00:01:08.000His spirit, his love of this country, he's done an amazing job building one of the most powerful youth organizations ever created, Turning Point USA.
00:01:16.000We will not embrace the ideas that have destroyed countries, destroyed lives, and we are going to fight for freedom on campuses across the country.
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00:02:04.000And so you're, a lot I want to cover with you.
00:02:07.000You're involved in a class action lawsuit that's still ongoing with the FAA.
00:02:11.000And I want you to tell us about that, but I do want to kind of speak more broadly because we had a conversation recently that went viral where we talked about how the FAA and some of these airlines are beginning to prioritize diversity over merit and excellence.
00:02:27.000And I think you have something to share regarding those statements.
00:02:32.000Well, certainly from the air traffic control side, the FAA for years, along with obviously other government agencies, but the FAA is more critical because it's a safety-related occupation.
00:02:43.000And they've engaged in what I believe to be a form of social engineering for years, but it got fairly blatant and bad in 2012, 2013 period, where they took the best source of controller applicants, the pipeline for air traffic controllers.
00:03:01.000There's 36 universities across the country.
00:03:04.000And in a midnight raid, so to speak, literally in late December of 2013, they just notified all these students who paid tuition and who had gone through two to four year programs investing their life's work and becoming an air traffic controller.
00:03:19.000They eliminated them from a preferential hiring list.
00:03:22.000And the reason was because they were the wrong color.
00:03:25.000And a lot of those young folks who were on that list, by the way, it was a very diverse list.
00:03:44.000It's really more your motivation and your ability to persevere through a tough training program.
00:03:52.000And so literally, this was from an organization called the National Black Coalition of Federal Aviation Employees who felt there were too many white privileged controllers on the list.
00:04:04.000They went to the Rainbow Push Coalition.
00:04:16.000And that's what we're litigating the case for, and that's what we're going to prove, to bring justice to these kids who lost not only their tuition, but their life dream, simply because they were the victims of identity politics.
00:04:32.000So then post-2013, that's 10 years ago, how has ATC air traffic control changed since then?
00:04:40.000Well, I will also definitely one of the things that happened, one of the causal effects, where now the FAA has facilities that lack adequate staffing.
00:04:53.000A lot of the delays you hear about are actually because they shut down airspace, not because of the weather, because of airlines.
00:04:59.000They literally shut down sectors because they don't have enough folks to work.
00:05:02.000Most controllers at major facilities now are working six-day weeks, a day of overtime per week, which is exceedingly costly.
00:05:09.000Air traffic controllers make a very good wage.
00:05:14.000And what happens is when these controllers work six-day weeks, after a while, they start sicking out.
00:05:20.000So you can imagine if you do the math, it's an exponential cost to the system.
00:05:23.000Not only are the controllers tired, the attrition rate is high, and a lot of folks are leaving the profession.
00:06:00.000They've been able to fly through weather for years, and they've been able to do certain things for a long time.
00:06:08.000So when the FA shuts down sectors and causes reroutes or eliminates flights, that's also a causal effect of eliminating the controller pipeline.
00:06:18.000According to the New York Times, there's more and more near-misses at airports.
00:06:30.000They work at most of your major facilities.
00:06:33.000The bigger facilities that handle most of the air carrier traffic, which is airline traffic.
00:06:37.000Most controllers work six-day work weeks when they're supposed to work five-day work weeks.
00:06:41.000And again, that's the domino effect I told you about.
00:06:44.000What ends up happening is controllers work, they work this overtime, and then to get a day off, they take sick leave.
00:06:49.000So the financial costs are high, but the human toll is high also.
00:06:53.000And so it's very difficult when you're tired.
00:06:56.000And your sleep cycles are controllers, but they're called your circadian cycles, because of the nature of the way air traffic controllers work.
00:07:02.000They work two nights, two mornings, and work at midnight.
00:07:09.000And so there's a lot of factors involved, but cutting the pipeline and eliminating folks that would have been fantastic certified air traffic controllers working the system now has led to a lot of safety issues.
00:07:21.000But the thing that the public doesn't know is that the air traffic controllers about 15, 20 years ago were given immunity for close calls.
00:07:30.000So it used to be if an air traffic controller had an operational error, controllers call them deals, an operational error simply means that two airplanes got less too close, less than standard required separation, that those controllers could be pulled off the boards and given retraining.
00:07:48.000In fact, in order to get retraining for a controller, the managers of the facility have to go through extraordinary measures, and usually they're overruled.
00:07:57.000So what you have is a system which wasn't meant to be deterrent.
00:08:02.000It was meant to provide training to controllers to bring them back up to speed if they kept having repetitive error, where they kept having deals, operational errors.
00:08:11.000Do you know of any examples without citing them, but just curious, of people that have been pushed through the system as pilots or air traffic controllers that might not have been as qualified as they should be?
00:08:27.000And would these people be in the, let's say, the diversity box?
00:08:31.000Certainly a percentage, I believe, are.
00:08:34.000Usually when I look at that or when folks are still in the FA, I still have a lot of contacts that work in the field in the FA, and I get lots of communications.
00:08:43.000And of course, they can't become, or they can't speak out themselves because they will be retaliated against.
00:08:48.000The FAA has gone full wokeness, full DEI.
00:08:52.000And certainly with the management over the last few years in the air traffic branch, they're more worried about diversity than they are near misses.
00:09:01.000Yeah, and then I want you to repeat that, but please do.
00:09:03.000Yeah, I'll give you a real quick story.
00:09:04.000I had a manager from a major facility contact me who's been in the FA for decades and tell me that during one of their management meetings that was supposed to be about how do we reduce or eliminate these operational errors, lack of standard separation, people getting airplanes getting too close.
00:09:25.000And the whole time the meeting was going on, the person in D.C. holding the meeting, all he wanted to do was talk about diversity, equity, and things of that nature.
00:09:33.000And literally the managers themselves across the country were communicating in text, instant messaging, offline about what a waste of time it was, and they were exceedingly disappointed.
00:09:44.000The people in the field are not the people I'm complaining about.
00:10:15.000I mean, if you go to Japan, you're going to communicate in English if you land.
00:10:19.000If you fly over any country and you're part of an air crew, the language is English.
00:10:23.000Do you know of current controllers that are not as well versed in the language?
00:10:29.000I don't know of any personally because I've been out of the field.
00:10:33.000I haven't worked as a controller in over 10 years, but I have stories from other controllers training people that I trained where they're exasperated or they're having a difficult time because they will be dealing with someone and their language capabilities aren't up to par.
00:11:06.000And I would venture to say that that person, I don't know this to be a fact, so this is pure speculation.
00:11:12.000And the current makeup of the FA and managers are not allowed to effectively discipline air traffic controllers.
00:11:18.000Not only do they get a pass on operational errors through this air traffic immunity program that's been put in place, but air traffic managers who try to do the right thing are oftentimes retaliated and their careers suffer.
00:11:32.000So I would be shocked because of the nature of the power the air traffic controllers union has if in fact that controller suffered any consequences at all.
00:11:42.000It was embarrassing to the system, and I'm also a pilot.
00:11:45.000So I can tell you, she was, and I was also a quality assurance specialist for the FA, so I happen to know the rules and regulations fairly well.
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00:13:03.000So, Michael, there, part of the problem is also the airlines.
00:13:06.000I know this is something that you just know probably adjacently.
00:13:11.000Anytime you sacrifice safety at the altar of political correctness or wokeness, you're risking people's lives.
00:13:16.000It doesn't matter if it's air traffic control, it doesn't matter if it's the flight side.
00:13:20.000I think most people in this audience and most people, when it actually comes down to brass tacks regarding regardless of which side they're on, would want the best surgeon operating on their child.
00:13:30.000If my child has an issue and I need a pediatric neurosurgeon, I'm going to get the best neurosurgeon possible, regardless of their race, ethnicity, color, sexual preference, all the other garbage that people deal with.
00:13:44.000Anytime you're in a merit-based occupation, you cannot afford to do that.
00:13:49.000And I think most folks in the industry would agree with that.
00:13:53.000There's enough examples of shining stars of every race, ethnicity, and creed to fill these positions.
00:13:59.000However, what we're doing is we're weakening the fabric in the system as a whole by not requiring air traffic controllers to have a certain level of expertise or qualifications prior to being checked out and certified.
00:14:16.000I want to play Cut86, and you're going to kind of tell us what's going on here because it's a lot of lingo going on here.
00:14:38.000I just want to be a full stop for 6'5 Charlie.
00:14:41.000And maybe we need to talk about that some more because you're the first controller in 15 years that's ever said that.
00:14:46.000Well, I'm just, you know, if you ask for a short approach, a short approach is when you turn your base above the numbers.
00:14:54.000If I know you're a student asking for a short approach, I know you're out there practicing and you probably will extend.
00:15:01.000But if you're doing something other than a short approach, don't ask for a short approach.
00:15:07.000Well, I will definitely look up the definition of short approach because I've never seen where it says you turn base abeam the numbers because I don't see how you could possibly do that.
00:15:17.000I googled short approach, and it said to turn your base abeam or before the numbers, and you will land probably touchdown around this field.
00:15:28.000The air traffic controller rules are in a document.
00:15:31.000It's a government order called the 7110.65.
00:15:35.000There's nowhere in there that you'll find, or the aim, the airman's information manual that pilots you use, will you find that definition of a short approach?
00:16:30.000She might have got a letter or a counseling session with the supervisor, but I can guarantee, well, I can't guarantee you.
00:16:37.000It's my sincere belief that that person didn't suffer any time off, was not retrained because they can't retrain them without the managers getting discipline themselves from folks in D.C. or worried about DEI issues.
00:16:50.000And she's a female, so there's a quota.
00:16:53.000And the only people that aren't protected class, being very straightforward, it might not be politically correct, but I could care less, are white males.
00:17:30.000They say key questions for leadership.
00:17:33.000So who do they mean by leadership, the FAA, when they say this?
00:17:36.000The folks in Lafont Plaza, which is where the FAA, the Department of Transportation is the DOT and the FAA headquarters are right next to each other.
00:18:26.000As I stated before, I've known air traffic controllers that are African Americans, Asians, Filipinos, certain female air traffic controllers, some of the best people I've ever worked with to let you know, just to be very straightforward.
00:18:38.000But to focus on identity politics, it forces it where it's not.
00:18:42.000Merit should be the only thing we care about.
00:18:44.000And there's plenty of people out there of all creeds and colors that have different races that could easily do these jobs.
00:18:52.000But trying to put everyone and paint everyone in a broad brush, no pun intended, with a broad brush, and say, okay, you can become an air traffic controller, whether they have the competency levels or not, is creating an intentional hazard to flight safety.
00:19:07.000And they've been doing it for over a decade.
00:19:20.000Once the FAA wiped out the air traffic CTI program, or attempted to, but Congress, thank goodness, has reinstated it.
00:19:28.000But back in 2013, the FAA literally wiped out lists of qualified folks, again, of all races, creeds, and colors, who could be air traffic controllers because the National Black Coalition of Federal Aviation Employees, NBC FAA, decided it was too white.
00:19:42.000And they used their political power and lobbying power to get that done.
00:19:51.000Our lawsuit is about that and about these folks being struck off the record due to characteristics that are allegedly protected by the Constitution and lots of laws.
00:20:03.000And you would not think that the United States government would actually be the ones to violate the constitutional provisions and laws, but they have.
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00:21:32.000What happened was prior to 2013, there was a peer-reviewed employment test called the ATSA.
00:21:41.000It was a test that controllers had to take to qualify.
00:21:44.000And it had been reviewed and modified many times to take out any form of bias.
00:21:50.000And the records are there, and it was done by the Civil Aeronautical Medical Institute, CAMI.
00:21:53.000Well, in 2013, the FA hired an outside vendor called APT Metrics for the first time in history to do an outside analysis and outside review and develop a new test.
00:22:07.000And the new test was called Biographical Assessment, our biographical questionnaire.
00:22:24.000And if you had any aviation experience, well, ironically, that test, when you grade it out, if your worst grade was science, you got 15 points.
00:22:32.000If your best grade was science, you got less.
00:22:35.000If you had any aviation or military experience at all or were a pilot, you got no credit for it.
00:22:43.000Basically, you got three points in one question, the other, you got zero credit, even though there's a high correlation with having some experience in something and being good.
00:22:52.000If you know which end of the knife cuts, you're going to be a better butcher.
00:22:56.000And that's basically what the FAA decided was that's not true.
00:23:00.000And the FAA in their infinite wisdom used this test, and they decided that they could take anyone and turn them into an air traffic controller.
00:23:07.000It's equivalent to the Veterans Administration hiring people off the street and teaching them how to be doctors as they butcher people in the hospitals or having your taxes overlooked and audited by someone who's not a CP or has no financial acumen at all.
00:23:20.000The government and at least the FAA decided that it was more important to put people in based upon select identity characteristics and competency.
00:23:30.000And those questions are, most people see them and they laugh.
00:23:34.000They can't believe that this was done.
00:23:36.000So, Michael, United Airlines announced, and they reiterated in an Axios interview about a year and a half ago, that in their hiring class, so as far as their trainees, that they want 50% to be female or black.
00:23:51.000Currently, less than 3 to 4% of all pilots are black.
00:23:55.000And I think maybe 8% to 10% are female.
00:24:52.000Well, it's the same, and I haven't looked at the exact statistic with pilots.
00:24:57.000There's a relevant workforce population that can do the job.
00:25:00.000And the Department of Labor keeps track of that simply because of the basic qualifications.
00:25:05.000So when United Airlines or any airlines artificially sets a limit and says we're going to do 50% of a flight class, it's already difficult enough to get folks.
00:25:12.000They have to have a minimum of 1,500 hours to work for, by the way, they lie a lot now.
00:25:29.000And there's other lucrative opportunities elsewhere.
00:25:31.000There's an opportunity cost issue there.
00:25:34.000But at the end of the day, this social engineering is creating hazards to the flying public.
00:25:41.000And the bad part about this is that the government and these folks engaging us have immunity.
00:25:47.000One of the things that needs to be changed, quite frankly, is the Federal Torque Claims Act.
00:25:51.000There's some other things that need to be modified because we have too many bureaucrats, specifically in the FAA, who are making life-altering decisions, unelected bureaucrats, by the way, unelected bureaucrats, that are making life-altering decisions with no consequences to them.
00:26:07.000Now, I will tell everybody the same thing I told folks in Congress when we lobbied to get these laws changed where the CTI went back.
00:26:12.000I talked to many members of the House and Senate, and it became real to them because it's in their backyard.
00:26:20.000So this is not an issue that you can sweep under the rug because the reason the FAA was created in 1958, by the way, was because of a collision, a couple of mid-air collisions.
00:26:29.000There were a couple of high-profile individuals, including congressmen, on board the airplanes.
00:26:32.000Well, that's when they really started regulating the system itself.
00:26:35.000Well, unless they grab a hold of this problem and they eliminate DEI, wokeness, whatever term you want to say, political correctness, from the hiring decisions, there's going to be blood on people's hands.
00:26:45.000The problem of it is, is when you're trying to isolate and hold them responsible, they're going to have immunity, and there's no one to hold responsible for these policies.
00:27:41.000No, it's not that explicit, but basically the way the test was designed was to eliminate or to give preference to African-American applicants, the biographical assessment specifically.
00:27:52.000The National Black Coalition of Federal Aviation Employees actually had the test prior, at least it's our allegations.
00:28:01.000The DOT inspector general investigated, but they, of course, whitewashed it, no pun intended.
00:28:07.000But they actually had keywords and they had at least a version of the test from what their representative said at the time.
00:28:14.000There's a tape recording of them out there saying that, to give preference to African-American applicants.
00:28:19.000So, no, they didn't come out in a policy and say there's too many white folks applying and we want to wipe the list out.
00:28:26.000But every bit of evidence and people you talk to behind the scenes, including some very straightforward African-American applicants, have told me that was what they basically said.