The Charlie Kirk Show - How Democrats Rigged a Presidential Election with Mollie Hemingway

00:00:00.000 Hey, everybody.

00:00:00.000 Today on the Charlie Kirk Show, Molly Hemingway from theFederalist.com, off of the book Rigged.

00:00:05.000 It's a phenomenal book.

00:00:07.000 Everyone should check out this book.

00:00:10.000 It explains the 2020 election better than anything I've seen published.

00:00:14.000 She talks about some themes that we've talked about in great detail on this program, including Zuckerberg's money, consent decrees, what happened in Georgia.

00:00:23.000 She's very informative and smart and fair, and she loves her country.

00:00:29.000 And so I think you're going to really enjoy this podcast.

00:00:31.000 It's one of my favorites we've done in quite some time, especially if you are trying to get to the bottom of what happened in the 2020 election.

00:00:38.000 This episode is for you.

00:00:40.000 Email us your thoughts, everybody, freedom at charliekirk.com.

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00:02:27.000 Very important episode of Molly Hemingway, the great, the legendary, the strong, the creators, the brave, and the wise.

00:02:32.000 Buckle up. 0.96

00:02:33.000 Here we go.

00:02:34.000 Charlie, what you've done is incredible here.

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00:03:07.000 Hey, everybody.

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00:03:34.000 Hey, everybody, welcome to this episode of the Charlie Kirk Show.

00:03:37.000 With us today is a legend, someone who has made America a better place.

00:03:41.000 And you can't say that about many people.

00:03:43.000 Molly Hemingway, author of Rigged, How the Media, Big Tech, and Democrats have seized our elections.

00:03:51.000 And it's out right now.

00:03:53.000 Is that right, Molly?

00:03:54.000 Yeah, just came out and it's doing great.

00:03:57.000 Good.

00:03:57.000 Well, everyone, go buy a copy.

00:03:59.000 It is a number one bestseller in media, internet, and in politics.

00:04:02.000 A lot I want to get into, but Molly, you are now bucking the consensus.

00:04:06.000 You're not allowed to say the election was rigged because you're a threat to democracy.

00:04:11.000 How dare you?

00:04:12.000 That's actually partly why I wrote the book. 1.00

00:04:15.000 I was very frustrated by the idiotic way that people were talking about the election. 0.94

00:04:20.000 You weren't allowed to ask any questions. 0.97

00:04:22.000 And even before the election, I had felt that the media and tech environments were so corrupted and so brazen in their limiting of information that they were meddling with our election.

00:04:35.000 And that's actually something that international observers will say that an election can't be deemed to be free or fair if you're in a propaganda or censorship environment.

00:04:45.000 And that's what we're in.

00:04:46.000 I mean, we have big tech controlling so much of what we're allowed to talk about, what we're allowed to share, what we're allowed to think.

00:04:52.000 And I thought that was a really important part of the story.

00:04:56.000 That's where I was mostly interested.

00:04:58.000 But then, of course, people were also talking about all these changes to election law and how those changes had degraded the integrity of the election.

00:05:07.000 And the fact that nobody else wanted to look into that, I thought, well, I have to research this.

00:05:12.000 I have to report this.

00:05:13.000 And I was frankly shocked and stunned by what I found.

00:05:16.000 And so I'm really glad that I did write the book.

00:05:18.000 So walk us through just some of that.

00:05:19.000 Tea, some of it, not all of it, because we want people to go buy the book and find it themselves, but kind of walk through some of the things that you found in researching this, because this is one of the most under-researched topics in the history of news.

00:05:30.000 You have the entire news media just not just uninterested, but they're invested in making sure you don't talk about it.

00:05:37.000 Exactly right.

00:05:38.000 So one of the things that I think is very interesting is that the same Democratic operative who ran the Russia lie, that was the lie that Donald Trump stole the 2016 election by colluding with Russia.

00:05:52.000 His name is Mark Elias.

00:05:54.000 He was at Perkins Cooey, which is this big Democratic firm.

00:05:57.000 He recently left to start his own firm and make more money and have more power and control.

00:06:04.000 And he was the one that funneled the secretive Russia lie.

00:06:07.000 That was where Hillary Clinton paid for opposition research. 1.00

00:06:10.000 It was just inventions, lies, that Donald Trump was planning to steal the 2016 election and that he did steal the 2016 election.

00:06:18.000 They actually have kept it going this entire time.

00:06:20.000 His name is Mark Elias.

00:06:21.000 He's also the guy who ran the Democratic operation to change all voting laws leading up to the 2020 election.

00:06:29.000 And that meant different things in different states.

00:06:30.000 So that could be about watering down the integrity of mail-in balloting.

00:06:35.000 That could be expanding the period of time in which you vote so that you're not really sure how many people voted or when they have to get their ballots in by.

00:06:43.000 And he has this array of different groups that he works with, whether they're Democratic operatives or nonprofit, nonpartisan groups that are actually just kind of arms of the Democratic Party and he would have them file lawsuits.

00:06:56.000 And so it was just this like wide-ranging operation to weaken the integrity of the election system.

00:07:02.000 And because of COVID, you know, this is something that he'd been wanting to do for decades, but because of COVID, suddenly all these judges or other people were more amenable to it.

00:07:12.000 And what's important to also keep in mind about this part of it is that sometimes these changes were done legally and sometimes they were not done legally.

00:07:19.000 So you're supposed to make all changes like this go through the state legislature according to the Constitution and according to many state constitutions, but frequently they were done through other means.

00:07:28.000 Like you would sue a friendly Secretary of State and then that Secretary of State would settle and agree to whatever your demands were.

00:07:36.000 And you could just like with the with the signature of a pen, change election laws in the middle of the game in a way that was not designed to bolster confidence in the result.

00:07:48.000 He was the architect behind a lot of this.

00:07:50.000 And so I guess one question I have for you is how much of this was colluded and how much of was this just everyone hated Trump, like big tech in their corner, financiers in another corner.

00:08:01.000 Was there kind of, and there actually is an article from Time magazine shows there was a central planning apparatus, but did you find in your reporting there was kind of a mission control?

00:08:10.000 Was there a war room that was orchestrating this?

00:08:13.000 Yeah, that was actually just like you mentioned, already revealed in a Time magazine article that was written by Molly Ball, who's a reporter who has very good ties with Democrats.

00:08:23.000 She wrote the fawning biography of Nancy Pelosi, and she's sort of rewarded with inside information from Democrats who know that she will put it out there in the nicest, kindest way.

00:08:34.000 And so she already wrote that this was a highly coordinated operation at the highest levels, but it was basically the establishment all got together and it was all hands on deck.

00:08:43.000 We have to do whatever it takes to prevent Donald Trump from getting reelected.

00:08:48.000 And what's interesting about this is they did do whatever it took.

00:08:51.000 And it still came down to like 43,000 votes in three states that it would have, that would have changed it and made it a tie in the Electoral College.

00:08:59.000 It was so close that they came to failing.

00:09:01.000 And that was by doing everything from controlling when and where riots occurred to controlling algorithms by Facebook and Google and all the big tech companies that tried to censor and deplatform voices that challenge their liberal orthodoxy to actually,

00:09:22.000 which we haven't even talked about, Mark Zuckerberg, who is one of the world's wealthiest and most powerful men, financing the private takeover of government election offices and the media colluding with this to suppress stories that were that were bad for Biden, the media running Joe Biden's campaign.

00:09:41.000 I mean, he wasn't on the road.

00:09:42.000 It was the media who ran his campaign.

00:09:45.000 They invented stories about Donald Trump, such as the fake story that Russia was paying bounties to kill U.S. soldiers or the lie that Donald Trump had disparaged soldiers at Ayn Marn or the dead Marines and others buried at Ayn Marn in France.

00:10:04.000 Like they just made up stories and then they took real stories, like the stories about the Biden family business and how corrupt it is, and they just suppressed and buried them.

00:10:12.000 But yeah, it was all coordinated and they're they're kind of open and honest about it because they wanted to brag about it.

00:10:17.000 Yeah, and that article for Time magazine was stunning.

00:10:20.000 And I think they just kind of wanted to take a victory lap and say, hey, look how smart we were.

00:10:24.000 We had Zoom calls with labor and with activist groups.

00:10:28.000 And it literally says in the article, I'm paraphrasing, but it says, yeah, if we would have not got what we want, we would have been in the streets the next day.

00:10:36.000 And that one framing in that article was incredible.

00:10:40.000 Charlie, that was the part that I found most interesting.

00:10:42.000 I actually kind of already knew because I was already researching some of this that there had been this level of organization, but I thought it was all like what we're talking about, Mark Elias and funding and, you know, the kind of things that you expect political operatives to do.

00:10:56.000 When they admitted that they had the power to get people to riot or not riot, I was like, oh, so the summer of violence was all part of this as well.

00:11:05.000 And it makes sense.

00:11:06.000 Like that was a really smart strategy.

00:11:08.000 And I actually put a chapter of it in Rigged about the summer of violence where there was this lengthy insurrection against, you know, there was an attack on the White House.

00:11:19.000 This is back when attacking federal buildings and disrupting government was great, you know, and you had Kamala Harris like asking people to bail out rioters.

00:11:27.000 They attacked a federal courthouse for months on end, which, you know, again, why we would care about one article, Article I branch, but not Article II or Article III branches that are under attack, I don't understand.

00:11:39.000 I oppose all political violence.

00:11:42.000 But they, you know, they murdered their people killed in these riots.

00:11:46.000 There was the arson.

00:11:47.000 They were burning down precincts.

00:11:50.000 And it was really important because of a multiple number of reasons. 0.78

00:11:55.000 Donald Trump was actually very effective in getting more black vote than most Republican candidates can.

00:12:03.000 And so they were fearful about it.

00:12:05.000 So they wanted to heighten race problems so that they could maybe keep that stranglehold on the black vote that the left has been able to have for decades.

00:12:14.000 They also just wanted unrest because it was kind of this difficult position for President Trump to be in.

00:12:20.000 He, in my opinion, should have done much more to quell the riots.

00:12:23.000 But when he did restore order right in front of the White House, not only did the media and the Democrats lose their ever-living minds, so did members of his own cabinet.

00:12:35.000 And so did Republican senators like Ben Sass and Mitt Romney.

00:12:40.000 They condemned him.

00:12:41.000 And so he was working with very little help.

00:12:45.000 And I'm not excusing it because I still think it was his responsibility to restore order and provide leadership there.

00:12:51.000 But it was a brilliant strategy because he was not keeping things in order.

00:12:55.000 And he also was boxed in and prevented from keeping things in order.

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00:14:31.000 Yeah, Floyda Palooza that summer was completely orchestrated, which is someone who kind of deals in the activist space and knows what it takes to get people fired up about something, just how blunt they are.

00:14:41.000 They're like, yeah, flip a switch.

00:14:43.000 It's just whatever.

00:14:44.000 It's like, we'll send in the shock troops.

00:14:46.000 Like they work for us.

00:14:48.000 And I tried to, you know, to little success, tell people, you realize this is all artificial, right?

00:14:53.000 It's not like they have organizers probably on payroll, ready to go with, you know, texting lists and it's just kind of deploy it at will.

00:15:01.000 Again, the book is called Rigged.

00:15:02.000 I want to make sure I keep on plugging it, how the media, big tech, and Democrats seized our elections.

00:15:08.000 And so I want to get into kind of the mail and ballot piece of this.

00:15:12.000 You wrote this piece for Newsweek recently, and I think it's actually an essay from your book, if I'm not mistaken, right?

00:15:21.000 And I think so, yeah.

00:15:22.000 Yeah, you wrote here about how the change in the election laws themselves had a profound difference in actually the outcome.

00:15:31.000 And so talk a little bit about this because here's one of my complaints about how people talk about the election, which you've done a phenomenal job of doing the opposite, which is people get so focused on a certain thing, like machines or routers.

00:15:44.000 This is comprehensive, right?

00:15:46.000 There were so many different elements of this that all kind of worked in harmony together.

00:15:50.000 Please talk about the mail-in ballot aspect of this.

00:15:53.000 Well, and I dove in in Wisconsin for mail-in ballots because I find that state to be so fascinating.

00:16:00.000 Wisconsin's constitution says that everyone has the right to vote.

00:16:03.000 They also have the right not to vote, and that mail-in or absentee balloting, I think is how they put it, is a privilege.

00:16:09.000 So there are different standards by which they judge in person, election day voting, and absentee mail-in balloting.

00:16:17.000 And first off, before COVID or anything else, Wisconsin has a problem where they're not keeping their list as clean as they should.

00:16:25.000 So people move all the time.

00:16:27.000 Like a huge percentage of the population is constantly moving.

00:16:30.000 You might have had yourself like 18 different addresses and you register to vote at one and then you move to the next, but you're still on the old list.

00:16:36.000 And so states are supposed to clean up their lists with some regularity.

00:16:40.000 And Wisconsin had a quarter of a million voter registrations that they were supposed to remove from their list, but they didn't.

00:16:47.000 They actually lost a court battle about whether to do it or not, but they still didn't.

00:16:51.000 And then into this mix is COVID.

00:16:53.000 And the clerks of the two most Democratic counties in the state say, we have this special provision in Wisconsin where you can register to vote without showing an ID.

00:17:05.000 So usually you have to show an ID, but if you say you're indefinitely confined, then you don't have to show an ID.

00:17:11.000 So they tell people to do it because of COVID.

00:17:13.000 And I think they get like another quarter of a million people registering to vote without requiring them, without a requirement for showing ID.

00:17:20.000 Some of them may have shown ID, but they're not required to.

00:17:23.000 Just have like messy lists happening everywhere.

00:17:26.000 Then the Wisconsin governor tries to postpone the election.

00:17:29.000 It's a huge issue because this isn't just a primary battle.

00:17:32.000 It's actually a general election for them.

00:17:34.000 He fails at doing it.

00:17:35.000 They do it.

00:17:37.000 And the New York Times writes up that what the Democrats really wanted this to be was like a test case for mail-in balloting because mail-in balloting is their strategy for the 20 for the general 2020 election.

00:17:46.000 And they're pretty pleased with how it went and how they can manipulate the vote and get out the vote, you know, get out more votes using the mail-in balloting.

00:17:54.000 And it's also when Republicans and Democrats realize that there is a partisan divide in whether or not people will choose to do mail-in balloting.

00:18:03.000 And Democrats have trust and confidence in the mail-in balloting process.

00:18:08.000 So they are pretty open to it.

00:18:10.000 Republicans are pretty hostile to it.

00:18:13.000 In some cases, like the RNC is polling people in different states.

00:18:17.000 It was like 80% of Georgians did not want to do mail-in balloting.

00:18:22.000 And so mail-in balloting becomes the Democratic strategy.

00:18:26.000 And this is important because of how it relates to what Mark Zuckerberg starts doing a couple months later, which is funding the private takeover of government election offices to massively expand mail-in balloting capabilities.

00:18:41.000 That's important because it has such a partisan effect.

00:18:45.000 He didn't just target his funding in a partisan manner, meaning he gave a lot of money to per capita to blue counties in swing states in order to achieve an outcome of actually swinging those states and he and he succeeded.

00:18:58.000 It's also just that mail-in balloting itself, like people left to their own devices, Republicans tend to vote in person on election day, maybe early.

00:19:07.000 Democrats are like, yeah, I have total confidence that every person involved in this like shady mail-in balloting process is going to treat my ballot with respect.

00:19:15.000 They might be right.

00:19:16.000 They might treat the Democrat ballots right.

00:19:16.000 They might be right.

00:19:18.000 So they might not be wrong.

00:19:20.000 But anyway, that's a different point.

00:19:22.000 And so talk, that's an important point because this kind of goes back to the central planning war room aspect of it, because Zuckerberg always denied that this was trying to have some sort of Democrat output.

00:19:34.000 This was all about trying to expand, you know, expand accessibility and it was about safety.

00:19:40.000 And we did an entire podcast on this where you just look at Georgia, nine out of 10, 25 out of 26 of the cities and counties where the money went to, the Federalists wrote this story and broke it.

00:19:51.000 And Phil Klein's been talking about this for a while, but we went through the entire Federalist piece kind of every paragraph by paragraph.

00:19:57.000 Phenomenal piece that shows that this was a massive partisan takeover.

00:20:01.000 But Molly, can you talk about how this was not just running ads?

00:20:04.000 This wasn't Zuckerberg running targeted ads.

00:20:06.000 This is something totally different.

00:20:08.000 So when people hear that Mark Zuckerberg spent $419 million to help Democrats win, they're like, well, it's a free country.

00:20:14.000 They gave more money.

00:20:15.000 Democrats had more money.

00:20:16.000 They want.

00:20:17.000 This is not campaign spending.

00:20:20.000 This is the governmental offices.

00:20:23.000 So what Mark Zuckerberg did is he gave money to two left-wing groups run by Obama operatives.

00:20:28.000 And then they funneled the money to these to these city and county election offices.

00:20:33.000 That money came with strings attached.

00:20:35.000 It mostly went to staffing.

00:20:37.000 These are the offices that handle voter registration, voting, ballot design, ballot counting, all of these, ballot harvesting, drop boxes.

00:20:47.000 And so by embedding into these offices in key blue cities, they were able to run the Democratic get out the vote operation from the government.

00:20:58.000 And that's what's so, you know, this is, this is like the one place that you're not supposed to have partisan politics engaged in.

00:21:04.000 We have the, we have the government handle elections precisely so that partisan partisans won't be able to manipulate the process.

00:21:11.000 And this is something that was like long, hard fought for in U.S. history.

00:21:16.000 And it would be like the New England Patriots hiring and training and paying the officiants at a game that they are playing against another team.

00:21:28.000 It's not, you know, doesn't necessarily mean that they're corrupt, but it certainly would not give you confidence in the results.

00:21:34.000 Yeah, but that I actually like the Patriots.

00:21:36.000 We have a lot of people that hate the Patriots.

00:21:38.000 I don't know.

00:21:39.000 Some people would call them cheaters.

00:21:40.000 Maybe the Astros would be a better example because we don't like them around here.

00:21:43.000 And so I like it.

00:21:44.000 Yeah.

00:21:44.000 The private takeover of elections is something that I was always told that Democrats hated.

00:21:51.000 That, I mean, could you, if the proverbial Koch brothers did this in 2014.

00:21:58.000 Yeah, it would be like having Karl Rove take Koch money to take like an army of college Republicans and put them into the system.

00:22:07.000 People would say, I feel like this isn't a good idea.

00:22:10.000 This isn't, this isn't how we should do it.

00:22:11.000 Or we don't want tech oligarchs controlling our elections. 1.00

00:22:16.000 And that's why actually a lot of states have already made it illegal.

00:22:19.000 I asked people in other states, like, why did you let this happen?

00:22:23.000 And first off, they were under the false impression that this was done for COVID relief and it was done in a bipartisan manner.

00:22:29.000 It wasn't.

00:22:30.000 I mean, they did give money to Republicans, but at such a small level relative to what they were giving, you know, Philadelphia would literally get $10 million and a Republican county would literally get 5,000.

00:22:41.000 I mean, the disparity was ridiculous.

00:22:43.000 But they said we didn't even know it was possible to take over our government election offices until it happened.

00:22:49.000 And so not only do people have to make sure that it doesn't, that that doesn't happen going forward, I think they need to be aware that Democrats are pretty entrepreneurial and savvy about understanding loopholes and exploits and make sure they're protecting what the plan is for the next election as well.

00:23:06.000 Well, and I will say, though, that every time Republicans try to be entrepreneurial, they get slammed by investigations and subpoenas.

00:23:15.000 And I don't want to get into much detail, but anytime I've been aware of groups that are like, yeah, this is what we'll do because there might be an opening here.

00:23:24.000 Immediately Washington Post comes or New York Times and it becomes, you know what I mean?

00:23:29.000 I do.

00:23:30.000 And I mean, I was thinking about it even when it came to detecting fraud.

00:23:33.000 So we all knew up until a year ago, everyone admitted, whether they were left or right, that mail-in balloting was rife with fraud.

00:23:40.000 I mean, that's why France banned it.

00:23:41.000 The New York Times and the Washington Post used to admit it.

00:23:44.000 It just gives you opportunities for fraud that you don't have with in-person voting.

00:23:48.000 And human nature being what it is, people of all persuasions try to commit, you know, try to try to manipulate things.

00:23:54.000 So you want to prevent the opportunities.

00:23:56.000 But when Republicans would actually detect problems, so for instance, Pennsylvania does not allow ballot harvesting.

00:24:04.000 You have to put your own ballot in the mail.

00:24:06.000 And they caught people putting in multiple ballots.

00:24:09.000 And when they did that, not only did the state AG, but the New York Times just lambasted the Trump campaign.

00:24:15.000 They're like, this is voter suppression.

00:24:17.000 If you have integrity in voting, that's voting suppression.

00:24:20.000 And so they did horrible coverage.

00:24:22.000 And it gets to the point where the Trump campaign is like, we can't even pursue this because we're getting destroyed.

00:24:29.000 And to have both the media and the supposed law enforcement people both colluding to prevent you from being able to detect fraud is a huge problem.

00:24:39.000 And it keeps on being a huge problem in Pennsylvania.

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00:25:44.000 So, Molly, one of my biggest issues is with Republicans.

00:25:48.000 And you kind of touched on this and I want to really focus on this because some of this was preventable and some of it was not.

00:25:55.000 And you can kind of, part of the part, it could have been preventable to restrain big tech years ago, but let's just say starting in January on January 1st, 2020 from Election Day, there was a lot of this could have been prevented.

00:26:09.000 And I met with the president in the summer of 2020 in the White House, and it was kind of during all of this question of Trump was tweeting about mail and ballots.

00:26:17.000 And I was there when he was getting calls from Republican governors, including Brian Kemp, saying, you've got to stop attacking mail-in ballots.

00:26:23.000 It's the most wonderful thing ever.

00:26:25.000 This is how we're going to win.

00:26:26.000 You're going to suppress our voters.

00:26:28.000 And not once did we get a special session from the Georgia state legislature or the Arizona legislature saying, hey, let's have a hearing and just kind of know what we're about to get into.

00:26:37.000 You know, we're expanding mail and balloting.

00:26:39.000 All this private money's coming in.

00:26:42.000 Why were Republicans caught so flat-footed?

00:26:44.000 Were they vacationing in the summer of 2020.

00:26:46.000 I mean, they have the constitutional authority to oversee the administration of these elections, and they just allowed unelected tech oligarchs just to purchase the election. 0.97

00:26:55.000 It was almost like they were all numb to what was happening.

00:26:59.000 And you see this repeated in states across the country.

00:27:01.000 I do want to say that there were that people should know that, in fact, a lot of this was fought.

00:27:07.000 And it was fought by the Trump campaign and it was fought by the RNC.

00:27:11.000 And frequently they were fighting. together against some of these changes and they had a ton of successes.

00:27:16.000 This could have been so much worse.

00:27:18.000 In fact, sometimes I wonder if all of those fake polls that said Biden was going to win by like 20 points, you know, when that you would hear it throughout the campaign, if they weren't designed to get people comfortable with the idea that such a thing could happen, because that's how much manipulation of the process was actually going on.

00:27:36.000 That's an interesting point.

00:27:37.000 It could have been worse.

00:27:38.000 The RNC and the Trump campaign both did take it seriously.

00:27:42.000 There's no question they didn't do enough.

00:27:45.000 There's no question that state legislatures didn't do enough.

00:27:47.000 In fact, in an infuriating way, they didn't do enough.

00:27:50.000 But then you also had situations where state legislatures weren't approving these changes and they would be brought in through this sue and settle approach.

00:27:59.000 And then courts that should have stopped it either just decided not to do anything or that too close to the election or there's nothing we can do.

00:28:07.000 You see this repeated at the Pennsylvania Supreme Court, the Wisconsin Supreme Court, all sorts of different, you know, in federal courts where courts don't like to get involved in elections and you can understand why, but by failing to bring integrity to the process and a clear understanding of the rules, they actually contributed to the disaster of people not having confidence in the results.

00:28:27.000 So sometimes backing away from, you know, the democratic process can actually lead to a greater disillusion of trust.

00:28:35.000 And you actually see the Supreme Court justices, Kavanaugh, Alito, and Thomas all say that, that failure to have done due diligence on some of these things.

00:28:47.000 You know, they would, a case would come up and they'd say, well, we don't, it's too soon to rule on it.

00:28:53.000 And then once the election had happened, they'd say, well, it's moot because the election is over.

00:28:57.000 You know, sometimes you actually just have to take up a case, let the chips fall where they may.

00:29:02.000 And, you know, I actually think a lot of these cases might not have actually gone in the Trump campaign's favor, but still having resolution would have been more ideal.

00:29:11.000 Well, and the opposition, they had the will and they saw the opening with the Fauci virus to change the way that we do elections forever.

00:29:20.000 So, Charlie, did you know about the consent decree that I was going to ask you about?

00:29:25.000 That was actually my next question.

00:29:26.000 Yeah.

00:29:26.000 How on earth did Brian Kemp sign a consent decree in private?

00:29:29.000 And most people didn't know about it until after.

00:29:32.000 Okay.

00:29:32.000 Well, I actually, I was going to ask about a different consent decision.

00:29:35.000 The RNC one that disallowed them from doing poll watching, right?

00:29:38.000 And let me just quickly talk about that one, which is they agreed to a consent decree in 1983 after they're accused of doing something wrong in a New Jersey gubernatorial election.

00:29:48.000 And it ends up lasting for almost 40 years that the Republican National Committee cannot do any election day work for literally nearly 40 years.

00:29:58.000 And so even though they finally get out of it in 2018, they sort of don't have the muscle memory to know what to do on Election Day.

00:30:07.000 And a bunch of people at the RNC actually were taking everything very seriously.

00:30:11.000 They were litigating all these issues, but they were still constrained by their own, you know, by having had 40 years with both arms tied behind their back.

00:30:20.000 Okay, different consent decree in Georgia.

00:30:24.000 It's not just, it's not just Raffensburger's fault there because it was actually his Secretary of State that signed that one in Georgia.

00:30:32.000 That's where Mark Elias comes in with one of his little groups and sues to change mail-in balloting guidelines.

00:30:42.000 And partly, I'm extremely critical of Georgia and the Secretary of State's office in the book.

00:30:49.000 But this is actually not the worst issue that they did, even though this was one of the bad issues that they handled.

00:30:56.000 They just kind of agree to what Mark Elias demands, but they did it in part because they'd already changed, the legislature had changed the law to expand mail-in balloting, and they felt that it wasn't too big of a deal.

00:31:08.000 Republican lawyers at the state and national level kind of signed off on this.

00:31:12.000 And they believed that if they went along to get along here, that it would give them a stronger footing when Elias came back and the Democrats came back and tried to expand election day ballot return for like another week or two.

00:31:27.000 And they kind of thought, well, if we show good faith here, then the courts won't force us to keep the balloting open for week after week.

00:31:34.000 But the much worse thing that the Georgians do, the Zuckerberg funding frequently comes in through friendly Democratic counties, right?

00:31:42.000 They give money.

00:31:43.000 You know, a Democratic county asks for a huge sum of money and they get it.

00:31:46.000 And there's some reason to believe they all knew exactly what was going on with it.

00:31:50.000 Georgia is the only case where like the Republican Secretary of State, they oversee this primary that's a total disaster in June and they get really negative coverage from the New York Times, which is like, who cares?

00:32:02.000 It wasn't really their fault.

00:32:03.000 It was the Democratic Fulton County commissioners who had done a bad job with managing the election. 0.55

00:32:09.000 But they took it very personally and they invite Zuckerberg money in so that they can expand and dramatically and do like, basically they bring in the money so that they can do Democratic get out the vote efforts from, again, the Secretary of State's office and these county offices.

00:32:27.000 And so they did it.

00:32:29.000 They basically ran it.

00:32:30.000 Raffensperger basically ran the Democratic get out the vote operation.

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00:33:32.000 I always focused on the consent decree, and you added some interesting context and put myself more in their shoes.

00:33:37.000 I still think it was a mistake, but you're right.

00:33:39.000 But you're trying to say that Raffensperger, because of a negative New York Times article, because of a poorly executed primary, they're like, you know what?

00:33:46.000 Let's try to get some private money into this whole opera.

00:33:49.000 Is that what you're saying?

00:33:50.000 Like, let's just do what Zuckerberg wants us to do?

00:33:53.000 Yeah.

00:33:53.000 So Fulton County was the place where people really did stand in line all day to vote in the primary.

00:33:59.000 By the way, if you listen or watch or read the media coverage of that primary, it sounds like the most unhinged people on the right after the election.

00:34:09.000 They're all like, they use Dominion voting systems and those are hackable and foreign adversaries.

00:34:14.000 You know, they're saying all this.

00:34:15.000 The New York Times and Politico sound just kind of like the Democratic senators.

00:34:20.000 If you ever watch those hearings where they're like getting very conspiratorial about voting machines, that's right.

00:34:24.000 Amy Clobotar and Colin Lee.

00:34:26.000 And they used to sound like that.

00:34:27.000 And they used to not be in power.

00:34:28.000 That's right.

00:34:29.000 Yes.

00:34:29.000 Right.

00:34:31.000 But that election goes so poorly that they think if we could help Democrats do their mail-in balloting, then we won't have long lines on election day.

00:34:41.000 And what they're not realizing is what they're saying, what they're saying is if we could run the Democratic get out the vote operation from within our offices, and they targeted the funding in areas where they were expecting people to be amenable to mail-in balloting, which means they were targeting these like high population Democratic areas.

00:35:01.000 And so they bring in the money and then they use the money to like do social media ads and radio ads targeting Democratic voting populations to help them maximize their vote numbers.

00:35:13.000 These are the types of things that private campaigns like Republican and Democratic campaigns spend a lot of money on.

00:35:19.000 They work really hard to get the information to know who to target and how to get out the vote.

00:35:23.000 And that's okay.

00:35:24.000 Like it's a free country and people can use them, you know, can use private funds to do that.

00:35:28.000 This was using private funds in the governmental office in a partisan fashion.

00:35:33.000 And usually when people did it, they were Democrat.

00:35:36.000 In George's case, they were Republican and didn't really.

00:35:39.000 And I just want to also point out, it's not just Raffensperger, but his chief of staff, who's named Jordan Fuchs, I think.

00:35:45.000 What is that name?

00:35:45.000 And that weird like private contractor guy that kept on going on television.

00:35:49.000 What was that guy's name?

00:35:50.000 Connor.

00:35:51.000 I totally forgot.

00:35:52.000 Do you know what I'm saying?

00:35:52.000 He'd like go on CNN and give like criticism of Republican.

00:35:55.000 Yeah, he had some German name, not Raffensperger.

00:35:58.000 I'll think of it.

00:35:58.000 It was like, I don't know.

00:35:59.000 It was like the weirdest guy.

00:36:01.000 I'll think of it.

00:36:02.000 If I had in front of me, if I was like a multiple choice test, but you know who I'm talking about?

00:36:05.000 It's like some weird subcontractor who kept on showing up on TV.

00:36:09.000 What's funny is it would always have his title as if he were a guy.

00:36:13.000 Gabriel Sterling.

00:36:15.000 Yeah.

00:36:15.000 Gabe Sterling.

00:36:16.000 Gabe Sterling.

00:36:17.000 And he was, he kind of got, I think he got, I'd heard he'd gotten more money by being a contractor than by being an employee.

00:36:23.000 But this is the same office that then leaks phone calls right on the eve of an election as sort of like this vindictive measure to go after President Trump. 0.98

00:36:32.000 They also, I don't know if they were too stupid or if they were too ill-informed to understand what the Trump campaign was asking for in some of those calls. 0.92

00:36:41.000 So in order to get a new election going forward in Georgia, courts have kind of said, you don't have to show how people would have voted if there are questionable ballots. 0.99

00:36:52.000 You just have to show that there are enough questionable ballots.

00:36:54.000 And one of the things the Trump campaign figures out is that there are in fact a ton of illegal votes in Georgia.

00:37:00.000 They don't know who they would have gone for, but there are people who should have been voting in one place who were voting in another.

00:37:05.000 And that disenfranchises, of course, legal voters who do follow the law about where you should vote.

00:37:11.000 And Trump says something on the call like, I don't need you to agree that we have 150,000 of them.

00:37:16.000 I just need you to find like 11,000 of them, which there were that many.

00:37:22.000 And that gets leaked as if he's asking for them to find illegal votes.

00:37:26.000 And it was, it was a like a somewhat complicated issue, but not that complicated.

00:37:30.000 And the Secretary of State's office is the one leaking that.

00:37:33.000 Sorry.

00:37:34.000 They cherry-picked the call.

00:37:35.000 They misreported the call, right?

00:37:37.000 Well, there was also that other call that that office was alleged to have leaked in which they, well, it wasn't audio they leaked because when the audio came out, it turned out that what they claimed had happened on that other call hadn't actually happened.

00:37:50.000 And that had been so explosive that it ended up, I think, in impeachment paperwork.

00:37:54.000 And that office could really use some competency that is not there right now.

00:37:59.000 So I first want to just reiterate the book title, Rigged.

00:38:03.000 Everyone should go buy a copy.

00:38:05.000 I want to thank you for writing it because you have a ton of respect and this issue is trying to be kind of swept under the rug by the ruling class in the Republican Party.

00:38:15.000 And you have enough respect where you're going to be able to, I think, make this a consensus issue amongst the educated people.

00:38:24.000 And do you want to comment on that before I get into the question?

00:38:27.000 Yeah.

00:38:27.000 Yeah, just I think it's important that people understand that this isn't just about what happened in 2020.

00:38:32.000 This is about all elections going forward.

00:38:35.000 And you can't just accept rigged elections.

00:38:37.000 You can't just accept like, oh, I guess we live in a place where people can completely pollute the process by which we elect people and there's nothing we can do about it.

00:38:47.000 Democracy depends not on the consent of the winners, but on the losers.

00:38:51.000 And so you have to have systems in place where people can trust results and they can deal with, you know, with the results, whatever they may be.

00:38:58.000 And you can't have a really messy system and have a democratic aspect to our government continue.

00:39:05.000 Yes.

00:39:05.000 And so that is really kind of where I want to close out this conversation because I always try to be solution oriented, but you can only really be solution oriented if you know the problem, which we've gone through it.

00:39:14.000 And we haven't even gone through all of it, by the way.

00:39:16.000 We're just coming to surface.

00:39:17.000 What can we do to make sure 2022 and 24 is not rigged?

00:39:23.000 Okay.

00:39:23.000 So first off, I would say don't care at all about the media and what they say about it because these are the same people who said 2016 was stolen by Donald Trump and now you can't talk about 2020.

00:39:33.000 Like just ignore them.

00:39:34.000 They don't matter.

00:39:35.000 But I would say people at the state level do need to understand what their laws are.

00:39:39.000 First and foremost, ban the private funding of government election offices.

00:39:43.000 That is a no-brainer and nobody can defend that.

00:39:46.000 Two, another issue that is actually very popular across the political spectrum is to ensure that you have voter ID.

00:39:52.000 A voter ID tied to either mail-in ballot or voting in person is very important.

00:39:58.000 Also, just clarifying the process.

00:40:01.000 Sort of one of the big problems that is out there is just not an agreement on what the rules are.

00:40:06.000 And so you'll see Democratic counties sort of saying, we don't really know what the rules are, so we'll flout them.

00:40:11.000 And you have Republicans who tend to be very like rule-oriented, following the strict letter of the law.

00:40:16.000 The more you can clarify what the law is and how it should be practiced is best.

00:40:21.000 And that's just going to depend on which state it is.

00:40:23.000 But more than anything, just like be involved, be careful.

00:40:27.000 Make sure you have proper oversight and make sure that the oversight is in place before the ballots are separated from the envelopes or before, you know, once they're separated, there's basically nothing you can do.

00:40:37.000 So make sure all the systems are in place at the front end.

00:40:40.000 Well, I just want to reiterate what you said, though.

00:40:42.000 First of all, not caring about the media is important.

00:40:44.000 They're going to say you're a threat to democracy and all this.

00:40:46.000 It's a bunch of nonsense.

00:40:47.000 And it's so, it's such a sad kind of indictment of where our country is because it's the opposite, honestly, because the ones that are a threat to democracy are the multi-billionaire oligarchs that no one voted for that just can come in and swoop and purchase the elections.

00:41:01.000 And let me just kind of close with this.

00:41:03.000 With the people you're talking to, the smart people in DC, you know, the important people, are you starting to see a consensus being built that this thing really was an election unlike anything we've ever seen?

00:41:15.000 Or are you like, hey, we got to add more fuel to the fire?

00:41:18.000 What are you seeing when it comes to this?

00:41:19.000 Honestly, I never talked to anyone who didn't admit that this was a total mess in 2020.

00:41:25.000 They all actually understood it and they all are working on it.

00:41:28.000 I think they could really improve how they talk about it.

00:41:31.000 And that goes for everybody, really understanding exactly what the issues are and clarifying and leading the way because it is an existential threat for people if we don't, if we can't have secure elections.

00:41:42.000 But I do want to give one thing, which is throughout our history, we have fought over these things.

00:41:46.000 We want to make, we want to make sure that people who should be voting are voting if they choose to vote and making sure that there isn't cheating.

00:41:54.000 We really have had ongoing issues since before we even were a country.

00:41:59.000 So it's not the end of the world that we're dealing with this.

00:42:01.000 It just requires active participation from concerned citizens.

00:42:05.000 And in a way, I'm more excited about where people are now that people are totally aware of how important it is to care about voting lists and ballot processes.

00:42:15.000 Like people are much more informed now than they were two years ago.

00:42:18.000 And I bet they wish they were this informed two years ago.

00:42:21.000 And that's a huge thing going forward.

00:42:23.000 I agree.

00:42:24.000 And this is the number one issue amongst the conservative base.

00:42:27.000 The book is rigged.

00:42:29.000 Everyone go get it right now.

00:42:30.000 Molly Hemingway from thefederalist.com, one of my favorite websites.

00:42:33.000 Very smart people over there.

00:42:34.000 Molly, thank you so much for joining us and great job with the book.

00:42:38.000 Thank you, Charlie.

00:42:39.000 All right, talk to you soon.

00:42:40.000 Thank you.

00:42:43.000 Thank you so much for listening, everybody.

00:42:45.000 Email us your thoughts.

00:42:46.000 Freedom at CharlieKirk.com.

00:42:48.000 God bless you guys.

00:42:49.000 Thank you for listening.

00:42:50.000 Talk to you soon.

00:42:54.000 For more on many of these stories and news you can trust, go to CharlieKirk. com.

The Charlie Kirk Show - October 15, 2021

How Democrats Rigged a Presidential Election with Mollie Hemingway

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