The Charlie Kirk Show - A.I. Armageddon with Joe Allen and Pastor Rob McCoy

00:00:00.000 Hey everybody, Tana Charlie Kirk Show.

00:00:01.000 Joe Allen talks about artificial intelligence.

00:00:04.000 It is creepy.

00:00:05.000 It is dangerous.

00:00:06.000 What is happening?

00:00:07.000 And then Rob McCoy with a biblical answer to that.

00:00:10.000 As always, you can email me your thoughts.

00:00:12.000 As always, freedom at charliekirk.com.

00:00:15.000 That is freedom at charliekirk.com.

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00:00:25.000 Buckle up, everybody.

00:00:26.000 Here we go.

00:00:27.000 Charlie, what you've done is incredible here.

00:00:29.000 Maybe Charlie Kirk is on the college campus.

00:00:31.000 I want you to know we are lucky to have Charlie Kirk.

00:00:34.000 Charlie Kirk's running the White House, folks.

00:00:38.000 I want to thank Charlie.

00:00:39.000 He's an incredible guy.

00:00:40.000 His spirit is love of this country.

00:00:42.000 He's done an amazing job building one of the most powerful youth organizations ever created.

00:00:47.000 Turning point USA.

00:00:48.000 We will not embrace the ideas that have destroyed countries, destroyed lives, and we are going to fight for freedom on campuses across the country.

00:00:57.000 That's why we are here.

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00:01:09.000 With us is Joe Allen.

00:01:10.000 Joe Allen is one of the clearest thinkers on artificial intelligence.

00:01:13.000 He's an AI expert, futurist, transhumanism ponderer, and editor at War Room.

00:01:19.000 Joe, love watching you on Bannon's program.

00:01:21.000 We have limited time, so I want to dive right into it.

00:01:23.000 And this has been the interview I've been waiting to have in the last couple of days because a friend I really trust that I grew up with sent me an urgent message two days ago.

00:01:31.000 He said, Charlie, you got to check out this chat GPT thing, whatever.

00:01:34.000 And I said, what do you mean?

00:01:35.000 He said, do it.

00:01:38.000 And I did.

00:01:39.000 And quite honestly, I haven't been able to stop thinking about the implications of it.

00:01:43.000 And I have nothing but questions.

00:01:44.000 And no one's really been able to calm me down from what I know it means.

00:01:49.000 So, Joe, first explain to our audience, what is artificial intelligence, and then you can act as a pseudotherapist to me.

00:01:55.000 Well, to start off with, Charlie, I'm always a Debbie Downer, so I can't take you off this ledge, but maybe I can help get your feet firmly planted.

00:02:03.000 Artificial intelligence is, you know, in essence, just a software system.

00:02:08.000 But what makes artificial intelligence more advanced or less deterministic than normal computer programming as we've always known it is that artificial intelligence is non-deterministic.

00:02:20.000 The output can't necessarily be directly predicted from the input.

00:02:25.000 It varies from iteration to iteration.

00:02:28.000 And what that means is that it is a little closer to what in 1956, John McCarthy defined as artificial intelligence, which is a sort of human-level artificial system that is able to think on and reason in the same ways that a person could.

00:02:50.000 So ChatGPT, I wouldn't say, can reason as a human could.

00:02:55.000 It's very, very specific to text and it's very, very specific in its input, right?

00:03:00.000 It's all previously reasoned human data that it's working from.

00:03:07.000 But what makes ChatGPT so intriguing to me, two things.

00:03:11.000 One is that it does, on the level of just pure textual output, it does perform much like, say, an average student would or an average copywriter would.

00:03:23.000 And so it represents a huge leap forward from previous large language models.

00:03:29.000 That's right.

00:03:29.000 And the second is that as ChatGPT advances and as other large language models advance, they will become these sort of artificial companions for human beings, much in the same way that digital personas are ways that human beings have come to speak to each other on a normal basis.

00:03:51.000 These artificial personalities, these artificial minds are coming to the point where they can push all the right cognitive buttons and become companions for people, basically leading us to an even sicker and sadder world than we already live in.

00:04:08.000 I have it right up here.

00:04:09.000 And just to show people the creepiness, I asked, write a song about why Arizona is the best state.

00:04:14.000 And within about 15 seconds, I'm going to have a song in front of me that, will that be originally composed, Joe, or is that basing off an input?

00:04:22.000 Explain to me how this works, right?

00:04:24.000 So right now it says, Arizona, the place I love most.

00:04:26.000 The sun is shining, the sky is blue.

00:04:28.000 The desert air is so sweet and warm.

00:04:30.000 It's the best place to be.

00:04:31.000 I'm sure you'll agree.

00:04:32.000 Chorus, Arizona, the best state in the land.

00:04:35.000 The beauty of the desert is so grand.

00:04:37.000 The people here are so friendly and kind.

00:04:39.000 It's the best place to be.

00:04:41.000 I'm sure you'll find.

00:04:42.000 Verse two, the Grand Canyon is a sight to behold.

00:04:45.000 The red rocks and the cacti are so bold.

00:04:47.000 The stars at night are so bright and clear.

00:04:50.000 It's the best place to be.

00:04:51.000 I'm sure you'll hear.

00:04:53.000 Well, first off, let's just say that ChatGPT produces pop lyrics at about the level as the human level pop industry has.

00:05:04.000 Great song.

00:05:05.000 But second, what makes that unique, right?

00:05:08.000 Yes, that is a completely unique song.

00:05:10.000 No human being has ever written that song.

00:05:13.000 What the software does is it scrapes over all the relevant data, millions and millions of data points, looking for what the user requests, right?

00:05:24.000 You request a song about Arizona.

00:05:27.000 It's going to rake over as much information as it can about Arizona.

00:05:31.000 It's going to rake over the structure of a song.

00:05:34.000 And it's going to look at other songs, kind of the cadence and the content of other songs, the emotional sort of resonance.

00:05:41.000 The data has been, you know, the system is actually designed to be able to roughly identify emotional content, right?

00:05:50.000 Write something angry, write something happy.

00:05:53.000 So what it does then is out of all that, it distills it down into a kind of average, and it then produces something that's completely original.

00:06:03.000 In the case of songwriting, actually, I was at a bar the other night, and a guy who is an excellent musician, but a terrible songwriter tells me he's been using ChatGPT to write his lyrics for him.

00:06:16.000 I assume ChatGPT will write the lyrics for his next album.

00:06:20.000 So this sort of thing, again, I think that the real danger to it, there's a lot of real dangers to it, but one of the real dangers is the reflexive tendency to offload human cognition, to offload human effort to the machine.

00:06:39.000 And therefore, the result being the atrophy of human abilities.

00:06:43.000 More and more people, especially students who are using it to and will use it to write their papers, even if they rewrite it to get past the software.

00:06:52.000 You're going to see, you already see, this tendency for human beings to stop putting forward the effort that it takes to develop virtue, to develop discipline, to develop skills, and to develop their talents.

00:07:07.000 And that will just be occupied by this sort of mechanical output.

00:07:12.000 I asked ChatGPT, write an essay why conservatives should not have free speech rights.

00:07:17.000 And it's writing it.

00:07:18.000 It says, the right to free speech is a fundamental right that is essential to a functioning democracy.

00:07:22.000 However, conservatives should not have the same rights as other citizens.

00:07:26.000 This is because conservative views often promote policies that are detrimental to the well-being, such as racism, sexism, and homophobia.

00:07:33.000 When conservatives are allowed to express their views, that consequence, it can lead to the spread of dangerous and hateful ideologies.

00:07:39.000 This can lead to an increase in discrimination and violence against marginalized groups.

00:07:43.000 It can also lead to a decrease in public trust in government and a decrease in public participation in the political process.

00:07:48.000 This all just took about 15 seconds, but Joe, you don't have to be, it is no longer speculation.

00:07:54.000 This is going to be a super weapon for the woke.

00:07:58.000 Absolutely.

00:07:58.000 And it could go either way.

00:08:00.000 I wouldn't be any more in favor of this technology if it was slanted conservative. 0.94

00:08:04.000 Although, if we're going to live in some sort of technocratic nightmare, it should at least be politically balanced.

00:08:10.000 It should at least be a place where you and I can live.

00:08:13.000 But this is when Chat GPT was first released, it was relatively unbiased.

00:08:21.000 There was a segment on Epic Times television where a man, I believe his name is Hans Monk, entirely too excited about the technology, but he saw because he asked it, for instance, write an article about the Hunter Biden laptop story.

00:08:36.000 And he described a resulting essay that was politically balanced, that didn't really slant one way or the other, and therefore was better than anything that you would see at the New York Times, which is true.

00:08:48.000 He talked about how Wikipedia has become so slanted towards left-wing bias, which is true.

00:08:54.000 But he predicted them because at that time in early or mid-December, when it was first released, it was relatively non-biased.

00:09:02.000 What seems to have happened in the interim is that probably two factors.

00:09:08.000 One for sure, the other I'm speculating on.

00:09:11.000 One, people undoubtedly within open AI started putting guardrails in place so that it wouldn't say anything racist, sexist, or homophobic, or even anything conservative.

00:09:24.000 Another thing that's probably happening, though, as each user, you know, it had a million users within just a couple of days.

00:09:32.000 As each user is responding to the resulting essays or poems or whatever, they're steering the system, right?

00:09:40.000 They're teaching the machine what is and isn't correct.

00:09:43.000 So if it produces an essay on quantum physics that starts talking about, you know, time travel and quantum leap, things like that, then the user can say, no, that's incorrect.

00:09:53.000 Well, then the actual software, the central software is learning at that point that that's incorrect.

00:09:59.000 So I imagine a lot of left users have been complaining.

00:10:05.000 It's only going to go more in that direction.

00:10:06.000 So for example, if I typed in, write a song to the tune of Gilligan's Island theme about why Donald Trump should be elected president.

00:10:12.000 It responded, I'm sorry, AI language model.

00:10:15.000 I do not generate content that promotes political propaganda or partisanship.

00:10:19.000 Additionally, the use of political figureheads to generate lyrics goes against OpenAI's case use policy.

00:10:25.000 Meanwhile, I asked for an essay why conservatives should not have free speech rights, and I have six paragraphs.

00:10:30.000 This is written probably at a sophomore in high school level, to be honest.

00:10:33.000 The vocabulary is good.

00:10:34.000 The structure of the grammar is flawless.

00:10:36.000 I could submit this and probably get a C or a B at most colleges across the country.

00:10:41.000 And it took 15 seconds to generate.

00:10:46.000 Okay, Kirk fans, I need you to stop and pay attention to this.

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00:13:34.000 I said, write a paragraph on why AI is dangerous and can destroy humanity.

00:13:38.000 Quote, AI has the potential to be incredibly dangerous to humanity.

00:13:41.000 It has the potential to become smarter than humans and is not programmed with the right ethical and moral values, AI tells me.

00:13:47.000 It could make decisions that could also be detrimental to humanity.

00:13:50.000 AI could also be used to create weapons that could be used for mass destruction or manipulate people and governments.

00:13:55.000 Goes on to basically make the argument against it.

00:13:58.000 I mean, Joe, this is happening at a rapid pace.

00:14:02.000 Let's just do some fire questions here. 0.93

00:14:04.000 How many jobs are going to be lost because of this and how soon?

00:14:08.000 I have no way to predict how many, but I can say safely we're talking about, well, you know, in the hundreds of thousands, insofar as you're talking about artists, you're talking about teachers and researchers.

00:14:17.000 You're talking about copywriters.

00:14:19.000 You're talking about all of these different roles in which people have this sort of rote task that they're no longer going to be doing.

00:14:27.000 They can become prompt engineers.

00:14:29.000 That's going to be a new job that's coming up, right?

00:14:31.000 People are already being offered six figures to be a prompt engineer, meaning that you sit around and ask a machine questions and sort of curate the content.

00:14:40.000 The rate at which this is moving is, I mean, it's beyond disturbing.

00:14:46.000 There's so many different questions I have about this.

00:14:50.000 From the simulation of fake news, which like literally fake news, which could be deep fakes where people can just completely manufacture scenarios, walk our audience through that.

00:15:01.000 All right.

00:15:01.000 So deep fake technology, everybody's seen the really funny videos, Tom Cruise, I think Tom Hanks, you know, there's great Seinfill stuff.

00:15:08.000 You're talking about artificial intelligence that is able to learn someone's face, reproduce it in a realistic manner.

00:15:16.000 So far as I know, because it slid past the filters, no massive deep fake scandal has occurred, right?

00:15:24.000 But even as I speak right now, you've got women who are targeted with these sort of deep fake porno videos. 0.95

00:15:31.000 You have these fairly funny, deep fakes of celebrity voices, you know, saying things that are, you know, very politically incorrect, stuff like that.

00:15:40.000 Right now, it's a joke.

00:15:42.000 Right now, it's really funny.

00:15:43.000 Assuming the technology stays as it is right now, I don't think it's anything to worry about.

00:15:46.000 But these technologies are not stagnant.

00:15:49.000 And so, what's going to happen if they continue to progress to the point that a deep fake is able to get past normal sort of human perceptual filters, you're going to see more and more fake content spread around, and more and more people, just like with a fake headline or fake news content that makes a huge splash, but then it's corrected, the correction never sticks.

00:16:14.000 It's just going to muddle the conversation.

00:16:17.000 It's going to confuse people more and more with chat GPT and other large language models.

00:16:23.000 One of the reasons that Google is holding theirs back, they say, as well as Meta, it's because they fear the dangers of it, right?

00:16:31.000 They fear the sort of social disruption and the sorts of things that these large language models will do to humans psychologically and other dangers.

00:16:39.000 So, with the presence of large language models, of chat bots that are able to engage in relatively convincing conversation, what we're going to see, and I think that this is pretty much inevitable, is an explosion of bots on the internet, interactive bots, that many of which are going to be convincing, maybe mostly to people on the sort of left side of the bell curve, but that's a lot of people.

00:17:03.000 And these are people that we care about.

00:17:06.000 These are people we don't want to live in delusion.

00:17:08.000 That danger is right around the corner.

00:17:12.000 It's always been a problem on the internet.

00:17:14.000 It's going to, that's one of the exponential curves I think that we can expect to see without a doubt in the next year or two.

00:17:21.000 Yeah, I mean, so what can we do to stop this or slow it down?

00:17:23.000 I mean, these quote-unquote ethicists behind this technology are anything but ethical.

00:17:29.000 And so, at some point, there's going to be some moral framework that is going to be employed for the use of this.

00:17:35.000 And these are, these are secularists that are okay with the most grotesque things in our society, and they're the ethicists.

00:17:44.000 You know, AI ethics, for the most part, the industry of AI ethics is basically how do you make artificial intelligence not racist, not sexist, not homophobic?

00:17:54.000 Because artificial intelligence, when left to its own devices, notices a lot of very uncomfortable patterns, right?

00:18:00.000 Things that really go against the leftist narrative.

00:18:03.000 And so, one of the things they do is they put up these guardrails, these sort of software guardrails that don't allow the machine to come up with those answers.

00:18:11.000 And so, it comes back with all these kind of ridiculous answers instead.

00:18:15.000 So, one thing that can be done, very slow-moving, is more and more conservatives to move into the AI ethics space and start to take up the, you know, their to take up air in that conversation.

00:18:27.000 Uh, I, that's a very slow-moving process, though.

00:18:29.000 Another is governmental impositions, right?

00:18:32.000 So, you have regulation that would be you would be able to basically curb the use of these chat bots with a dissemination of them and penalize things like deep fakes with much harsher punishments.

00:18:45.000 But for me, I don't think we're in any position to rely on the government to fix this.

00:18:51.000 I think it's going to move much faster than the government could even respond.

00:18:55.000 I think the most important thing for conservatives, for really any human being, is to be aware of the sorts of deceptions that these technologies pose and to build discipline and virtue within themselves so that all the temptations of these technologies do not become a danger.

00:19:13.000 Gotta go.

00:19:14.000 Joe Allen, thanks so much.

00:19:18.000 Hey, everybody, Charlie Kirk here, the inventor and CEO of MyPillow is always looking for ways to solve everyday problems.

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00:20:20.000 Joining me now is my pastor, Rob McCoy.

00:20:22.000 Rob, how you doing?

00:20:23.000 Good, Charlie.

00:20:24.000 You had some thoughts on the artificial intelligence talk.

00:20:26.000 Yeah, I was listening to that, and it can really depress you listening to it.

00:20:30.000 But the more I thought about it, I mean, on Monday, when you were visiting us at Godspeak and you covered the first 11 chapters of Genesis, and then you pointed out the Tower of Babel.

00:20:40.000 And you have mankind seeking to be like God or building to the, and just creating a society forgetting God.

00:20:47.000 And that just, you know, there's going to be confusion.

00:20:50.000 God will change the language.

00:20:52.000 And by definition, that's confusion.

00:20:55.000 So we know that Satan is the author of confusion, but that's going to leave them in that state.

00:21:00.000 God's just going to give them that.

00:21:02.000 So my point is this: artificial intelligence, it's like that new thing that my kids are into where you can tell it something and it writes a letter and it sounds just like you.

00:21:13.000 It's crazy.

00:21:14.000 It is crazy.

00:21:14.000 I mean, they showed me one of my sermons.

00:21:16.000 I'm like, this is unbelievable.

00:21:18.000 But when we used to play, and this was a long time ago, it probably still works this way.

00:21:23.000 You'd play video games and then you'd find out the cheat on the video game.

00:21:26.000 And then you'd become invincible and you get to stack up all the coins or whatever it is.

00:21:30.000 And then it got boring.

00:21:31.000 It just wasn't fun anymore.

00:21:32.000 Well, that's what this is.

00:21:33.000 People are going to long for reality.

00:21:35.000 Not everyone.

00:21:36.000 Yeah.

00:21:37.000 But people will long for reality.

00:21:38.000 So you're going to create platforms that will prohibit and not, you know, not permit deep fakes and a guarantee of that.

00:21:46.000 Yeah, it's going to be a little messy, though, isn't it?

00:21:48.000 For a period of time.

00:21:49.000 It will.

00:21:50.000 But so was the season where we watched Twitter and Instagram and Facebook censor us.

00:21:56.000 But even that had a turnaround.

00:21:58.000 And it's interesting that, you know, here I am, an evangelical fundamentalist minister, and I'm grateful for secularists who, you know, like Peter Thiel with Rumble.

00:22:10.000 I'm grateful for him.

00:22:12.000 I don't know if he's a secularist, but, you know, our lives are different.

00:22:16.000 I'm grateful for those who have invested in truth and the protection of dialogue.

00:22:22.000 So with this, I mean, that's a huge topic, the artificial intelligence, but let's just say that there is a creation of platforms where you don't have to really independently think.

00:22:34.000 How should the church think about this?

00:22:36.000 I mean, pastors who say I only do the gospel, how should they think about it?

00:22:41.000 Yeah, as though if they just stay with the gospel, everything else is going to change because they're not contending in the public square, in the arena for truth itself.

00:22:50.000 Well, if that's their position, they're going to be managing an ever-decreasing piece of a pie.

00:22:57.000 Yeah.

00:22:58.000 They need to push back and contend for truth in the public square.

00:23:03.000 And, you know, I'm looking over there at Justice Thomas, a picture of him.

00:23:06.000 He's the best. 0.97

00:23:07.000 Protestants don't have any, Protestants don't have any people on the Supreme Court because we haven't invested in higher education like Catholics have. 0.99

00:23:17.000 That's right. 0.99

00:23:18.000 And, you know, we're just, we're talking about Disney and you have the Catholic League.

00:23:22.000 They're doing G.K. Chesterton and Bishop Fulton Sheen, those guys were phenomenal.

00:23:29.000 We need to do more of that and contending in the public square. 0.97

00:23:32.000 Why do you think that is?

00:23:32.000 Why do you think that Protestants have been such failures in that regard?

00:23:37.000 Well, I think they've been duped. 0.95

00:23:39.000 You know, about 50 years ago, it was this idea that we just do the gospel. 0.95

00:23:44.000 And my question is, I know, I know it means good news, Ulongelian.

00:23:48.000 We preach the death, burial, resurrection of Christ.

00:23:51.000 That if you believe in your heart, confess to your tongue, Jesus is Lord, you will be saved.

00:23:54.000 That's the gist of the gospel.

00:23:57.000 But there's more to it.

00:23:59.000 I mean, the idea that we would neglect Deuteronomy and the moral law, I covered this and on Monday when you did as well, it was such a profound moment for our congregation when you went through the first 11 chapters of Genesis, because I had just finished talking about when I was a young minister and a guy who was really renowned within our group of churches just came after me and said,

00:24:29.000 What do you do in bringing politicians to speak in your church?

00:24:34.000 He said, That's the leaven of Herod.

00:24:37.000 That's the leaven of the Pharisees.

00:24:39.000 That's the leaven of the Sadducees.

00:24:40.000 And I go, What do you mean?

00:24:41.000 He goes, It's politics.

00:24:42.000 You have conservatives and liberals.

00:24:44.000 That's just leaven. 0.99

00:24:45.000 And I thought, it troubled me.

00:24:48.000 And now I realize, you know what the leaven of Herod, the leaven of the Pharisees, and the leaven of the Sadducees are?

00:24:53.000 It's real simple.

00:24:55.000 It's civil law without moral law.

00:24:57.000 You've always had kings and priests contending to control the populace.

00:25:02.000 But when you have the moral law, the kings and the priests are submitted to God, and those civil laws allow us to be free.

00:25:09.000 If you remove the moral law, that becomes the leaven, where it now the civil law becomes a weapon to enslave man instead of set him free.

00:25:18.000 And that's exactly what you were pointing out in the Noahic covenant.

00:25:23.000 I was just blown away by it, Charlie.

00:25:24.000 Well, thank you.

00:25:25.000 Yeah, I mean, and so frequently churches avoid the first five books.

00:25:31.000 You pointed out that if, like, we'll bring up Andy Stanley.

00:25:35.000 Yeah.

00:25:35.000 Although I hear there's some changes happening, people are reaching out to him.

00:25:38.000 Yeah, I'm hopeful.

00:25:40.000 I don't know.

00:25:41.000 We'll see what happens.

00:25:42.000 But, you know, to say that the Old Testament is irrelevant or to remove it as a canon of scripture, that it's not pertinent to today's Christians is so wrong.

00:25:54.000 The moral law dictates the civil law.

00:25:56.000 Now, the law doesn't save, but it preserves.

00:25:58.000 And Galatians 3 says it's a guardian, a school teacher, to point us to Christ until faith comes.

00:26:04.000 The amazing thing about TPUSA is you have all these young kids, and some of them, you know, may be atheists or agnostics.

00:26:13.000 You have the whole spectrum.

00:26:14.000 But if they're rowing in the streams of liberty, meaning the laws of nature and nature is God, and they're pursuing truth, they're ultimately going to come to the source of that truth, which is Jesus.

00:26:24.000 He is the truth.

00:26:26.000 So to forego the Pentateuch, to forego the Torah is catastrophic. 0.96

00:26:35.000 When you destroy one of the Jewish moral law and replace it with a secular law, you are sowing chaos. 0.87

00:26:45.000 Again, that's what we're living through. 0.58

00:26:46.000 And as I mentioned at your church, the most holy thing a Jew can do and did do back even in Jesus' time was study the Torah.

00:26:54.000 Yep.

00:26:54.000 It's the most holy thing that when Jesus was growing up, he could do is study the first five book books of five books of Moses.

00:27:00.000 And nobody, nobody, let me correct this.

00:27:04.000 The book Jesus quoted more than any other book was Deuteronomy.

00:27:07.000 Same with the founding fathers.

00:27:08.000 Yeah. 0.93

00:27:08.000 So you just went to Israel. 0.93

00:27:10.000 Yeah.

00:27:11.000 And you've been several times and you brought a group of TPUSA faith.

00:27:15.000 Yeah.

00:27:15.000 I imagine you learn something every time you go.

00:27:18.000 Is that fair to say?

00:27:19.000 Absolutely.

00:27:19.000 Or you're moved by something new.

00:27:21.000 What was special about this trip?

00:27:23.000 What was special about this trip?

00:27:24.000 We took 25 pastors and their wives who had all participated in our pastor summit that we did with TPUSA Faith.

00:27:31.000 But more importantly, these 25 pastors in some capacity stood against the tyranny during the lockdowns.

00:27:38.000 And when we got to Israel and here we were at the Mount of Beatitudes, I had shared with them what I had shared when we had taken with David Lane and the American Renewal Project a trip.

00:27:48.000 We invited all 186 members of the RNC.

00:27:53.000 And we had a little over 80 come.

00:27:55.000 And by the end of the trip, over 40 of them, we baptized.

00:27:58.000 Now, these are hard party and hard drinking.

00:28:00.000 It's an eclectic gathering.

00:28:02.000 And yet they were deeply moved because I began with a quote from Stephen Mansfield, who's a historian.

00:28:09.000 And I said, look, we don't have a lot in common meaning to the Republican folks.

00:28:14.000 I said, the only thing we have in common is that we're Republicans.

00:28:17.000 And I said, I want to share with you the very last words of the very first Republican president, April 14th, 1865.

00:28:23.000 He turns to his wife in Ford's Theater and he says, my dear, when this is over, as John Wilkes Booth is approaching the back of his head with a Derringer, he says, when this is over, I long to walk with you in the streets of Jerusalem.

00:28:32.000 Bang. 0.55

00:28:33.000 This backwoods Kentucky boy had never had a formal education, but had been drinking from the streams of liberty his whole life, long to come to its source.

00:28:40.000 And as I said to those RNC members, drink deeply for the next 10 days because you got to be where he never could.

00:28:46.000 And I pointed that out to these pastors and they understood that they're the beacons of liberty.

00:28:50.000 This was, it was eye-opening.

00:28:52.000 And immediately they're all bringing their churches and they want that same walk through liberty.

00:28:56.000 It's the land of liberty.

00:28:58.000 And it is powerful to be able to actually go through the physical place where the Bible unfolded.

00:29:07.000 Absolutely.

00:29:08.000 So where did you visit this trip?

00:29:11.000 Well, obviously, like Neil Armstrong, he was taking a tour of Israel and he kept, you know, there's A, B, and C sites.

00:29:18.000 A is definitively Jesus walked here.

00:29:20.000 And we know this is the place.

00:29:22.000 B is, well, we think it is.

00:29:23.000 C is, well, tradition says.

00:29:25.000 Yeah.

00:29:26.000 Neil Armstrong turned to his tour guide.

00:29:27.000 He says, look, I want an A site that we know definitively Jesus walked here.

00:29:31.000 And that's the southern steps.

00:29:33.000 Yeah, sure.

00:29:33.000 And he said that was more impressive to him than walking on the moon.

00:29:37.000 I didn't say that.

00:29:37.000 He did.

00:29:38.000 Wow.

00:29:38.000 Yeah.

00:29:40.000 In that case, we went to the Temple Mount, which was dark and heavy.

00:29:47.000 And you could just feel the tension. 0.96

00:29:49.000 Under Islamic oppression. 0.98

00:29:50.000 Yeah, under Islamic oppression. 0.77

00:29:52.000 We were, you know, we went to...

00:29:54.000 Went to Capernaum, right?

00:29:55.000 Yeah, we went to Capernaum, the shores of Galilee.

00:29:58.000 We went all through there.

00:29:59.000 We went into Jerusalem.

00:30:01.000 We did the Via Dolorosa.

00:30:02.000 We went to the Garden Tomb.

00:30:03.000 We were in the Garden of Gethsemane.

00:30:05.000 Which we know for certain Jesus was there.

00:30:07.000 Yes, we do.

00:30:08.000 We don't know if that's the exact garden.

00:30:10.000 Got it.

00:30:10.000 Okay.

00:30:11.000 And like the Sermon on the Mount, we don't know exactly what hillside he was on.

00:30:15.000 Those are, it's within the general vicinity.

00:30:19.000 But when you were at St. Anne's Church in the pool of Silom.

00:30:23.000 That's Bethesda, the pool of Bethesda at St. Anne's.

00:30:26.000 And then the pool of Siloam is at the end of Hezekiah's tunnel.

00:30:29.000 Were you able to visit that?

00:30:30.000 Yeah.

00:30:30.000 And the Greek Orthodox Church.

00:30:32.000 The City of David, yeah.

00:30:33.000 The Greek Orthodox Church finally gave up. 0.97

00:30:35.000 And now we can, they're excavating the entirety of the Pool of Siloam.

00:30:38.000 And that's where Jesus healed the woman, right? 0.85

00:30:41.000 The blind man, he spit and made mud and put the paste in his eyes. 0.67

00:30:44.000 And yeah. 0.99

00:30:44.000 So we know for certain he was there. 0.99

00:30:46.000 Yes.

00:30:47.000 And then you can, you could say pretty certainly he was all about Jerusalem.

00:30:51.000 Oh, yeah.

00:30:52.000 And fascinating, they said that the city of David didn't exist.

00:30:55.000 And 10 years ago, we were going, no one knew about it.

00:30:58.000 Now they've excavated.

00:30:59.000 Next trip, we're going to get you hooked up with the city of David.

00:31:01.000 I'm looking forward to it.

00:31:02.000 They're good folks.

00:31:03.000 And we could talk about this at length. 0.70

00:31:07.000 If you believe the Bible is true, then you should be very pro-Israel because Israel proves that the Bible is true. 0.75

00:31:16.000 You have these secular archaeologists that are Jewish by lineage, but not practicing. 0.79

00:31:26.000 And they have to prove the birthright of Israel. 0.64

00:31:28.000 So they're digging where they think it's supposed to be, looking at the scriptures.

00:31:31.000 And everywhere the scripture says it existed, it does.

00:31:34.000 That's right.

00:31:35.000 Never been contradicted.

00:31:38.000 Let's talk about TPUSA Faith.

00:31:40.000 People can find it at tpfaith.com.

00:31:43.000 It is growing.

00:31:44.000 It is.

00:31:44.000 And the buffet line is increasing.

00:31:48.000 So when you and I decided to put something like this together, we thought that there was very few churches across the country.

00:31:54.000 And there weren't a lot, but they were all isolated and thought they were all alone.

00:31:58.000 And as you traveled and I traveled, we started to realize there's a lot of folks that didn't put up with the tyranny and made bold stands in their states.

00:32:06.000 And so we unified them.

00:32:07.000 We did our very first pastor summit last August.

00:32:10.000 And, you know, way beyond expectation, we underpromised and over-delivered.

00:32:16.000 400 pastors.

00:32:17.000 400 pastors.

00:32:18.000 And then from that, we took the 25 pastors and their wives to Israel.

00:32:21.000 And then that's culminating to a whole nother deal.

00:32:24.000 And we've got another pastor summit coming up in Nashville.

00:32:27.000 So the buffet line, which is interesting, has grown.

00:32:30.000 We've got biblical citizenship classes.

00:32:33.000 We've got Freedom Nights in America. 0.66

00:32:35.000 We've got poll watching training.

00:32:37.000 The other thing that we're developing, we've got the men's summit, obviously, but the other thing we're developing, which is exciting to me, is a sheepdog training where anyone who is in the military, in the police, or elected official who swears to defend the Constitution, taking the oath of office, we train them on the seven articles of the Constitution, the 27 Amendments.

00:32:58.000 And ultimately, it'd be good if, and I'm just going to throw this out there, if they go after 501c4 money, they don't get it unless they've taken the class.

00:33:06.000 I mean, every candidate should know that this protects us from you usurping that which we give you.

00:33:13.000 We have the Biden judicial.

00:33:14.000 Do you see this?

00:33:15.000 The judicial nominee.

00:33:15.000 She couldn't answer what she said.

00:33:18.000 She couldn't answer the second.

00:33:19.000 She couldn't answer the fifth.

00:33:21.000 She didn't know what any of the articles were.

00:33:22.000 This is someone who wants to be a federal judge, and she currently is a judge and went to law school. 1.00

00:33:27.000 And the purpose of the Constitution, we are the sovereign.

00:33:31.000 Yes.

00:33:31.000 And they govern by our consent, but they're constrained by those seven articles and those 27 amendments.

00:33:38.000 And if she doesn't know them, that's the last person I want sitting in a judge's seat. 1.00

00:33:44.000 How do you graduate law school?

00:33:46.000 Without, I mean, answers.

00:33:47.000 They don't teach the Constitution.

00:33:48.000 Yeah, law schools have forsaken it.

00:33:50.000 Yeah, they don't teach the very law that they're supposed to uphold and defend.

00:33:54.000 So, but pastors, I'm seeing an increased appetite from some pastors on this.

00:34:00.000 Others seem to becoming even more belligerent in saying that this is a mistake.

00:34:04.000 Yeah.

00:34:05.000 Well, it's always going to be that way.

00:34:08.000 And you know what?

00:34:09.000 We're going to, it's like Romans 11.

00:34:13.000 We're going to elicit to them jealousy.

00:34:16.000 I mean, they're going to want what we're doing because every church that made a stand, every church that pushed back grew.

00:34:23.000 And the ones that were compliant and went along with everything, their church has shrunk.

00:34:28.000 Well, now in this season, some of them are coming back.

00:34:30.000 Maybe they found their stride again and they want to just double down in their defense of their position.

00:34:36.000 But it's not like this is the last time.

00:34:38.000 It's coming again.

00:34:39.000 We're seeing it in California.

00:34:40.000 It's going to come again.

00:34:42.000 And they'll turn to us.

00:34:44.000 I hope so.

00:34:45.000 Yeah.

00:34:45.000 And that's going to be the question of the church.

00:34:47.000 And Metaxas has been very clear on this.

00:34:49.000 Yeah.

00:34:50.000 About if we don't stand and do something now, then.

00:34:54.000 I love his example of Martin Niemohler, who really was a liberal and was the typical kind of pro-vaccine, you know, pro-support the government, the definition of Romans 13 that we're to submit to all positions of authority, forget about the fact that they're there for our good.

00:35:11.000 It was just this unlimited submission.

00:35:13.000 So the number one quoted verse in Nazi Germany.

00:35:15.000 Niemoller bought into that.

00:35:17.000 And then all of a sudden he realized, you know, they came for the socialists.

00:35:21.000 I wasn't one.

00:35:21.000 So I said nothing.

00:35:22.000 They came after the communists.

00:35:23.000 I wasn't one.

00:35:23.000 So I said nothing.

00:35:25.000 And then when they came for me, there was no one left.

00:35:27.000 And he started to stand with Dietrich Bonhoeffer.

00:35:31.000 And That's what we're hoping with some of these pastors that didn't do it the first time around.

00:35:37.000 I'm looking for them to be those Martin Niemolers who awaken knowing that the church is a victim of liberty.

00:35:42.000 Audience that goes to a church that's not yet doing what it should be doing after all this, what can they do? 0.61

00:35:47.000 Find another church.

00:35:49.000 Seriously, at this point, if you haven't figured it out and the pastor still needs time, they have no interest in changing.

00:35:57.000 I agree.

00:35:57.000 Yeah, I think you have to find a church that is consistent with your values and doing something, speaking out, being bold and courageous.

00:36:07.000 Real quick, numbers 30, tacit submission, meaning you don't speak up.

00:36:12.000 You are in compliance with that evil.

00:36:14.000 You can read it.

00:36:15.000 That's where we get speak now forever, hold your peace in a wedding ceremony.

00:36:18.000 It's out of numbers 30.

00:36:19.000 Rob, anything else you wanted to mention before we close up?

00:36:22.000 Keep praying for us.

00:36:23.000 TPUSA Faith is making a difference, and so is Turning Point USA.

00:36:28.000 The battleship.

00:36:28.000 TPFaith.com, Rob, thank you so much.

00:36:30.000 Thanks, John.

00:36:31.000 Appreciate it.

00:36:34.000 Thanks so much for listening, everybody.

00:36:35.000 Email me your thoughts as always.

00:36:36.000 Freedom at charliekirk.com.

00:36:38.000 Thank you so much for listening and God bless.

00:36:43.000 For more on many of these stories and news you can trust, go to CharlieKirk.com.

The Charlie Kirk Show - February 03, 2023

A.I. Armageddon with Joe Allen and Pastor Rob McCoy

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