00:00:14.000Tucker Carlson, Patrick Bett, David, Candace Owens, Glenn Beck, Rob Schneider, Roseanne Barr, Dennis Prager, Allie Bestucci, Jonathan Isaac, James O'Keefe, Riley Gaines, Ben Carson, Michael Anton, Jason Whitlock, Gad Sad, Brandon Tatum, Seth Dillon, Jack Pesobic, Benny Johnson.
00:00:29.000We also have Avek Ramaswamy and Steve Bannon.
00:00:57.000His spirit, his love of this country, he's done an amazing job building one of the most powerful youth organizations ever created, Turning Point USA.
00:01:06.000We will not embrace the ideas that have destroyed countries, destroyed lives, and we are going to fight for freedom on campuses across the country.
00:01:44.000Actually, we titled it somewhat provocatively: Vivek says his opponents are cowards for not acknowledging or not being aware that we're in a war.
00:01:58.000One of the reasons that I wanted to interview Vivek is because of all the presidential nominees, with perhaps a partial exception of Trump.
00:02:09.000He's the one that understands that we're in a war.
00:02:16.000As he's fond of saying, you can't win a war if you don't know you're in one.
00:02:21.000So, requirement number one is to know you're in one, and requirement number two is to have a commander-in-chief who can lead the war.
00:02:30.000So, that's and what Vivek did, he challenged his opponents, particularly Nikki Haley and Ron DeSantis, to declare themselves.
00:02:42.000Do they think we're in a war or don't they?
00:02:46.000And he even went so far as to say that they're not real patriots if they don't address the issue of our time.
00:02:58.000So, that was the gist of the interview, I think.
00:03:00.000And he, in addition to the war, you know, he talked about his various policies, immigration, birthright citizenship.
00:03:09.000He wants to pass an English-only amendment.
00:03:14.000But I think the real nuts of it, the center of it, was this idea we're in a war, and my opponents either don't realize it or realize it, but don't say it.
00:03:26.000So, from your perspective, how is it possible that a majority of the people running, not a majority, everyone but two running for the Republican nomination don't even acknowledge that we're in a war?
00:03:37.000Is it that they know it and they don't want to say it because it sounds too radical?
00:03:45.000Well, my basic answer is: I don't know.
00:03:49.000One answer, which is what the Veik proposed not unreasonably, is if you acknowledge a risk, in this case, war, then you've got to do something about it.
00:04:03.000We tend to put our heads in the sand because, again, if we acknowledged whatever the danger is, then we might have to do something about it.
00:04:14.000So some of it, again, this is, I'm really channeling the Vaik here.
00:04:20.000He's calling, in fact, he explicitly called them cowards.
00:04:25.000I also think that, you know, Republicans have been thinking about the world for generations now in a certain kind of way.
00:04:33.000And they have an understanding of what constitutes the right, left, Democrat, Republican split.
00:04:46.000Sometimes they're intimidating, I guess.
00:04:50.000You know, if you come out and you say we're in a war and you attack Black Lives Matter and you say things, as I did in a recent speech, America is not racist.
00:05:03.000If you say things like that, you get called racist.
00:05:08.000And most of our politicians, the Vake and Trump being notable exceptions, don't want to be called racist.
00:05:18.000They want to get invited on mainstream media.
00:07:20.000I was a fellow, Lincoln fellow, a couple of summers ago, and we talked a lot about this.
00:07:25.000Is once you acknowledge that you're in a war, then you can go about solving it and fixing it.
00:07:30.000And that really is the divide right now.
00:07:33.000Now, Tom, you talk about this in your piece, where if I go to an average Republican breakfast, 500 grassroots folks, 99% of them will tell us we're in a war.
00:07:47.000If I go to an average turning point USA meeting, they know we're in a war.
00:07:51.000But if I go to the Republicans running for president or Republicans in Congress, they say, no, no, no, we're not in a war.
00:08:00.000How do you explain that disconnect where the rank and file, the base, the patriotic core of the party know that we're in a war, yet the leaders refuse to acknowledge that?
00:08:12.000Well, that's the healthy part of our society that understands the importance of family and church and community, and they can see those things being eroded.
00:08:25.000Our leaders, again, they're in Washington and they're a little bit distant, but the rank and file, Trump's base, we're very, very lucky to have Trump's base.
00:08:36.000Your audience that you talk about who understands we're in a war, we need those people very much.
00:08:44.000And that's one of the reasons I tend to favor Trump is that he has this base that's passionate.
00:08:50.000You know, the other side, it's always true in a revolution that there are relatively few revolutionaries, very committed, who can carry the day.
00:09:02.000We usually don't have people on our side that can match the passion and enthusiasm of the woke radicals.
00:09:15.000Typically, the American right is more focused on building their family, building their business, raising their kids, and doing the minimum amount of work possible.
00:09:25.000What the MAGA Trump movement has done is now we have matched, if not surpassed, the activist passion from the left.
00:09:34.000I couldn't, Charlie, I don't know that I could improve on that.
00:09:36.000Well, but just walk us through the history because when I think of old school Republicanism, it's more intellectual arguments, small groups of people, you know, winning the debate.
00:09:45.000But the left has always had the advantage with the infantry, always.
00:11:14.000And remember, retirement is about more than just investments.
00:11:17.000The Charlie Kirk endorsement of the PAX Financial Group LLC was given for compensation, which creates an incentive to recommend PAX's advisory services.
00:11:27.000Need to make sure that disclaimer is very clear.
00:11:29.000So check it out, paxfg.com slash Charlie.
00:11:33.000Everyone should check out the website, TomKlingenstein.com, chairman of the Claremont Institute.
00:11:40.000So acknowledging that we're in a war for some people, Tom, is uncomfortable.
00:11:46.000I recently was chatting with a Republican donor.
00:11:49.000He's a good person, but he's very naive, wealthy.
00:11:52.000And he says, Charlie, I don't like this language that we're in a war.
00:11:55.000We've been through tough times before, and cooler heads ultimately prevail, and we have more in common than not.
00:12:02.000And we need to stop our divides and find common ground.
00:12:12.000I mean, you have to allow for the possibility that while it's generally true, we've been able to get through tough times, times of division.
00:13:13.000But then we can look at what's happening today in America.
00:13:18.000And we're talking about people censoring and shaming and the government spying on us, people getting fired, required to make loyalty oaths to DEI to get a job.
00:13:31.000Some people even denied banking services.
00:13:37.000This is something we don't talk much about.
00:13:40.000If you work for Trump, there's an organization out there called the 65 Project that wants to disbar you, keep you from ever representing people again.
00:13:52.000And of course, this won't stop at Trump lawyers.
00:13:57.000It will continue and it will apply over time to anybody who defends an anti-woke cause.
00:14:07.000So these things are really unique, right?
00:14:10.000This isn't the run of the mill divide that we've seen.
00:14:15.000I tell you something else that impresses me, not always easy to convince people, but I think Trump was taken out in a coup.
00:16:23.000A leader who will say it and explain it and be able to respond to that donor of yours.
00:16:30.000That donor's attitude is not insignificant.
00:16:32.000I'd say a majority of people in the ruling class have that attitude.
00:16:36.000They live a comfortable life and they almost refuse to acknowledge that life might have to get a little bit uncomfortable to save something bigger than themselves.
00:17:54.000So Tom, the obvious question is, once we are able to educate people and enlighten them that we are in the midst of a war, which the rank and file know that we are in a war, what next?
00:18:05.000What is the battle plan and what does success look like?
00:18:09.000Well, first of all, you've got to do things like you don't reach across the aisle, right?
00:19:04.000And therefore, we on the right have to try to maintain K through 12.
00:19:11.000Now, there's some good news here because of all the areas of American life, K through 12 is one where there is some pushback on the right.
00:19:23.000So your listeners, those with children, ought to get on their local school boards and they ought to take this pornography out of their school libraries and they have to insist on an America-first civics education.
00:19:41.000They have to insist that they teach America, despite its many sins, that this is a great country.
00:19:50.000They live in the greatest country in the world.
00:20:32.000I would, we could go through the disadvantages too.
00:20:34.000If you were just to kind of, as an outside observer, say we are in a war and you have one side versus the other, the right versus the left, what are the advantages that the right has for us to win this war?
00:20:47.000You know, I'm more comfortable giving you the disadvantages.
00:21:17.000The point of the military is to kill people, obviously in defense of America, right?
00:21:24.000The rules that apply in the general public, right, don't necessarily apply in the military because the military has a different goal, which I said, to kill people.
00:21:36.000And therefore, they have different standards.
00:21:39.000Now, to your question, of the things we lack, even with Trump's base, we don't have the kind of committed force that the left has.
00:21:57.000Obviously, we don't control any of the major institutions in this country.
00:22:04.000The one place where we have a real presence is in politics at local and the federal level.
00:22:12.000That is a strength, but we have to use it.
00:23:39.000Ron DeSantis ought to bow out of this race and get behind Trump and campaign for him and stop throwing or shooting arrows at Trump, shoot them at Biden, express a willingness to serve in Trump's administration.
00:23:59.000Obviously, DeSantis is very qualified.
00:24:02.000And doing that, I think, gives him an opportunity to explain. just what's happening.
00:24:10.000I mean, even to the act of stepping out of the race, which, you know, you never see that, right?
00:24:18.000That act by itself is noteworthy and calls attention to the fact we're in a war.
00:24:25.000You know, if I'm DeSantis and I'm just thinking about my own self-interest, I stay in this race, right?
00:25:23.000A concern that some people have, and I think it's interesting, is that if Trump were to win, we still have all the other existing cultural problems, but a leader can go about solving them.
00:25:36.000I want you to take a step back, Tom, and give us your opinion on the raw material of America as far as the everyday man.
00:25:45.000Do you think the country has lost from the everyday ethos, how people operate, the values, the morals, and the character that they have?
00:25:54.000Do we still have that strong mean, the middle class?
00:26:00.000Or has that been largely destroyed by a regime over multiple generations?
00:26:05.000Well, if it has, then we're doomed, right?
00:26:09.000People have to remember, and I think the average person understands that our regime, the founders understood that our regime was dependent more than any other kind of regime on the virtue of the citizens, right?
00:26:27.000Checks and balances and those things that we learn in civics, they're important, but they are very secondary bulwarks.
00:26:36.000The first line of defense is the virtue of our citizens.
00:26:42.000And I believe, I certainly hope, but I also believe that the healthy part of our society, the part that believes in family, and let me pause to say, nothing is more important than family because it's family that teaches the next generation of citizens what it means to be an American citizen, what constitutes virtue.
00:27:06.000So we still have a large portion of the population that believes in family.
00:27:12.000Yes, religion is falling, but we're still a more religious nation than is Europe and most of the rest of the world.
00:27:21.000So you asked me earlier for positives.
00:27:25.000So I'm counting on what I imagine to be your audience.
00:27:34.000On the other side, you know, they're going about trying to destroy family.
00:27:39.000BLM even had that as part of their mission statement.
00:27:42.000They want to get rid of family, and that's part of their effort to achieve outcome equality.
00:27:51.000Everything that they're doing, one way or another, directly or indirectly, is aimed at bringing about this outcome equality regime.
00:28:03.000But to answer your question or to repeat my answer, I think absolutely there are enough people.
00:28:11.000And I even think that many Democrats, the Democrats have been taken over by the radical wing.
00:28:19.000Somebody within the Democrat establishment has to stand up and distance themselves from the woke radicals.
00:28:28.000Because if they don't, then they're just like the woke radicals.
00:28:31.000They can say they're not, but they amount to the same thing.
00:28:35.000I would add to the list of advantages, and it has not been finalized, but the trend is positive when you see people like Elon Musk engage in the cultural landscape and use some of their political power and some of their podium towards calling out the woke and trying to do something to protect Western values.
00:28:57.000I'm not saying Elon is on the conservative side, but he certainly is making life more difficult for the radical Marxist.
00:29:08.000You're exciting news to share about saving babies by providing ultrasounds.
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00:29:22.000And right now, you can save twice as many babies.
00:29:25.000Maybe you're already wondering about end of the year giving and want to give every dollar, get the most results.
00:29:30.000Or maybe you just want to know that a girl making this decision deserves the truth.
00:29:33.000So that next year at this time, she's picking out a Christmas stocking for her baby's first Christmas.
00:30:12.000So, Tom, there's so much I want to talk to you about.
00:30:15.000The last topic that I want to cover, though, I'm not sure how long this will take, is the use of political power.
00:30:21.000If you were to create a game plan, a war plan, for people that are in office, attorneys general, governors, the House of Representatives, since we are in a war, how should we use political power?
00:30:37.000I mean, I'm not sure that's my area of expertise, Charlie.
00:30:41.000I was going to say, but there are things that we can do.
00:30:46.000One reason for optimism, you noticed in these Hamas protests, finally, some of the big donors started withdrawing their contributions or committing not to contribute to these Ivy League schools where they've encouraged protest.
00:31:09.000One of the advantages you asked earlier, well, the conservatives still have money.
00:31:14.000They don't have as much money as the left, but they have money and they ought to use that.
00:31:24.000And, you know, that's power for 70 years at least.
00:31:31.000The wealthy Republican donors have financed colleges that are teaching things that are very much against their interest.
00:31:41.000Maybe these protests will alert them to the fact that their colleges have been teaching something very bad.
00:31:52.000And the Hamas protests are just an extension.
00:31:56.000I think attorneys generals can go after this ESG.
00:32:06.000Attorney General or states can, as they have in some states, initiate their own border patrols.
00:33:10.000I don't know any more than you do, Charlie, or your audience, but I'm hopeful.
00:33:15.000The answer is, I think we're going to win.
00:33:18.000And in part, that's because I want to win.
00:33:21.000And I think it's so important that we do win.
00:33:25.000And what everybody has to understand, Trump understands it, that we've got to win.
00:33:31.000We don't have that many more choices, despite what that wealthy donor of yours that you referred to earlier believes.
00:33:42.000You know, we don't have that much time and we need that sense of urgency, which is one reason I want DeSantis out of the race and support Trump and explain to people, because DeSantis can explain, explain why it's different this time and why Trump is the leader for this moment.