, I think, would rather be part of the masses.

00:11:43.260 And that's been encouraged through media, through all sorts of social engineering.

00:11:48.140 Yeah.

00:11:49.180 Like that quote about the rise of the common man.

00:11:51.820 It's like, it's idiocracy.

00:11:52.780 Have you seen that movie?

00:11:53.860 Yeah.

00:11:54.200 I mean, sometimes you look around and you're just like, oh, my gosh, it's idiocracy.

00:12:00.020 It's happening.

00:12:01.180 Yeah.

00:12:01.460 It is coming true.

00:12:03.500 One thing I saw a video, it was in the 60s, and it was filmed by, I think, the Navy or the Air Force.

00:12:12.740 And it was basically trying to show sailors or airmen, I forget which branch, you know, social graces.

00:12:19.900 And so they had, you know, two guys.

00:12:22.520 They had a guy who was Mr. Spit and Polish and knew all the courtesies and the manners and really clean cut, knew how to go about it. 0.99

00:12:30.080 And then they contrasted him against the rube, you know, of the day, you know, the slob. 1.00

00:12:36.000 Now, it's corny to watch now and it's kind of sad.

00:12:39.680 But what I really got out of it was the rube of 1966 would have been David Niven today.

00:12:49.240 It's gone down faster than they even expected.

00:12:54.020 And it's really pretty sad.

00:12:55.380 Yeah.

00:12:55.700 I mean, I love those old social, you know, etiquette movies, like the Cornette films.

00:13:01.020 Yeah.

00:13:01.680 Big fan.

00:13:02.460 Yeah, you're right.

00:13:03.180 Like, you know, I'm a big collector of vintage men's magazines.

00:13:06.680 Oh, cool.

00:13:07.320 And I'm always amazed at looking at the pictures.

00:13:09.740 There's this one that's geared toward like college guys.

00:13:11.920 And, you know, it shows like the wardrobe for the college man.

00:13:14.360 And it's like a suit and a tie, a hat, you know.

00:13:19.440 Absolutely.

00:13:20.220 And now, I mean, if you go to like, no one dresses like that on a college campus.

00:13:23.300 And like, it's funny, like their definition of like casual wear back in the 1940s is like,

00:13:28.020 you know, you had to wear like a pair of khakis, a button down shirt and a vest.

00:13:32.560 And like, you know, casual wear now is just like t-shirt and cargo shorts and flip flops.

00:13:36.000 You know, that's that you can wear that to class.

00:13:38.900 Yeah.

00:13:39.100 You can wear that to a nice dinner.

00:13:41.060 Yeah.

00:13:41.420 Oh, yeah.

00:13:42.000 Yeah.

00:13:42.540 International plane.

00:13:43.440 You know, it's pretty disgusting.

00:13:45.680 People just don't.

00:13:46.300 Yeah.

00:13:46.400 They don't have a sense of, yeah, the social graces that, you know, creating.

00:13:51.020 They don't.

00:13:51.660 They just think we just think about ourselves.

00:13:53.000 That's the idea.

00:13:53.600 It's like every.

00:13:54.380 Right.

00:13:54.640 We have like we live in an internal world and don't think about, I guess, the group enough.

00:14:01.060 Exactly.

00:14:01.500 The public experience.

00:14:02.600 Yeah.

00:14:02.980 And that's an important part.

00:14:04.360 It is.

00:14:04.820 Of life.

00:14:05.160 That's why men dressed up and wore hats and ladies wore dresses up until, you know, 50 years ago. 0.88

00:14:10.400 Yeah.

00:14:11.240 But yeah, you're right.

00:14:11.900 The media and just our culture is we, it fosters a consumer mentality.

00:14:17.860 Yes.

00:14:18.400 And me first.

00:14:19.780 And I guess, yeah, we're kind of going off track here, but I like this idea of like the

00:14:25.260 private man.

00:14:26.140 Right. 0.99

00:14:26.520 The Greeks, like the word idiot, right, that we have, like that, that meant private, like 0.99

00:14:32.180 you were a private man back in, like in Roman or Greek. 0.99

00:14:35.800 So like if you were, if someone called you an idiot in Greece, like then or in Latin, I 0.99

00:14:40.880 guess. 1.00

00:14:41.200 So it's Rome.

00:14:41.840 They're saying you had no conception of public life and that you were just so involved in

00:14:47.180 your own world. 1.00

00:14:47.840 So like, yeah, like we, we are literally surrounded by idiots because oftentimes people aren't 1.00

00:14:54.160 thinking about others around, about the public experience of life. 1.00

00:14:59.140 Yes.

00:14:59.880 Yeah.

00:15:00.080 You'll see people yelling across a public room at each other.

00:15:03.560 Hey, Harold.

00:15:04.700 Hey, when's checkout time?

00:15:06.200 You know, across the hotel lobby instead of just walking 30 feet over and going, hey,

00:15:09.960 Harold, you know.

00:15:11.440 Yeah.

00:15:11.940 No, no conception of other people.

00:15:13.540 So I would say, yeah, selfishness is, is a huge subset of the common man.

00:15:18.760 Yeah.

00:15:19.960 Very cool stuff.

00:15:20.840 Let's get kind of into the book, like some of the topics you hit in this first volume.

00:15:24.840 What I found was, I thought it was interesting was, you know, when people think, you know,

00:15:29.140 modules of manhood, you know, they think like, oh yeah, they're going to show me how to shoot

00:15:32.120 a gun.

00:15:32.740 He's going to show me how to like do Krav Maga and fly a plane.

00:15:36.400 Yeah.

00:15:36.580 Race dots.

00:15:37.220 Yeah.

00:15:37.500 Yeah, exactly.

00:15:38.900 Throw a caber or toss a caber. 0.77

00:15:42.260 But a lot of, most of the skills are sort of like those soft skills, like communication.

00:15:46.180 You talk about the social graces, persuasion.

00:15:50.760 And I, you, we talked about this, you know, earlier that, you know, there's sort of this

00:15:54.180 decline amongst young men who have trouble with these things.

00:15:58.960 Why do you think young men, and I think even like you would, you, you would argue too, that 0.99

00:16:02.860 young women today, I guess we've kind of been talking about this in a roundabout way, but

00:16:07.020 like why, why do we have such a hard time with soft skills like selling or persuading or

00:16:13.240 rhetoric or these types of stuff, those types of things?

00:16:16.180 Um, I, I think it just hasn't been taught.

00:16:19.060 Uh, you mentioned young girls, young, young girls today are cruder than young men were

00:16:23.520 in my age.

00:16:24.940 It's gotten that bad.

00:16:26.800 Um, but yeah, you're right.

00:16:28.320 In volume one, I do start with the soft skills.

00:16:30.640 I, I try to start building someone from the inside out because that's the only way it can

00:16:35.760 be done.

00:16:36.700 Um, so, you know, my first chapter is understanding, you know, understanding what?

00:16:42.180 Understanding a lot about a lot of different things.

00:16:45.280 Uh, just how the world works.

00:16:47.580 Uh, Dr. Phil has, uh, a really good book called, uh, I think 10 life lessons.

00:16:52.340 I highly recommend it.

00:16:53.180 One of the best self, self-help books out there.

00:16:55.880 Uh, one of the 10 is you either get it or you don't, you know, in his Texas fashion and

00:17:02.580 he's right.

00:17:03.100 And this is what I was trying to convey in the understanding chapter.

00:17:05.760 And I, I, I talk about all sorts of things from people to finances, economics, just little

00:17:09.960 vignettes of, you know, things that you just have to get in life.

00:17:14.960 Um, one of them, I'm just flipping through just routinely accomplishment is what creates

00:17:20.820 happiness.

00:17:22.020 Yeah.

00:17:22.220 Happy, happiness is not the same thing as joy.

00:17:24.860 Um, all things permissible, not all things profitable.

00:17:28.000 That, uh, is, uh, quoting, uh, Paul from first Corinthians six, 12, um, worry never solves

00:17:35.400 anything.

00:17:36.020 Trust your gut, whatever you think about, you will do whatever you do, you will become.

00:17:41.500 We're spiritual beings having a physical experience.

00:17:44.060 You know, just basic little building blocks about how life works and who you are.

00:17:48.940 So I have to start there just to get the reader, hopefully somewhat on the same page with where

00:17:54.040 I'm going to go after that.

00:17:55.180 And then chapter two, I get into thinking truth and wisdom.

00:17:59.460 Then, uh, chapter three, integrity and character.

00:18:02.560 Chapter four is a big, important chapter, conquering, conquering yourself, conquering your fear, depression,

00:18:08.640 laziness, anger, impatience, pride.

00:18:11.100 You know, you see where I'm going with this.

00:18:12.360 If you, if you don't have these things, these ducks in a row, uh, it doesn't matter about,

00:18:17.700 uh, your career and, you know, which college you choose, you're going to make a hash of

00:18:21.860 it anyway.

00:18:22.940 Yeah.

00:18:23.500 Very cool.

00:18:24.720 Um, so one of the things I love about this, your book and, um, keep on flipping through

00:18:31.540 it, but the way, the way it is, um, presented, um, you, a lot of it is like, just sort of

00:18:37.060 like quotes and vignettes and excerpts, um, from other books, from other thinkers, from

00:18:43.200 other writers.

00:18:43.880 Um, so I'm curious, I mean, cause it, I mean, it's just, I love it cause you can just like

00:18:47.140 flip through any section and there's some kind of cool thought.

00:18:51.220 There's a nugget.

00:18:52.020 There's a nugget.

00:18:52.680 Exactly.

00:18:53.540 Um, so I'm curious about this, like how you collect all these quotes and all these things

00:18:56.740 like that.

00:18:57.100 And I mean, do you have a commonplace book?

00:18:59.460 Uh, how, how, how do you collect all that sort of, all this stuff?

00:19:01.760 I used to be a quotation collector nut, you know, uh, right after high school and into

00:19:07.000 college.

00:19:07.400 And I, you know, any quotation book I could find, uh, at a used bookstore, I, I grabbed

00:19:12.420 up, I had Bartlett's and, you know, all those.

00:19:14.760 And, and I, and I went through there.

00:19:15.920 I've read a hundred thousand quotations, I'm sure.

00:19:19.240 And I probably kept two or 3000 of them.

00:19:22.140 And I started, how I started writing Brett was started writing quotations.

00:19:25.960 You know, I, I'd have a, an insight about a particular subject in a witty way, I thought

00:19:30.440 to say it.

00:19:31.700 And, uh, and that's how I started writing.

00:19:33.720 And a lot of my quotations, uh, if you ever see something by Dresden James, that was, uh,

00:19:39.060 a name I was going to use.

00:19:40.760 So over the years, I've, I've got a vast, uh, archive of quotations.

00:19:45.420 Um, and a lot of people, you know, kind of complain politely that yearbooks are always

00:19:49.820 full of quotations, especially this one.

00:19:52.480 And, uh, I got to thinking about it and my, my, uh, way of, of taking a reader into

00:20:00.280 success as a human is this.

00:20:03.160 I take them into a gold mine shaft.

00:20:07.100 And as we walk through that mine shaft, my job is to scratch the wall and show where the

00:20:13.920 vein of gold is.

00:20:15.460 Okay.

00:20:16.000 It's not my job to, to be with him with, with pickaxe and shovel and a wheelbarrow and all

00:20:21.240 that to actually do the mining.

00:20:22.740 But I do with my experience in this, walk him through that mine shaft and scratch the

00:20:29.640 walls on each side.

00:20:31.160 And I say, there's a vein of gold.

00:20:32.880 You need to get at that later.

00:20:34.100 Here's another one.

00:20:35.060 Get at that, you know, when you have time and so forth.

00:20:37.680 And so this is why I can get away with, so to speak, merely offering, you know, a quotation

00:20:43.160 for a subs, you know, a subset of a, of a subject, you know, the, the quote contains all they

00:20:49.720 need to know.

00:20:50.180 It's the finger having scratched a wall and showing them where the vein of gold is.

00:20:54.360 And, uh, you know, that, that's all I have to do.

00:20:56.960 The rest is up to them to build that themselves and do the mining.

00:21:00.840 All right.

00:21:01.080 So many of our listeners are young men who your book is for.

00:21:06.500 Um, what do you think is one thing that they can start doing today that will have the

00:21:11.840 most payoff and becoming manly or men, men of value, right?

00:21:16.560 Right.

00:21:16.960 That's easy.

00:21:18.160 Turn off the TV, get off of, we cut your video screen.

00:21:23.580 Entertainment time is much to zero as possible.

00:21:26.900 Most guys spend a thousand hours or more a year on video, whether it's, uh, Skype or the

00:21:35.320 internet or gaming or whatever, thousand hours a year, you know, that's almost, uh, three

00:21:40.660 hours a day.

00:21:42.660 So gosh, in that time, if you took a thousand hours a year and picked any one of the three

00:21:51.440 things I'm going to read to you, you could master those three skills in an hour a day

00:21:57.520 a piece.

00:21:58.260 Follow me.

00:21:58.880 Yeah.

00:21:58.980 And then the next year you pick another two.

00:22:01.720 All right.

00:22:01.980 So speak an entirely new language credibly well, own basic and reflexive skills and a solid

00:22:08.800 martial art, uh, become a confident dancer, ballroom, swing, salsa, whatever.

00:22:13.380 Uh, learn to fly a small airplane, become a private pilot that, that takes only 70 hours.

00:22:18.720 It takes, uh, about nine or $10,000 also ride motorcycles, take up sailing, become proficient

00:22:24.040 in a small boat, get into public speaking and master this important art.

00:22:27.200 Uh, learn to write any kind of letter, become a credible cook using ingredients from scratch,

00:22:31.720 play guitar or piano decently with many songs in memory, learn dozens of poems to recite

00:22:37.080 from memory, uh, totally transform your body through vigorous exercise.

00:22:40.380 I would say that's one of the first ones learn, uh, home construction, welding, how to fix

00:22:44.120 cars, you know, so take a guy in high school.

00:22:47.620 If he wants to impress the ladies, he should do three things, get fit, learn to fight, learn

00:22:51.880 to dance next year, learn guitar, learn a foreign language, fly an airplane, talk about

00:22:56.760 studly.

00:22:57.520 And in two years they'll think he's James Bond by the time he's a senior in high school,

00:23:01.360 even in college.

00:23:02.400 So, but you know, there's only 24 hours a day.

00:23:05.220 We're only awake for 16 or so of them.

00:23:07.420 Um, and, uh, you've just got to get rid of video screen entertainment and, and carve

00:23:12.160 out a real life, a real accomplishment.

00:23:14.520 And then you'll become a real guy who can attract a real lady, you know, a real man for 0.98

00:23:19.820 a change.

00:23:20.480 So, uh, quit surrogate living, you know, that's what I would say. 1.00

00:23:23.940 I love it.

00:23:24.220 Yeah.

00:23:24.500 I mean, that's something, um, I'm actually writing about right now is, uh, don't, don't,

00:23:28.780 uh, in order to become a man, right?

00:23:30.640 Like you don't want to, you don't want to spend some, all your time living vicariously,

00:23:35.640 right?

00:23:36.300 No, not at all.

00:23:37.000 Through another man.

00:23:38.020 Actually do those things.

00:23:39.640 Yeah.

00:23:40.080 So for those who are listening, who are dads, who are fathers, what can they do to help

00:23:44.140 their sons grow into good, solid men?

00:23:46.400 Ooh, that's easy to spend time with your sons.

00:23:49.180 It almost doesn't matter what you do.

00:23:51.820 Uh, the average amount of time per week, American and British men spend with their sons is less

00:23:58.180 than a half an hour per week.

00:24:00.460 Yeah.

00:24:00.960 It's just minutes per day.

00:24:02.360 Oh son, how are you doing?

00:24:03.340 How was school?

00:24:04.200 Oh, great.

00:24:04.780 Yeah.

00:24:04.980 Okay.

00:24:05.540 I got to go do something else, you know, and son wants to do something else too, because

00:24:09.740 a father's not taking them out and doing things.

00:24:13.120 I, you know, my, my father's, I had a father and a stepfather.

00:24:16.640 Uh, my, my father's did okay here and there, but there are a lot of stuff that they could

00:24:20.660 have shown me, uh, could have told me, uh, had they just taken a little more time.

00:24:24.400 And then I'm not saying this to disparage them on the air.

00:24:26.600 It's just, you know, life.

00:24:27.880 I think any son could say that about any father almost, but, uh, yeah, take your sons and do

00:24:33.140 something.

00:24:33.480 Tell them how the world works.

00:24:34.480 Talk about women, you know, talk about sex, you know, because otherwise they're going 1.00

00:24:38.760 to learn something, uh, you know, lousy about it at school or through their peers. 0.70

00:24:43.140 Well, what about women? 1.00

00:24:44.580 Um, do they play a role in helping men become men?

00:24:46.860 Absolutely.

00:24:47.500 Absolutely.

00:24:48.260 In chapter six of my Boston's gun Bible, I've got three pages in the women and guns chapter.

00:24:53.340 And it's basically saying that, uh, women need to have higher standards because men are

00:25:00.040 only going to be as good as what's demanded of them.

00:25:03.340 Yeah.

00:25:03.940 And if women give men a pass on manners, on manliness, on responsibility, on what they can 0.97

00:25:12.420 do in life to provide for their family, if, if women go slack on that, you know, men are

00:25:16.940 efficient.

00:25:17.320 We're only going to do as much as we have to, you know, it's just the way we're built

00:25:21.740 because we have a lot of things to do.

00:25:23.080 So we're not going to overdo something if there's no payoff for it.

00:25:26.280 So women need to like put men through, you know, some courtship rituals, like the animal 1.00

00:25:30.940 kingdom, you know, scene, you know, I'm incredible.

00:25:32.940 Check me out.

00:25:34.100 You know, I mean, the, the male sparrow has to go through more to, to get Mrs. Sparrow than

00:25:40.640 the human male does.

00:25:42.620 And, uh, that's just not right.

00:25:43.760 So if women complain, there are no good men out there, it's like, we'll start demanding

00:25:46.940 good men.

00:25:47.780 Yeah.

00:25:47.940 And the, and the general, uh, rebuttal I, I hear from women about that, well, you know, 0.99

00:25:53.880 we don't want to be single. 0.98

00:25:55.040 And then some other, uh, you know, slut is going to just going to say, Hey, fine, we'll, 1.00

00:26:00.200 we'll take him as he is. 0.98

00:26:01.140 We don't, we don't demand quality.

00:26:02.600 Yeah.

00:26:03.400 That's like, yeah, I understand, but you sisters need to get together. 1.00

00:26:05.980 And within 10 years, if they did, they could really ramp up the, uh, manly

00:26:10.900 quality-ness in this country, you know, cause men, men would have no choice.

00:26:14.680 Yeah.

00:26:15.140 Well, I mean, it's interesting that women, I love, you know, reading history and I'm

00:26:19.040 always, yeah, the effect that women have on men, like the Spartans, right? 0.99

00:26:24.100 Like the women played a huge role in, in shaping that, that Spartan ethos amongst their 0.98

00:26:30.340 warriors.

00:26:30.680 Like they would shame men basically, uh, for not living up to the Spartan way of

00:26:35.180 life.

00:26:35.780 Yeah.

00:26:36.180 Come back behind your shield or on it.

00:26:38.300 Yeah.

00:26:38.800 Or like moms would, you know, if they saw cowardice in their son, they would say, you

00:26:42.880 know, lift up their skirt and said, come back under here where you belong. 1.00

00:26:46.000 Uh, you're not, you're not fit to be a man yet.

00:26:49.280 You know, we don't, we don't do that. 0.94

00:26:51.980 No, there's, there's no, there's no shame in being a wuss bag. 0.82

00:26:55.020 Yeah. 0.91

00:26:55.680 Yeah.

00:26:56.020 And there should be, and the women can start with that. 1.00

00:26:58.280 Yeah.

00:26:58.580 And yeah, even that, that happened in world war two and world war one, where if I think

00:27:03.780 in Europe, if there was like some deserter or something like that, the women would like 0.99

00:27:07.600 throw, you know, chamber pots at them and bricks.

00:27:11.360 I mean, it was like, and they would just sort of battle's worse than that.

00:27:14.000 Yeah, exactly.

00:27:14.900 I mean, you'd probably just want to die in battle.

00:27:17.080 Right.

00:27:17.900 All right.

00:27:18.520 So this, uh, book, uh, modules in manhood, uh, is the first in a three part volume collection.

00:27:24.480 Um, what can we expect in the next two?

00:27:27.180 Um, before I answer that, let me just get a quick little rejoinder to the last thing.

00:27:31.680 Uh, the other thing women can do is understand what men are, what manhood's about and not 0.89

00:27:36.140 get in the way.

00:27:37.120 Yeah.

00:27:37.400 Okay.

00:27:37.840 There, you know, when they say, oh, you, you two guys, no, no, don't, don't fight you

00:27:41.380 guys.

00:27:41.760 You know, sometimes guys need to fight, you know, get something out.

00:27:44.780 So women need to understand, you know, how men operate because it's much different than,

00:27:49.340 than women. 0.99

00:27:49.740 And so, and stay out of the way, um, as far as the volume collection, uh, volume two will

00:27:54.540 be out in late September.

00:27:56.480 And I think the Amazon page is either up or will be up soon.

00:28:00.340 But what I get into in volume two is a lot more action and doing oriented stuff, uh, teaching,

00:28:06.300 deciding, prioritizing your time, solving problems, great chapter power, understanding

00:28:11.600 what power is, what power you have, what power people have over you and how to deal with

00:28:16.100 that, uh, leading, working in success, savings and debt, money and inflation, taxes, government,

00:28:23.340 uh, very hard chapter for me to write because I know so much about it and it's hard to pare

00:28:26.900 it down.

00:28:27.580 And, uh, the last chapter in volume two will be fighting.

00:28:30.720 And I don't say self-defense.

00:28:32.680 I don't say martial arts.

00:28:33.940 It's fighting.

00:28:34.600 Everyone is fighting, you know, for something.

00:28:36.640 Even an old lady in a nursing home is fighting about something. 1.00

00:28:40.460 Volume three, eating health, moving, meaning locomoting yourself around the planet, surviving,

00:28:45.420 pursuing a woman, loving a woman, husbanding, fathering, believing in God, how to know God,

00:28:51.480 dealing with suffering in the last chapter, sort of, uh, uh, uh, an end cap called living,

00:28:57.160 successful living.

00:28:58.400 So I think the, the chronology and the hierarchy makes general sense.

00:29:04.120 And I think these are successive building blocks that be helpful.

00:29:07.400 And I'm, I'm very excited to get the two other volumes out this year.

00:29:11.720 Awesome.

00:29:11.800 Yeah.

00:29:11.920 It sounds great.

00:29:12.700 I can't wait to check them out.

00:29:14.120 Yeah, great.

00:29:14.480 I'll send them to you.

00:29:15.260 Kenneth W.

00:29:15.600 Royce.

00:29:15.920 Thank you so much time.

00:29:16.800 So we can find your book on Amazon, right?

00:29:18.840 Yeah.

00:29:19.100 Amazon.com or, uh, my publishing house, javelinpress.com.

00:29:23.440 Cash orders get a signed copy personally from me.

00:29:26.260 Very cool.

00:29:27.300 Well, Kenneth W.

00:29:27.880 Royce, thank you for your time.

00:29:28.740 It's been a pleasure.

00:29:29.900 Likewise here.

00:29:30.620 Look forward to the next time.

00:29:32.200 Our guest today was Kenneth W.

00:29:33.520 Royce and he's the author of Modules for Manhood.

00:29:36.220 What Every Man Must Know. 0.69

00:29:37.760 And you can find that on amazon.com or javelinpress.com.

00:29:41.600 Well, that wraps up another edition of the Art of Manliness podcast.

00:29:46.260 For more manly tips and advice, make sure to check out the Art of Manliness website at

00:29:49.540 artofmanliness.com.

00:29:50.700 And until next time, stay manly.

00:29:53.440 Thank you.

The Art of Manliness - May 31, 2014

#70： Modules for Manhood With Kenneth W. Royce

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