The Blueprint: Canada's Conservative Podcast - Russia and Canada’s National Defence policy

00:00:00.000 Hello and welcome once again to The Blueprints. This is Canada's Conservative Podcast. I'm your

00:00:07.640 host, Jamie Schmael, Member of Parliament for Halliburton Court, the likes of Brock,

00:00:10.860 with new content for you every single Tuesday, 1.30pm Eastern Time. We are going right through

00:00:16.300 the summer. We are not taking any breaks because this is a message you probably aren't getting in

00:00:20.560 the mainstream media. So we ask that you like, comment, subscribe, share this program, and

00:00:24.980 together we can push back against that ever-moving Liberal agenda. And of course, as always, if you

00:00:29.480 can't listen or watch the entire program right this second, download it, listen to it later on

00:00:34.360 on platforms like CastBox, iTunes, Google Play, Spotify, you name it, it is out there. So great

00:00:40.360 show lined up for you. I know I say that every single week. We have two amazing guests to talk

00:00:45.140 about national security. We're going to talk about the Arctic. We're going to talk about global affairs

00:00:49.780 and how Canada plays a role in that. So to chat about that, we have Carrie Lynn Finley, the Member

00:00:54.740 of Parliament for South Surrey, White Rock, and beautiful British Columbia. She's also the

00:00:59.380 critic for National Defence. And right beside her, we have Cheryl Gallant, the Member of

00:01:03.460 Parliament for Pembroke, Nipissing. Sorry, Renfrew, Nipissing, Pembroke. Sorry, I drive

00:01:08.580 through it all the time. You'd think I'd get that right. Thank you, both of you, for joining

00:01:11.560 us. Thank you.

00:01:13.000 So let's talk about the Arctic, something that is kind of a topic of conversation for many

00:01:17.520 about where Canada stands in terms of securing it. We have trillions of dollars worth of minerals

00:01:23.580 and natural resources up there. We have Russia and China kind of looking in to see where

00:01:28.300 they play a role and what they can do in that region. So does Canada prepared at all to defend

00:01:34.440 or do we even have an Arctic strategy? I know Stephen Harper had it, but really didn't get

00:01:38.300 picked up after the Liberals took power in 2015.

00:01:41.520 Well, I'm glad you mentioned Prime Minister Harper because he actually made it a priority.

00:01:45.920 Went up there every summer, made a point of backing the Franklin Expedition, for instance,

00:01:52.320 to show the history there. We also mapped the continental shelf and have laid claim to that.

00:01:58.220 So that focus on the Arctic has completely fallen away under the Liberals and we are not prepared,

00:02:05.340 frankly. And in an ever-changing and more dangerous world we find ourselves in, particularly since

00:02:12.080 the Russia invasion of Ukraine, it is really important, more than ever, to talk about continental defense

00:02:19.580 and to talk about our Arctic. Most people growing up in Canada, we look at a map and we think

00:02:24.820 it goes right up to the North Pole and we think that's all ours. Well, there's some other countries

00:02:30.260 that have some different ideas. China likes all the rare earth minerals up there. Russia itself has

00:02:36.360 definitely been navigating through Northwest Passage, very close to our shores, and we really don't

00:02:44.660 know where Russia's going next or what they're doing. In addition, the capacity of missiles to, even

00:02:53.420 from North Korea now, to go further, to take different trajectories, even coming up from the south,

00:02:59.320 as a recent Chinese missile did, means that we have to upgrade, modernize our early warning systems,

00:03:06.120 our NORAD modernization is very important. There was an announcement by the government just a few

00:03:14.740 days ago of $4.9 billion going into NORAD modernization, but that's not new money. It's

00:03:20.200 money that was already allocated in the budget and very lofty promises about another $40 billion over

00:03:25.980 the next 20 years. I don't know about you, Jamie, but I don't know that I'll be in this specific role

00:03:31.140 15, 20 years from now, and I don't think they know that I'll be in it. Well, you're in your 20s,

00:03:34.900 so you have lots of time. Well, I have the time and the energy. It's just that usually in government,

00:03:39.460 things change. Besides that, we want to have a conservative government in, so to make promises

00:03:45.460 in those kind of dollar figures over that kind of time frame is basically meaningless.

00:03:51.040 The United States wants to see more integration, and we should want to see more integration from Canada

00:03:58.140 as well in continental defense. And that means being part of the understanding that these rogue

00:04:05.500 states see us as one target area, and we need to do our part.

00:04:10.460 Now, Cheryl, you sit on the NATO Parliamentary Friendship Group. You're also a member of the

00:04:15.760 National Defense Committee. You must be looking at this as a whole, wondering where Canada is.

00:04:21.400 Are they able to meet their 2% commitments? Something it hasn't done in a while, and it's not getting

00:04:26.100 any better under Justin Trudeau. We're seeing issues with military procurement, and the list goes on.

00:04:31.980 Yes, we're far below the 2% commitment in Made in Wales, and even with the percentage of our gross

00:04:40.260 domestic product that we do spend towards defense, it's fudging. The numbers are fudged by the Liberals

00:04:46.000 as well because they now include the Coast Guard. Other countries include the Coast Guard, but their

00:04:55.760 Coast Guards are armed, so they can become involved in a conflict if need be. Ours are not. They're just

00:05:04.240 trying to pad the numbers. As well now, they're including Veterans Affairs. But we've been far below,

00:05:11.520 and we have countries like Lithuania, who are now have increased over time to 2.5% and committed. We have

00:05:19.760 Germany, who has been sort of under the radar, but they have put forth huge commitments towards their

00:05:27.680 NATO spending as well, defense overall. So, yeah, Canada is lagging behind in terms of protecting our Arctic. We

00:05:37.440 have four submarines, and we are fortunate to have one submarine in the water participating in the

00:05:45.840 security of the world at any point in time. And we need new submarines. We haven't seen any plans,

00:05:54.000 actually even calling for proposals, and the submarines we do have cannot go under the Arctic ice.

00:06:02.240 So, the deepwater port that Prime Minister Harper started, we've had no updates in Defense Committee,

00:06:12.720 I believe Carrie Lynn, that I can recall as to how that is going, if they've even continued to pursue it.

00:06:19.200 So, we can't defend our North. We already have the Chinese who have a laboratory in the Arctic, 1.00

00:06:26.720 and Russia, Putin has established an ever-growing naval base in his Arctic, supposedly to allow for more

00:06:42.240 commercial traffic. But really, I think we've learned, especially over the past four months,

00:06:48.080 you can never take what Putin says at face value.

00:06:51.680 You also can't rely on our historical position, even with our allies. For instance, the AUKUS 0.98

00:06:58.960 agreement. We were left totally out of that. One of the reasons is what Cheryl's brought up about, 1.00

00:07:04.880 we don't have nuclear submarines. And when I questioned the Minister of Global Affairs on that,

00:07:12.320 she seemed to think that nuclear was about nuclear missile capability, not how you power the sub.

00:07:18.560 So, we have ministers who don't completely understand what we're talking about. And when you start,

00:07:25.600 as one of the Five Eyes partners, historically, when you start being left out of

00:07:30.480 high intelligence briefings, when you start being left out of new agreements, that is problematic for us.

00:07:36.880 And we have been criticized by the Americans for, I think the term was used, freeloading.

00:07:43.440 And, you know, it's about getting our defense spending in line with our Wales commitments and

00:07:50.720 NATO. But it's also about understanding the role we could play, and the role we're not playing right

00:07:56.880 now, with our very closest allies, and for our own national security.

00:08:01.120 So let's talk about equipment, because if we want to protect our coasts, whichever coast it is,

00:08:05.600 we need the equipment. So choosing a pistol seems to be a problem for the military. We can't seem to get

00:08:11.520 our icebreakers built. We can't seem to get our strategy on subs. I remember, and I'm sure you

00:08:16.960 both did in 2015, fighting the battle on F-35s. And I took a pounding in those debates because the

00:08:23.520 the Liberals and NDP said that was a horrible decision. Turns out, not so bad. The Liberals are

00:08:28.320 finally going forward with it, albeit about six years too late. But this seems to be an issue within

00:08:33.600 the community itself on how to get equipment quickly into the hands of those that need it.

00:08:41.600 Sorry, go ahead. The problem is, this government has never taken national security seriously.

00:08:49.840 I think Carrie Lynn can expand upon that. Our procurement system process in Canada is far too 0.95

00:08:57.600 politicized. We're criticized by other countries for this. Cheryl mentioned Germany. Germany has suddenly

00:09:03.200 come to the table in a big way and has really made bigger, much bigger commitments. But you look at

00:09:10.160 other countries where they made the F-35 decision in a couple of years. We were so severely criticized

00:09:17.440 as a government for being part of the F-35 consortium. And now, after seven years, they're back to it.

00:09:24.080 However, they're very big on announcements and very short on implementation. So here we are with a big

00:09:31.040 announcement about F-35s, a major investment. They still haven't signed the contracts. We've been

00:09:36.480 asking. They're saying, well, maybe by the end of the year they'll be done. And yet, we purchase the F-35s.

00:09:42.880 That's the deal in the consortium at the same price as the U.S. in the year we acquire them. And the

00:09:49.120 minister's now making promises about delivery when we don't even have contracts. So it takes too long.

00:09:56.000 It is too politicized. It's too complicated. We need to do better. The NDP the other day were

00:10:03.280 criticizing us, saying we didn't do any better. That's just not true. We were in Afghanistan,

00:10:08.960 and we had to streamline our procurement during that time to get equipment and kit. This government

00:10:14.960 doesn't even seem to be able to get basic kit, basic uniform kit, to a lot of our armed forces,

00:10:22.000 never mind the big, big equipment purchases. The procurement minister and committee of the whole

00:10:28.160 basically ended up saying, after being asked on several of these, well, we just sort of wait for

00:10:33.840 the national defense to tell us what we want, and then we try and get the contracts done. It's a very,

00:10:38.800 would you agree, a very hands-off way to approach procurement and what we need.

00:10:44.960 Totally dysfunctional.

00:10:46.000 So we have an issue with procuring equipment. We also have the numbers, I think, getting down

00:10:52.080 to concerning levels in terms of our military readiness, in terms of overall recruitment. I

00:10:57.280 think that's an issue that needs to be worked on as well that the Liberals, from what I see,

00:11:02.000 aren't putting much effort into.

00:11:03.840 The troops are demoralized. Their focus on matters more to do with social engineering

00:11:13.280 than getting them the practice they need for exercises in between deployments is

00:11:21.280 really what's turning them off. Young people, especially, join the military for adventure.

00:11:28.560 Being stuck on base, mopping a floor isn't what they signed up for. They wanted to be a part of

00:11:35.120 contributing to the defense and security of Canada. So it's a huge disappointment that they're not able

00:11:41.120 to participate or have the equipment they need to do the jobs that we ask them to do.

00:11:48.000 We've just been studying this in the National Defense Committee on recruitment and retention.

00:11:53.120 We're down depending on different estimates between 8,000 to 12,000 troops to start with.

00:11:58.720 So we really need to recruit brave and patriotic Canadians, as we always have, into the armed forces.

00:12:09.040 But what are they signing up for exactly? And that's where there's a disconnect. There's something

00:12:14.880 like 150 different jobs you could have in the CAF. But do they advertise those jobs? Do they talk about them?

00:12:22.400 Do they look for the right fit? Our study has shown that they don't use modern recruitment tools,

00:12:30.640 modern human resources tools. They're very slow to get back to people even after they've shown

00:12:36.320 a keen interest. We're also talking again about universality of service, whether that's a help

00:12:43.920 or a hindrance. That's something we've always had. But at least look at modern practices in HR

00:12:50.560 and at least advertise and fully advertise what the opportunities are or you're just not going to get

00:12:58.000 people signing up.

00:12:58.880 So all these challenges with procuring equipment, getting soldiers or whatever into the military,

00:13:05.440 like you said, it could be in a different capacity, what have you. Are other countries

00:13:10.880 around the world talking to us right now in terms of making important decisions? You talked about the

00:13:14.960 submarines. I think we were left out of that conversation at all. Like there are some pretty

00:13:20.160 important conversations taking place, but it doesn't look like Canada's involved in many of them.

00:13:24.640 The one thing we are involved in which was initiated by Prime Minister Harper was our participation

00:13:33.600 training in Latvia and having a presence in Latvia next door to Russia.

00:13:41.600 We also had training in Ukraine and certainly we've had some praise for the fact that

00:13:48.000 that the tremendous heartfelt and tough effort that Ukrainians have been put under with Russia's

00:13:55.280 invasion, part of the reason they've been able to meet the challenges to date is because of earlier

00:14:02.480 training with Canadians. But as far as being left out of conversations, we know we are being left out

00:14:08.640 of conversations even within the Five Eyes Partnership, which is UK, US, Canada, New Zealand and Australia.

00:14:18.800 And that is very concerning. We need to be part of all those conversations. We need to

00:14:26.960 up our capacity and interoperability of our equipment with other allies. I think on NATO, particularly since

00:14:35.120 the invasion in Ukraine, we're definitely at the table, we're definitely seen as a valid NATO partner,

00:14:43.600 but we're still not doing our part. We're still not putting the investments in that we should be,

00:14:49.840 that we pledge to do. And you don't get there by just reallocating already allocated funds or by

00:14:57.920 lapsing spending, which they have done in recent time. You have to be serious, something they haven't

00:15:04.400 been. And we have to be serious about what we can do in the world. We've had, again, the Global Affairs

00:15:12.000 Minister say, well, you know, Canadians are more conveners. Well, that simply isn't true. Yes, we can convene,

00:15:20.800 but we're also fighters. We've showed our mettle. We've showed that we will step up and we will do the hard

00:15:26.800 jobs that need to be done. And that is very insulting to our troops, many who have laid their lives on the

00:15:32.800 line. Even in peacetime, we have naval ships that go out of Esquimalt and all the other naval harbors,

00:15:41.440 and they deploy for eight and nine months into the Gulf. It's a sacrifice to those families. It is

00:15:49.440 service above self by those in the military. And we should never forget that by saying we're just

00:15:56.240 conveners. That's insulting. Well, we'll probably finish on this because I believe we are running

00:16:02.960 out of time. But the Global Affairs Minister under fire, Melanie Jolie, for somehow allowing one of

00:16:10.400 her bureaucrats to attend a garden party at the Russian embassy here in Ottawa, apparently her excuse

00:16:16.720 is they were too busy to read the email sent to her staff and herself regarding that decision. Do they

00:16:24.800 approve? And apparently it got looked at. I don't know if Cheryl, you want to comment on that quickly?

00:16:28.880 It totally eclipses our goal of keeping Russia in its place and the sacrifices many are making with 0.96

00:16:38.800 respect to the restrictions on trade with Russia that have been put in place. Our farmers in particular,

00:16:45.520 every industry in Canada that interfaces with Russia is sacrificing. And yet she couldn't read an email

00:16:58.320 in order to ensure that we bypass that particular tea party to demonstrate to Ukraine that yes,

00:17:07.040 we are serious. We are behind you. And remember, this wasn't just any person who went,

00:17:12.400 it was deputy chief of protocol. That is true. So first of all, she made the decision to go.

00:17:17.600 Someone backed that decision. Emails were sent to the appropriate places saying she was going. They

00:17:23.360 said they were busy in LA, I think it was. So they couldn't read them. But how did it even happen in

00:17:29.920 the first place? Russia has a very sophisticated plan. It's a military plan, a food plan and an energy plan.

00:17:37.520 And they are not stopping their efforts to subjugate Ukraine and its people. And this is something that 0.97

00:17:45.360 should never be seen, even have the appearance of being taken lightly. It's a threat to all Western

00:17:52.480 democracies and the stability of the world. How is that not resonating in Global Affairs Canada?

00:17:59.520 Only under this government. I can't imagine it happening under our government.

00:18:03.680 And nobody in the department said, wait a second, this might be a bad idea.

00:18:08.080 It sounds implausible, which makes you wonder if others knew. I find it hard to believe the deputy

00:18:16.400 chief of protocol just did it all on her own. I agree. So I always give the guests the last word,

00:18:22.960 just a couple seconds to give your final thoughts on maybe the state of the nation, where you think

00:18:29.680 conservatives can take the defense file, what have you. The floor is yours. Carrie Lynn, 1.00

00:18:34.400 do you want to start? Well, we'll start with you.

00:18:36.960 So, as you may know, we had our NATO parliamentary assembly conference in spring recently.

00:18:44.480 And two things struck me. I was speaking to a congressman who was sitting in front of me,

00:18:50.480 and he was talking about how his sons had served in Afghanistan. And I said, oh, you know, the soldiers

00:18:58.080 back home, they call. And when I'm chatting with them, they ask, you know, we gave up a lot. We lost

00:19:06.640 our brothers, our sisters. Was it really worth it? How do I answer these soldiers when they wonder if all

00:19:17.920 that sacrifice that has been made and treasure and blood was worth it? And he said, man, you're only

00:19:25.520 counting the casualties. What we can never calculate are the successes, the people we saved, the people

00:19:33.840 who didn't die. So that was one message I took away. And then we also met with actual members of

00:19:42.000 parliament who were soldiers on the front lines of Ukraine, but who were allowed to come to this

00:19:48.000 conference. And I said, you know, the people in my writing really would like to be side by side with

00:19:54.080 you after they had trained you and but still be with you right now to help you through this conflict.

00:20:01.760 And he said, well, will you tell them that every success we have is because of that training.

00:20:08.000 Our successes are your successes. Well said. Carrie Lynn.

00:20:15.120 Well, I think conservatives have a stalwart history of patriotism and backing our military and

00:20:24.000 sometimes through very hard times and hard choices we've made as a government, too, to deploy in times

00:20:30.160 of conflict. In my own writing of South Surrey White Rock, we started a Canadian Walk for Veterans.

00:20:36.480 And this is something that's five years in now. We have 151 cities participating and even

00:20:45.040 people walking in Australia and the Netherlands because we don't interact enough with our military

00:20:51.520 as a Canadian public. Most of the bases have been moved away from urban centers. It's one of the

00:20:57.600 issues with recruitment is that a lot of people don't understand it. But conservatives know the

00:21:04.160 sacrifice. We appreciate it. And we want to always be shoulder to shoulder with our serving men and

00:21:11.120 women and our veterans, many of whom come back with unseen injuries that they deal with for a lifetime. 0.83

00:21:18.160 So I'm very proud of our commitment. And certainly a conservative government would take it all seriously.

00:21:26.880 And when we make announcements, we implement them. We don't make big announcements and then kind of figure

00:21:33.360 it out later or maybe let them lapse. We are true to our word. And I would like to see that going forward.

00:21:41.120 Well, thank you very much, both of you. Carrie Lynn Finley, a member of parliament for South Surrey

00:21:45.280 White Rock and the critic for national defense. Also beside her, Cheryl Gallant, a member of parliament

00:21:50.880 for Renfrew, Nipissing and Pembroke. Always a pleasure. Many more questions. Short on time,

00:21:56.320 sadly, but we'll get you back again. And we appreciate you joining in. As I said off the top,

00:22:00.560 this is probably a message you're not getting in the mainstream media. So please like, comment,

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00:22:09.280 Download it, listen to it on platforms like CastBox, iTunes, Google Play, Spotify,

00:22:13.440 you name it, it is out there. As always, low taxes, less government, more freedom. That's the blueprint.

The Blueprint: Canada's Conservative Podcast - July 12, 2022

Russia and Canada’s National Defence policy

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