Matthew Peterson is the co-founder of NewFounding, a venture studio that helps solve problems in media, tech, and finance. In this episode, he talks about how he got started in venture and why he thinks we need alternative institutions.
00:01:30.520Hey, everybody. How's it going? Thanks for joining me this afternoon. I've got a great stream with a guest I think you're really going to enjoy. Now, we've talked a lot in this corner of the internet about the need for alternative institutions. You know, lots of analysis, lots of understanding, lots of explaining, but we've talked a lot also about the need for building. And I thought I'd bring on someone who is involved in the work of building who would be very interesting for you guys. Matthew Peterson. Thanks for joining me, man.
00:02:00.520Hey, it's great to be here. Great admirer of your work.
00:02:05.100Oh, well, thank you very much. And I'm very glad that you're doing the work you're doing, which is why I wanted to have you on. I think it's so important to not just talk about all of the different things we're analyzing and all of the problems and everything about that, but also solutions. And you're somebody who has a lot going on and we're going to get deep into that. But before we do, for people who are maybe a little less familiar with your work, could you give a little bit of background?
00:02:31.220Yeah, so two years ago, I moved from California to Texas. I was just a random, random occurrence, you know, taxes were lower.
00:02:42.420And really came to Texas to found new founding. And the goal of new founding is really to be the venture studio we need to create the things we need, particularly in media, tech and finance.
00:03:01.920But to solve some of the problems that, you know, that prevent, let's call it a, you know, an aligned economy from emerging and an aligned culture from emerging.
00:03:13.860And there's similar problems that lots of businesses face. And so we tackle those head on. We connect people, we connect talent, we connect capital, aligned to aligned investors to businesses.
00:03:26.140And we, we basically like created the venture studio that was like, let's try to do all the things, right. And, and really went to town in the last two years.
00:03:35.560And now we have some, you know, emerging, some things work, some things didn't work, but now we have kind of an emerging picture of, you know, of some things that really are working.
00:03:46.160And does that make sense? I mean, that may not be specific. I feel like probably some of the audience is like, yes, and some is no, what are you talking about?
00:03:55.980But, you know, in venture, you're trying to build what you think is going to work and what's needed.
00:04:00.500And we felt like, you know, practically in the commercial cultural space, we need a new movement that is really in a way similar to ESG or social justice,
00:04:09.760that is struggling to break forth, moving in a different direction.
00:04:13.620And, and, and we're, we want to birth that baby.
00:04:18.040So we're, we'll get into a lot of that. But for people who are unfamiliar, what is your background in?
00:04:24.600Are you, are you someone who's a businessman? Are you someone advertising finance?
00:04:28.160Like, where, where did you kind of build this skill set that's going to allow you to kind of move this forward?
00:04:34.420Yeah, exactly. So I was involved in a lot of media.
00:04:38.860media. And, and politics, really, is my, is my background. And, and I'm very entrepreneurial along the way, like I built, you know, little things here and there.
00:04:50.580So my role at new founding is more on that side of things is to see the strategic positioning, and to match, right, to match the people together, and also just a general entrepreneurial general partner kind of thing where I come up with ideas and experiment.
00:05:08.560Um, so, uh, you know, my background is varied. I mean, I, I started out wanting to, um, save the world in education. Um, you may, uh, you may be familiar with this phenomenon.
00:05:21.120Um, and, um, you know, I was torn between going into politics, but I thought, you know, people just go straight into politics. Like that's weird. You know, I was smart enough to realize that that's, that's not right. Uh, something wrong with that. You got to do stuff. And so, but I, but I was, I was drawn to ideas.
00:05:38.880And so I was drawn to understand more about the founding and how to place it in terms of political philosophy. Um, and I thought that, you know, shaping the university was very important. I still do. Um, but I soon realized along the way, as I did other entrepreneurial things that I had skills in, in, uh, communication and, you know, communication strategy, and then doing a lot of online stuff from a very young age. Um, uh, you know, I was a sued, uh, well before that was a thing.
00:06:08.880I was a thing on Twitter, uh, before Twitter existed, I was a sued. Um, and I, I, uh, made money off of that too, because I was, uh, getting involved in journalism and consulting and doing all kinds of shady things. Um, so, so anyway, along the way I would go do these more entrepreneurial things and I'd say media and politics and consulting. And then, and then I was still in education until I realized that, uh, much too late. I wish I had realized it sooner, uh, that there really wasn't an end game there because the only way to change
00:06:38.740education is to be in charge, uh, and wield power from the top, uh, you're certainly not going to do that from the bottom by convincing anyone. And that means you've got to be on a board or a president, right. Or, you know, administrator who is very good friends with the board and president. And as soon as I realized that the hard way in microcosm, I was like, I'm done, you know, I'm done with this. Like, this doesn't make any sense. Plus the world's falling apart, you know? Uh, and so, you know, so politics and, and media with, uh, with, uh,
00:07:08.740experience in between and this academic background that I slowly left behind.
00:07:14.980Excellent. So I'm going to pitch you a few softballs. They may seem obvious, but I feel like there are still a lot of people who aren't completely on board or don't completely understand the essential nature of kind of this approach. So, uh, we'll, we'll start from that, uh, zoomed out view and then we'll kind of, uh, move in and get more specific. So why do we need this approach? Why don't we just win an election
00:07:36.740and like have a president and pass some bills? And then we can just get back to kind of the 1950s. Like, why is it essential to have this, uh, you know, all encompassing approach or this approach where you are, uh, you know, looking at, uh, commercialization, networking, all those different things. Why do we just have this, you know, political solution that kind of puts everything back on track?
00:07:57.300Yeah, well, the, the short answer is, is because you live in a system that is so corrupt, uh, that corruption is what is normalized and what it's become. Uh, no politician is going to save you at this point. Um, no, no, you know, I like to tell, uh, conservative audiences, you know, Donald Trump or Ron DeSantis, neither of them are going to save you, put them in the white house tomorrow.
00:08:23.860And the reason for that is that you have an apparatus that has, uh, changed over a very long period of time in some cases, uh, you know, some, sometimes slowly and then suddenly. Um, but it's a, it's a, it's a system that's encrusted. It's, it's enthroned, uh, it's enshrined.
00:08:42.580And in that system, you know, where, how power flows, uh, is, is just not really directly related to who comes into that office. And so I still think those things are important. I don't discount them. I'm not someone who says, oh, well, you know, it's, it's all over. Um, but the party is a vehicle to be used political parties and politicians, frankly, for the most part are going to be pushed forward.
00:09:09.060Uh, they're going to be symbolic of actual, the actual flow of power and, and victory and the real battle almost at the end of that. Right. Almost like, almost like a bobber on the current, like that's the policy, you know?
00:09:22.280So I, I've just come to the conclusion that the system is set up in such a way that they don't have the ability to, they don't have a magic wand to wave. Uh, and you know, I consider myself someone, I guess I know a lot of people in that world and formally studied it even if that matters, which it doesn't. Uh, but also, um, you know, also have examined it over the, you know, experience, interacted with this system.
00:09:47.420So there's no way you solve the problem with law at this point, uh, when, when law has shaped something that's bigger than law, which is, you know, the contours of the entire, let's call it the actual constitution of the regime, the actual form or structure of the society in which you live has calcified into something that cannot be changed, uh, by, by moving politicians around, uh, you know?
00:10:14.880Yeah, I think that's really important for people to hear. Again, it may feel obvious to some of us, but it's really essential. I think when people it's, it's especially because of the nature, I think of like political talk radio and TV and that kind of things, you know, the horse race thing is just, well, you know, focus on the candidate, focus on the details, look at the polling. Oh, let's get to the next cycle of issues. Let's zoom in on this next thing.
00:10:38.160It's so easy to get swept up in that. That's what kind of churns and burns in the news media, but that's not the focus. Like you said, no politician is going to come in and sweep in and save you. And that doesn't mean it doesn't matter who's in the white house or who's getting elected.
00:10:53.940And it doesn't mean that law doesn't have a role, but the really essential thing that I think you pointed out there is that law in and of itself, even if you could get those paths, which I think the Republicans have proven they're not very good at, but even if they could move the ball in that direction, what you don't control are all these things that are part of the system, but are outside of the direct apparatus.
00:11:16.600You don't control the actual implementation of that law once it's passed. And so it's really key, I think, for conservatives and those on the right to understand that opposition is not simply one or two bills away, an election away, a news cycle away.
00:11:34.460It's a long process. It's something that's involved. It's something that's complicated. And that doesn't mean it's not winnable, but it means that you need to shift your priorities and your understanding and your outlook if you want to win.
00:11:46.880This is a lifelong project, not a two-year election where you can just go back to what you were doing before and ignore it once you're done.
00:11:54.920Yeah. Can I just, I mean, I think that's, that's very well said. And I think one way to look at this would be, you know, Adrian, Adrian Vermeule, you know, Pope Adrian Comstock Vermeule III or whatever. Great, interesting guy. He was a law professor, right? If your, your, your audience doesn't know him. And he does, I mean, I disagree with him on some things, but he makes a great point about the power of the administrative state.
00:12:21.460I would say, I would say right now, more important than any law being passed by far. I mean, a thousand fold. I would trade us not passing the right, not passing a law or possibly even electing any politician to electable federal office, putting anyone in power. I would trade both those things, electing a law or putting anyone in the political offices in the plumb book for the federal government.
00:12:49.440For one thing. And that's control over everyone else who works in the federal government. Yeah. Right. I mean, if you, if you took all the employees of the administrative state, similar in a state government, if you took all the employees in the educational system, K through 12 in a state and the state university system, and you put them in with people who thought rightly about these things, that would be far more powerful than passing any damn law.
00:13:15.440You wouldn't need to pass the law. Laws would take care of themselves or they just resist the law. So, I mean, that's the way to think about it. Because right now, you know, it's not very clear. It's not very clear. What, what do you do?
00:13:28.160What do you do when you come in and you're, oh, you're in charge of this, this ship now. You're the captain of the ship. Here's the captain's quarters. Here's the three people who work for you. Everyone else here works on the ship too, but actually they all hate you and won't do what you say.
00:13:42.760Yeah. Yeah, exactly. No, that's, that's something that I think, you know, the Trump administration learned, uh, in a very visceral way. And, you know, I've talked to guys like Andrew Klosser and it's clear that that lesson was learned. Um, that, which is good. There are people thinking about how to solve that problem. Now it's, I, hopefully the next time someone gets a crack at that, it won't look the same way because that will have been considered and there'll be a plan in place.
00:14:12.440But that's a, it's a very difficult problem on a lot of levels because even if you're aware of the issue and even if you want to set up the mechanisms to fire bureaucrats and properly vet things and get people past that kind of stuff, what you're really looking at is an apparatus that is so large that it's difficult to overcome because you might be able to, you know, have some control over hiring and firing, but you don't have control of the education mechanism.
00:14:38.060So the people who are, you know, certified, who are qualified, who have the credentials to become these administrators and these bureaucrats are steeped deeply in the ideology of your enemies.
00:14:50.120You don't have the ability to control the legal system outside of it. So anyone serving inside the administration could basically be opening themselves up for endless lawsuits and testimony in front of Congress, because it's very clear that the left is more than willing to basically imprison any of its political enemies.
00:15:08.680It has the option to, while the right just kind of twiddles its thumbs and complains about candidate quality.
00:15:14.680I think the problems are obvious, like I said, we know about these, but the solutions that you've been talking about, the things that people are going to found are going to be really influential.
00:15:27.440So let's talk a little bit about institutions, right? We know we want to control these bureaucracies, like we understand the importance of them.
00:15:35.440But why do we need institutions outside of those in order to influence and control the bureaucracies that then could create kind of those essential changes?
00:15:47.120Yeah. So you need to look at what forms. What we're talking about with institutions, I think, is what forms human souls, what forms human beings.
00:15:55.760You know, and by form, we mean, not just bodily, right? Although they do form you bodily and what they allow you to eat or encourage you to eat, right?
00:16:05.880What they encourage you to do with your body, whether that's to mutilate it or to, you know, to to nourish it.
00:16:14.220But but the way in which we if you don't like the word soul, you can talk about behavior, like what shapes us.
00:16:20.620Right. And and what shapes us are are things like media, which is educating us all the time.
00:16:27.680The hours you spend on your screen throughout your whole life is really the primary educator in a way at this point for most humans.
00:16:35.860And and education, obviously, in a direct way is trying to form you.
00:16:42.900And when you look at all these institutions, I mean, the power they have is that they shape the people who then go into, you know, the government and they shape what everyone what the purpose is.
00:16:58.900Right. What are you trying to accomplish with power?
00:17:01.460And how does power masquerade itself often and tell you that it's well, this is really for the sake of the common good, because, look, every every no one no one ever says you need to support me because I need to have power.
00:17:17.160Right. The way this works is similarly with, you know, and this isn't even very cynical or Machiavellian.
00:17:22.720I think it's just true. You can have different takes on human nature.
00:17:26.560But, you know, no one ever gives a tip. It comes to corruption or whatever, to the hotline because of the common good.
00:17:33.000They do it because they hate that bastard over there.
00:17:36.260You know, no one gets in trouble in our society right now for breaking the law because they just randomly happen to found to be bad.
00:17:42.200It's that they're in a power war with someone else. Right. And then they leak.
00:17:45.500That's just the way that's just the way these things work.
00:17:48.200So, anyway, I mean, go back to your question. I mean, these institutions are what shape the goal, what the purpose is.
00:17:55.600And you don't if you're if you're really just about power or your own self-interest, which is something every human being has within them, the desire for just to defend themselves.
00:18:05.040You're always going to have to make an argument for justice or an argument for why this is good for everybody.
00:18:10.540Right. And you can't just say it's good for me. That's pure tyranny.
00:18:14.620Everyone recognizes it such and then you've got a legitimacy problem.
00:18:17.220So so all these institutions shape that debate.
00:18:20.580They shape what we think we're trying to achieve in common and who we are as human beings.
00:18:25.420And the idea that you can just you know, you can waltz in with a couple of politicians at the top of the federal apparatus and solve the problem is sort of crazy.
00:18:33.620Like that may have caused the problem over a long period of time.
00:18:36.720Over a long period of time, you may be able to or, you know, maybe you could speed that up somehow if you take more power.
00:18:44.820But you're talking about the way human beings think about themselves, what they think their purpose is, how they live their lives every day.
00:18:53.060You know, you have to go to these other institutions.
00:18:55.020And if they're controlled by people who you radically disagree with about these things, then, you know, you've got a real problem.
00:19:05.380You know, Gatana Mosca called this a political formula.
00:19:08.260And a lot of people will, like you said, they'll get cynical and Machiavellian saying, well, you know, basically this political formula is just a justification for power.
00:19:19.540But Mosca says that actually it's really essential over the long term that you believe this, that, you know, while you can reduce this to this political formula, if people aren't bought in, including the rulers, eventually it shows.
00:19:35.340And so when you have institutions, when you have power centers that are oriented towards the good of the people they're serving, when they do benefit the rulers, because they always will, but they also benefit the ruled.
00:19:48.800When everybody's interests are aligned, that's really when power is flowing well.
00:19:56.640And if you don't have that, if you have that that fundamental break, then you have a huge issue.
00:20:02.360And so until you kind of realign those institutions to be benefiting people, to be shaping those souls, be shaping those minds, those hearts in a direction that's going to benefit both the rulers and the ruled, you're always going to have kind of a sick society.
00:20:18.920And so I think in a lot of ways, the key is realigning those interests.
00:20:24.540But to realign those interests, you need to know the people you're fighting for, right?
00:20:29.120You need to understand the community you're fighting for if you want to better their lives.
00:20:34.140You can't just have some kind of formless, shapeless blob.
00:20:37.620You have to actually get in and look at the people and care about them.
00:20:41.400And so one of the things I think that I've seen you kind of look at and focus on is building institutions that are looking to serve the interests of a group,
00:20:50.300looking to serve people who are going to be aligned, who are going to have similar values, who are going to share something rather than going for this big, broad umbrella,
00:21:00.180focusing on something that's truly going to benefit and build a reciprocal relationship with kind of a group that's going to move forward together.
00:21:11.580That is certainly the goal and easy to say, hard to do.
00:21:17.480Look, I go back on this to the very simple way in which Aristotle talked about corruption,
00:21:22.960which I think is the classic definition of it, which is really like whoever, whether it's one person,
00:21:29.100whether it's a few people at the top or whether it's a democracy where there's a majority involved,
00:21:34.340if that group of people decides that, you know, they're going to rule for the sake of themselves and maybe they're backscratching pals and not for the sake of everybody,
00:21:46.740then the common good isn't served and it's corrupt in some way because, like you said, those interests aren't aligned.
00:21:53.400And I think when it comes to these institutions, we need new ones because when we say like they're intrinsically corrupted,
00:22:00.400I think people kind of struggle with that.
00:22:40.280And when the institutions get corrupted and you lose sight of all that and you're just doing all this crap because you just have to do it and don't understand, that's when you need new ones.
00:22:49.040And so there you say very simply, like, it's like the talent network, you know, I started doing this informally.
00:22:54.500I don't know how it comes to me, but people will, people will see my, you know, they'll see what I'm saying about the scene.
00:23:01.160And this is why the investors like me, by the way, you know, the finance guys have always, have always loved me because they, they see that I think they see that I see something about what's going on that, that maybe I'm willing to articulate that other people aren't and other people don't see.
00:23:15.660And, you know, they, they want to, they want to know where, you know, where these things are going.
00:23:22.260But very, very practically, they would, they would knock on the door and they'd say, hey, man, I really like your tweets, you know, can you get me out of my job?
00:23:32.740Can I, do you know other people who believe this?
00:23:35.260Because when you, when you take a stand and you're pre-canceled, you're, you say this and people see that you have some legitimacy to, you know, your background or professional, whatever you're doing.
00:23:44.940Then they start flocking and saying, hey, do you know, can I be general counsel to a non-crazy, you know, firm?
00:24:34.400So let's create an in-between, you know, network where they sign up and we go to also the businesses who want them and we use our network to quietly build that and just allow people to get out from under woke capital and build things with like-minded people.
00:24:50.580And to me, it's one of these things where, I don't know, I'm probably a psycho in this way because I always, some people are always like, what do you want to do, Matt?
00:24:57.800I always end up doing what I think needs to be done.
00:25:19.300I would trade a large number of theoretical political victories for a reliable alternative network of employment for people willing to stick their necks out there, right?
00:25:29.820Like, I had this conversation so many times with people and I was shocked, but I guess I'm not anymore.
00:25:38.040I would talk to people who, you know, I have more opportunity to talk to people higher up and, you know, with more influence.
00:25:44.840And they would just say things like, well, you know, everybody just needs to stand up and say the truth.
00:25:50.020And once they all, you know, everyone has the courage of their convictions to speak out, then the whole thing will turn around.
00:25:55.600And I'm just like, guys, have you lost your mind?
00:25:58.160Like, have you been out in the real world in the last five to 10 years?
00:26:02.620I mean, the people, you know, forget the average worker, guys, you know, Papa John was fired from his own company.
00:26:11.220He was the Colonel Sanders of the company.
00:26:13.000His face is on the side of the product.
00:26:16.080And he got fired from his own company because, you know, he transgressed in, you know, some video somewhere.
00:26:22.600Where you really think some average guy who's a widget in some massive bureaucracy or company somewhere, you know, is just going to, like, you know, stand up and speak the truth and they're going to be fine.
00:26:34.160You can't ask people to charge machine gun nests if you don't have a plan for victory.
00:26:39.520You know, one or two guys might be willing to walk into the firing line if they think that the rest of the guys are going to be able to move on.
00:26:47.160But if every single person who runs forward gets mowed down, then no one's going to go.
00:26:54.420And, you know, I just don't understand how people think that, you know, you've got guys like Jordan Peterson who, you know, a lot of valuable things to say over time.
00:27:03.440But, you know, are attacking, you know, internet pseudonyms because, oh, well, you know, you're not having the courage of your conviction.
00:27:19.680Like, that's not a way to encourage people.
00:27:22.960You've got to have an alternative network if you want people to have families, if you want people to build, if you want people to be involved in the community.
00:27:29.640They need a way to do that while also saying the truth.
00:27:33.820You can't have them destroy themselves and destroy their futures standing up to a movement that you're not willing to stand up to yourself.
00:27:50.060You have to be out of touch in some way.
00:27:52.600You know, I get why, like, the think tankers on the right will not get it because they haven't really, they don't even know anything about what's going on.
00:28:00.120And I've worked at, you know, I think the best right-leaning think tank, but it's not like this.
00:28:21.480And it strikes me, like, it's really weird.
00:28:23.960It's also really weird how the rhetoric around this is kind of poisonous.
00:28:29.440Like, kind of Jordan Peterson on one side saying, oh, ha-ha, soothes, you know, you're cowards, which is completely crazy.
00:28:36.760And then on the other side, like, there are people who are like, no, no, you know, never, never come out, never, just stay under their radar completely.
00:28:44.880And I kind of come in between them and say, guys, there's things we can do on both sides of this, right?
00:28:49.260I mean, of course, you're going to stay as sued.
00:31:15.060It's not as if, in fact, you probably have more to lose because they're going to care more about screwing you if you go off the reservation than they will somewhere else.
00:31:24.100So, yes, you can go to war with them, the wealthier and more powerful you are.
00:31:31.000And then even if you're not a coward, you're just smart.
00:31:33.760You're thinking, is it worth it, right?
00:31:36.160Is it worth it that I go off all – I throw everything away that I have position-wise because, say, I say I support Donald Trump publicly?
00:32:28.980Create the – you know, not to invoke the evil name of unions here, but, you know, create mutual aid societies where if someone gets canceled, someone loses their job, someone, you know, gets taken out, you know, standing for something that you believe in,
00:32:44.740they're not just gone tomorrow, they're not homeless tomorrow, they're not just completely disappeared tomorrow, create those networks where if someone has an option to exit, an option to escape,
00:32:55.320they can suddenly say, all right, I'm going to stand up and I'm going to say this because tomorrow, maybe I take that pay cut, maybe I make that move, but my kids will still eat because there's another job lined up with people who agree with me.
00:33:07.800And there's a way forward, you know, that I can see.
00:33:10.140There's a line to victory where the pain, I may endure it, but there'll be something on the other side.
00:33:17.260It's not just jumping off the cliff, running into the machine gun fire, you know.
00:33:20.800One of the other things that I think I've seen you talk about, which is essential, is also, you know, conservative or right-wing employers and businessmen, entrepreneurs walking the walk when it comes to credentialism, right?
00:33:33.380We've got an entire system built around people paying vast amounts of money, taking out huge loans, putting themselves in indentured servitude for the rest of their lives so they can sit in a progressive seminary, fund woke ideology, and then come out and parrot it in the halls of power for the rest of their existence.
00:33:52.980Because if they don't, there's a financial gun to their head.
00:33:56.120And if there's going to be any escape from this, then conservative businessmen, guys who are putting this stuff together, it's not enough to just to build the network.
00:34:03.920You need to have a system where you can vet and employ people who are willing, capable, able, trainable, but didn't devote themselves to this, didn't buy completely into this indoctrination system.
00:34:17.420And if you're not willing to do that, if you're not willing to take a chance on people who have the ability, but decided that maybe, you know, eight years of piling money into this system and sitting in front of professors that hate them isn't worth it.
00:34:31.580Like, if you're not willing to engage with those people, then you're missing out on probably some of the best upcoming talent.
00:34:36.080Yeah, boy, I couldn't agree with you more there.
00:34:40.980My whole sort of educational background was rebellious in the sense that I did the dumbest thing money-wise.
00:34:48.640You know, I just went from undergrad on to where I could read the books I wanted to read and study the actual things I wanted to study.
00:35:13.660The problem is that when you are really thick into credentialism, like you, it really, really matters, you know, where you went to school and you got that Harvard degree or whatever.
00:35:23.320What's hilarious is New Founding is all against credentialism.
00:35:27.580And I do have, like, we need to put a quota against the Harvard people who have turned traitors against their schools who are working there.
00:35:36.080When I was growing up, let me put it this way, to show the depth of my emotion here.
00:35:40.000When I was growing up, I remember going to these things, it's like conservative, you know, young Lebowski urban achievers for conservative, you know, events.
00:35:48.320And you go to them and be like, oh, yeah, look at the young people, they're great.
00:35:52.460And you kind of be like, you know, I was talking to that guy from that elite school and I don't want to say anything, but he didn't even know the books I was talking about.
00:36:00.800You know, he didn't even read those books.
00:36:03.440And we're all supposed to be on the same side.
00:36:05.940And when you say something like that, I'd be like, oh, you must be envious, son.
00:36:09.180You know, you didn't go to that school.
00:36:10.500I'm like, no, no, I'm literally saying, like, maybe he's smarter than me because it's really just a giant IQ test in your mind.
00:36:15.660Maybe, but he hasn't read the books, though.
00:36:20.540If you're relying on credentialism to the extent you are now, that means that you have lost a notion of what the substance of education is and what actual skills you need in your business.
00:36:33.300So, in other words, you don't have the ability to judge yourself or your institution or your business doesn't have the ability to judge yourself who actually has the skills you need.
00:36:43.200You're lazily relying on that piece of paper and other people to do that work for you.
00:36:51.380That shows a kind of insecure bureaucratic mindset that means things are already far along the route to decay.
00:36:58.800And what I would say is if I look back on the older people that I respected in my life, you know, some of them had elite degrees, et cetera.
00:37:09.540But they were all people who were like, they just saw talent and they had the confidence to say, I don't give a crap where this guy went to school.
00:37:28.260I don't care whether you've got these degrees.
00:37:29.860And we've lost that because we've lost the confidence that we actually know intellectually and practically or, you know, business-wise who can do what.
00:37:40.420And so, look, if you're a conservative, you know, out there and they're out there who's a CEO of a big company, you're going to have to do the work.
00:37:49.720You know, you cannot – if you keep funding the system, it will destroy you.
00:38:29.460They give millions of dollars to everyone who hates me.
00:38:31.800And yet, I'm giving a $50 million contract every year, right, to this advertising agency or to this law firm that persecutes my side and people who believe what I believe.
00:38:44.680Now, that is a solvable problem, though, given what we were saying earlier.
00:38:50.440Given that if you looked at a bunch of advertising agencies across the country, you could cobble together multiple alternatives with people of equal talent who've worked at those places.
00:39:01.000You could cobble together – law firms are already emerging of people, if you care about the credentials and all that, who have equal talent who just would be the non-woke alternative.
00:39:10.060And that's what we have to actively build.
00:39:12.400And then as far as getting the younger kids, you know, not from these schools, there it's like you've got to look at institutional alternatives, right?
00:39:20.000You've got to look at other institutions that are outlying educational institutions, look at those alternatives, start to realize the top 5%, 10% of those kids are going to be just as good, in fact, way better than your other students because they're actually educated.
00:39:32.100And then also, God forbid, that multi-billion dollar businesses had to do this, but also, why don't you develop tests for what you know you need yourself?
00:40:21.120Or even, yeah, here's an even more radical one.
00:40:24.080Why don't you have a program where you train promising people?
00:40:28.300Where you, I don't know, you could take someone into your business, and they, you know, could learn under someone who's familiar with the process.
00:40:36.380We could call it, I don't know, apprenticeship.
00:40:40.940It's a wild idea, never been tried before.
00:40:44.720But I'm willing to bet that, you know, somewhere out there, there's an option for this.
00:40:49.140But it does drive me nuts when there's just this lazy and slavish acceptance.
00:40:55.260Like, as long as you are bought into this idea that you have to hire from an institution that is basically guaranteed to build a fifth column inside your own organization, yeah, you're just doomed.
00:41:07.960And like you said, it's an admission of incompetence because what you're saying, what a lot of these people are saying is I am not confident in my ability to, A, vet management, and, B, find enough people who are then themselves capable of identifying and installing talent inside my institution.
00:41:27.600They're saying, basically, I need to offload all of this work onto institutions that hate me because I am incapable of finding people to do it myself, and that is just profound weakness.
00:41:38.440You've got to have the confidence, you have to have the willingness, you have to make the investment, and you have to be able to provide alternatives like testing that would allow you to say, okay, this guy's smart, he was willing to look at this.
00:41:49.900You know, I've got a friend who, you know, otherwise was, he was a burnout for a long time, and he didn't really get anything together with his life.
00:41:57.380And then one day he kind of figured out that there was this manufacturing place that had high-skilled employees, and if you went in and you took the test, you could start at a really good job and have a family and have benefits if you just learned this particular skill, took the test, and he didn't have to go to college, he didn't have to even pay for any kind of tech college stuff.
00:42:18.780He got the manual, he learned the stuff, he mastered it, he took the test, and he started, you know, he was able to make a good living, have a family, have kids, just being able to do that.
00:42:29.780He was smart, he was capable, he just didn't have the avenue to realize that without staring at a wall of debt and four to eight years of committing himself to something he hated.
00:42:40.260And you have to be able to provide alternatives like that if you want to go ahead and find people who aren't completely bought into this system.
00:42:48.980I mean, I think one thing to prey on, because what I find works the best with, let's say, you know, elites or people we need to convince is not so much rational argument as shame.
00:43:00.920And they don't like being shamed, because they think they're supposed to know this, and they're supposed to be that, and they're more self-conscious than a lot of regular people.
00:43:12.200And so the shame should be, you don't have, like what you said in the beginning, you don't have the confidence to make this choice yourself.
00:43:18.200And I will tell you, it doesn't matter what field it is, whether any part of business, education, media, finance, whatever.
00:43:24.400Those old guys who are just like, who had, it's the best if they have the elite degree, right, but they didn't give a crap about it.
00:43:32.300They just recognized talent and would take it wherever they were.
00:43:35.100The idea you could work yourself up through the mailroom, right?
00:44:05.040That doesn't make any sense, especially now.
00:44:07.100Get rid of them all, like firing squad for all that.
00:44:09.340I mean, we can solve these problems by simplifying things in many ways.
00:44:14.600And, you know, of course, I don't want to idolize the past, but I do think back in my own family.
00:44:20.160I mean, I have a grandfather on one side who he got an associate's degree, pretty fancy, and went and ended up working for IBM the rest of his life, basically.
00:44:33.540You know, he stayed solving the problems rather than moving up in management, even to the point of more money because he just liked to do that.
00:44:40.640And, you know, I think about him a lot because he was very talented, right, in the peculiar smarts that he had.
00:44:48.800And he was able to utilize it and provide a life for his kids, even though he was the child of Swedish immigrants, right?
00:44:55.560On the other side, you've got a farming family out in the country.
00:44:59.620And my grandfather there, he's like the black sheep of the family, ran away to California for a while.
00:45:04.780You know, he had some time, comes back, you know, high school education.
00:45:14.360And he's the guy who, you know, had that job for enough to get his retirement.
00:45:18.260And he's reading books about history and whatnot in his free time, right?
00:45:21.800Because he has leisure time, he's not – the whole way in which the calculus that's being used here for prestige is also screwing us up, right?
00:45:33.860Because the idea of what a decent way of life means and is has also been completely screwed up.
00:45:40.480And they're like Mike Rowe's whole thing, right?
00:45:49.880So I don't even know where to begin with it, right, in some ways.
00:45:53.520But we have to take these small steps to delegitimize their system and then small steps to take on different facets of this and find things that actually work to just propel people forward into real jobs.
00:46:08.040And then third, I guess, is the last thing I said, which is really important, which is what you do a lot of and we all try to do, which is just delegitimize their prestige, right, and just mock their credentialing system.
00:46:18.820It's like you're so lame, you have to use this old system in a country of 350 million people with the same like elite schools that existed 300 years ago, you know, here.
00:47:02.080And if you do build parallel, how do you keep the existing institutions from basically just coming around and snuffing you out once you have some level of success?
00:47:39.200On the other hand, of course, I have a modified pincer movement.
00:47:42.340I do think there are, of course, there are institutions and places that you can reform or take shots at.
00:47:48.940I would just say, like, there's a lot of it to me that's complete trash at this point and no one should be wasting their time other than maybe like, you know, it's like a behind enemy lines kind of recon.
00:48:01.980And maybe you're doing some good there by taking a few kids out of the Ivy League schools a year or whatever.
00:48:07.700That's fine, you know, but way less emphasis should be placed on that.
00:48:11.900Now, the institutions where you can perform or enter and do some damage do exist.
00:48:18.300And probably the best example of that is the state system if you're in a red state, right?
00:48:23.300I mean, there, I don't know if this is quite the long march.
00:48:26.640It will take a while if it's successful at all.
00:48:29.960But it would be open warfare as DeSantis is doing, you know, in Florida.
00:48:55.320So, you know, I don't know if that's what most people have in mind.
00:48:58.240They used to have in mind, like, we'll slowly reform and convince people from within.
00:49:02.720But if you mean, like, slowly take over in a place where you do have the upper hand, like a red state where there's a strong governor, absolutely.
00:50:07.300So, to me, it's about realistically what can you reform and what is so far gone that it's just the enemy that needs to be destroyed.
00:50:13.960Yeah, I think that's a really good point.
00:50:17.160And this is why my argument continues to be for DeSantis in Florida, staying in Florida, is the essential work that can get done there, right?
00:50:26.520Like, I am very skeptical of the ability of entryism in the federal bureaucracy.
00:50:33.520Like, completely controlling and reforming those, at least at this point, seems almost impossible.
00:50:38.720But there is a real option of doing what DeSantis is doing in Florida, putting guys like Rufo on college boards and that kind of thing.
00:50:46.980That is something that he really can control.
00:50:49.800And you can start to get conservatives comfortable with the idea of we fire enemies and we hire friends.
00:51:24.860But that's a different dynamic, very different dynamic than you have at the state level.
00:51:30.800And look, I think there's a ton that can be done if you have leaders that are willing to say what's required.
00:51:41.420And when you say, like, hiring and firing friends and enemies, everyone thinks today, like, this is some, like, radical, rebellious, you know, thing.
00:51:55.700Like, you're talking about people who disagree about such fundamental things that you can't really have a society with them long term.
00:52:05.180You know, you're disagreeing about such radically fundamental things about what a human being is, what a family is, what a man is, what, you know, sexual relationships are, what a citizen is, what a nation is.
00:52:18.780You disagree about all that, like, you disagree basically about more fundamental things than a lot of religious wars have been fought over.
00:52:40.220You think that in a country of this many people, hundreds of millions of people, you can't find equal talent at when you have all these other universities, you know, some of them which are fairly selective, like the top 5%, you know, just maybe the top, if it's just an IQ test, okay, the top percent may be a little smaller.
00:52:59.900But even that is way overrated here when you look at the actual talent on offer.
00:53:04.140So, anyway, the friends and enemies things, it takes you a long way.
00:53:10.280You go back to, like, old school businesses in America for the last 100 years, there's a lot of friends and enemies that will take you a long way.
00:53:24.280Something about that would be right, would be far more right than the wrong thing you're doing now, which is going to destroy you, your business, and America.
00:53:31.680And the more that we can figure out, like you and I and others, how to explain that to people and show it to people in action, the better.
00:53:40.560Again, I think DeSantis' move on that board is a step in the right direction because he's not messing around.
00:53:45.180It's like, nope, you can tell the kind of people I want, I want to build a Hillsdale-type school here.
00:53:50.120And if you don't like it, you know, and that's what you need to do in business.
00:53:54.560The first thing you should do, like Musk, I mean, he played kind of nice with them for a while.
00:53:59.180I don't think he's fully on our side, but over time, what has he done?
00:54:38.000One of the biggest problems that I think a lot of people are looking at when you're looking at this business stuff is, yeah, you can do all this stuff, right?
00:54:45.280Like we can hire for the right people, and we can build these networks, and we can select for competence and for ideological alignment or just shared values, whatever.
00:54:57.000We can hire the canceled people and give them shelter.
00:54:59.380What happens when the banks cut you off?
00:55:01.640What happens when your business is trying to scale to a point where you compete with other people who have infinite funding from all of the global American empire stuff, and you can't compete because you can't get a loan?
00:55:15.520Like how do people deal with the fact that it seems like the entire financial system is moving in a way to try to align itself to be able to cancel businesses, even guys like Musk, who might stand up and make a difference in this way?
00:55:33.700Yeah, no, I think that is one of the central questions I ask myself on a daily basis.
00:55:37.540It's one of the central questions that guides what I'm doing now, why I kind of threw everything to the wind in order to come and do what I'm doing now, and the simple answer in my mind is if we don't build that, it's done, and we still have some time.
00:56:26.780Not the fake Silicon Valley, like, oh, we're going to disrupt this company.
00:56:29.660I want to disrupt that civic order, right, that commercial order that is now wielding outsized control throughout the world.
00:56:38.860And what I would say is I think there's a window of time in order to build the elements and to separate people out who want to separate out to build those financial structures.
00:56:49.320So, you know, we – and to me, it's a race.
00:56:53.540So, number one, like a good example that everyone does know about publicly is the states, right, the red states saying we're not going to go with BlackRock anymore.
00:57:04.660We're not going to use these big investment vehicles.
00:57:08.520It frees up billions of dollars potentially, say, to 25 red states that could go now to large financial structures that are non-woke or they're on our side.
00:57:19.160And they start, you know, cycling the money around.
00:57:21.700Like, I will say this as a – I don't know if a white pill, but it's something that is somewhat positive.
00:57:28.600These people – like, there's a lot of people who do realize this is a problem who are in finance.
00:57:33.160Like, finance is the most black-filled area of the elite sectors that I interact with, you know, and I've seen this for the last five years.
00:57:41.460It's much more likely that someone in finance, as opposed to media, even if they're a pontificator or politics, God forbid, you know, they're all cucks anyway, or these other – like, tech, to understand how bad things are.
00:57:57.400But the people who are on our side in finance are like, oh, yeah, dude, this ship has sailed.
00:58:03.820If not, what can we do, like, before the end?
00:58:16.100You see a lot of people behind the scenes trying to create the kind of investment banks.
00:58:20.660But the fundamental thing is it's not just about the banking, like everyone thinks, you know, which is the way they ultimately cut you off on the front end.
00:58:32.160You need investors as a group to be channeling money out from underwoke capital into businesses that are actually making money, right?
00:58:41.740Not American flag grifts or whatever, like, you need real businesses that make things in America, right, that are aligned with investors who are aligned, and you need to get that money out from underwoke capital.
00:58:53.340And that is something that, in our offices, we're working on every day, both in microcosm and, like, big picture, what do we do?
00:59:00.720And I don't have this, you know, there's no magic wand here solution, but I guess I'd just say I think you're absolutely right that that is a fundamental reality, and if we don't resolve that reality as soon as we can, I don't see a lot of, you know, it's time to go to Montana.
00:59:20.000All right, so we'll go ahead and leave it there for now.
00:59:23.940A lot more maybe to discuss on another episode, but we're hitting up to that hour.
00:59:28.240We have a few questions from the audience, so I'm going to go ahead and run those through real quick.
00:59:34.700I've got three super chats that came from Brad Denton, but he put them on before the stream started, so I can't throw them up there, but I'm just going to go ahead and read them out.
00:59:44.380Brad, thank you so much for your super chats.
01:00:14.260As a pastor, I preach on the need for Christians to not buy from people who hate us, which I think Matthew Peterson would definitely agree with,
01:00:22.000and to get involved in building new works to the glory of God.
01:00:24.660How can pastors and churches support your work?
01:00:27.560How can I talk to other pastors about your projects?
01:00:30.340It will take us a long time to build a worthy future for our children.
01:00:39.380So, Matthew, maybe you have a few thoughts on this.
01:00:43.060I know a lot of people of faith want to get involved, and one of the things that I think people of faith are hesitant about is the ghettoization of their efforts, right?
01:00:56.660They make these efforts to try to fund projects, to try to make something meaningful that impacts the culture, to grow people.
01:01:05.020And then they end up getting kind of chintzy or cheesy projects that only deliver kind of substandard stuff to the choir.
01:01:12.840How can they spend their time well in a way that's going to kind of grow their communities and also raise up maybe young leaders who may be able to then enter the kind of institutions you're talking about?
01:01:26.800Yeah, by the way, I've seen this stuff about Montana.
01:01:30.580I certainly didn't mean anything bad about Montana.
01:01:48.380First off, we need to acknowledge that in the past, a lot of this stuff was chintzy and just didn't work.
01:01:56.800When it comes to religious communities and the pastors, and I feel like just the building of real community that helps people in the local level, the parish level, the church level, is kind of like the microcosm of what we're talking about here.
01:02:13.820And really, it's the tip of the spear for it, which is making sure that those parishioners, those people that you serve, that they're able to help each other in this way when it comes to jobs, when it comes to what their kids should do, et cetera.
01:02:29.200Because if you build that there, this almost sounds platitudinous, but it's really not, then all of a sudden, all these other things fall into place for the larger network of people and everything else.
01:02:42.840So, in other words, you want to build these communities where people are starting to think much more practically about how they help each other as believers or having these shared values or however you want to describe it practically, which might mean building a school, right?
01:03:00.160Which might mean making sure the church as a whole is trying to shape a school that allows for education.
01:03:05.920It may mean making sure that people feel comfortable talking about their job situation within the church, right?
01:03:14.200There's someone they can talk to that's basically like their new founding type person who's going to sit there and say, what's going on?
01:03:20.800Like, oh, this company is woke, blah, blah, blah.
01:03:26.660And I think that increasingly, people do get it.
01:03:31.480They're just not used to at the local level, which is insane, by the way, right?
01:03:35.620I mean, we've all been taught, like, everyone's been taught, like, oh, there's a 1-800 commercial for this charity that will help the doggies, and the doggies are dying, and we need to help them.
01:03:47.480And they feel like they did something good if they send a check into some charity they know nothing about nationally.
01:03:53.620And the idea of, like, actually having a way to contribute to something that's meaningful locally, like, oh, I don't know about that.
01:04:23.980Like, sorry, but it's time to roll up the sleeves.
01:04:26.820And if you're not in a position to change it, that's okay.
01:04:31.100But you need to talk to the people in your area that are and make that happen.
01:04:35.500And by the way, for Brad, it's like, who in your church community and your extended church community around you, what businesses are there that are aligned already?
01:04:45.640I mean, I want to know about them now.
01:04:48.040Like, I go back to the, you know, the Catholic, they always have the same, like, printed, you know, everywhere is the same with the local ads in the back, right?
01:04:57.260And now I'm like, are these people actually aligned?
01:04:59.660If I knew that they were, I'm going there, you know, and I want them to tell me that.
01:05:04.620Yeah, yeah, and I want to make it clear, guys, and, you know, there's a delicate balance with your church, because your church and politics will intersect because your religious faith should inform your political practice.
01:05:20.200But make sure you're not having your political practice dictate the honoring of your faith, right?
01:05:27.260Like, it should flow from what God wants and the good of your community to then the manifestation of in your politics, not the other way around.
01:05:38.120And so even though you might have to discuss some level of politics because of just the nefarious nature of what's happening in the world today, remember to keep God and the community centered in your church.
01:05:52.840And I think that if you have a church that cares about people and is taking care of people and is finding jobs for members and supporting people and taking care of those who are maybe lost their job because they got canceled, that kind of thing.
01:06:06.120If your church is supporting people, then you will naturally be supporting people who also agree with you when it comes to, you know, this kind of stuff.
01:06:15.180But don't make that the prerequisite alone.
01:06:17.320Make sure that you're serving God in the community first.
01:06:19.700And I think that will naturally bring you to then supporting things that will manifest themselves positively in kind of the political arena.
01:06:26.460The way I put it really quick is exactly right, is that serve God first, and then from that should arise a way of life that's very practical.
01:06:36.120Like, you don't have to call it political.
01:06:38.040It's not, I mean, it is political in like a really broad sense, but of like Aristotle's notion, but in the way most people use political, it's not political.
01:06:46.340This is about how you live your life practically because of your service to God, so in the church.
01:07:07.420Few negative connotations for that term.
01:07:09.900I mean, yeah, the problem with conservative, and, you know, I tell this to conservatives all the time, is that, you know, we are no longer the movement that is trying to protect what exists now, right?
01:07:26.900It's hostile to a good way of life, and so the term conservative, you know, just kind of has to go as attached.
01:07:34.560I use it because people understand it colloquially, but it's not a useful organizing tool.
01:07:39.720The same is true, I think, of actually the dissonant right.
01:07:41.900While it's useful as a kind of a loose collection to identify something very quickly, it's not a very good name.
01:07:47.300It's not a very good organizing principle, you know, builder, you know, might have to work on that, but it has the right connotation, right?
01:07:53.580It has the right understanding of, you know, that foundation that you are creating to move forward.
01:08:00.700You're no longer there to conserve the corrupt system that's falling apart.
01:08:04.320You're assembling something that's going to be useful for the future, and I think that's what everyone needs to understand is powerful, and that's why I wanted to talk to someone like Michael, because I think he does, you know, understand that in a very profound way.
01:08:15.500Yeah, I mean, I love this comment, Christian.
01:08:19.020I mean, I struggle with this, too, because I just don't want to use the word conservative.
01:08:23.440Like, I'll have editors insert it into what I'm writing.
01:08:38.080I like that because, you know, I don't know if it's the word, but because it's not destroy, which is what everyone thinks.
01:08:45.760And some of my friends even, and some maybe within myself, you just feel the desire to destroy what's out there, but that's not enough.
01:08:53.300And that's the whole point of new founding and kind of my project and everything we want to do to foster a new commercial cultural movement is you can't defeat, you know, a positive with a negative, right?
01:09:03.100And it's not, it can't be just destruction.
01:09:22.000And so, you know, some of these projects are still in their infancy.
01:09:25.580They're in different levels of completion.
01:09:27.140There's, you know, it's all being worked on.
01:09:29.360But, you know, if you don't see something that you need, you know, think about how you can create it in your own community and also how you can reach out to someone, you know, like Matthew and see, you know, if you're able to create that as well.
01:13:32.100And then if God bless you, you're a better person than I am and you're not on Twitter.
01:13:35.960You know, I would say, you know, I'll make it when I can just take my cell phone and give it to some assistant and say, I'm never touching this again.
01:13:46.460You know, that's when you'll know I'll consider myself to have one.