The Art of Manliness - Episode #52： Real Men Real Style With Antonio Centeno

00:00:00.000 This episode of the Art of Manliness podcast is brought to you by Online Great Books.

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00:00:52.320 Brett McKay here, and welcome to another episode of the Art of Manliness podcast.

00:00:56.300 Well, some of our most popular content on theartofmanliness.com is our style content.

00:01:01.480 A lot of our readers are young men who are making that transition from college to professional life.

00:01:07.700 So they're wanting to know how they can upgrade their wardrobe to something more professional,

00:01:11.520 mature, something more masculine.

00:01:14.100 And we also have a lot of older guys who maybe didn't get any advice on how to dress professionally.

00:01:19.580 So they're looking for that sort of content on the art of manliness.

00:01:23.700 And the man who has written most of our style content is Antonio Centeno.

00:01:29.740 He is the founder of two, I guess, men's style businesses.

00:01:33.720 The first is a tailored suit.

00:01:35.000 It's an online custom suit provider.

00:01:37.700 And then he also has RealMenRealStyle.com, which is a men's style advice site where he provides

00:01:46.000 content on how men can improve their style as well as provides classes and consultations

00:01:52.000 one-on-one with men on how they can improve their personal appearance and style.

00:01:57.080 And today we're going to have Tony on the podcast.

00:01:59.340 And we're going to talk about how Tony got into menswear, how he became kind of established

00:02:04.300 as an expert in men's style.

00:02:06.400 And we're also going to answer some common questions that men have about improving their

00:02:11.540 style.

00:02:12.200 So stay tuned for that.

00:02:13.940 But before we get to the interview, we have a short word from our sponsor.

00:02:21.500 All right, guys, I'm admittedly not the most style savvy guy.

00:02:24.220 So putting together a good looking outfit is not my forte, which is why I was excited to

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00:02:29.500 TrunkClub.com takes the guesswork completely out of shopping.

00:02:32.740 You sign up online at TrunkClub.com.

00:02:34.840 You're assigned a personal dedicated stylist and you tell your stylist through the website

00:02:39.540 exactly why you need an outfit, whether it's for a job presentation or first date, you're

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00:02:48.440 together a box full of outfits just for you and sends it directly to your doorstep.

00:02:54.020 There's no upfront signup costs.

00:02:56.140 Shipping is completely free and you only pay for the clothing you actually keep.

00:02:59.780 I've used Trunk Club a few times when I really needed to up my style game.

00:03:03.620 This one time I had to give a presentation to a bunch of business moguls, need to look

00:03:07.220 professional, sharp, told my stylist what I was doing and she brought together an awesome

00:03:11.940 outfit and that gave me that little boost of confidence that I needed when I was giving

00:03:16.120 this presentation.

00:03:17.540 So if shopping for clothes makes you scratch your head like me or you're pressed for time,

00:03:22.520 I definitely recommend checking out Trunk Club.

00:03:24.400 For more information, check out trunkclub.com slash AOM.

00:03:28.320 That's trunkclub.com slash AOM.

00:03:31.420 All right, Tony.

00:03:32.060 Well, welcome to the Art of Manliness podcast.

00:03:35.460 Well, Brett, thank you very much.

00:03:37.260 I'm very happy to be here.

00:03:38.960 Well, I'm shocked that it took us this long for you to get you on the podcast.

00:03:43.600 So I'm glad, I'm glad we could finally do this.

00:03:46.460 Yeah.

00:03:46.920 You know, for some reason, I just thought that I just thought you didn't like me.

00:03:51.240 I didn't.

00:03:52.460 I don't.

00:03:52.960 I mean, I don't like you, Tony.

00:03:55.260 That's understood.

00:03:56.140 That's understood.

00:03:56.920 I mean, I think I did go to that school down south.

00:03:59.920 So.

00:04:00.920 All right.

00:04:01.440 Well, Tony, we go back a long way.

00:04:05.820 I mean, you were with us since like the beginning of the site.

00:04:08.400 And I'm sure a lot of people who are listening have been following and reading your articles

00:04:12.180 on the Art of Manliness, as well as your content on Real Men, Real Style.

00:04:16.300 But for those who are just sort of new to the site, new to the podcast, what's your story?

00:04:21.400 You are like a primo men's style expert.

00:04:25.220 How did you become that?

00:04:27.700 The man, the legend you are today?

00:04:32.180 Well, first off, I'm a regular guy, just like anyone else out there.

00:04:35.900 And I think it's very interesting how on the web and nowadays with all of this stuff that

00:04:41.180 we've got going on, how you can become anyone that you want to.

00:04:44.820 And I don't think I started off wanting to become a men's style expert.

00:04:49.200 In fact, I started off, if I go back, I won't go back too far, but let's start.

00:04:53.300 Graduated from Cornell College, went into the Marine Corps, and I wanted to be a jet pilot.

00:04:59.300 And I'm flying T-34s and I blew out my sinuses.

00:05:02.820 I went straight to the infantry.

00:05:04.080 The Marine Corps, in their wisdom, said, hey, let's go make a – let's go send them

00:05:08.520 to 3-1 out at Camp Horno in Camp Pendleton.

00:05:12.720 That's out near – just near San Diego in California.

00:05:15.800 And after numerous deployments and returning from a sandy vacation known as Iraq at the time,

00:05:23.040 I decided to take some time off.

00:05:24.640 Went and lived in Ukraine where I was at the time dating a woman.

00:05:28.720 Now, it's my wife and we have three beautiful children.

00:05:31.080 But I ran a nonprofit over there, realized I knew nothing about money.

00:05:36.020 I had – my background was actually in biology and philosophy.

00:05:39.700 And I had no business background, so I went to business school at the University of Texas.

00:05:44.440 And upon graduating from the University of Texas, got a job up in Wisconsin, was promptly fired

00:05:50.040 and realized that I don't want to work for anybody.

00:05:53.160 And this is a great time now that my wife is pregnant with our second child and I'm bringing

00:05:57.740 them here to the United States to start a company.

00:06:00.020 And I started my clothier, a tailored suit.

00:06:03.480 That was probably late – late 2007.

00:06:06.960 Early 2008, started putting out content on the web because it was really me teaching myself

00:06:13.060 about men's style.

00:06:15.680 I had a number of good partners who were enabling me to make really good, very high quality custom

00:06:21.920 suits.

00:06:22.400 And I was trying this new idea of being able to build them and have them delivered via

00:06:26.840 the web.

00:06:27.840 I take your measurements.

00:06:28.220 And I think that's about the time that you contacted me via this very ugly blog, which 0.93

00:06:33.580 is actually still there.

00:06:35.180 And you just like left a comment.

00:06:37.100 I'm like, who is this guy?

00:06:38.300 Okay.

00:06:38.640 It's not a spam bot.

00:06:39.940 So, I reached out to you and we just started writing together.

00:06:42.980 And so, I continued to run a tailored suit.

00:06:46.740 I still own the custom clothier.

00:06:48.440 But over the last couple of years, we have really transformed the business and we have

00:06:52.880 found that there is a huge hole, a niche, a need to simply teach men about style.

00:07:00.140 And that's where I'm at now.

00:07:01.420 So, we're using video.

00:07:02.580 We're using audio.

00:07:03.640 Well, we need to do better with the audio.

00:07:05.620 But video was my primary means.

00:07:07.540 I've also written between, you know, writing for you, writing for my own blog and just

00:07:12.100 putting out content across the web.

00:07:14.180 We've got about a thousand articles on men's style, over 300 videos.

00:07:18.700 And by throwing out that wide net, we've been able to build an audience of men who are very

00:07:24.340 interested in being able to use style in the way they dress and present themselves to basically

00:07:31.140 live up to the man they know themselves that they know that they can be.

00:07:35.220 And I think that's what really drives me is I look at – I look – I'm not – the clothing

00:07:40.640 is cool, but I don't, you know, I'm not a – I don't stay up late at night thinking

00:07:45.700 about dress shirts.

00:07:47.040 I don't sleep in a suit, you know, contrary to what some people may think.

00:07:51.060 You know, when it comes down to it, I'm a very regular guy.

00:07:53.880 I've got three young kids.

00:07:55.140 I spend most of my time with them and my wife.

00:07:57.580 And I like to think that clothing is just a tool that we use to be able to send the message

00:08:03.180 we want to send.

00:08:04.180 And so that's where I'm at now.

00:08:06.480 That's – so, okay.

00:08:07.380 All right.

00:08:07.620 So let's recap.

00:08:08.220 So you were a Marine.

00:08:10.300 Then you went to the Ukraine.

00:08:12.580 And I think – I remember you mentioned sometime in one of our conversations you actually like

00:08:16.360 drove across the United States on a motorcycle.

00:08:19.000 I did.

00:08:19.680 Yeah.

00:08:19.900 Okay.

00:08:20.020 All right.

00:08:20.280 So you did that.

00:08:21.180 And then you got fired from your job in Wisconsin.

00:08:24.780 I mean, how – why did you decide like custom suiting?

00:08:27.660 I mean, did you have like a style background at all?

00:08:29.840 Were you like one of those guys who were like – you've always been interested in men's

00:08:33.980 fashion and style or –

00:08:36.240 I need to probably put up some pictures of me before.

00:08:38.840 I mean, it was really bad.

00:08:40.320 I was in the oversized T-shirts, everything.

00:08:43.500 For some reason, I'm 5'9", 170 pounds.

00:08:46.440 And I thought extra large was my size.

00:08:49.860 So, you know, it was pretty bad.

00:08:52.120 Carpenter jeans, you know, and I'm not a carpenter.

00:08:55.500 But, no, it came down to when I was in Ukraine, I was getting married back in 2004.

00:09:02.040 And I just went out and looked for a suit and I could not find anything.

00:09:05.360 And I tried on my first Italian suit and I was amazed at how it made me – how it made

00:09:10.480 me feel and then what happened is I – I could never find that though in a price point that

00:09:17.300 I was willing to pay.

00:09:18.180 That Italian suit was $3,000 and I wasn't going to pay that for, you know, not really

00:09:22.760 needing a suit except for my wedding.

00:09:24.940 Fast forward a year from 2005, I'm going out to Cornell University.

00:09:30.340 They were flying me out for this program that they were having and I – I needed to look

00:09:34.840 good.

00:09:35.000 I'm going to an Ivy League school.

00:09:36.260 I'm flying into New York City and all I had left over was this Russian suit that I

00:09:41.240 bought when I was in Ukraine and it fit me horribly.

00:09:44.200 And I ended up finding a custom – a clothier just wandering.

00:09:48.420 I mean, this guy was – I met him up on the street, I remember, in Kiev, Ukraine.

00:09:53.720 And I got a friend to introduce me to him and I was amazed at what he could do for $1,500.

00:09:59.480 And I thought, you know, this needs to be more readily available.

00:10:02.820 And I read about Mark Cuban buying a jet online.

00:10:05.360 And I just thought, you know, if Mark Cuban is willing to buy a jet online, I think guys

00:10:10.340 would be willing to buy really nice suits online.

00:10:14.040 So, I took that idea, went to business school, kind of forgot about it until I'm in business

00:10:18.460 school at Texas and I go through the same custom clothier experience.

00:10:21.700 I wanted – I was going to go down the consulting investment banker path.

00:10:26.780 I'm very happy I did not.

00:10:28.220 But during those interviews, I needed a nice suit, a set of suits.

00:10:31.300 I had some custom made.

00:10:33.760 And again, I met a guy who had a fourth grade education, was from India and he was making

00:10:38.860 about half a million dollars a year.

00:10:41.380 And I was like, you're doing what?

00:10:44.420 And I'm about to sell my soul into investment banking and you're making, you know, this kind

00:10:49.740 of money and you have this type of education.

00:10:52.460 And now, this guy had built – for 40 years, he built a client base.

00:10:56.060 So, that's how I was able to make that kind of money.

00:10:57.720 And he was only working six months out of the year.

00:11:00.540 So, I thought, can I accelerate that?

00:11:03.600 And I think it was – was it Roosevelt that said, you know, a man with a – what was

00:11:08.020 it?

00:11:08.220 With an – a man with a high school education can steal a rail car, but with a college education

00:11:13.000 can steal the railroad?

00:11:14.060 Yeah, yeah.

00:11:15.040 And I always thought, you know, I went like, okay, I can take my business education and

00:11:21.320 go into an industry which is just full of very – I mean, they're good people, but

00:11:26.400 many of them are my – I mean, they're very myopic in the sense that they don't – they

00:11:29.980 don't want to learn anything new.

00:11:31.180 They want to do it the way it's always been done and that's great, but let's flip it

00:11:34.780 on its head.

00:11:35.960 So, after I was fired, I kind of put – again, I put the idea to the side.

00:11:41.100 It's like you trip over the truth so many times, but you just keep picking yourself

00:11:44.540 up and go on like nothing happened.

00:11:46.620 And eventually, when I got fired from the company within a couple months of working there,

00:11:52.020 I'm like, you know, let's start a business.

00:11:53.680 I've had this idea, I talked to my wife about it, and she said, let's see who's

00:11:58.060 doing it.

00:11:58.440 We saw a company over in England doing something similar, but they were the only ones I could

00:12:02.680 find searching on the web for a week.

00:12:04.960 I'm like, let's try to do this except do it in the U.S.

00:12:07.960 And that was how a tailored suit was born, and it still exists.

00:12:12.680 Well, yeah, so that's really comforting to know that like you're just like this regular

00:12:16.280 guy who dressed in baggy T-shirts and carpenter jeans.

00:12:19.740 All right, so Tony, you kind of mentioned this a little bit earlier in your intro telling

00:12:24.880 us about your story, but can you tell us like your guiding philosophy when it comes

00:12:29.400 to men's style?

00:12:32.080 All right.

00:12:32.740 Yeah, I can do this, Brett.

00:12:33.800 You know, I've written probably 40 or 50 articles for you, so if anyone wants to dive

00:12:38.460 into that, they need to go check them out.

00:12:40.180 And I really – I think I hit on it in the style pyramid.

00:12:43.080 And really, the three things – it's not the style pyramid, by the way, but it is – your

00:12:49.440 clothing should be timeless, it should be functional, and it should enhance – it should

00:12:55.440 enhance whatever it is you're seeking to do.

00:12:58.100 So, I'll break into each of those.

00:12:59.860 Timeless, I really stress on because I want men to buy quality clothing that's going

00:13:05.600 to last them and they're going to get their money's worth.

00:13:08.260 Whenever somebody goes out and they make a major investment, let's say an automobile,

00:13:12.000 automobile, people break it out, they look at, okay, I'm going to spend $25,000 on this

00:13:17.280 truck and I'm going to get this many years out of it, I'm going to be getting a truck

00:13:21.400 because I haul stuff all over the place, so I'm going to get a lot of use out of it.

00:13:25.740 I'm going to be – you know, so you break it out and that makes sense.

00:13:28.640 Well, I think many people should do this with clothing, so instead of going to Walmart

00:13:34.060 or Target, which are both fine stores and there are some great things there, but oftentimes

00:13:38.920 people go straight to price and they don't think, well, they end up not ever feeling

00:13:44.320 good.

00:13:44.800 The clothing never makes them look good and it's not – it really doesn't serve the

00:13:48.440 purpose that they buy it for.

00:13:50.480 And so, they end up going through really disposable clothing.

00:13:54.480 And the idea is to buy something that's going to work for you, that's going to look great.

00:13:59.560 And, you know, a quick way to show this is let's look at the economics of a suit.

00:14:02.900 If you go out there and buy a $1,000 suit that you wear a hundred times and every time

00:14:09.180 you wear it, you feel great and you look like a million bucks, it comes out to $10 a wear.

00:14:15.100 Now, if you go out there and buy a $500 suit or let's go a $100 suit and it feels like

00:14:22.100 a $100 suit, it makes you look like you're wearing a $100 suit.

00:14:26.080 And you only wear that whenever, you know, just because you have to sometimes.

00:14:32.320 So, you end up only wearing that five times before you throw it out.

00:14:36.600 That was $20 a wear.

00:14:39.480 And so, that suit was actually more expensive.

00:14:43.000 And, you know, I try to really stress that that's why you should buy timeless.

00:14:47.520 And then – and then think about function.

00:14:50.100 So, I'll use the example, Brett, of the article I wrote for you about dressing for cold weather.

00:14:55.140 A lot of times when I was – I used to climb radio communication towers when I was in college.

00:14:59.740 That was how I got paid $20 an hour, which I could get paid $7 or $8 an hour flipping burgers.

00:15:04.940 But, if you climb these big tall communication towers and risk your life, hey, you get $20.

00:15:09.460 So, that was my deal.

00:15:12.300 And I – when I would do that, I would wear clothing that had to keep me warm.

00:15:16.440 This was in Iowa during the winter and it was cold up on those radio communication towers.

00:15:20.880 But, you need to be able to move.

00:15:22.240 And I remember having to buy clothing that fit closer to the body.

00:15:25.740 I would layer it and I would also make sure it had a high arm holes that the – the jeans 0.88

00:15:31.460 that they had, you know, they fit me well in the crotch area so that I had full freedom

00:15:36.040 of movement.

00:15:37.100 And I feel a lot of guys, when they're going out there and buying clothing, they're not

00:15:40.640 looking for – how is this going to function?

00:15:43.940 And is this really going to serve the purpose?

00:15:46.560 So, if you're in sales, you need to buy clothing which conveys trust.

00:15:51.980 If you're a technician or you're a blue-collar worker, you work with your hands, you want

00:15:56.160 to buy clothing that protects your body.

00:15:58.640 So, whether it be work boots, whether it be a suit, buy clothing that is functional for

00:16:03.880 – for what you need it to be functional for.

00:16:05.880 And then, the last thing is always look for clothing that's going to enhance and make

00:16:11.260 you look better.

00:16:12.520 So, that's one of the reasons I always tell guys if you can, try to wear a sports jacket.

00:16:16.960 Always throw a sports jacket.

00:16:18.740 And you need to get used to wearing it.

00:16:20.300 You have to practice wearing a sports jacket.

00:16:22.300 But, there's nothing that a man can wear that's going to make his shoulders look a

00:16:26.800 little bit bigger, make him look a bit taller.

00:16:28.780 It's going to trim up his waist area and it's going to make him just look more masculine.

00:16:32.780 So, if you're going out, you're meeting other guys and you want to simply send the

00:16:36.960 message, hey, I'm a – I'm a good potential, you know, I've got your back.

00:16:40.580 I'm a strong, healthy guy and you're – we want to form a good business relationship,

00:16:45.840 a sports jacket.

00:16:46.780 If you're meeting a woman for the first time and you want to turn this into a long-term 0.95

00:16:50.440 relationship, you're sending the message that, hey, I'm a provider, you know, and

00:16:55.240 these are very subliminal things, but they're things that people do pick up on.

00:16:59.440 And there's so much – there's just tons of scientific evidence behind this.

00:17:04.720 That's one of the things that I – why I reached out to you so many years ago was that

00:17:09.940 philosophy because I could tell from the content that you're writing that you were – it was

00:17:13.960 just very practical.

00:17:15.580 I feel like there was, like, a lot of men's style bloggers.

00:17:18.300 There's even, like – there's tons now.

00:17:19.820 Nowadays, it's just, like, everyone's starting a men's style blog.

00:17:22.020 But a lot of them – I don't know.

00:17:24.200 They just don't seem very, like, functional or, like, practical.

00:17:27.080 Like, they get really fisted about, like, these, like, small details.

00:17:31.300 And it just never seemed – like, never resonated with me.

00:17:34.700 But I just love how practical your philosophy is.

00:17:38.100 So it's like, yeah, like, if you're going to be out in cold weather, yeah, look good.

00:17:42.160 But, you know, the first thing you should think about is, is this going to keep you warm,

00:17:45.460 right?

00:17:46.380 Exactly.

00:17:46.960 So let's get down into the fabrics.

00:17:48.640 Understand the difference between wool, between cotton, between synthetics and how they insulate

00:17:53.780 differently.

00:17:54.800 And it's not a – you know, it's – it's not so much about the clothing.

00:17:57.640 It's about you being able to do your job and not, you know, having – you know, falling

00:18:02.720 over because you wore too much clothing that didn't let you breathe and, you know, you

00:18:07.020 overheat.

00:18:08.320 And, you know, that – those things happen.

00:18:10.860 We've – many of us have seen those things happen.

00:18:13.180 And – or that you sweat so much and then, you know, you get a chill because you strip

00:18:18.160 it off and next thing you know, you're – you're losing too much heat.

00:18:21.120 So, maybe it's some of my background, I think, in the – in the Marine Corps.

00:18:25.180 But the Marines, you know, besides being, you know, kind of like the stormtroopers of the

00:18:29.480 U.S. military and being a bit, you know, I would say a little bit more fanatical than

00:18:33.960 many of the other services is they care about the way they dress.

00:18:37.680 So, I would always – so, I was a staff officer with an infantry battalion and we would go

00:18:42.440 do inspections.

00:18:43.360 I remember on Friday nights, all the young enlisted Marines were going out and they – they

00:18:48.480 were dressed to the nines.

00:18:50.340 These guys, everything fit them right.

00:18:52.360 They were sharp.

00:18:53.340 They were going out and, you know, I'd always – you'd see the guys leaving and stuff

00:18:57.120 and I'd be on duty a lot of times on a Friday night.

00:18:59.660 And you just see them going out and they did care.

00:19:02.300 And they knew that it made a difference, that by wearing that type of clothing, it

00:19:06.120 would enhance their overall physique.

00:19:08.560 They – you know, the guys that dress sharp, they just – they would make that connection

00:19:12.960 that putting forth this effort would result in, well, having a little bit more luck that

00:19:18.000 evening.

00:19:20.360 All right.

00:19:22.640 It's – I'm also amazed.

00:19:23.940 Like, you have – like, you've done some pretty manly things, Marines, motorcycle.

00:19:27.940 I didn't know you – you worked on giant antennas in the freezing Iowa weather.

00:19:33.100 That's pretty manly too.

00:19:34.680 That's impressive.

00:19:36.240 Thanks.

00:19:37.560 All right.

00:19:38.140 So let's talk – you talk – Tony, you've consulted and coached, I'm sure at this point,

00:19:43.260 thousands of men about men's style.

00:19:46.480 What are the biggest style mistakes you see men making?

00:19:51.320 So the biggest one is – and you can go look at – you know, you see this in the comments

00:19:55.340 whenever we post something, somebody is always taking the time to let us know that they don't

00:20:00.040 care.

00:20:01.260 And I always – it's – you know, if you really don't care, why are you even leaving

00:20:05.580 a comment?

00:20:06.000 I think if you don't care, the apathy, you know, to me really that sense is you don't

00:20:11.860 care about yourself.

00:20:12.940 I mean, this isn't about the clothing.

00:20:15.140 It's about you giving yourself the best shot to succeed.

00:20:19.540 I don't care if you've got a Harvard MBA in your back pocket. 0.61

00:20:23.000 Nobody sees that if you dress like – like a hoodlum.

00:20:27.740 And, you know, it's just something I want – that's the biggest thing because if a guy

00:20:32.000 understands and if he cares, he's going to find a way.

00:20:35.080 In the same way, if you're hungry, you're going to find a way to feed yourself.

00:20:39.720 If you're going to – you're going to go make a sandwich, you're going to make – you're

00:20:42.600 going to cook yourself a lasagna, you're going to go out and you're going to – you're

00:20:46.860 going to find a way to feed yourself.

00:20:48.420 And that's probably the first thing is you've got to care.

00:20:51.440 Now, specifically, what I notice is that most men wear clothing that's way too big.

00:20:58.300 They're all – I did this.

00:21:00.180 The vast majority of – we do this because we're in a society – if you go back a hundred

00:21:05.080 years, most people, they had their clothing made for them.

00:21:09.400 I mean, it was just common.

00:21:10.880 I mean, it was less expensive than going – buying that expensive clothing that was pre-made.

00:21:15.680 Let's move a hundred years now into the future.

00:21:17.900 All of a sudden, that's complete opposite and most of the clothing is made to fit as

00:21:22.280 many body types as possible.

00:21:24.200 As a result, we wear things that are just not made for us.

00:21:28.000 They're made for – to fit as many people and it's just – it looks bad.

00:21:31.820 And so, it probably – you know, I would say, you know, if I was to give one tip, if I was

00:21:37.360 to tell people one thing that they could do to change this is to learn the name of their

00:21:42.940 tailor and why this is important is if you know the name of your tailor, then you've

00:21:48.160 got a relationship with him.

00:21:49.640 You are going in there.

00:21:51.020 You're engaging with him.

00:21:52.580 You're taking him your clothing to get adjusted and it's such a small price to pay for really

00:21:59.060 improving the way.

00:22:00.160 You can take a $100 suit, get it tailored, adjusted and if it's, you know, made with decent

00:22:05.680 material, it's going to look better than a $1,000 suit that has never been adjusted.

00:22:10.860 Yeah, I've learned to do that whenever I buy things off the rack now, like if it's

00:22:15.980 just like a dress shirt or a pair of pants to right away take it to – I don't have

00:22:21.760 like a fancy tailor but like just like there's like little shops around Tulsa, right, where

00:22:26.420 you can get things adjusted and it's amazing.

00:22:29.120 It's like $10, $15, $20 and it just makes all the difference.

00:22:33.200 Just your shirt fits better.

00:22:35.300 It's not that baggy looking thing.

00:22:36.980 It looks more athletic.

00:22:37.760 It's just amazing what that extra $10 or $15 can do.

00:22:41.880 Exactly.

00:22:43.140 All right.

00:22:43.660 So big mistakes are just not caring and then it's like wearing stuff too big.

00:22:49.920 I think it's a very American thing too.

00:22:52.120 You don't really see that problem so much in Europe, I don't think, or in other countries.

00:22:57.820 It's like it's – yeah, wearing stuff big is very – we like to do things big here

00:23:01.860 in America, right?

00:23:02.540 Yeah, you know, that's part of it.

00:23:05.400 I also just think it's we're also products of our environment.

00:23:08.660 I mean try eating healthy in the United States.

00:23:10.840 It's very difficult.

00:23:12.380 We've got three children and we try to feed them at home and try to feed them healthy food

00:23:16.880 all the time but we're bombarded by all of these, you know, get this latest style.

00:23:21.580 Get this – the fashion industry and I do make a distinction between style and fashion.

00:23:26.220 Fashion's job is to try to sell you something every season and whether it be a new hat, 0.85

00:23:31.820 a new pair of sneakers, a new pair of jeans, the coolest belt, they're trying to, you

00:23:37.280 know, and it goes to many other things.

00:23:39.400 Think about that with tools.

00:23:41.020 Many of us have tools.

00:23:42.220 We go out there and we're buying all the new coolest looking tools.

00:23:45.780 We do this for our cars.

00:23:46.960 So, it doesn't just apply to clothing.

00:23:49.180 And it comes back to that principle of finding timeless functional pieces that enhance you.

00:23:56.720 Awesome.

00:23:57.380 All right.

00:23:57.680 So, you mentioned just getting – knowing your tailor as like a simple style upgrade.

00:24:04.880 Any other tips that men can do to upgrade their personal style?

00:24:09.080 They can start to set up systems in their life and you're going to hear me hit on this

00:24:13.080 a lot.

00:24:13.400 So, you know, I've got my courses, the style system, a man's guide to timeless style.

00:24:17.940 I find that whenever you make a commitment and you start to take action that it – and you've

00:24:24.460 read the book, I think Changing – or it's about – I think it's Habits.

00:24:28.460 It's by – what's his name?

00:24:30.740 Charles Duhigg.

00:24:31.440 Duhigg.

00:24:31.840 Yeah.

00:24:32.100 I did a video about it actually.

00:24:34.520 Great book.

00:24:35.060 Yeah.

00:24:35.300 And you remember part of Changing Habits is understanding how we change.

00:24:39.500 So, imagine, Brett, if you woke up and you were just telling me that, you know, you had Gus

00:24:44.460 was sick. 0.82

00:24:45.680 And, I mean, everything probably went out of whack because you're not getting sleep.

00:24:50.640 When the kid's sick, it just throws all of your systems out the door because getting

00:24:55.540 sleep and sleeping through the night is a system.

00:24:58.100 I mean, you could sleep during the day, but we choose as a society oftentimes to sleep

00:25:02.660 from, you know, 10 o'clock at night till 6 o'clock in the morning, solid eight hours.

00:25:06.040 Not everyone gets it, but we try.

00:25:08.320 But, whenever you – you have to be sick kid, that doesn't apply.

00:25:10.860 They're throwing up in the middle of the night.

00:25:12.320 You're up checking the temperature every single hour.

00:25:15.640 Your sleep system is – throw – has a wrench.

00:25:19.020 We do this to ourselves all the time because we have no system in how we dress ourselves.

00:25:24.300 We – we – we need to set up those systems.

00:25:27.300 You need to lay out your clothing the night before.

00:25:30.000 It sounds simple, but if you do that, what are you going to do?

00:25:34.220 If your dress clothing is all laid out the night before, your shirt is already ironed,

00:25:40.720 your suit is pressed, your shoes are shined, everything in there is ready, are you going

00:25:45.660 to go fumble through your closet in the dark and try to find clothing that just looks bad

00:25:49.960 on you?

00:25:50.520 No, you're going to go down the simple path, which is to wear the clothing that you've

00:25:54.420 got laid out.

00:25:55.740 All right.

00:25:56.300 So, systems.

00:25:56.860 I know you love systems.

00:25:57.800 We talk about systems.

00:25:58.360 I love systems.

00:25:59.060 Yeah.

00:25:59.300 Tony loves – let me tell you guys, Tony loves systems.

00:26:01.740 Every time we get on the phone, he's always telling me about his new system that he's

00:26:05.540 developing.

00:26:06.160 And it's actually been inspiring because I've tried to implement some systems in my

00:26:10.020 own life that have helped me.

00:26:12.100 All right.

00:26:12.660 So, Tony, are there any, like, style rules that you think are followed to religiously?

00:26:19.720 Because I know if you go into some of the style forms, like Reddit – there's, like,

00:26:25.300 a Reddit menswear form there.

00:26:27.180 And, like, you can see people get very zealous about some style rules.

00:26:31.600 Are there any ones that you think are just like, okay, you guys are taking this way too

00:26:35.300 serious.

00:26:35.700 It's not that set in stone.

00:26:37.540 Or do you think most of them are appropriate?

00:26:40.220 Like, you should be that zealous about them?

00:26:42.300 Yeah.

00:26:42.460 Well, the number one one is whenever you sit down and you have to unbutton your jacket.

00:26:47.400 Could you believe that?

00:26:49.740 Yeah.

00:26:49.980 So, for those of you who don't know, Tony did a series of videos with me when he came

00:26:54.020 through Tulsa a few months ago.

00:26:56.960 And he left his button, his suit, his jacket button, when he sat down.

00:27:01.560 And, like, just, like, every comment –

00:27:02.900 I was overwhelmed by your manliness.

00:27:04.900 Yeah.

00:27:05.580 Yeah, you were so overwhelmed by my mustache, you forgot to unbutton your jacket.

00:27:09.500 But, yeah, everyone on YouTube was just like, oh, you need to – that was just so jarring

00:27:13.720 that you didn't unbutton your suit jacket.

00:27:15.940 So, is that one of those rules?

00:27:17.020 Or is it just like, okay, guys, they're a bigger fish to fry?

00:27:20.640 I think most of the rules out there – rules are guidelines.

00:27:25.080 And if you've got a four-wheel drive truck and you've got to get from point A to point B

00:27:29.820 and, you know, as – you know, let's just say we've got a zombie apocalypse going on.

00:27:36.640 Do you watch The Walking Dead, Brett?

00:27:38.620 You know, I haven't.

00:27:40.260 I've been wanting to do it.

00:27:41.620 It's just I haven't had time to get into it.

00:27:43.500 I have to admit that's probably one of my guilty pleasures on Netflix.

00:27:47.120 But there's this part – like, I'm always watching it.

00:27:49.140 They, like, show one side of the highway and there's all these burnt-out wrecked cars

00:27:53.380 and the other side of the highway is completely clean.

00:27:56.280 Now, rules are meant to be followed.

00:27:59.120 But I – if, you know, if I had a zombie apocalypse going on,

00:28:01.900 I tell you I would not be driving on that other side of the road.

00:28:05.140 And that's one thing I love about when you travel.

00:28:07.840 Whenever I go back to – when I was in India or Ukraine or a lot of places where people really drive crazy,

00:28:13.200 they don't follow – like, rules are there for other people, I think, is the philosophy of it.

00:28:18.020 So, rules are there as a general guideline to get you started.

00:28:21.140 But you don't – if you understand the rule, then you have the – you can oftentimes go through and break it,

00:28:27.260 especially if you've got a bit of confidence.

00:28:29.260 But I would say one thing that I think people are too stuck on here,

00:28:33.160 especially in North America, the United States, is jewelry.

00:28:36.760 And spending time in Europe, other parts of the world,

00:28:40.880 it's perfectly fine to wear a couple extra rings, to wear a necklace, to earrings.

00:28:46.740 I mean, now, this is just something – every time I post about it, people just go crazy that, you know,

00:28:52.640 you're only supposed to wear one ring.

00:28:54.540 And people zero in on these things.

00:28:56.240 I would say that that's – it always makes me smile.

00:28:59.240 And it's good.

00:28:59.820 I love writing about it because I always get lots of comments.

00:29:02.460 But I would say jewelry is something that guys get a little bit too fanatical on.

00:29:06.820 And, you know, just because you wear a ring on one finger does not send really any signal.

00:29:14.240 Also by The Strenuous Life.

00:29:15.880 The Strenuous Life is an online platform that we created to help you put into action

00:29:18.960 all the things we've been writing about on AOM and talking about on the podcast for the past 10 years.

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00:29:28.800 public speaking, social skills, and hard skills like wilderness survival, first aid, self-defense.

00:29:34.300 So you can go through these badges.

00:29:35.380 They're not going to make you an expert.

00:29:36.440 They're going to get you started on working on these things.

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00:29:42.880 We also have weekly challenges.

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00:30:00.100 And as soon as the enrollment opens up, we'll send you out an email and you can sign up.

00:30:04.120 So strenuouslife.co.

00:30:05.520 Hope to see you there.

00:30:06.980 And now back to the show.

00:30:08.220 Well, I think it's funny, too.

00:30:09.680 And you've talked about this before with like with your style pyramid that a lot of what I what I've noticed, too, just kind of interacting with readers and following the comments on your blog post is that so many men, when they're getting into like they want to improve their style.

00:30:25.800 Like the first thing they do is like they go in on these like little small details.

00:30:29.520 Like, OK, what sort of like pattern do I wear with this sort of like suit fabric?

00:30:35.820 Right.

00:30:36.140 But they're not even thinking about, OK, does your suit fit well?

00:30:40.220 Does the suit even look good on your body frame?

00:30:43.480 And like the only thing they care about is these little small details.

00:30:46.420 And they're just they think that's going to make all the difference.

00:30:48.660 And but without having that nice, solid base of just, you know, clothing that fits well, that that's serves, you know, that's a fun that it serves its function.

00:30:58.900 Right.

00:30:59.320 For what the purpose you're wearing it.

00:31:02.100 And they sort of lose sight of the big picture, I guess is what I'm trying to say.

00:31:06.140 No, it's and just to equate it to an article that you just put out, which actually just made me smile because I have this on one of my boards and I've had it here for about a month now is is the, you know, the Eisenhower matrix of one, two, three and four.

00:31:21.420 And most things that are being written about on the Web are are threes and fours.

00:31:27.200 And people are getting and for anyone that doesn't know, you just go back and check out the art of manliness and you understand what we're talking about.

00:31:34.480 But basically, people are focusing on what seems to be urgent and it's not important.

00:31:40.500 And those little details, they're like one percent effectors there or it's like point two percent focus on fit, focus on fabric and the quality of what you're wearing and focus on the style.

00:31:52.660 You focus on those three things.

00:31:54.500 Boom, you've got the you've got 80 percent you've passed and everything else is just extra.

00:31:59.620 All right. So let's let's get a little more specific here.

00:32:04.240 I'm sure this is a common question that you get.

00:32:06.820 And there's people who write tons of blog posts about this sort of this sort of question is what are the pieces of clothing that every man should have in their wardrobe?

00:32:16.800 And I know this is I'm sure this causes lots of debate, but just sort of you want to have just a just a general use go to wardrobe that for any occasion you're good to go.

00:32:26.320 So what should you have?

00:32:27.980 Okay. The first thing is you need to have a suit.

00:32:30.920 You'll you'll hear this and I know some guys will say, well, I only wear the suit one time here.

00:32:35.460 And when you wear it one time a year, you're wearing it because it's probably something pretty important.

00:32:40.100 Someone has died. Someone's getting married.

00:32:42.300 And if you're ever going to look good, this is when you need to look good and make sure you practice wearing that suit.

00:32:49.060 Just putting on a suit does not make you look good.

00:32:51.100 You need to practice wearing it and you need to make sure it fits, that it looks good.

00:32:55.800 So every year, put it on, make sure moths haven't eaten through it.

00:32:59.820 You make sure to seal it properly, but have one suit.

00:33:03.420 I don't care, you know, if you're a master, you know, we talked about this, I think, in one of the articles.

00:33:08.140 I mean, you may be a plumber and you may make tons of money and you don't, yeah, you don't have to impress anybody.

00:33:13.820 But you know what?

00:33:14.520 Your little girl, when she gets married, you want to look good because you're going to be there at that wedding

00:33:19.300 and you don't want to, you know, embarrass her in the photos when she looks at that.

00:33:23.360 You want – so, you know, focus on that one suit and everything that goes with it.

00:33:27.700 Have a nice, crisp, simple white shirt that fits you well.

00:33:32.560 Have shoes, just go with a pair of classic black Oxfords.

00:33:36.240 The suit color would go – you can go with navy or charcoal gray works better for probably most men.

00:33:41.440 Navy is nice, it can make a man look a little bit younger.

00:33:45.120 So, if you are 18 to 22 years of age and you've got a baby face, perhaps just go with charcoal gray, don't go with navy.

00:33:52.000 So, that is the first thing.

00:33:54.280 Next, have a pair of jeans that look really good on you.

00:33:58.560 And this could be something where you go in and you speak with someone that you trust and have them look on you,

00:34:05.280 but a dark pair of denim is going to go far because you can MAC, you can dress it up, you can dress it down.

00:34:13.200 It's – and focus on that fit.

00:34:15.900 Maybe try sizing down just a little bit.

00:34:18.400 I'm not talking about going with skinny, super skinny jeans here.

00:34:21.700 Now, that's an abomination.

00:34:23.360 No, look for – if you're used to wearing really loose jeans,

00:34:27.260 maybe wear the regular or the classic and see what it looks like on you.

00:34:32.480 And so – so, focus in on getting a good fit.

00:34:35.660 Make sure that they're not worn.

00:34:37.460 Make sure that they're dark and you're going to be able to use them in a lot of different ways.

00:34:41.640 Now, let's talk about a sports jacket, a simple sports jacket.

00:34:45.700 Go with something in brown, go with something in blue.

00:34:48.840 Again, make sure it fits you, that it works well.

00:34:52.060 And right there, that's going to go with your jeans.

00:34:54.540 You could dress it up by getting also a pair of dress slacks, but I'm not going to say that you have to have those.

00:34:59.260 But, if you're going to go out with some friends or you've got a – you know, let's say for a wedding,

00:35:04.240 you've got a reception dinner that you've been invited to,

00:35:07.180 well, all of a sudden you're able to wear those really nice jeans with that sports jacket.

00:35:11.980 You want to have also a couple nice collared dress shirts that, you know, just fit you well,

00:35:18.680 that you've taken and gotten adjusted.

00:35:20.680 You can go to places like Target and you can find some nice ones.

00:35:23.520 You're going to need to take them to a tailor because they're usually made a bit more billowing.

00:35:27.340 But, maybe you can find a slim fit if you're a bit slimmer.

00:35:30.080 If you're a bit larger of a guy, that doesn't mean that you have to wear your clothing loose.

00:35:34.300 And believe me, being a large guy, I've written the book on it.

00:35:38.120 Wearing big clothing is – and we've got a great resource over at The Art of Manliness as well,

00:35:42.320 so go check it out.

00:35:43.420 But, wearing all that loose clothing does not hide the fact that you're a large guy.

00:35:47.940 It just makes you look like you're a large guy with no sense of style.

00:35:50.800 It's better to, you know, get it trimmed up, go to your tailor and look like you're large 0.86

00:35:55.860 and in charge versus, honestly, fat and sloppy.

00:35:59.960 So, moving on from there, shoes.

00:36:03.680 Invest in a pair of, you know, find something that works for you, but something that is a

00:36:08.900 step up from the $50 or $20, you know, don't running shoes.

00:36:14.260 If you're not running or you're not working out, try to avoid the running shoes.

00:36:19.680 Find a pair of casual leather shoes that look good.

00:36:22.720 These don't have to be – I mean, usually I throw out, you know, dress boots or bluchers

00:36:26.840 or what, derbies or saddle shoes or a pair of loafers.

00:36:33.800 Those are all fine, but find something that at least is made from leather and that has a

00:36:38.940 more presentable look to it.

00:36:40.760 Don't – don't wear your running shoes with your – with your jeans and your t-shirt

00:36:44.540 around town.

00:36:45.220 I mean, you can wear that.

00:36:46.480 That's great working around the house.

00:36:48.180 But, if you're going out, you know, look to upgrade it.

00:36:51.240 Try to throw on a collared shirt.

00:36:53.220 Polos are nice, but there are various degrees of polos.

00:36:56.960 And I'm going to say having one nice polo that is made from a little bit more finer of

00:37:02.140 fabric.

00:37:02.500 And if you need to get an example, go in and look at the difference between an old

00:37:06.960 navy polo that's made from a very low-quality fabric.

00:37:11.480 And those are fine for wearing around the house, but you want to go look at one that's

00:37:14.940 made by a higher-end menswear company.

00:37:18.380 So, you can – you know, a few brands that are decent.

00:37:20.840 I mean, Ralph Lauren, they've got the iconic polo out there.

00:37:25.120 And then, Nautica is a fine brand as well.

00:37:27.340 So, go look at those and look at the difference in – in the actual weave of the fabric.

00:37:31.540 And that's what you're aiming for.

00:37:33.640 So, we've talked about the jeans.

00:37:35.500 We've talked about a polo.

00:37:36.980 We've talked about probably at least three nice dress shirts that are – stick with

00:37:41.480 whites and blues.

00:37:42.420 Very simple.

00:37:43.320 Very interchangeable.

00:37:44.740 Don't go with hot pinks and all these other colors.

00:37:47.500 Don't go with a black. 1.00

00:37:48.640 Those are all casual.

00:37:49.640 And those are fine, but they're not part of that core wardrobe that we're talking about.

00:37:54.140 Awesome.

00:37:54.540 Okay.

00:37:54.820 So, guys listening to this and he's saying, okay, I need to do this, but I have a limited

00:38:00.140 budget.

00:38:01.540 Maybe like he's in college, right?

00:38:03.420 Or he's just starting out in life.

00:38:04.940 Any advice to these guys who have a limited budget that they can't go out and buy all

00:38:10.640 of this all at once?

00:38:12.140 What can they do to build a wardrobe like this? 0.83

00:38:17.260 They can do a Google search for the art of manliness, how to dress like a million dollars

00:38:22.020 on $200.

00:38:23.140 That's a great – okay.

00:38:24.080 So, that – but I'll go into a little bit of detail later.

00:38:26.480 One, we talk about thrifting, going in and finding amazing finds.

00:38:30.420 And not everything in thrift stores is used.

00:38:33.100 Oftentimes, you have just – someone that had a – bought a whole bunch – I mean, you

00:38:36.860 have estate sales that come in.

00:38:38.280 Literally, a guy passed away and he had like 20 dress shirts that were still wrapped in

00:38:42.380 plat – you know, in the packaging that were just donated.

00:38:45.500 And these are $100 dress shirts going for $2.

00:38:49.160 There's a great website called Thrift Store Runway.

00:38:52.520 Again and again and again, I see people assembling amazing outfits for less than $50 and that includes

00:38:58.840 the shoes.

00:39:00.060 So, let's talk about the shoes.

00:39:01.380 You can go into thrift stores and you can find a gently used pair of Allen Edmonds, Alden,

00:39:06.180 a lot of higher-end brands and you can send them back to the company and have them rebuilt

00:39:10.620 for $100.

00:39:11.780 So, you get a $500 pair of dress shoes for $100.

00:39:16.320 Moving on to, you know, your trousers, keep those simple.

00:39:20.220 Focus on the fit.

00:39:21.360 This is usually an area that you can go with an El Cheapo brand.

00:39:25.420 Lee, Levi's, these both make fine – Lee just came out with a really nice modern series.

00:39:30.700 Levi's has a number – Levi's has kind of lowered the rise, so I'm – you've got

00:39:35.120 to be a little bit younger of a man.

00:39:36.280 They don't really have anything that's mid-sized.

00:39:39.040 But, you can easily spend, you know, $30, $40, find them on sale at JCPenney's and boom,

00:39:44.400 you've taken care of – of your jeans.

00:39:47.460 Also, you know, don't be afraid to go to Target and look at some of the slacks. 1.00

00:39:51.460 Have them then taken in.

00:39:53.660 Now, where you're going to want to spend your money and spend a lot more time looking is

00:39:57.500 going to be something like the sports jacket.

00:39:59.200 That's a bigger ticket item.

00:40:01.200 It's worth spending the investment.

00:40:02.980 But, you know what?

00:40:04.120 Many of us look like our fathers.

00:40:06.340 We look like our uncles because we share the same genetics.

00:40:09.380 Well, you know what?

00:40:10.260 Ask that stylish uncle who doesn't wear his clothing much, you know, wear this stuff and

00:40:14.820 say, hey, can I – you have any clothing that maybe you've got stored up, you've

00:40:18.080 got boxed away in a storage unit?

00:40:21.020 Don't be afraid to ask people.

00:40:23.100 You would be – you would be surprised what's out there.

00:40:25.160 I had one gentleman on my email list email me that he basically had an uncle open up

00:40:29.480 a storage unit and he just had like five boxes of amazing clothing.

00:40:34.320 And, yeah, half of it was kind of dated to the 1970s, but the other half was perfect.

00:40:40.140 And even that stuff that – you know, he even started wearing some of that 70s stuff

00:40:43.400 saying, wow, you know, it really gave me a bit of flair.

00:40:45.620 And he's having a bit of luck out there with the ladies.

00:40:48.520 He's – so who – the point I'm saying, guys, is don't let money – money is probably

00:40:55.420 what – I have a couple excuses down.

00:40:58.640 And I think, Brett, we've been talking about this, about, you know, common problems

00:41:03.060 that guys – and money is one of the biggest problems that guys throw out there.

00:41:06.840 But I think it's a lack of creativity.

00:41:09.040 And it's not just style.

00:41:10.580 Look at Robert Rodriguez, his first film, El Mariachi.

00:41:14.960 Did you ever hear the story about that?

00:41:16.340 I think I have, but I've forgotten it.

00:41:20.160 $6,000 he made that movie.

00:41:22.040 That's impressive.

00:41:22.860 And he did – yeah, and he raised that movie and it made about a million dollars in the

00:41:26.020 Mexican market.

00:41:26.960 He made that movie because he just got friends and family to be the actors.

00:41:30.940 He used ketchup as blood and he basically volunteered himself as a summer to take pills

00:41:37.080 and gave away plasma.

00:41:38.600 And that's how he raised all the money.

00:41:40.120 But you know what?

00:41:41.080 He did it and he got creative because he wanted it bad enough.

00:41:44.000 So, if you want to improve yourself, don't – forget about the clothing.

00:41:48.600 It's not about the clothing.

00:41:50.060 It's about understanding what is your why and why – where do you want to be in life

00:41:53.820 and understanding that clothing is simply one way to enable – it's one of those multipliers

00:41:59.720 that will enable you to – to be able to get in – your foot in the door at that bank

00:42:05.100 that you want to work at.

00:42:06.240 And you don't want to just work at, you want to manage.

00:42:08.020 And use the clothing to dress like what they expect a future manager to look like.

00:42:14.460 Awesome.

00:42:15.580 That's all great stuff.

00:42:16.860 And one thing that's helped me too with this like budget issue is like understanding like

00:42:22.240 you don't have to build a wardrobe all at once.

00:42:25.860 Like a lot of guys think they have to – I've got to go out there and I have to get it all

00:42:28.260 right now.

00:42:29.320 And for me, I've just sort of learned that, you know, you can slowly build up your wardrobe

00:42:35.080 over a year, multiple years.

00:42:37.340 Like you pick up a suit one year.

00:42:38.840 Then the next year you make a big investment in, you know, the pair of shoes or whatever.

00:42:43.320 And then, you know, pretty soon you've got like a pretty awesome wardrobe.

00:42:48.320 I think there's like – what's that?

00:42:49.740 Have you seen El – what's it called right now?

00:42:52.760 Gran Torino, right?

00:42:54.400 And like there's this scene where Clint Eastwood's with this young kid and the kid's

00:42:57.920 like, I want all these tools you have in your garage, but I can never afford this.

00:43:02.100 And like Clint Eastwood told him, well, you know, it took me years to like get this awesome

00:43:06.200 tool collection.

00:43:06.820 So it's going to take you years to develop – to get your collection as well.

00:43:11.400 So yeah, I think maybe some patience, right, could help too.

00:43:15.100 And we've got that four-part series over at The Art of Manliness.

00:43:18.880 We've got checklists there of what to add in to build your wardrobe.

00:43:23.220 And I think we've even broken it out in certain categories.

00:43:26.600 So if you're in, you know, if you're a professional, if you're a uniform man, we

00:43:30.680 talk about that and where to invest your money, where to possibly save some money.

00:43:35.100 And yeah, you'll compromise on the fabric, but that's okay.

00:43:38.420 You know, at this point, this will – this will do you.

00:43:40.520 It's kind of like, yeah, with the tools.

00:43:42.360 You know, you want to invest in a lot of money in certain tools simply because you want

00:43:46.020 to get it right the first time and you compromise in other areas.

00:43:49.740 And as you get the funds, then you start to build up the other areas.

00:43:54.340 Awesome.

00:43:55.000 All right.

00:43:55.480 So I have a question.

00:43:58.420 I think a lot of people have this question because you are Mr. Style Guy.

00:44:01.340 You are like – and in your videos, you're always rocking the sport coat with the pocket

00:44:05.560 square, sometimes a tie, sometimes not.

00:44:09.940 What do you wear on a day-to-day basis?

00:44:11.480 Because, like, you're not always filming.

00:44:13.100 And I know you work from home in the middle of nowhere in Wisconsin, so are you always

00:44:18.100 wearing a sport coat and pair of slacks at all times, 24-7?

00:44:22.640 Normally, I dress in black tie at 6 a.m.

00:44:26.440 And then I'll wear that till – well, actually, I wear my stroller.

00:44:30.560 And then I transition to black tie and occasionally on the weekends, white tie.

00:44:35.260 But, no, the truth is, is that I wear jeans.

00:44:38.860 I've got jeans and a polo.

00:44:41.900 So the whole reason that Old Navy polo came out is because I got an Old Navy polo on that

00:44:46.140 I've had for quite a while.

00:44:47.520 I have a pair of Lee jeans on.

00:44:49.900 This is their new modern – yeah.

00:44:51.880 So that's where those words actually came from, Brett, because I'm wearing them.

00:44:55.840 Isn't that from the – what was that movie with – gosh, with – in which the guy's – he – verbal can't – he's – he's looking at the board and he's pulling bits of info from the board.

00:45:11.220 The Usual Suspects.

00:45:12.340 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:45:14.820 All right.

00:45:15.440 So, yeah, you don't – so you dress like an average guy during the day.

00:45:19.040 I do.

00:45:19.740 Now, there is research out there.

00:45:21.320 How we dress – I'm not sitting in my boxers.

00:45:25.820 Now, I also – I'm wearing clothing that works for me that I feel comfortable in that I live in a town of just over a thousand people.

00:45:32.620 I'm surrounded by farmers and when I go out, I interact with people.

00:45:36.880 It just makes sense to dress – and I'm still out dressing most of the people here.

00:45:41.860 But I do want to be dressed in a manner that I will feel at least presentable if I need to quickly drive up to my school.

00:45:48.360 Although, if I did drive up to the school with the current weather, what I do is throw on a very nice sweater and that would – that would enhance my current look.

00:45:55.780 But – but it – but it's something that you got to pay attention to your environment.

00:45:59.460 I don't want to say – you know, it just – it's not practical for me at this point to wear a suit every day.

00:46:04.620 I'm not – not having to commute or anything like that.

00:46:07.080 No one is seeing me.

00:46:08.620 But it is something that there's a lot of research coming out of Northwestern University and other places about the field of – in the field of enclosed cognition.

00:46:17.780 The New York Times wrote about this and they can do a quick Google search if they want to learn more.

00:46:21.440 But they talk about how we are affected by the clothing that we wear and how it changes our mindset.

00:46:27.740 And we actually will perform better if we dress in a manner that makes us feel good.

00:46:31.460 So some people listening may say, well, you know, when I've got a test on a – I dress sharp for that test.

00:46:36.840 Well, if it makes you feel better, then do it because guess what?

00:46:39.580 You will perform better.

00:46:40.760 And they've shown this again and again.

00:46:43.200 Yeah, I occasionally when I really need to hunker down and get some good work done, I'll switch out of the T-shirt and jeans I typically wear because I work from home too.

00:46:53.760 And I'll put on something a little nicer.

00:46:55.900 Even though I'm not going out, it does change your mindset for me at least.

00:47:01.460 I think it's interesting you mentioned something, Tony, about you live in a rural area.

00:47:09.200 And this is actually – we had a question from Twitter from Mantic59.

00:47:13.580 He's the man who's probably taught more men how to shave in the world than is out there.

00:47:20.280 But he asked about dressing well in a really rural area.

00:47:23.880 I mean, is it – I mean, should you even like try to like wear your Armani suit or sport coat all the time when you're out strolling Main Street in the middle of nowhere America?

00:47:35.600 Or should you be more cognizant of your surroundings and dress to the environment that you happen to be in?

00:47:46.200 So, Brett, let me ask you a question.

00:47:48.020 If you were to go – let's say you decide you guys took Gus to the doctor.

00:47:52.800 And, you know, you're a little bit worried.

00:47:55.440 Everything is okay.

00:47:56.100 But you take him to the emergency room, 2 o'clock in the morning.

00:47:59.340 And a guy comes out and he's dressed in a t-shirt and jeans and running shoes.

00:48:03.160 And he says, hey, I'll take him.

00:48:04.400 You know, are you – what are you going to think here?

00:48:08.000 Well, I would like you're not a doctor.

00:48:09.700 I don't know if you're a doctor.

00:48:10.760 Yeah.

00:48:11.080 Because – well, so what does a doctor look like?

00:48:13.900 He's got a lab coat on.

00:48:16.000 Exactly.

00:48:16.540 Yeah.

00:48:17.300 He's got that thing on his head.

00:48:19.220 So the answer is what is your position in life?

00:48:23.140 Who are you?

00:48:24.060 Who are you?

00:48:25.140 And what is – what is – you know, I am the owner of a custom clothier and I'm the owner of a style channel.

00:48:30.980 I need to live up to the expectation because if I betray people's expectation of that, it's going to send a mixed signal and it's going to create distrust.

00:48:40.400 So if you're – the best dressed people in this town actually are the teachers and I like that because they take their – even in a small town and, you know, but when I go to my son's school, I notice the teachers are always well put together.

00:48:55.280 They try to put their best foot forward and, you know, some of the guy teachers got to work on fit and they wear those kind of outlandish funny ties with, you know, Yogi Bear on them or, you know, or Fred Flint or something like that.

00:49:06.120 You know, and I'm like, I smile, but, you know, they do that for the kids and I respect that.

00:49:11.820 And whenever I go take my kids to school and I'm going to go in and I meet with the teacher, I always dress well.

00:49:17.640 I don't overdress, but I do send the signal I'm a business owner.

00:49:21.960 I represent my family and that's who I dress for.

00:49:24.720 Awesome.

00:49:26.840 This is kind of – going back to Mantis' question, one thing that I remember learning during some sort of professional development class when I was in law school was about dress, right?

00:49:36.940 Because when you are an attorney, particularly when you're at trial, you are basically putting – you're basically putting on a performance, right, and trying to convince a jury to go your way with the case.

00:49:48.440 And one of the people that came and spoke to us really hit home the point, like, you know, you want to dress and present yourself for that performance so that you get the result that you want.

00:50:00.240 Now, people say, oh, this is so manipulative and whatever.

00:50:02.400 Well, like, well, that's just how people are.

00:50:03.880 We are very emotional and like you mentioned, there's research and studies that show that people pay attention to how people dress and whether they trust them or not.

00:50:11.540 And they hit on the fact, like, if you are, you know, presenting a case in New York City or even like Tulsa, Oklahoma, you know, an urban area, like, you'll want to wear a conservative gray suit, nice white shirt, you know, very crisp, conservative, just like your typical stereotypical power attorney because that's how people in urban areas perceive – that's how they like their attorneys, right?

00:50:37.960 That's how they imagine an attorney looking.

00:50:40.160 But he said if you were to try a case, present a case in some district court in the middle of nowhere in Oklahoma and you wore that same sort of outfit, you know, the people there are going to look at you a little suspicious because they're going to say, oh, this is some, you know, highfalutin big city attorney.

00:50:57.740 I don't know if I can trust this guy.

00:50:59.260 So this guy said, you know, for that situation, if you're in a district court in kind of a rural area, you want to dress it down where they're a little more informal.

00:51:09.460 Even though it's a court of law, they're very much – they're much more informal in that area.

00:51:13.260 So you might want to go with a tweed coat or a brown suit, some suspender, you know, a bow tie, right, and sort of bring – you know, just make it a little bit more homey so that people trust you.

00:51:24.460 And so I think a lot of people – I've tried to do this more in my own life is like, you know, taking – it's not all about you.

00:51:33.140 You also need to take into consideration what other people and how they perceive you to get the maximum result with what you're trying to do with your wardrobe or your clothing.

00:51:41.740 Now, and you said a very interesting word.

00:51:44.900 You talked about manipulation.

00:51:46.900 Manipulation is wrong because what you're trying – you know, when people are manipulating, they have an alternative motive and there's – there is something negative there.

00:51:56.340 What I'm talking about and, you know, I think what we write about, what we both agree on is that it's more about you allowing – you being able to reach your goals and to not let – to make sure the message is very clear as to who you are and what you represent.

00:52:13.760 So, if you're a plumber, you need to dress like a plumber and dress like a professional plumber.

00:52:19.140 Because when you knock on that woman's door who's at home alone and she's wondering – she wants to make – she's going to make a very quick decision, you know, can I trust you to come into my house? 0.98

00:52:30.980 My husband's gone.

00:52:32.180 You know, I've got my baby here, you know, in the next room sleeping.

00:52:35.760 And it's not about manipulation that you are wearing, you know, a very set uniform and clothing that sends a signal of trust.

00:52:44.260 That's – you know, you're just doing simply your job and you're doing it to a higher level.

00:52:50.020 Okay, awesome.

00:52:50.580 All right, Tony.

00:52:51.540 We're running out of time here.

00:52:52.900 But before we go, are there any other places that you recommend men going besides Art of Manliness and your awesome site, Real Men Real Style and, you know, the various style systems?

00:53:03.300 Any other places that you enjoy on the internet or books about men's style that you find helpful that you think guys should check out?

00:53:10.700 So, I'll really quick give them a list of blogs.

00:53:13.700 I actually created – we – in the last – we put out a list earlier this year of the top 10.

00:53:18.320 And I ranked around 236 men's style blogs.

00:53:22.720 Now, we're at like 500.

00:53:24.440 So, I'll give you some – and this is – so, based off my – a lot of personal opinion here.

00:53:30.160 But I really like what Raphael's doing over at the Gentleman's Gazette.

00:53:34.420 That's a bit more formal.

00:53:36.120 But for anyone interested in history, I mean, he is really hard to beat.

00:53:39.160 His information is great.

00:53:40.520 There's Joe over at Dappert.

00:53:42.340 So, we talked about a lot about saving money and, you know, finances and things.

00:53:47.980 Go get on Dappert's email list.

00:53:50.120 Joe is just aggregating some of the best deals out there on the web.

00:53:54.900 There's the guys over at KinoWare that not as many people know about that website.

00:53:59.520 And I rank it in my top five.

00:54:01.960 KinoWare is really a great website because I think they – you talk about systems as well.

00:54:07.080 There's Barron over at the Effortless Gent.

00:54:09.520 He is doing some great things.

00:54:10.940 And Barron really targets, I think, the younger man and the urban male.

00:54:15.620 There's the guys over at the Style Blogger.

00:54:17.660 They're a little bit more fashion forward.

00:54:20.260 There's Put This On.

00:54:21.460 Jesse, you know, he's done a great job over there.

00:54:24.220 And lastly, you know, once you've got your foundation built, I would invite – go check out the Style Forum and ask Andy about clothes.

00:54:32.900 Awesome.

00:54:33.620 Well, Tony, thank you so much.

00:54:34.960 This has been, I hopefully, I hope, a very helpful podcast for people who are listening.

00:54:40.020 Where can people find you, Tony?

00:54:41.960 Where can they go to find more about Antonio and his work?

00:54:45.400 Go check me out at Real Men Real Style.

00:54:47.460 There's a contact form.

00:54:49.000 And I make – you know, have a little bit of fun as you've gone through my contact form.

00:54:52.960 I like to make it fun.

00:54:54.320 And, yeah, go check it out.

00:54:56.080 People can reach me that way.

00:54:57.500 Awesome.

00:54:57.820 Well, thanks, Tony, so much for your time.

00:54:59.860 Thank you, Brett.

00:55:00.620 Bye-bye.

00:55:01.200 Our guest today was Antonio Centeno.

00:55:03.180 Antonio is the founder and owner of RealMenRealStyle.com.

00:55:06.860 I highly recommend you go check it out.

00:55:08.560 And you can also find Tony's writing about style and menswear at ArtofManliness.com.

00:55:13.400 So definitely check it out.

00:55:16.380 Well, that wraps up another edition of the Art of Manliness podcast.

00:55:19.600 For more manly tips and advice, make sure to check out the Art of Manliness website at ArtofManliness.com.

00:55:24.000 And until next time, stay manly.

The Art of Manliness - April 04, 2014

Episode #52： Real Men Real Style With Antonio Centeno

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