Episode #4： Man Stories with Dan Kern
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Summary
Dan Kern is a voice actor, writer, and podcaster. In this episode, Dan talks about his journey to becoming a man, and what it means to be a man in the modern era. Art of Manliness is a production of Native Creative Podcasts, a Parcast Original.
Transcript
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This episode of the Art of Manliness podcast is brought to you by the Art of Manliness store at
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Brett McKay here, and welcome to another edition of the Art of Manliness podcast. And this week,
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we return to our series called Man Stories, where we interview a different gentleman every other week
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and ask him what it means for him to be a man. And this week, our guest is Dan Kern. Dan,
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welcome to the show. Thanks, Brett. I'm so excited to be here. This is great.
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It's fantastic. Well, Dan, take a few moments to introduce yourself. Let us know about you.
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Okay. Well, as you mentioned, my name is Dan Kern. I came from a background of radio and television.
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I worked for 22 years in that industry. I've also worked in film, in theater, in production.
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I've worked for six years as a professional photographer. I photographed actors. I've acted
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myself. And these days, I make my living as a voice actor. I read radio and television commercials,
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narrate documentaries, etc. And that leaves me free for most of my days to write. I work on novels,
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short stories, essays, and things of that nature. Wow. So you've done it all?
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Well, I've done a lot. Yeah, I wouldn't say certainly all. But it's kind of interesting,
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though, because it's given me where I am in my career now. It's given me a great opportunity
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to really sort of pick and choose which skills I want to use. And then, of course, the ones that I
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don't need anymore, I can just let them be, you know, over on the sideline. They're there when I need
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them. But yeah, I'm a pretty lucky guy in that regard. Great. And where are you from, Dan?
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I'm in Winnipeg, Canada. Oh, great. We're right in the center of the continent, actually, almost.
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We're sort of right in the center on an east-west level, and then pretty much as well north-south.
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So yeah, right in the middle of the landmass. That's where you'll find me. Great. And do you have
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any family, Dan? I do, yeah. I have obviously mom and dad, three sisters. I have a wife,
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and who we're not together anymore, but I still talk to her, and we're great friends. And that's
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it. No kids. Great. Great. Fantastic. All right, Dan. So are you ready to get started with the
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questions? You betcha. All right. So Dan, when do you feel like you became a man?
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Well, there are some say that I haven't yet, and I find that kind of funny. I think one of the
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things that I sort of made a decision in my life early on was not to have any kids. And so I think
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that I've sort of lived most of my life. I'm 45 today. Not today as in my birthday, but I'm 45
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years old. I think without having kids, you sort of miss out on a lot of the milestones that sort of
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tell you that you've become a man. So you sort of have to find it through other ways. And obviously,
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I mean, I've matured over the years, and I do. You know, I'm a man, obviously. But I think it hit
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me a couple of years ago when somebody came up to me out of the blue, somebody that I had been
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working with, sort of coaching. And they said to me, you may not be ready for this, but you're my
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mentor. And I sort of had that little sort of epiphany, that sort of parting of the clouds, and
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realized, oh my, I guess I'm a man now, you know? So it was kind of that little moment.
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That moment when someone asked you to be a mentor, was it a professional mentor? Was it just
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more personal? I think it was a little bit of both, you know? But yeah, certainly it was
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professional. I mean, one of the things that I've always done with my career is I've shared openly
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with others who are just getting into the businesses that I've worked in. And I've always been sort of
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an open door kind of person. And if they have any questions to, you know, please call. But yeah,
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so that mantle that they put on me that day, that sort of made me feel like I was a man.
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That's fantastic. We talk a lot about mentoring on the site, how it's, you know, when you're
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an older person to take the time to mentor younger people, because not only it helps the younger
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person, you know, get their bearings straight, but I think there's a lot of benefit that we
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as men get from mentoring as well. And then besides that epiphany that you felt like, you
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know, you've become a man, were there any other benefits you got from the mentoring relationship?
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Oh, gosh, it's endless. And I think that the person who actually does the mentoring
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is actually the bigger benefactor from that process. I think the person who's learning,
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obviously, guess what they get out of it. But nothing sharpens your skills and your wits about
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you more than sort of being put to the test. And when somebody asks you a question about something
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that you've done, it really, it sharpens you. It also inspires you and energizes you. I know for a
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little while there, I was hanging around with some people that were much, much younger than I was
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on a professional level. We were working on some films together. And their energy was just so
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infectious. And I came away from that experience thinking, you know, I wasn't, or sorry, they
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weren't the ones who benefited from this. I was. And that was because I made myself available in a
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mentorship role. So it's a win-win-win. Definitely. All right, Dan, what does manliness mean to you?
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So this is funny, actually, because this is actually how I found the site, The Art of Manliness. I was
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actually doing a search, a general search through Google on that topic. I was researching for one of
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my novels because one of my characters has to go through that very question and ask that very
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question. And then all of a sudden I stumbled upon this site and I was going, oh my goodness,
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look at this. So I think I'm still answering that question. And maybe that's one of the reasons why
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I'm writing and especially choosing the theme that I'm writing into my novels is, you know,
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what does that mean? So I'm going to try and really briefly give you what I think it means to
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me. I think it means capability. A man is someone who's capable and uses their strength and their
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skill and their intellect to that end. I think being a man means treating others with respect. And I think
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that really becomes, especially so with women. And I also think that being a man is, is, is,
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is all about charity. And yeah, so I think that that's where I'm at these, at least at this point
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in my life, I don't know, ask me 10 years from now, I might have a different set of answers.
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Yeah. I think maybe after you've written your novel as well, you might have a set of answers.
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Fantastic. All right, Dan, what men, you know, living, dead, fictional have influenced your views
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of manliness? Well, I grew up in entertainment and media. So I tend to look at those people,
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I guess, maybe. And, you know, some might say that's a little bit shallow. But I think if I
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were to sort of point to the quintessential man's man these days, I would have to say it's probably
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Brad Pitt. And it's not just for the movies that he's been in, but it's for what he's doing with
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his life as well. I mean, he's taking his fame and his money, obviously, and he's using it to good
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ends. I mean, he's doing some really, you know, honorable things, I think, in the aftermath of
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Hurricane Katrina. And, you know, there's other issues and things that he's involved with around
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the world. And I think that that's just such a, I don't want to use the word worship thing,
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you know, because it's not really that, but I just think it's so admirable, you know, that he's
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doing that, you know, and I mean, and not to mention, too, I mean, he's, you know, he's a great
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looking guy. I also look to George Clooney, I think he does the same. You know, guys like Robert
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Redford and Richard Gere have sort of all given their their time and talent and money to worthy
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causes. There's an American president that I'm quite enamored with these days, I know he's getting
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older, and I'm not looking forward to the day when when, you know, he won't be with us anymore. But
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that's, that's Jimmy Carter. And I know he's, he's been sort of lambasted this last little while
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for, you know, some things that he said. But, you know, here's a former president of the United
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States of America who, who, you know, goes and helps build houses for homeless people. And I just
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go, wow. So, yeah, I think he's one. There's an author I'm very fond of, his name is Paulo Coelho.
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And, you know, Leonardo da Vinci. I don't know, he just say, I read a biography on him a while back,
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and, you know, and he was really into cooking. You know, he came up with a recipe for a minestrone
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soup that that works even today. And yeah, and he's just, I don't know, one of those weird,
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weird guys that just kind of like, you know, just wow, like, it would be really fun to meet him.
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Yeah, you know, he's the quintessential Renaissance man. And we've written quite a bit about on the
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site. Yeah, I think so. Very good. All right, Dan, how has your father influenced your conception
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of manliness? My dad is one of these guys who really doesn't say too much right off the bat. So
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he's really patient. One of these sort of slow to anger, slow to speak kind of guys. And so he's
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kind of, he's still alive. He's gonna be 75 in December. And he's actually quite the Google Earth
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expert. He shows me stuff on there that I would, you know, it's like, how on earth did you find
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that? But he's one of these guys who has shown me over my lifetime, very quietly, you know,
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sort of the way to be a man. And, and that's, I'm just in awe of that.
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Is there anything particular that you remember?
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You know, it's the things that I don't remember, I think, that are sort of coming back to me now,
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you know, like, I remember when he didn't get mad when, when, when I had done something. And I
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remember when, you know, he didn't, you know, do something that, you know, everybody expected him
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to do, you know, which would have been the easy way out. And, and those things now, as I, as I
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contemplate, you know, the, the characters in my own stories, they're, they're, they're, they're
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slapping back at me like a wave, like, like a wave in the ocean. And, you know, in some cases,
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just sort of rolling me over. It's just been one of those really wonderful kind of almost
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spiritual kind of discoveries. And Dan, you mentioned your dad's pretty handy with Google
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Earth. But is there another skill that your dad has that you wish you could do?
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Yes. And it's a bit of a shame. I think I'm a bit of a shame to him, maybe even also is,
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is auto mechanics. Gosh, I'm terrible when it comes to fixing cars, or I can't even change the oil. And
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I know, I know there's a number of your readers right now, listening to the podcast, who might be
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going tsk, tsk, tsk to me. But my dad is one of those guys where not only is he really good with
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tools, but he also has that, that intuition, you know, he can sort of, you know, there's like horse
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whisperers and dog whispers, he's kind of like a car whisperer, you know, he can sort of listen to a
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car and sort of drive it, and he sort of knows what's wrong with it. And, and, and I have none of
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that, I inherited none of that from him. Do you have a desire to learn those things? Or just?
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No, no, I don't know what it is. It's, it's like, I sort of, I grew up the artist. And,
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you know, and I, and I have, I have rather lovely hands, which have been featured in, in, in, in,
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in posters before I've, I've worked as a hand model. And, and I don't know, the whole thing
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about, you know, getting my hands dirty in, in, in, in oil and grease and stuff, and, and,
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you know, cutting them, I mean, as, as, as I'm in love with the romance of that thought,
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but, but wouldn't want to get involved with it myself. So no, I think I'll leave the fixing
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All right. And Dan, what's the hardest thing you've ever done as a man, either, you know,
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I'd have to say fire someone. I was, uh, back in the nineties, I was, uh, I found myself,
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uh, as a general manager of, uh, two radio stations in, uh, in the province of Saskatchewan,
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uh, here in Canada. And, uh, I had, uh, become, um, good friends with the, the, uh, the morning
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guy, the guy did the morning radio show. And, uh, it just wasn't working out. And, uh, and I knew,
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uh, that I had to fire him. And one of the best, uh, pieces of advice that was given to me, uh, was
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the minute, you know, you think you should fire someone, uh, then do it the next minute. Uh, oh,
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but don't do it on a Friday because then they worry about it all weekend, do it on a Monday.
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Uh, and so I sort of had to take all of that and, and, and, and, and parse it and, and,
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and sort of, sort of make a game plan. And the more I thought about it, of course, the more sick
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I became. And so I said to my wife at the time, I said, you know, uh, this was on the Friday and
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I knew that on the Monday I would have to do this, this thing, this deed. And I said to my wife, I
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said, let's get out of town. Let's just go. And she says, well, where? And I said, I don't care.
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I just don't want to be in the city. I don't want to run to the, into them in a grocery store
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or movie theater or anything like that. And she said, okay. And so I went and of course I
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stewed about it all weekend. And when I came back on Monday, uh, after the show, I called
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him into my office and I said, um, uh, we, uh, I have to let you go. And he was quiet
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for, uh, about a minute. And, uh, and I, and I was just, you know, churning inside. And
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then he looked up at me and he said, I'm not quite sure how to thank you, but I wasn't sure
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how to go about quitting. And now, uh, you know, I don't have to. And so it was all for
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not all of that horrible worrying, but that's just the thing I think was that for me was
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that I realized that I would be messing with another man's livelihood, with his family, with
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his future, with everything. And I just, I wanted it all to be okay. So that was the hardest
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And do you think if you had to do that again, it would still be just as hard or I don't
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think that ever gets easy. I think for anybody who's ever, ever been fired, you know, and
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they, and they think back to their boss and they, and they, and they think unkind
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thoughts. Um, I think those people really need to know that unless you've actually been
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in the chair and done the firing, you have no idea what that takes.
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Yeah. Yeah. Well, Dan, thank you for taking the time to speak to us today.
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Well, my, uh, my, uh, my thanks to you as well. And I just want to offer my congratulations
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on your successful website. I mean, he's like well over 50,000 RSS subscribers, your book launch.
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I'm waiting for my books from my local bookstore because that's what I do. I support my local
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bookstore. Uh, and they're not in yet in Canada, uh, your podcasts and, and here's to your future
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media empire. Uh, Brett, I think you're awesome. And thank you for doing what you're doing.
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And that wraps up this edition of the art of manliness podcast. Make sure to check back
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at the art of manliness website at art of manliness.com for more manly tips and advice.