00:00:35.000His spirit, his love of this country, he's done an amazing job building one of the most powerful youth organizations ever created, Turning Point USA.
00:00:44.000We will not embrace the ideas that have destroyed countries, destroyed lives, and we are going to fight for freedom on campuses across the country.
00:01:54.000But you got to see this guy, McGonagall, who was on the ground floor of the investigation to accuse Trump of working with Russia, has now pled guilty to working with Russia.
00:02:04.000But back to this matter, here's what we ought to do, and we shouldn't make it that complicated.
00:02:09.000First, we should tell Jack Smith that he has to show up and give a transcribed interview to the House Judiciary Committee in the next 15 days.
00:02:16.000If he doesn't do that, we should issue a subpoena.
00:02:18.000If he ignores the subpoena, we should hold him in criminal contempt of Congress and force him to be the first prosecutor to bring a case while under criminal contempt himself.
00:02:29.000And if Merritt Garland won't enforce that criminal contempt, then he subjects himself to an impeachment of the House.
00:02:35.000So it would be an attorney general under impeachment, a prosecutor under contempt.
00:02:40.000And I think that frames what's going on better than just sitting back and hoping we hear no evil, see no evil, and speak no evil as this plays out.
00:02:48.000Because if we grant the premise, Charlie, that this is an ongoing, legitimate matter, then it just builds into it the notion that it is law enforcement activity and not election interference.
00:03:00.000Congress has equities at play with election interference.
00:03:05.000Simultaneous to that, you can actually bring President Trump in to give testimony to the Congress and in doing so, immunize him.
00:03:12.000Now, there's different forms of immunity that take place at the committee level, subcommittee level.
00:03:17.000In some instances, for full immunity, you have to have more of a super majority vote.
00:03:23.000But if you had a super majority vote of a committee, like Speaker McCarthy could set up a select committee tomorrow that could bring Trump in and immunize him, and then we could proceed with the very legitimate investigative work that we're doing of the Bidens and the corrupt DOJ.
00:03:39.000Unfortunately, none of those things are happening.
00:03:41.000Instead, Congress is not in Washington, not assembled.
00:03:48.000No timing in D.C. is ever just a mere coincidence.
00:03:54.000And so right as Congress is leaving town, right as we're walking away from our equities, you see this acceleration of activity against.
00:04:02.000So yeah, let's be specific here, though.
00:04:04.000So immunize him from what crimes, even if he's under current indictment?
00:04:09.000Is that including even the obstruction claims?
00:04:11.000And give us some examples of how this has been used recently.
00:04:15.000Well, it hasn't been used recently, but obviously we're aware of the ability for any person to plead the fifth.
00:04:22.000You can dissolve someone's ability to plead the fifth if you immunize them.
00:04:26.000And so Congress has this ability that's been recognized.
00:04:29.000It's even laid out in 18 USCA 6002 and 6005, if folks want to look it up.
00:04:37.000But there, you've got the ability to say, well, we're hereby compelling your testimony.
00:04:45.000We're giving you immunity for anything you say to us and anything that that would lead to.
00:04:50.000And so, for example, if President Trump came in and said, I'm here to give you testimony about the witch hunt, the abuse of criminal process that Congress has legitimate oversight equities to resolve.
00:05:04.000And if he were to say things to us, we could immunize him for that conduct that he were to discuss.
00:05:16.000Is it the whole House that has to vote on immunization?
00:05:18.000And when was the last time this statute was used?
00:05:22.000I don't know when the last time it was used.
00:05:24.000I can say it can be any committee or subcommittee that can grant immunities.
00:05:29.000So we could even bring him into the subcommittee chaired by my good friend and colleague, Andy Biggs, the crime subcommittee that has jurisdiction over some of these activities of the Department of Justice.
00:05:39.000And if Trump were to essentially become whistleblower, a whistleblower, you have to think about it almost like whistleblower protections.
00:05:45.000Trump, the ultimate whistleblower, potentially the beneficiary of congressional immunity on some of the information.
00:05:54.000I just want to make sure I understand this.
00:05:55.000So that Donald Trump could be called in, let's say, by the Andy Biggs Committee or whatever, or the Weaponization of Government Committee, which obviously he's a subject matter expert.
00:06:03.000And as long as he is giving whistleblower testimony on each one of the charges against him, that would effectively neuter the Department of Justice from being able to consent to continue to pursue charges against him.
00:06:18.000It's a little more nuanced than that, Charlie.
00:06:20.000You're immunized for the statements you make and the conduct that that uncovers.
00:06:25.000You know, if we're talking in hypotheticals, if President Trump had committed a murder somewhere, I don't know that giving testimony about the weaponization of the federal government would immunize that type of conduct.
00:06:39.000But I think particularly where you've got Jack Smith trying to fashion the actions the president took while in office to try to evaluate and investigate information that was coming across his desk, you could certainly immunize him for that.
00:06:54.000So I think that the areas where we could provide the broadest immunity for President Trump would be around the conspiracy charges, the deprivation of rights charges.
00:07:03.000It's almost hard to say with a straight face that Jack Smith has brought.
00:07:07.000In fact, it was the FBI doing the most to deprive people of their rights when they had agents meeting with Facebook, Meta, Twitter, all these technology companies to try to get the Hunter Biden laptop story just scrubbed from the entire information domain during the 2020 presidential contest.
00:07:26.000So that would be a specific area where I think we could neuter the deprivation of rights and conspiracy charges in the Jack Smith indictment if we brought President Trump in for whistleblower testimony.
00:07:37.000And so potentially Donald Trump could come in as a whistleblower and blow the whistle on what was happening up in the events of leading up to January 6th.
00:07:46.000Nancy Pelosi didn't want to give troops, you know, because a lot of the indictment is centered around the events that lead up to that.
00:08:02.000I don't know if it'll stand up in court, but it's certainly worth a try.
00:08:07.000And this is exactly the type of thing we need as the Department of Justice is used as a Democrat super PAC.
00:08:12.000Why wouldn't we try to offer Donald Trump immunity and force the hand of the Department of Justice, especially on the conspiracy charges and the January 6th related stuff?
00:08:26.000Well, in theory, the downside of bringing anyone before Congress to give testimony is that if you say something that is material and that is not accurate, that can create a cascade of follow-on charges.
00:08:39.000So it's never something that you typically think of as a first step to try to bring people into Congress to give testimony because it's not typically something people enjoy a great deal.
00:08:49.000But in this case, I think we misunderstand the fight that we are in.
00:08:54.000Right now, you have the Department of Justice functioning as the enforcement wing of the Democratic Party.
00:09:00.000And in a lot of ways, what you're seeing now was set up by Eric Holder and Barack Obama because they got some of their most talented political operatives and they gave them the ability to bring charges.
00:09:11.000They turned them into prosecutors that are now career prosecutors and above reproach.
00:09:16.000But the reality is these are left-wing, oftentimes Soros-aligned and trained killers.
00:09:22.000And they're coming after our people, our movement, and our president.
00:09:27.000And I think that if Congress just accepts this premise that it's an ongoing matter and thus we shouldn't be involved, then you underscore the legitimacy of that very matter.
00:09:39.000That's where I'm in the minority of the majority.
00:09:41.000I want to be very clear with you, Charlie.
00:09:43.000Most Republicans in Congress just think we ought to throw our hands in the air and allow the chips to fall where they may.
00:09:50.000I think that is a tremendous disservice to the Constitution when we are facing an election interference operation, not a legitimate prosecution.
00:11:45.000Ron's done a great job as governor of Florida, and frankly, I'm working pretty hard to keep him the governor of Florida for the next few years.
00:11:52.000This is a pattern I've seen before from Ron DeSantis.
00:11:56.000In 2018, when I was working as a senior part of his campaign, he woke up one day and didn't think the campaign was going well, and he asked me to do an audit or a review of the personnel we'd assembled.
00:12:10.000And I told him that if we continued with that team, that Andrew Gillum would be the governor of Florida and he would not be.
00:12:16.000And in sweeping fashion, he replaced the senior members of the team.
00:12:21.000And the great irony is he brought in Susie Wiles to write the ship.
00:12:28.000And now Susie Wiles is the titular head of the Trump campaign.
00:12:32.000So, my, the interesting square dancing that we do, kind of trading partners around in Florida politics a good bit on the campaign staff side.
00:12:42.000And now I think Ron has had a similar realization that the team that he had in place had burnt through tens of millions of dollars.
00:12:50.000That Ron DeSantis has waged a campaign against his own vote share.
00:12:56.000Ron DeSantis was knocking down about a third of the vote in the Republican primary before he became a candidate.
00:13:03.000And since becoming a candidate, he's clubbed his own vote share down to about half of where it was before he got in the race.
00:13:11.000So I think that would make anybody running question the team they had around him and the predicate of the strategy.
00:13:17.000Right now, I don't think it's anything wrong with Ron DeSantis and his campaign.
00:13:22.000I think it's just that the American people see the moment we're in, and we see that President Trump has unique skills and experience and capability to get our economy going again and also to obliterate a weaponized government that's been turned against our people.
00:13:37.000I don't know that Ron is really in a moment to captivate that energy that President Trump seems to have really zeroed in on.
00:13:46.000Yeah, I mean, look, he's engaging in a policy debate.
00:13:48.000That's not what this is at all, right?
00:13:50.000This is a primal scream, as Steve Bannon would say.
00:13:53.000This is a time to get back at the Uniparty for an all-out Bolshevik Maoist agenda against the American people.
00:14:14.000Is it time for Ron DeSantis to not further damage his national bona fides and continue as a rock star governor of Florida and then maybe look at potential political prospects?
00:14:29.000And I think he's got a bright political future ahead in Florida and in national politics.
00:14:34.000And I'm going to be a big cheerleader of his when he comes back to resume the governorship in the Sunshine State.
00:14:40.000I do think that getting drubbed in Iowa and New Hampshire and South Carolina and Nevada doesn't necessarily set up those future prospects as well as unifying behind President Trump.
00:14:53.000But, you know, there is a policy debate going on.
00:14:56.000You're right that it's not the primal urge that draws us to a particular campaign.
00:15:02.000But we do need to make sure some of these arguments that are being made don't prevail.
00:15:05.000I just saw today, Charlie, Nikki Haley criticized the great senator from Alabama, Tommy Tumberville, for putting holds on these woke generals who want to continue to pay for abortions and abortion services and abortion travel with taxpayer money.
00:15:22.000And so we do need to see some of these bad ideas like those advanced by Nikki Haley defeated.
00:15:28.000We need to see the bad ideas that Chris Christie and Mike Pence are advancing regarding Ukraine defeated.
00:15:36.000Our future is not inexorably linked to theirs.
00:15:39.000And I think President Trump's in a position to really get the best of both worlds, the right policy arguments, but then also the right visceral urge to make the necessary changes we have to make to save the country.
00:15:50.000Look, I'm going to be talking to some donors tonight, some of which agree with me, some of which disagree.
00:15:55.000You know, some of them texted me and said, Charlie, we'd love to hear your thoughts on Glenn Youngkin.
00:18:14.000And the book really is as deep a dive as you're going to get into the ideologies that drive some of the most powerful corporations and NGOs on the planet.
00:18:25.000Many that you've talked about and we've talked about, of course, Google, Facebook, Meta, Amazon, and the World Economic Forum, to mention just a few.
00:18:35.000I also go into the technologies themselves.
00:18:39.000Of course, the ideology or the dreams that are put forward, nightmares for us, are always going to exceed the technologies themselves.
00:18:48.000And so I hope to give the reader a good sense of where we're at right now or where I was at when I submitted the book.
00:18:55.000Things have actually changed so fast that they've already passed me up.
00:18:59.000But in the end, what I really hope to communicate is that this is, in fact, spiritual warfare, that it is a spiritual vision of what the human being is, of what the purpose of the human being is, what the purpose of our civilization is, and that these competing ideas are coming to a head.
00:19:21.000Some real world examples, I think, you had the response to COVID as a sort of trial run as to what it would be like if you had one side of humanity that sees their status as being as hinging upon their biological status,
00:19:38.000their technological status, and the use of technologies to basically separate humanity into the acceptable and the unacceptable, such as the vaccine passports and also the contract, the contact tracing technologies that were rolled out in places like Singapore.
00:19:58.000So, the book, is it done in novel form or is it just kind of an overview?
00:20:04.000Just walk us through the structure of the book.
00:20:07.000So, I begin, obviously, just to describe what is transhumanism, the desire to optimize the human being and the eventual goal of merging human beings with technology.
00:20:19.000I'll also go into the history of transhumanism.
00:20:21.000Some of the more profound thinkers, however much I disagree with them, the ones that are quite, I think, familiar to many in your audience, Ray Kurzweil or Martine Rothblatt, but also some of the more obscure figures like Bing Goertzel, who has recently come to the fore in media but has been there for a long time.
00:20:43.000And Hugo DeGaris, I spend a lot of time on his vision of what the future will be like once artificial intelligence reaches full maturity.
00:20:53.000You know, the first part really is to look at the supposed inevitability of a transhuman turn in human civilization, looking at the underpinnings in the theory of evolution, biological evolution, cultural evolution, digital evolution.
00:21:09.000The second part begins to move more into the spiritual nature of this.
00:21:14.000I do talk about the World Economic Forum and the Great Reset, and I do talk about some of the more common figures like Elon Musk and Yuval Noah Harari actually kind of comparing them and seeing really who is the villain and who is the hero.
00:21:30.000I don't think that any villains or heroes emerge in any clear way from this story.
00:21:35.000It all looks very murky and very bleak.
00:21:38.000Moving to the end, though, the third part is really looking at the spiritual response to this.
00:21:45.000And maybe the most compelling chapter, which is the fruition of a few short pieces that I've published before, Countdown to Giga Death, confronting this concept of existential risk and the idea that the technologies we're creating could either eradicate human beings, eradicate most human beings, or even just eradicate a significant proportion of the human population.
00:22:13.000I don't necessarily, I'm not, this is not a book about doom, but it's definitely a book that follows the ideas of existential risk to their logical conclusion.
00:22:25.000So is there an argument to be made that the inevitability of AI and the merging might be a lot clumsier than the predictions would suggest?
00:22:35.000We can kind of see where this is headed in the language models.
00:22:38.000We can see the sophistication and the outright creepiness of the power of chat GPT.
00:22:43.000At the same time, though, there have been far more technological predictions that have failed in the timeline than have ever actually come to fruition.
00:23:35.000Futurists have never, no single futurist has ever envisioned even the immediate future, let alone the long-term future, exactly right.
00:23:44.000And all of their visions for the future diverge.
00:23:48.000But what I do, and I try my best to capture that diversity.
00:23:53.000What I do see happening, though, if you look at even the predictions from the post-war era, or if you go all the way back to H.G. Wells and his contemporaries.
00:24:08.000At its core, I think the project of futurism, as you have all these different visions moving towards the future, and as you have powerful people and powerful corporations who sign on to these visions of the future, some approximation of those futures does, in fact, come to pass.
00:24:26.000And so while I'm not myself a futurist, and I don't try to predict even the next decade with any exacting accuracy, I do think that something like a broad vision of what is around the corner can be gleaned from these futurist predictions if only by looking at the intention and the power of the people who are pushing them.
00:24:49.000Now, I think that the myth of inevitability is extremely dangerous because it paralyzes people in the face of change.
00:24:58.000And I also think that the myth of progress is a real danger because it means that you just simply aren't part of the relevant course of history.
00:25:06.000I think that people who do not want these futures, which are definitely coming from the top down, if they don't want to live them out or sign on to them, then they have to first be able to reject them and secondly to envision their future.
00:26:03.000And so if I'm understanding you correctly, which I agree completely, is that while we still have time left on the clock, should we be now sending out a distress signal?
00:26:13.000Now's the time to organize your sovereignty.
00:26:16.000Now's the time to commit to wanting to be free.
00:26:19.000Is that a fair summary of the call to action, Joe Allen?
00:26:25.000I think it will be different for different people and different societies.
00:26:29.000So that in America and different regions or even subcultures of America, the response to the future is always going to be different.
00:26:36.000But there are some basic orientations that can be generalized.
00:26:42.000The orientation of transhumanists or accelerationists, this is an orientation which holds technology up as the highest power on earth and is a sort of salvific force that that is the salvation of humanity.
00:26:56.000And there are various other secular and what I have the most affinity for, the spiritual or religious traditions, these do stand as a counterpoint to that, especially the spiritual traditions.
00:27:10.000But they're obviously the world is quite a diverse place and there will be diverse responses to that sort of technocratic or transhumanist orientation towards technology as the way forward.
00:27:23.000And I think that we are coming to an inflection point where it may not be binary, but it will be very different in those places, in those cultures which accept this as being the norm and those which resist it.
00:27:37.000Those trajectories are going to be significantly different, however much gray area there is between them.
00:27:44.000Yeah, and I think that, I mean, look, most people that, I mean, there's a potential of mass job displacement and not just in the ways that you might anticipate.
00:27:53.000You know, there's a new article out that they say, oh, the news is now going to be administered by AI-created people.
00:27:59.000I say, how's that any different than CNN?
00:28:01.000It's just going to save them money, right?
00:28:02.000They just hire some, it's the same thing.
00:28:04.000For us, we have our jobs protected because the AI doesn't agree with everything we say, at least protected for now.
00:28:10.000However, Joe, I want to explore this Gnostic element and also talk about H.G. Wells' essay/slash book, World Mind.
00:28:17.000I think there is this belief that the connectivity of a hive mind, a oneness, which is the gnosis, that's where we get the word Gnosticism.
00:28:27.000There is this hermetic, almost magic wizardry appeal to AI that goes back thousands and thousands of years.
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00:30:00.000I think that artificial intelligence is really going to force people to reckon with human limitation, and it will force people to understand what it means to be human in the face of something that at least seems like an artificial or non-human intelligence.
00:30:21.000Yeah, I mean, for me, and this is, you know, I went through a lot of, I actually did a whole weekend of thinking about this while my phone was off.
00:30:26.000I said, look, it's going to challenge me to be the best possible human I can.
00:30:29.000If I lose out to machines, then so be it.
00:30:32.000But I'm going to become the best version of myself and I'm going to use it as an iron-sharpening iron type thing.
00:30:37.000But I have a soul and the machine does not.
00:30:39.000I have a soul and the machine does not.
00:31:27.000I don't think the Chat GPT or any of its corresponding technologies, like say BARD, I don't think that they have anything like human creativity.
00:31:38.000The best human writers far exceed them.
00:31:41.000However, mediocre writers are going to get left in the dust.
00:31:46.000And I think Hollywood has had a problem with that for a long time.
00:31:49.000As it moves out, though, into the corporate world, as it moves out into other creative endeavors, and it already is, two things are going to happen.
00:31:57.000One, people who are becoming excellent are not going to be challenged with the sort of drudge work that would have been required in a pre-AI era.
00:32:07.000And I think that a lot of the practice and a lot of the discipline will suffer because of that.
00:32:12.000Also, though, more and more, you're going to see, I think, the expansion of what Yuval Noah Harari so detestably called the useless class.
00:32:22.000I believe Harari was 100% right about that.
00:32:25.000That there is already a growing useless class, and there will be a much larger useless class going forward.
00:32:33.000The answer to that to me, make yourself useful and make other people of use.
00:32:42.000So, this is going to be one of the, I mean, is it fair to say that this will be the existential question for the species over the next five years?
00:32:53.000Is this going to happen in the next five years, 10 years, 20 years?
00:32:56.000I look at this as kind of a multi-decade question, Joe.
00:33:00.000I mean, it's going to make, I think, the transition from agrarian to the Industrial Revolution look like child's play.
00:33:05.000And every intelligent prognosticator believes the same.
00:33:10.000You look at something that has been really jarring of late.
00:33:13.000We've covered this since they first announced it.
00:33:16.000Amazon's Amazon One payment system, the Palm payment system, rolling out in every Whole Food store now, has been at many Whole Food stores for over a year and a half.
00:33:31.000Yeah, going into entertainment venues, going into Panera Bread, all of these different places.
00:33:37.000So that Palm payment system has religious significance for Christians who are well-versed in the prophecies of Revelation with the mark on the hand in order to buy or sell.
00:33:51.000Also, it ties into Sam Altman's project, WorldCoin or World ID, the kind of evil orb that takes your IRIS scan, ties that to a blockchain-based currency, and also can be used, and they're partnering with governments right now, used as a biometric identification for various purposes.
00:34:13.000The one he proposes that stands out the most is that it would be used to verify your humanness on the internet in an era in which bots are already growing in number but will proliferate.
00:34:26.000So, ChatGPT from OpenAI, created by Sam Altman, creates a problem.
00:34:32.000Sam Altman has a solution on the other side to tie your biometric identity to your digital identity, to your wallet, and ultimately to your access to certain parts of the internet.
00:34:44.000These are the immediate manifestations of long-term trends.
00:34:49.000If you look at, for instance, the history of credit card adoption and credit card use, it kind of chugged along for a time, and then as it became more and more convenient and integrated into the economic system, shot up.
00:35:03.000I don't think there are enough people who are alarmed by the concept of biometric payment systems to stop that ball from rolling.
00:35:12.000So whatever the ultimate outcome is, we are moving into an era where these sorts of technologies will be adopted in greater and greater numbers, and the extremity of those technologies will increase over time.
00:35:26.000And that's, going forward, we are already there at this point of bifurcation among those who would like to keep things as they are or maybe even turn back the clock a little bit towards a more human era and those who want to race forward.
00:35:40.000And as I said before, that gray area in between, I believe, will shrink significantly.
00:35:45.000And you're right, it is, it's not something that tomorrow you'll wake up and suddenly robots will be flying out of the sky.