“I’d probably be dead right now”— MP sounds alarm on Canada’s suicide agenda
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Summary
In Canada, assisted dying has risen 13-fold since it was legalized in 2016, and is on track to become the fastest growing assisted dying program in the world. But now, Conservative MP Andrew Lawton has joined the campaign to ban MAID for people with mental illness.
Transcript
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I'm Candice Malcolm and this is the Candice Malcolm Show. Thank you so much for joining
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us today. We are going to cover a very sensitive, very dark topic today. And I want to just
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start by talking about the rise of euthanasia in Canada. This is from a Cardis report. Cardis
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is a wonderful organization, does research into this kind of thing. So here is what they
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write. From exceptional to routine, MAID in Canada is the world's fastest growing assisted
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dying program. Here are some of the key points. The number of Canadians dying prematurely by
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what we call medical assistance in dying. We're using euphemism MAID to make it just seem like
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a normal procedure or another bureaucratic acronym from the government. No, we're talking about
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dying. We're talking about people being killed by medical practitioners and using the
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government to help them commit suicide. Well, this assisted dying has risen 13-fold since
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its legalization in 2016. The number of people dying in this way was 1,018. In 2022, the last
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year that we have data available, it is 13,241. This makes MAID in Canada the world's fastest
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growing assisted dying program. This is a serious concern, people, because this is not normal,
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right? Look at the assisted deaths as a percentage of total deaths in other countries around the world.
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You can see Canada is that red line. We just introduced this program in 2016, and it goes
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straight up. So other countries, European countries have been doing this sort of thing for a generation
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now, and their levels are still growing in a concerning, alarming way, but nothing like the growth
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in Canada. And the things that the government, the liberal government is now applying this program
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to are concerning to all. We saw a proposal that it gets applied to minors, and now we have one that
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it would be applied to people with mental illness. Well, that is why I'm pleased to announce and to
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report that the Conservative Party is pushing back. A Conservative MP has introduced a private
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member's bill to ban medical assistance in dying. I prefer to just call it by what it is, assisted
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suicide for mental illness. So back in May, Tamara Jensen, who is a Conservative member of Parliament for
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Cloverdale-Langley, tabled Bill C-218, a private member's bill that seeks to amend the criminal code to
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explicitly exclude mental disorders from being considered a grievous and immutable medical condition
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for the purposes of MAID eligibility. If the bill passes, individuals would qualify for assisted death
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on the basis of mental illness alone. So that private member's bill was introduced. And I'm happy to
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announce that Conservative MP Andrew Lawton has also joined this campaign. Of course, Andrew is a former
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journalist here at True North, and he was a host of the Andrew Lawton Show before becoming a member of
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Parliament. He is now representing the writing of Elgin St. Thomas, London South. And I'm pleased to
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welcome Andrew to the show. Andrew, thank you so much for joining the show. Great to see you.
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Always good to be with you, Candice. Thanks for having me.
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Well, tell us a little bit about this bill and why you've chosen to get alongside and working on this
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one. Absolutely. So Bill C-218, or as we've named the Right to Recover Act, is there to ensure that
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people who have a mental illness are able to be treated and supported and given hope instead of
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given death by the health care system? Just a bit of background here, if I may, Candice. The
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expansion of MAID to people with mental illness was never supposed to happen. It was never demanded
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by a court. What actually happened was a court decision in Quebec said that Canada's MAID rules
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were too restrictive. And the Liberal government responded with a significant expansion. And then
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the unelected Senate unilaterally decided to put in this additional change that if you had only a
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mental illness, no physical ailment whatsoever, you'd be eligible for MAID. They passed it. They
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kicked it back to the House of Commons. And the Liberal government under Trudeau, with David Lamedi at the
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time being the Attorney General, decided to move this forward in spite of massive pushback from the
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mental health field, the health care field, disability rights activists, a lot of people in
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this space from a number of different sectors, conservative, liberal, didn't matter. And what they
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did is they put in place a date that this would go into effect and said, well, we'll figure out the
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details later. We'll figure out how we prevent abuse later. They couldn't do that in time. They still
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haven't done that. They've had to extend this date a couple of times. But right now, if nothing
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happens, as of March 17, 2027, people with a serious mental illness will be able to go through
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the MAID process. Now, this was something that is very near and dear to my heart. I've shared
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publicly, I've shared it with my former listeners and viewers here. I am a suicide survivor myself. I
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almost lost my life about 15 years ago to a suicide attempt after a prolonged battle with mental
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illness that very nearly took my life. I'm convinced that I would have gone through the
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MAID system 15 years ago. And given how we've seen this system unfold, I might have been successful in
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getting that sign off and having my life ended, which means I wouldn't be here today. I wouldn't
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have a loving wife. I wouldn't have the career I have. I wouldn't have all of the wonderful people
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I've met and worked with over the last decade and a half. So that was why I launched the I Got
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Better campaign to highlight stories of healing and show why the stakes are so high if we go down
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the road of granting MAID for people with mental illness. Some say the bubbles in an arrow truffle
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piece can take 34 seconds to melt in your mouth. Sometimes the very amount you're stuck at the same
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red light. Rich, creamy, chocolatey arrow truffle. Feel the arrow bubbles melt. It's mind bubbling.
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Well, it's unbelievable. And Andrew, I thank you for sharing your story. I saw that you posted a video
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on social media telling your very personal story. And I know it's not easy to do that. You sort of
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go through what personally happened to you. I want to say, you know, it takes a strong man to come out
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and admit that you suffered through that. You had a problem. I'm just reading some of the comments
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here, Mario Zaleja. He writes, what a legend. It takes a strong, confident man to talk about this.
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Congrats on overcoming this and the massive impact you're having on society. And I think especially
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to young men, I think that what you went through, a lot of other people are going through. We saw
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a huge increase in the sort of diseases of despair, especially during COVID and particularly how it hits
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young men. And so I'm just wondering, like, what is your message to other young men out there that
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might be suffering through something like this? One of the things that's really important about
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mental illness is it affects different groups differently. And, you know, there is a huge push
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now. I shouldn't say huge, but there's a larger push now around men's mental health because people
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have realized how men have a unique hurdle on seeking help for this. And it's not to say that it's
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worse or better. It's just different. You know, there are pressures that men put on themselves.
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There are pressures that society puts on men, the pressure to provide, the pressure to perform,
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to be a certain way. And there's also this expectation of being stoic and strong and tough.
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And I think this is where it's really, really important to have these conversations to ensure
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that there are supports available there and that we're not normalizing the desire to end your life.
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And that's the other key here is that there are going to be people that because of their mental
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illness go through the MAID process because they're going to be permitted to do that.
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But by giving that eligibility, we also create this other problem, which is that we basically give
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a green light to the idea that ending your life because of mental illness is the right thing to
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do. And I'm actually, and again, this is speculative on my part, but I am worried that
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there's going to be an increase in non-MAID suicides because now all of a sudden we've said,
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you know what, this actually makes sense. This is a logical, reasonable thing to want.
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And that to me is very concerning. And I can't stress enough, this is a life or death issue.
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Well, I do want to shift it back to medical assistance and dying, the euphemism that we use.
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Really, it's euthanasia. It's assisted suicide. It's going to a doctor and saying that,
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you know, my life is over now or whatever the circumstances. Andrew, you've seen this
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during your time at True North. There have been reports of doctors or even government officials
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offering this as a solution to people who are suffering. So, I mean, now that you're on the
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other side and you're a member of parliament, is this something that concerns you that not only is
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this just sort of available in the background, but it's something that's often actively promoted
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and given it as an option to Canadians who would not have otherwise considered it?
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We have all heard the horror stories of the veteran that wants a wheelchair lift and is instead
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offered maid or people who have sought it and been granted it because of poverty, because they don't
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like their living conditions. And these situations are tragic. And I think the one most important thing
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here is that we have to support people in what they need to want to live their life.
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And that's oftentimes what's missing in this. And if you look at some of the numbers, even from the
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Canadian maid reports, you see people that, you know, they're dealing with a medical issue,
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but they also put as a reason for wanting maid loneliness. They put poverty, they put isolation,
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they put these other things in there, which are not medical things, are not medical qualities. It could
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actually be combated in a very real way. There was a case recently where Scott Adams, a cartoonist in
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the United States, I was just reading about this, was very close to using maid and his life because of
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cancer. But he finally found one treatment that was able to ease his suffering long enough to want to be
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alive, even though he knows his days are numbered. We see time and time again, people who go through the
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system. And there are other externalities beyond their immediate suffering that are causing them
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to seek this. And, you know, what we're dealing with in this legislation is the mental health
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component, because that same issue is there. We know that there is treatment and support available.
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And we also know there's a capacity issue as well. When someone wants to end their life because of a
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mental illness, that we typically view that as a symptom. And we treat it and intervene. And actually,
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the state has the right to commit someone to stop them from ending their life because we realize that
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protecting the vulnerable is one of the areas where you have a role for government. So if I go in
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to a doctor's office and I say, doctor, I'm dealing with depression. It's really difficult.
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I want to end my life. Well, how do we know when that legal and ethical responsibility to stop me kicks
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in versus the provision of services of, OK, here's a maid pamphlet?
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Well, I mean, that's the shocking part of it all. I don't know if you've read Tristan Hopper's
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book, but he talks about how Canada has become like a cautionary tale. And when they were debating
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having some kind of a euthanasia program in the UK, both parties were worried not to allow their
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system to become like Canada, where it is just too often used. I mean, the fact that it's such a leading
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cause of death in Canada now that we've seen this 13 fold growth just in less than a decade
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since it's been brought in, it seems like a big issue, Andrew. And yet we don't really hear a lot
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about it aside from, you know, the bravery it took for you to put out this video in this private
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members bill. You know, is this something that you think that you will get support across the aisle
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from? Are there other MPs, even from other parties and within your own party that agree that this
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program has probably gone too far? We're hoping. I mean, this is and should be a nonpartisan issue.
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There was a bill in the previous parliament seeking to do exactly what this one is, and it fell short
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by only a handful of votes. It had support from all of the Conservatives, all of the New Democrats,
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both of the Greens at the time, and eight Liberals as well. And this current bill, which we're putting
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forward, I'm hopeful will receive support from across the aisle. If the Conservatives and the New
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Democrats and the Green MP Elizabeth May all support it, it will pass if 20 Liberal MPs get
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behind it. 20 Liberal MPs. That's the math on that. So there are some Liberals on there that have been
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very outspoken in support of what we're trying to do. I hope to see more of that. This is, again,
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a Liberal government that claims it's a new government. Perhaps Marnie will do the right
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thing here as Prime Minister and have his Attorney General get behind this. I do not want to score
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political points off this. I want to save lives, and I want to prevent people going through what
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I went through 15 years ago from doing something irreversible. And I hope we can get support from
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that. And that's my call to action to all of your listeners and viewers, Candace, is no matter where
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you are in the country, no matter who your MP is, whether you like them or not, reach out to them and
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ask them to support this bill. Ask them to support C218. If you have experience with mental illness
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yourself, share that with your Member of Parliament. Make sure they know there's a human face on
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this. And that's the spirit behind the I Got Better campaign, which at the risk of shamelessly
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plugging is at igotbetter.ca. Well, what a great initiative, Andrew. I really applaud. You
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congratulate you for that. While you're here, I want to ask you, though, because we've talked about
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this on the show yesterday. This has become a huge firestorm in the middle of a summer. Usually
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summers are quiet for news stories. But I think a lot of people are concerned by the story of
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Sean Foyt. So basically, the CBC painted this guy as if he was some kind of an extremist and
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some kind of a mega rock star because he supports Republicans and Donald Trump in the States.
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That doesn't really have anything to do with his concerts, though. He's a worship leader,
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a Christian singer. He had a tour planned across Canada. Apparently, it's his third year
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in a row touring across Canada. But suddenly, he became very controversial and has had his permit
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revoked in cities across eastern Canada from Halifax to Montreal. In Montreal, we saw that showdown
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with the police, with Antifa, where they fire bombed a church using a smoke bomb in the middle
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of a performance, which is, as I walked through on the show yesterday, there is a criminal code
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offense against interrupting a church service or a service of worship. And that's exactly what
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these Antifa thugs did right in front of the police. I saw that you wrote a lengthy post about
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this on X, Andrew. And I'm wondering if you can comment on what's happening and what you make of
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it all. Look, the idea that you need a permit to engage in worship, regardless of your religion,
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is absolutely absurd. I have been clear going into politics and throughout my media career that
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freedom of expression is my hill to die on. And when I see the interruption of a religious concert,
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which is, again, it's worship, I'm very concerned by it. Again, I stand up for freedom of expression
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and freedom of religion on principle. I don't need to agree with or share someone's religious
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practices or what they say. And I say that not as a denunciation of Sean Foyke, but I literally had
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never heard of him before, before, you know, two or three days ago, whenever it was that this came up.
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And, you know, I don't actually care what his beliefs are, care what he says. I would stand up for
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his right to engage in the work that he's doing and not be harassed by bureaucrats. Now, again, I mean,
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the nature of freedom of expression is that you have to protect people who are saying things that
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you disagree with if you want to have any consistency and moral clarity on this. And, you know, in this
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case, it's a Christian singer. And I get people have raised all sorts of issues with him about, you
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know, how he's run his business and all of that. And none of that matters. All of that's a
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distraction. At the end of the day, you know, his right to speak, his right to sing, a church's right
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to host him, those are decisions to be made by them. And people can decide whether they want to
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go. There is no place for the government in that equation at all. Well, you raise a really
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interesting point. I'm just going to read a little bit about comparing it to something that happened
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under the Harper government. So you wrote, 17 years ago, the Canadian arts community and political
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left raised holy hell about a bill from Harper government that would have blocked tax credits
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for film projects that went against public policy. That proposal which the conservatives
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ultimately scrapped was lambasted as censorship. Of course, it was no such thing. The government has
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no obligation to fund any particular piece of art. Punishing people for what they create is another
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story. And then you write about how that reminds you of what's happening here. I mean, I don't really
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expect there to be consistency from these people just because I'm talking about people in the woke
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left. Like, like, yeah, they'll criticize the conservatives for doing something and then
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they'll turn around and do the exact same thing without any sense of shame or irony. But it is
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interesting how, you know, back then, even just saying that we're not going to fund, and I think
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the specific example was like, anti Alberta energy activists or something like that, saying that the
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government doesn't have to fund them. And that was considered censorship. And here we have them
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actually blocking a church service, and endangering them. But even I mean, the fact that someone threw
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that smoke bomb, and you can see with such grace, right, Sean Fout just picks it up, hands it to
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another church leader, who just calmly walks it out the door, right? They weren't panicking,
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they weren't trying to fight, they weren't trying to agitate, they were really just trying to pray.
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And the fact that the police just stood by while that happened, and I don't think anyone was arrested,
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I don't think anybody was charged. It seems just like a blatant and ugly double standard. And to me,
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it shows anti-Christian bigotry and an anti-American hatred in our country by the same people who are
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sitting here saying, you have to be inclusive, we believe in diversity, no hate, hate has no home
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here. And yet they're showing all of those things. I mean, there's just so much irony here. Andrew,
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what do you make of it all? I think you need to be able to apply whatever the rules are evenly.
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And I know people have pointed out some very radical, hateful protests and demonstrations
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that have taken place in Montreal that have not attracted the ire of Montreal by-law enforcement,
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that have not received condemnation for operating without a so-called permit. So I think at the end
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of the day here, what's going to happen is we're going to have to have a conversation in this country
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about the assaults that are taking place about freedoms. And if anyone's interested, I talked about
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this in my maiden speech in the House of Commons, in which I said that I wanted to make Canada
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a freer place. And that was motivating my entry to politics. You know, we need to have the freedom
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to worship, the freedom to pray, the freedom to sing, the freedom to engage in art, the freedom to
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express our political opinions. And we cannot allow governments of any level to get in the way of
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that. And I'm very glad that so many of my colleagues have spoken up about this as well. And
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Jamil Javani has specifically talked about attacks on the right to worship in a motion he's put forward
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before the Heritage Committee, which I think is very much one that should be getting some more
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attention as well. Well, Andrew, I know you're just getting started in Ottawa and as a member
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of Parliament, you're doing great work already. We appreciate your time and you joining the program.
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Andrew Lawton, thank you so much for joining us. Thank you, Candice. All right, folks,
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that's all the time we have for today. Thanks so much for tuning in. I'm Candice Malcolm. This is
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Candice Malcolm Show. We'll be back again tomorrow with all the news. Thank you and God bless.