The Candice Malcolm Show - Canada needs to side with the U.S. in ending the forever wars

00:00:00.000 I'm Candace Malcolm and welcome to The Candace Malcolm Show. We have a great episode for you.

00:00:10.400 Hope everyone had a wonderful weekend. Hope you had some time with your family and friends and

00:00:15.060 a nice relaxing one. And we're back into a crazy week. We're still reacting to what has happened

00:00:19.620 on Friday when President Donald Trump welcomed Ukrainian President Vladimir Zelensky into the

00:00:26.240 Oval Office. And well, let's just say things didn't go very well in that meeting. So we're

00:00:31.080 going to watch that clip, break it down. We're going to talk about the Canadian reaction, which

00:00:36.320 folks, it is just increasingly deranged. The idea that democracy is embodied by Ukraine and

00:00:44.120 Vladimir Zelensky is somehow the leader of the free world is just the most insane thing that

00:00:49.520 I have seen. And so we're going to talk about that. I am joined by two guests today. I'm

00:00:53.360 very excited about this conversation. So first we have Alex Zoltan, who is a crime reporter

00:00:57.480 at True North and also Marty Belanger, first time on the show. He's known online as Marty

00:01:03.520 Up North. So gentlemen, it's great to have you. Thanks for joining the show.

00:01:07.640 Hey, good to be here.

00:01:09.820 Okay. So let's go back to Friday afternoon. And we sort of had this historic moment, this

00:01:15.800 Oval Office address. This is something kind of fun about the White House, about the Trump

00:01:21.140 White House, is that you sort of have access to things that we would have never normally

00:01:25.280 had access to. So I don't know whose idea it was to have this sort of bilateral agreement

00:01:29.840 being negotiated sort of live on television. But things just sort of got deranged very quickly,

00:01:36.060 got derailed, sorry, very quickly. And it turned into quite a heated reaction and back and forth.

00:01:41.800 I'm sure you've seen this clip by now, but I just want to show.

00:01:43.800 To answer, before you get to the clip, to answer one of the questions, right? Like Trump 2.0 is

00:01:49.360 different than Trump 1.0. I did not, and I thought Trump 2.0 would be a little bit calmer

00:01:56.920 than the first one, but man, we're like, he's off to a great start. And that's the context for

00:02:01.800 the clip, I think. Like when he got elected, right? Remember a month ago, he was crazy with

00:02:06.640 executive orders and getting stuff done. And I remember joking, saying, what's he going to do

00:02:13.040 next? And we joked about, he's going to do peace in Ukraine and peace in Israel, like, you know,

00:02:18.000 big, other big things like that. And he's doing that, but he has a very crazy, weird way of getting

00:02:23.660 stuff accomplished, I think. It's totally unpredictable. You're right. And I mean, to be

00:02:28.400 honest, I'm almost surprised that this hasn't been dealt with already. I thought that this was going to

00:02:32.060 be something that Trump was able to skillfully put together kind of day one, like bring Putin

00:02:36.400 and Zelensky to the table. Nobody wants this war to go on. Everybody just, I mean, from my

00:02:41.220 perspective, I don't want wars. I don't like wars. I don't like the idea of young men out there

00:02:44.880 getting drafted onto the front line and killing each other, especially Ukrainians and Russians who

00:02:50.380 were more or less like brothers or cousins. I mean, it's so awful. I completely agree. We all

00:02:57.380 thought he was going to solve the war in Ukraine on day three of his presidency. Yes. So

00:03:02.040 obviously they're having some issues. And I think from this exchange, I mean, we'll show

00:03:05.440 it. It seems to me that it might be Vladimir Zelensky who is the obstacle to peace. So let's

00:03:09.500 play this clip.

00:03:12.200 Do you think that it's respectful to come to the Oval Office of the United States of America

00:03:16.860 and attack the administration that is trying to prevent the destruction of your country?

00:03:21.140 A lot of questions. Let's start from the beginning. First of all, during the war, everybody

00:03:26.760 has problems. Even you, but you have nice ocean and don't feel now, but you will feel it in

00:03:33.540 the future. God bless. You don't know that. God bless. God bless. You don't know that. You

00:03:37.160 will not have the war. Don't tell us what we're going to feel. We're going to feel very

00:03:40.720 good. You will feel influence. We're going to feel very good and very strong.

00:03:44.160 You will feel influence. You're right now not in a very good position. You've allowed yourself

00:03:48.920 to be in a very bad position. And he happens to be right about it. From the very beginning

00:03:52.900 of the war, Mr. President, I was... You're not in a good position. You don't have the cards

00:03:56.400 right now. With us, you start having cards. I'm not playing cards. But right now, you're

00:04:00.240 playing cards. I'm very serious, Mr. President. You're playing cards. I'm very serious.

00:04:02.980 You're gambling with the lives of millions of people.

00:04:05.600 So, I mean, you know, obviously, as part of a much longer exchange, I think it was like

00:04:11.340 an hour long back and forth. And at first, it seemed like it was going to be okay. I

00:04:16.220 look at Zelensky's body language there, and he just seems like a petulant child, like arms

00:04:20.440 crossed, huffing, kind of rolling his eyes, very angry. From my perspective, it's like,

00:04:25.640 you know, the Americans have invited you in. Trump wants to have peace. That is his objective.

00:04:30.740 That is his goal. And I think that's laudable. And, you know, he's already pledged that they're

00:04:35.000 going to have some kind of an economic deal afterwards. So Trump is there trying to negotiate.

00:04:39.600 And it seems to me that Zelensky just, I don't know if it was performative or he just, there

00:04:44.660 was some kind of a language barrier. Alex, I want to bring you in on this. Like, what was

00:04:47.780 your sort of takeaway from Friday afternoon? I thought everybody was really rude.

00:04:53.540 Across the board, really. Yeah. I thought the suit comment was particularly rude. Do you own a suit?

00:05:00.440 I thought that that was kind of belittling. But I also completely agree with you guys.

00:05:04.980 I want the war to end. Yeah. I mean, like, like, you know, if I got invited to the White House,

00:05:11.880 if I'm Zelensky and I get invited to the White House this week, I'm only thinking one thing. Oh,

00:05:17.500 good. You know, Trump wants to talk and I've heard Trump talking about wanting peace. I'm getting

00:05:22.380 invited to have that discussion. I'd be a little bit disappointed that Trump didn't use his power

00:05:29.060 to bring Putin and me, Zelensky, in the room together. But yeah, I got invited to meet with

00:05:36.660 Trump. So I'm going to go there and listen to him and then try and figure out how we advance this.

00:05:41.440 He looked like a man who, like you said, who either went there naively thinking, oh, I'm going to get

00:05:47.120 more money for my war. I'm going to convince them that I'm the good guy. Like he, they misread each

00:05:53.820 other is, is how I interpret this. And then, and then somehow along the way, they misread each

00:05:58.960 other. There's definitely a language barrier. I mean, when, you know, when Zelensky says things

00:06:03.340 like I had to listen to him two, three times to try and figure out what he meant in some instances,

00:06:07.140 like you're, you know, you got oceans, you're going to feel the, what he's saying is you're not

00:06:11.440 threatened by Russia because you have an ocean between you and them. But, you know, yeah. And,

00:06:17.380 but then I agree with Alex after a while, when you watch it, you go, okay, somebody should have

00:06:22.880 called a timeout because, um, it does happen in, in business and in politics, you get a little bit

00:06:28.400 too emotional and too passionate. And then somebody needs to call a timeout and everybody needs to

00:06:32.640 regroup, but they let this thing escalate. So at the end, they kind of all looked a bit foolish,

00:06:37.840 you know, especially because they're, they're supposed to be, um, leaders.

00:06:42.040 Yeah. Well, and, and, and like, okay, again, from perspective, so we had Zelensky in there and yeah,

00:06:48.640 he wasn't wearing a suit, which to me, it seemed a little weird. And then, I mean, you go back and

00:06:52.640 you look and it seems to be how he always dresses. He's wearing this sort of national Ukraine outfit.

00:06:57.300 Okay. We can forgive him for that. But there were other points to it, uh, Alex, like he kept

00:07:01.900 referring to the vice president by his first name, JD, which to me was so disrespectful. Like, you know,

00:07:08.440 Vance himself was calling him Mr. President. And then in response,

00:07:12.040 Zelensky was calling him by his first name, which to me was sort of like pejorative. Right. And so, I mean,

00:07:18.080 whoever's idea it was to have it out in front of the press, like there's no way to really call a timeout

00:07:21.980 because the press is there and they're egging them on. Um, but it just, it just, to me, it's to me,

00:07:26.580 I think I watched the exchange and just from my perspective, it seemed to me that Zelensky was just

00:07:32.060 lacking any kind of like gratitude or graciousness or like even not recognition of the support that the

00:07:38.200 Americans have given. And a few times he said, we're, we're completely by ourselves. We're at this

00:07:41.940 alone. And it's like, well, it's not really true when the United States has pledged what hundreds

00:07:45.440 of billions, $250 billion. And so to me, I, I, I mean, everyone can view that differently. Um,

00:07:52.440 it seems that I am on the opposite side of the Canadian establishment because just about every

00:07:55.960 Canadian leader came out with the opposite side saying that Zelensky was right. So let's just go

00:08:01.000 to Justin Trudeau. He wrote on X following exchange. He said, Russia illegally and unjustifiably

00:08:05.660 invaded Ukraine for three years. Now, Ukrainians have fought with courage and resilience.

00:08:09.540 Their fight for democracy, freedom, and sovereignty is a fight that matters to us all. Canada will

00:08:14.480 continue to stand with Ukraine and Ukrainians in achieving a just and lasting peace. Um, not

00:08:19.820 surprising there, I guess, because that's sort of been his position all along. Pierre Pauling of

00:08:23.860 the conservative leader, similarly put out a similar message, maybe not as strong, but he said,

00:08:28.500 as leader of Canada's common sense conservatives, I've always been clear. We stand with Ukraine in its

00:08:32.880 defense against Vladimir Putin's illegal invasion. I also firmly believe that the future of Ukraine

00:08:37.920 must be determined by the Ukrainian people. Conservatives will always stand on the side

00:08:41.700 of freedom and democracy. Now that seems a little simplified for me, right? Like no one's denying that

00:08:47.000 Vladimir Putin invaded and that it was illegal and it was reckless and that it was horrible. Like

00:08:50.920 Putin's not in the right here. But this idea that Ukraine is like the personification of freedom

00:08:57.000 and democracy. Like, I'm sorry, I don't buy that. I don't think that Ukraine is a democracy. They were

00:09:01.300 supposed to have elections last year in April of 2024, and they canceled them because they have martial law

00:09:06.120 because they're in this war. So the idea is like, let's end the war. Let's end the war. Let's find

00:09:11.380 a way to negotiate peace and not prolong this awful war. And let's stop pretending that Ukraine is the

00:09:17.660 leader of the free world or that Vladimir Zelensky is a leading democracy. Go ahead, Martin.

00:09:22.840 If we put it into a weird context, well, not weird, but Ukraine is a proxy war. Like these little,

00:09:29.600 I mean, like if you play the game of risk, Ukraine is one of the strategies. You win risk by controlling

00:09:34.880 Ukraine. And it's a proxy war, but it's an interesting time because in this, we've had

00:09:41.500 proxy wars like this for the last 50 years. And people usually took the American or the Russian

00:09:46.760 side. This is an interesting one because people are taking the Ukrainian side, the guys that are

00:09:52.340 being played. And in every proxy war we've had, whether it's Afghanistan, Iraq, Vietnam, Cuba,

00:09:58.600 places like that, the middle guys have always been fairly innocent, the people, but the leaders on

00:10:07.720 the inside that are used in these proxy wars, they've always been evil, like easily manipulated

00:10:12.960 who've thrown their own people under the bus. So I'm trying to weave a story. I don't think you,

00:10:18.100 it's weird that we are suddenly calling Ukraine, yeah, democratic. Like the pattern does,

00:10:24.480 it repeats itself and there's nothing, there's nothing democratic about what's going on in

00:10:29.180 Ukraine. Wasn't prior to, and hasn't been since in the last three, four years, like nothing democratic.

00:10:34.900 What's your take, Alex? Yeah. So there's also kind of this weird fallacious opinion I'm seeing,

00:10:41.140 especially on the political left, that we have never made concessions to Russia before.

00:10:45.620 Um, I don't know if they've ever read a book on world war two, but we gave Russia all of Eastern

00:10:53.060 Europe, um, really less than one lifetime ago. So if we were to give them Donbass, I mean, I think

00:10:59.640 that that would be a terrible defeat for the Ukrainians. And I still have a lot of sympathy

00:11:02.600 for them because as Marty mentioned, they're the victims in all of this, but it's certainly not

00:11:06.620 historically unprecedented. It's an interesting take. Yeah. I mean, I tend to agree that I think

00:11:11.720 that like at the beginning, so this has been going on for three years, right? For me, I had a bit of

00:11:16.520 skepticism at the very beginning because it seemed like all of the people who were being like

00:11:20.620 particularly insane and nasty over COVID and the trucker convoy, the freedom convoy, all of a sudden,

00:11:26.140 like overnight, all those people started putting Ukraine flags in their bio. And you saw the same

00:11:29.980 sort of propaganda machine in the CBC and Canadian media, like telling us that we had to support

00:11:34.660 Ukraine. Whenever that happens, I'm like a little skeptical. We did a bit of a deep dive here at the

00:11:38.760 Kenneth Malcolm show on Chrysia Freeland and her ties to Ukraine nationalists and this whole idea

00:11:43.540 of like Nazi strongholds in that country. And there's a lot of validity there. Like, I don't

00:11:48.240 think that Ukraine is necessarily a good actor, but this idea that it's three years later and we're

00:11:53.780 still litigating the same thing. We're still like pretending. I mean, I'm just going to go through

00:11:57.400 some of the particularly bad takes and then I'll get to you, Marty. But okay, this is on the Canadian

00:12:02.180 political right. These are conservatives. These are people who are supposed to be in favor of like

00:12:07.220 freedom. And I mean, I just think they're wrong. So we'll start with Spencer Fernando,

00:12:11.040 who is a conservative writer. He puts this on X. Ukraine is now leader of the free world. Okay.

00:12:16.660 I've never seen a post get ratioed quite like this one, but it's just a strange thing. I mean,

00:12:22.740 I get it. Yeah. Vladimir Zelensky put on a show in the Oval Office and a bunch of people in the EU,

00:12:28.780 like every EU leader came out in support where you see like leader after leader after leader throwing

00:12:33.540 their support behind Vladimir Zelensky, calling Trump a bully and saying that they side with

00:12:37.920 Zelensky in this war. Not surprising. Trudeau also jumps in on that. But you know, this idea that a

00:12:44.320 country like Ukraine is a leader, Adam Zivo, who writes for the National Post, he had a column over

00:12:49.480 the weekend and he just writes that Zelensky's visitor White House imploded Friday after Trump

00:12:53.960 and Vance berated and gaslit the wartime leader. The behavior demonstrated yet again how the Trump

00:12:59.000 administration cannot be trusted as a reliable security partner. Then of course, Andrew Coyne

00:13:04.280 with the Globe and Mail writes, never better display of Zelensky's courage than today. Never

00:13:09.760 clear that Trump Vance are on the side of the Kremlin. Never more obvious that the democratic world must

00:13:14.600 unite in defense of Ukraine and in defiance of the United States. So America's now the enemy,

00:13:20.840 I guess, in Ukraine is this like wonderful partner, Kaveh Sharus, who I usually have a lot of time

00:13:25.400 for. He was an attempted conservative candidate and he's a scholar, very good on Iran. But this is

00:13:32.360 this is what he says today about Ukraine. He says, Ukraine is the moral test of our time. Standing

00:13:38.320 with Ukraine means standing for the most basic moral principles that the powerful shouldn't be able to

00:13:44.960 just take what belongs to the weak whenever they wish. Anyone against Ukraine today can't be an ally in

00:13:51.600 any democratic cause. I mean, that just seems like very extreme. Like I think like even for me, look,

00:13:59.760 I don't claim to be the like moral arbiter in this dispute. I just happen to be skeptical of Ukraine.

00:14:06.400 And I don't want to fund wars. I don't want to fund them. And I think that this is over now. Like we need

00:14:10.560 to find a way to have peace. Even if we don't agree with the borders, I'd rather have that. But this idea

00:14:14.720 that like if you if you don't agree with these people in Ukraine, that you can't even be part of the

00:14:18.880 conversation on democracy. It just seems like really, really we'll get back to this. But let

00:14:23.280 let me so let me let me weave this story. Right. So first of all, let's go back quickly to the

00:14:27.680 interview to the to the discussion. It should have been held then private first and then they should

00:14:32.560 have come out in front of the media. Trump has a very particular way of doing things. If he loves you,

00:14:37.520 like the Prime Minister of Japan, he invites you, he puts you on a podium, brags about you,

00:14:42.080 he takes the selfie and he shares it. If he doesn't like you like Trudeau, he makes you sit over there

00:14:47.680 and you take the selfie and, you know, do whatever you want. So if so Trump, in this instance, it's

00:14:54.800 to me, it's clear that he was sending a message to Zelensky, he brought him, he brought him to the

00:15:00.160 carpet and he gave him a beat down. Now, why back to my theory on proxy wars, there have been proxy wars

00:15:08.800 in the past between Russia and the Americans. And eventually the poor scapegoat in the middle,

00:15:16.400 how does it end for them? How did it end for Muammar Gaddafi, for Saddam Hussein,

00:15:20.160 for those guys? They didn't get an invitation to the White House to to be, you know, beat down.

00:15:25.760 They got terminated. And so Zelensky is kind of in that situation. But the difference between

00:15:32.080 Zelensky and the other guys is that Zelensky, his his war was in an era that's different than the

00:15:39.680 others. And he got to play the media and he got to play all sorts of things and he got sympathy.

00:15:43.920 So he does appear as a good guy. And Canadians and lots of people in the world, as we know,

00:15:49.600 are easily conned. So this has been going on forever. So one of the last tweets you said there

00:15:54.960 where, you know, that said it's kind of a moment in history, perhaps the moment in history here is

00:15:59.680 that we might finally get to see that the Americans and Russians have actually been fighting each other

00:16:04.320 for a long time. And maybe we will finally get a real peace. But but I think I think Zelensky in

00:16:12.080 Ukraine is no different than what we've seen many, many times in the past, except that Zelensky managed

00:16:17.200 to get a lot of sympathy from a lot of people and a lot of money to a lot of money. They always do.

00:16:22.320 What do you what do you what do you take away from all of these sort of conservative voices? Not not only, I think,

00:16:29.040 kind of taking the wrong position on this exchange, kind of the Trump derangement vision of this exchange,

00:16:34.480 but saying that if you're not a reliable ally on this one issue, you can't be part of the discussion

00:16:40.000 anymore. Yeah, well, give Adam Zivo some credit, because he went there to Ukraine, and he experienced

00:16:46.560 it himself. So I'm not speaking about him when I make these comments. But I am speaking about the

00:16:50.640 others. It's really easy to support a war that's halfway around the world that involves

00:16:54.560 nobody you know, or anybody in your direct circle, or even by several degrees of separation.

00:16:59.920 If the Americans were to put people on the ground, like they did in Vietnam,

00:17:04.080 you'd see people getting pretty upset pretty quickly.

00:17:07.760 Okay, and then what about what about to Adam Zivo, like just because he went there, you think that he's

00:17:12.720 more credible? Like, what about what about his thing that you had here?

00:17:15.920 I think it gives him some authority. Certainly, as you can see, I'm in Ukraine right now,

00:17:19.120 my lights just went out. I shouldn't say that. Yeah, I mean, he went there. So kudos to him.

00:17:28.640 It's an important thing to do on the ground journalism. And I think that that was very

00:17:32.400 brave of him. And I think that does make him a bit of an authority on the subject.

00:17:35.920 I can't necessarily say the same thing about the others, though.

00:17:38.400 But your question was specific, Candace, right? You're you asked specifically about the

00:17:43.120 conservatives. Like, can you can you rephrase your question or ask it again? Like,

00:17:47.040 yeah, I'll put it to you, Marty. So, you know, I would kind of expect this from Trudeau. Trudeau

00:17:52.400 just seems to be like the current thing guy that like, whatever the popular thing on the political

00:17:56.400 left to progressives are, he's gonna be the champion of that thing, whether it's like, well,

00:17:59.520 progressive politics, or I mean, the Ukraine stuff. I mean, he seems to have a personal

00:18:04.160 friendship with Vladimir Zelensky. But but but then on the on the right side, like, like,

00:18:08.800 in the United States with the Republicans, it seems like there's almost now a consensus that

00:18:12.160 they think this is a waste of time and money, and they just don't really want to fund it anymore.

00:18:15.760 And yet in Canada, when it comes to more conservative minded, like leaders, I would say

00:18:20.720 people like I don't know if you can consider Andrew Coyne a conservative anymore. He was long

00:18:24.480 kind of thought about that way. But I don't think he can be anymore. People like Spencer Fernando,

00:18:27.920 who has long been like a writer and advocate for small C conservative values in Canada,

00:18:34.000 him taking this position, and then some of the others. I mean, I saw Adam Ziva's point,

00:18:38.800 we can disagree. Cavy Shiraz is another one, like he's, he works with me. If you don't put the names

00:18:44.320 of the people making those posts, you'd have a hard time knowing what side of the of the political

00:18:49.360 spectrum they're on. Right? Yes. In Canada, more than my question is, like, why is it that the

00:18:55.040 conservative establishment is on the same side with the left on this issue? Well, when it comes to Adam

00:19:01.360 Ziva, I just wanted, like, I don't agree with what he says. But I think when you stand in the firing

00:19:04.960 line, you get the privilege of kind of being able to say whatever you want. Yeah, no, I'm not talking

00:19:10.400 about him. Sorry, I'll put that to you, Marty. So why is it that the Canadian conservative

00:19:15.040 leaders have the same position as the left on this issue?

00:19:17.920 I think it's, they're looking at the popular opinion, and they're just, like, Canadian

00:19:24.560 conservatives are always afraid to be conservative and to go against the popular opinion. I mean,

00:19:30.080 they, everything they say is based on polling. I'm convinced of that. So, you know, and they're

00:19:36.800 battling the liberals right now, we see it in the polls. So they're moving to the center, and

00:19:41.680 and their, their opinion is hard to distinguish. I, I, that's one aspect. I think the other aspect,

00:19:48.160 too, is, you know, it's easier to say, to fool someone than to get them to admit that they've

00:19:52.560 been fooled. And so this is a hard pill for a lot of people to swallow, including senior politicians

00:19:57.920 like Poiliev or whoever are making these comments that they're not going to suddenly say, you know,

00:20:04.160 oh, we got fooled and Ukraine is the bad or Zelensky is the bad guy in this one. So it's,

00:20:08.960 it's, it's just, it's one, it's one aspect of politicians that I, that I detest, which is they're,

00:20:13.840 they, they, they're so reluctant to admit that they were wrong. Well, I want to go. So on Sunday,

00:20:18.800 Pierre Polyev was speaking at a press conference in Ottawa. He was specifically asked about this

00:20:23.600 question on this issue, and he, well, let's play the clip and then we can react to it.

00:20:29.520 We support Ukraine and its right to defend itself and to be independent. The aggressor in this

00:20:35.440 conflict is Russia. Russia carried out an unprovoked invasion of Ukraine, an invasion

00:20:41.840 that has been mercilessly prosecuting for the last three years. And Ukraine has been the victim of that

00:20:47.680 invasion. All democracies need to stand with Ukrainians and their right to defend themselves

00:20:53.840 and reclaim their territory. And any suggestion to the contrary is wrong.

00:21:02.000 So it kind of just repeating what he put in his, in his tweet there. And I think later on,

00:21:06.480 he did talk about the need for basically like Canada could have played a bigger role in this.

00:21:12.240 Had we agreed to like sell our oil, like we could have used Canadian LNG and energy to,

00:21:19.600 so that Europe didn't have to buy Russian oil and gas. And, and basically this idea that we could

00:21:25.600 have lowered Europe's energy costs, lower their reliance on Russia and created jobs at home if we

00:21:31.120 had just done something different. So I think it's good to sort of pivot away from the issue when

00:21:35.440 Polyev senses that it could be divided. Because I don't think that the consensus is there in Canada

00:21:40.640 like it is in the US. Maybe it's because we have a larger Ukrainian population in Canada. I don't,

00:21:44.960 I don't know what that's, that's a good, actually, that's a point. The fact that we have a large

00:21:49.120 population, but, but think about Polyev's comments. Like, imagine if we go back to, I don't know,

00:21:53.760 2002, when Russia invades Afghanistan, would Polyev have stood there and said, hey, you know,

00:22:00.640 Russia's the aggressor and everybody has the right to defend themselves and blah, blah, blah. The difference

00:22:04.800 would have been back then that Afghanistan was considered not a democracy and perhaps more of an

00:22:10.320 enemy. So then Polyev defends it. He's defending Ukraine. And he's using the excuse that Ukraine

00:22:17.360 is a democracy. And which is also an interesting thing, because that's what, if I was talking to

00:22:23.120 Polyev on the stage right now, it's like, how can you make that stretch? How can you say that Ukraine

00:22:27.520 is a democracy? Like, based on what? Well, okay, let's look, let's get into this, because Marty,

00:22:33.040 you shared this clip from the Joe Rogan podcast episode 1880 with Tulsi Gabbard, which was recorded

00:22:38.400 eight months ago. And in this, they go to, this is super interesting. They go to a clip of Stephen

00:22:44.720 Colbert report, Colbert report, where he is talking to an editor and sort of like an insider

00:22:50.720 in the Obama administration. So 2014, kind of almost like predicting this war and, and, and talking again

00:22:58.320 about how, I mean, to me, this is, this is not predicting it. He's explaining it. He's selling it.

00:23:02.880 He's selling it on the, on the news. He's what he's doing. Yeah. So like this idea that Ukraine

00:23:08.560 was a buffer state, right? It's like, it's like between Europe and Russia, and it's going to remain

00:23:13.840 neutral and it has to always remain neutral so that the two, the two sides can never clash. And then

00:23:19.040 this is basically him saying, you know, our American strategy is to break that, that neutrality, push our

00:23:26.160 people and push our side and, you know, replace any kind of like Russian government with a pro-American

00:23:31.920 guy. Like, like this is, this is the kind of stuff that, that I think part of the reason that Trump has

00:23:37.040 been elected in the United States, because people don't want these like regime change machines

00:23:42.000 happening in Washington. They don't want the American government to basically dismantle a foreign

00:23:48.320 government. So they disagree with us. So anyway, we'll, we'll watch this clip. It's super interesting.

00:23:51.760 And then we'll react. I think it's on the longer side. I think it's two or three minutes here,

00:23:54.800 but let's play the clip and then I'll get your reaction. Mr. Rose, thank you so much for being

00:23:58.640 here. There's the magazine Foreign Affairs. Now, now, now, now Gideon, uh, help me out here.

00:24:07.840 We've got a, we've got a battle. The Ukraine, some of them want to go into the EU, the European Union.

00:24:13.120 Right. Uh, and some of them want to stay with Russia. If the Ukraine's not in Europe right now,

00:24:17.600 what continent is it on? Well, it's part of Eurasia, but it's part of Eastern Europe and the former

00:24:22.480 Soviet bloc. It's basically Robin to Russia's Batman. And the challenge here, the challenge

00:24:29.920 here is to try to attract it to the West to get it to flip sides. So the rebels in the streets,

00:24:35.440 what are they fighting for? They're fighting for a better future. Countries have a development.

00:24:39.280 That sounds like a political speech. No, but it's actually true. Countries have to develop over time.

00:24:44.160 And Ukraine basically after it, the, uh, end of the Soviet Union faced two tracks. It could stay a sort of

00:24:49.440 stagnant, corrupt, authoritarian country tied to Russia, or it could essentially join the West.

00:24:55.760 It could modernize, liberalize, become a democracy. Uh, at the last minute, when it looked like it was

00:25:00.720 going to trade up from its sort of, uh, abusive relationship with its boyfriend from the hood

00:25:05.200 to a nice yuppie, uh, uh... You're not loading these choices in any way whatsoever.

00:25:10.080 It's actually true. When it looked like it was going to trade up to a better, uh, environment,

00:25:14.960 uh, at the last minute, Putin offered a bribe. How much? Uh, $15 billion. Uh...

00:25:19.360 That's a lot of cash, man. It's a lot of cash. And the president,

00:25:21.680 who himself was tied to the old elites and the eastern part of the country who ties to Russia,

00:25:26.640 decided to back off the change and go join Russia. Do you know how many pirate-themed

00:25:30.720 restaurants you can buy with $15 billion? The problem was the western parts of the country

00:25:36.000 and the younger parts of the country and the more modern liberal parts of the country

00:25:39.360 basically knew that they had no future being Russia's, Russia's vassal, and so they took to the streets.

00:25:44.480 Is America taking sides in this in any way? If these people, the rebels are winning right now,

00:25:49.600 right? Yes, just recently. Why isn't Obama spiking the ball in the end zone and calling

00:25:54.080 Putin and saying, hey, you might have won the medal count, but we won the country count, biatch?

00:26:01.280 Okay, so that was Gideon Rose, who was the, uh, editor of Foreign Affairs magazine,

00:26:06.160 and he was a member of the Council on Foreign Relations, talking about a book. I mean,

00:26:09.760 it's so weird to see them kind of making light about it and joking about it,

00:26:12.960 but this is the kind of stuff that happens, and this is, I think, something that so many people,

00:26:16.480 especially on the political right, but it used to be an issue of the political left. I mean,

00:26:19.840 I remember when I was in university and the Iraq War and the Afghanistan War,

00:26:23.600 the people that opposed those wars were on the political left. Now, it seems that they're on

00:26:27.520 the political right, but this idea that America, like, basically meddles with the playing field and

00:26:33.280 installs these governments and then goes on TV and laughs about it. I mean, it's infuriating. What's your take,

00:26:38.560 Marty? It's exactly that. I mean, it's, it's fascinating to see these old clips that, that,

00:26:43.840 I love the internet for that. You can find these old clips. That, that, uh, Gideon is basically,

00:26:48.400 yeah, he's an insider who's going on the, on the new, on the talk show, a comedy talk show,

00:26:54.160 and the light banter is, it's all scripted, and he's basically, uh, telling people what they're about

00:26:59.920 to do. And, and, and, and they went and did it. I mean, yeah, like Ukraine is the bread basket of,

00:27:05.920 of, of Europe. I mean, the, the amount of food that comes in there, like I said, it's on,

00:27:10.240 it, it's so strategic. I was surprised that the Russians let it go when they did, when the

00:27:16.400 federation broke apart, because all the rich, uh, uh, Russians had properties on the Black Sea and on,

00:27:23.840 and like the resorts are there. I mean, we never even knew about those resorts until after, like,

00:27:28.400 you know, uh, just before the war in Ukraine, it was popular to go there and visit these resorts.

00:27:33.840 They're gorgeous. And, and it was super corrupt. I, I just want to bring out one other thing,

00:27:38.640 one really, really weird thing, but you know, when COVID ended, when the war in Ukraine started,

00:27:44.960 as soon as the war, as soon as the war in Ukraine started, we stopped talking about you, uh, COVID,

00:27:49.920 and all the people pushing the COVID narratives went, oh, thank God it's over. We can move on.

00:27:54.560 And now you're seeing that with the war in Ukraine. A lot of people that are,

00:27:59.680 I'm surprised that the conservatives are not flipping quickly and, and, and going with Trump,

00:28:04.320 but you know, get on the right side of history and Trump is exposing what's going on. And, and if you

00:28:09.680 continue down this path, you're going to be, you're going to be a fool.

00:28:13.040 Well, I agree. I think that was the first thing that gave me skepticism was I was watching the

00:28:17.520 trucker convoy and all the people who were trying to say that these people are MAGA funded and they're

00:28:22.560 extremists and they're Nazis or whatever. It was like the same exact accounts suddenly like turn

00:28:26.960 on a dime and start pushing this Ukraine thing. And from my perspective, like, as soon as I just,

00:28:32.000 like someone sent me a tip, showed me this picture of Chrysia Freeland, um, with this kind of Ukraine

00:28:36.720 nationalist, um, scarf on. And I, and I posted it and I'm like, you know, this is a extreme group in,

00:28:43.200 you know, the Banderas and, and having a bit of the context of like who that was, Ukrainian leader,

00:28:48.320 um, who collaborated and worked with the Nazis. Um, and then this is who Chrysia Freeland is

00:28:53.680 promoting. And then all of a sudden I'm called the Putin chill. And I had like people in the

00:28:57.440 government and people in the liberal establishment saying that I'm, that I must be funded by Putin.

00:29:01.040 I'm like, I don't like Putin. I'm not a fan of Putin. I'm just raising questions here. And a lot

00:29:04.880 of it coming from tips from viewers. And to me, that really showed like, it was like, it was,

00:29:10.560 you could see the work of a propaganda machine, propaganda campaign at work playing out online.

00:29:15.520 And that, to me, that was what made me skeptical of it. Alex, I want to bring

00:29:18.880 you in on all this. Um, like when you, when you look back and you see clips, uh, or, I mean,

00:29:24.160 even the idea that it was the Biden administration and Kamala Harris that were kind of like openly

00:29:28.560 talking about bringing Ukraine into NATO, into the European union, that the, the idea that it's

00:29:34.560 supposed to be a neutral buffer zone. And they're just kind of like, nope, that's not going to be the

00:29:38.000 case anymore. I'm not saying that I support Putin at all. I think the war has been terrible.

00:29:42.960 And obviously it's an illegal invasion. Um, but it's not, it's not as black and white as they

00:29:48.000 paint it. Yeah. I mean, it's definitely surreal to see, as Marty had mentioned, the, the political

00:29:53.200 right now becoming the peaceniks versus the political left. But I wonder how much of that

00:29:57.040 is just a by-product of the American political system and the two party system. They do tend to

00:30:01.440 flip flop on a lot of different issues over time. So I don't know if that's terribly surprising.

00:30:07.040 If I could backtrack just slightly to Paul Yev's position on the Ukraine war, I think what's

00:30:11.280 happening here. And again, I don't necessarily agree with his position, but I think it's some

00:30:14.960 good political calculus because let's be honest here. 99% of the people in Canada who support Trump

00:30:20.960 are already voting for Paul Yev. He doesn't need their vote. He needs votes from the middle.

00:30:26.320 Right. And so, so it's really quite smart for him to position himself as somebody who Trump doesn't

00:30:32.480 like. Right. So that's how he's going to secure a lot of those 65 and older, you know, the grandma

00:30:37.760 vote, let's be honest here, who think that he's extreme right and so on and so forth.

00:30:41.680 I just, I think that's wrong. I think that that calculation, I mean, like in order to win an

00:30:46.000 election, you have to motivate your base and it's the base that are going to go out. They're going to

00:30:49.680 make phone calls. They're going to volunteer. They're going to drive people to the polls. Like,

00:30:52.800 like the people that you really need are your star. And I think if anything, what the conservatives

00:30:56.880 should have taken away from the last two election defeats is that when they alienate that base to try to

00:31:01.600 move to the center, it doesn't work out for them. They don't actually win. Like to me, I would rather

00:31:05.680 see a strong, like unequivocally conservative government. And otherwise, I mean, you even,

00:31:10.720 you have the PPCs, right? So people, they have another place to go or they can stay home. We saw

00:31:15.200 this in Ontario, just, you know, the voter turnout for Doug Ford was abysmal, right? It was like 46%

00:31:21.040 of the province came out and voted. So conservatives stayed at home. Now for Ford, he didn't need that

00:31:26.320 extra 10% of the base because there's no real opposition. But in Canada, there is. I mean,

00:31:30.960 maybe if it was Trudeau and it was going to be a walk in the park for Paglia, but he has a serious

00:31:36.240 contender now in Mark Carney. And I don't think that he can just rely on the centrally conservative

00:31:40.800 people to show up. I don't know that they will. Yeah, I agree. I mean, I don't, I don't think

00:31:44.960 that's the theme of the show for today, but we'll go there for a few minutes. I mean, I think moving to

00:31:50.000 the center, if, if both parties move to the center and they make this an election about resumes and

00:31:55.600 personalities, Carney could win this one on personality and resume and, and credentials,

00:32:01.200 but, and, and I agree. I'd love, I'd love conservatives, Canadian conservative leaders

00:32:06.240 to be like Ron DeSantis or, or, or somebody like that, that have proven that you can be conservative

00:32:12.480 and win an election. But there's a, I think conservatives in this country are afraid that

00:32:16.960 being conservative won't win you an election. I, I completely agree. Okay. I want to go back to this

00:32:21.920 side of your switch. Cause I, I, we still have a couple of things to get to. I want to first play,

00:32:26.400 uh, this is Tulsi Gabbard on TikTok. Um, just kind of going through Zelensky and saying like,

00:32:32.960 this guy is not your ally. Like this is not a good model for like freedom and democracy in the West.

00:32:39.200 Let's play that clip. Ukraine's president Zelensky has just banned yet another political opposition

00:32:45.760 party. One that questioned his legitimacy as president and use Ukraine's department of

00:32:51.680 justice to mandate the seizure of this party's members assets. Now, this is just the latest

00:32:57.360 of Zelensky's actions to do this sort of thing. He began banning major political opposition parties

00:33:02.880 in 2022, when he also started banning TV channels that were associated with his political opponents.

00:33:10.240 And he took over total control of Ukraine's largest television networks now controlled by their

00:33:15.680 government. Zelensky's presidential term ended on May 20th. He canceled elections in the name

00:33:21.840 of martial law, suspending Ukraine's constitution so that he could stay in power. So this is the

00:33:29.280 perspective obviously of the Trump administration. So on Sunday, we had the 2025 London summit on Ukraine.

00:33:35.840 So Western leaders quickly got together European leaders. Plus there's Justin Trudeau. Um,

00:33:41.040 they're all standing with, with Vladimir Zelensky. And just again, to counter the point that you were

00:33:46.960 trying to make there, Alex, you had Maxi Bernier, uh, come in and posted the following on X. He wrote

00:33:52.960 of these leaders, he said, these globalist losers fatally weakened their economies and societies with

00:33:58.560 wokeism, mass immigration, unsustainable spending, destructive energy policies, and climate hysteria.

00:34:04.480 Now they want to ramp up a pointless war against Russia while antagonizing the US suicidal.

00:34:10.240 Well, what's your, what's your take from that, Alex? What do you, what do you think of Bernie's

00:34:13.680 response? I like Bernie's response for sure. But I think that the PPC is a terrible party to vote for.

00:34:20.720 I mean, you might as well do a write in ballot for yourself at that point. And they're kind of

00:34:24.880 irrelevant and unelectable. You can say all sorts of things that I like. It doesn't mean that I would

00:34:29.200 vote for him because at the end of the day, it's, it's political, right? Like you,

00:34:33.360 politics is a game about winning. It's not about a game about saying the best things.

00:34:38.960 If you replayed that clip, don't replay it, but if you replayed that Tulsi clip, the last one,

00:34:44.080 and you replace the word, uh, Ukraine with, uh, Canada, and you replace the word Zelensky with

00:34:50.160 Trudeau, it would ring true. Like, you know, she's, she's critical of a, of a, of a country that has

00:34:56.880 censored, uh, its people remove politicians that are, that are, uh, problematic. Uh, like all those

00:35:04.080 things we've, you know, the liberals have done all of that. Um, Max is critical of the liberals and he's

00:35:10.480 spot on when he does that. I mean, the, you know, and so, which also explains why, of course, if you're

00:35:16.720 a liberal in Canada right now, you're going to try and defend, um, Ukraine and praise Zelensky because

00:35:24.400 you're praising a man who's doing exactly what your party is doing. And so you can't come out and

00:35:28.960 criticize Zelensky. If a liberal came out and criticized Zelensky for censorship or, or jailing

00:35:34.800 dissidents or freezing bank accounts, what would we do? We'd go, well, you did all those things. So

00:35:40.080 they're caught in, uh, which again, I'm surprised. Like if I was a conservative, I would be hammering

00:35:45.920 on the liberals and Zelensky all through this, but I don't know why they didn't.

00:35:50.960 I tend to agree with that. And I want to bring this in because Jagmeet Singh in the midst of all

00:35:54.880 of this, right? So prepare us before you show up. It's frustrating enough to have Justin Trudeau,

00:36:02.000 who should be on his way out. Like he, I just don't like him going and spending all of his time

00:36:05.840 on international stage representing us like that. Okay. That's bad enough. But then

00:36:09.920 on top of that, you have sort of his partner in crime Jagmeet Singh, who in a regular world

00:36:14.720 wouldn't really have any voice. He wouldn't have any standing in on an international stage

00:36:20.080 in representing Canada, but because of the situation where he props up the liberals,

00:36:23.600 he has this importance and you have to take what he says seriously, but he's, he's crazy. I'm sorry.

00:36:29.200 He's very framed on this issue. So he wants to kick the US out of the G7. He's calling on Trudeau

00:36:36.160 to not allow Donald Trump into the country saying no to president Trump. He is saying that he should

00:36:41.760 not be allowed to attend the G7 leaders summit, which is coming up in Canabascus, Ontario. Sorry,

00:36:48.720 Canabascus, Alberta. We have a clip from him and here he is basically just saying that Trump is a

00:36:53.440 fascist and we shouldn't let him into Canada. Here's that clip. I also believe we need to ban

00:36:59.040 Donald Trump from attending the G7 summit. Donald Trump should not be welcome here. Why would we

00:37:07.040 invite someone who has threatened our very democracy, our very sovereignty?

00:37:14.480 So, um, Justin Trudeau to his credit said that, that Singh is being irresponsible and that that's

00:37:20.560 obviously not going to happen, but at the same time, you know, we're talking about it. And so we

00:37:25.600 have to take seriously what this individual has to say. My perspective is that Canada needs to

00:37:30.400 deepen its ties with the United States and we should make greater efforts to be a partner

00:37:35.040 and to be part of the North American team. Uh, what's your position, Marty?

00:37:39.200 Hard to be a bigger partner. I mean, we're already like their biggest partner. I mean,

00:37:43.440 you know, 70% of their trade is with us. We're like it or not. We're in bed together.

00:37:48.000 Yeah, but not in rhetoric. I mean, the fact that our leader, I'm part of the part of the reason

00:37:50.960 that is because Justin Trudeau takes every opportunity he can to criticize and to make

00:37:57.680 like disparaging comments towards president Trump at this point, I, you know, you, you, you're right.

00:38:03.520 I mean, when, when, when Trudeau handed in his resignation, like in the private sector,

00:38:08.480 I, if he handed in his resignation and said, I'm going to stay on for another two weeks,

00:38:12.160 I would have said, no, here's your two weeks of pay. Get the hell out. We're letting him go around

00:38:16.160 and do things, which is crazy and dangerous. And I, and I do believe, yeah. And I do believe there

00:38:21.600 is a scorched earth, uh, kind of policy at this point that, that, that Trudeau is going to continue

00:38:26.960 to aggravate Trump because it helps, uh, his party longterm. Um, you know, and, and, and then back to

00:38:35.600 Singh, I mean, you know, like saying again, the hypocrisy of him saying that, uh, Trump is a,

00:38:41.440 a threat to democracy. I'm like, come on saying like you, Mr. Singh, you, you, you propped up a

00:38:48.160 minority government for four years for your own benefit. Like you're the threat to our democracy

00:38:52.960 in this country. So, um, I can't take saying with any kind of, I've had people try to convince me that

00:39:00.400 he's actually an intelligent man and he's just really, really, really good at playing politics.

00:39:05.600 And I'm like, you're playing politics with people's lives at this point. It's not, it's,

00:39:10.800 it's not good politics. Is it bad politics? I can't buy that argument because if he was

00:39:15.360 actually good at politics, he wouldn't be driving around Ottawa in a Maserati. He wouldn't have a

00:39:19.120 Rolex watch collection. He wouldn't be in these tailored suits. Like he's not, he's not good at

00:39:23.600 this. He's not very smart. My, my, my two cents. Alex, what do you think?

00:39:26.880 Yeah. So again, I'm taking off my subjective citizen hat here and I'm putting on my political

00:39:30.880 war room hat. I totally agree with both of you guys on Ukraine and, and, and the entire subject really.

00:39:36.560 But if Max Bernier is political decision to be the contrarian and to be the only one who's opposing

00:39:42.320 Trump amongst all the leaders is a good political decision. Why isn't it moving the needle? I mean,

00:39:47.600 the PPC, it doesn't look like they're doing any better than they were two weeks ago.

00:39:52.000 And while it may be offensive to us on, you know, the political center of right, let's say,

00:39:57.040 um, and, and kind of our exosphere, if that's even a thing, um, we've sometimes forget it.

00:40:02.720 And it's easy to lose context of how leftist Canada really is. I mean, Paul, you have just

00:40:08.160 on policies alone. It's probably left of Mac of, uh, Bernie Sanders. Totally. I mean, just,

00:40:14.720 just on healthcare alone. I mean, on, on lots of different policy issues. And so he needs those

00:40:19.280 votes. I'm glad you went there. I agree with that. Right. Like I've been taking a lot of crap lately for

00:40:25.600 daring to say that the polls are probably telling some truth, right? The polls that show that the

00:40:30.640 liberals are regaining some, some popularity and that the conservatives are losing it, but it goes

00:40:36.080 to that, to, to Alex's point, we are, you know, what we've been liberal 70% of the last 157 years,

00:40:42.480 and we love to think of ourselves as progressive. So, um, it, it is, uh, yeah, that's a reality and

00:40:49.920 good point that, you know, so I, I just want to explore that with Alex. So do you think,

00:40:54.080 cause I often hear that the PPC people say that PPC have a nice platform and they're conservatives.

00:40:58.800 Um, do you think it's because of the person that, uh, given a different leader, would the PPC?

00:41:06.640 I just want to push back on one thing. Cause I think that when it comes to the policies,

00:41:10.480 like each country, like you operate within the context of your own country, right? So like,

00:41:14.640 if Bernie Sanders was a politician in Canada, he would be to the left of the NDP,

00:41:19.360 but he's working in like the realm of what's possible in the United States.

00:41:22.000 The call for universal healthcare is left wing in the United States.

00:41:25.200 In Canada, it's just the, the, the basic, like it's, it's, it's what we have.

00:41:29.520 We've moved past that a long time ago. Yeah. Yeah.

00:41:31.120 Yeah. And so like, I think that Polly have to, to his credit, his instincts are conservative,

00:41:36.080 and I think he's a conservative individual, but he's obviously making calculations as the

00:41:39.840 leader of a political party and doing things and saying things that he has to, I would just

00:41:43.680 disagree with that strategy. And I would say that I think people want authenticity. They want

00:41:47.600 something different. So yes, Canada is a default liberal country. I I'll take that. Even though I do

00:41:52.080 think that there are deep conservative principles that exist that a leader has to tap into in order

00:41:56.960 to win. And you can like, even in centrist, like progressive mainstream conservatives who get their

00:42:02.240 news, unfortunately from the CBC, like if you show them a different perspective and show them a different

00:42:06.400 path, they would give it a chance, right? They would say like, if, if, if Polly have came out

00:42:10.640 and took a lot of the positions, say that Maxim Bernier is taking that, that, that, that he could

00:42:15.200 be doing better in the polls. That's, that's my position. I'll, I'll let you put your question to Alex

00:42:18.880 here and then we'll wrap up the show. Mario, I did put the, the, the question I had to Alex is,

00:42:24.960 is, is I don't think we want to go there too deeply, but is it, is the PPC with the PPC do

00:42:30.240 better with a change in leadership? I mean, it's hard to say it's a hypothetical, but, but to address

00:42:35.200 both of your points, if a party were to direct its entire platform towards bringing over the more

00:42:43.120 conservative, the more American conservative voter base in Canada, um, maybe it's a failure of Max

00:42:48.080 Bernie as a leader, but it doesn't appear as though it's getting a lot of traction.

00:42:51.920 Why that is, I don't know. It, could it be the leader? Could it be bad press? I have no idea,

00:42:56.800 but it doesn't seem to be ranking higher than what? 2%, 3%, not a single seat in the house of commons.

00:43:03.520 So there was a by-election here recently in Cloverdale that received 125 votes. I remember as a

00:43:08.800 kid, the communist party used to get more votes than 125. Um, so yeah, it just doesn't seem to be

00:43:15.120 popular amongst Canadians. I don't know why. Hmm. Were you at the, uh, I was going to get up.

00:43:20.640 Yeah. So, okay. Well, we'll have to have you gentlemen back and we can talk a bit more about

00:43:25.680 conservative strategy, but I think, I think it's a bit unfortunate that, uh, we still have to beat

00:43:30.400 this drum. And when there is criticism of like the uniparty in Canada, I think that this is one of the

00:43:34.640 issues they point to on Ukraine. It's like, why do we have to, why do we have to put a pointless

00:43:38.960 and, and, and before we, and I know we were running out of time, but I want to just maybe

00:43:43.600 talk about this real quick. I hope there is peace in Ukraine and there was, and we forgot to talk

00:43:48.240 about that. I mean, there was progress made. So, you know, Trump and, and Putin sort of had a deal

00:43:54.320 and, and there were deals on the table. So I, uh, what's your thoughts on the events of Friday? Did it

00:44:00.320 completely kibosh a peace deal or was it just a temporary setback?

00:44:04.640 I think there's a fundamental difference of agreement, right? Disagreement when it comes

00:44:09.200 to what the security guarantees are going to be. Like, I think that Trump was taking it for granted

00:44:13.280 that he was going to get Putin and Zelensky to just agree that we need to stop the war. And then

00:44:18.720 at that point, Trump wanted to go in and look at mineral rights and make a deal to kind of like

00:44:22.880 rebuild Ukraine, but you can't start, you can't have an economic deal until you have the security

00:44:26.880 deal and just, it doesn't seem like they're there yet. That doesn't mean that they're not going to get

00:44:29.520 there. Like maybe they're working behind the scenes and maybe diplomats are working hard to try to

00:44:34.800 you know, fix things and get everyone back together and say like, no, no, we do want this

00:44:39.120 agreement to happen. But from what I saw Friday in the fallout from it, uh, yeah.

00:44:43.920 Yeah. I mean, Zelensky's playing it up, right? Like Zelensky's playing the victim in this and he's got,

00:44:49.760 he's garnering a lot of sympathy from a lot of people. So in this sense, this might've backfired

00:44:54.800 on Trump. It'll be interesting. Kind of like his approach to Trudeau and you know,

00:44:58.880 the way the liberals are soaring in the polls, right? It did. I I've asked that question,

00:45:02.720 right. Was he doing it? Cause he's, he's, he's definitely giving a bump to the liberals. I don't

00:45:06.720 think he did it intentionally. Um, but yeah, he's definitely giving a bump to the liberals.

00:45:12.560 Yeah. If you, if you were like really cynical, you'd almost think that Trump and Trudeau had

00:45:16.480 some kind of a deal. Like, cause every time Trump, all right, gentlemen, thank you so much for joining

00:45:21.120 us for a lot of fun. That's Marty up north and, uh, Alex Zelensky. Uh, sorry.

00:45:29.440 All right. Cheers everyone. All right. Thank you so much for tuning in. We'll be back again

00:45:34.640 tomorrow with all the news. I'm Candace Malcolm. This is the Candace Malcolm show. Thank you. And God

00:45:38.080 bless you.

The Candice Malcolm Show - March 03, 2025

Canada needs to side with the U.S. in ending the forever wars

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