Liberal’s ideological driven gun politics
Episode Stats
Words per Minute
171.48572
Summary
Bill C-21 is a new piece of legislation that would ban the importation, sale, and transfer of firearms in Canada. Conservative MP Glenn and Conservative Councillor Raquel Lemay join us to discuss the implications of this legislation, and why it is a bad idea.
Transcript
00:02:09.980
We saw an announcement from the Liberals that was not targeting that problem really at all.
00:02:14.640
And that's what's very frustrating for Canadians that want to see meaningful action on gun violence.
00:02:20.360
So this new ban, if it passes, stops the importation, the sale, the transfer of firearms.
00:02:27.160
And as we were speaking off air, when the last firearms owner dies with a handgun, there should be no legal firearms in Canada.
00:02:38.500
So just to correct, I wasn't a member of the RCMP.
00:02:43.800
However, I think, as Raquel has said, you know, the rhetoric behind what the Liberals have been trying to do with gun violence in our communities over the last seven years and where they've missed the mark so terribly, it seems like they are catering with language to people who aren't aware of the very strict laws we already have in this country.
00:03:05.240
And as you asked in the first question, the targeting of C-21, of the handgun ban and anything to do with firearms has been focused solely on Canadians law-abiding gun owners who have never been a problem in this country with creating violence.
00:03:23.820
And they have a, what is it, three times less likelihood of committing an offense as a firearms owner than the average citizen in Canada.
00:03:32.200
And so, you know, we have a misguided approach by this government that is focused on the easy, it's lazy government legislation when you can go after those, the low-hanging fruit, if you will, and miss the exact mark where we're after.
00:03:53.080
And so by targeting people, you know, who are law-abiding, you have missed the mark.
00:03:58.600
And the sad thing about it is we all want improved public safety.
00:04:01.640
We don't want people shooting up our streets and having lives lost.
00:04:13.400
We know that the issue is smuggling at the border.
00:04:16.260
We know that gangs are causing a lot of this increased violence.
00:04:20.140
But if I lived in the city, Raquel, you're not too far from Winnipeg.
00:04:23.360
If I'm in Vancouver, Edmonton, Toronto, wherever these shootings are happening, I just want these shootings to end.
00:04:28.380
And I think, is that something we have to really educate about to let people know that it's basically a false sense of security that the government is giving them right now?
00:04:37.620
Certainly. I think we've been effectively communicating that in the media opportunities we've been provided in the last week since the Bill C-21 announcement.
00:04:46.240
I did want to build on something Glenn had said.
00:04:47.900
Those who have an RPAL, which is what you need to own a handgun in this country and other various restricted firearms, are the most vetted people in Canada.
00:04:58.620
So I think that that point really needs to be made very, very clear.
00:05:01.820
But to your point, I know in Winnipeg we're seeing rising violence generally and rising violence with firearms or guns.
00:05:10.760
And so I toured the Winnipeg Police Headquarters facilities to find out more about this.
00:05:14.660
They had recently done a half-million-dollar drug bust, a big table full of all the drugs and all the cash,
00:05:19.580
and then a very long table of the firearms they apprehended in this bust.
00:05:26.880
And every single one of those handguns were already illegal, not even just prohibited or restricted,
00:05:33.280
but were already illegal models of handguns in Canada.
00:05:35.820
And all of them were smuggled in from the United States.
00:05:38.820
They anticipate some by rail, some by vehicle, and in other parts of the country might be from marine ports of entry.
00:05:45.380
So the police were explaining to me the severity of this and the growing problem.
00:05:49.680
So we need more resources for our hard-working police who put their lives on the line to defend Canadians against gang violence and gun violence.
00:05:57.760
And certainly, obviously, more resources invested in our border security, certainly.
00:06:04.860
You know, I think building on the resources, we also need legislation.
00:06:10.400
We need the laws that then hold those who commit these offenses to account.
00:06:15.520
And right now, you know, we have Bill C-5, which we talked about off-air ahead of time.
00:06:20.940
You know, and what the Liberals are trying to do with this piece of legislation is on the C-21,
00:06:25.720
now they're saying we're going to get tough on those who smuggle firearms,
00:06:29.220
and, you know, we're going to increase the mandatory maximum from 10 to 14 years.
00:06:37.200
However, at the same time they're doing that, they are lessening the mandatory minimums for the exact same type of offenses
00:06:49.620
And so we need a consistent approach across, you know, law enforcement and the legal community to keep our community safe
00:06:57.420
and that those who use firearms in the commission of an offense need or have possession of firearms illegally
00:07:07.820
And what's interesting is our public safety minister, back a number of years back,
00:07:18.980
And, you know, and then he invited me back to his writing.
00:07:22.540
And what was striking, and unfortunately I'd missed the airing on TV Ontario's blind date production,
00:07:28.340
we talked to a mom who had both of her young daughters shot in the playground in gang violence.
00:07:34.480
Thankfully, they didn't die, but they were going to be traumatized for life.
00:07:38.100
And we asked, I asked her, I said, so what can we tell Canadians?
00:07:44.600
And she goes, the criminals that I know that do this sort of stuff that shot my two daughters are not afraid of the police.
00:07:56.620
Criminals who use firearms, and her words were criminals,
00:07:59.480
these people who shoot up our streets need to be held accountable, you know,
00:08:03.620
to a higher degree than someone who doesn't use a firearm.
00:08:07.300
And that's from a mom who had her own, in center Toronto, who had her own daughters shot.
00:08:15.020
So in part of the issue with Bill C-5, and again, some of these firearm offenses
00:08:19.600
that they're eliminating mandatory prison time for is robbery with a firearm,
00:08:24.540
extortion with a firearm, firing a firearm with the intent to injure.
00:08:31.060
Yeah, we'll no longer have a mandatory prison sentence
00:08:36.700
So now in the instance of the woman that you just mentioned,
00:08:39.580
there may be an opportunity in a similar circumstance
00:08:42.520
where someone has fired a gun at someone in a community that's already vulnerable,
00:08:46.440
and now rather than removing that dangerous individual
00:08:48.480
and putting them in prison where they may be able to receive rehabilitation programming,
00:08:52.760
they may keep them in that community surrounded by those influential gang elements.
00:08:57.800
And to me, that seems like they could further terrorize the community.
00:09:05.200
that these vulnerable communities should be concerned about
00:09:08.160
because those dangerous elements will no longer have a mandatory prison time
00:09:15.340
And I think one of the other things, and I heard you talk about this once before, Raquel,
00:09:19.060
is we need to have a mechanism where we go back to things back when I was a lot younger
00:09:24.880
in my policing career where we had the Bail Reform Act.
00:09:28.080
And if someone committed an offense, they needed to show justice why they should be released.
00:09:38.460
There's some, you know, some criteria in the criminal code.
00:09:43.060
It seems to me over the last 10, 12 years that there's a significant slide
00:09:47.680
in people who continue to commit offenses while they are out on bail,
00:09:52.860
awaiting, you know, court proceedings in the very first offense they were there in the first place for.
00:09:58.060
And so they continue to re-offend while they even haven't been dealt with for the first offense.
00:10:04.600
Like, we need to fix those who continue to be out on our streets after they've been convicted of a violent offense.
00:10:11.840
Well, I think it's also important to remind those that aren't familiar with the gun laws and our firearms laws
00:10:17.580
is that basically if you are, you have an RPAL, you own a handgun,
00:10:29.200
And you have to apply for a permit to transport.
00:10:36.080
Not only that, your name is run through the police data bank every single day.
00:10:40.780
So as it was explained to me, it's basically like being on parole.
00:10:47.580
And when you have a restricted firearm, and correct me if I'm wrong, Glenn,
00:10:50.160
but you have to get it approved by the chief firearms officer.
00:10:52.500
So the police actually know where every single legally owned restricted firearm is in the country.
00:10:59.240
And quite frankly, conservatives agree that gun laws should be very strict.
00:11:03.740
Only the most vetted, responsible, law-abiding citizens should ever even be near a firearm.
00:11:09.940
But then when you have Bill C-21 coming in and doing this,
00:11:12.440
I mean, there's so many repercussions on our Olympic sports shooting community,
00:11:17.640
There are also impacts on hunters and guides and a number of individuals who work in rural and remote areas
00:11:25.520
who have special handgun permits to carry their handguns in the event a wild, dangerous animal sneaks up on them,
00:11:31.940
for example, and they don't have time to bring out their long gun.
00:11:34.120
So that's also not covered in Bill C-21, not acknowledged.
00:11:38.520
So there are discussions to be had about this, and none of those, the Liberals are not allowing any of those to happen.
00:11:44.560
So we're quite concerned about that and that this will not tackle a very serious issue that we need to be making progress on,
00:11:51.440
that every single year that Justin Trudeau has been Prime Minister has worsened.
00:11:55.300
And violence in Toronto, Montreal, Winnipeg, Vancouver, Edmonton has gotten worse year after year.
00:12:00.900
So their approach is failing. This is their so-called answer, and yet it does not target the problem.
00:12:08.300
You know, we talk about, the Liberals talk a lot about their red flag laws and how...
00:12:16.580
Bill C-21, this is going to solve a problem that, you know, we're going to fix this,
00:12:20.840
that those who might, you know, have some violent tendencies or domestic violence or something along those lines
00:12:26.860
are going to be in a position where we can identify them and remove their license and remove their firearms.
00:12:33.520
What they don't, what they purposefully ignore is that the law, the criminal code, and the Firearms Act currently,
00:12:43.220
and has for decades, allowed the police and the courts to remove firearms.
00:12:49.000
I mean, I have done it personally over the years.
00:12:51.200
I know, you know, when I was a street supervisor, we did it on a regular basis.
00:12:54.760
If we had a violent situation, a domestic violence situation, and the individual might have firearms,
00:13:00.580
we could remove those for safekeeping and then take it to the courts and let them decide based on the disposition of that case.
00:13:09.480
So for the Liberals to, you know, stand on a soapbox and say,
00:13:13.200
we're going to solve this problem because we're going to eliminate some risk to the public,
00:13:17.000
and we've said all along, Conservatives very much want to ensure that those who have the firearms,
00:13:22.320
it's a privilege to have a firearm, have a PEL and an RPEL,
00:13:25.740
and nobody complains about the higher standard we have to live up to.
00:13:31.560
But don't tell the Canadian public that we're going to solve this problem by doing this
00:13:36.480
when that same issue is already addressed in law currently.
00:13:43.140
Like, you know, how do you educate the Canadian public on firearms issues?
00:13:49.740
And it's whoever has the loudest voice, I suppose, seems to.
00:13:54.000
And the Liberals right now, this is all for political gain.
00:13:58.820
This is a political posturing by a government that, you know,
00:14:02.500
is intent on an ideology not based in evidence.
00:14:08.040
Well, there's a few articles coming out today, specifically in the National Post,
00:14:12.240
that talked about how Justin Trudeau keeps campaigning like he is in the United States
00:14:15.920
on issues that have nothing to do with Canada, that are totally different here in Canada.
00:14:20.520
But yet he keeps trying, he's trying to keep the United States model alive for some reason here in Canada.
00:14:33.760
And I agree with what Glenn had said earlier as well about the red flag laws.
00:14:36.880
All parties agree we need strict rules and laws and police powers to support domestic violence victims and victims of abuse.
00:14:44.400
We welcome the discussion of how we can tighten those up.
00:14:47.560
But again, that's just a very small part of Bill C-21.
00:14:52.420
But, yeah, Mr. Trudeau, you know, he's really changed his rhetoric from when he was running for leader.
00:14:58.500
You'll probably remember this, when he was saying, oh, guns are an important part of Canadian heritage and our culture
00:15:06.000
I thought, like, what a great line at the time, you know.
00:15:11.080
And he clearly was lying or I'm not sure what's going on.
00:15:14.620
But now, obviously, it's consistently, year over year, attacking a very important part of Canadian heritage
00:15:27.780
And one point I'd like to make on that is that the buyback for the OIC ban that we hear so much about.
00:15:38.160
They have no idea how they're going to implement this thing.
00:15:40.180
But we know it's going to be in the billions of dollars to implement.
00:15:42.800
This new handgun measure, like, will be very costly as well.
00:15:46.140
They've already spent $920 million on gun control since they've been in office.
00:15:53.120
Imagine if all of those resources had been put into police guns and gangs units to fight gangs
00:15:57.980
or into border agents and better border security technology.
00:16:01.500
How much of an influence could we have had on reducing gun violence?
00:16:06.420
if we can invest as well in organizations, grassroots, anti-gang organizations in the city of Toronto,
00:16:15.780
Marcel Wilson, ex-hard criminal, did his time, rehabilitated himself,
00:16:20.560
and now saves young people, primarily young men, from a life of gangs and crime.
00:16:24.920
These are the types of people we need to be empowering.
00:16:27.180
These are the organizations that will have a long-term impact on saving lives,
00:16:30.460
not just the gang members themselves that can be pulled out of that life,
00:16:35.140
Those are areas that we can invest in to actually make meaningful reductions
00:16:40.680
Jamie, you asked the question about why is it that it seems that the Prime Minister
00:16:45.040
is modeling himself after American politics, right?
00:16:50.160
He has used consistently, and in 2017, I can't remember exactly what the tragic event was,
00:16:58.260
but he has used events primarily in the United States as a backdrop, shamelessly as a backdrop,
00:17:07.860
And then, well, unfortunately in Canada, we've had some of our own tragedies,
00:17:12.720
and it's always on the backs of those that they try to score political points.
00:17:17.480
And it's not about a political point, it's about keeping Canadians safe.
00:17:21.720
Conservatives have been consistent in this message.
00:17:23.720
We need to ensure that those who commit offenses with firearms are held accountable, period.
00:17:33.740
And if we do that in the most efficient and effective way possible,
00:17:40.520
Talking about it, going after licensed firearm owners is not the solution to that problem.
00:17:49.960
So, as you know, the guests always get the last word, so I will turn it over.
00:17:53.520
We will probably start with Glenn, since I let Raquel go first.
00:17:56.720
So, Glenn, if the floor is yours, you get to close it out.
00:18:01.580
One, you know, I've got to say, Raquel has really grabbed on to this critic role in public safety,
00:18:10.960
and she's doing an amazing job of understanding the issues and working well, you know,
00:18:20.040
One of the things that we haven't touched on in this conversation today yet is the fact that the handgun,
00:18:27.360
if we're just talking handguns and firearms, the impact that it will have on thousands of businesses
00:18:32.280
and jobs across this country, and it has always impacted that, you know, separate from firearm owners.
00:18:39.860
Those who own gun shops and gunsmith shops and all those sort of things will be negatively impacted by this legislation as well.
00:18:59.040
They would rather you not use it if there's something they disagree with, whether it be fossil fuels, whether it be firearms, that kind of thing.
00:19:12.660
This is very topical, and Canadians are very concerned about the rising crime they're seeing in their cities.
00:19:17.560
And they're Justin Trudeau's lack of leadership on this.
00:19:19.720
And one thing we didn't touch on was how tightly related gun violence is to drug trafficking, smuggling drugs across the border.
00:19:26.740
We're seeing thousands, particularly young people, die of opioid fentanyl, carfentanil.
00:19:31.400
One thing we haven't mentioned is that in Bill C-5, mandatory prison time for drug traffickers will be eliminated.
00:19:37.880
These are people that are responsible for killing thousands of young Canadians with the drug traffic, with fentanyl and carfentanil.
00:19:45.900
Gangsters want to protect their drug territory, and they use guns to do it.
00:19:50.300
And I just want to make the point that those are so tightly related.
00:19:53.840
We cannot talk about reducing gun violence unless we're also talking about attacking the illegal drug trafficking trade.
00:20:04.380
The liberals have spent more money than any government ever in history.
00:20:09.280
If they wanted to make a meaningful reduction on this gang and criminal and gun activity,
00:20:15.240
they should be investing more money in border security and police guns and gangs units
00:20:19.020
and anti-criminal organizations that run at the grassroots level that really focus on young people.
00:20:27.380
I will keep talking about them until I'm blue in the face.
00:20:29.640
But if you want to solve this issue, that's where you have to focus.
00:20:45.000
Raquel Dancho, Member of Parliament for Kildonan St. Paul,
00:20:49.680
and Glenn Motts, the Member of Parliament for Medicine Hat, Cartston Warner.
00:20:56.940
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00:20:59.500
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00:21:01.800
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00:21:05.600
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00:21:09.060
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00:21:12.300
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00:21:16.100
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00:21:20.440
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