The Blueprint: Canada's Conservative Podcast - Blueprint： Law & Order

00:00:00.000 Hello and welcome once again to the Blueprints. This is Canada's Conservative Podcast. I'm your

00:00:11.380 host, Jamie Schmael, Member of Parliament for Halliburton, Kawartha Lakes, Brock, with new

00:00:14.720 content for you. As always, every single Tuesday, 1.30 p.m. Eastern Time, we ask that you like,

00:00:19.180 comment, subscribe, and share this program. There are two ears that need to hear this message. You

00:00:24.540 can help us do that. We have a great show lined up for you. And don't forget, you can download this

00:00:28.940 content and listen to it at your convenience on platforms like CastBox, iTunes, Google Play,

00:00:33.880 and Spotify. The dynamic duo are back. We have the two gentlemen that always get great reviews

00:00:42.720 and great requests to come back on because we're talking about a very difficult subject right now,

00:00:49.560 something I think is really affecting people. So we have Glenn Motts, of course, Medicine Hat,

00:00:55.060 Cartston Warner, and we have Larry Brock, Brantford Brant. Thanks for coming back, gentlemen.

00:00:59.560 Great to be here.

00:01:00.000 All right. Excellent. Again, we keep talking about renaming the show. We may have to do this.

00:01:04.380 All right. Let's start over with, let's start off with the firearms issue. It's before Parliament,

00:01:09.320 as we speak, actually. We'll see 21 is being talked about. I was just watching the debate before coming

00:01:13.780 over here to the studio. And what is going on with that? That's a piece of firearms legislation. It's

00:01:18.760 deeply flawed. Tell us what's going on there.

00:01:20.640 Well, right at the moment, it's being debated at report stage in the House. It has been rammed

00:01:26.960 through at committee stage by a programming motion by the Liberals. They restricted debate,

00:01:32.100 restricted any sort of conversation or amendments to any of the government amendments and stuff

00:01:39.240 that were there. Five minutes per party. That's all we got to talk about each individual amendment.

00:01:45.000 Legislation this important, this critical to millions of Canadians and so deeply flawed requires full

00:01:53.600 democratic debate. And the Liberals just proved it again. A, they're out of touch with a flawed,

00:01:58.840 misguided bill and thwarting democracy when it comes to the whole idea of a limiting debate. And

00:02:06.060 they're limiting debate not only at committee. We sat, we had two midnight sittings. And then now at

00:02:12.520 the report stage and third reading, again, limiting debate as to get it rushed off to the Senate.

00:02:17.800 So I guess the most contentious issue was the, the complete, I guess, I don't even know how to

00:02:24.520 describe it, just complete focus on hunting rifles for the most part. They took that away. Thanks,

00:02:31.740 thanks for all the pressure that was caught. But they did it in a sneaky fashion now. It's still

00:02:36.080 pretty much there. Exactly. So what happened is Bill C-21 was debated in the House as a handgun freeze

00:02:43.220 and a few other things. Then in November, they introduced a bunch of new amendments, including

00:02:49.220 what the government called G-4 and G-46. And it provided a definition, a new definition for a

00:02:55.580 prohibited weapon that included shotguns and hunting rifles and the majority of them. And then a bunch of

00:03:02.640 other definitions as well. Pushback by Canadians. Thank you for those that are watching for your

00:03:07.740 pushback on that to the government. The government acquiesced and withdrew those amendments in early

00:03:12.780 February. We sat on Bill C-21 for probably almost two months until finally they came back with a new

00:03:20.720 definition of a prohibited weapon and other things again. But, you know, groups that came to the

00:03:27.020 committee said, listen, this bill is not going to improve public safety. The red flag laws that the

00:03:32.480 liberals and the NDP pushed through, we had Pauly Suvian and 20 other women's groups that said,

00:03:38.520 please don't pass red flag laws, which has a victim ex parte go to a judge and ask for, you know,

00:03:48.960 some remediation, firearm seizures, whatever it might be, let the police do their job. That's what

00:03:54.640 they're asking liberals to do. Oh, no. Liberals and the NDP gathered together to vote in support of that,

00:04:00.120 which is really, really bizarre. But anyway, that's where we're at. Again, this is a misguided

00:04:04.060 approach. It isn't going to improve public safety. Legal, law-abiding Canadians who own firearms are

00:04:10.460 not and have never been the problem with gun crime in this country. It's criminals who acquire firearms

00:04:17.240 illegally. The majority of crime guns in this country are smuggled in from the U.S. That's where the focus

00:04:22.200 should be, should focus on, you know, stopping the revolving door of justice, dealing with criminals and not

00:04:27.660 legal firearm owners and, you know, giving some resources to plug those holes.

00:04:31.600 If I could, if I could weigh in, just a moment on the red flag laws. I commend all the work that my

00:04:38.600 colleague, Mr. Moss, has done on this committee and those of our colleagues for really pushing this

00:04:44.520 issue and making some changes. But unfortunately, this bill is still flawed in so many significant

00:04:51.060 areas. That's to Glenn's point about public safety. I look at it from a legal lens. Everything that I do in

00:04:56.680 this house, I have that legal lens. And what they're doing is they're actually exacerbating and creating

00:05:02.760 to more of a backlog in our criminal justice system from coast to coast to coast. Already we are

00:05:09.560 suffering from the impacts of COVID in terms of scheduling trials. We, as you know, we've got a

00:05:15.740 Supreme Court of Canada decision named Jordan that mandates that trials be completed within so many

00:05:21.720 months, so many years, depending on the jurisdiction. Now we're going to have the floodgates open up with

00:05:27.340 all of these applications from legitimate and probably illegitimate complainants who just want to

00:05:34.860 exact a measure of revenge. It is going to just really tap our very limited resources in the justice

00:05:42.180 system already. Let the police do their job. Section 117 of the criminal code gives the police the powers

00:05:51.300 to enter a home, to remove a weapon, and to hold someone accountable for a period of time if there is

00:06:00.260 sufficient evidence to establish that this person is a harm to themselves or to others. The government did

00:06:07.260 not need to exacerbate that issue. It's frustrating, I think, to many law-abiding firearms owners that this

00:06:15.020 is going on, to having to watch this, but also to watch all the issues going on around our country.

00:06:21.500 And this is where the liberals decided to put their focus, right? We have drug use that's out of control,

00:06:27.500 inflation's through the roof. We have a housing crisis. We have crime that is up 32 percent, I saw,

00:06:34.540 and continues to go up. We have problems with our bail system. And the liberals say, you know how we're

00:06:40.300 going to fix this or take the focus off all of our failures? We are going to go after law-abiding

00:06:45.980 firearms owners. Like, how frustrating is that? And just smoke and mirrors. Like you said, you're not

00:06:52.540 going to solve the gang shootings. That's not going to stop. You're not going to stop the repeat violent

00:06:59.260 offenders. That's not going to stop. Criminals are already going to follow up.

00:07:03.100 Does it go deeper? Well, I guess it doesn't go deeper than that, right? Like, that's what I think

00:07:06.300 many people are wondering. Well, when will this government admit to Canadians that the lawful gun

00:07:14.540 owners are not the issue? They have never been the issue. They are not responsible for the 32 percent

00:07:23.580 uptick in violent crime across this country. This government needs to wake up and finally enforce

00:07:30.780 and secure our borders and to work with officials across the border to the United States to deal with

00:07:37.660 the illegal smuggling system that is so ingrained within that society. They're basically outsmarting

00:07:46.380 law enforcement. They're outsmarting politicians. That's where the illegal guns are flowing from. 0.99

00:07:52.140 Our ports. Another example is containers not being properly thoroughly searched. We've got drugs pouring

00:07:59.740 in across our borders, across our oceans, and now weapons. That's where the attention of this

00:08:06.940 government should be. That's where we differ. That's where a PolyEv-led conservative government 1.00

00:08:12.300 will put the resources where it's required. And one other one, in addition to that, Larry,

00:08:17.340 and thank you for that, is holding criminals accountable. When criminals get caught and get

00:08:23.980 charged with offenses, you know, the chances of them getting out on bail now, for whatever the offense is,

00:08:31.580 is incredibly high. And, you know, Canadians call it the revolving door of justice. Conservatives call it

00:08:39.180 the revolving door of justice, because that's exactly what it is right now. Back in my day and

00:08:43.900 in Larry's day as a prosecutor and as a policeman, we used to have called reverse onus. Yep. And so,

00:08:50.940 if a person that had committed a criminal offense was out already on some sort of judicial interim

00:08:55.660 release and they committed another offense, the onus is on them to show why they should be released.

00:09:00.460 Not anymore. You know, that is changing. That has changed. And Larry sits on the committee that we're just

00:09:06.700 discussing. Yeah. And this, this might be a segue to discuss the very next topic. Bill C-46. This is why

00:09:12.140 you two are the dynamic duo. Okay. I already know where the conversation's going. What do you need me

00:09:16.860 for? Don't answer that. I don't even want to answer that. Keep going. Canadians need to know. This is

00:09:24.220 hot off the press. Yes. We had a technical briefing that broke down for technical reasons. We had,

00:09:31.340 we had a translation issue. But they delivered the draft of the bill to members beforehand. I took a

00:09:37.900 look at it. And to use a phrase that I know my colleague has used, they have essentially put a

00:09:45.580 band-aid, a very tiny band-aid on a gushing wound, or to use the words of my, of my colleague, Mr. Moss, 0.83

00:09:52.940 putting lipstick on a pig. All right. They're using appropriate language, but the net effect is going to be

00:10:01.260 essentially the same status quo that still exists. They've added some reverse onus provisions in the

00:10:08.540 criminal code. We already have reverse onus provisions in the criminal code. And quite frankly,

00:10:14.540 all of the topical stories that we have heard of individuals running amok, creating violence within

00:10:21.660 our cities, killing people, maiming people, injuring people, are already those individuals who are facing

00:10:28.460 reverse onus bail hearings. So adding more reverse onus provisions in the code does not address the

00:10:37.260 underlying issue. And the underlying issue is because of our Supreme Court of Canada releasing two

00:10:44.060 significant decisions, starting with Antic, then Zora, and the government introducing Bill 75. It has

00:10:52.220 created a principle of restraint that it does not matter what your criminal record is like. It doesn't

00:10:59.900 matter what your age is. It doesn't matter what the circumstances of the offense is. The default position

00:11:06.620 for any justice, meaning a justice of the peace or a provincial court judge or a superior court judge, is this

00:11:14.540 person needs to be released, regardless of whether it's a crown onus offense or reverse onus offense. That's in the

00:11:21.980 mindset of a judge. Well, I think I heard it this week, actually, just a moment ago, as reiterated in the House,

00:11:28.780 that, I believe it was Vancouver, 40 individuals, a very small percentage, were creating the vast

00:11:35.980 majority of calls and issues for police. 6,000. That's right. 40 individuals created 6,000 offenses.

00:11:43.740 Committed 6,000 offenses in one year. That should tell you all you need to know. Yes.

00:11:49.260 Those people that don't want the help of the various organizations that are there to rehabilitate,

00:11:54.220 don't, don't want to participate in society. Right. And those 40 individuals will not be impacted at all. That's right.

00:12:01.420 By this new Bill C-46. Oh, they won't. Will not be impacted. That's the problem. Because those individuals were still

00:12:07.820 facing reverse onus. Nothing has changed. We need to see, in terms of real bail reform, we need to see a more emphasis on

00:12:18.060 community and victim safety. Right. That's where we need. And this bill basically indicates that a judge

00:12:25.900 must consider the community impact, the victim impact, over a crime. Well, they do that anyways.

00:12:34.540 Part of their whole analysis, when they're hearing evidence and hearing submissions, whether or not a

00:12:39.500 person should be released, are those very same factors. Codifying it in the criminal code will do

00:12:46.460 absolutely nothing to increase community confidence and safety in our justice system.

00:12:53.180 The press conference is just going on. I was kind of watching it as I was making my way over here,

00:12:58.300 catching bits and pieces. And it is frightening that it took this long for the government to even

00:13:04.540 take action. And Larry just kind of outlined all the flawed bills, C-75, that started this ball rolling.

00:13:09.980 But the fact that the amount of people that we, as opposition, brought to the House of Commons in

00:13:16.700 our speeches, in our statements, saying that people are being victimized in our community,

00:13:21.820 we're having people worried about being a victim of crime, and noticing that things are not right

00:13:26.940 anymore. And it took them years to actually move even a little bit.

00:13:32.700 Well, the part that's troubling is not only this bill on bail reform or C-21, or there's many other

00:13:39.340 bills. This government has demonstrated repeatedly, and this is another example, of just how out of

00:13:45.340 touch they really are. No consultation, no understanding that if we introduce this, C-75 for

00:13:53.420 example, it has the potential to have this impact. Like, there's just no forethought that goes into it.

00:14:01.820 And then, as you said, Jamie, Canadians, victims groups, law enforcement, premiers, you know,

00:14:10.460 justice officials have said, and average Canadian said, like this, for example, the bail system is so

00:14:16.460 broken, and it's been broken now since C-75 was introduced. And what's that, four years ago? Three

00:14:22.940 years ago? And nothing. Like, even to introduce it. This was brought to them at that point in time,

00:14:28.300 and said, this is broken, this is going to cause problems, please, don't, you know, we need amendments

00:14:32.940 to your bill. They refused to listen. So Glenn mentions examples where the government does not

00:14:38.620 listen to important stakeholders. In this particular case, they actually were bombarded with information

00:14:45.660 from stakeholders, and still got it so massively wrong, and completely out of touch. And that is what

00:14:52.780 so frustrating for me as a former member of the criminal justice system in terms of prosecution.

00:14:59.100 This is going to be extremely disappointing to police agencies across this country, definitely

00:15:05.180 disappointing to the premiers who really pushed hard to move this government to introduce this type

00:15:10.940 of legislation. And quite frankly, they just ignored really solid concrete suggestions from members of

00:15:19.580 parliament and other stakeholders who really were projecting how this government could move on

00:15:26.460 important legislation to make a difference. They failed us. Did they ever. Let's quickly talk about

00:15:32.940 our friend and colleague Michael Chong, if we could. It kind of ties into this whole government incompetence

00:15:37.260 and the endless just failures that we just keep in front of us. It turns out through evidence that the

00:15:44.700 the government pretty much knew about this, really did nothing about it, knew that Michael Chong's family

00:15:49.580 was being targeted back home in Hong Kong, didn't warn Michael Chong about it because of a vote he made on

00:15:56.060 the floor of the House of Commons. To this public safety and how we segue into it, right? Like,

00:16:02.620 Canadians in general aren't feeling safe. We have members of parliament that are being threatened for

00:16:08.620 votes they make on the House of Commons, and yet this government turns a blind eye. Why? Because it might have

00:16:13.260 benefited them in the election. Yeah. This is your belly. I might have teed that up just too good for you.

00:16:20.540 No, but you sat on the committee. You've done these. I have. I've sat on proc. I've sat on ethics.

00:16:29.500 We are doing a deep dive with respect to the Trudeau Foundation and their role in terms of accepting

00:16:36.300 monies for influence and gaining access to the Prime Minister. I think what is most disturbing is the

00:16:45.100 is the level and the government accuses and to this day, today as a matter of fact, accuses the

00:16:52.060 Conservatives of deliberately misleading or misinforming the House and misinforming the public and using it for

00:17:00.460 partisan gains, for fundraising, completely, you know, missing the the whole objective of what the legislation is all about.

00:17:09.580 They have done the same thing regarding this particular issue. I think it has to be concerning to every Canadian

00:17:17.340 that our government, whose number one role, regardless of fiscal responsibility, its number one role and mandate is to

00:17:28.780 keep us safe and sovereign. And when you hear what this government has done in terms of turning a blind eye and

00:17:39.420 allowing these police states, these police run illegal operations in Canada and allowing diplomats from the

00:17:48.940 Chinese communist regime to be running amok in our society and bragging as to how they've influenced 1.00

00:17:57.420 elections. And all of this information acquired by CSIS, Canada's number one spy agency, whose number one

00:18:07.500 mandate is to run it up to the chain of command, right up to the Prime Minister, which they did,

00:18:14.780 and he did nothing, is appalling and disgusting. And that's why we need to have this government removed

00:18:24.540 sooner than later, so that we can restore safety and confidence and protection to all Canadians.

00:18:31.180 Willful blindness on behalf of this Prime Minister and Liberal government

00:18:33.980 is for their own gain is, to me, is grounds that the Canadian public should say we've had enough.

00:18:39.660 We can't trust this government.

00:18:41.260 It's time for a poly-a-led government. 0.78

00:18:43.260 Well, his Chief of Staff, Katie Telford, confirmed that the Prime Minister reads everything.

00:18:47.260 A ferocious reader.

00:18:48.300 He was...

00:18:50.300 It's hard not to laugh at that. But yeah, so according to Katie Telford, yes, he's got his grip on everything.

00:18:59.260 Uh, so, where do we go from here? What are the next steps? I know C21, there's going to be a vote at some point.

00:19:05.260 Uh, this week.

00:19:06.540 There'll be a debate on the new bail reform legislation, or lack thereof, coming up very shortly.

00:19:11.980 So, uh, this week we're expecting the vote?

00:19:13.820 Yes, so, uh, debate on, um, report stage and third reading of C21 is today, tomorrow.

00:19:19.980 There'll be some votes tomorrow on it, and then on Thursday is the final vote.

00:19:23.900 And from there it'll be sent to the Senate. Um, I'm hopeful that the Senate will gut this bill

00:19:29.500 completely like we try to do at committee. Send it back, say, hey, this is flawed.

00:19:34.300 Start over again would be ideal. I'm not sure what they're going to do.

00:19:37.180 At least I hope they give it an honest effort like we tried in committee.

00:19:40.780 Yeah, it is, uh, I just, I just watching every failure.

00:19:47.180 Like last night we had the housing minutes. I'm going to go off on a topic just a little here,

00:19:51.260 because I've been dying to talk about this. The housing minister, I don't know if you

00:19:54.620 watched the take note debate last night with the housing minister. It was a take note debate.

00:19:59.100 It gives us a chance to quickly rapid fire questions, right? And, and the, the, our leader,

00:20:04.540 Pierre Polyev asked very simple questions. What's the average price of a home in Canada?

00:20:08.700 What's the average rent? What's the average mortgage payment? Housing minister had no clue,

00:20:14.700 no clue on his file on something that every Canadian is dealing with right now.

00:20:20.460 We have people can't get into the housing market. And this housing minister had no

00:20:24.700 clue what the average price was. Wow. It is, it is absolutely incredible. And, and, and, and,

00:20:30.380 and I know I'm getting those letters and phone calls and emails. I'm sure you are too, both of you.

00:20:36.540 There's a lot of people hurting and this government does not seem to care. They don't care.

00:20:39.580 I think that's the theme of what we're talking about today. On everything. They don't care.

00:20:42.940 But hey, we got a new passport. Oh, don't, let's not start that one.

00:20:49.180 I have a nice constant reminder of a young Justin Trudeau frolicking in a lake.

00:20:53.420 And a squirrel eating a nut. That's meaningful to me as a Canadian.

00:20:57.340 You know. I say facetiously.

00:20:59.420 Yeah, I figured there was. Yeah, absolutely. I didn't think it literally.

00:21:03.580 There's, that is literally a great description of how lost this government really is.

00:21:10.780 Yep. They have lost their way. They've lost the ability to govern. In fact, they never really

00:21:15.660 had it, but they've lost their way big time. And we need to, we need to do, the Canadians need to 0.93

00:21:20.540 realize that, you know, the reason we are in bad shape is we are economically, you know,

00:21:26.540 people losing hope, losing their homes, can't get into homes, can't afford to live, can't afford

00:21:31.580 groceries, are not safe in our communities, have, have many other issues that we're dealing with as a

00:21:36.620 country. This, this government, where is it? This prime minister in this government, where is

00:21:41.420 these issues? And the only way to solve this problem is to next election. Dr. Beggs.

00:21:48.620 Well, here's another issue that hasn't been talked about. I'm probably going way long on the show

00:21:51.980 here. Yes, I am. Chrystia Freeland, the finance minister, where has she been? She hasn't been in

00:21:56.940 the House, I think, two days and two months, I think. Two days and two months.

00:22:00.300 She's around the country, around the world, interviewing for a new job. She won't even go

00:22:05.180 up here before committing for two hours to talk about her budget. Not at all. Billion spent,

00:22:10.380 and doesn't give the time of day. Four hundred and ninety some billion dollar budget, and she 1.00

00:22:15.740 But she's only giving, she's only giving one hour. One hour. Not two. Not two. Not two. We don't want to

00:22:20.140 overburden her. No. She's super busy, you know. She's got things to do. She does.

00:22:24.380 Yes. Final comments, gentlemen. Oh, where do we start? We've touched on so many major issues. I think,

00:22:32.700 I think the theme that at least I was presenting and what my colleague was presenting as well is just

00:22:37.420 how broken this particular government is. They've, they're well beyond the best before date. Every

00:22:44.780 government has a shelf life. This shelf life is long and done. We need a new government led by Pierre

00:22:52.700 Pauliev. We have a wonderful caucus. We're going to gain new caucus members in the new election. We are

00:23:00.220 ready to restore Canada to its prominence, keep Canadians safe, keep us prosperous, keep roofs over

00:23:08.620 our head, food on our table, and all the things that this government should have been doing for a

00:23:14.700 number of years and has just failed us. And for me, thank you, Larry. I think we talked a lot today

00:23:21.740 about what's broken and there's a lot to be talked about, but also there is hope. The reason that we

00:23:28.540 fight the fight that we do, you fight our, our, our, our conservative colleagues fight this fight is

00:23:33.820 there's hope. And we're not going to give up the fight for this country that we love, for the people

00:23:38.700 that we're here to serve. And, you know, a Pauliev led conservative government does bring hope to a

00:23:45.420 country that is broken, to a government that's broken. And I'm excited to stick around to make that happen.

00:23:50.860 Absolutely. And we want to see that happen. Absolutely. I know. When I first met you,

00:23:54.380 you had hair. So this is what Justin Trudeau is doing.

00:23:58.620 We appreciate your time, gentlemen, with Len Watts, Medicine at Carston Warner, Larry Brock,

00:24:03.660 the one and only from Brantford Brant, the dynamic duo. Always appreciate having these two on the show.

00:24:08.380 It's a great conversation. We appreciate your time as well. Please like, comment, subscribe,

00:24:12.540 and share this program. 1.30 PM Eastern time is when we have new content for you every single Tuesday.

00:24:18.620 And don't forget, you can listen to it on platforms like CastBox, iTunes, Google Play,

00:24:22.060 and Spotify. Until next week, remember, low taxes, less government, more freedom. That is the blueprint.

The Blueprint: Canada's Conservative Podcast - May 16, 2023

Blueprint： Law & Order

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