The Ben Shapiro Show - The Un-Askable Question | Ep. 978

00:00:00.000 President Trump considers reopening the economy as epidemiologists protest.

00:00:04.000 The media tried to blame Trump for some dude actually eating fish tank cleaner.

00:00:09.000 And Democrats continue to play politics with an economic rescue bill.

00:00:11.000 I'm Ben Shapiro.

00:00:12.000 This is the Ben Shapiro Show.

00:00:14.000 This is the Ben Shapiro Show.

00:00:22.000 Stand up for your digital rights.

00:00:24.000 Take action right now at expressvpn.com slash pen.

00:00:27.000 I really mean that.

00:00:27.000 A lot of people getting hacked right now.

00:00:28.000 Expressvpn.com slash pen to protect your online activity.

00:00:32.000 Okay, so we begin as always with your latest updates on the news before we get to the politics.

00:00:37.000 So, the coronavirus map today.

00:00:39.000 is showing a vast increase in the number of deaths in the United States.

00:00:42.000 There were over 100 deaths yesterday in the United States.

00:00:45.000 We're up to 591 total deaths at this hour in the United States from coronavirus.

00:00:50.000 46,485 cases diagnosed so far.

00:00:52.000 Now, we are expecting these numbers to rise, obviously.

00:00:54.000 That is not a great shock.

00:00:56.000 Again, we are testing.

00:00:56.000 Once we start testing, you're going to start finding things that you are testing for, as opposed to what China, there's rumors that China is actually continuing to see coronavirus cases and they stopped testing.

00:01:06.000 And that's why they're not seeing an increase in the number of cases that are out there.

00:01:08.000 Now, one of the big problems here is that China's path is one of the great hopes for the world, because if China's been able to tamp this thing down, it makes everybody feel like, okay, well maybe we can tamp this thing down too. 0.98

00:01:17.000 That's why more people are putting faith at this point in South Korea, which has seen 9,000 total cases and 120 deaths, and has not completely shut down their economy to do so.

00:01:25.000 The difference being, South Korea had massive testing regimes already in place Thanks to H1N1 and their response to SARS in the past.

00:01:33.000 Because of all of that, they had been pretty well prepared for all of this.

00:01:36.000 The United States simply was not and we were late on the game.

00:01:38.000 Because we were late on the game, the entire ballgame here has been how do we shift from Chinese lockdown strategies, everybody stay home, into South Korean social distancing, everybody wear a mask, strategies where most of us can go back to work.

00:01:50.000 If you're sick, you stay home.

00:01:52.000 If you're elderly or you're vulnerable, you stay home, right?

00:01:55.000 Everybody keeps saying, I hear this from a lot of people on the right side of the aisle, why don't the old people and the vulnerable people, why don't they just stay home and everybody else goes back to work?

00:02:02.000 And the problem is right now there's too much social mixing.

00:02:04.000 You don't know who has it and who does not.

00:02:06.000 There's no way to tamp down the people who actually are sick.

00:02:08.000 And so because we have not yet gotten this thing under control, you can't go to South Korean type measures.

00:02:13.000 The question is how fast we can get there.

00:02:15.000 Meanwhile, in Italy, The situation continues to be incredibly grim.

00:02:18.000 Italy has about 64,000 cases at this hour with approximately 6,000 total deaths.

00:02:22.000 Their death rate is significantly higher than that of the United States.

00:02:25.000 Again, we have what we are gaining on them in terms of total number of cases, but we have fewer, well under 1,000 deaths at this point.

00:02:32.000 Just about 600 deaths.

00:02:33.000 Italy has 64,000 cases and 6,000 deaths.

00:02:36.000 That is because their healthcare system is being overwhelmed.

00:02:38.000 And that is why so many people in the United States right now are worried about the overwhelming of our healthcare system at this time.

00:02:45.000 That is why people are also worried about a bed shortage looming in California.

00:02:48.000 According to the New York Times, Governor Gavin Newsom estimates California will be short about 17,000 hospital beds.

00:02:53.000 Although the state is frantically trying to source thousands more of them, the pace of testing remains stubbornly slow in California.

00:02:59.000 I've been hearing from hospitals in the area that they are indeed inundated with people who are coming in for coronavirus, although we have heard no stories about ventilator shortages at this point in time.

00:03:08.000 Elon Musk actually came up with a thousand ventilators yesterday.

00:03:11.000 We are quickly ramping up production across the country of ventilators, of masks, of personal protective equipment.

00:03:16.000 That's those PPEs you hear everybody talking about.

00:03:19.000 And the fact is that it takes a little while for the U.S.

00:03:21.000 economy to get going on this sort of stuff, but once industry kicks in, we are fantastic.

00:03:26.000 at producing what it is we actually need to produce.

00:03:28.000 New York state has conducted twice as many tests as California for the virus.

00:03:31.000 As of Monday, New York had tested almost 80,000 people, including 33,000 in New York City.

00:03:35.000 California had conducted 26,400 tests by Sunday.

00:03:39.000 That was the most recent data available.

00:03:40.000 Officials in California have rushed to reopen hospitals that had been shuttered by motels to house the state's more than 150,000 homeless people and retrofit college dormitories to serve as hospital wards.

00:03:51.000 Again, the homeless problem in California continues to rear its ugly head because the fact is that Los Angeles homeless people are not exactly socially distancing.

00:03:59.000 All of the fun and games with regard to letting people live on the streets and declaring they have a right to live on the streets and be a health threat.

00:04:06.000 It turns out that has some pretty serious consequences.

00:04:08.000 There's some video of LA homeless folks, not exactly people who are concerned about cleanliness and social distancing at this point.

00:04:15.000 I mean, you can drive around Los Angeles right now and you can see there's nobody anywhere, but you'll see large congregations of homeless people in downtown LA under overpasses by the LA River.

00:04:23.000 None of that speaks well of the possibility of tamping down the coronavirus epidemic.

00:04:28.000 Gavin Newsom said the state is chartering flights to China to procure protective equipment.

00:04:31.000 China has been hoarding all of that protective equipment.

00:04:35.000 Oh, those wonderful folks in the Chinese government.

00:04:37.000 This is some video that we were talking about of the situation with the homeless in Los Angeles.

00:04:42.000 That looked like a place that is thriving and ready for health to you.

00:04:45.000 This is in downtown LA.

00:04:47.000 Across California, the promise of widespread access to testing for the virus has not yet materialized.

00:04:51.000 Doctors say they were alarmed about shortages of protective equipment.

00:04:54.000 One of the other big problems is that the states are handling this sort of differently.

00:04:59.000 And so while California has locked down and New York has locked down, Texas and Florida have not yet completely locked down.

00:05:04.000 And this is leading epidemiologists to believe that there could be hotspots in some of the states that have not yet locked down that are not yet measurable.

00:05:11.000 Meaning the testing is not happening in Texas and Florida the same way it's not happening in California.

00:05:16.000 But lockdowns have not really gone into place in Texas, in Florida, the same way they've gone into place in California either.

00:05:22.000 In New York City, the attack rate, meaning the amount of transmission, the number of people who have this thing, in the general population in New York is much, much higher than anywhere across the rest of the country so far, as we can tell.

00:05:33.000 New York is actually testing.

00:05:34.000 But in California, which is also starting to test, the rates are nowhere near as huge.

00:05:39.000 And that is because, of course, New York is an extraordinarily populated area.

00:05:42.000 When you have that many people living right on top of each other, the possibility of pandemic transmission becomes much, much higher.

00:05:48.000 This has been true literally forever.

00:05:50.000 This is why when you read old books about the plague hits London, and all the rich people immediately jump in their carriages and head off to the country cottage, there's a reason for that.

00:05:59.000 People are trying to do that in New York right now.

00:06:00.000 They're trying to flee to Florida, and Florida's saying, no, you guys don't get in.

00:06:03.000 Stay home.

00:06:04.000 You're not bringing your coronavirus with you here.

00:06:06.000 Dr. Deborah Birx pointed this out at a press conference with President Trump yesterday.

00:06:10.000 She said, yes, there's an alarming attack rate in New York City.

00:06:13.000 Here's Dr. Deborah Birx.

00:06:15.000 The New York metro area of New Jersey, New York City, and parts of Long Island have an attack rate close to one in a thousand.

00:06:25.000 This is five times what the other areas are seeing.

00:06:29.000 Through the high-throughput lab investigations, we're finding that 28% of the submitted specimens are positive from that area, where it's less than 8% in the rest of the country.

00:06:43.000 So to all of my friends and colleagues in New York, this is the group that needs to absolutely social distance and self-isolate at this time.

00:06:53.000 Yeah, all of that obviously is true.

00:06:55.000 Intensity is really an enemy in a situation like this, says Dr. Steven Goodman, an epidemiologist at Stanford University.

00:07:00.000 With large population centers, where people are interacting with more people all the time, that's where it is going to spread the fastest.

00:07:05.000 We'll get to more coronavirus updates, particularly economic updates, because we're starting to ask the unaskable question here.

00:07:12.000 And that is the question that we should have been asking all along.

00:07:15.000 How do you balance all the policy considerations?

00:07:17.000 And I know that that's considered bad taste.

00:07:19.000 We're not supposed to say things like, how exactly do we generate a policy that is most likely to save the economy and also save lives?

00:07:25.000 We're instead supposed to say that everything shuts down until every life is saved.

00:07:29.000 And that, of course, is not plausible.

00:07:31.000 I mean, the fact is that we at some point are going to have to unlock the economy.

00:07:34.000 The question is how we do that in the safest possible way.

00:07:36.000 That doesn't mean that we all go back to work tomorrow without any protective measures.

00:07:40.000 It also doesn't mean that we keep the economy locked down interminably and forever, because that is not It's not going to happen either.

00:07:45.000 People, I've seen a lot of folks who are protesting that President Trump and people who are talking about the economy, you're overlooking human life.

00:07:52.000 How could you overlook human life?

00:07:53.000 It's not that you're overlooking human life.

00:07:55.000 It's that every public policy consideration is a balancing of various outcomes that you are weighing.

00:08:01.000 And if the suggestion is that we do everything we can in the United States to save even one human life, well then we should all be walking around in bubbles.

00:08:07.000 Forget about a pandemic.

00:08:08.000 Like all the time, we should be walking around in bubbles.

00:08:10.000 We should go back to horse and buggies.

00:08:12.000 The fact is there are lots of things we could do in the United States to quote-unquote save lives.

00:08:15.000 They also happen to destroy the economy, which would have its own horrific side effects.

00:08:19.000 So all of this is public policy balancing, and that should not be an unaskable question.

00:08:23.000 In fact, it's the only question that is worth asking at this point when you are talking about government policy, when you're talking about what exactly the federal government and state governments ought to do.

00:08:30.000 We're gonna get to more of this in just one second.

00:08:33.000 First, Let's talk about how you are going to look when you emerge from this situation.

00:08:37.000 Are you going to look sharp?

00:08:38.000 Are you going to look cool?

00:08:39.000 So let me tell you something.

00:08:40.000 I am not a natural born cowboy, right?

00:08:42.000 I'm an Orthodox Jew from a major city, but I've always had a soft spot for cowboy attire.

00:08:48.000 And this is particularly true of boots.

00:08:49.000 Well, a few years back, I went out and I got myself a pair of cowboy boots.

00:08:52.000 I've never been able to wear them since because my wife laughed at me. 1.00

00:08:55.000 And instead, now, I'm using the best pair of cowboy boots you can find because they are subtle and they are cool.

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00:09:18.000 They look fantastic with tons of timeless styles.

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00:09:39.000 They do.

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00:09:41.000 I love wearing my Tecovas boots.

00:09:43.000 Makes me feel like a cowboy, even though I don't have to look like somebody who can't handle cowboy boots.

00:09:48.000 Get yourself a pair of Tecovas cowboy boots today at tecovas.com slash ben.

00:09:48.000 Do what I did.

00:09:52.000 You are enough of a man to wear cowboy boots so long.

00:09:55.000 Okay, so the reason that people are starting to go nuts about even mild considerations of public policy is because they are afraid that we are going to jump one way or the other, that we're going to jump precipitously back into a vast amount of social life with no social distancing and everybody going back to work and then millions of people die Or, alternatively, the economy is going to be shut down forever.

00:10:23.000 And those are not the only two approaches.

00:10:26.000 They better not be the only two approaches, because if those are the only two approaches, then neither one of those is worth choosing. 0.98

00:10:31.000 But to pretend that there are no economic effects of this, that we can do this interminably, is of course idiotic. 0.90

00:10:35.000 Nelson Schwartz at the New York Times writes, The American economy is facing a plunge into uncharted waters. 0.95

00:10:40.000 Economists say there is little doubt that the nation is headed into recession because of the coronavirus pandemic.

00:10:45.000 With businesses shutting down and Americans being shut in, it's harder to foresee the bottom, how long it will take to climb back.

00:10:50.000 Greg Daco, Chief U.S.

00:10:51.000 Economist at Oxford Economics, says the economy is assured of a recession.

00:10:55.000 Output will fall 0.4% in first quarter, 12% in the second.

00:10:59.000 Goldman Sachs says they expect a 24% drop in the second quarter.

00:11:03.000 And Morgan Stanley is saying that it might be up to 30% in the second quarter, which would be the greatest economic retraction in the history of the United States by a long margin.

00:11:11.000 On Thursday, the Labor Department reported that initial jobless claims jumped 30% the previous week, in one week, to 281,000, the highest level since the aftermath of a hurricane In 2017, but Goldman Sachs foresees that this week, this week, 2.25 million unemployment failings this week.

00:11:30.000 Okay, so this cannot continue forever.

00:11:33.000 And so when President Trump talks about how we need to stop this at some point, that of course is true.

00:11:38.000 And that doesn't mean that Trump is downplaying this thing.

00:11:40.000 He is not downplaying this thing, right?

00:11:41.000 Here's President Trump yesterday, did a press conference.

00:11:43.000 He said, yeah, things are going to get real bad this week.

00:11:45.000 You're going to see the numbers go up.

00:11:46.000 By the way, the numbers will continue to go up next week.

00:11:48.000 Everything lags.

00:11:49.000 And as far as the deaths, that lags too because people are lingering for a week or two at the hospital sometimes before they die.

00:11:55.000 Here's President Trump yesterday saying, yeah, things are going to be pretty bad this week.

00:11:59.000 It's going to be bad and we have A lot of people dying from the flu, as you know.

00:12:05.000 We have a very bad flu season on top of everything else.

00:12:07.000 It's very bad.

00:12:08.000 It looks like it could be over 50,000.

00:12:10.000 And certainly, this is going to be bad.

00:12:14.000 And we're trying to make it so that it's much, much less bad.

00:12:18.000 And that's what we're doing.

00:12:20.000 I think we're doing a very good job of it.

00:12:23.000 The president did announce some new measures that were being taken by the federal government yesterday.

00:12:26.000 He said that FEMA is distributing millions of critical supplies.

00:12:29.000 And it is true they are activating in terms of getting N95 masks out to as many medical workers as possible, ramping out the distribution of personal protective equipment.

00:12:39.000 Everybody is indeed mobilizing.

00:12:41.000 You know, in a crisis, the crisis doesn't stop just because people are mobilizing.

00:12:44.000 The question is how long it takes to alleviate the crisis.

00:12:46.000 Here's President Trump announcing that FEMA is getting directly involved.

00:12:49.000 FEMA is distributing 8 million N95 respirator masks and 13.3 million surgical masks across the country right now, focusing on the areas with the greatest need.

00:13:01.000 We have shipped 73 pallets of personal protective equipment to New York City and 36 pallets to the state of Washington.

00:13:12.000 In the past 96 hours, FEMA has also received donations of approximately 6.5 million masks.

00:13:18.000 We're having millions and millions of masks made as we speak.

00:13:23.000 Okay, so that is good news.

00:13:25.000 President Trump also says that we are pursuing coronavirus treatments in record time.

00:13:28.000 They're developing a vaccine, pushing it as fast as they possibly can.

00:13:31.000 Here's the president on coronavirus treatments.

00:13:33.000 And my direction, the federal government is working to help obtain large quantities of chloroquine.

00:13:41.000 And you can look from any standpoint tomorrow in New York.

00:13:48.000 We think tomorrow pretty early.

00:13:49.000 The hydroxy chloroquine And the Z-Pack, I think, is a combination.

00:13:58.000 Probably is looking very, very good, and it's going to be distributed.

00:14:02.000 We have 10,000 units going, and it'll be distributed tomorrow.

00:14:09.000 It'll be available.

00:14:10.000 Got approved in record-setting time.

00:14:12.000 There's never been anything even close to it.

00:14:17.000 President Trump has been pushing this hydroxychloroquine solution.

00:14:20.000 It is not clear at this point.

00:14:21.000 There are no tested trials as far as hydroxychloroquine in any mass numbers to see whether this thing is incredibly effective across the board.

00:14:29.000 Trump did pump hydroxychloroquine again yesterday at his press conference.

00:14:32.000 He's been pushing this thing pretty hard.

00:14:34.000 There have been a lot of stories of people who say they feel better after using hydroxychloroquine in coordination with azithromycin as well as zinc.

00:14:41.000 So we'll see if that plays out.

00:14:43.000 It is amazing the lengths to which the media will go in order to try and portray Trump mentioning this thing as a grave, grave evil.

00:14:52.000 So yesterday, I mean, honestly, I was astonished.

00:14:54.000 I'm not sure I've ever seen Trump derangement syndrome as strong as I saw it in the media yesterday.

00:14:58.000 This is an unbelievable story.

00:15:00.000 Okay, so Heidi Prisbilla over at NBC News Tweeted out this tweet yesterday.

00:15:06.000 She tweeted out, let me find it here.

00:15:09.000 Oh my god.

00:15:10.000 Don't take anything.

00:15:11.000 Don't believe anything.

00:15:12.000 Don't believe anything the president says and his people because they don't know what they're talking about.

00:15:15.000 And don't take anything.

00:15:16.000 Be so careful and call your doctor.

00:15:18.000 This is a heartache I'll never get over.

00:15:19.000 What exactly is she talking about here?

00:15:21.000 She's talking about a story in which a woman suggested that she and her husband had taken hydroxychloroquine in order to fend off coronavirus, even though they'd not been diagnosed with it.

00:15:31.000 And then her husband died and she ended up in the ICU.

00:15:34.000 And Heidi Prisbilla tweeted, her husband is dead and she's in the ICU after ingesting chloroquine.

00:15:39.000 We saw Trump on TV, every channel, all of his buddies.

00:15:41.000 And this was safe, she said.

00:15:42.000 Trump kept basically saying it was pretty much a cure.

00:15:45.000 She implored Vaughn Hilliard of NBC News, educate the people.

00:15:48.000 According to Heidi Przybyla, the couple did not have coronavirus symptoms, but took the chloroquine phosphate as a preventative measure.

00:15:54.000 They feared contracting coronavirus.

00:15:55.000 The couple each mixed one tablespoon of chloroquine, a phosphate, with soda.

00:15:59.000 Within 20 minutes, they began experiencing severe sickness and called 911.

00:16:02.000 I was in the pantry stacking dog food, and I saw it sitting in the back shelf, and I thought, hey, isn't that the stuff they were talking about on TV?

00:16:08.000 And it was.

00:16:09.000 Hilliard interviewed her from the hospital bed over the phone.

00:16:11.000 This is the most horrible day of my life, and it feels like my heart is broken.

00:16:13.000 It'll never mend.

00:16:14.000 It's just broke.

00:16:15.000 Like my husband.

00:16:15.000 Dead.

00:16:16.000 I'm 61.

00:16:17.000 We're healthy.

00:16:17.000 My husband is 68.

00:16:18.000 No, no underlying, no diabetes or lung issues.

00:16:21.000 Okay, Von Hilliard has this, has this audio.

00:16:21.000 Nothing.

00:16:25.000 With this crazy lady talking about how it was Trump's fault. 0.98

00:16:29.000 Talking about the woman in the ICU. 0.90

00:16:31.000 Trump kept saying it was pretty much basically a cure.

00:16:33.000 Do we have that audio of this woman talking to Vaughn Hilliard at NBC?

00:16:36.000 This supposedly national news here about Trump killing somebody because he told them to take hydroxychloroquine?

00:16:41.000 You know, they kept saying that it was approved for other things and, you know, Trump kept saying it was, you know, basically pretty much a cure.

00:16:53.000 What would be your message to the American public?

00:16:57.000 Oh my God, don't take anything.

00:17:01.000 Don't believe anything.

00:17:03.000 Don't believe anything the President says.

00:17:06.000 And his people.

00:17:07.000 Because they don't know what they're talking about.

00:17:10.000 I was in the pantry, stacking, eating dog food, and I just saw it sitting in the back shelf.

00:17:18.000 So hey, isn't that that stuff they're talking about on TV?

00:17:21.000 Yeah, it was.

00:17:25.000 Okay, so according to the media, it sounds like President Trump has been pushing chloroquine phosphate, and that some lady took his advice, gave it to herself and her husband, and then he died, and she's in the ICU.

00:17:35.000 Wait until you hear the punchline of this story, which demonstrates that the media are full-scale insane. 0.74

00:17:39.000 Insane! 0.89

00:17:40.000 I mean, this is, really, this is the most insane case of Trump Derangement Syndrome I have ever heard of, and there's a lot of Trump Derangement Syndrome out there, but the mainstream media have picked up on this story. 0.80

00:17:48.000 The punchline here is unreal.

00:17:51.000 Seriously, wait for it.

00:17:52.000 Okay, first, let's talk about the fact that even when all of this is over, taxes are still going to be a part of your life.

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00:19:04.000 Okay, so what is the punchline to this story where Trump supposedly killed some dude and then put his wife in the ICU after recommending inappropriate substances?

00:19:04.000 Get your business on track.

00:19:16.000 It turns out they didn't actually have hydroxychloroquine phosphate in like, you know, the medicinal form.

00:19:23.000 They had fish tank cleaner in the back of their closet.

00:19:27.000 And fish tank cleaner has an at chloroquine phosphate. 1.00

00:19:30.000 And these morons went in the back. 1.00

00:19:32.000 Advisedly, I am saying this. 1.00

00:19:34.000 If you take fish tank cleaner and put it in your body because you heard on the TVs that chloroquine phosphate is good for you.

00:19:41.000 And it literally says on the package, not for human consumption.

00:19:44.000 And you then down it with some soda.

00:19:47.000 That's on you.

00:19:49.000 Okay?

00:19:50.000 That's not on Trump.

00:19:51.000 That's on you. 1.00

00:19:52.000 Because you're stupid. 1.00

00:19:53.000 Okay? 1.00

00:19:54.000 And I feel bad for you that you're stupid. 1.00

00:19:55.000 But, you're stupid. 1.00

00:19:56.000 Like, there's no two ways about that. 1.00

00:19:58.000 I'm sorry.

00:19:59.000 Here's the actual story.

00:20:00.000 So, if I just told you what NBC told you, you would think that Trump said, take this pill, the person took the pill, and the person died.

00:20:05.000 Right?

00:20:05.000 That would be the story.

00:20:06.000 But that is not the story.

00:20:08.000 Here's the story from Fox 29 in Arizona.

00:20:10.000 Medical experts with Banner Health are warning the public against using inappropriate medication and household products to prevent or treat coronavirus.

00:20:17.000 The warning by Banner Health comes after an Arizona man in his 60s died from taking a substance used to clean fish tanks at aquariums in order to prevent contracting COVID-19.

00:20:26.000 In a statement released on Monday, experts emphasized that chloroquine, which is a medication used for malaria, should not be taken to treat or prevent COVID-19.

00:20:33.000 Banner Health officials say the man who died, along with his wife, both took chloroquine phosphate.

00:20:37.000 The man's wife, also in her 60s, is currently under critical care.

00:20:40.000 Officials say both were taken to a Banner Health hospital for immediate treatment after they experienced immediate effects within 30 minutes of taking the substance.

00:20:48.000 Most patients who become infected with COVID-19 will only require symptomatic care and self-isolation to prevent the risk of infecting others, read a portion of the statement.

00:20:55.000 The routine use of specific treatments, including medications described as anti-COVID-19, is not recommended for non-hospitalized patients.

00:21:01.000 The FDA has reiterated in a statement there are no FDA-approved therapeutics or drugs to treat, cure, or prevent COVID-19.

00:21:08.000 Chloroquine has been used to treat malaria since the 1930s.

00:21:10.000 Hydroxychloroquine came along a decade later and has fewer side effects.

00:21:14.000 The latter is sold in generic form under the brand name Plaquenil for use against several diseases.

00:21:18.000 The drugs can cause heart problems, severely low blood pressure, and muscle or nerve damage.

00:21:23.000 Plaquenil's label warns of possible damage to the retina, especially when used at higher doses.

00:21:28.000 But, beyond this, this is not the same thing as, you know, fish tank cleaner.

00:21:36.000 As fish tank cleaner.

00:21:38.000 That is not the same thing.

00:21:39.000 Okay, that is like Trump saying that, you know, there have been some studies that show the beneficial medicinal effects of a glass of wine at dinner.

00:21:47.000 So you're like, oh, well that means alcohol is good for me.

00:21:50.000 So you go in your bathroom, you take two bottles of isopropyl rubbing alcohol, and you proceed to down them.

00:21:55.000 And if you do that, that one's on you. 1.00

00:21:57.000 That one's not on Trump because you're stupid. 1.00

00:22:00.000 But the media tried to blame Trump for this. 1.00

00:22:01.000 It's unbelievable. 0.98

00:22:02.000 I mean, truly, it's absolutely ridiculous. 0.51

00:22:05.000 The amount that the media are trying to turn this into a Trump bleep show, as opposed to we're all in the midst of a pandemic and nobody knows anything, which is really the story of this thing.

00:22:15.000 And then we are all sort of muddling through.

00:22:17.000 It's pretty incredible.

00:22:18.000 I don't know how you blame Trump for that one.

00:22:20.000 But meanwhile, the media have been trying to foster Debate between Trump and Dr. Anthony Fauci.

00:22:25.000 Now at this time, if you're rooting for the country, you may not like everything Trump is saying from the podium.

00:22:28.000 You may think that he exaggerates.

00:22:30.000 You may think that he prevaricates.

00:22:31.000 You may think that President Trump says things that are not true.

00:22:33.000 That he straight out says things that are not true.

00:22:35.000 So who do you want in the administration making sure that the response is handled as correctly as possible?

00:22:39.000 Probably one of those people would be Dr. Anthony Fauci, right?

00:22:42.000 Wouldn't that be the person who you are actually counting on to keep Trump on the straight and narrow?

00:22:46.000 Yet every question coming out of the media right now directed at Anthony Fauci is, why won't you rip on Trump some more?

00:22:51.000 Why don't you go rip on Trump some more?

00:22:53.000 Like, please, go rip on Trump some more.

00:22:54.000 So the New York Times has an entire piece today dedicated to the proposition that President Trump hates Fauci.

00:23:00.000 Because if there's one thing that is guaranteed to ensure conflict, it is media coverage.

00:23:05.000 According to the New York Times, the president has become increasingly concerned as Dr. Anthony Fauci has grown bolder in correcting his falsehoods about the spread of coronavirus.

00:23:12.000 Dr. Fauci, the director of the NIAID, the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, since 1984, has grown bolder in correcting the president's falsehoods and overly rosy statements about the spread of coronavirus in the past two weeks, and he has become a hero to the president's critics because of it.

00:23:27.000 And now, Mr. Trump's patience has started to wear thin.

00:23:31.000 So is the patience of some White House advisors who see Dr. Fauci is taking shots at the president in some of his interviews with print reporters.

00:23:37.000 Well, offering extensive praise for Trump in television interviews with conservative hosts.

00:23:41.000 Trump knows that Fauci, who has advised every president since Reagan, is seen as credible with a large section of the public and with journalists, and so he has given the doctor more leeway to contradict him, according to multiple advisors to the president.

00:23:51.000 When Trump knows he has more to gain than lose by keeping an advisor, he has resisted impulses to fight back against apparent criticisms, sometimes for months-long interludes.

00:23:59.000 So far, the president appears to be making the same calculation with Fauci.

00:24:03.000 But the president has resisted portraying the virus as the kind of threat described by Fauci and the media are trying to play up. 0.95

00:24:09.000 I mean, this is ridiculous.

00:24:09.000 The media are trying to play up conflict between Fauci and Trump at a critical point where it's pretty important that Trump be having open conversations with Fauci.

00:24:16.000 By the way, Trump in his press conference has been unendingly and unstintingly praiseworthy of of fauci i mean talking extensively about how he thinks fauci is doing an excellent job trump yesterday in his press conference despite all of the talk about how much he hates fauci and he's losing patience with fauci and questions being asked about to fauci about trump being a liar and why don't you stand up to trump by the way if you ever get fauci in interview dumbest question you can ask at this point is what's your relationship with trump like who cares for Who cares?

00:24:46.000 As long as Trump is listening to him, that's all that matters.

00:24:49.000 And why would you try to undermine that trust if you actually believe that Fauci has something to offer here?

00:24:53.000 By the way, again, Trump is mouthing openly his willingness to listen to both Fauci and Deborah Bix, the person who's heading his efforts here.

00:25:02.000 We'll get to President Trump praising Fauci.

00:25:04.000 Even as the media try to undermine that relationship in just one second. 0.53

00:25:07.000 And then we'll get to the big controversy of the day, which is Trump suggesting that at some point we're going to have to reopen the economy.

00:25:11.000 Which again, I have a hard time finding it, how this is in any way remotely controversial.

00:25:17.000 If he opens the economy on Friday, that's controversial.

00:25:20.000 But saying we're going to reconsider this thing every step of the way?

00:25:23.000 That's just called like being a president.

00:25:25.000 That's called being a politician, considering public policy.

00:25:27.000 We'll get to that in just one second.

00:25:30.000 Right now, we've got to avoid crowds any way that we can.

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00:26:53.000 Okay, so as I say, the media have been trying to foster some conflict between Trump and Fauci, but Trump publicly has been saying he's listening to Fauci.

00:27:00.000 Here's Trump yesterday.

00:27:01.000 He's very important to me, and I will be listening to him.

00:27:04.000 I'll be listening to Debra, who you just spoke to.

00:27:07.000 I'll be listening to other experts.

00:27:09.000 We have a lot of people that are very good at this.

00:27:13.000 And ultimately, it's a balancing act.

00:27:16.000 But, you know, the expression, we can do two things at one time.

00:27:21.000 And we've got an incredible country.

00:27:24.000 We have to keep it that way.

00:27:26.000 And that includes not just economics.

00:27:28.000 That also includes life and death.

00:27:32.000 Okay, so again, he is not going after Fauci.

00:27:35.000 He's actually, you know, he's actually praising Fauci there.

00:27:39.000 Also, Trump says that Fauci has not agreed to him.

00:27:42.000 So now we get into the big issue of the day.

00:27:44.000 And that is, how do we balance the needs of the vast majority of people who are not going to die of coronavirus and the needs of the people who are going to suffer from coronavirus?

00:27:53.000 How exactly do we balance the needs of the health system and the needs of our economy? 0.88

00:27:57.000 These are not separate issues.

00:27:58.000 Okay, so President Trump, Was raked over the coals by large swaths of the media yesterday for saying he is not looking at a months-long shutdown.

00:28:05.000 Now again, I don't know how this is remotely controversial.

00:28:07.000 Okay, if the US economy were to shut for literally three or four months, that would not be something the United States could recover from.

00:28:14.000 Truly.

00:28:14.000 Because right now we're pumping and nobody's buying the bonds.

00:28:17.000 The only way to do this would be to inflate the currency tremendously.

00:28:20.000 You can only have the government backing every bit of commercial business Commercial bonds for so long.

00:28:26.000 The Fed pumping yesterday did not help the market.

00:28:28.000 I'll tell you what did help the market this morning was the open conversation that is now happening about when this thing comes to an end.

00:28:34.000 And that's a conversation that needs to be had.

00:28:36.000 Now I've been urging people at the White House, I've been saying for a long time on the show that what we need here is a metric of when it is possible for people to go back to work.

00:28:42.000 That does not mean that the metric is hit on Friday.

00:28:44.000 It does not mean it's time to go back to work on Monday.

00:28:47.000 What it does mean is that we have to start considering at which point that line of medical supplies rises above the flattened curve.

00:28:54.000 Right?

00:28:54.000 That is what we are talking about.

00:28:55.000 Because so far we've heard no metric from Andrew Cuomo in New York, no metric from Gavin Newsom, no metric from the federal government as to when we can expect that the resources that are necessary will be available such that when we all go back out to work and there's a second wave of infections, which is what you're starting to see in Asia right now, that there'll be enough ventilators and beds on hand to take care of that so we can all go back to work When are the tests going to be available?

00:29:16.000 When are tests going to be widespread and available such that we can use 75,000 tests a day, 100,000 tests a day, and we can all get back to work?

00:29:23.000 We can start to use social distancing and masks in order to allow us to go back to our daily life and back to our jobs gradually as we move toward a vaccine.

00:29:32.000 What do we have to do in order so that we can up the amount of resources necessary so we can Cordon off the vulnerable populations from the non-vulnerable populations and contact trace all of the people who have actually had coronavirus, which is exactly what's happening in South Korea. 0.97

00:29:47.000 So when President Trump says, we're not looking at months here, that's good because if you were just watching the headlines right now, if you're the market and you're just watching the headlines, the market is just the aggregate of human knowledge about the economy, and you're watching the headlines.

00:29:59.000 And on the one hand, you have Andrew Cuomo saying this thing could last nine months.

00:30:02.000 And on the other hand, you have Fauci saying this thing could last 12 weeks.

00:30:04.000 And you have Mnuchin saying it could last eight weeks.

00:30:06.000 And then you have President Trump coming out and saying, look, I'm not looking at months.

00:30:09.000 This is not going to last for months.

00:30:11.000 People start to breathe a sigh of relief because they think, OK, my business cannot last another three months with no income.

00:30:16.000 My business cannot last another three months on the basis of small business loans provided by the federal government or grants provided by the federal government.

00:30:23.000 How can my business remain open?

00:30:25.000 Eventually, this thing has to open back up.

00:30:27.000 Otherwise, I'm not going to invest in my business.

00:30:28.000 I'm just going to sit home, and I'll take the unemployment insurance instead.

00:30:31.000 Turns out that running a business is a very risky enterprise, very stressful.

00:30:34.000 You know what's easier is if they are sending you a check in the amount of how much money you were making before, and you don't have to run the business, then that is less stressful and easier, especially if you don't know what's going to come out on the other end of all of that, right?

00:30:48.000 There's a lot of uncertainty in the economy right now, and Trump trying to provide some sort of timeline here is actually quite necessary.

00:30:53.000 So yesterday, Trump says, I'm not looking at months, and people went nuts.

00:30:55.000 Here was Trump yesterday.

00:30:56.000 I'm not looking at months, I can tell you right now.

00:30:59.000 We're going to be opening up our country, and we're going to be watching certain areas, and we're going to be practicing everything that Deborah's referring to right here.

00:31:09.000 We're going to be watching this very closely, but you can't keep it closed for the next, you know, for years, okay?

00:31:17.000 This is going away.

00:31:18.000 We're going to win the battle.

00:31:21.000 And then Trump came out.

00:31:21.000 Okay.

00:31:22.000 He said, listen, we don't say no more driving of cars.

00:31:25.000 Like we're, we're going to have to have some sort of public policy discussion about what level of risk is attendant on reopening the economy.

00:31:31.000 People went nuts over this.

00:31:32.000 How could he equate this to car accidents?

00:31:34.000 How could he equate this to the flu? 1.00

00:31:36.000 It's not an equation, it's an analogy, you idiots. 1.00

00:31:39.000 Okay? 1.00

00:31:40.000 Every public policy decision comes with risks, and it comes with benefits.

00:31:43.000 This does not mean, I've said this 1,000 times during the show, this does not mean, go out, enjoy yourself, spring break party time.

00:31:49.000 No one is saying that.

00:31:50.000 And, I am not saying, for one, that we should reopen the economy on Friday, because I don't think that that would be beneficial.

00:31:55.000 Frankly, I think that if the risks are still as great as they are right now with coronavirus, and we are still as low in terms of data as we are right now, Then the economy being reopened is actually not going to help the economy.

00:32:05.000 Nobody's going to go back to restaurants at this point.

00:32:07.000 Nobody's going to go out to theme parks.

00:32:08.000 Nobody is going to go back to work if they can afford to stay home at this point, right?

00:32:13.000 So just saying, quote unquote, the economy is reopened tomorrow does not mean the economy is going to just zoom and take off and everybody's going to start going and spending tons of money.

00:32:20.000 A lot of people are risk averse and are going to stay home.

00:32:22.000 So until this thing is actually tamped down to the extent that we feel some level of confidence that huge swaths of humanity are not going to die, the economy is not going to recover.

00:32:33.000 But, when Trump says, we don't say no more driving of cars, this of course is accurate.

00:32:36.000 And people who are going nuts over this are being deliberately dishonest about this.

00:32:39.000 We have a very active flu season.

00:32:42.000 More active than most.

00:32:44.000 It's looking like it's heading to 50,000 or more deaths.

00:32:47.000 Deaths, not cases.

00:32:48.000 50,000 deaths.

00:32:51.000 Uh, which is, uh, that's a lot.

00:32:54.000 And you look at automobile accidents, which are far greater than any numbers we're talking about.

00:33:00.000 That doesn't mean we're going to tell everybody no more driving of cars.

00:33:04.000 So we have to do things to get our country open.

00:33:10.000 And again, all of that is true.

00:33:11.000 And he's not saying, I'm going to reopen the economy on Friday.

00:33:14.000 I think the media are trying to play this up specifically so that they can play up the clicks, the conflict between him and Fauci, the clicks about people ingesting fish tank cleaner, the clicks about Trump is going to buck all the advisors and simply say, go back to work on Monday.

00:33:27.000 There's no evidence that that's what's going to happen on Friday.

00:33:29.000 Okay, but considering these things is not out of the realm of possibility.

00:33:33.000 Even the most ardent shut-it-down people like Andrew Cuomo in New York, even he's admitting this is not a science and it's not even an art.

00:33:40.000 We're just kind of blindly groping around in the dark until we get further data, which is to suggest that as we get further data, we're going to have to figure out how to get out of this.

00:33:47.000 Here was Andrew Cuomo saying there was no art to what we did in New York.

00:33:49.000 We may have even taken the wrong measures in shutting down schools.

00:33:52.000 There is an art form here which is overlaying a public health strategy and an economic strategy.

00:34:00.000 In other words, what we did is we just closed everything down as quickly as we could.

00:34:05.000 Just shut all the doors, border all the windows.

00:34:09.000 There was no art to what we did.

00:34:10.000 There was no nuance.

00:34:12.000 Is there a public health strategy that says, look, You can start to bring young people back to work.

00:34:19.000 You can start to test and find out who had the virus and who resolved from the virus, and they can start to go back to work.

00:34:26.000 And that's how we'll restart the economy with a smart public health strategy.

00:34:32.000 Okay, and he's saying the same thing as Trump is.

00:34:34.000 He's just saying it in more nuanced form, right?

00:34:35.000 He's saying, at a certain point, we're going to have to reopen this thing up, and that cannot be forever, okay?

00:34:40.000 And that means that we're going to have to talk tough risks.

00:34:43.000 We're going to have to talk about what is the level of risk, because there is no world where there are no more deaths from coronavirus over the course of the rest of the year, particularly in a second wave that's going to happen in fall, as most epidemiologists are predicting at this point.

00:34:56.000 So to pretend that we're not going to have these discussions is really, really ridiculous.

00:35:01.000 Now, that doesn't mean the discussion has to be had in the dumbest possible way, but I think everybody is looking to be outraged because that's sort of our usual mode. 0.91

00:35:08.000 The usual mode is looking for rationales to be outraged.

00:35:10.000 In the world of politics, this is how people make a buck, is to be outraged all the time.

00:35:15.000 Let's all just acknowledge We're all groping blindly.

00:35:18.000 There is no grand strategy at this point.

00:35:21.000 Until there's more data, we don't know what to do.

00:35:23.000 But these are conversations that must be ongoing as we add data to this matrix.

00:35:26.000 We can figure out, maybe, what is the best thing to do.

00:35:30.000 And people are going to articulate this in brusque ways.

00:35:33.000 They're going to articulate these problems in awkward ways.

00:35:36.000 And that doesn't mean that they're saying some... They're not looking for old people to die on the one hand, or for the economy to be completely killed on the other.

00:35:43.000 Nobody has a good answer here.

00:35:44.000 So, last night, Texas Lieutenant Governor Dan Patrick was raked over the coals because he was suggesting that at some point we're going to have to reopen the economy, and when that happens, then older people are going to be at more risk.

00:35:53.000 Which, by the way, is 100% true, right?

00:35:55.000 I mean, that part is true. 0.62

00:35:56.000 He phrased it in a very awkward way, but it happens to be 100% true.

00:35:59.000 I mean, my own parents have said to me, listen, if this meant that we'd have to basically stay in the House for the next 18 months so that the economy could be revived, then we would do it.

00:36:07.000 Right.

00:36:08.000 The problem is right now that that won't work.

00:36:09.000 But in the near future, that may be something that that has to be considered.

00:36:13.000 I mean, that's what they're doing in South Korea, effectively speaking.

00:36:15.000 Here is Texas Lieutenant Governor Dan Patrick, who's ripped up and down for this last night.

00:36:18.000 No one reached out to me and said as a senior citizen, are you willing to take a chance on your survival in exchange for keeping the America that all America loves for your children and grandchildren?

00:36:34.000 And if that's the exchange, I'm all in.

00:36:37.000 And that doesn't make me noble or brave or anything like that.

00:36:40.000 I just think there are lots of grandparents out there in this country like me, I have six grandchildren, that what we all care about and what we love more than anything are those children.

00:36:51.000 Okay, so, you know, what he is saying may not be relevant at this moment, right, where he is saying, okay, open it right back up.

00:36:57.000 He seems to be saying, open it right back up and I'll take the risk.

00:36:59.000 Okay, that's not his risk to take.

00:37:00.000 I mean, there are a lot of elderly people in the country.

00:37:02.000 He's not the only one, but in the near future, these are conversations we are going to have to have.

00:37:07.000 And when I see headlines like this one from a guy I like, Matt Lewis, Over at the Daily Beast. 0.67

00:37:11.000 I mean, this is a ridiculous headline.

00:37:13.000 I'm sorry. 0.99

00:37:13.000 The Party of Life Embraces Trump's Death Cult? 0.99

00:37:16.000 We've skipped over any nuanced discussion of economic considerations straight to the part where Republicans rationalize letting a million or so people die to fix the economy.

00:37:23.000 Nobody is talking about letting a million people die to fix the economy.

00:37:27.000 Okay, first of all, we don't know a million people are going to die anyway.

00:37:30.000 These are all estimates.

00:37:31.000 We don't know the answers to this stuff because we don't have enough data.

00:37:34.000 If you asked epidemiologists, what level of certainty do you have that a million people are going to die in the United States?

00:37:40.000 My guess is that most epidemiologists would suggest not a 100% level of certainty, probably not even a 70% level of certainty.

00:37:46.000 We are all guessing.

00:37:48.000 Now, epidemiologists may have better models than we do, and they may have better models as to how the system gets overwhelmed and how many people die, but there is no level of certainty given the fact that all of this is fluid and we are taking measures on the ground as we speak.

00:38:01.000 These are conversations that we are going to have to have, and we're gonna have to have them sooner rather than later, because there had best be a plan.

00:38:06.000 And the reason, again, that the economy is jumping again today, well, not the economy, the stock market is jumping again today, is because people are starting to say, okay, at least we're having rational conversations.

00:38:15.000 Because if the conversation is we shut this whole thing down until coronavirus is off the face of the earth, we're talking about not an economic depression, we're talking about an economic asteroid hitting the earth and wiping out all forms of economic life.

00:38:27.000 Because you're talking 12 to 18 months until there is a vaccine.

00:38:30.000 And again, the data that's coming in, we just don't know how reliable any of this data is.

00:38:36.000 So, you know, I'm saying the most annoying thing that is possible to say in this circumstance, which is I don't know the answer.

00:38:40.000 You don't know the answer either.

00:38:41.000 Trump doesn't know the answer.

00:38:43.000 Fauci doesn't know the answer.

00:38:44.000 Nobody knows the answer.

00:38:45.000 All we have is a formula with a bunch of variables.

00:38:48.000 And as those variables get filled in, then hopefully we can start figuring out what that equals sign looks like on the other side of the ledger.

00:38:55.000 Right, we don't know anything yet.

00:38:57.000 So right now this is all a data gathering exercise.

00:39:00.000 In the meantime, we are gonna have to have a discussion about when exactly that equals sign is low enough in terms of death rate that we can all start to move back into working.

00:39:11.000 So the reason I bring this up is because there are a couple of different theories about how exactly we should go back to work.

00:39:18.000 One comes courtesy of Scott Gottlieb, who's the former FDA director for President Trump.

00:39:21.000 He's been a very critical voice in terms of everything should shut down.

00:39:24.000 We need enormous amounts of testing.

00:39:26.000 And then there's Ezekiel Emanuel, who is also suggesting lockdowns.

00:39:30.000 We'll bring you their opinions right now.

00:39:31.000 Ezekiel Emanuel's kind of an Obama guy, and Gottlieb is sort of a Trump guy.

00:39:35.000 But even that, listen, I think this is a necessary conversation.

00:39:38.000 I think it's a good conversation to have.

00:39:40.000 People are treating it as unaskable.

00:39:41.000 I don't think it's unaskable.

00:39:42.000 I think it's very much askable and necessary to ask.

00:39:44.000 And that is, when do people go back to work and what is the metric for when people go back to work?

00:39:48.000 We're going to get to that in just one second.

00:39:51.000 But if you haven't had a chance to see some of our new content called All Access Live, you should head over to dailywire.com and go check it out right now.

00:39:57.000 Jeremy Boring and I kicked it off last week.

00:39:58.000 All of the other hosted live streams over at dailywire.com as well.

00:40:01.000 We're going to continue all this week at 5 p.m.

00:40:03.000 Pacific.

00:40:04.000 All Access Live, it's pretty chill.

00:40:06.000 I mean, so chill that I was wearing a short-sleeved shirt yesterday.

00:40:08.000 I know.

00:40:09.000 Unthinkable.

00:40:10.000 But you could have hung out with me.

00:40:11.000 I was literally just playing classical music off of my cell phone so that you could hear some of the pieces that I like and answering questions about apparently their fan clubs devoted to how good-looking I am.

00:40:22.000 I mean, I know because I'm the only member, but apparently I find these things out during things like All Access Live.

00:40:27.000 The show is intended for our All Access members, but during this pandemic shutdown, We are all going to hang out together.

00:40:33.000 So as long as you are a member of any sort, you get to access All Access Live.

00:40:36.000 Please let us know what you think of it.

00:40:37.000 I think people are enjoying it.

00:40:38.000 We had like thousands and thousands and thousands of questions that were input yesterday.

00:40:42.000 Join us on All Access Live over at dailywire.com.

00:40:45.000 Come hang out with us.

00:40:46.000 I'm trying to, who's going tonight?

00:40:47.000 Do we know who's doing tonight?

00:40:49.000 Knowles is doing it tonight.

00:40:50.000 Okay, so Knowles is doing an All Access Live tonight.

00:40:53.000 I am back on Friday is the plan, barring some sort of exigent circumstances.

00:40:57.000 So You know, stick around for all of that.

00:40:59.000 We have all sorts of material.

00:41:00.000 We're all going to hang out together.

00:41:01.000 We'll last this thing out.

00:41:03.000 And as I said, I think that this is going to be weeks, not months, before we start to figure out a transition plan.

00:41:09.000 But stick with us while we do that over at Daily Wire.

00:41:11.000 You're listening to the largest, fastest growing conservative podcast and radio show in the nation.

00:41:15.000 So Trump getting ripped up and down for the suggestion that we may have to reopen the economy in weeks, not months.

00:41:26.000 But it's opened the conversation.

00:41:28.000 I think that's actually a very, very good thing.

00:41:30.000 By the way, again, the markets think that's a very good thing too, because finally somebody is taking seriously that side of the concern, right?

00:41:36.000 The market was up 8% in early trading, like over 1,600 points in early trading.

00:41:41.000 And that is because people are starting to say, okay, well, this won't last forever.

00:41:45.000 Okay, we don't know what the date certain is when we get off the bench and get back in the game, but it is not going to last forever.

00:41:50.000 Scott Gottlieb has an optimistic piece over the Wall Street Journal.

00:41:53.000 He says, soon the United States will be able to do 75,000 tests a day that will make changes in strategy possible.

00:41:58.000 He says, first, the bad news.

00:41:59.000 America's coronavirus epidemic is only beginning.

00:42:01.000 The suffering will become more searing over the next two weeks.

00:42:03.000 Hospitals in New York may soon be overwhelmed.

00:42:05.000 New Orleans, Chicago, San Francisco, Seattle may not be far behind.

00:42:08.000 It will soon be clear why COVID-19 cannot be allowed to rage through the country untamed.

00:42:13.000 Intense restrictions are necessary, but so is a path back to a more normal life.

00:42:17.000 Here's what the priorities should be in the coming weeks.

00:42:19.000 Containment is no longer realistic in some areas of the United States.

00:42:22.000 In other places, it may be possible.

00:42:23.000 As public health authorities learn more about infection rates in different parts of the country, governments can tailor strategies to the facts on the ground.

00:42:29.000 There's a trade-off between mitigation strategies, which target large populations like sheltering in place, and interventions that try to isolate people who are infected or who might have been exposed.

00:42:38.000 Population tactics are blunt instruments necessary for isolating hotspots like New York and Seattle.

00:42:43.000 Other places may be able to rely more on individual interventions, Which do cause less disruption and economic damage.

00:42:49.000 Every state should be taking steps such as encouraging social distancing, preparing to expand hospital capacity.

00:42:55.000 Some have been too slow to respond, but for any of this to work, the United States needs widespread testing to know where and to what extent the virus is spreading.

00:43:02.000 Testing capacity, says Scott Gottlieb, has increased significantly in the past few weeks thanks to relentless efforts from public academic private labs such as Quest and LabCorp.

00:43:10.000 A good reminder that nationalization of industry is a dumb idea, generally speaking.

00:43:14.000 A new test developed by Cepheid can be deployed in a doctor's office. 0.93

00:43:17.000 There are people who are talking about Being able to get test results within a couple of hours or at home tests being available too.

00:43:22.000 By the end of next week, the US will have the capacity in place to screen more than 75,000 people a day.

00:43:27.000 South Korea tested 1 in 160 of its people and deployed technology to identify people who are infected and trace content.

00:43:33.000 The US should do the same.

00:43:34.000 Another step!

00:43:35.000 Serological surveillance, which means blood tests to detect antibodies developed to fight the novel coronavirus, which means that if you've got those antibodies, you're already immune.

00:43:43.000 These antibodies confirm immunity, can reveal whether a person has been exposed.

00:43:46.000 If a sizable portion of a local community has some protection, authorities can be more confident in relying on less invasive measures.

00:43:52.000 One of the problems with lack of testing and lack of serological content is, again, we don't know who's had it and who's already immune.

00:43:58.000 It may be literally hundreds of thousands of people in the United States.

00:44:01.000 More important is developing a therapy to treat COVID-19 or perhaps prevent people from contracting it.

00:44:06.000 America is home to a vast dynamic life science industry.

00:44:08.000 This is its moment.

00:44:10.000 One strategy would be to infuse convalescent plasma antibodies from the blood of patients who have recovered from COVID-19.

00:44:16.000 This could help boost the immune response in those recently infected.

00:44:19.000 Arturo Casadevall of Johns Hopkins outlined such an approach in these pages last month.

00:44:23.000 Perhaps the most promising option is antibody drugs engineered by biotech companies, a strategy that was used with success against Ebola.

00:44:29.000 Also, regulators need to leverage master protocols which allow providers to test multiple promising therapies in the same large trials.

00:44:36.000 He says, with the right mix of controlling transmission, expanding testing, and deploying promising drugs, American ingenuity can beat back this pathogen.

00:44:43.000 So, that is the conversation that needs to start.

00:44:46.000 Okay, let's do all this stuff, and how fast can we do all this stuff?

00:44:49.000 Ezekiel Emanuel is saying we have 14 days to defeat coronavirus.

00:44:53.000 He says America's losing the war right now against COVID-19, but we can win it with decisive and extraordinary actions right now.

00:44:58.000 By the way, again, I admire the tenacity of people who say that it is very, very bad to discuss public health trade-offs.

00:45:03.000 While quoting Ezekiel Emanuel, the Obamacare advisor who once suggested that we ought to minimize treatment for people over age 80 in order to save medical resources for people who are under age 80.

00:45:12.000 Okay, I'm not making that up.

00:45:13.000 He wrote that for The Atlantic talking about why he wouldn't mind dying at 80.

00:45:17.000 Okay, so now the same people who had no problem having these discussions about trade-offs with regard to nationalized healthcare are very unhappy to discuss any sort of trade-offs whatsoever with regard to American economic response to pandemics.

00:45:29.000 Ezekiel Emanuel says that the economy can't be fixed without solving the pandemic, which, as I mentioned before, is true.

00:45:35.000 But if you just open the economy right now, people aren't going to go back to work and not socially distance.

00:45:38.000 We're all freaked out.

00:45:40.000 He says the window to win the war is about 7 to 14 days.

00:45:42.000 If the United States intervenes immediately on the scale China did, our death toll could be under 100,000.

00:45:47.000 Within 3 to 4 months, we might be able to begin to return to more normal lives.

00:45:51.000 Now again, that seems like a pretty steep estimate.

00:45:53.000 Under 100,000 when we have less than 600 deaths in the United States total.

00:45:57.000 At this point, but again, that's how exponential growth works, presumably.

00:46:00.000 Ezekiel Emanuel says affected states have led the way by closing schools, bars, restaurants, non-essential businesses, by issuing shelter-in-place orders.

00:46:09.000 This isn't uniform across the country, but it needs to be, at least for the moment.

00:46:13.000 And there needs to be social pressure for local governments to wield to enforce physical distancing strictly, but compassionately.

00:46:20.000 And mayors should close streets to vehicular traffic to make them pedestrian spaces so people can be at a safe distance.

00:46:25.000 Also, the president must be honest with the American people that the CDC, FDA, other agencies did not roll out testing quickly enough.

00:46:31.000 That's true.

00:46:32.000 But we also need to ramp that stuff up very quickly.

00:46:35.000 We have to conduct random samplings of people to determine the percentage of population with coronavirus and the percentage of people with the virus who die.

00:46:41.000 With those stats, we have better data.

00:46:43.000 We need better equipment production, says Ezekiel Emanuel.

00:46:45.000 We need hospitals to up their capacity.

00:46:49.000 We need visitors to be banned at these hospitals.

00:46:53.000 We need businesses to retain workers and keep up their facilities so they can rapidly return to operation when COVID-19 is under control.

00:47:00.000 So everybody's now having the right conversations, okay?

00:47:02.000 So this is the optimistic side of me.

00:47:04.000 Everybody is now having the correct conversations.

00:47:06.000 And yes, Trump is having that right conversation too.

00:47:08.000 It is not an unaskable question.

00:47:10.000 It is not a bad question to say, when does the economy reopen?

00:47:13.000 In fact, that is the exact question that is going to lead to the ramping up of resources necessary for the economy to reopen.

00:47:18.000 If you care about the economy reopening, then you really have no choice but to discuss what are the costs of the economy reopening?

00:47:25.000 How do we make the economy robust when it does reopen?

00:47:27.000 How do we get all the resources necessary so the economy can reopen?

00:47:30.000 Trump is right to think in these terms.

00:47:32.000 He is correct to think in these terms.

00:47:34.000 I am glad that President Trump is a business person and he is not a nationalize everything, lockdown everything until further notice guy.

00:47:39.000 Because that's not what the government should be doing.

00:47:41.000 This is the greatest work stoppage in the history of America.

00:47:44.000 It is not close.

00:47:45.000 It really is not.

00:47:46.000 And if we are not thinking already about what is the path to get out of this thing, then we are not doing enough.

00:47:51.000 That does not mean we reopen it tomorrow.

00:47:53.000 And despite the media, again, trying to foster divisions between Trump and Fauci, and despite people suggesting, let's just open this, like, I have really not seen, I think there's a bit of strawmanning going on.

00:48:02.000 I've not seen a ton of people saying, reopen this thing up today.

00:48:06.000 Like, reopen it completely today.

00:48:08.000 I think everybody understands that we don't have enough data to do that.

00:48:10.000 But the people on the other side who say that conversation is verboten.

00:48:13.000 You can't even have that conversation? 0.97

00:48:15.000 That's a ridiculous strawmanning too. 0.98

00:48:17.000 Because, like, come on. 0.98

00:48:19.000 Come on.

00:48:20.000 Of course we have to have that conversation.

00:48:21.000 We're talking about the greatest public policy, either failure or success, in the history of the world right now.

00:48:27.000 Of course we have to have conversations about what metrics we can use in terms of what risks are we willing to take as a society.

00:48:33.000 I feel like I'm beating a dead horse here, but obviously it's not a dead horse because everybody is too busy going nuts over President Trump and his supposed gall in suggesting that we ought to take into consideration the economy in having these discussions.

00:48:44.000 It is not a bad thing to ask that question.

00:48:46.000 It is a very good thing to ask that question.

00:48:48.000 The only bad thing would be if we get the wrong answer to a very, very obvious question.

00:48:52.000 Okay, meanwhile...

00:48:53.000 The United States Senate continues to have this ridiculous debate over a Senate bill.

00:48:59.000 Now there are problems with the Republican Senate bill that was proposed by Mitch McConnell. 0.99

00:49:02.000 The bipartisan bill that was pushed at the end of last week that Chuck Schumer declared bipartisan and then immediately reversed because apparently Nancy Pelosi had his balls in her handbag. 0.90

00:49:10.000 She showed up from vacation.

00:49:12.000 Chuck Schumer was ready to sign this thing. 0.98

00:49:13.000 She shows up and she's like, I want a bunch of random bullcrap. 1.00

00:49:16.000 And he's like, Okay. 0.95

00:49:18.000 Okay, sure.

00:49:19.000 We'll do random bullcrap now.

00:49:20.000 And so, Pelosi just rejected the Republican bill out of hand, even though it had been worked on by members of both parties.

00:49:26.000 And then, Schumer had basically become her minion, shutting down people from having discussions of this Republican bill, filibustering the bill in, I believe, three separate votes yesterday.

00:49:36.000 And it's absurd. 0.99

00:49:37.000 Because Nancy Pelosi's bill is just a pork barrel bag of garbage. 1.00

00:49:40.000 It really is. 0.96

00:49:42.000 Now listen, you can have a reasonable conversation about the oversight provisions on the loans to be provided by the Treasury Department.

00:49:47.000 Honestly, my preference is zero interest loans given to the banks that are already handing out those loans.

00:49:52.000 I mean, I think that right now the banks are in best position to determine which businesses are going to survive and which businesses are not on the other end of this.

00:50:00.000 And backing the loans that the banks are giving, such that they don't call those in immediately, would be the best available move.

00:50:05.000 I don't like politicians who have no expertise on the economy whatsoever, no expertise in running businesses, 0.92

00:50:10.000 I don't want them deciding how this money gets handed out, neither do I really want the Treasury Secretary determining how the money gets sent out, which is why I sort of support the idea of the government, yes, creating a slush fund that is basically a backstop for the banks, because they're the ones who have undertaken the risk, and the risks they undertake are likely to be smarter than the risks undertaken by either Treasury Secretary Mnuchin or the morons in Congress who can't tie their shoes. 0.97

00:50:37.000 But, with that said, that was not the debate the Democrats were having.

00:50:42.000 The debate the Democrats were having was a completely different debate.

00:50:45.000 So, this truly is incredible.

00:50:49.000 What were some of the things that Nancy Pelosi wanted in this new bill?

00:50:52.000 What were some of those things?

00:50:54.000 Here are some of the new things that Nancy Pelosi wanted in the bill.

00:50:56.000 She wanted $33,200,000 for the National Oceanographic and Atmospheric Association.

00:51:04.000 That's what she wanted.

00:51:05.000 She wanted $33 million in this, and we have to hold up American aid so that we can fund global warming research. 0.98

00:51:11.000 She wanted $100 million for NASA in this bill and $100 million for construction and environmental compliance.

00:51:18.000 What does this have to do with shoring up the economy for purposes of preventing a coronavirus-induced economic meltdown?

00:51:25.000 She wants $278 million for the IRS.

00:51:29.000 $300 million in this bill for the IRS and Nancy Pelosi's version of this bill.

00:51:33.000 She wanted $35 million for the JFK Performing Arts Center in this bill.

00:51:38.000 She's going to shut down and hold up the American economy so that we can fund the JFK Performing Arts Center. 1.00

00:51:43.000 Deeply vital stuff for people who are lacking ventilators right now and for small businesses that are on the verge of shutting down and going bankrupt and never reopening their doors.

00:51:50.000 She wanted $90 million for an HIV program in a coronavirus bill. 1.00

00:51:56.000 She wanted $36 million for the National Center for Advancing Translational Sciences.

00:52:03.000 What the hell is the National Center for Advancing Translational Sciences?

00:52:07.000 What?

00:52:08.000 She wanted $7 million for a specific DC charter school like Gallaudet University.

00:52:14.000 Howard University, she wants $23 million for them.

00:52:18.000 By the way, Howard University has an endowment of $647 million.

00:52:21.000 She wanted $300 million for the Corporation for Public Broadcasting.

00:52:24.000 We definitely need to make sure that Big Bird survives coronavirus here.

00:52:28.000 Very, very important stuff from Nancy Pelosi.

00:52:30.000 And $500 million for the Institute of Museum and Library Services.

00:52:34.000 By the way, kudos to a Twitter account called Oilfield Rando who has gone through all of this stuff.

00:52:40.000 A million dollars for the sergeant-at-arms and doorkeeper of the Senate.

00:52:44.000 Very vital, very vital stuff.

00:52:46.000 $300 million for migration and refugee assistance.

00:52:49.000 Because we definitely need to worry about migration and refugee assistance as we close every border we could possibly have. 1.00

00:52:56.000 And also, we need to use more minority banks.

00:52:58.000 Expansion of the use of minority banks and minority credit unions is mandated in Pelosi's bill.

00:53:02.000 We need corporate boards to have diversity quotas if they are to receive loans.

00:53:07.000 So that's exciting stuff.

00:53:08.000 The government is going to force people onto your corporate board if you take a loan that you have to take because the government shut down your business.

00:53:15.000 If federal agencies use any banks owned by white people, they have to explain themselves.

00:53:20.000 Seriously.

00:53:21.000 The feds are going to buy $300 million worth of food and then redistribute it.

00:53:26.000 I can't imagine that they're going to be great at that.

00:53:28.000 Also, there's going to be another committee, the Coronavirus Accountability and Transparency Committee.

00:53:34.000 Also, we need E-rate support for Wi-Fi hotspot and connected devices.

00:53:39.000 I mean, this is just, I'm sorry, this is ridiculous.

00:53:42.000 Also, we need federal election oversight.

00:53:44.000 Very important to have in a coronavirus bill.

00:53:47.000 Okay, so all of this led the Senate to absolutely explode last night.

00:53:51.000 Ben Sasse, Senator from Nebraska, he says, Nancy Pelosi is basically taking hostages here. 0.99

00:53:55.000 I mean, all she is doing here is holding up the business of the American people. 0.99

00:54:00.000 After a directed government shutdown in order to get her policy priorities.

00:54:03.000 By the way, they're not hiding this, right?

00:54:04.000 Representative Jim Clyburn from South Carolina.

00:54:07.000 He openly said this.

00:54:07.000 He said that we can use this to push our priorities.

00:54:09.000 Here's Ben Sasse saying Pelosi's taking hostages.

00:54:12.000 We got families that are suffering.

00:54:13.000 We got small businesses that are closing literally by the hour.

00:54:17.000 We have doctors fighting to prevent their hospitals from being over surged and overwhelmed.

00:54:22.000 And what is Speaker Pelosi trying to do?

00:54:25.000 She's trying to take hostages about her dream legislation, all sorts of dream legislative provisions that have nothing to do with this moment, and say the American public can't get access to the public health piece of legislation or the economic relief pieces of legislation unless she gets hostages that are entirely unrelated to this moment. 0.92

00:54:46.000 We're better than that.

00:54:47.000 Okay, that of course is true.

00:54:48.000 Senator John Kennedy from Louisiana, he said, I mean, he was more blunt.

00:54:52.000 He said, listen, some of my colleagues here, they're just acting like a-holes. 0.77

00:54:54.000 I mean, frankly, they're just holding this thing up for political purposes.

00:54:58.000 And it is amazing the media coverage, what the media will do to defend Democrats.

00:55:01.000 Here was Senator Kennedy yesterday going off on the Democrats.

00:55:04.000 People are losing their jobs.

00:55:07.000 They're losing their savings.

00:55:09.000 They're losing the 401k.

00:55:11.000 We think we know how to get the economy back on its feet over the next 60 to 90 days until we can get control of the virus.

00:55:23.000 And some of my colleagues, they're acting like a-holes.

00:55:28.000 I'm sorry, I'm not saying they mean to, but nonetheless, they're killing it.

00:55:33.000 I mean, obviously that's true.

00:55:34.000 Senator Lindsey Graham, who again is a fairly moderate senator, he says Democrats are obviously trying to prioritize things that do not involve the saving of the United States economy at this point.

00:55:41.000 Look.

00:55:42.000 You drive a car through my living room wall.

00:55:45.000 You then have to reimburse me for the cost of driving through my living room wall.

00:55:49.000 And that is the first priority.

00:55:50.000 And I don't want to hear from you how I damaged your paint job.

00:55:54.000 I don't want to hear from you your alternative priorities.

00:55:56.000 Here's Lindsey Graham going off. 0.73

00:55:58.000 I mean, again, when you've pissed off Lindsey Graham and Susan Collins, it's hard to find a more sort of wishy-washy contingent than that on this in general, in terms of fighting Democrats hand to hand.

00:56:09.000 Here's Lindsey Graham saying Democrats have other priorities, not saving the American people at this point.

00:56:14.000 You see this as an opportunity to do things you couldn't do otherwise.

00:56:20.000 Republicans see this as an opportunity to do things that have to be done now to save lives.

00:56:30.000 I have never been more disgusted since Kavanaugh.

00:56:37.000 You tried to destroy a good man's life just to keep the seat open.

00:56:42.000 And close friends of mine in the House have publicly said this is an opportunity to reshape the country in our image.

00:56:51.000 It's not going to happen.

00:56:54.000 Susan Collins was shut down on the floor of the Senate yesterday, right?

00:56:57.000 She's as moderate as it comes and Susan Collins was shut down.

00:56:59.000 She just wanted to say something and Schumer prevented her from saying anything about the Republican bill that was being proposed.

00:57:05.000 The Democratic leader objected to my even being able to speak this morning?

00:57:13.000 Is that what we've come to?

00:57:16.000 The Democratic leader objected to our convening at 9 o'clock this morning so that we could begin working in earnest?

00:57:27.000 How can that possibly be controversial?

00:57:32.000 How can any of us want to see millions of Americans lose their paychecks, their health insurance, their contributions to their retirement plans?

00:57:45.000 This led also to a great debate between Mitch McConnell and Joe Manchin.

00:57:48.000 Joe Manchin, of course, the senator from West Virginia.

00:57:50.000 And Manchin was saying, well, of course we're going to filibuster this thing because then you might pass the bill.

00:57:55.000 And McConnell was like, we're not even talking about a vote on the bill yet.

00:57:58.000 We're talking about a vote to hold a debate on the bill.

00:58:01.000 And you guys are filibustering that.

00:58:02.000 Here was Mitch McConnell getting very feisty with Joe Manchin.

00:58:04.000 Things were very hot in the Senate yesterday.

00:58:06.000 There's still 30 more hours.

00:58:07.000 We know that.

00:58:08.000 30 hours.

00:58:09.000 So in what way, I would ask my friend from West Virginia, would Your side be disadvantaged by that.

00:58:15.000 The American people are waiting for that today.

00:58:17.000 The House has laid it out very clearly, as she always does.

00:58:22.000 We don't have time for this.

00:58:24.000 We don't have time for it.

00:58:25.000 Let me ask you a question.

00:58:26.000 Answer my question.

00:58:27.000 In what way would the Democratic minority be disadvantaged?

00:58:31.000 Go ahead, Senator from West Virginia.

00:58:34.000 Okay, so again, it got very feisty yesterday.

00:58:36.000 Naturally, the New York Times blamed, you guessed it, the Republicans.

00:58:39.000 They blamed Mitch McConnell, the editorial board of the New York Times.

00:58:42.000 They said, Senator Mitch McConnell failed to do his job this weekend.

00:58:45.000 As the economy spiraled downward, McConnell, the Senate Majority Leader, said he'd produce a bipartisan bailout bill authorizing an infusion of desperately needed aid.

00:58:52.000 Instead, McConnell emerged on Sunday evening with a bill that would provide a lot of help for corporate executives and shareholders and not nearly enough for American workers. 0.97

00:58:59.000 Except that Chuck Schumer basically endorsed the damn thing on Saturday night. 0.82

00:59:02.000 Okay, the fact of the matter is that right now is not the time to wait on this stuff. 0.94

00:59:06.000 Right now, we need the help, we need the backstop of the economy, and we need the open conversation about when the economy reopens.

00:59:12.000 The fact that Democrats are putting on the table a pork-laden, three times as long bill that nobody has read, laden with crap like money for the JFK Center for Arts or whatever, it demonstrates the utter unseriousness of the people in Congress.

00:59:24.000 It's why the Federal Reserve has become basically the economic resort that everybody uses as a first resort, not a last resort.

00:59:31.000 Bottom line is this.

00:59:32.000 This is why you can't trust government to fix all your problems.

00:59:35.000 And when government imposes the problems, the question becomes, how fast can we get out of this alternative universe in which the government runs everything?

00:59:41.000 Because this really blows.

00:59:43.000 And I understand that the answer is not today.

00:59:45.000 When the answer is not tomorrow, the answer is probably not the end of this week or even the end of next week.

00:59:48.000 But it better be faster rather than slower.

00:59:50.000 Because if you think I want these dolts running the economy and the national healthcare response over the course of any long scale period of time, you have to have another thing coming.

00:59:58.000 This is insanity. 0.94

00:59:59.000 All right.

00:59:59.000 We'll be back here later today with two additional hours of content.

01:00:03.000 Otherwise, we'll see you here tomorrow for the latest updates.

01:00:05.000 I'm Ben Shapiro.

01:00:05.000 This is The Ben Shapiro Show.

01:00:11.000 The Ben Shapiro Show is produced by Colton Haas.

01:00:13.000 Directed by Mike Joyner.

01:00:14.000 Executive producer Jeremy Boring.

01:00:16.000 Supervising producer Mathis Glover and Robert Sterling.

01:00:19.000 Assistant director Pavel Lydowsky.

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01:00:23.000 Playback and media operated by Nick Sheehan.

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01:00:27.000 Edited by Adam Siovitz.

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01:00:32.000 The Ben Shapiro Show is a Daily Wire production.

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01:00:36.000 You know, the Matt Wall Show, it's not just another show about politics.

01:00:40.000 I think there are enough of those already out there.

01:00:42.000 We talk about culture, because culture drives politics, and it drives everything else.

01:00:46.000 So my main focuses are life, family, faith.

01:00:51.000 Those are fundamental, and that's what this show is about.

The Ben Shapiro Show - March 24, 2020

The Un-Askable Question | Ep. 978

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