The Auron MacIntyre Show - April 17, 2025


How America Became an Open-Air Prison ｜ Guest： Kevin Dolan ｜ 4⧸16⧸25


Episode Stats

Length

55 minutes

Words per Minute

179.15962

Word Count

9,892

Sentence Count

529

Misogynist Sentences

11

Hate Speech Sentences

17


Summary

Kevin Dolan of the Exit Group joins me on the show to talk about his new report on why parents are having trouble having kids, and how we can fix it. He also talks about why it s a problem, and what we can do about it.


Transcript

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00:00:30.000 Hey everybody, how's it going?
00:00:31.480 Thanks for joining me this afternoon.
00:00:33.320 I've got a great stream with a great guest that I think you're really going to enjoy.
00:00:37.600 Yesterday, President Trump met with Bukele, the president of El Salvador.
00:00:42.500 And he had a very simple message.
00:00:44.780 One that I think is amazingly refreshing in the American context.
00:00:49.560 He was just talking about how you have this situation where so many people get angry at guys like Bukele or Trump for putting criminals in jail.
00:00:59.080 But jailing criminals is actually liberating for the population.
00:01:03.680 Without law and order, without the application of law, without knowing that the government is there, the state is there to step in on your behalf and stop those that deserve to be stopped.
00:01:13.740 You can't really be free in a meaningful sense.
00:01:17.560 And as we look at a court system and Democrats that are trying to bring back an illegal immigrant who's allegedly a member of MS-13, as we watch an alleged killer who, again, allegedly stabbed a young man in Texas,
00:01:32.500 collect a large amount of money, move into a new home, get a new car, get rewarded in many ways, it seems, for the actions it took.
00:01:39.820 It's really striking the level of just a lack of rule of law and a lack of real freedom that our citizens get to experience.
00:01:48.340 It's almost as if the things that we have to do to control the criminals that have been allowed to roam the United States have turned it in many ways into an open air prison.
00:01:56.900 Joining me today to talk about that is my buddy, Kevin Dolan.
00:02:00.480 He runs the Exit Group.
00:02:02.060 Kevin, thanks for coming on.
00:02:03.800 Great to be here, man.
00:02:04.700 Thanks.
00:02:05.700 Recently, you guys put on NatalCon and a big success.
00:02:09.340 Sounds like you made some waves yet again in the mainstream press.
00:02:12.800 You want to give a little bit of an after action of a report for people who are unfamiliar with what went on?
00:02:19.180 Yeah.
00:02:19.540 So we had about twice as many people as last year.
00:02:22.140 Last year, we had a lot of mainstream academics talk about, you know, the contours of the issue in a way that, you know, last year we were focused on, hey, this is a problem.
00:02:35.700 Like, everybody, like, pay attention to this.
00:02:37.380 Pay attention to the consequences of this that are very easy to quantify.
00:02:41.020 And this year we were talking about, like, all right, what is actually causing this and what can we do about it, which is substantially trickier.
00:02:48.540 You know, if you sort of ask people naively, you know, why aren't you having kids, why didn't you have kids, the answers they give are not particularly, like, useful from a policy perspective.
00:02:58.740 So drilling down to, like, what is the fundamental reason that people are rejecting or unable to fulfill this, like, basic natural imperative is a deep question.
00:03:12.480 So we had a lot of really, really good perspectives on that.
00:03:16.380 And, yeah, we had media beating down our door, which was crazy.
00:03:22.560 And, you know, CNN covered it in a way that I thought was actually, like, fairly objective and sympathetic.
00:03:29.100 I was blown away.
00:03:30.060 I couldn't believe it.
00:03:32.620 NPR was less nice.
00:03:33.780 But, yeah, it was a really, really good time.
00:03:38.480 And I think it brought – I was sort of willing to hazard people being a little bit nasty about this thing that I was doing to get the word out.
00:03:48.560 And I think so far it seems like it's succeeding.
00:03:51.580 Well, I'm glad to see it succeed.
00:03:52.940 I'm glad to see it grow.
00:03:53.980 So I think there are a lot of new organizations, conferences, people on our side getting together to solve big issues in a way that was just not acceptable a few years ago.
00:04:04.900 And you guys are touching on an issue that is weirdly polarizing despite being something you would assume everyone would want to get on board with.
00:04:12.920 Hey, people want to have kids.
00:04:15.020 They're having trouble having kids.
00:04:16.860 We should probably figure out how we can let these people have families that should be pretty much the most politically neutral, pro-general American policy or conference one could have.
00:04:28.560 And so the fact that – and I think in some ways it does appeal across the aisle in this way.
00:04:33.020 But the fact that maybe you're getting some slightly more favorable coverage might mean that the needle could be moving a little bit on that.
00:04:39.400 I think that that's what's causing some people to be more favorable to it and it's what's causing some people to bristle at it because it is kind of an unanswerable critique of the whole architecture of Western liberalism.
00:04:55.700 It's basically saying, like, it doesn't matter that you've solved these other problems or feel like you've solved these other problems because you're failing to solve the fundamental problem, which is how do people raise families?
00:05:07.780 And how do you make sure that young people like each other and want to be around each other and want to build together and trust each other?
00:05:17.480 And in failing to do that, all the other stuff collapses anyway.
00:05:23.440 And so I think there are some people who are temperamentally and politically liberal who look at that and go, like, oh, maybe we should actually reexamine some things.
00:05:37.980 And there are some who basically say, like, you know, threat detected, like their HUD goes red and they panic because they see it as a threat to, like, everything that they think was achieved and every battle they think was won since, like, 1950.
00:05:59.220 So, yeah, it's been really interesting to watch the variety of the media response.
00:06:06.760 Well, it's, again, one of those scenarios where the true test of any civilization is its ability to replicate itself, right?
00:06:13.100 Like, dead societies have no principles.
00:06:15.640 And so you have this moment where people have to look at that.
00:06:18.760 And, you know, I've had this discussion with people who are, like, kind of pro-feminism and they'll say, oh, well, you know, we've resolved this issue and that issue.
00:06:26.220 And generations of women will not have this problem in these Western countries anymore.
00:06:31.160 It's like, first, which generations of women?
00:06:33.420 Because you're not making any more.
00:06:35.100 But second, because you're not making any more, actually, no, it's going to be the people who are reproducing.
00:06:40.140 It's the civilizations that are continuing who will decide.
00:06:43.060 So, yes, you've gotten rid of gender imbalance in the United States or in the UK.
00:06:48.180 Congratulations.
00:06:49.240 All of the Muslims moving in don't care.
00:06:51.740 And they will not care about your gender balance and they will not seek to solve that problem.
00:06:56.100 And so by solving the problem, you have almost guaranteed its continuation because the civilization that solved it will eradicate itself.
00:07:04.100 Absolutely.
00:07:04.880 Absolutely.
00:07:05.840 I was actually having a conversation with Mother Jones about this.
00:07:09.740 And they were asking me if I was the eugenicist because I talked about the fact that these systems that don't replicate themselves will be replaced.
00:07:18.960 And what I said to them was, like, and this is what I believe, I actually don't want to see the libs eradicated.
00:07:27.140 I think libs do really interesting creative work.
00:07:30.040 Like, I miss when libs, like, made movies and music and it was good.
00:07:33.880 And I'd like for them to, like, stop destroying society and, like, get back to that stuff.
00:07:40.760 And so, yeah, it's – if you care about anything, if you care about art or civilization or science or the survival of human species or going to other planets or going to Mars, like, that's what Elon cares about.
00:07:58.060 And, like, it's sort of a backdoor to caring about this because he's smart enough to think about it from first principles and go, like, oh, well, if we don't have the people who do this, then it's not going to happen.
00:08:09.500 And that's true of everything.
00:08:13.480 Well, like I said, I'm glad to see that in a way you're getting more positive coaches.
00:08:17.940 You guys are building momentum.
00:08:19.180 You're getting a lot more people at the conference.
00:08:20.760 And we'll be diving into our main show topic today right after we hear from today's sponsor.
00:08:26.600 Hey, everybody.
00:08:27.240 This episode of the Oren McIntyre Show is proudly sponsored by Consumers Research.
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00:09:29.260 All right, Kevin, I just wanted to play this really quickly so people have an understanding of the context here.
00:09:35.200 I apologize in advance.
00:09:36.680 Bukele, despite being the most dangerous dictator in the world, is very soft-spoken most of the time, but I think you can probably make it out.
00:09:43.420 We're very happy, and we're very eager to help.
00:09:47.640 We know that you have a crime problem, a terrorism problem that you need help with.
00:09:55.820 And we're a small country, but if we can help, we can do it.
00:09:58.760 And we actually turned the murder capital of the world, that was the Journalist College, right?
00:10:04.840 Murder capital of the world to the safest country in the Western Hemisphere.
00:10:07.460 And, you know, sometimes they say that we are increasing thousands.
00:10:14.040 I like to say that we actually deliberated millions.
00:10:17.480 So, you know, like, it's very good.
00:10:21.880 Who gave him that line?
00:10:23.260 Do you think I can use that?
00:10:24.340 It's very hard not to like Trump, right?
00:10:30.180 Like, that is the most human moment of, like, that's great branding.
00:10:35.300 I wish I'd come up with that branding.
00:10:37.220 Yeah.
00:10:37.700 Well, and Bukele, you mentioned being soft-spoken.
00:10:42.100 He's like, I understand you have a crime problem.
00:10:45.020 Perfect quote.
00:10:46.300 Perfect.
00:10:47.320 Perfect.
00:10:47.680 Yeah, so I'm listening to this, and, you know, I'm just thinking to myself, what an amazing moment that we've come to, where we need a lesson on basic things like, if you don't stop crime, you're actually victimizing the rest of the population.
00:11:06.700 By imprisoning people who deserve to be in prison, you are liberating the rest of the population from the effects of rampant crime.
00:11:15.180 And that should be a pretty obvious thing, but as we watch the Democrats battle to bring back alleged gangbangers, as we watch alleged murderers get rewarded by GoFundMe, and, you know, they get to buy new houses and new cars and these kind of things, it seems kind of wild that we live in this moment.
00:11:35.660 Even after Donald Trump's election, ultimately, we're still looking at a reality where law and order still seems to be very hard for many people to obtain across the United States.
00:11:46.720 Absolutely.
00:11:47.440 I mean, Trump, you know, I'm glad he's there, but he actually doesn't determine, you know, Carmelo Anthony's bail.
00:11:57.180 And he doesn't determine, like, there's some, there's this deep layers of bureaucracy that have been established over decades, and personnel is policy.
00:12:07.980 The guy who was standing next to Carmelo Anthony, talking about, you know, he's home in their $900,000 house they just got with the funds.
00:12:17.760 And that guy, I found out, had shaken a baby so that its brain and eyeballs bled, and he did eight days in jail because of a, I believe it was a Denton County judge, which that's actually coincidentally the county I was born in.
00:12:35.500 And so it's remarkable to see what justice looks like there now.
00:12:43.060 And, and yeah, it's, it's, if you don't know, if you don't know that you'll be safe walking down the street, and, and, you know, obviously, like, I think people like you and I would prefer that the state was not wholly responsible for our personal security.
00:13:00.560 But, given that, given the consequences for exercising your right to self-defense in a lot of these jurisdictions, it's like, you know, not, not only is the state not going to protect you, they're also not going to let you protect yourself, which, you know, your audience would be very familiar with, with the concept of anarcho-tyranny.
00:13:18.520 The idea that the people who are easiest to control and easiest to coerce are the law-abiding, and so they get it, they get the coercion.
00:13:31.300 And, and, and yeah, you, you, you, you look around at like a CVS or a, or a, a target in the Bay Area, and like everything's under like plastic and bulletproof glass and all this stuff.
00:13:44.480 And it's like, it's like walking into a prison commissary, because they've had to make the entire world around them robust to the continual presence of, of criminals who won't be punished.
00:13:57.300 Yeah, and, and that really is something that I think is just weighing on everybody.
00:14:03.020 More and more, you know, we talk about the loss of a high-trust society, and a large amount of it is we have introduced multiculturalism.
00:14:10.600 We no longer have a shared understanding of traditions or folkways or customs, religion, the things that would inform our data interactions and allow us to cooperate in a way that we can trust each other,
00:14:22.420 or we can participate in society without having a large degree of barriers between us and the consequences of what other people do.
00:14:29.160 But another big aspect of that is the criminal element, as you're pointing out.
00:14:33.160 Democrats in general, the left, but even some on the right, have really resigned themselves to the idea that the population is just going to do what it's going to do, right?
00:14:43.260 That, well, maybe we've shifted things demographically, maybe we've broken down social fabric, maybe we've made it so it's almost impossible to incarcerate anyone for any lengthy amount of time on serious issues,
00:14:54.560 even though we pretend like we have an over-incarceration problem.
00:14:57.700 You know, we, we, we talk about this stuff as if it's just unsolvable.
00:15:01.620 There's just, there's no way we've lost the technology to have a society in which you don't have to put everything behind glass.
00:15:09.120 You don't have to lock down or zip tie or padlock every freezer at a convenience store.
00:15:15.240 You know, pretty, pretty simple things.
00:15:17.520 I spent my entire life, you know, there, when I was a kid, you know, what area was really, really bad if they had to put the, uh, the soda machine in the cage, right?
00:15:26.980 Like if you have to put it in soda jail, like that's how you knew that, that, that things were bad and you were in a bad part of the neighborhood.
00:15:32.480 Now everything is soda jail.
00:15:33.980 Now everything in, you know, you can't walk into, you know, even chains that were specifically designed like target to kind of be upscale, to be above a certain element, to create a scenario in which you're going to drive the prices and the venues are going to drive out.
00:15:50.460 Uh, some of the people who are going to create crime, create a lack of safety and create intimidation that are going to keep shoppers from interacting.
00:15:57.460 You now find them dealing with this issue, them having to lock all of their products behind things.
00:16:02.580 It's harder and harder for the average person to find a neighborhood where they don't have to worry about soda jail.
00:16:07.860 Yeah, absolutely.
00:16:09.080 And I think, I mean, you have to understand that I think, I think the impression that a lot of people get is that this is like, uh, and I think you've had this conversation with like putting the woke away, but like, I think a lot of people get the impression.
00:16:24.080 This is like an ideological fever and that it's just the result of a lot of people having, uh, having some bad ideas and those ideas are a fad.
00:16:34.800 And, and, and, and eventually they'll realize how broken it is.
00:16:37.320 It'll pass, but actually the mechanisms that generate these incentives that incentivize people to, to, to, to release criminals and incentivize people to, to, to lock things up rather than securing space.
00:16:53.120 But these are matters of federal law.
00:16:54.960 I mean, like these are, these are things that, uh, essentially the, the constitution was overridden and replaced in 1964.
00:17:03.140 Uh, by this, by this massively egalitarian, uh, uh, system of, of, of rule, uh, whereby, uh, anything that might reveal distinction, anything that might land differently on one group than on another group is unacceptable.
00:17:24.440 And of course, uh, every law and every standard you can apply, uh, uh, lands differently on different groups.
00:17:31.120 And so you basically can't have standards at all.
00:17:33.540 And, uh, and that's, that's the world we're living in.
00:17:36.540 And I think it is appropriate to, uh, it is appropriate to, to, to make noise and get mad at the politicians about this.
00:17:46.980 Um, but I think we, as individuals, as families, as communities, uh, need to start building for this situation, building for, uh, things as they are.
00:18:04.240 And that's, I mean, that's, that's what I'm about at exit.
00:18:06.420 That's what I'm doing.
00:18:06.980 Yeah, I, I saw you just came out with a piece.
00:18:09.780 I didn't have time to read it all before we went, uh, live, but talking about how the Brazilian vacation of America is, is, uh, is, uh, enshrined in the law that it's unavoidable due to the way that our law is structured.
00:18:22.320 And, um, you know, that's, that's something, if you've listened to this show, you might have had hints of that.
00:18:27.500 You may have grasped kind of that, that is part of the barrier that we're facing, but I think it's really critical for people to understand that even when someone like Donald Trump is in office, right.
00:18:37.600 Which is still a positive, like, I am glad that Donald Trump is in office.
00:18:41.100 This is a much better outcome.
00:18:42.860 We have a possibility to win victories in areas that I did not think we would be able to win them before.
00:18:47.700 But ultimately the gradient of our system, the trajectory remains the same.
00:18:53.620 And when I look at guys like Chris Ruffo, who I like and whose work I admire, but he continues to say things like, we're going to use the civil rights law to fix this problem, right?
00:19:03.680 Like we're just going to civil rights harder.
00:19:05.860 Like this time we're really going to actually apply the civil rights law and we're not going to have this carve out, uh, you know, for white people where they don't get protected, that kind of thing.
00:19:14.500 And it's just hard to see because even when I had a discussion with Chris on the show about this topic, it was difficult.
00:19:21.560 You know, he's like, well, you know, if there's differences between communities, then they, you know, one will just have to do better.
00:19:26.460 Right.
00:19:26.780 Like, and it was like, dude, that is, um, that's, that's some powerful 1990s talk radio conservatism there, but that is not civil rights law.
00:19:34.160 Right.
00:19:34.480 That, that is just not how civil rights law works.
00:19:36.880 And, and also Chris, I need you to put, like, I need you to sit in a room with a representative of these minority communities that you are talking about.
00:19:45.980 I need you to look them in the eye and tell them you're failing, do better.
00:19:50.720 I gotta see that.
00:19:52.280 Like, like, cause that's the political, that's the political situation that you're telling me is going to occur.
00:19:58.140 Is that you're going to like, look like the representative, you know, the collective representative of these communities in the eye and be like, don't suck.
00:20:04.980 And then go back to like running a meritocratic society.
00:20:08.260 And they just won't notice if all the people of color disappear from Harvard and the New York times and all these institutions where they've been installed by the civil rights act.
00:20:17.400 And I'm just not buying that outcome, man.
00:20:19.740 I want it.
00:20:20.340 I want it, but I'm not buying it.
00:20:22.340 Yeah.
00:20:22.840 I'm the type of radical, uh, insane, immoral monster who thinks that most people are.
00:20:28.140 They're just crying their best and, uh, and that's not going to fly.
00:20:31.840 Um, I think, I think you, but, but I think you can characterize the sort of right approach to this situation and the wrong approach to the situation in terms of like good Rufo and evil Rufo.
00:20:42.740 So, uh, uh, uh, yeah, evil Rufo is like, let's, let's civil rights harder and let's, um, let's tell, let's tell the public school teachers who are overwhelmingly, uh, left wing by political affiliation.
00:20:55.840 Let's tell them they're not allowed to do critical race theory.
00:20:58.720 Let's tell them they're not allowed to say gay, uh, uh, during classroom instruction.
00:21:02.940 And, and one of the things you notice is they'll be like, well, this placard is not a flag.
00:21:07.160 And so I can have an LGBT placard if it's not a flag.
00:21:10.960 Like these are postmodernists, like getting around, like the rules is what they dislike the water they swim in.
00:21:18.120 They know exactly how to do that all day long.
00:21:19.860 And, uh, but, but, but, uh, so that's evil Rufo, right?
00:21:24.700 Good Rufo is let's just give all these MAGA homeschool moms money to send their kids where
00:21:33.040 they want to send them.
00:21:34.260 Yeah.
00:21:34.560 Like, let's just smash that power base, make it irrelevant.
00:21:38.400 Let people choose.
00:21:40.100 Um, that's good Rufo.
00:21:41.580 And that's very good Rufo.
00:21:42.880 We love Rufo for that.
00:21:44.320 Yes.
00:21:44.560 And, and so like that, I think, and that, that's, you could almost analogize that to
00:21:50.080 like every part of the system.
00:21:52.080 It is not about like making fortune 500 companies treat, you know, us fairly.
00:21:59.940 They're not going to like, you're not going to out boycott out coerce companies that are
00:22:07.160 subject to like the most elaborate apparatus of coercion ever devised by man.
00:22:11.840 Like, you're not going to beat that.
00:22:13.720 What you can do is you can build a life that is outside that you can build a life that is
00:22:18.220 not subject to, to like where they don't get to decide whether or not you eat.
00:22:22.680 Right.
00:22:23.260 And that's, uh, that I think is the right approach.
00:22:25.660 And so like, in terms of policy, like why is Trump good?
00:22:28.640 Why is Rufo good?
00:22:29.860 Why, why is having all this, this political, uh, machinery good?
00:22:34.640 How could you deploy it?
00:22:35.620 Um, I think you deploy it toward, uh, the, the dismantling of these people's ability to
00:22:42.300 decide, uh, and, and you, you take the resources that they've captured and you return them to
00:22:49.420 the people.
00:22:50.020 And so school choice is a good example of that.
00:22:52.520 Um, I think re-industrialization is a good example of that.
00:22:55.760 Let, you know, uh, making it possible for smart guys.
00:22:59.640 Uh, this is a project that I'm working on now with, with the exit guys, uh, buying up
00:23:05.000 these businesses that, uh, that, you know, the boomers are retiring from and they're getting
00:23:08.960 out of and, uh, you know, that need, that need automation, that need process improvements,
00:23:14.580 that need to be scaled better, like getting into those games, uh, and, and getting sovereignty
00:23:20.400 that way, uh, uh, owning the means of production, so to speak, uh, that's how you secure sovereignty.
00:23:26.960 It's not by, you know, demanding that the system treat you better.
00:23:31.460 It's about getting your own thing, getting your own piece.
00:23:34.140 Yeah.
00:23:34.640 And that's a, you know, that's something Curtis Yarvin talks a lot about, really.
00:23:37.400 There's, there's, that's very subject behavior.
00:23:39.960 You know, I need you to respect me.
00:23:42.320 I need you to give me a chance, please.
00:23:44.820 Oh, sovereign.
00:23:45.680 Oh, sovereign.
00:23:46.460 Won't you let me have my moment?
00:23:48.780 Yeah.
00:23:49.000 That, that is, that is behavior of people who are going to be ruled, you know, you're petitioning,
00:23:53.600 uh, a sovereign power that, you know, is aimed against you in kind of the, the civil rights
00:23:59.520 architecture.
00:24:00.620 And it, it, it's again, so hard for people to grasp this, even to this point.
00:24:05.100 I hope, like I said, I would love for Chris Rufo to like make the CRA work correctly.
00:24:11.240 Right.
00:24:11.940 But my, my impulse is that having an institutions whose job it is to be the thoughtful, the thought
00:24:18.960 police in every interpersonal and professional and public interaction across the United States
00:24:25.340 24 seven, uh, that's always going to work against me, even if it changes up its mission
00:24:30.860 statement slightly.
00:24:31.900 Like, I think the existence of that apparatus is the actual problem, not just the fact that
00:24:37.080 it's currently being, uh, misused in this moment.
00:24:40.740 Right.
00:24:41.420 Right.
00:24:41.680 I mean, the purpose of the purpose of the apparatus is to eradicate distinction and it,
00:24:47.700 it, it eats by finding new distinctions that it can interpose itself in and try to equalize.
00:24:53.300 Like that's how it, that's how it grows.
00:24:55.620 It wants to grow.
00:24:57.300 Um, you know, obviously I'm being a little bit metaphorical there, but, but it, it, uh,
00:25:01.680 the incentives are for these systems to, to expand and to, and to consume.
00:25:07.300 And so, uh, yeah, the idea that you're going to make that more totalizing and more all consuming
00:25:14.860 and that it will thereby become more just, I think is, is, is, is, is insane.
00:25:20.080 Um, and that is, I mean, that is essentially what, uh, what liberals argue for is they say
00:25:25.540 like, well, you know, the reason that these, these distinctions haven't actually been equalized
00:25:29.760 yet, despite, you know, 60 years of trying is that the, uh, the rot is just so deep and
00:25:36.300 so insidious.
00:25:37.200 And you don't even know that you're, uh, hateful, but you are deep inside.
00:25:42.940 And so we need to root down deeper and deeper inside of you to find the little, the, the
00:25:47.660 Hitler particles and, and, and get them out of you.
00:25:50.400 And it's like, that's just not, that's just not what's driving this.
00:25:53.820 And, and, and the fact that that assumption is wrong is actually like an infinite power source
00:26:01.820 because the problem never gets solved.
00:26:04.080 And so you can always justify deeper and deeper and deeper interventions until there's just
00:26:08.920 not one stone left on top of another.
00:26:10.780 And that's, I mean, that's, that's sort of where we're headed.
00:26:13.380 Yeah.
00:26:13.440 This is the biolinism argument, right?
00:26:15.340 There's, there's an infinite amount of political energy in natural differences because you can't
00:26:20.080 overcome them.
00:26:20.660 Natural hierarchies aren't going anywhere, no matter how radical you get.
00:26:24.420 And so there will always be this differentiation, which means there will always be some kind of
00:26:29.060 political animus towards those that are benefiting from the natural hierarchy.
00:26:32.820 And therefore there's always a explanation as to why you need to conquer more and more
00:26:37.440 territory.
00:26:38.060 And this inability to grasp that the populations that you import, the populations that you favor
00:26:44.500 matter, it doesn't even just happen in the United States.
00:26:48.240 Obviously, you know, the UK is constantly in a more desperate situation somehow, even than
00:26:53.020 the United States, God bless them.
00:26:54.560 Um, and, and, and right now their most recent thing was that they, uh, they barely, they
00:27:00.140 barely stopped an explicit, uh, ruling that would force courts to, uh, give harsher sentences
00:27:07.500 to white men specifically, uh, which was an amazing moment.
00:27:11.200 Like even they were like, Ooh, that that's kind of a bad look.
00:27:13.720 Maybe like, we can't go that South Africa yet.
00:27:16.520 Right.
00:27:17.040 But these are people who have banned, um, you know, the, the joke in the United States has
00:27:21.760 always been, Oh, you guys don't have guns.
00:27:24.100 What are you going to ban next knives?
00:27:25.360 And the answer was yes.
00:27:26.660 Like literally, you know, it's, we have to ban ninja swords because the ninjas are everywhere.
00:27:30.620 You gotta, you know, ninjas could be anywhere.
00:27:32.920 And so you, you, you've got to get rid of this and it just becomes absurd because you
00:27:37.280 recognize that as, as absurd as that example is, it really is just a microcosm of everything
00:27:43.600 about kind of the open air prison mentality.
00:27:46.380 We are not going to stop bringing in people we know do violence.
00:27:50.880 We're not going to stop, uh, you know, stripping away the police efforts and, uh, the, you know,
00:27:56.040 the sentencing and things that would actually disincentivize these people.
00:27:59.640 We're not going to deport any of the people who aren't supposed to be here or who we know
00:28:03.580 are violent, but we are going to take away ninja swords.
00:28:07.180 And that way, you know, everybody doesn't have access to these, uh, weapons and we'll all
00:28:12.360 be safer.
00:28:12.840 It's just delusional, but it continues to be the solution, no matter how absurd it gets.
00:28:18.860 Yeah.
00:28:19.040 And I think, I think what's, what has happened is that the state's effort to expand.
00:28:26.400 Get unlimited grocery delivery with PC express pass meal prep delivered snacks delivered fresh
00:28:33.860 fruit delivered grocery delivery on repeat for just $2 and 50 cents a month.
00:28:38.920 Learn more at PC express.ca has sort of outstripped the external threat.
00:28:44.780 Like there's not a clear external threat to like the UK that they can, uh, uh, sort of,
00:28:50.840 uh, justify themselves around.
00:28:52.960 And so the threat has to be internal.
00:28:55.220 It's keeping you safe from each other.
00:28:56.560 And, and, and the, the way that, the way that, uh, liberalism works is basically liberalism's
00:29:04.060 job as an ideology is to shave off all the particularities that make people fight, uh, so
00:29:11.940 that they can collaborate on bigger and bigger, you know, uh, larger and larger scale, uh, production
00:29:18.720 basically.
00:29:19.420 Uh, because that was sort of the, the, the, the technological, uh, incentive was to build
00:29:24.700 these massive hyper-scaled, uh, states.
00:29:27.900 And so, uh, you needed as many people as possible getting along as much as you possibly could
00:29:32.160 have.
00:29:32.380 And so, you know, you got to shave off religion and you got to shave off languages barrier.
00:29:35.940 You got to shave off, uh, eventually like we're getting to the point where it's like,
00:29:39.960 well, we have to shave off men and women and we have to shave off, you know, you, you,
00:29:43.920 your kids actually shouldn't matter to you more than anybody else's kids.
00:29:46.740 And it's this complete, uh, uh, eradication of, of all, uh, distinction and all identity,
00:29:53.260 which then, I mean, this is like a lot of the doomers, a lot of like the Black Hill guys
00:29:58.860 will be like, you know, it's just going to be endless, you know, fake and gay forever
00:30:03.040 and ever because that entropy gradient, uh, never stops.
00:30:07.740 But where I think it stops is that people, the reasons that people raise families, the reasons
00:30:16.200 that people fight wars and the reasons that people, uh, invest for the future are all based
00:30:22.720 on those particularities.
00:30:24.860 Like those are the things that give meaning to those sacrifices.
00:30:27.960 That's why people do them.
00:30:29.600 And so they have succeeded in making people harmless to one another, but in so doing, they've
00:30:36.600 taken out, they've taken out basically the reason to live.
00:30:39.020 And so, you know, basically either people are rejecting that, uh, that structure, they're
00:30:46.020 rejecting the eradication of their particularities, which is what I hope people will do, or they're
00:30:53.120 embracing it and going extinct.
00:30:54.860 And that's, that's sort of the, the, the reckoning that all of Western liberalism is coming to.
00:30:59.500 What do you think about the democratic plan here, trying to fight the deportations of illegal
00:31:08.540 gang members?
00:31:09.500 I mean, you, you've got, uh, was it Kilmar Garcia is this guy's name?
00:31:13.940 You know, he keeps getting, uh, described as a Maryland man.
00:31:17.060 A Maryland man has been.
00:31:18.720 A Marylander.
00:31:19.360 Yeah.
00:31:19.780 What does that mean?
00:31:21.240 Comes out, you know, many generations of, of Garcia's buried in, in, uh, the hills of Maryland.
00:31:26.940 Many, uh, you know, the long, long, uh, you know, uh, history, their ties to the land.
00:31:32.660 It's very strange.
00:31:33.960 It's this guy who very obviously is, they could, it feels like they couldn't have picked
00:31:38.520 a worse target.
00:31:39.360 This guy is a resident of El Salvador.
00:31:41.860 So their arguments against deporting people to El Salvador don't work with him because he's
00:31:46.660 actually from El Salvador, whether or not he is a gangbanger, allegedly the judge seems
00:31:53.260 to think so because part of the reason he couldn't get deported was that other gangs
00:31:57.240 would threaten his life.
00:31:58.320 So that's a, that's a, that's a little bit of a hint there that perhaps he might be involved
00:32:02.660 in some, uh, some activity that would put him, uh, in a gang affiliation on top of this.
00:32:08.180 It just came out.
00:32:09.420 Apparently Andy knows reporting that his wife, uh, filed, uh, domestic violence charges against
00:32:14.660 this guy.
00:32:15.180 So, you know, all around keeper, I just got to say, you know, Kyle Rittenhouse shoots into
00:32:19.540 a crowd of Democrats, hits a couple of pedophiles and a, and a wife abuser, you know, that your
00:32:23.640 chances are pretty high, right?
00:32:25.040 Like, so it's just amazing that Democrats have built their, their strategy around this.
00:32:29.420 On one hand, I think there is some traction for Democrats on the idea that rule of law
00:32:34.260 is in danger.
00:32:35.000 And you, like, I think they can probably spin that narrative up.
00:32:37.340 On the other hand, the examples they're picking are so horrific that I'm only seeing people
00:32:43.180 mainly in, in support of Donald Trump.
00:32:45.640 I mean, you, you always have the, uh, who is it?
00:32:48.180 It's not Scott Alexander.
00:32:49.480 Who was it that did the, the two, uh, two movies on the same screen, uh, example, uh,
00:32:54.920 the Dilbert guy.
00:32:55.600 I can't remember his name.
00:32:56.920 Thank you.
00:32:57.600 Scott Adams.
00:32:58.140 Yeah.
00:32:58.280 That, that, that is probably his greatest contribution to, to the political conversation.
00:33:02.540 You know, you do have that, uh, going on where you have Democrats and Republicans, both
00:33:06.880 looking at this event and he's an innocent Maryland man, a father who loves his country, whichever
00:33:13.080 country that might be, uh, you know, and then you have the Republicans obviously who are
00:33:18.020 against this, but I think overall, I think that the, the optics are bad for the Democrats
00:33:23.060 on this defense.
00:33:25.460 Yeah.
00:33:26.080 And I, I, I suspect that what's happening.
00:33:30.460 So number one, they've got him.
00:33:31.560 They've also got this, like, uh, this like gay hairdresser who I guess had tattoos and
00:33:37.220 they were like, you know, this guy, uh, a gay hairdresser couldn't possibly be gang affiliated
00:33:42.640 or associated with the drug trade, which, you know, that's a little bit silly, but like,
00:33:46.440 they do have more sympathetic targets.
00:33:49.820 And I almost think that this is probing.
00:33:54.280 It's like, how, uh, how much power do we still have over this system?
00:34:02.540 What can we, and I think both sides are doing that.
00:34:05.040 Like, I think, I think what, what is happening right now is, uh, the expectation of law and
00:34:10.160 order has collapsed on both sides.
00:34:12.980 And so everybody's trying to figure out what they can actually still do.
00:34:20.260 Like if they command who will obey.
00:34:24.160 And, uh, that's a really dangerous situation because it means people are probably keeping
00:34:28.840 lists and, um, and thinking through what they'll do when they're back in charge.
00:34:35.000 Um, but, uh, but yeah, I mean, I, I think, uh, it's sort of like, uh, um, point, point deer
00:34:42.800 make horse.
00:34:43.400 There's an element of, uh, you know, exercising control over people by, uh, requiring them to
00:34:51.320 assent to ridiculous, uh, propositions.
00:34:54.700 And yeah, this, this test of like, well, how did, what, what does the rule of law mean
00:34:59.560 to people now?
00:35:00.900 Uh, cause I don't think that's clear to anybody.
00:35:03.140 Certainly not clear to me.
00:35:05.400 Yeah.
00:35:05.820 I was actually talking about this funny enough on Dinesh D'Souza earlier today, saying that
00:35:10.080 exactly that, that I think the, the very concept of the rule of law has disintegrated, especially
00:35:15.380 in a moment where you have Donald Trump, he's the elected president of the United States.
00:35:20.180 He's acting under the authority of article two of the constitution.
00:35:22.860 You have a judge.
00:35:23.980 His entire job is to adjudicate disagreements about the law, but to uphold the law, uphold
00:35:29.700 the constitution together.
00:35:31.420 And it's very clear that the judge is actively working against the law.
00:35:36.120 Like he's actively working to violate the law.
00:35:38.380 He does not care about the law in the slightest.
00:35:40.920 His only concern is raising his profile.
00:35:43.940 And more importantly, I think signaling his allegiance during the cold civil war.
00:35:48.380 And I think that's what we're seeing as you point out is how, how much of the system still
00:35:54.000 works.
00:35:54.460 You know, Yarvin has, uh, has put it this way.
00:35:56.780 The Trump administration is attempting to run the government like the government still
00:36:00.240 works and they're doing the best job anyone has done at that.
00:36:04.000 And we're about to find out if the old girl can actually turn over the engine.
00:36:07.440 You know, like that's, that's kind of where we're at is, is, is, is, you know, JD Vance
00:36:11.540 and Elon Musk and Donald Trump have, they've cleaned up everything.
00:36:14.500 They replaced the spark plugs, you know, they've, they've redone the wiring.
00:36:18.380 Uh, and, and now we're there, we're going to turn the key and see if this baby can actually
00:36:22.220 run anymore.
00:36:23.220 And if the answer is no, then we all have to answer much harder questions, but I'll
00:36:28.440 say this, God bless them for trying this.
00:36:30.720 And I'm not saying that in a condescending way, genuinely God bless them for trying this,
00:36:34.960 because I think that's what people need to see.
00:36:36.920 I think that's the only thing that's going to make people aware of kind of where we are
00:36:41.160 as a country, when they watch someone who was literally shot, trying to, uh, get elected,
00:36:47.000 operating the country in the constitutional manner in which it was meant to operate.
00:36:51.620 And then things still don't move or change.
00:36:54.260 Well, then we kind of know what's up.
00:36:56.340 And, and if they do move and change, then awesome.
00:36:58.620 There was still something left in the tank.
00:37:00.500 We can still re-inhabit it.
00:37:02.240 Uh, you know, those, those narratives, because I still think that despite the system being
00:37:06.960 as broken as it is, there is still some narrative power left in the constitution, in the American
00:37:15.100 dream, in the way of life.
00:37:16.320 I think sometimes, uh, guys like Curtis Yarvin oversell how dead that is.
00:37:20.800 I think there is still a lot of animating, uh, you know, vigor in those, if you can access
00:37:26.440 them.
00:37:26.880 And so if it can work at all, I feel like the Trump administration is giving it the, the
00:37:31.700 best try we're going to see.
00:37:33.400 And if it can't, then this will kind of show, I think for most people that the system is
00:37:37.940 simply not going to be salvaged in its current incarnation.
00:37:41.980 Yeah.
00:37:42.420 It's a religion, uh, or it's a, it's a, it's a moral view, uh, the constitution and, and,
00:37:49.400 and sort of the, the belief in, in what America is supposed to be.
00:37:54.260 And it matters to the people to whom it matters.
00:37:57.980 Uh, and, and the issue is you want to make sure those people are actually.
00:38:01.700 In charge and in a position to, uh, to make those calls, which, uh, you know, the, the,
00:38:09.000 the paradox or the difficulty there is that you're having to act against what has been
00:38:17.180 procedurally decided that America is sort of the, uh, the pharisaical, uh, notion of
00:38:24.100 what the rule of law is.
00:38:25.200 And the person who wants to get people who actually care about America back in charge
00:38:30.920 so that that civic religion can be alive again, um, is, is, is facing these procedural forces
00:38:38.660 that are, you know, to some extent, an outgrowth of, or, or a corruption of those original,
00:38:46.380 uh, beliefs.
00:38:47.840 So it's complicated, but, but yeah, you want them to win.
00:38:51.480 Of course you want them to win.
00:38:52.740 And I guess I would say like, whether or not they figure it out, the right thing for us
00:39:00.440 to do on the ground is to organize and to create, uh, deep, you know, uh, uh, uh, illegible
00:39:11.260 bonds with other people and, and, and build things that are not dependent on the power structure
00:39:19.140 that's opposing all this.
00:39:20.740 And that, I mean, uh, because he, you know, if, if, if we win and we, we make America great
00:39:26.700 again, again, like then, then, uh, it will be good for you to have built these connections
00:39:34.100 and, and, uh, and, and created things that are robust and that will be part of the new
00:39:39.480 order.
00:39:40.100 That's good.
00:39:41.480 Um, but if not, like you're going to need these things.
00:39:45.160 And so like, I see it as like for us individually, you know, you hope it goes one way, but you
00:39:50.020 don't need it to go that way.
00:39:53.120 Do you find it strange, uh, that the most radical insight for a lot of people, uh, politically
00:39:59.360 in the last, you know, few years is that, uh, religion still matters.
00:40:04.220 Like, like, like it's, it, it's the way of being that has really defined humanity throughout
00:40:11.280 its entire existence.
00:40:13.260 And yet for some reason, the, you know, I feel like the entire neo-reactionary discussion
00:40:19.240 was, yeah, like there's, there's plenty of insights there, but the major one was just
00:40:22.620 like, yeah, no, everything's still a religion guys.
00:40:25.080 Like that's actually still, which came from us from two atheists.
00:40:28.520 Yeah.
00:40:28.820 Like the two biggest thinkers in India reaction.
00:40:31.460 And yet that really is the most important insight.
00:40:33.740 And you would expect this pattern of being that is so intrinsic to human flourishing to
00:40:41.040 show itself everywhere.
00:40:42.940 Cause people get touchy when you talk about the civic religion, right?
00:40:45.820 Cause they're like, oh, that's crass.
00:40:47.720 You know, that's, that, that, that's, uh, you know, that don't be a heretic, you know,
00:40:51.100 you're trying to, but ultimately what you're just saying is the, the, the pattern of human
00:40:57.220 existence that is activated by religious belief and is animated by religious, uh, belief.
00:41:03.740 Ultimately is also present in other aspects of our existence.
00:41:07.960 Like, why would you expect religion to stop just at the divine though?
00:41:13.160 While that's the most important manifestation of religion, why would you expect humans not
00:41:17.380 to, to pattern their understanding of life and government and everything else around this
00:41:23.400 thing that defined human existence for centuries?
00:41:26.260 It's just kind of funny to me that at this moment, the deepest insight you can really bring
00:41:30.880 and people forget it.
00:41:31.920 You know, they learned it for 10 seconds.
00:41:33.020 Wokeness is a religion.
00:41:34.340 Oh, okay.
00:41:34.820 So what are we going to do to combat it?
00:41:36.120 We're going to be as rational as possible.
00:41:38.380 Ooh, wrong lesson, buddy.
00:41:40.040 Wrong lesson.
00:41:40.500 But we just keep going back to it somehow.
00:41:43.360 Yeah.
00:41:43.760 It's well, and I think, you know, maybe you needed atheists to, uh, you know, as, as someone
00:41:49.660 who's of, of, uh, sincere faith myself, I don't like to think of religion in its character
00:41:57.360 as like a social technology that has utility.
00:42:00.160 Right.
00:42:00.600 Uh, because that's the fact that as utility doesn't matter to me, what matters is that
00:42:04.000 it's true.
00:42:05.160 Which is why it has utility, but yeah.
00:42:07.180 Well, right, right, right.
00:42:08.120 Exactly.
00:42:08.800 Uh, it doesn't work the other way.
00:42:10.120 Like if you, if you try to use it as a tool, it, it breaks on.
00:42:13.300 Um, um, but yeah, it's, it's, and it's really just like, I think there's, there's a separation
00:42:19.480 that people want to exist between the divine and spiritual and this life.
00:42:27.420 And like, it's, it's like, it's like, uh, you know, religion is too holy and too sacred
00:42:32.440 to like sully with real life.
00:42:34.420 And it's like, no, your beliefs about who you are and where you come from and what you're
00:42:38.960 here to do.
00:42:40.260 How could that not color your politics?
00:42:43.260 Um, how could that not change the way you think people should interact and the way you
00:42:48.540 think they should be governed?
00:42:49.460 Like, of course it changes it.
00:42:51.340 And, uh, and yeah, like, like the, the, the American system of government is predicated
00:42:57.680 on all sorts of beliefs about what human beings are that are fundamentally religious questions.
00:43:03.540 And, uh, you know, it not, not everyone who believes in those precepts is Christian, but
00:43:09.080 those, those precepts come from Christianity.
00:43:11.800 Right.
00:43:12.260 And they don't, and they don't exist in non-Christian countries.
00:43:15.480 Uh, like, I think, uh, it's remarkable how much you learn from traveling about like how
00:43:22.060 weird you are for caring about like the rule of law and honesty and equality in the particular
00:43:31.900 way that you do.
00:43:32.920 Like, it's, that is Christian.
00:43:35.680 It's, it's a particular thing.
00:43:37.140 It doesn't exist in China.
00:43:38.560 It doesn't exist in India.
00:43:39.820 It doesn't exist, you know, in, uh, in sub-Saharan Africa.
00:43:44.420 And, uh, and yeah, like, like, why wouldn't it permeate every, every part of your life?
00:43:51.760 And, and yeah, it's, that, that comes down to like, who is an American?
00:43:56.180 Right.
00:43:56.800 It's, uh, it's not just a set of ideas, but it contains a set of ideas.
00:44:05.600 Like the, the, the ideas matter a great deal to what it means to be an American.
00:44:09.600 It's not that there is no proposition.
00:44:11.800 It's just that that proposition came from somewhere.
00:44:13.920 It's not some a priori thing that we all agreed on before we started the, the civilization.
00:44:18.800 Exactly.
00:44:19.460 Exactly.
00:44:20.580 So Kevin, one more question before we wrap this up, uh, you're the leader of the exit
00:44:25.300 group.
00:44:25.680 I would be remiss if I didn't ask you, uh, you know, as you pointed out, while we are
00:44:30.840 getting a nice breather, uh, while we are getting an opportunity to build, while the, uh,
00:44:35.760 the fact that guys like Chris Rufo are making space and guys like Donald Trump are making
00:44:39.820 space for us is positive.
00:44:42.080 Ultimately, we can't rely on this.
00:44:44.040 Ultimately the, the system is too rotten throughout to expect that each one of these guys is going
00:44:51.060 to be able to just fix the whole thing top to bottom.
00:44:54.800 And so that then, uh, leaves it to us to figure out what are we going to do right now?
00:44:59.980 Now, how shall we live?
00:45:01.260 You know, and, and so my question for you is obviously you can't give away the whole
00:45:05.660 farm.
00:45:06.040 People have got to check out exit, but, but just a little basic, uh, what should people
00:45:10.480 be doing right now?
00:45:12.520 Are there, I know smaller communities seem to be part of this is what should people be
00:45:18.320 doing so that they can make sure that if the next bad guy gets elected or if, you know,
00:45:23.320 Trump isn't able to secure his, uh, you know, imperial reign for the next thousand years
00:45:27.500 on the golden throne, like what, what would, what should they be doing to prepare themselves
00:45:31.240 in case the government decides that they're not going to be giving us space anymore?
00:45:35.520 Yeah.
00:45:35.980 So I think one of the consequences of Brazilification is that the political is going to become intensely
00:45:40.540 personal and, uh, and has become intensely personal.
00:45:44.760 Like, like, you know, what, what happens to you in the event that you're the victim of
00:45:48.740 a crime or the perpetrator of a crime very much depends on just who the judge is and what
00:45:53.140 they think of you.
00:45:54.560 And, uh, that is in terms of like your, your, your economics, how you make a living, uh,
00:46:02.640 a lot is going to depend less on procedure and it's going to depend more on like who, you
00:46:06.420 know.
00:46:07.520 And, uh, as, as I put it, uh, in the, in the post, uh, on blog.exitgroup.us, um, Mediterranean
00:46:14.360 times call for Mediterranean business norms.
00:46:16.740 Uh, you need to start, uh, hiring your friends.
00:46:20.600 You need to start, uh, building things with your friends.
00:46:23.780 You need to start living with your friends.
00:46:25.460 You need to treat your friends like friends, um, and, and, uh, you know, favor them and,
00:46:33.380 and, and, and build patronage.
00:46:34.820 And, and that's, that's sort of the objective of what I'm doing is making sure that I have,
00:46:38.800 uh, that I'm useful to useful people.
00:46:41.720 And that's, uh, that's what I think everybody should be doing is, is building those networks,
00:46:45.880 doing cool things together, learning cool things together and, uh, and, and becoming
00:46:51.360 a people because, uh, you're going to need people.
00:46:54.860 And you should recognize that people are going to hate this.
00:46:57.120 I know the guys at Ridge Runner up in Tennessee are facing a lot of this problem right now as
00:47:01.340 they try to build an intentional community up there.
00:47:03.660 They've got all these, you know, local reporters who are sad little men desperately trying to raise
00:47:09.100 their profile by screaming Nazi as loud as they can.
00:47:13.160 And so, you know, it's not just about that building, which I think is absolutely critical,
00:47:17.120 but it's also about recognizing that you're forming that network.
00:47:20.240 That's going to be able to withstand those moments.
00:47:22.920 You know, these guys who are forging this community together, you know, their wives are
00:47:27.300 supporting each other.
00:47:28.180 They're meeting together.
00:47:29.080 You know, this is a situation in which they recognize that if they, if they don't have each
00:47:34.800 other's back, this is not going to work.
00:47:36.840 Uh, and so, like you said, it's, it's not just about, uh, it, you know, building is important,
00:47:41.960 but it's also about having that community, having that backing, knowing at the end of
00:47:46.420 the day that once you have entered into this project, the people around you are going to
00:47:50.540 stand alongside you because you are going to have the system pushing back the, like you
00:47:55.080 said, the political is getting extremely personal and the system is not going to like to see
00:48:00.020 people making the decisions that allow them to concentrate, have that shared community,
00:48:06.080 have that shared vision, have that support, break away from relying on others that don't
00:48:11.380 agree with them or who would be hostile to them.
00:48:13.660 They are not, that's not all going to just happen because you decide to move somewhere.
00:48:17.700 So recognize that you're, you know, it's both that you have to integrate both of those
00:48:21.980 sides into this strategy of a strategy of finding a way together to build a community that's
00:48:27.800 going to be able to stand apart.
00:48:28.780 Yeah, I mean, there, there, there is no shire, uh, uh, what drove the, uh, the piece that
00:48:35.700 I wrote this week was reflecting on my travels.
00:48:39.720 I get on a plane once a month and I've been doing that for about three years.
00:48:42.320 So I've been to basically every major city and a lot of really small cities.
00:48:46.080 And, uh, there isn't a place where the kids aren't on tablets watching weird porn.
00:48:52.340 And there isn't a place where, um, you know, there's not migrants at Home Depot.
00:48:57.780 It's everywhere in the country.
00:48:59.940 Uh, they don't have exactly all of the same pathologies, but there's nowhere that doesn't
00:49:05.640 have these modern pathologies.
00:49:08.360 And so if it's, it's sort of, um, if, if you want the shire, you gotta, you gotta scour
00:49:14.200 it first.
00:49:14.640 Like you can, you're going to have to build something and, uh, and yeah, you're going to
00:49:19.860 need this.
00:49:20.160 That starts with the people that you build it with.
00:49:22.920 And, uh, yeah, that's, that's, that's my, that's been my approach is, is to think about
00:49:29.020 this, not in terms of jurisdiction, not in terms of geography, uh, but in terms of who
00:49:35.500 are the people that I want in the foxhole with me.
00:49:39.500 Absolutely.
00:49:40.080 And that's something that I think everybody needs to recognize in this moment.
00:49:43.020 You need to be thinking about who do I want to be next to?
00:49:45.240 Who do I want that foxhole with me?
00:49:46.980 Who, if, if I have to make the call tomorrow, can I get.
00:49:50.160 Five guys to protect my house.
00:49:51.520 If I need to make the call tomorrow, can I get a buddy a job when he just lost it?
00:49:55.660 If I, you know, if there's, if there's a, a emergency tomorrow with my family, do I know
00:50:00.460 that people will step up and, and, and be able to come alongside me that that's the most
00:50:04.080 critical question for people hadn't, uh, heading into this.
00:50:07.020 So, yeah.
00:50:07.800 And there's, there's a joke in the, in the like network state sphere that's like, yes,
00:50:12.240 I'm going to create my own sovereign clade, autonomous, whatever.
00:50:16.240 And it's like a guy who can't start a dinner party.
00:50:18.880 Right.
00:50:19.200 Like, so, so like, yeah, that's the way I think it starts is, is, uh, have, have a monthly
00:50:25.380 night out, uh, go get, go get drinks, go get dinner, uh, become an institution at that
00:50:32.260 scale.
00:50:33.540 And, uh, and I think that is, is the kernel of, and then you talk about like, well, what,
00:50:39.700 what do we want to do?
00:50:40.400 You know, maybe it's a, maybe it's like road cleanup.
00:50:42.080 I know a guy who basically started with like a couple of guys who had some trade skills and
00:50:46.520 he was like, can we, can we help fix up some old lady's house?
00:50:50.700 And they use that to learn like who was credible, who knew their stuff, who would show up.
00:50:55.740 And they eventually sort of refined that into, um, a little kind of contractor, uh, uh, cooperative
00:51:05.720 and they ended up fixing up a building in a downtown area and turning it into a business
00:51:09.900 together.
00:51:10.200 And now it's kind of like they're, they're like Tony Soprano clubhouse.
00:51:15.020 Um, and so you, I guess what I would say is like, you know, think about the big picture,
00:51:20.060 but, but it starts with, it starts with dinner parties and little odd jobs around the house
00:51:25.580 and just, uh, being neighborly.
00:51:29.780 Excellent.
00:51:30.340 Well, we have a few questions from the audience.
00:51:32.200 So before we get to those, Kevin, where should people look for exit and the rest of your work?
00:51:36.780 Yeah.
00:51:37.040 Exitgroup.us the, uh, the newsletter is blog.exitgroup.us.
00:51:40.480 And if you subscribe, you get access to our cocktail hours, which we've got, uh, we've got
00:51:45.520 two coming up in the next couple of weeks in, uh, in Dallas and Austin.
00:51:48.920 So yeah, exitgroup.us.
00:51:51.180 All right.
00:51:51.820 Everybody should be checking that out.
00:51:53.720 Let's head over to our questions.
00:51:56.220 Vegas 77 says, uh, the gated, uh, 55 and up communities around me create false reality
00:52:01.920 for the boomers that live there.
00:52:03.440 They have a nice loophole.
00:52:04.860 Meanwhile, young families have to fight, uh, for a place in diversity Thunderdome.
00:52:09.740 Yeah.
00:52:10.020 I, I'm trying to remember what, uh, somebody had the most incredible post, uh, a lot, a while
00:52:15.860 back, which is, uh, you know, uh, institutions of higher learning are about getting the right,
00:52:21.240 uh, opinions about diversity and making enough money to avoid the consequences.
00:52:25.540 Uh, and that's, uh, very much the mentality.
00:52:28.240 I think, unfortunately for a lot of people who are at the, you know, twilight years, uh,
00:52:32.920 they kind of felt like, well, we did our part and, you know, we can kind of live in this
00:52:37.040 bubble.
00:52:37.440 We're affluent enough to where we can, uh, section ourselves off from many of the consequences.
00:52:42.840 And so therefore it's probably not that big of a problem and they don't recognize that
00:52:47.780 there's a, an awfully big wall of money between them and, uh, what, you know, most of the younger
00:52:53.340 people are trying to start a family are struggling against.
00:52:56.340 Yeah.
00:52:56.900 It's also massively true of people who don't have kids because they have the flexibility
00:53:01.500 and the mobility to, uh, to fly above a lot of things where you're just less both,
00:53:08.400 both like physically, but also like socially you are more rooted and you can't, you can't
00:53:14.640 avoid the consequences of things as much as you can, if it's just you and you're just sort
00:53:18.620 of thinking about your personal safety, you know, your personal media consumption, all
00:53:22.580 that you, you make those choices.
00:53:23.860 But when you have kids, it's, uh, it's very different.
00:53:27.240 Yep.
00:53:27.860 And then Orr McIntyre can't say my name.
00:53:29.980 So I changed it for $5.
00:53:31.660 Thank you.
00:53:32.420 Uh, British Supreme court just ruled that men aren't legally women.
00:53:35.680 I'm glad to hear it, but what a world we live in.
00:53:38.720 Yeah.
00:53:38.880 I'm honestly surprised that the British Supreme court even came up with that ruling given
00:53:42.720 everything else happening in that country at the moment.
00:53:45.260 But, uh, for some reason, the British, you know, I think they also banned, uh, transition
00:53:49.160 surgeries for children before America did.
00:53:51.780 So, uh, you know, in strange moments, despite them being insane on everything else, they do
00:53:56.280 seem to run slightly ahead on the gender issue.
00:53:59.040 Weird.
00:53:59.600 Like there's like a really strong, like turf constituency out there.
00:54:03.880 I don't know what drives that.
00:54:04.880 Yeah.
00:54:05.940 Yeah.
00:54:06.460 No, I think that is a part of it.
00:54:08.740 Sadly is, is that the, um, the irate feminist still has more power than the institutional
00:54:14.340 conservative somehow.
00:54:15.480 And so, uh, when, when they decide that something's wrong, even if it's on the transgender issue,
00:54:20.360 they can actually power it through in the way that your, uh, your, uh, your average, uh,
00:54:25.660 evangelical pastor is just unwilling to go to bat for, sadly enough.
00:54:29.360 Uh, evangelical pastors care more about your religion than a feminist cares about hers.
00:54:33.540 Just, uh, going to, going to throw that one out there for you.
00:54:37.300 All right, guys, uh, we're going to go ahead and wrap this up.
00:54:40.180 Of course, always great talking to Kevin, make sure that you are following him on all
00:54:44.000 the relevant platforms.
00:54:45.200 If it's your first time stopping by here, of course, you need to go ahead and subscribe
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00:55:04.960 We've got plenty of merch under the Oren McIntyre collection for you to pick up there.
00:55:09.100 Thank you everybody for watching.
00:55:10.480 And as always, I'll talk to you next time.