The Art of Manliness - #98： West Point in 1915 With Michael Haskew

00:00:00.000 Brett McKay here and welcome to another edition of the Art of Manliness podcast.

00:00:18.640 So West Point, the U.S. Military Academy has produced several great men, distinguished

00:00:24.500 men who had a profound impact on American history, but there was one class in particular

00:00:28.240 that produced several great leaders that had a profound impact on America's success during

00:00:34.560 World War II, as well as shaping America in the post-war years.

00:00:38.920 That was the class of 1915.

00:00:42.140 So of the 164 graduates that year, 59 attained the rank of general, and the two most famous

00:00:48.500 were Dwight Eisenhower and Omar Bradley, who both became five-star generals.

00:00:53.620 So today on the podcast, we have Michael Haskill.

00:00:55.900 He wrote a book called West Point 1915, Eisenhower, Bradley, and the Class the Stars Fell On.

00:01:02.040 And Michael and I discuss what was it about this class, the class of 1915, that allowed

00:01:07.060 it to produce so many great military leaders in the same amount of time.

00:01:11.040 It's a really fascinating discussion and a fascinating book.

00:01:13.720 So let's do this.

00:01:19.040 Michael Haskill, welcome to the show.

00:01:21.040 Thank you very much.

00:01:21.900 I'm pleased to be here.

00:01:23.020 Okay, so your book is about the graduating class of West Point in 1915.

00:01:28.860 And in the subtitle, you call it the class the stars fell on.

00:01:33.680 What made this class different from previous and subsequent West Point classes?

00:01:39.320 Well, there are a couple of things that I think are really important about this class,

00:01:43.660 even prior to the fame that these guys achieved later on in their military careers.

00:01:49.680 First of all, the class of 1915 at the time was the largest class in West Point history.

00:01:57.080 West Point was already over 100 years old, was founded in 1802.

00:02:01.820 And this class was significantly larger than any that had come in before.

00:02:06.620 And in the end, by the time they reached graduation in June of 1915, the number of graduating seniors in the class was 164.

00:02:19.160 And of that 164, 59 actually in their career achieved a rank of brigadier general or higher.

00:02:26.720 And in the class through the years at West Point, there was about a little over a 40% attrition rate.

00:02:33.360 So a number of people that started with the class didn't make it all the way to graduation.

00:02:38.180 So first of all, it was the largest in history.

00:02:42.140 And then afterward, these men and then the events that unfolded in the years after they graduated came together to really set this class apart due to the number of individuals who achieved brigadier general or higher in rank.

00:02:59.380 There's never been a class before or since that's done that.

00:03:02.000 And it was, I think that was interesting, because I guess the way they did enrollment changed that year, right?

00:03:07.740 Is that what happened?

00:03:08.600 A little bit, yeah.

00:03:09.940 The congressmen were allowed to make more than one appointment, and it did change the numbers somewhat.

00:03:17.740 That's right.

00:03:18.380 Okay.

00:03:18.840 So what was West Point like in 1915?

00:03:21.100 Because it's sort of an interesting time in military history, because you're making that transition from how we did warfare for over 100 years to modern warfare.

00:03:30.400 Did West Point change their curriculum any to reflect modern warfare, or did they sort of stick to the same curriculum they did back in the 19th century?

00:03:39.540 Well, about that time, the curriculum at West Point was heavily weighted toward engineering.

00:03:46.820 West Point was known then and still is as one of the great engineering schools in the country.

00:03:52.260 But at the time, if you look at the curriculum, there were topics that would be considered kind of anachronistic.

00:04:03.760 For example, hypology, how do you take care of a horse, cavalry tactics, and those types of things.

00:04:12.040 And this was in an era where technology had advanced to the point where mechanization was becoming more and more of a standard over time.

00:04:24.540 Of course, armies around the world still depended on the horse for transportation in a large part,

00:04:29.780 but the horse as a cavalry transportation vehicle was becoming outmoded.

00:04:40.420 It was certainly kind of anachronistic at the time.

00:04:44.480 And so the curriculum at West Point was in transition as well.

00:04:47.920 But in my opinion, based on what I've seen, it was a slower transition than you might expect,

00:04:54.000 particularly by the summer of 1915 when a war had been raging in Europe for more than a year, or about a year, let's say.

00:05:03.520 So the curriculum was still heavily weighted toward engineering, toward mathematics,

00:05:09.040 but it carried that feel of an older, bygone era with it through the care of horses,

00:05:18.200 the tactics that surrounded cavalry, some of the things that dated back to the Civil War as far as the tactical use of military formations is concerned.

00:05:30.800 If I remember correctly, at that time, they built like this really giant stable or a place where they could ride horses around that.

00:05:37.740 They did.

00:05:38.260 They did.

00:05:38.900 West Point, right at the time these guys reported in 1911, was in the midst of a major building campaign.

00:05:49.520 And one of the things that they built was a riding hall.

00:05:52.540 It's just an immense riding hall that was used for cavalry practice.

00:05:59.380 Even some of the artillery units, the horse artillery, would actually unlimber and deploy their guns in this venue.

00:06:07.060 It was so huge, and that building does still exist today on the campus there.

00:06:11.980 It's called Thayer Hall today.

00:06:14.020 It's been repurposed many times over, of course, but it has classrooms and such in it now.

00:06:19.660 But at the time that it was built, the intent was for it to be just a huge riding hall,

00:06:25.160 which is kind of amazing that they would invest those dollars in equestrian pursuits at that time.

00:06:33.640 Okay, so you talk about there was lots and lots of leaders that came out of this class,

00:06:39.620 and two of the famous ones were General Eisenhower and Bradley.

00:06:46.140 Let's talk about Eisenhower, because that's the one.

00:06:48.140 He was president.

00:06:48.940 He was the commander of the invasion at Normandy.

00:06:51.900 What was his experience like at West Point?

00:06:54.280 I mean, what kind of student was he?

00:06:56.420 Did he play any sports?

00:06:57.520 Just give us an overview of what his experience was as a cadet.

00:07:00.760 Sure.

00:07:02.340 Interestingly enough, Eisenhower was an excellent athlete,

00:07:05.740 and one of the things that he wanted to do was go to college via his athletic ability.

00:07:13.000 And he wound up going to West Point to play football.

00:07:16.240 And this is after he and his brother had made a pact between the two of them

00:07:22.820 that one would go to college and one would stay in Abilene and work in the local creamery

00:07:27.840 and send money along as he could and help his brother get through school,

00:07:32.080 and then the second one would go.

00:07:34.360 And Eisenhower's brother went on to the University of Michigan,

00:07:38.080 and he stayed behind and worked in the creamery and played football at the local high school

00:07:43.200 and then found out that it was possible to get a free, quote-unquote, education funded by the U.S. government

00:07:51.680 if you were willing to give time back after your years at West Point as an officer in the United States Army.

00:08:00.140 And so he pursued that with the intent of playing football primarily.

00:08:05.640 And then, you know, he found some challenges there because, let's face it,

00:08:10.320 he was from really what was then kind of a rough-and-tumble part of the country.

00:08:14.680 Abilene was a town that had been on the old Chisholm Trail back in the days of the Old West.

00:08:21.120 And he had a little bit of an independent spirit.

00:08:24.060 So he goes to West Point, and he can't help himself.

00:08:28.460 He's got a great sense of humor, makes a lot of friends,

00:08:32.360 but he also engages in some activities of getting into a little bit of trouble, smoking, loves to play cards,

00:08:40.680 loves to sneak out at night and go to a little town maybe 15 miles or so up the Hudson River Valley

00:08:47.340 and get coffee and sandwiches and sneak back in.

00:08:53.080 He enjoys just having a little bit of an edge about his educational experience there.

00:09:01.680 And there are a couple of things that really stand out,

00:09:05.900 one of which he was ordered with a classmate to report to a junior corporal's quarters

00:09:14.280 for some infraction in full dress and tails.

00:09:19.780 Of course, the guy didn't say anything about wearing pants,

00:09:22.560 so he and his cohort showed up with their nice long-tailed coat but no pants.

00:09:29.520 And it was a comical situation for the guy's roommate,

00:09:35.280 but the corporal that ordered them in there didn't think it was funny at all.

00:09:38.060 So just a little indication of the sense of humor that he had.

00:09:42.920 When he got to West Point, he did play football

00:09:46.020 and became one of the best backs, running backs, really in the country at the time.

00:09:51.740 But he did suffer an unfortunate injury in a game against Tufts

00:09:57.100 and had a knee injury that nearly not only cost him his football career,

00:10:01.880 but nearly cost him his career in the Army.

00:10:05.260 And so after the knee injury, he was not able to play football anymore,

00:10:09.280 but he stayed close to the athletic programs and actually coached some

00:10:14.320 with the junior varsity there and was a cheerleader.

00:10:17.980 And what was his final class rank?

00:10:23.360 He was 61st in the class, which out of 164 put him slightly above the middle of the pack maybe.

00:10:35.740 He really amassed quite an impressive number of demerits during his tenure at West Point.

00:10:43.360 He did display, obviously, an intellect that had he been more interested

00:10:52.240 and more diligent in pursuing some of his academics would have put him higher in standing in the class.

00:10:59.200 But as it was, he finished 61st in the class.

00:11:02.760 And I still believe, though, based on some of the things that we see in his West Point career,

00:11:08.440 that there were instructors, there were other people, there were classmates who recognized in him

00:11:15.220 that there was a spark of leadership, there was something about him that maybe set him apart

00:11:21.300 just a little bit from some of the other cadets there at West Point.

00:11:25.040 And that led to his ability to advance in his post-West Point military career.

00:11:31.760 Yeah, I guess you have to have a little bit of edge to be a successful leader,

00:11:36.500 be able to take a little risk every now and then.

00:11:39.920 Well, you know, you do have to think that the return is commensurate with the risk that you're willing to take.

00:11:50.080 And so when you look at risk versus return, that's absolutely correct.

00:11:54.360 He was willing to take a little bit of risk.

00:11:56.560 He was willing to step out a little bit.

00:11:58.900 And in return for that, his abilities were recognized probably more rapidly and more readily

00:12:06.460 than others in his peer group at the time.

00:12:10.600 Yeah. One of the stories I love that you highlight in Eisenhower's experience at West Point was,

00:12:16.640 I guess there was a tradition where the upperclassmen would sort of haze the younger, the newer cadets.

00:12:23.520 And one of the things was, if you ran into them, you're supposed to ask the newer cadet, what was his, what was the previous, like your previous post?

00:12:31.940 Previous, previous form of servitude or condition of service, something like that.

00:12:38.440 Yeah. It was sort of derogatory, right?

00:12:41.340 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:12:42.780 Well, and tell us what happened to Eisenhower where he decided he was going to stop doing that.

00:12:46.780 Well, he was out on campus one day, and a young cadet who was an underclassman ran into him and kind of knocked him over.

00:12:58.500 And Eisenhower kind of was gruff and abrupt and started to dress this young cadet down.

00:13:05.760 And he said, what was your previous condition of servitude?

00:13:07.720 And he said, you look like a barber.

00:13:10.920 And the young man said, I was a barber, sir.

00:13:14.580 And when he got back to his room, he told his roommate, P.A. Hodgson, that he had just belittled a man based on what he did for a living

00:13:25.140 and really kind of who he was and what his identity was prior to coming to West Point.

00:13:29.980 And I think it resonated with Eisenhower because someone had asked him the question, well, I'm from a lower-to-middle-class family in Abilene, and I worked in a creamery.

00:13:42.520 And so at that point, Eisenhower said, I vowed never again to display that kind of attitude and to treat other people that way.

00:13:51.200 And that was a great life lesson for him, and I think it carried through in his dealings and his interactions with others throughout his military and then his political career

00:14:01.460 and really defined him as one of those things that made him an effective leader.

00:14:08.740 Yeah, he had fantastic people skills.

00:14:11.520 He really did, and a broad grin that was just unforgettable.

00:14:15.400 Yeah.

00:14:15.640 So these young cadets graduated at the time World War I was going on, but Eisenhower and Bradley famously missed out on this war.

00:14:27.000 What was their response to that?

00:14:29.660 Well, at the time that World War I was being prosecuted overseas and some of their classmates had gone on to actually be involved in combat and receive some decorations for bravery,

00:14:43.400 both Eisenhower and Bradley remained stateside.

00:14:48.540 Bradley was in Butte, Montana, essentially leading guard duty over some copper mines.

00:14:56.540 Eisenhower had various posts as an instructor, and that was one of the things that kept Eisenhower here in the United States

00:15:03.260 was the fact that he was a very good instructor, and they put him to use in that regard.

00:15:10.200 Both of these guys were bitterly disappointed.

00:15:12.800 There's no question about that.

00:15:14.560 And they believed that the fact that they had not been in combat or at least been in France during World War I was extremely detrimental to their careers.

00:15:25.980 At one time, Bradley kind of bemoaned his whole situation and thought, well, maybe, maybe I'll be able to retire after 20 years in the Army

00:15:38.520 and hopefully reach the rank of lieutenant colonel.

00:15:42.640 And that was about all he felt like he might be able to do.

00:15:47.040 Eisenhower was disappointed.

00:15:47.980 They both felt like they had been kind of relegated to the backwaters of the military and that their careers were going to take a backseat to actually those who had been in combat and been in Europe.

00:16:04.620 One of the things that's really interesting about that, though, is as they continued their military education at the infantry school,

00:16:12.460 at the command and general staff college and those types of things, Bradley made a really interesting point.

00:16:17.960 Some of the guys that had been over in Europe had been exposed to tactics and strategies that were archaic, that in the next war would not be applicable.

00:16:29.040 And, in fact, if they continued to ascribe to those, would be a real handicap as far as being able to prosecute another war successfully.

00:16:37.100 But when Bradley got into the classroom, he hadn't absorbed any of that because he hadn't been in Europe.

00:16:43.620 So he had fresh ideas and a fresh perspective on the future, which, in kind of an ironic twist, actually helped him.

00:16:53.440 So were there any graduates of the class that served in World War I that showed some distinction?

00:16:59.920 Absolutely.

00:17:00.400 Louis Merillat, who was the foremost All-American football player on the team at the time of graduation

00:17:10.120 and had really probably one of the most outstanding reputations just for notoriety,

00:17:16.160 went to France in World War I and was seriously wounded, actually did recover and received decorations for that.

00:17:25.160 Charles Ryder, who commanded the 34th Division in the Mediterranean in the North African and Italian campaigns,

00:17:33.740 received a distinguished service cross in France.

00:17:36.880 James Van Fleet was a decorated and wounded veteran of combat in World War I when he came home.

00:17:45.640 So there were a number of people that were involved in the campaigning in World War I.

00:17:51.460 And Joseph McNarney was in the Air Corps.

00:17:55.400 And several of these guys had some intense combat experiences during World War I.

00:18:02.080 Others, sad to say, were victims of the 1918 flu epidemic and actually died either en route to France or in France of influenza.

00:18:11.380 So to answer your question, yes, there were several that were involved in the fighting in France

00:18:20.060 and that actually were distinguished in their service.

00:18:23.320 You mentioned James Van Fleet.

00:18:25.100 He actually served in several wars, not just World War I.

00:18:28.740 I thought that was really, I think you said like five different battles or conflicts.

00:18:33.020 Well, think about the span of time that was involved there, the Pancho Villa expedition in 1916, World War I, World War II, Korea, and then the Vietnam era.

00:18:49.180 By that time, he was basically retired, but he did do some studies on the combat efficiency of special forces in Southeast Asia.

00:18:59.020 But James Van Fleet, if you look at the longevity of his career and ending it as a four-star general, is pretty remarkable.

00:19:08.780 He's a great example of perseverance and really the will to win kind of was his mantra.

00:19:17.260 He endured some setbacks in his career that most people, I would say, would have a great amount of difficulty overcoming.

00:19:26.180 First of all, as he was continuing his educational experience in the classroom, he had always been somewhat challenged.

00:19:33.240 And we all know people like that who are excellent thinkers, great conceptualists, and able to conceive and execute a plan.

00:19:43.960 But maybe when they sit in the classroom and someone puts a test in front of them, that's not their shining moment.

00:19:51.400 And Van Fleet was kind of one of those people.

00:19:53.720 So he completed one of the courses there for young officers, and his file basically said he really is not suited for further education in the U.S. Army.

00:20:05.820 So he kind of had that strike against him early in his career.

00:20:10.280 And then for whatever reason, and there's still some mystery shrouded around this,

00:20:15.740 But for whatever reason, there was a story that circulated that George Marshall, the Army Chief of Staff, had him confused with another officer,

00:20:24.700 but believed that James Van Fleet had a serious drinking problem.

00:20:28.540 And so when he would come up for promotion, that would be held against him erroneously.

00:20:34.440 And so to that end, he was actually a regimental commander in the 4th Infantry Division on D-Day and had not achieved a rank beyond colonel

00:20:46.540 when several of his classmates, obviously by that time, were wearing not one, not two, but three and four stars.

00:20:54.140 And so there's a lesson there that once that discrepancy was cleared up, according to all the information that we see,

00:21:03.560 his advancement was rapid.

00:21:05.080 He went from regimental to division to corps commander,

00:21:08.080 and then at the end of his career was a four-star general and commanded the 8th Army, U.S. 8th Army forces in Korea.

00:21:16.080 But interestingly enough, he never really acknowledged or said a lot about that misconception that may have existed with Marshall.

00:21:26.260 And another kind of interesting twist to that is that Bradley, Joe Collins, who was the 7th Corps commander,

00:21:33.820 and Eisentower to an extent, each of them seemed to want to take at least a little bit

00:21:40.020 and maybe more than a little bit of credit for straightening Marshall out as to who exactly Van Fleet was,

00:21:45.360 that he had the wrong guy.

00:21:48.640 Yeah, and I have to mention one thing, too, that you may want to go back and take a look at in the book,

00:21:54.860 but Van Fleet was struggling at West Point.

00:21:57.900 He said he was having a tough time, and his father wrote a very inspirational letter to him to persevere,

00:22:06.820 encouraging his son doing some really, really difficult times to stay the course, to work hard,

00:22:13.080 and that good things would happen.

00:22:15.080 And so I think that that was a really defining moment in Van Fleet's career,

00:22:21.020 where he may not have finished West Point at all,

00:22:23.680 but then later in life, as a four-star general, he stood in front of a group of cadets,

00:22:28.720 and he said to them, I stand here before you today not suited for further education in the United States Army.

00:22:35.020 Wow. Yeah, I remember that letter, and I remember reading it, and it even inspired me.

00:22:40.280 Well, isn't that fantastic? I think we need coffee mugs that have that emblazoned on them.

00:22:46.200 So if you ever have a bad day when you hit the door at the office,

00:22:48.940 you know, pick that coffee mug up, take a look at it, and say, you know, get tough.

00:22:53.780 Get tough. Don't feel sorry for yourself.

00:22:55.840 Yeah, exactly.

00:22:56.860 All right, so a lot of these men ended up in high leadership positions during World War II,

00:23:04.440 generals and commanders and colonels.

00:23:07.340 How do you think their experience at West Point shaped them in their leadership in World War II?

00:23:16.060 I think there are a couple of different things here to take a look at.

00:23:19.260 First, you have the external influence of West Point.

00:23:23.920 These guys got off the train, they walked up the dusty hill to the plain there at West Point,

00:23:29.580 and their lives changed.

00:23:31.760 Everything that they brought with them was essentially taken away and packed up.

00:23:36.320 Even their money, these cadets were not allowed to keep currency on their persons.

00:23:43.640 They went to the barber, they were given new clothing, they were assigned a room,

00:23:49.660 they were told where to be and when to be there, what to do.

00:23:54.120 So really they went from being pretty much free people left to their own devices to a very regimented social framework

00:24:06.460 and military framework there at West Point.

00:24:09.420 So what they began to find was that they were inculcated into that military way of life,

00:24:16.660 and it dictated to them several things.

00:24:20.580 One was duty, honor, country, the motto of West Point.

00:24:23.820 How to work together.

00:24:25.660 How to achieve goals.

00:24:27.740 How to take orders.

00:24:29.600 How to understand what a chain of command is.

00:24:33.420 How to deal with adversity that's forced upon you externally.

00:24:38.180 Then look at the internal side of it.

00:24:41.620 There's a battle within each one of us when we enter a challenging environment like that,

00:24:46.160 and we get to make a decision as to whether we want to stay and play or pack it up and go home.

00:24:51.900 And each of these guys battled that in one way or another.

00:24:56.620 It was more difficult for some than it was for others.

00:24:59.460 Some just reveled in it, just thrived in that regimented environment.

00:25:04.780 Others had to take a step back maybe and look at this thing and say, you know, this is physically demanding.

00:25:12.640 This is mentally demanding and stressful.

00:25:15.840 The academic load is tremendous, and I don't get to go home for two years.

00:25:23.800 So you've got the internal and the external forces at play there,

00:25:28.580 and those who were able to get through four years of West Point had achieved more than just getting a college education.

00:25:36.260 They had been inculcated into a way of life, and that experience helped them to understand how to show their leadership skills,

00:25:45.620 how to demonstrate a capability to solve a problem,

00:25:52.440 and then also to work together and build a team to get a job done.

00:25:56.840 So West Point obviously was instrumental in their lives through the way they looked at the world.

00:26:04.360 Discipline, again, honor, duty, and country, and seeing an objective, being assigned an objective,

00:26:12.820 or assigning others to an objective, and then achieving that objective.

00:26:16.820 Do you think they developed a camaraderie with each other that would be beneficial later in World War II?

00:26:23.160 Like they understood, you know, how each other ticked, and so they were able to get along better.

00:26:28.620 I think there's no question that they did.

00:26:31.220 And when you consider the span of time between 1915 to 1940, you're looking at 25 years.

00:26:38.100 These career Army officers by that time had known one another for about 30 years.

00:26:44.660 And Eisenhower was born in 1890, so in 1940 he was 50 years old.

00:26:50.200 These guys were approaching the mid-to-latter midterm in their careers.

00:26:56.080 Some of them had left the Army and been called back to service during World War II,

00:27:01.540 but the core group that remained officers in the U.S. Army knew one another pretty darn well.

00:27:09.920 And they had that common bond of having been at West Point in the class of 1915 and beyond that,

00:27:16.500 those in the classes that surrounded them, the ones that were immediately preceding

00:27:20.620 and immediately following the class of 1915, all of them knew one another pretty well.

00:27:25.780 And interestingly enough, they placed such a great emphasis on athletics

00:27:31.640 and on the team building that goes on in athletics that that had an influence on the choices

00:27:38.620 that Eisenhower and Bradley both made in assigning corps commanders, division commanders,

00:27:46.180 and other officers who took on certain areas of responsibility because they said,

00:27:50.520 hey, that guy played football at West Point.

00:27:53.080 That says something about them.

00:27:56.220 Or I played baseball with that guy.

00:27:58.680 We competed together.

00:28:00.900 And both of them made statements later in their lives about how important it was to have been an athlete,

00:28:08.620 how important it was to have played football at West Point,

00:28:11.640 and that that made a difference in the military careers of a lot of these guys.

00:28:15.060 Interesting.

00:28:16.280 So after World War II, what do these graduates do with their lives?

00:28:21.840 I mean, we know Eisenhower went on to be the president of Columbia, correct?

00:28:27.500 He did.

00:28:28.240 Right after the war, he became the president of Columbia University.

00:28:31.280 And then he became president of the U.S.

00:28:32.980 That's right.

00:28:33.600 Became a two-term president of the United States.

00:28:37.100 Bradley became the chairman of the Bull of a Watch Company.

00:28:39.980 Both of them, of course, after the war, were instrumental in the formation of NATO,

00:28:46.660 chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, those types of things.

00:28:49.480 They held some very positions of great responsibility during the early days of the Cold War.

00:28:56.760 Several of these guys went on.

00:28:59.360 Well, Joseph McNarnie went on to consolidate Valti.

00:29:03.020 He was an executive with a defense contractor.

00:29:08.020 Van Fleet kind of retired quietly after the Korean War

00:29:13.080 and lived on a farm in Florida

00:29:17.860 and worked off and on for the government and various projects and such.

00:29:22.860 But these guys were successful in business and in industry after the war

00:29:28.520 and in government in large part due to their discipline

00:29:32.680 and due to their military background and bearing

00:29:35.840 and what they had learned at West Point.

00:29:39.860 Several of these guys went on to make some pretty significant contributions

00:29:44.600 in the post-war world.

00:29:46.140 And many of them, once they reached their retirement age in the military,

00:29:52.820 retired quietly to their farms or their homes.

00:29:58.540 One who's very interesting is Hubert Harmon,

00:30:01.980 who actually was instrumental in the founding

00:30:04.860 and the building of the United States Air Force Academy.

00:30:09.600 Harmon actually a few decades later was named the father of the Air Force Academy,

00:30:15.260 and so he spent a great deal of his time in the twilight of his career

00:30:20.300 devoted to that endeavor.

00:30:22.940 Did they stay in touch with each other in the twilight years of their life?

00:30:27.080 You know, it's really remarkable.

00:30:29.540 West Point is big on that camaraderie that's developed while you're there

00:30:35.680 and then consistently in bringing classes back for reunions

00:30:41.520 or having reunions or having associations in other cities.

00:30:44.600 And interestingly enough, these guys consistently were able to have reunions,

00:30:50.960 to stay in touch with one another, to know one another's families,

00:30:55.940 even to the extent that Bradley's daughter married Hal Bukama's son,

00:31:05.420 another one of their classmates.

00:31:07.220 So a son and daughter of classmates married.

00:31:09.160 And, yeah, they stayed in touch with one another.

00:31:13.580 They knew one another well.

00:31:15.580 And you can see, having done the research,

00:31:19.800 that they had an active newsletter that circulated among them

00:31:24.640 and they consistently reported back to the Association of Graduates

00:31:28.960 so that there was information exchanged.

00:31:31.980 And, you know, it's funny, all the way through it,

00:31:34.000 the secretary, whoever it was at the time, would always say,

00:31:38.580 you guys got to get me your new addresses.

00:31:40.720 You guys got to get me a letter and tell me something that's going on in your life

00:31:44.400 so that we can put it in the newsletter, you know, just like we would today.

00:31:48.980 And it was certainly a situation where they stayed in touch.

00:31:53.540 They felt that camaraderie and that common bond, and it lasted throughout their lives.

00:32:00.360 So we've discussed a few lessons that we can take from the graduates of 1915,

00:32:06.880 but are there any big other lessons you think that men can take from West Point 1950

00:32:11.680 on how to be a better man?

00:32:14.220 I think so.

00:32:15.440 I think if we consider the circumstances that these men found themselves in,

00:32:24.020 they certainly were given a great opportunity being accepted to West Point.

00:32:29.620 But in order to even be accepted, they had to pass a couple of rigorous tests.

00:32:34.700 They had to have an appointment from a congressman or a member of government,

00:32:39.880 and they had to be physically fit.

00:32:41.980 So they had to set some goals and achieve those goals early in life even to get to West Point.

00:32:49.220 Once they were there, they had to work hard and persevere to get to the graduation day.

00:32:56.240 Once they graduated, they were presented with a world that was in turmoil.

00:33:01.320 And, you know, you can argue that events shape men into what they will become,

00:33:08.900 but men have to have something that is shapeable.

00:33:14.120 And so I think in both cases, these folks used the assets that were available to them

00:33:20.860 to the best of their ability to achieve what they achieved.

00:33:24.640 And so there are a couple of lessons there.

00:33:26.060 One is perseverance.

00:33:27.560 The other is take what you got, identify what your skill set is

00:33:32.760 or what your best attributes are, and leverage those to the maximum

00:33:37.740 to achieve all that you can achieve within that sphere.

00:33:43.900 And, you know, I think you also, all the way through that,

00:33:46.520 you have a common thread of integrity,

00:33:50.140 a common thread of duty and loyalty.

00:33:54.520 And, you know, those things sound outnoted sometimes or a little bit corny.

00:34:03.980 But when you get right down to it, those are the traits that are most admirable in men.

00:34:10.320 They are also the traits that are lasting in men.

00:34:13.820 And those are the traits that adult men try to convey to younger men.

00:34:20.180 And so I think in this way, when we look at the class of 1915 individually and collectively,

00:34:26.600 they demonstrate some of the very best, timeless, traditional traits that men want to emulate.

00:34:34.860 Fantastic. Well, Michael, where can people find out more about your work?

00:34:38.420 You can find out more about my work in a couple of different ways.

00:34:43.020 There are a number of books available through various sources.

00:34:47.460 Zenith Press certainly has West Point 1915.

00:34:51.460 I do have another book coming out on the Civil War.

00:34:55.300 March 1st it will be available, and it's called Appomattox,

00:34:59.380 The Last Days of Robert E. Lee's Army of Northern Virginia.

00:35:02.560 That will be available through Zenith Press.

00:35:05.820 Amazon, Barnes & Noble, various outlets there will certainly have books that I've written in the past available.

00:35:14.460 I'm also the editor of WW2 History Magazine, which has a circulation of about 75,000 and has been around for a number of years.

00:35:27.220 We publish some excellent stories related to World War II around the globe, and it's a great little publication.

00:35:35.820 And we're out there and appreciate anyone taking a minute to kind of take a look at what we're all about.

00:35:41.740 Fantastic. Well, Michael Hasky, thank you so much for your time. It's been a pleasure.

00:35:45.500 Thank you, Brett. I really appreciate you taking the time and having an interest in the book.

00:35:49.720 Our guest today was Michael Hasky. He's the author of the book West Point 1915, Eisenhower, Bradley, and the Class the Stars Fell On.

00:35:56.600 You can find that book on Amazon.com and bookstores everywhere.

00:36:00.400 Well, that wraps up another edition of the Art of Manliness podcast.

00:36:05.260 For more manly tips and advice, make sure to check out the Art of Manliness website at artofmanliness.com.

00:36:10.880 And if you listen to this podcast on iTunes or Stitcher or whatever, I'd really appreciate it if you give us a review or a rating.

00:36:17.260 That would help other people find out the show. I don't care what you give us. Just give us your honest review.

00:36:21.660 I'd really appreciate that.

00:36:22.800 Until next time, this is Brett McKay telling you to stay manly.

00:36:26.600 Well, that wraps up another edition of the Art of Manliness podcast.

00:36:34.840 For more manly tips and advice, make sure to check out the Art of Manliness website at artofmanliness.com.

00:36:39.800 And I'd really appreciate it if you also check out store.artofmanliness.com where you can find Art of Manliness products.

00:36:45.960 Again, we just launched a journal inspired by Benjamin Franklin's Virtue Journal that he developed for himself as a young man.

00:36:53.080 It's a way you can track your progress in becoming a better, more virtuous man.

00:36:57.880 It's pretty cool. So go check it out. You can't find it anywhere else.

00:37:01.000 That's store.artofmanliness.com.

00:37:03.440 And until next time, this is Brett McKay telling you to stay manly.

The Art of Manliness - January 24, 2015

#98： West Point in 1915 With Michael Haskew

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