The Charlie Kirk Show - Antifa Attacks TPUSA In Berkeley

00:00:03.000 My name is Charlie Kirk.

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00:01:09.000 All right.

00:01:10.000 Welcome back to the Charlie Kirk Show.

00:01:12.000 It is Tuesday, November 11th.

00:01:15.000 Honored to be with you all, stations across the country, Real America's Voice, streaming podcasts.

00:01:21.000 Thank you so much for joining us.

00:01:22.000 As always, I'm joined by Blake Neff, our not-so-secret weapon.

00:01:27.000 I'm Andrew Colvett, executive producer of this fine show, and we have lots to get to.

00:01:32.000 Yesterday, of course, was the two-month anniversary of Charlie Kirk's assassination.

00:01:39.000 And we had a campus tour event, the final one of the This Is the Turning Point tour.

00:01:46.000 We rebranded it after Charlie's assassination, and it was at UC Berkeley, which is supposed to be the birthplace of the modern free speech movement.

00:01:55.000 The birthplace of the free speech movement and like persistent like layer of the worst, most like wretched elements of ones that haven't moved to Portland or Seattle.

00:02:07.000 Yeah, Charlie visited the campus a few times.

00:02:09.000 I was with him on one occasion, and we were struck by just this prevailing sense of nihilism and of depression.

00:02:18.000 It's a very, it's a very, I think, a dark place, but there are great people there.

00:02:22.000 And Antifa swarmed our event last night.

00:02:25.000 It became a massive news story, as most of you probably have heard by now.

00:02:30.000 And I want to get right into it because we have Lila Youssef.

00:02:35.000 She is part of our Cal Berkeley TPSA chapter there.

00:02:38.000 She's a second-year law student.

00:02:40.000 And she was stuck in the mob, had a glass bottle of paint thrown on her. 1.00

00:02:45.000 And I want to welcome her to the show to give us her firsthand account of what she saw and witnessed.

00:02:51.000 Layla, welcome to the show.

00:02:53.000 Thank you so much.

00:02:54.000 Good morning.

00:02:54.000 Thank you for having me.

00:02:56.000 Yeah, thank you for coming on and making the time.

00:02:58.000 I know it was probably a late evening for you all there and an eventful one.

00:03:02.000 So why don't you just start by telling us what happened, what you saw, and we're going to unpack this piece by piece here.

00:03:12.000 Sure.

00:03:13.000 It was absolutely a horrible experience with the Antifa book protesters.

00:03:18.000 Pretty much I finished class around 5.30.

00:03:22.000 I walked over from the law school and kind of it was clear that there were two different groups.

00:03:27.000 It was the Antifa and the violent protesters carrying their signs.

00:03:31.000 At that point, they had already started mocking Charlie Kirk's death, shouting slurs like Nazi fascists to anyone walking by, wearing a MAGA hat or anything with the American flag on it.

00:03:46.000 I saw people stepping on U.S. flags.

00:03:49.000 And so then I ended up joining this line of people to enter when all of a sudden I start hearing three loud booms and it sounded as if it was as if it was almost a bomb or gunshots going off.

00:04:03.000 I later found out it was, I believe, some car revving or fireworks.

00:04:08.000 And then all of a sudden I see a glass bottle being thrown above the crowd at the police officers.

00:04:15.000 And all of a sudden the police officers, they kind of get into a formation.

00:04:20.000 They put their visors on.

00:04:22.000 And that's when the glass bottles get start getting thrown on us.

00:04:26.000 And so I at the time was standing with a police officer.

00:04:28.000 I was the first person in line in the barricade that at the time was open.

00:04:33.000 So I ran through the barricade and I ran through the two lines of police officers and I kind of hid beneath the police officers to be protected from a glass shard and bottle that was almost a few inches from my head.

00:04:46.000 And so just so everybody's clear about what actually happened and, you know, you were so close to it that you probably didn't understand the tactical formations that were happening.

00:04:46.000 Yeah.

00:04:54.000 So these Antifa people, and I've got the whole rundown from our team, these Antifa thugs tried to basically block off the one entrance to the venue.

00:05:04.000 It's 141.

00:05:05.000 Throw it up.

00:05:05.000 So Berkeley end fascist Turning Point's youth-oriented campaign of incitement to violence.

00:05:12.000 Yeah.

00:05:12.000 So what they're doing now is they're claiming that Turning Point is inciting violence by holding a free speech event in Charlie's honor, something he died for, something he was murdered for.

00:05:23.000 As always, our speech is violence.

00:05:26.000 Their violence is speech.

00:05:27.000 Yeah, exactly.

00:05:28.000 The whole upside down, bizarro world that is the radical left.

00:05:32.000 So what they did is they cordoned everybody.

00:05:36.000 They tried to block the one entrance.

00:05:38.000 And what happened was we were begging the police, our staff was begging the police to get involved to open this up.

00:05:46.000 And it wasn't until actual violence started happening that the police finally, you know, did something to block these people off and create safe passage.

00:05:56.000 And they did sort of a thing that we experienced at UCLA a few years back where they played with the QR codes.

00:06:02.000 So a lot, maybe you could speak into this, Layla, where a lot of people had QR codes.

00:06:06.000 And we have to use, sometimes we have to work with the universities, especially in California, for ticketing systems.

00:06:12.000 And a lot of people were having issues with that.

00:06:14.000 Can you explain what was going on there?

00:06:15.000 What do you know about that?

00:06:17.000 Yeah, so pretty much I, like many others in the line, we had already ticket, we had tickets, we had QR codes that we believed would work.

00:06:25.000 And when we would reach the front of the line, we were told that this didn't work because we had only filled out a student interest form or not the correct form.

00:06:33.000 We were pretty much all being told different things.

00:06:36.000 And I believe it was part of an orchestrated effort to ensure that the hall wasn't completely full, that the students were allowed to enter.

00:06:43.000 And as you mentioned, this was the one entry point.

00:06:47.000 So we were kind of left with, we're stuck in this line, but I can't even leave because I'm going to be attacked by these Antifa thugs.

00:06:54.000 So it was, it was, we were pretty much cornered.

00:06:56.000 You were sitting down.

00:06:58.000 Yes.

00:06:58.000 Yeah, pretty much.

00:06:59.000 And the QR codes, nobody knows why they weren't working.

00:07:02.000 I'm a Berkeley law student.

00:07:03.000 I mean, you'd think that I'd use my Berkeley law email to register for this event through Turning Point, through the school, and somehow it's not working.

00:07:12.000 For the number of people that I saw it not working for, it's very odd.

00:07:17.000 Yeah, you almost assume that there was some sort of sabotage going on.

00:07:22.000 I mean, I'm not trying to speculate wildly, but it does feel, I mean, we've run into this before in Memphis.

00:07:29.000 We had a situation where the actual administration and the school were sabotaging our events.

00:07:34.000 So it doesn't surprise me that you would go into a deep blue university and there would be shenanigans at play.

00:07:42.000 Blake?

00:07:43.000 I just, I really, it's really incredible to read this flyer they had because it includes the line.

00:07:47.000 Yeah, put it back.

00:07:48.000 A few examples, it's in tiny text.

00:07:50.000 A few examples of Kirk and Turning Point's typical rhetoric should make clear that Turning Point's actual method for our university community is not about free speech or freedom of debate.

00:08:00.000 It is about the intimidation of free speech, especially in an academic setting.

00:08:04.000 It is about bringing an end to free debate.

00:08:08.000 These people, they just accuse you of exactly what they do. 0.99

00:08:12.000 They're really despicable, despicable vermin. 0.94

00:08:15.000 Well, and there was fights that broke out, and I think we have the B-roll. 0.99

00:08:20.000 They attacked our people.

00:08:21.000 They attacked.

00:08:22.000 So what happened in this instance is there was a guy out there with a red freedom shirt, and it had a cross on the back, and he was saying, Jesus is Lord, you know, whatever.

00:08:31.000 And he's getting antagonized by these people.

00:08:34.000 And then one of these Antifa goons comes up and rips the cross and his chain off of him.

00:08:41.000 The guy runs to go get it. 0.98

00:08:43.000 And then the guy proceeds to physically assault him, punch him, bloody him.

00:08:47.000 The cops in their defense probably didn't know who started it.

00:08:50.000 They tackle both of them and they arrest him.

00:08:53.000 Yeah, this is the bird's eye view of this altercation.

00:08:56.000 And you can see he rips the chain, and then he's running after to go get it.

00:09:00.000 And this guy just proceeds to just pound him, grab him by the collar, and punch him in the face a couple times.

00:09:07.000 The guy kept going after him before the cops ended up tackling both of them and putting them both in handcuffs.

00:09:14.000 I don't know the status of them taunting him afterwards. 0.67

00:09:18.000 Yeah, and they said, you're bleeding, white boy. 0.82

00:09:20.000 You're bleeding. 0.95

00:09:21.000 So then he racial, so the other goons come up and they racially taunt him for being a white guy.

00:09:28.000 And the guy that, you know, that grabbed the chain certainly doesn't, he looked dead in the eyes.

00:09:34.000 Let's put it that way.

00:09:35.000 Look dead in the eyes.

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00:10:23.000 Charlie and Glenn over at Patriot Mobile, dear, dear friends.

00:10:26.000 So I'll give the last word to Charlie.

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00:10:42.000 We've got Lila Yusuf from UC Berkeley.

00:10:46.000 So tell us what happened inside once you guys did get inside.

00:10:51.000 Actually, what happened with the ticketing system?

00:10:53.000 How did you ultimately get inside?

00:10:55.000 Yeah, so I got inside because one of the Turning Point staff members was very kind and helped me, honestly, walked me through every single gate because they were being, for some reason, even when I had a QR code, they didn't want to let me in.

00:11:11.000 So and even, and when I got in, I was like kind of surprised because the room wasn't even full yet.

00:11:17.000 Like I thought I wasn't being allowed in because it was at capacity or something, but they were simply just not letting people in for some arbitrary rules.

00:11:25.000 But then I did end up getting in.

00:11:27.000 Yeah.

00:11:28.000 Good.

00:11:29.000 And so what happened when you got inside?

00:11:30.000 I mean, this was, the clips, I literally, I jumped out of my seat and I started clapping.

00:11:36.000 I was so proud of you guys because it was like I knew the hell outside.

00:11:40.000 I was getting calls from reporters that were stuck outside being like, can you get me in?

00:11:43.000 Can you get me?

00:11:44.000 The reporters were freaked out.

00:11:46.000 And so I had to connect them with turning point staffers to get them inside the building.

00:11:49.000 I know some of the audience members maybe questioned my judgment, but listen, anybody who's stuck out in that melee, like, you know, you can make reporter jokes all you want, but nobody deserved to be stuck out there with the chaos and the violence that was happening out there.

00:12:02.000 And so we got them inside.

00:12:03.000 We made sure they had a safe place to get to.

00:12:06.000 What happened inside?

00:12:08.000 Because it was beautiful.

00:12:10.000 It was phenomenal, honestly.

00:12:11.000 I mean, I've never been able to wear my MAGA hat for the past year and a half that I've been at Berkeley.

00:12:18.000 All Berkeley conservative students, and I say I speak for pretty much all of us, we are ostracized.

00:12:24.000 We are canceled.

00:12:25.000 So to be able to hear wonderful speakers like Rob and Frank kind of go into this notion of, yes, we have conservative values and beliefs, but we can't succumb to the pressures that they want us to.

00:12:37.000 We can't join their cancel culture.

00:12:39.000 We have to love and not hate.

00:12:41.000 We have to remain true to our principles and values and kind of doing it through a comedic fashion.

00:12:47.000 And just the full two hours, even the Q ⁇ A was wonderful.

00:12:50.000 I mean, there was this one individual who asked a question in a very rude, derogatory manner.

00:12:57.000 And Rob Schneider at the end told him, come shake my hand.

00:13:00.000 Come up and shake my hand.

00:13:01.000 And I think that that is symbolic of what us conservatives believe.

00:13:05.000 We are able to talk with people that we disagree with.

00:13:08.000 And that was this whole message of this entire event.

00:13:13.000 That's fantastic.

00:13:14.000 I mean, the clips were absolutely amazing.

00:13:18.000 And, you know, there's a, here's, we'll just give people a, you know, let's just give a taste of inside because it was, it was an amazing, amazing moment.

00:13:26.000 Let's play 149. 0.88

00:13:27.000 This is UC Berkeley Turning Point Chapter President.

00:13:30.000 He gave a great speech.

00:13:32.000 I was very proud of him.

00:13:33.000 John Paul Leon.

00:13:34.000 John Paul Leon.

00:13:35.000 There you go.

00:13:35.000 149.

00:13:36.000 It is clear to us which side is winning when your side becomes the violent agitators.

00:13:42.000 When you try to win with force and not through reason, you have lost.

00:13:47.000 And the reality is they would never come in and ask a question.

00:13:50.000 They're not trying to win, honestly.

00:13:52.000 They have already lost the intellectual battle.

00:13:54.000 Their goal is to disturb the crowd, silence those who disagree, and destroy any ounce of conservatism that they can get their filthy paws on.

00:14:03.000 Well said.

00:14:05.000 Lila, why don't you just sum it up?

00:14:06.000 We got two minutes left here.

00:14:08.000 What has happened in the wake of Charlie's assassination on UC Berkeley's campus?

00:14:13.000 What are you noticing?

00:14:14.000 Are you seeing more courage?

00:14:15.000 Are you seeing more attacks?

00:14:17.000 The floor is yours.

00:14:18.000 Yeah, so at the law school in particular, I think the pressure has been heightened because the undergraduate campus is huge.

00:14:26.000 I mean, it's almost 40,000 individuals, but the law school is small.

00:14:30.000 So each class is about 350 people.

00:14:33.000 And after the assassination of Charlie Kirk, I had people taking pictures of me because I'm somebody who is vocally conservative being canceled, people saying we shouldn't have just killed Charlie Kirk.

00:14:47.000 We should kill other people that think like him and kind of pushing this narrative forward.

00:14:53.000 And so people like John Paul, for example, and myself have faced a lot of backlash for even the day I posted that Charlie Kirk got assassinated, the amount of messages I got saying I should die just like him and kind of this general rhetoric within the student body, but also around the community as well. 0.92

00:15:12.000 This is, it's not safe anymore to walk around Berkeley as a conservative.

00:15:16.000 It's a very dangerous place.

00:15:19.000 Antifa is prevalent and it's a domestic terror group that needs to be handled with.

00:15:24.000 And quite frankly, with all their defund the police chance, I don't think the police are intervening enough and protecting the students enough.

00:15:30.000 The administration certainly isn't.

00:15:33.000 So I certainly, of course, since the assassinations of Charlie Kirk, people who before were afraid have been more empowered to speak, but that has come with consequences, unfortunately, at Berkeley.

00:15:43.000 Yeah, we really need to emphasize on that point.

00:15:45.000 Like Antifa is basically like if we had a group that just in the South, if we had a group in the South that had a uniform and went around and terrorized people who were trying to hold speeches, you know, like the Klan did back in the day, like we'd be able to say this is a domestic terror group and should be targeted accordingly.

00:16:00.000 And like when you have these Antifa urchins who will harass any conservative event in Berkeley, that is a domestic intimidation terror group.

00:16:07.000 Yeah, I mean, to Blake's point, it's a really good point. 0.55

00:16:10.000 And, you know, and you brought it up, Lila, that you do not feel protected.

00:16:14.000 You do not feel like the cops are taking this seriously enough.

00:16:17.000 And we did have the president just, you know, declare that Antifa is a domestic terror group.

00:16:23.000 And I know Treasury is working on kind of putting together this loose network.

00:16:28.000 They pop up cell by cell, but they do wear uniforms.

00:16:32.000 They are, listen, if you're going to wear the black block and you still want to do this thing where you identify yourself visually, then I think the authorities need to be empowered.

00:16:42.000 And there was a lot of that going around on X last night where people were like, listen, they're laughing in your face to the administration's face because they're out there loud and proud and nobody's doing anything about this.

00:16:53.000 And students like you are getting caught in this violent culture, this subculture, this ideology that's trying to intimidate, bully, and assault conservatives on campuses like UC Berkeley.

00:17:08.000 What would you like to see happen as a result of what we saw unfold last night?

00:17:12.000 I would like an extreme condemnation from the administration, first and foremost.

00:17:17.000 I would like for heightened security for our events, any conservative events in general across campus.

00:17:24.000 And I want this university that once used to supposedly champion itself as being, you know, free speech and all to recognize that it's now not free speech.

00:17:34.000 It's free speech as long as they like it.

00:17:36.000 And if they don't, then you're going to get a glass bottle thrown at you or fireworks thrown at you.

00:17:40.000 And that's what we saw yesterday.

00:17:41.000 And no successful institution can succeed like this.

00:17:45.000 No law school can succeed like this.

00:17:47.000 How are these people going to become lawyers when they can't even engage in dialogue with people with whom they disagree with?

00:17:54.000 Their resort is to throw a glass bottle at them.

00:17:57.000 So this is something that's very dangerous.

00:17:59.000 I want to see action from the administration and not just through words, but also through action.

00:18:05.000 I want these students to be reprimanded.

00:18:07.000 There needs to be student conduct violations.

00:18:10.000 There needs to be charges against these people that are inciting violence against and trying to intimidate conservatives on campus.

00:18:18.000 There needs to be a stronger message sent to these people.

00:18:21.000 I absolutely agree.

00:18:22.000 As long as there is not a full-throated condemnation and very serious accountability.

00:18:30.000 If a university receiving public funds, like we have very broad federal laws on this, if UC Berkeley is systematically not allowing conservative groups to have their constitutional rights expressed, the ones that are protected on any public university campus, freedom of speech, freedom of assembly, these have to be protected at public university campuses, then the Trump administration should say, you're not going to get any more money, University of California.

00:18:54.000 Yeah, we'll put the fear of God into them.

00:18:56.000 But candidly, these cells need to be rooted out.

00:19:00.000 That too.

00:19:01.000 I mean, there needs to be.

00:19:02.000 The university will help you if they have an incentive to do it.

00:19:06.000 1,000%.

00:19:07.000 Well, Lila, we're proud of you.

00:19:08.000 Thank you for showing up last night. 0.94

00:19:10.000 Thank you for remaining firm and bold and loud and proud and not being cowed by these bullies, these thugs, these goons.

00:19:18.000 Please stay safe.

00:19:20.000 And we're grateful.

00:19:22.000 We're grateful for the frontline student work that you guys are doing.

00:19:25.000 So God bless you.

00:19:26.000 And we'll see you soon, hopefully, at Amfest.

00:19:29.000 Thank you.

00:19:30.000 Have a good rest of your day.

00:19:31.000 All right, you too.

00:19:34.000 Hey, everybody.

00:19:34.000 This is Andrew Colvett, executive producer of The Charlie Kirk Show.

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00:20:37.000 So we have a great guest up next.

00:20:41.000 His name is Christopher Rufo.

00:20:42.000 He needs no introduction for most of you.

00:20:45.000 Christopher, welcome to the show.

00:20:46.000 Honored to have you.

00:20:47.000 And congratulations on your new show, Rufo and Lomez.

00:20:51.000 I appreciate it.

00:20:52.000 Thank you so much.

00:20:53.000 Yeah.

00:20:53.000 This is, I mean, we have a topic, a very clear topic that we're going to get to about bringing together the disparate coalitions on the right.

00:21:03.000 However, I just want to encourage, the show that you're doing with Lomez is going to be a must-listen to for if you want to hear sort of, I would say, just really smart dialogue, challenging the ideas, everything that's going on in X, all the chaos.

00:21:20.000 Maybe just tell us one more, give us a few lines about the show and why you guys are doing it.

00:21:25.000 Yeah, we're doing a show called Rufo and Lomez.

00:21:27.000 It's me, Rufo, and my friend Jonathan Lomez Keeperman.

00:21:31.000 Look, we're both creatives.

00:21:33.000 I was a documentary filmmaker.

00:21:35.000 Lomez was an English professor.

00:21:37.000 And so we're trying to tackle culture and politics through a different lens than people are used to in the kind of traditional right-wing talk radio format.

00:21:47.000 We're trying to take all of the chaos out of the digital sphere.

00:21:51.000 We're trying to break it down, dissect it, analyze it for people, and really serve as a trusted, responsible guide through the times that we're in.

00:22:01.000 And I think that's what the responsibility for all of us is to do right now.

00:22:06.000 We have a very chaotic politics.

00:22:08.000 We have a lot of infighting on the right.

00:22:11.000 And it's time for those of us who have the ability to step up and try to be a really kind of responsible guide, much like Charlie Kirk was for so many people.

00:22:22.000 Yeah, that's well said and a good segue.

00:22:25.000 And Blake's going to kind of bring us to your tweet.

00:22:27.000 114, you brought this, you tweeted this yesterday.

00:22:31.000 I instantly flagged it, and I thought it was so much better.

00:22:33.000 We've got to hear it.

00:22:34.000 Yeah, so you just said, it's become very clear in retrospect that Charlie Kirk was holding the right together and that we need JD Vance to step into that role, which will require settling disputes and laying out the boundaries of the coalition.

00:22:49.000 Nixon figured out how to do this after being vice president.

00:22:53.000 So, and then someone said, you know, Vance should have his own podcast, which we've had him on a few times, and we should hopefully do that again in the future.

00:22:59.000 But yeah, I think that's, for those who aren't aware, who are watching, there's been a lot of discussion of this online because there's been a lot of arguments within the right over, you know, for example, when Tucker interviewed Nick Fuentes, what are the barriers on the Israel question on different on foreign policy questions, on a lot of stuff, what's up for debate, what's not up for debate, what's beyond the pale.

00:23:21.000 And, you know, Charlie was such a coalition builder.

00:23:24.000 He was so interested in keeping the focus on get wins against the left.

00:23:29.000 Don't, you know, Charlie would not have been having a big fight over what the right should believe a week before the elections in Virginia and New Jersey.

00:23:37.000 And I think it's very important to emphasize that.

00:23:38.000 And I'm glad you were emphasizing it, Chris.

00:23:40.000 Yeah.

00:23:40.000 And so, Chris, yeah, build on why JD.

00:23:42.000 Why do you see him as uniquely positioned to be that person?

00:23:46.000 Well, look, I mean, I think, again, in retrospect, I saw it.

00:23:50.000 And, you know, I remember during the transition period, I talked with Charlie, and he called me and he said, Hey, I need great names for people to staff the Department of Education.

00:23:58.000 I'm down at Mar-a-Lago.

00:24:00.000 We're trying to pick a great team.

00:24:02.000 And that's the moment that I realized that he was someone that in public had this huge role, but also in private.

00:24:10.000 He was essential in figuring out how to get good people together that were focused on the mission, that were going to deliver results.

00:24:18.000 And I think I didn't quite understand that and appreciate that until after he was gone.

00:24:24.000 And then there's this sense of a void.

00:24:28.000 There's no one that can stitch together the various coalitions into the MAGA movement, into the general right.

00:24:35.000 He was really just an incredible leader in that regard.

00:24:37.000 And as I'm looking around for other people who could fill his shoes and serve in that same capacity, the first person that obviously comes to mind is the sitting vice president of the United States.

00:24:49.000 You know, JD has great relationships with all the various factions on the right.

00:24:53.000 He, of course, has the bully pulpit of being the vice president.

00:24:57.000 That's actually quite helpful to be in a powerful position.

00:25:01.000 And he can really gatekeep in a unique way, kind of offering the access to the White House, offering access to the office of the vice president, and then getting people in line.

00:25:15.000 And look, the right is facing this question now.

00:25:18.000 Obviously, it's very chaotic.

00:25:20.000 Many of us wish that we weren't doing it, for example, right before election.

00:25:24.000 But the cat is now out of the bag.

00:25:26.000 And I think we need to resolve these questions sooner rather than later.

00:25:30.000 And I think the vice president has the authority, the credibility, and more importantly, the relationships to get the job done.

00:25:37.000 I could see why he would want to kind of let things maybe resolve naturally.

00:25:42.000 But I hope that he steps up and I hope that he can be a galvanizing figure.

00:25:47.000 I hope he can be a figure that really sets the boundaries and also sets the direction so that all of us can be more effective in our work.

00:25:56.000 Yeah.

00:25:58.000 Charlie was, of course, a big fan of the vice president.

00:26:01.000 It's very hard for him to become vice president and senator before that.

00:26:04.000 And so let's go to the man himself.

00:26:07.000 This is Charlie on JD.

00:26:08.000 Let's play 158.

00:26:10.000 We recognized his gifts early on.

00:26:12.000 I saw the talent and I said, this is the guy.

00:26:16.000 This is the one.

00:26:17.000 JD Vance has become such a warrior for our cause in the past six months.

00:26:21.000 JD Vance is acting and looking like the vice president that Donald Trump needs, the vice president that Donald Trump deserves, and maybe beyond that, even the 48th president.

00:26:32.000 We're a long way from that.

00:26:34.000 We shouldn't even think or talk too much openly about that, but he's a rock star.

00:26:38.000 He's smart.

00:26:39.000 He's capable.

00:26:40.000 He's humble.

00:26:41.000 He's phenomenal.

00:26:42.000 And what an upgrade from what we had during that last administration.

00:26:47.000 Unclear if he's talking about Joe Biden's or Trump 1.0 there, but it probably would have remained probably true from Charlie's perspective on either.

00:26:56.000 But yeah, I mean, listen, Chris, JD has the built-in advantage of not only being the vice president, but, you know, Charlie in death somehow has taken on even more important of a position within the movement symbolically, spiritually.

00:27:14.000 And of course, the words that he spoke out and all these clips we have of him, he was in JD's corner a billion percent.

00:27:21.000 I can tell you this from the first time we had him on the show years ago when it was just talking about it.

00:27:27.000 He'd always say, people would say, like, Charlie, you should run for president.

00:27:29.000 He's like, I don't need to.

00:27:30.000 JD.

00:27:30.000 JD runs for president.

00:27:32.000 Yeah.

00:27:32.000 So that, I mean, that holds a significance within the conservative movement, that Charlie was such a huge proponent of his.

00:27:40.000 Yeah, I think that's right.

00:27:41.000 And I think, again, he really set the example.

00:27:44.000 If you see how Charlie dealt with kind of right-wing racialism, right-wing conspiracism, the Grouper movement more broadly, he was trying to kind of create good boundaries that would benefit.

00:27:58.000 And he understood that sometimes there is addition through subtraction in a political coalition.

00:28:03.000 There are certain groups that you want to manage, and there are certain groups that you want to manage out because ultimately they detract.

00:28:10.000 And the end of my tweet was a reference to Richard Nixon.

00:28:14.000 And if you look at the history of Nixon, Nixon was derailed in his 1962 campaign for California governor by the John Birch Society, which in that time represented a more extreme form of right-wing conspiracism.

00:28:28.000 They, of course, were famous for attacking President Eisenhower as a communist agent.

00:28:34.000 And by the 1968 presidential campaign, which Nixon won, and then in 72, which he won by an overwhelming margin, winning 49 states, he learned how to successfully cut through these thorny questions, how to create a successful coalition that galvanized huge majorities, and also how to edge out some of the negative influences, some of the net negatives, like the John Birch Society.

00:29:02.000 He had this sophisticated strategy of strategic distance without getting sucked into a debate with the Birch Society.

00:29:12.000 And I think that for someone like JD, a similar approach could be quite effective.

00:29:17.000 Look, again, Nixon won 49 states.

00:29:19.000 I think he has he demonstrated one potential model for this that could be very important.

00:29:27.000 And of course, Nixon was, you know, formerly served as vice president.

00:29:32.000 And so that's why I think the historical example might be useful and might offer a plausible way forward.

00:29:39.000 Yeah, I think, you know, this is the debate.

00:29:42.000 I mean, what you've just isolated is the, you know, and Buckley played a big role with, you know, who, who was in, who was out.

00:29:50.000 I mean, it's a, it's, I can't tell you how many people have sent me the Buckley example going back to those days.

00:29:56.000 And, you know, it's a really tricky question.

00:29:59.000 It is a tricky one because, like, for example, you could say some of Buckley's influence meant that we had like that anti-intervention, anti-immigration faction of the right was too low for too long, and that caused a lot of damage to the movement and the country, arguably.

00:30:16.000 Yeah, no, I think you have to get it right.

00:30:18.000 And I will say, you know, I mean, let's just name names.

00:30:21.000 Let's just do it.

00:30:22.000 And Chris, you can either choose to engage or not.

00:30:26.000 I mean, that's kind of what you're talking about.

00:30:28.000 Well, let's not get sucked down to it, but sucked down into this sort of like, I would say, counterproductive infighting.

00:30:34.000 And I agree with you that there are opportunities where we need to sort of say, hey, this is a line too far.

00:30:40.000 It's a bridge too far.

00:30:42.000 But, you know, a lot of people, we've said it on Thought Crime.

00:30:45.000 I think we've said it on this show as well.

00:30:46.000 You know, a lot of people are asking us to distance ourselves from Tucker, given everything that's happened.

00:30:52.000 And I would say, listen, one of the last things that we were asked to do or that Charlie made very clear to us was that I will not be morally blackmailed when it comes to Tucker Carlson.

00:31:05.000 He's my friend.

00:31:05.000 I believe in him.

00:31:06.000 And listen, we have a, I understand a lot of the pressure that comes with the fallout from that interview.

00:31:13.000 I understand a lot of it.

00:31:14.000 But, you know, it's there is a relationship there.

00:31:18.000 There is a history there with Charlie and Tucker.

00:31:21.000 And so just to say it really clearly, that's not going to happen.

00:31:26.000 Now, debates, the collision of ideas at AmFest, trust me, we are pursuing every single means.

00:31:33.000 And I think it's a worthwhile debate to be having about what is our foreign policy?

00:31:36.000 What should it be with regards to how much we spend on foreign nations?

00:31:41.000 What, you know, is there a line between moral and financial support?

00:31:44.000 Is there a line between boots on the ground?

00:31:45.000 Certainly, I think the movement is consolidated and I would say very united when it comes to boots on the ground.

00:31:53.000 But there are really important conversations that deserve to be challenged in a public forum from different perspectives.

00:32:01.000 This is Lane Schoenberger, Chief Investment Officer and Founding Partner of WhyReFi.

00:32:06.000 It has been an honor and a privilege to partner with Turning Point and for Charlie to endorse us.

00:32:11.000 His endorsement means the world to us, and we look forward to continuing our partnership with Turning Point for years to come.

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00:33:10.000 All right, this is more from when Charlie was singing JD Vance's praises in January.

00:33:16.000 This is January 27th of 2025.

00:33:18.000 So earlier this year, 159.

00:33:21.000 Getting behind JD Vance in 2000 and, what was it, 21?

00:33:27.000 Yeah, that's right.

00:33:28.000 2021, we endorsed JD Vance very early.

00:33:31.000 It's kind of like buying Bitcoin in 2013.

00:33:34.000 It's a lot of upside.

00:33:36.000 It's a lot of upside.

00:33:38.000 People hear him and go, wait, this guy is great.

00:33:42.000 He got vilified so much earlier and it's got even better.

00:33:46.000 And everyone around me knows how much I believe in JD Vance.

00:33:49.000 I mean, I went all out twice for him.

00:33:52.000 First on the Senate thing and then on the vice presidential selection.

00:33:55.000 Yeah, I can personally attest of just how much Charlie, how much equity he put it, political capital he put in to getting JD to be selected as the vice president, to getting him to win the primary for the Ohio Senate race.

00:34:10.000 Charlie believed in JD Vance.

00:34:12.000 And my goodness, JD Vance has been an absolute hero in the aftermath of Charlie's assassination.

00:34:19.000 He's anything we need.

00:34:21.000 He's right there to help and he means it and it's sincere.

00:34:24.000 Blake, take us in.

00:34:25.000 Yeah, Chris, we just want to hear what you have to think about the elephants in the room, which is we're having this big factional debate because it didn't start with him.

00:34:35.000 Tucker Carlson interviewed Nick Fuentes.

00:34:37.000 Some people said that's fine.

00:34:39.000 Some people said we don't like it, but whatever, it's his show.

00:34:44.000 And some people are saying this is beyond the pale and we should condemn it.

00:34:48.000 We're having faction fights at Heritage.

00:34:50.000 So we just wanted you to offer your perspective on that.

00:34:52.000 Yeah, how do we approach it, Chris?

00:34:54.000 Well, it's a little, it's a very complex question, and I have a few parts to the answer.

00:35:01.000 You know, first off, I think like many of us, Tucker gave so many people on the right a great start, a great boost, great support.

00:35:10.000 I count myself as someone who really is grateful for what Tucker has done.

00:35:14.000 And so I think you give someone like that more latitude.

00:35:17.000 If you're talking about the Fuentes interview, my own personal preference would have been for Tucker to really interrogate Fuentes a little bit more, challenge his opinions, really make it a kind of journalistic and adversarial enterprise. 0.84

00:35:35.000 However, I think that therefore the call to banish Tucker, to banish Kevin Roberts from Heritage, to banish anyone in that orbit is foolish.

00:35:47.000 I think it's premature. 0.82

00:35:49.000 I think it is counterproductive.

00:35:51.000 And in my own attempt, I've texted with Tucker subsequently.

00:35:57.000 I've tried to give him my sense of how to think about the Fuentes or Grouper phenomenon, how to approach it in a way that I think would be more productive.

00:36:06.000 We exchanged pretty cordial messages.

00:36:09.000 And I think that is probably the best strategy moving forward to recognize that Tucker does have an important place in the conservative movement.

00:36:16.000 And even in places of criticism, I think that we can try to debate those ideas.

00:36:22.000 We can try to push people in a more productive direction.

00:36:25.000 I think this is what Charlie did with not just with Tucker, but with many other people.

00:36:30.000 And I am, well, I think that, look, again, there's always addition through subtraction with people who are net negatives, very counterproductive.

00:36:39.000 I think kind of racialist, conspiracist factions certainly fall under that.

00:36:45.000 But, you know, this instinct to denounce, to disavow, to draw red lines, to purge leadership, to do that kind of action, whether at Heritage or now at ISI or in other institutions, I think that is not the right way approach, right approach.

00:37:03.000 And I think we get into an almost inverse of the BLM moment where you have DEI-style struggle sessions at conservative institutions.

00:37:12.000 I think that is a very bad idea. 0.89

00:37:15.000 Post the Black Square. 1.00

00:37:16.000 Post the Black Square, Chris.

00:37:18.000 It's like, it feels like our version of Post the Black Square, which, by the way, Charlie raged against.

00:37:24.000 You don't like this aggressive moral coercion that just uses, you know, how dare you have this conversation?

00:37:33.000 How dare you have that thought?

00:37:35.000 He was very against that.

00:37:37.000 Well, Chris, that was well, that was really well said.

00:37:40.000 And I'm glad to hear that from you because you're a smart guy and you've thought deeply about these issues.

00:37:46.000 And I would just say, you know, listen, let's put the Grouper phenomenon aside.

00:37:51.000 Let's put all of that aside.

00:37:52.000 I will tell you with a thousand percent certainty because I had dozens of conversations about this.

00:37:58.000 The larger critiques, the chew the meat, spit out the bones kind of critiques about what this country has done when it comes to betraying young men, young white men, what it's done to break the social compact and to label a lot of these groups as toxic, as beyond the pale, as not worth fighting for, has done such extraordinary damage to our country that some of this backlash, it needs to be harnessed and focused.

00:38:25.000 And that's what Charlie devoted his life to.

00:38:27.000 You heard that with Erica Kirk in her memorial speech, that this was the guy that killed Charlie was the same kind of guy that he was out on these college campuses trying to save.

00:38:36.000 And that work must continue.

00:38:37.000 We must remember that some of these, yes, it comes out in gross and vile ways, but at the core, there is a truth that we must acknowledge and be very, very serious about addressing.

00:38:47.000 Final word to you about 50 seconds, Chris.

00:38:49.000 Yeah, I think about it.

00:38:50.000 I mean, if you're a young man growing up today, you came of age during the COVID lockdowns.

00:38:55.000 You came of age during the BLM era where you were told that you were inherently and intrinsically evil because of your sex, because of your race.

00:39:04.000 And so there is a justifiable resentment that has been bubbling up for many years.

00:39:10.000 But I think that the best way to address that is through eliminating DEI, delegitimizing BLM ideologies, and then kind of tapping into those essential pillars of building our civilization, economic opportunity, great institutions, strong families, and offering young men a way that is not nihilistic, but a way that's actually going to make their lives better in the real world.

00:39:35.000 If conservatives can't do that, we need to keep thinking.

00:39:38.000 Yeah, I agree.

00:39:39.000 We got to offer them a better vision.

00:39:40.000 Christopher Rufo, host of the new show, Rufo and Lomez, two really great, great guys, thought leaders in the movement.

00:39:48.000 Thank you, Chris.

00:39:48.000 We'll have you on again soon.

00:39:49.000 Thanks, gentlemen.

00:39:55.000 For more on many of these stories and news you can trust, go to CharlieKirk.com.

The Charlie Kirk Show - November 11, 2025

Antifa Attacks TPUSA In Berkeley

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