Viva Frye is a former litigator, former Canadian lawyer, and former partner in a law firm. He has been a part of the Toronto Crown Prosecution Service (TPP) for over 20 years. He's been in the business for a long time, and has been involved in the defense of some of the most infamous criminals of all time. Viva has been on the show before, but this time he's joined by me to defend the prosecution's case against Tyler Robinson.
00:00:56.000The Charlie Kirk Show is proudly sponsored by Preserve Gold, the leading gold and silver experts and the only precious metals company I recommend to my family, friends, and viewers.
00:02:11.000Yeah, that actually upsets me because I want to claim him for myself.
00:02:16.000He had the curse of not living long enough to sully his wonderful reputation.
00:02:19.000And then you've got the Jim Carries of the world who live long enough to, you know, Canadians might count them as one of their own, but he might have gone a little bit more.
00:02:44.000So I wanted to have you on this because you are also mixing it up online.
00:02:50.000You have defended, at least from what I can tell, I actually want to hear what your real thoughts are, aspects at least of the prosecution's case.
00:02:58.000If that is correct, which I believe it is, why do you believe aspects of the prosecution's case?
00:03:08.000Well, this is like we live in this world of dichotomized or false dichotomies where if you say, you know, there's certain things I believe and then everybody's immediate trope is, oh, so you believe the FBI, you believe the official narrative.
00:03:21.000And like, I don't believe anything and I don't believe anybody except what I can, to the best of my ability, surmise, deduce, or, you know, observe myself.
00:03:30.000So, you know, do I think that there's any better explanation for what we already have in terms of Tyler Robinson having been on the roof, allegedly with a gun?
00:03:40.000I mean, you can always pick certain holes in certain stories and say, well, how did he get the gun down?
00:03:44.000And it had a towel on it when it shipped.
00:04:13.000So it doesn't go through the whole body there.
00:04:15.000So like, then you say, okay, well, there are circumstances in which a 30-odd six would not have an exit wound, but it's not a question of blindly believing a narrative.
00:04:23.000You just, you know, do your best based on whatever evidence is available as of now.
00:04:28.000And, you know, the exploding lapel mic was preposterous in the first place.
00:04:32.000I mean, almost too preposterous to even feel the need to address.
00:04:35.000But people complicating things by saying, okay, exploding lapel, they've got a man with a detonator.
00:04:40.000They falsely identify a number of people at first.
00:04:43.000And they think that that somehow suffices to cast doubt on the best evidence that exists to date, which is that Tyler Robinson shot the shot.
00:05:11.000And this is where I say like people are doing a disservice to the actual, what might be a conspiracy in the truest legal sense of more than one person working towards an outcome here that I don't believe Tyler took the shot.
00:05:24.000I believe that others, in as much as those screenshots were accurate, and I think they've been confirmed, posting in advance, they knew something was going to go down.
00:06:29.000There was other instances of people appearing to have advanced knowledge.
00:06:33.000Well, that's where I am very, very curious and very suspicious and don't believe what we're being told that, you know, Tyler Robinson acted alone or that text message, which really reads more like a script out of a movie of like Walter White from Breaking Bad, trying to save Skylar so he sets up that phone call and makes her look like she didn't know anything that was going on.
00:06:54.000Now, whether or not it's just a coincidence, that type of coincidence, I'm less inclined to believe is a coincidence.
00:06:59.000You know, there's these Discord chats where quite clearly people were discussing things.
00:07:03.000Did he have other people helping him, setting up decoys, assisting in the planning or at least keeping quiet what was going to go down?
00:07:11.000That's where I would go with what I believe to be a conspiracy that is not in line with the official narrative if the narrative is Tyler Robinson acted alone and his lover had no idea what was going on.
00:07:22.000That being said, and I sort of I've defended some of the other actors as well.
00:07:26.000You know, Ian Carol, I've had him on my channel a while back.
00:07:29.000And I defend his right to say stupid things online.
00:07:33.000And when, you know, Candace, again, defend their right to say things if they sincerely believe them.
00:07:39.000And I can understand how people discovering these text messages, you know, the ones that are now the central point of this conspiracy that it was a hired assassination by Israel.
00:07:49.000I can understand how people read those texts and say, holy crap, that's a coincidence that now I'm going to connect two dots on.
00:07:55.000But like I keep trying to tell people, it's like, okay, on the one hand, that would describe a potential mensre interest.
00:08:01.000If they want to be convinced by that, and I can certainly understand why people find them suspicious, like, okay, you've described what might be an incentive for an intention without ever having addressed how it might have actually played out in reality.
00:08:13.000Was it an Israeli agent who took the sniper shot?
00:08:15.000Was it Israeli Mossad agents who weaponized Tyler Robinson online?
00:08:21.000And if the evidence goes there, then take it there as it might be.
00:08:25.000But for now, other than those text messages, which shows something of a sinister inside look at donors and what they expect from the people that they give money to, nothing's for free and there's no free lunch.
00:08:36.000It doesn't do anything to contradict or add on it to the current best evidence out there, which I appreciate they can't flesh out and get into and delve into now until the trial.
00:08:46.000But the bottom line problem is nobody trusts the FBI.
00:08:51.000And people are now so conspiracy traumatized from everything that we've seen that was told was the official narrative only to learn that it's an actual concocted conspiracy.
00:09:00.000They don't believe anything anymore to the point where you have people who don't believe that the earth is round.
00:09:07.000I don't believe that Tyler acted alone.
00:09:09.000I don't believe that it was a lapel mic exploding because that just complicates what would have otherwise been an easier to explain assassination from the get-go.
00:09:15.000Well, and I want to make one thing clear because I've seen even big accounts sort of misrepresent this very critical point.
00:09:22.000The FBI is not trying this case, right?
00:09:41.000There's the county attorney and then several sub-prosecutors as well.
00:09:45.000I think there's five or six names on the charging document, for example.
00:09:49.000That's who's actually constructed this case and is going to be prosecuting it in court.
00:09:54.000And by the way, I'm with you, actually, Viva.
00:09:56.000When I see that video right there, I'm like, who knew what when?
00:09:59.000And you've got this like armed SLC queers group or whatever that immediately took down their social media.
00:10:06.000I mean, there's it would be it would be good if we had a full investigation of it, at least.
00:10:11.000So we could, we should at least, among other things, we should just know if they're all crazy freak shows who are marinating in violent rhetoric.
00:10:18.000Even if he said, ha ha, I'm going to shoot Charlie Kirk and they like laughed it off and didn't believe him.
00:10:24.000We should, or if they just said, yeah, that'd be cool.
00:10:27.000Like there's a lot of things we deserve to know, even if they aren't literal co-conspirators.
00:10:33.000A new Hillsdale College miniseries on colonial America offers a fresh way to think about Thanksgiving.
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00:13:45.000It's going to make a lot of news, I'm sure.
00:13:47.000So Viva, let's, you know, I want to actually make one mention and then I'm going to ask you a separate question.
00:13:53.000But, you know, a lot has been made about these text exchange that have gone back, that went back and forth between Robinson and his lover, his trans furry, gay lover, whatever.
00:14:04.000And people say it doesn't sound right, doesn't sound right.
00:14:07.000Well, there is a video that I want everybody to check out by Turkey Tom.
00:14:11.000I believe you've watched it now, Viva, where, and this has been authenticated as somebody who was in the Discord chats with them and apparently spent time with them at this apartment.
00:14:22.000And he said, 100%, this is how they talked, which is a striking finding.
00:14:27.000We're going to go into that more probably tomorrow, the next day, depending on how today goes.
00:14:32.000But I mean, I get the skepticism on this.
00:14:35.000At first, it struck me too, but apparently this is how they talk, Viva.
00:14:39.000That was not the most implausible thing to believe.
00:14:45.000It does read, regardless of whether or not this is how they talk, people saying they were manufactured by or drafted by AI.
00:14:51.000To the extent that they're confirmed text messages, you can come to whatever conclusions you want after that.
00:14:57.000But whether or not this is how they talk regularly, to the extent that those were authentic text messages, they show what they show, which is whether or not his lover was aware of what was going on.
00:15:08.000You're etching bullets and it's maybe not for target practice of a sporting nature.
00:15:14.000But when I say I don't believe the official narrative, you have to go back to a number of things here.
00:15:18.000I put my sort of best theory as to what went down.
00:15:22.000I want to know who was on the Discord chat in advance, what they were discussing, and whether or not there might have been some other foreign influence.
00:15:29.000I say foreign, not foreign government, but outer influence there.
00:15:32.000Tyler Robinson is getting radicalized right about the same time as Thomas Crooks, right about the same time as the other guy, Ryan Ruth.
00:15:41.000You know, he's being radicalized at a politically relevant period of time, right around the same time, oddly enough, as the alleged suspect in the January 6th pipe bomber, you know, a timeframe where political violence is potentially very useful for the upcoming election.
00:15:56.000So the timeframe of the radicalization is very interesting.
00:16:00.000To see whether or not he was on anybody's radar beforehand, we don't yet know that and why there would not be confirmation on that can lead to suspicion.
00:16:06.000You remember the old man, George Zinn, arrested for claiming to be the shooter the day of and then gets busted for CP on his phone.
00:16:13.000Like, in my mind, if I'm making a plausible theory here, George Zinn was probably on some Discord chat with a bunch of young perverts, and he's an old pervert, and he's getting off doing whatever they do on those chats.
00:16:32.000But, you know, it is the absence of total disclosure, the total lack of faith that anybody has, not just in the FBI per se, but in any state law enforcement.
00:16:43.000Nobody has any faith in our institutions anymore.
00:16:46.000And it leads people to go from, you know, healthy skepticism to just not believing it to concocting the most outlandish conspiracy theories imaginable.
00:16:55.000But then those text messages, you can understand how they will cause people to come to those types of conclusions.
00:17:00.000And, you know, allegedly, the rumors are Kash Patel, you know, getting mad at Tulsi Gabbard and Joe Kent for trying to look into a potential terrorist angle to this also does nothing to foment faith in the system, foment faith in the authorities.
00:17:16.000So you can understand why people are coming to their conclusions and their conspiracy theories.
00:17:19.000It's very much akin to the Sandy Hook conspiracy theories, where you still have people today who don't believe that people died on Sandy Hook on the day of.
00:17:28.000And it's because people are so traumatized by conspiracy that they are manufacturing the most outlandish conspiracies.
00:17:34.000And I think it does a disservice and an injustice to the actual conspiracy, which is it seems that many people had advanced knowledge of this shooting.
00:17:41.000And now the only attention is being placed on Tyler Robinson and or these more outlandish theories and not exploring these more plausible conspiracy theories.
00:17:49.000Well, I think it's important to emphasize we have a responsibility to use your reason.
00:17:58.000You truly have to shepherd how you think about things.
00:18:02.000And that's one of the most damaging things with really outlandish things.
00:18:05.000I mean, the Sandy Hook one is a great example where it can be addictive to really marinate in something that if you really were to write down all of the evidence straightforward and try to like make a logical syllogism out of it, it just doesn't make any sense.
00:18:20.000And the newest one I heard over the weekend was that it was actually an electrocution and that the people around him were standing on rubber mats, so they weren't arrested.
00:18:31.000Or if you want one that just came up, a bunch of people decided that that shooting in Australia was an IDF operation.
00:18:37.000So I'm just instantly ran with that one.
00:18:38.000Well, everything points back there, I guess.
00:18:50.000And like with Sandy Hook and saying, you know, all crisis actors, nobody died that day, you actually distract and divert from the true tragedy, which is, you know, state authorities failed to do what they were required to do to protect those children.
00:19:03.000And instead of discussing that, you end up having to discredit everyone who asks any questions because of the more outlandish conspiracy theories.
00:19:10.000Viva Fry, former litigator, future American, thank you, my friend.
00:19:17.000President Trump walked into a catch-22 when taking office.
00:19:20.000Do nothing in America would be staring at a ticking debt bomb, the kind of crisis that could cripple our future.
00:19:25.000Instead, he's taken action with strong policies to slow the train and buy us some time.
00:19:30.000But the effects of past administration spending are still working through the system, and experts predict dramatic price increases and market uncertainty.
00:19:38.000Trump is doing all he can, but no matter who's in office, protecting your retirement savings is ultimately up to you.
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00:20:20.000So we got pitched this idea, and Blake and I talked about it.
00:20:24.000We're like, man, this really sounds really cool.
00:20:36.000And we got pitched over the weekend by a friend of ours who said, Hey, this guy has an interesting take comparing Charlie to George Bailey, the hero of Bedford Falls, in that film.
00:20:51.000And so, we're joined now by Titus Tekara.
00:20:54.000He is a distinguished fellow at Hillsdale College, and he's also the executive director of the American Cinema Foundation, your big film buff.
00:21:04.000So, I don't know where exactly you're going to go with this, but lay it out for us, Titus.
00:21:13.000So, I'm a distinguished fellow at Hillsdale, and just the first couple of weeks now in December, I recorded a course on cinema and civilization for Hillsdale.
00:21:23.000And one of the movies I was talking about was It's a Wonderful Life.
00:23:02.000His idea of property is to buy a sturdy piece of luggage so that he can get through the world with it.
00:23:09.000And each stamp he says on that piece of luggage will prove that he has achieved something, that he has measured himself against something much bigger than the small town in which he lives.
00:23:19.000But then, you know, he has a sense of duty too, and he can't abandon the family business or the community.
00:23:24.000And he ends up making his life there in Bedford Falls, you know, an idyllic small-town community, but not so idyllic that it's unrealistic about what it takes to make a community work.
00:23:37.000The kinds of things that Jimmy Stewart, George Bailey, faces are the kinds of things we're dealing with now.
00:23:46.000He wants people to be able to buy a house so that they can make a family and make a life for themselves and the community.
00:23:52.000Or else, of course, none of this lasts.
00:23:54.000There's no future without it because owning property, first of all, for your home, your family, is the basis of self-respect and therefore the basis of self-government.
00:24:08.000For those who don't remember in the film, the big problem is there's that banker, Potter, and he's basically trying to buy out all the housing in the community.
00:24:20.000The whole thing is Potter trying to take the small portion that George Bailey's family have done through the savings and loan, this small portion of lending through the community and making self-sufficient members of the community.
00:24:32.000Potter just wants to have them all live in the world.
00:24:35.000He wants to take over all of the housing, and Bailey is constantly fighting to make sure everyone still owns their own home.
00:25:11.000I mean, these are the problems of the big cities.
00:25:13.000This is the challenge of modern America as Capra sees it.
00:25:16.000And it's better to face it than not to face it.
00:25:19.000And he might also be right that if you want to face it, you probably need men like that to face it.
00:25:25.000Again, it's not like the problem didn't happen before Charlie Kirk noticed that home ownership and marriage for young men is in crisis now.
00:25:35.000It's just that not so many people talked about it.
00:26:19.000And it's a really fascinating way to think about Charlie's life as a leader of a community that ended up, you know, you think about in death, you know, I guess the other central theme of it, as I'm thinking about this, Titus, is that, you know, the whole story revolves around what if George Bailey never existed.
00:26:41.000And that's a, I mean, you think about when you see all this outpouring of love for Charlie at the memorial, all the things that he's accomplished, his massive legacy and imprint on the world.
00:26:50.000Imagine if Charlie Kirk never existed.
00:26:53.000When he has that vision, there's, you know, his kids don't exist.
00:26:56.000His brother doesn't exist anymore because he drowns and all of that.
00:26:59.000And I think about we had that call during the AMA a few weeks ago where those people, they had a child because Charlie motivated them to do it.
00:27:09.000Or you think of this people who say, I finally proposed to my girlfriend.
00:27:13.000Maybe they'll have kids later who wouldn't have existed without Charlie's example.
00:27:28.000So, you know, I was just now talking to a friend of mine, a pastor from Indiana, who told me, as I think many other pastors have noticed, that week after week since Charlie was assassinated, men come to church.
00:27:42.000He says, some of these people come back, but all of them at least stayed for a long conversation.
00:27:48.000And I think you can see how even that makes a difference.
00:27:51.000But he says, one of them is now a member of his church about to become.
00:27:57.000And, you know, that's one soul that may be saved, which I think the business pastors are in.
00:28:03.000There's a lot of this stuff happening throughout America, lives that are being changed.
00:28:09.000And it's not just the life Charlie lived, but after his death too, still makes a difference.
00:28:15.000And that I think points you to something like the power of religion, like the movies trying to tell you men like that, although they're impressive, they still need prayer.
00:28:23.000They still need to look up to divine providence above them.
00:28:26.000And you see that in the effect their lives have even after they pass.
00:28:31.000And I also thought, you know, at the end of the movie, when his wife tries to call all the community together, Mary Bailey brings everybody together, tells the kids, yes, you should be praying for your dad.
00:28:42.000And then all the community comes to help out.
00:28:46.000That's not one like the vigils for Charlie.
00:28:50.000How many people went out of their way to show not just solidarity, but a love, a sense also of the loss, what was lost with his death, and presumably a resolve to make for a better life so that it was not all in vain.
00:29:07.000I think that's part, maybe that's the part that we don't talk about as much.
00:29:12.000How many people resolve themselves to do better so that everything he did and his death would not be in vain.
00:29:17.000And that also is somehow fit for a Christmas movie because it gives you hope about the future.
00:30:07.000Hey, so Titus, just while we have you here, it's kind of a question out of left field, but we did lose Rob Reiner over the weekend, another American film legend as a director.
00:30:19.000You know, minute and a half, you know, your reflections on his body of work.
00:30:24.000Yeah, it was an impressive guy, had a great career, especially in the 80s.
00:30:29.000But let me say one more thing about the, it's a wonderful life before we drop that.
00:30:34.000You know, there's something about what, you know, to understand somebody like George Bailey, to understand that kind of ambitious man, it takes this counterfactual.
00:31:04.000There's quite a bit of cruelty and brazen indifference.
00:31:07.000And instead of family life or home ownership or what you might call suburbia, what you get instead is a lot of gambling and some prostitution and obviously drinking.
00:31:16.000And again, that's a lot like the America today.
00:31:19.000There's way too much sports heroes out there trying to corrupt young men, advertising betting apps.
00:31:26.000There's a lot of, you know, just think about horrible stuff like OnlyFans.
00:31:34.000And I think that's what we're all afraid of.
00:31:36.000And I think that's what Charlie was afraid of and why he was trying to help young men build life for themselves, not become drug addicts or addicts to like only fans.
00:32:09.000TikTok has always strived to build that kind of place that thrives on respectful connection, where curiosity fuels connection and we can share what's on our minds and learn from each other.
00:32:19.000When ideas meet respect, good things happen.
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00:32:43.000TikTok is a place where respect opens the door for discussion, and discussion helps us build something real.
00:32:49.000Portions of our program are sponsored in part by TikTok.
00:32:54.000So I want to talk about this FBI plot that was just foiled.
00:33:02.000There was a press conference as we started the show here.
00:33:05.000But essentially, what we know is that the FBI has foiled a New Year's Eve terror plot, and they found that the alleged is in Southern California, and it's by far-left radicals.
00:33:19.000They say a radical offshoot of the Turtle Island Liberation Front or TILF, an extremist group motivated by pro-Palestine, anti-law enforcement, and anti-government ideology, allegedly planning coordinated IED, improvised explosive devices, bombing attacks on New Year's Eve at different locations across Los Angeles.
00:33:43.000Turtle Island is a name often used by pro-American Indian activists because apparently it's one of the names, I guess, that a American Indian tribe used for kind of it's a little debated, but like America or the world or whatever.
00:34:01.000And so some people believe that, you know, really radicals, they'll, it's common in Canada, so they won't want to call it.
00:35:06.000And they say that they must have been tracking these guys because it sounds like what happened was they went out into the Mojave Desert to make their explosives, they're saying.
00:35:16.000And then the FBI swooped in on them right now.
00:35:19.000A very sophisticated left-wing group is behind this.
00:35:24.000And they are saying that the executive order that President Trump signed after Charlie's assassination to label some of these far-left groups as domestic terrorists and to uncover their funding mechanisms has directly contributed to the FBI being able to foil this plot.
00:35:39.000So that's a huge piece of this story is that, you know, you start looking, you know, we just were talking about what happened if Charlie's life had never existed.
00:35:51.000Well, I know it comes in death, which is terrible and tragic, but the reason this got elevated so much, and I'll reiterate, I think I've told this story on the show before, is that the last text message he sent to Stephen Miller was, we have to root out these funding networks for the far-left extremists.
00:36:40.000Yeah, they plan to bomb five-plus locations in L.A., Orange County on New Year's Eve, explicitly called it a terrorist act, follow-up attacks targeting ICE agents, vehicles with pipe bombs to take some of the mountains, scare the rest.
00:36:52.000You know, as you saw the Death to America signage, et cetera.
00:36:56.000So the media will probably bury this because it's not the narrative.
00:37:00.000Remember, political violence only comes from the right, according to them, even though all evidence that we have in recent memory is all left-wing political violence.