The Charlie Kirk Show - October 10, 2023


An America-First Middle East Policy with Vivek Ramaswamy


Episode Stats


Length

37 minutes

Words per minute

179.92024

Word count

6,768

Sentence count

518

Harmful content

Misogyny

3

sentences flagged

Toxicity

5

sentences flagged

Hate speech

26

sentences flagged


Summary

Summaries generated with gmurro/bart-large-finetuned-filtered-spotify-podcast-summ .

Vivek Ramaswamy joins the show to talk about the recent attacks in Israel and Iran, and why the U.S. should be focused on supporting Israel, not on bashing Iran. He also talks about how to deal with the aftermath of the attacks in Gaza.

Transcript

Transcripts from "The Charlie Kirk Show" are sourced from the Knowledge Fight Interactive Search Tool. Explore them interactively here.
Misogyny classifications generated with MilaNLProc/bert-base-uncased-ear-misogyny .
Toxicity classifications generated with s-nlp/roberta_toxicity_classifier .
Hate speech classifications generated with facebook/roberta-hate-speech-dynabench-r4-target .
00:00:00.000 Hey everybody, today on the Charlie Kirk show, Vivek Ramaswamy joins the program.
00:00:04.000 Email us as always, freedom at charliekirk.com and subscribe to our podcast.
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00:00:23.000 Here we go.
00:00:24.000 Charlie, what you've done is incredible here.
00:00:26.000 Maybe Charlie Kirk is on the college campuses.
00:00:28.000 I want you to know we are lucky to have Charlie Kirk.
00:00:32.000 Charlie Kirk's running the White House, folks.
00:00:35.000 I want to thank Charlie.
00:00:36.000 He's an incredible guy.
00:00:37.000 His spirit, his love of this country.
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00:01:06.000 Joining us now is Vivek Ramaswamy.
00:01:08.000 You know he is running for the presidency and he has some exciting ideas about how to fix this country.
00:01:15.000 Vivek, welcome to the program.
00:01:16.000 I want to just dive right into the Israel situation.
00:01:19.000 How should we think about what happened in Israel from America First perspective, not from the traditional neoconservative perspective, still having the back of our ally in the region?
00:01:30.000 Vivek, how should we think about this?
00:01:32.000 Yeah, absolutely.
00:01:33.000 I mean, the way I think about it, Charlie, is that these were barbaric attacks.
00:01:36.000 They were medieval, inhumane attacks, and it was wrong.
00:01:40.000 And Israel absolutely has the right to defend its own homeland to the fullest extent necessary.
00:01:47.000 And I think the job of the U.S. as an ally is to support Israel diplomatically, to support Israel with the necessary munitions needed to do that.
00:01:56.000 We store some of those munitions in Israel.
00:01:59.000 Intelligence sharing against the U.N., which has a habitual response almost always to draw false equivalents between Israel and the terrorists and enemies who target Israel.
00:02:09.000 That's where the U.S. should be leading.
00:02:12.000 But while keeping a clear-headed and cool-headed response that avoids an all-out war, a regional war in the Middle East that enmeshes the U.S. in it, that does not advance U.S. interests.
00:02:25.000 That is the key.
00:02:26.000 And we require, I think, a cool-headed response, a rational response here, Charlie.
00:02:30.000 This was a catastrophe for Israel. 0.72
00:02:33.000 And as an ally of Israel, the United States is affected by that too.
00:02:37.000 But we can't make the same mistakes that we have in the face of past catastrophes, say 9-11 or otherwise, in entering prolonged regional conflicts in the Middle East.
00:02:47.000 And so we have to do both of those things at once.
00:02:50.000 Have Israel's back so that they can defend their own homeland while being rational and avoid getting yanked into a broader regional conflict.
00:02:59.000 And I have some very clear and specific ideas of how to do it.
00:03:03.000 I am disappointed in other Republican presidential candidates, like the likes of Nikki Haley, who have been hysterically shouting things like finish them that are entirely incoherent, calling this an attack on America.
00:03:16.000 It was a bad attack on Israel, but that is still not an attack on America.
00:03:19.000 That's irresponsible.
00:03:21.000 And this is a time for actual America First leadership.
00:03:24.000 And that's what I would bring to the table.
00:03:26.000 So, Vivek, the question then is Iran.
00:03:29.000 How should we think about Iran?
00:03:30.000 Should we reapply sanctions on Iran?
00:03:32.000 Should we try to cut off the money?
00:03:35.000 Are there more things we could do against Iran? 0.97
00:03:37.000 I mean, the Biden administration is just lying when they say that there's no evidence that Iran was behind the Hamas attacks.
00:03:44.000 That's completely and totally false.
00:03:47.000 How should we think about Iran?
00:03:48.000 So Iran is fundamentally hostile to the United States. 0.57
00:03:51.000 We have to see that for what it is.
00:03:53.000 Let's take the latest lie, which I think is absolutely relevant to what happened here.
00:03:58.000 The $6 billion that were unfroze to Iran.
00:04:01.000 And by the way, more recently, even payments that were sent $10 billion from Iraq to Iran earlier this summer, that strengthens Iran.
00:04:08.000 And it is a lie when we say that those are only reserved for humanitarian purposes.
00:04:14.000 Just think about it for a second.
00:04:15.000 If you're a country or a company or whatever and you have $6 billion coming in, yes, even if that's restricted in its use, that $6 billion that you would have spent on humanitarian purposes, that you can spend from a different hand supporting terrorist groups like Hamas or Hezbollah.
00:04:31.000 So that's a lie, and Iran is a problem. 1.00
00:04:34.000 I think our top objective with respect to Iran has to be making sure that they completely fully phase out any nuclear capabilities. 0.93
00:04:43.000 The Biden administration has been a disaster.
00:04:45.000 I think that we should absolutely apply the full financial force to make sure that Iran is weakened. 0.98
00:04:51.000 But at the same time, Charlie, and no one else is talking about this, I think it is boneheaded U.S. policy by the Biden administration, with the aiding and abetting of some Republicans, to engage in a serious discussion with Saudi Arabia about becoming nuclear equipped in the region as well.
00:05:06.000 That is crazy.
00:05:08.000 And so I think nuclear nonproliferation throughout those countries, the Arab and Shia countries in the Middle East, I think is a top priority.
00:05:16.000 Iran cannot be nuclear equipped, but we're not helping ourselves when we're having that same discussion about nuclear technology transfer to Saudi Arabia.
00:05:24.000 And I think it is remarkable, Charlie, that I'm the only Republican that actually has the spine to bring up that issue, but that is part and parcel of what a rational U.S. strategy here has to be.
00:05:36.000 And we can't be dancing around eggshells.
00:05:39.000 This is an important time to both support Israel while also be really clear-headed about we're at risk of seeing a major all-out regional war in the Middle East that does not advance U.S. interests. 0.77
00:05:51.000 And a true U.S. leader, a true America first leader, would avoid that outcome while still standing for our friends in Israel.
00:05:59.000 That's the way I would lead.
00:06:00.000 So the other candidates, they're increasing the chatter.
00:06:05.000 I, for one, am cheering for Israel to be able to get justice.
00:06:08.000 And, you know, Vivek, this is not...
00:06:11.000 Can you expand on that?
00:06:12.000 Because this was not just a typical Israel-Hamas border dispute.
00:06:16.000 You know, when I first saw this on the news, I wrongly assumed, okay, probably a couple dozen dead, not diminishing that, right?
00:06:25.000 But, you know, kind of what we've grown accustomed to over the last decade, right?
00:06:28.000 Rockets here, rockets there, they fight for a couple days, and then they come to some sort of settlement.
00:06:35.000 There's now reports, Vivek, that they were cutting babies' heads off.
00:06:38.000 And they were not going from...
00:06:41.000 They were not going for military targets.
00:06:44.000 And I think this is the really important thing we must emphasize, that it would be bad if, okay, they attack a military base, they're at war.
00:06:51.000 They bypassed other military targets to go for civilians.
00:06:57.000 Yes.
00:06:57.000 And I think that it is accurate, Charlie, when people have said, I think rightly called this Israel's 9-11.
00:07:04.000 I really do think it was, because it was as much a psychological attack on Israel's national right to exist. 0.75
00:07:11.000 That's really what this was.
00:07:13.000 That is heinous.
00:07:14.000 And Israel needs to decide what its response is going to be.
00:07:17.000 That decision belongs to Israel, and it's up to us in the U.S. to respect that decision and to support them as they defend their national self-existence, as they rightly have the right to do for their homeland.
00:07:31.000 And I think it was different.
00:07:32.000 But I think one of the lessons to learn is that we made disastrous responses in this country to our 9-11 in this country.
00:07:40.000 And I don't want to see Israel make those same mistakes, but more importantly, I don't want to see the U.S. make those same mistakes.
00:07:45.000 We went 25 years of wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, sacrificing $3 trillion of taxpayer money, more importantly, thousands upon thousands of innocent American lives to what end?
00:07:58.000 The Taliban still in charge in Afghanistan, still a hostile anti-American regime in Iraq, vulnerable to Iranian incursion.
00:08:05.000 So we cannot repeat those same mistakes of the past while still making sure we act with fortitude to allow Israel to defend its own homeland as they deserve to.
00:08:16.000 And that's the kind of clear-headed leadership we need.
00:08:18.000 And the reason I'm being vocal about this now, Charlie, is that the rest of the Republican field has lost their minds on this issue.
00:08:25.000 I mean, I haven't heard where Trump is on it, but I'm talking about the other people who are on that debate stage.
00:08:30.000 I mean, the Nikki Haleys and the Mike Pence's, the Tim Scotts.
00:08:34.000 This is heading in an irresponsible direction.
00:08:36.000 I'm even seeing Ron DeSantis using a bullhorn, making a George Bush-like 9-11 recreation that I don't think really fell anything other than flat.
00:08:45.000 This is wrong.
00:08:46.000 And I think that we have to be clear-headed in our response.
00:08:49.000 No, I mean, Ron DeSantis grabs a random bullhorn and goes into the street as if he was over the ruins of 9-11.
00:08:55.000 It fell flat.
00:08:56.000 It was not smart.
00:08:57.000 So I want to keep talking about this because how we respond as Americans is very, very important.
00:09:04.000 And, you know, Lindsey Graham is going out there, I think, rather irresponsibly saying we might have to go have American jets go bomb Iranian refineries. 0.98
00:09:12.000 I think that's insane, right?
00:09:14.000 I think some people...
00:09:16.000 So the Pentagon right now, quote, does not rule out troops on the ground to rescue American citizens in Gaza.
00:09:22.000 Now, I could potentially see an argument for that, but my gut instinct, Vivek, 45 seconds, is I don't trust these people to not have that potentially barrel into a bigger story.
00:09:36.000 Vivek.
00:09:37.000 So look, again, we have to be level-headed about our principles.
00:09:40.000 America first.
00:09:40.000 What's our principle?
00:09:41.000 And part of America first is no American left behind.
00:09:45.000 So I think there is a reasonable discussion, Charlie, to see how we prioritize getting American hostages out of that situation.
00:09:52.000 But that's a separate point from a broader regional conflict in the Middle East.
00:09:57.000 And I think that we should be really clear-headed, whatever our responses.
00:10:01.000 The limiting principle here should be: we're not going to see the U.S. enmeshed in some other ground troop conflict in the Middle East with Iran or otherwise.
00:10:10.000 And I think it is beyond insane that we're actively discussing, for example, nuclear technology transfer to Saudi Arabia.
00:10:16.000 The other principle needs to be nuclear nonproliferation across the board, Iran, Saudi Arabia, full stop, while still supporting Israel's ability to defend its own homeland. 0.55
00:10:27.000 That's what real leadership means here.
00:10:30.000 Are you prepared for the unthinkable ahead?
00:10:33.000 Charlie Kirk here.
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00:11:33.000 I want to play a piece of tape here.
00:11:35.000 Let's go to, yes, Nikki Haley, as mentioned.
00:11:39.000 I want you to respond to this tape, Vivek, and explain why you think this is an irresponsible answer.
00:11:44.000 Play cut five, please.
00:11:46.000 This should be personal for every woman and man in America.
00:11:50.000 Why?
00:11:51.000 Because when they did this, when they did this surprise attack, when they took these hostages, when they murdered these families, they were celebrating.
00:12:00.000 And what were they celebrating?
00:12:01.000 They were saying, death to Israel, death to America.
00:12:05.000 This is not just an attack on Israel.
00:12:07.000 This is an attack on America because they hate us just as much.
00:12:11.000 And I'll say this to Prime Minister Netanyahu: finish them.
00:12:16.000 Finish them.
00:12:17.000 Hamas did this. 0.62
00:12:18.000 You know Iran's behind it. 0.99
00:12:19.000 Finish them. 0.97
00:12:20.000 They should have hell to pay for what they've just done. 0.83
00:12:23.000 The Vake Your Response.
00:12:24.000 I think that was an irresponsible response from somebody who touts her own foreign policy experience.
00:12:31.000 When I say Nikki Haley does have foreign policy experience, and it shows, among other things, in her bank account, that's a separate point for another day.
00:12:38.000 I do not think that somebody who profits from war as a military contractor or otherwise should be able to get anywhere near the White House.
00:12:45.000 But put that to one side, she's representative of a broader wing of the Republican Party, the Lindsey Graham, John Bolton, Chris Christie, Mike Pence, Nikki Haley wing of the party that is trying to bring back an era, a bygone era for now, of disastrous U.S.-Middle Eastern engagement, almost as though they're salivating over the opportunity to go to war again.
00:13:06.000 This was a disastrous attack on Israel. 0.77
00:13:09.000 It was the equivalent of Israel's 9-11. 0.86
00:13:12.000 It was wrong.
00:13:13.000 It was barbaric.
00:13:14.000 It was medieval in its nature.
00:13:16.000 We have to help and support Israel to defend itself.
00:13:20.000 But that is different from calling it, as she literally did, an attack on America.
00:13:27.000 That means you don't understand what an attack on America actually is.
00:13:30.000 There are attacks brewing in America.
00:13:32.000 We have porous borders in this country.
00:13:34.000 Violence rampant in cities across this country because of that border crisis.
00:13:39.000 More people due to die in this country this year.
00:13:42.000 80 times as many that died on 9-11 dying of fentanyl poisoning in this country from what crosses the southern and northern border.
00:13:50.000 There's no interest in that, though.
00:13:52.000 She's calling this an attack on America.
00:13:54.000 And just in a literal sense, it is irresponsible for somebody running to be our commander-in-chief to speak that way.
00:13:59.000 And then to invoke both Iran and Hamas in the same sentence and then hysterically shout, finish them.
00:14:06.000 That is the kind of warmongering that is dangerous without precision.
00:14:10.000 So put them to one side, Charlie.
00:14:12.000 Put that wing. 1.00
00:14:13.000 It's Nikki Haley, but she's representative of a broader toxic movement in the Republican Party. 1.00
00:14:18.000 We need clarity.
00:14:20.000 Stay out of World War III. 0.91
00:14:21.000 Stay out of broader, unmeasured conflict in the Middle East, while still enabling Israel to defend itself as it has the right to do with diplomatic support, munitions support where necessary, and also, frankly, intelligence sharing.
00:14:37.000 Another question, Charlie, and this is really important.
00:14:39.000 Everybody else in the existing establishment says this is a question for later.
00:14:43.000 I want to know what the hell went wrong with U.S. and Israeli intelligence and with Israeli defense.
00:14:50.000 When there's an airplane that crashes, they don't let the same airliner that crashed the plane analyze the black box.
00:14:57.000 That goes to somebody else.
00:14:58.000 We need that answer now.
00:15:00.000 How this was able to happen in an era of what should have been heightened security, approaching the 50-year anniversary right around it of the Yom Kippur War of 1973.
00:15:09.000 How did this happen?
00:15:11.000 And until we get that answer, we're at risk of making some of those same mistakes at an even larger scale as the likes of Nikki Haley beat the drums to war, almost rooting for it in the Middle East.
00:15:23.000 To say we need a cool-headed, rational-level response, supporting Israel's ability to defend its own homeland because that's the right thing to do. 0.53
00:15:32.000 And Israel fully has the right to defend its national self-existence.
00:15:36.000 And we stand with them and against anybody else who will argue against that.
00:15:40.000 but at the same time, diplomatically with sanity, avoiding that broader regional U.S. enmeshed conflict in the Middle East.
00:15:48.000 We've seen that movie before and we don't want to see it again.
00:15:51.000 I want to explore something with you that I don't think has been covered.
00:15:54.000 Number one, we are told, this is a wrinkle that has not been covered by Steve Schmidt and other people that January 6th was 9-11.
00:16:02.000 You know what?
00:16:03.000 No, actually what just happened in Israel, that should really put some of these domestic security state people in their corner.
00:16:12.000 Like, no, actually, that's what a 9-11 looks like.
00:16:16.000 It should put things in perspective.
00:16:16.000 Okay.
00:16:18.000 But number two, Vivek, we have this massive leviathan, this federal Bureau of Investigation that has a whole category for MAGA that is spying on conservatives.
00:16:27.000 We have the CIA International.
00:16:29.000 I am not confident, Vivek, that our government is currently monitoring the sleeper cells that are in this country to potentially prevent an attack on the homeland.
00:16:41.000 We have a wide open southern border, and it seems as if, according to the government's own sworn congressional testimony, they say domestic, violent, right-wing extremism is the greatest threat.
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00:18:57.000 So you hear frequently that right-wing domestic violent extremism is the greatest threat to the homeland.
00:19:03.000 Vivek Ramaswamy continues with us.
00:19:05.000 Vivek, do you have confidence in our federal government to preempt a sleeper cell activation event here if the Middle East goes into a kinetic regional conflict?
00:19:16.000 Absolutely not.
00:19:17.000 There is no basis to have that confidence.
00:19:20.000 So Charlie, when I've talked about my plan, for example, to shut down the FBI, and I stand by it, and people will use this as an occasion to say, oh, no, that's a crazy plan.
00:19:29.000 No, it's actually doing two things at once.
00:19:32.000 First is we're taking aim at the corruption that begins in that rot of the failed Bureau of Investigation that is the modern J. Edgar Hoover FBI.
00:19:40.000 Still the J. Edgar Hoover building that people walk into.
00:19:43.000 That's the source of corruption.
00:19:44.000 By the way, the same one that tried to target Martin Luther King with suicide over improperly collected tapes is now targeting conservatives and what they call MAGA extremists as terrorists.
00:19:54.000 That's wrong.
00:19:55.000 But we have to go also one step further to measure the effectiveness of this.
00:20:00.000 This isn't just a slogan for me.
00:20:01.000 This is clarity of vision.
00:20:03.000 35,000 employees at the FBI, 20,000 of them are back office bureaucrats.
00:20:09.000 We will send them home to find honest work in the private sector as they should.
00:20:13.000 But 15,000 of them, Charlie, are agents on the front lines, good people that are being used poorly.
00:20:19.000 They're not doing as good of a job as the U.S. Marshals on sex trafficking from kids and otherwise, or on drug enforcement, or on financial crimes.
00:20:26.000 So we will move them to the U.S. Marshals or to the Financial Crimes Enforcement Network or to the Secret Service or otherwise, other parts, the DEA, that have had far greater specialization.
00:20:37.000 And the FBI we have right now is purposefully asleep at the switch when they have had the same people doing counterterrorism now that were doing financial crimes or fraud before and vice versa.
00:20:48.000 They completely lack even the competence, let alone the specialization, to get that job done.
00:20:54.000 And so when a guy like me comes in and says we're going to shut down the FBI but move the 15,000 good people on the front lines, not only is that going to reduce corruption and cost and waste and bureaucracy, it will also increase the effectiveness of being able to actually see the real enemies are anti-Americans in the United States who want to harm the United States, not America-loving patriots who happen to be political enemies of the current administration, which is what we see today.
00:21:19.000 So I want to emphasize this.
00:21:21.000 And by the way, let's play CUT 60 here.
00:21:23.000 Here's Joe Biden saying the greatest threat is white supremacist right-wing extremism.
00:21:27.000 Let's play CUT 60, please. 0.97
00:21:29.000 To stand up against the poison of white supremacy, as I did my inaugural address to single out as the most dangerous terrorist threat to our homeland is white supremacy. 0.96
00:21:48.000 And I'm not saying this because I'm not a black HBCU. 0.97
00:21:53.000 I say it wherever I go.
00:21:56.000 I didn't know there were non-black HBCUs.
00:21:58.000 But anyway, let's also play Cut 59 and contrast what Joe Biden says with Cut 59.
00:22:03.000 I'll tell you for over two years now, Border Patrol agents have been telling us they've got extreme concerns about who is crossing our southern border, primarily because so many agents have been pulled off the front lines to instead focus on processing.
00:22:16.000 And that then leaves gaps in our border where we simply have nobody out on patrol.
00:22:21.000 And the numbers are startling.
00:22:22.000 We'll start with the terror watch list numbers.
00:22:24.000 Fiscal year 2023, so far, 151 people on the FBI's terror watch list have been arrested by Border Patrol agents while they were crossing illegally here at our southern border.
00:22:36.000 That is the highest number on record.
00:22:38.000 So Vivek, connect some dots here.
00:22:41.000 An open border is a direct threat to the homeland.
00:22:46.000 It is not too far of a grasp to say that there could be hundreds, if not thousands, of, let's just say, Hamas-sympathizing sleeper cells here in the homeland.
00:22:57.000 Vivek Ramaswamy.
00:22:59.000 I don't think it's a stretch at all.
00:23:00.000 I mean, Charlie, I went to the northern border, somewhere where the other candidates haven't really gone, but I think we need to pay attention to it.
00:23:07.000 It is wide open.
00:23:08.000 I mean, it's the footage that I posted online.
00:23:11.000 There are hiking trails literally at the Border Patrol office that you could see at the Customs and Border Patrol office.
00:23:16.000 That is a wide open border where you even have a lot of other people who are getting turned away at the southern border now turning.
00:23:22.000 So make no mistake, we have porous, if not outright open borders in the United States of America today.
00:23:28.000 That is a fact.
00:23:29.000 So one of the things that I think we need to do in response to this attack on Israel is wake up and say that if this can happen in Israel with the level of security and intelligence they have over there, it can absolutely happen right here at home.
00:23:43.000 This ought to be our wake-up call to protect our own homeland, not just sealing the southern border and the northern border with our own military, which obviously is a basic, low-hanging fruit step we obviously have to take, and that's solvable.
00:23:56.000 But we have to now deal with the problem that we have within the country already.
00:23:59.000 So I think any resident alien who has in any way been affiliated with Hamas or similar jihadist networks in the Middle East need to be deported out of this country immediately. 0.99
00:24:10.000 And some of them, if they're affiliated with Hamas, extradited to Israel, where they deserve justice in Israel in light of what's happened here as well. 0.98
00:24:17.000 That's the kind of leadership that we need, targeted, precise, rather than the deflection tool.
00:24:22.000 It's the consistent tool, Charlie, the woke smoke to deflect accountability.
00:24:26.000 That's what you see from the Biden administration.
00:24:28.000 So I'm going to risk sounding insensitive here, but people know where I come from because I'm a very outspoken pro-Israel person.
00:24:35.000 But Vivek, what does bother me is that some candidates get more fired up about what happens abroad than here domestically.
00:24:43.000 And I would not lump you into that category, nor Donald Trump.
00:24:47.000 But you know that Nikki Haley tape or Mike Pence, there seems to be a decibel level that is reached sometimes for the foreign and not the immediate.
00:24:55.000 And I'm not saying this does not, this does not justify outrage.
00:24:59.000 That's not what I'm saying.
00:25:00.000 That's not my position.
00:25:02.000 But it is strange that some politicians reach the highest fever pitch when things are happening in a different continent.
00:25:11.000 Why is that?
00:25:11.000 Help me understand.
00:25:13.000 So part of this is just the selective moral outrage even abroad.
00:25:17.000 I mean, look at the persecution of 100,000, 120,000 Christians in Armenia.
00:25:22.000 How much do you hear about that, either from the mainstream media or mainstream Republican, traditional Republican candidates?
00:25:28.000 Not a peep.
00:25:29.000 And so let's take the Ukraine conflict.
00:25:31.000 I mean, both these are around the perimeter of Russia.
00:25:33.000 On one hand, they claim it's good versus evil, which I reject.
00:25:37.000 Ukraine is not in any sense good just because Russia is bad. 0.98
00:25:40.000 But then you hear pin drop silence, Charlie, on what Azerbaijan is doing to those Armenians.
00:25:46.000 It's the exact same situation on the same facts, but you don't hear a peep.
00:25:49.000 Now, the reason why there is both Ukraine and Azerbaijan have very powerful, well-connected, well-funded lobbies in the United States, in Washington, D.C., and it's a special interest game.
00:26:01.000 And the same people who are the puppet masters of D.C. politicians are the puppet masters of candidates like Nikki Haley or Mike Pence or otherwise.
00:26:08.000 It is a broken and corrupt system.
00:26:11.000 But I think the key for us is not to be reactionary against them, as frustrating as that is.
00:26:15.000 Israel is an important, the key important ally of the United States in the Middle East.
00:26:20.000 What happened there was wrong.
00:26:21.000 We have to call that out for what it is and support Israel to defend its own national identity, but without using that as an excuse to enter broader regional conflict in the Middle East.
00:26:32.000 And it is part of this broader self-loathing when I don't see anybody else getting on a bullhorn for the 80,000 people that are dying of fentanyl overdoses or the crimes that are committed by people who illegally cross the border.
00:26:42.000 Get me the bullhorn for that rather than the theatrics and the histrionics we see from the rest of the Republican Party, which I think is shameful.
00:26:50.000 And I think the future of the Republican Party ought to be unapologetically America first.
00:26:54.000 They're making one last charge to try to stop that from happening.
00:26:58.000 That's the real divide in today's Republican Party.
00:27:01.000 But I think we need to bury the neocon philosophy back where it belongs and go back to putting the interests of this country first.
00:27:08.000 Yes, that does include supporting in the correct and focused ways our allies like Israel, but putting this country first without getting drawn into conflicts that do not advance our national interests.
00:27:20.000 Okay, so I completely and totally agree.
00:27:24.000 And I want to go to another layer here, which I think is important and it's related.
00:27:29.000 So, you know, we need to look at solving this long term.
00:27:34.000 So, Vivek, are you in support?
00:27:37.000 If President of the United States, you're a unique problem solver and entrepreneur, two-state solution, three-state solution.
00:27:43.000 Some people talk about a one-state solution, which is very bold.
00:27:48.000 How do we macro, is this solvable or is this just you're going to have to live with it?
00:27:53.000 That you're going to have to live with conflict, you're going to have to live with disputes, you just have to make sure nothing like this ever happens again.
00:28:00.000 And I think that's important, Vivek, because one of my fears is that Israel in the pursuit of justice will pursue revenge more than justice. 0.89
00:28:12.000 And I do not want to see this turn into a regional war.
00:28:15.000 I do want them to obviously defend themselves and take out Hamas. 0.97
00:28:19.000 But what does success look like in a Ramaswamy administration geopolitically?
00:28:24.000 How should we think about this?
00:28:26.000 So the right answer for Israel should be determined by Israel. 0.97
00:28:30.000 And I think that's a very important first principle.
00:28:33.000 They have tough decisions to make for themselves.
00:28:36.000 Are they going to take responsibility for Gazans, which historically Israel has been very reluctant to do or not?
00:28:42.000 These are tough decisions that belong to Israel. 1.00
00:28:44.000 And it is our job to respect the decisions that Israel makes, but making sure that we don't get accidentally mired with U.S. troops on the ground or otherwise in involvement in a broader regional conflict that does not belong to us.
00:28:59.000 So those are some basic principles.
00:29:01.000 Israel should pursue Israel first, and we have their back as they do it diplomatically and in terms of intelligence sharing and limited necessary munitions support in this narrow conflict. 0.97
00:29:12.000 While it's our job to look after America first principles.
00:29:15.000 Now, as a U.S. leader, if I'm on the phone with Bibi, I would share with him the learnings, the bad learnings that we have in the United States when we had our 9-11.
00:29:23.000 We made mistakes in response to that.
00:29:25.000 We got mired in Iraq and Afghanistan, 3 trillion, thousands of lives, that we now regret. 0.95
00:29:31.000 So good friends, share those learnings with each other.
00:29:33.000 But that's going to be Israel's decision to make what it does for its homeland.
00:29:37.000 But the U.S. decision needs to be we are going to prioritize avoiding a broader regional conflict and war in the Middle East that does not advance U.S. interests.
00:29:47.000 I think Iran, we need to make sure that they have full slate no nuclear capabilities.
00:29:52.000 But that is also why it is insane for the Biden administration to be engaging in talks with one of the most oil-rich nations in the world, Saudi Arabia, about nuclear technology transfer.
00:30:03.000 That is beyond insane.
00:30:05.000 And I think that those are the kinds of mistakes that we're actively making as we speak that most in the Republican Party are somehow walking on eggshells and afraid to call out, that it will take a true America first leader to actually state out loud to keep us out of a broader Middle Eastern war while standing for our friends in Israel and then apply those principles in places like Russia, Ukraine, negotiate peace there.
00:30:27.000 Another place where we have a President Biden that's sleepwalking us into major conflict that doesn't advance U.S. interests.
00:30:33.000 Now these become cumulative and we're really depleting our own ability to protect our own homeland, which I'm sorry to say this cynically, Charlie, for some people in the United States might even not only be an accident, it might be the goal itself.
00:30:47.000 And I'm not going to let that happen on my watch.
00:30:50.000 Vivek, plug your website, please.
00:30:51.000 We have one more segment together, but I want to make sure our audience is aware how to support you, how to get behind your grassroots campaign.
00:30:57.000 Sure.
00:30:58.000 It's Vivek2024.com, V-I-V-E-K2024.com.
00:31:03.000 We're not holding back.
00:31:04.000 I'm not playing the super PAC puppet game, but grassroots will take it.
00:31:07.000 So thanks a lot.
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00:32:07.000 Vivek, in foreign policy, prudence is the most important thing, to not compare everything as if everything is alike.
00:32:14.000 I think of the Russia-Ukraine situation in a completely different, not completely different, but a categorically different box than the Israel-Hamas situation.
00:32:24.000 Everything is not a nail, and we're not a hammer looking for a nail, right?
00:32:28.000 So you have to look at things through using prudence and practical judgment.
00:32:32.000 This is a classical trait that the Greeks talked about a lot, which is you can't fit everything into a prearranged box.
00:32:40.000 What would you say to the audience?
00:32:41.000 Because they'll say, but Charlie, if you say you're pro-Israel, why are you not pro-Ukraine?
00:32:46.000 Vivek, what is your response to that?
00:32:49.000 Well, my response is a couplefold.
00:32:51.000 Israel is an ally and matters to the U.S. Taiwan matters for practical reasons to the U.S. in terms of semiconductors in a way that Ukraine just does not.
00:33:01.000 And in the Ukraine conflict, just because Putin is bad does not mean that Ukraine is good.
00:33:06.000 This is a country that has banned 11 opposition parties, consolidated all TV media into one state media arm, celebrated a Nazi in its own ranks, Zelensky did, holding the U.S. hostage for more money over holding its own elections. 0.58
00:33:19.000 And by the way, the regions of the Donbass, Luhans, and Donetsk that are occupied now, these are Russian-speaking regions where most of the people don't view themselves as part of Ukraine and haven't been represented in the Ukrainian parliament for more than a decade.
00:33:32.000 And it is pathetic that most people will not have heard of those facts from the mainstream media as it exists today.
00:33:37.000 So we have to reasonably ask in Ukraine, what is a reasonable path to peace?
00:33:42.000 Because this war does not advance American interests.
00:33:45.000 I've laid out a very clear plan to get there, one that will allow Ukraine to come out with its own sovereignty intact.
00:33:51.000 But it's like what you said, Charlie, it's not about analogizing, it's about analyzing each situation in a rational, cool-headed way about how we advance American interests.
00:34:02.000 And so it's not some blanket, one-size-fits-all for the neocon group, it's go to war.
00:34:07.000 But it's not like there's an opposite camp where we should make the same mistake of having one blanket solution.
00:34:11.000 We need a commander-in-chief who can analyze each situation, do it in a rational way without corrupting special interests or influences, and say, how do we engage in a way that, yes, advances U.S. interests, not just for the short run, but over the long run, sure, but still exclusively advances U.S. interests.
00:34:30.000 And that's different in Taiwan from Ukraine, from Azerbaijan to Armenia, to Israel and Hamas.
00:34:35.000 And that's the kind of leadership we haven't had for a long time.
00:34:39.000 I think it's going to take an outsider, Charlie, and if I may say it, an outsider from a different generation, to start with a clean blank slate to see it with clear eyes.
00:34:49.000 That's what I see missing in today's GOP.
00:34:51.000 I am disappointed with the other people who have populated and permeated that debate stage with the same old neocon, one-size-fits-all pro-war solutions.
00:35:00.000 Shamefully, with some of those people like Nikki Haley, even set up to make money off of going to war even more.
00:35:05.000 That's shameful.
00:35:06.000 That's the way of the past.
00:35:08.000 Let this not be the Karl Rove, John Bolton, Nikki Haley, Chris Christie, Mike Pence wing of the party that governs anymore.
00:35:15.000 We need a future that, yes, puts America first, but we're going to do it thoughtfully.
00:35:19.000 Not making their mistake of the one-size blanket fitting all, but situation by situation, asking that question guided by actual facts on the ground, not a one-size-fits-all approach.
00:35:31.000 Vivek, in closing here, I want you just to kind of summarize all this.
00:35:35.000 And I just want to say, look, Vivek, you running for president.
00:35:40.000 Very, very important.
00:35:41.000 Your ideas are changing the party for the better.
00:35:43.000 You're moving the Overton window.
00:35:45.000 You're introducing different perspectives.
00:35:48.000 And I feel like you're speaking directly to me, Vivek, because I've known nothing but war my entire life, basically, since 2002 and 2003.
00:35:56.000 You feel the same.
00:35:57.000 And I want our audience to understand the perspective of millennial, you know, late Gen Z. We've known nothing but no-win wars and quagmires.
00:36:05.000 And I think that that opinion needs a seat at the table with the moral clarity you've delivered.
00:36:10.000 One minute remaining, Vivek, please.
00:36:12.000 I mean, I do have peers who served in places like Afghanistan and Iraq.
00:36:16.000 It's frustrating.
00:36:16.000 To what end?
00:36:17.000 Years later, they're worse off, but those countries are not any better served with the Taliban still in charge, with a hostile anti-American regime in Iraq.
00:36:26.000 And by the way, it's a generation, Charlie, that's been sold one myth after another, that you go to four-year college degrees, earn that college debt, somehow get a start in the American dream.
00:36:35.000 Many of those same people haven't repaid their college student loan debts.
00:36:38.000 And so I understand why young people, our generation, does not trust the government.
00:36:43.000 It's because the government doesn't trust us back with the truth.
00:36:47.000 And I do think it's going to take a new generation of leadership to speak the truth, to say that, you know what, we made those mistakes.
00:36:55.000 Nobody in the neocon establishment has come out and said it.
00:36:58.000 I would forgive somebody for doing it, to come back and say, hey, we made those mistakes.
00:37:02.000 We were wrong.
00:37:03.000 We learned from them and we're never going to let that happen again.
00:37:06.000 I have forgiveness in my heart for that.
00:37:08.000 But that's not what we have heard.
00:37:10.000 What we're seeing now is a doubling down to make the same mistakes again, and that's not going to happen on my watch.
00:37:14.000 Vivek Ramaswamy, I am enthusiastically behind you running for the presidency in the sense of moving the Overton window and representing our generation.
00:37:23.000 God bless you, men.
00:37:24.000 Thank you so much.
00:37:25.000 Thank you.
00:37:25.000 Thanks so much for listening, everybody.
00:37:27.000 Email us your thoughts as always.
00:37:28.000 Freedom at CharlieKirk.com.
00:37:30.000 Thanks so much for listening and God bless.
00:37:33.000 For more on many of these stories and news you can trust, go to CharlieKirk.com.